₦airaland Forum

It is sin that condemns, not Jesus.

You do not understand the gospel. No wonder you are so condemned. Who is the liar? John 3:17 -God sent not His son into the world to condemn the world. But that the world through Him might be saved.

Backslider, i guess you have not been trained to understand that your name determines what you are or will become. U tell me; is it possible to remove drug addicts and prostitiues from the streets and truely set them free without the massage of Christ and the annointing of God's Spirit? And mind you, the message we preach is not the kind that you preach. Jesus condemned sin but he didnt condemn the sinner. He loved them, so much so that He died for them. Such people will have to see the love of Christ not only preached but demonstrated in and through you. I think you should start by preaching to yourself first. From the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks. What you have inside is what you release. If you have sin, condemnation, guilt and fear in you, that is what you will release. Thereby bringing your hearers to share in your condemnation. Selah

If you were speaking truth you will be blessed by God. But since you choose the path of lies, there is destruction waiting for you. You have Called this man a cheat without cause yet every major Christ embassy church has an innercity mission reaching out to the needy. Very many children are taken from the streets, fed, clothed and given decent accomodation. There is also a loveworld academy where they are all given free education. Why don't you go and check for yourself? We remove prostitutes, drug addicts and robbers from the streets giving them decent accommodations, new jobs and businesses as i have personally been involved with this mission group. Even if we never have a chance to defend ourselves, our works will testify before God against all who tell lies. They will surely not go unpunished. And Like Jesus taught, we do not come out in public and begin to commend or defend ourselves because He hath said, 'woe unto you when all men speak well of you'. If i may ask you Backslider, what church and under whose authority are you submitted? What is your function in the house of God? Why are you trying to bring others into the same condemnation as yourself in your backsliden state? If i may say this, You do not appear to me to be a christian. It is easy to slander others and speak against others but not many are builders. Jesus said, anyone who falls upon this rock shall be broken but on whosoever this rock shall fall, it shall grind to powder. So keep talking what you do not know.

What are the false doctrines and techniques? And what makes them false? Reading my bible i see that there's nothing strange about the way and manner in which the guy was raised. And please, kindly let us know what the proper technique for raising the dead is.

The above post actualy describes what i spoke about earlier. First they try to deny that the miracle ever happened and then when they consider that it possible it actually happened, they begin to quote scriptures attempting to portray the man as a devil. Well thank God that scripture did not say that all who call Him lord will not enter. Meaning that there are some who work miracles and who will call Him on that day and be recieved.

Let God be true and every man a liar. In the days of ignorance God overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent.

Tayo D, now i feel real sorry for you. I actually thought you had some information at least from the Interview Pastor Chris granted on this matter. Now i know that all your references are made to some soft sell magazine somewhere. You do not have full info on the matter and you have passed judgement. Is it not christian to hear two sides of a story first? May God forgive you. For the purpose of those who will like to know Pastor Chris never wrote that letter. He never instructed the letter to be written. It was only after his attention was drawn to the letter that he asked his staff to look for the writer of the letter who had since explained himself. The signature was not his neither was the letter written with his knowledge or consent. The money never got to Pastor Chris or to the ministry's accounts. I have warned you guys in love to be careful but you will not listen. Like those foolish journalists you too are looking for your own share of punishment.

The bible called Jesus the lamb of God because He was offered as a sacrifice to take away the sin of the world. The Holy Spirit was never, any where in scripture, called a dove. I think you are beginning to show what your true color is. It does not matter how many scriptures you quote, if you are not born again, you are a child of the devil. There is no middle ground. To the pure in heart, all things are pure the bible says. Did you say i learnt my theology in sin and from sinful men who do not have salvation? Well, i leave you to God. Wrong theology is the reason for many of the problems we face as christians. Do you know that some christians in this penticostal group still pray and fast for days (sometimes with beatings and deliverance sessions) in order to recieve salvation and be born again? Those who have the truth should not hold back. Speak out and let the devil be ashamed!

@Backslider As christians, we were born Holy when we were born again and as such we must live Holy lives. However, this is not the same as living 'holier than thou' lives. I Suggest you guys(church police) go look for the pastor of one of the many Christ Embassy branches in Lagos who recieved money from the man; tell him what you have to say and hear his own side of the story so that you dont continue to heap condemnation on yourselves.

@Backslider As christians, we were born Holy when we were born again and as such we must live Holy lives. However, this is not the same as living 'holier than thou' lives. I Suggest you guys(church police) go look for the pastor of one of the many Christ Embassy branches in Lagos who recieved money from the man; tell him what you have to say and hear his own side of the story so that you dont continue to heap condemnation on yourselves.

War? If there is a war here it is definitely not against God but against all forms of religiocity(if there's a word like that). The truth must be told my brother. Why don't you use the lamb to symbolize God? The lamb does not eat flesh, it is not stubborn. It is gentle. Jesus was even called the lamb of God. Why are you struggling to keep the dove emblem. Has it become your God? Why is it difficult for you to let it go? Whether it is LIKE OR AS the truth remains that the Holy Spirit is not a dove, neither does he look like one. And talking about the dove having only one partner; so how many does God have? The Holy Ghost is not fire, oil or smoke. He is Himself God. He looks, loves, laughs, weeps, heals, prays, comforts, provides, teaches etc like Jesus. Jesus said, I will send you another comforter(allous paracletos: allous- meaning one that is exactly the same in kind and quality and paracletos- meaning comforter) why is it not easier for you to use the man Jesus in describing the Holy Ghost? It is that attachment to the dove that i have come to make war against. No wonder when Jesus spoke of the Holy Spirit He said, the world cannot recieve Him because they see Him not. The world lives and functions in th realm of the senses. They always want to relate with God through their senses and that's the reason for the idols and images they make. And did you say they do not worship this dove? Well, look around carefully once more; and mind you, that was the same thing they said concerning statues of mary and all them saints at a certain catholic church the last time i checked. God is spirit and they that worship Him must do so in Spirit and in truth.

Since when did Seun and his nairaland become God's annointed apostolic voice and instrument for chastising, purging or pruning His church? Are you trying to be of help to the Holy Spirit? I think He knows how best to do His job.

@Backslider As christians, we were born Holy when we were born again and as such we must live Holy lives. However, this is not the same as living 'holier than thou' lives. I Suggest you guys(church police) go look for the pastor of one of the many Christ Embassy branches in Lagos who recieved money from the man; tell him what you have to say and hear his own side of the story so that you dont continue to heap condemnation on yourselves.

Po Deep:
@donnie
As for the dove symbol.It means no harm,its just Christian symbology.

Did you say it means no harm. That is what satan will have you believe my dear.

Are you aware that the Holy Spirit is God Himself?
Take a look at this:

Exodus 20:4
Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

And this is the cry of the Spirit today:

Jeremiah 8:19 
Behold the voice of the cry of the daughter of my people because of them that dwell in a far country: Is not the LORD in Zion? is not her king in her? Why have they provoked me to anger with their graven images, and with strange vanities?

Is the Lord not among you? Does He not dwell on the inside of You? Why do you provoke Him with these images and with strange vanities?

Po Deep:
Remember when John baptised Jesus,a dove came over Jesus(representing The Holy Spirit) & God's voice was heard from heaven approving Christ as his son whom he is very pleased.
So thats where the dove comes in.

That is not true. A dove did not come upon Jesus. The Holy Spirit came upon Him according to the bible, IN BODILY FORM like a dove would. Those words were carefully chosen by the writter as the greek Word used for the Holy Spirit is pnuma meaning air.

So He is trying to communicate to you the fact that he took a form(not just as air) when he decended on Jesus. He did not say that He took the form of a dove but that He descended upon Jesus the same way a dove would descend.

So this is actually where the dove comes in.

Matthew 3:16
And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:

Mark 1:10
And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him:

Luke 3:22
And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.

John 1:32 
And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him.

In case you are unaware, this false teaching has led believers to see the Holy Spirit as a lesser personality than the father and the Son. They paint Him in their pictures as a dove flying above the father and the Son. Some think that the reason He is called the third person of the Godhead is that He is the lesser of the three persons. This teaching is like a veil upon the eyes sheilding the true personality of this precious comforter without whom we cannot live the Christian life.

I wish you could see the expression of His face. If you only knew that He was the forth man in the fire with the three Hebrew Children. If you only knew that He was that mighty cloud that followed the Isrealites by day and that pillar of fire that gave them light by night.  The one who blew over the red sea dividing it and holding it up until over 6 million Jews went across; You will not call Him a gentle dove(as some do call him).

No wonder His power is absent from their lives. No wonder they have trouble when they see His presence manifested in signs wonders and miracles; attributing such manifestations to satan.

No wonder they attack such manifestaions but are at peace with those who sprinkle water and oil all over the place.

Come out from among them and be ye seperated. Turn from your vanities and recieve the Word with meekness.

I did not intend to say this much on this issue even though there is a lot more to say.

God be with you all.

In all my years of being a christian, i never saw myself as being penticostal. As a matter of fact, the name penticostal really does not make sense in Christianity as according to the bible the penticostals did not recieve the Holy Ghost on that day of penticost. I would rather be called catholic, Anglican, methodist, or even baptist as these appear to be more meaningful names. Besides, from that group of christians(penticostals) have proceeded certain teachings which unknown to many are presently troubling the church. Where did the teaching of using the DOVE symbol to represent the Holy Spirit come from. It does not matter for how long this teaching has been, it has to leave the church. The Holy Ghost is not a dove and does not resemble a dove. The Holy Spirit looks just like YOU (if u r a christian) for He looks like Jesus the one whom you were born after. Why will God's people be prevented from knowing this mighty, precious Holy Ghost for who He really is? How come you are now turning to the very things you were once opposed to? Why do you carry around(and even sell) bottles of oil, crosses, hankies and so on and preach that these items will bring their users deliverance. While you claim to be the ones who have experienced the Holy Ghost, your words and actions tell otherwise. I do not intend to continue mentioning these things as my only purpose is to show you the result of relying on sense knowledge above God's Word. Jesus is coming soon and every tree which the Lord hath not planted shall be uprooted. Jesus is enough; the ultimate sacrifice for the salvation of mankind. And we are complete in Him. Glory to God.

It matters by what name you are called because God is interested in names. When he wanted to bless Abraham, He had to change his name. The same with Jacob. Our names go a long way in determining our destinys.

Hello Seun, its so refreshing hearing from you after so long. Well i'm still here. I think i should say, happy new year and of course, a big congratulations for a job well done so far. I am impressed at how much this site has grown. As for the new apostolic status which you have bestowed on me; i think i will be more comfortable if i am seen as christian as that is really what matters afterall. And for your new atheist stand on nairaland, you and i know that in your heart of hearts, you believe this gospel that we preach. But for the sake of maintaining some balance and of course, some more excitement, you prefer to be seen as atheist. Well keep it up. Later man, 1luv.

By the time all a person can see and preach about is sin and unrighteous its high time you begin to examine such a fellow because chances are that he is merely expressing the struggle he is facing within himself; perhaps thinking that everyone's facing the same struggle. If the gospel of condemnation was glorious how much more shall the gospel of righteousness be much more glorious.

According to the bible, there was the tree of life in the garden just as there was the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. The tree of the knowledge of good and evil was not there to tempt man. It was there for a purpose; to be eaten when the time was right. As man would have had to eat of that tree when it is time for him to judge the angels for according to the scriptures, the saints will judge the angels. My own question for Adam is why did he not eat of the tree of life as there was no law against eating from that one? That explains the behaviour of man as regards the law and instructions. For where there is no law, there is no knowledge of sin. The flesh loves to go contrary to God. As a result of Adam's disobedience, God drove them out of the garden so that they would not have access to the tree of life and live forever. Because eating of that tree in their fallen state will make them to be as demons. However, we have access to that tree of life today in Christ Jesus. Glory to God.

Amen! Thank God for the miracles and even more importantly, for the Holy Spirit who is responsible for them. Thank God we can recieve and be full of this Precious Holy Ghost today.

Thank you and i can understand your desire to understand me even though i actually did not expect a response from a Christian here.

davidylan:
My dear Donnie, i have a big problem with your post! Where in the bible does it say the gospel is not in word but in Power?

What we preach is the kingdom of God.

1 Corinthians 4:20 (Whole Chapter)
For the kingdom of God is not in word, but in power

The gospel did not come to us through arguements it was and is still being delivered in Power. Jesus was declared to be the Son of God with Power by the resurrection from the dead.

To be a witness is to be a proof producer.

davidylan:
John 1:1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Is it possible for the bible to indicate that the gospel is not about God Himself but about power?

The Word of God is God but you cannot see the Word manifested without Power.
Every witness of Ghrist must acquint his/herself with this power that came from on high on the day of Penticost. Only then can the unsaved be convicted of their sin amd turn to God.

davidylan:
John 6:63
It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
Note that here, it is the WORD that giveth life and NOT power.

True but it matters who that Word is coming from. For it to produce life in and for the hearers, that Word must come forth with Power ( from one who is full of the Holy Ghost) otherwise, they are just empty speach or arguements.

That is why Jesus said, "the Words that i speak unto you, they are Spirit and they are life"

davidylan:
John 8:31
Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
Ye are my disciples based on what? The criteria is continuing in the WORD and not by how much power/miracles they can show!

It is not about showing miracles as i can tell you, Jesus never set out anyday to perform a miracle.They happened as the occasion demanded. He only ensured that He was full of that miracle working Power of the Holy Ghost. It is not about showing miracles but about having that mighty presence of God with you where you preach. With that presence there, anything is possible. Men's hearts will break and you could even see some  of them weep and shake with conviction under the power of God as you preach.

davidylan:
Romans 10:17
So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

It is clear that you have quoted 1 Cor 4:20 to buttress your claim that the gospel is about power and not the word. But can we ask what kind of power Paul was refering to there? It is the power in the word and not merely the power that is erroneously attributed to miracles. Even the devil today can perform "miracles", magicians can do the same but the difference is in the power that comes with the words of God.
The bible says that the letter killeth but the Spirit (the word!) giveth life! The power here is the power in the word and not merely the power in miracles. All throughout the gospels it is clear that Jesus placed more emphasis on preaching the word than to raising the dead and each time he performed a miracle it was that "they may know that the Father hath Sent Me".

Besides, Paul himself is known primarily for the preaching of the gospel than his miracles which are few and far between!

You are misxing the whole thing up. When you fully understand this thing i am telling you,  you will know that the two (The Word and Power) are in seperable if you are to be an effective witness for Christ. If you Preach Christ and he sent you, you will see Him back up your claims. You don't just say okay, "i will now perform a miracle". Noooooooo You will do as the Spirit leads you. When you are full of this Holy Ghost, you will be amazed at some of the things you will say and do. you will see yourself commanding adverse circumstances and situations to fall in line with the will and plan of GOD. Because you see, you are yielded to the Spirit, Speaking His Word and full of power!

The purpose of  my post was actually to call us christians to a place where we are dissatisfied with talk talk (Where you just talk because you have it up in your head). It is to stir in us a desire to have that tangible presence of Jesus with us when we stand to minister. This one thing i have always wanted to know: That presence of Jesus. Not just because they say He is everywhere but a Knowing. So that When we lift up our hands, or say a word, it should be because He said to do so. It is a call to a more intimate fellowship and partnership with the Holy Spirit as He leads us in carrying out His vision for this world. Then, it will not be a question of i believe or i do not believe in miracles. The Holy Ghost will fill you up. His hands will be in  your hands, His head in your head, His eyes in your eyes. When you speak, it is His voice men will hear. When you touch the sick and the weak in compassion, He is actually the one touching them. The miraculous will be inevitable.

I have Spoken as i was told to. God bless you.

Your problem is not the case of stealing. It is a result of deep-rooted envy which is now evolving into hatred. We know your type. They are not new to us. We have dealt with them long ago and you know where they are now? Under our feet. I can understand if you were among those who ganged up all over Nigeria to see to it that Christ Embassy is finished. But to your disappointment, the reverse was the case. We grew more than ever before, We became greater than ever before. Our voice became louder and they that gathered against us were scattered. They were silenced and just in case you are unaware, they have learnt their mistake.

I was told about a popular man of God in Port-Harcourt who called out from His congregation all those who had at anytime spoken evil against this man of God. He cmmanded them to kneel before the alter and repent even as He joined them and asked for forgiveness as he too had at some time spoken against Pastor Chris. This man is wise. He knows the annointing of God. But when you do not have a master over you and over your tongue. when you are used to speaking powerless empty words, you are free to say anything as you do not even know the difference between speaking words of power and empty speach. When the Holy Ghost is Lord of your tongue there are certain words that cannot come out of your mouth. Because your words are loaded with power.

When you see us rejoice at the Word of God you say we are worshipping the man of God. You don't understand these things. There is a presence that that man carries with him; it so tangible. I recognise that presence of the Spirit each time i see Him.

If it were for Pastor Chris alone, his handsome looks or his polished speach or miracles, i will not be listen to him. But i tell you, those of us who love Him actually are in love with Jesus. He is the one we actually see in the life of this man. That is why it looks as though we will love Him to the death. We are very healthy christians in Christ Embassy. We feed on the Word and we know how to put it to work for ourselves.

Why do you hate us that much? Is it because We have refused to fail and fall like you had expected? Talking about the honour we show our Man of God; We cannot but put the Word to work. the bible says in 1 thes 5:12-13

[i]12Now we ask you, brothers, to respect those who work hard among you, who are over you in the Lord and who admonish you. 13Hold them in the highest regard  in love because of their work. [/i]NIV

The Kings James version says:

 12And we beseech you, brethren, to know them which labour among you, and are over you in the Lord, and admonish you;

  13And to esteem them very highly in love for their work's sake. And be at peace among yourselves.

So it is in the Spirit of Christ to esteem your man of God, not just highly(as that would have been good enough), but very highly. Please don't be angry at us as it is the Spirit that we have that causes us to behave the way we do. One love.

You do not even know what is pursueing you but i can tell you. If your pastor is honest he will tell you. How can someone move around with so much zeal trying to castigate the character of a Man of God. That is evil in case you have not been told.

Many have since been voicing the thoughts of demons without even knowing. Beware!

I guess u r beginning to realise what and who we r up against here.

I have watched with little patience the way christians on this thread have tried relentlessly to convince unbels about the truth of Christ's death burial and resurrection. The truth is, we may try our best to convince them but there's just so much we can do without demonstrating the power of what we preach. These atheists are glad when they see you play down on the importance of miracles. In fact, they lead you on, unknown to you, in attacking ministries and men with whom the power of God is manifest. They know that until you have that power function in and through u, they can always have the advantage in these kind of arguements. The bible tells us that the gospel is not in Word but in POWER! One miracle settles all arguements. Its high time all christians get back into the Word and see what it is to really preach this gospel that we believe; for if you understand this and walk in the light of it, the world will become afraid of you as they see Jesus- the Word come alive in you. By your hands the blind will see, the lame will walk, the deaf will hear and the dumb will speak haleluyah! And those who claim to see(but lie) will become blinded by the light of our gospel. Those who speak lies will have their tongues tied, and their teeth scattered in their mouths. The fire of God is burning all over the world; enough of talking too much without power.

Why go that far and then stop short of mentioning the issues? As for the rest of you who speak carelessly, I have too much rank and of course too much knowledge of God to join you. I know why David, despite all his flaws including sleeping with a man's wife and killing the man; could yet stand justified before God, having his enemies defeated at every count. Unlike Saul who appeared to be perfect before men but sadly had the kingdom taken from him and an evil spirit torment him because of a 'little' mistake on his part. Continue with your talk against this man. You will only end up where those who spoke before u have ended up. The truth is, you do not know the anointing let alone recognise that this man is anointed of God. I advice christians to b careful and stay far from these folks who obviously are enemies of the cross.

Hell is real. A terrible and dreadful place. But according to the bible, not all of hell burns with fire for satan and his demons reside there. They are not yet in torment for their time of punishment hasn't yet come. According to the bible, in the end, all of hell will be emptied into the lake of fire. This is a more terrible place of torment than hell. Satan, his angels and all who reject Christ will end up there. They will be tormented day and night. YOU MUST BE BORN AGAIN!

If it doesn't, why then is it stirring up so much emotion? Why are so many getting all worked up?

Thanks for your exhortation. I hope u are not inferring that i believe a man more than Christ. No, i believe in God and His son Jesus Christ and i am walking in Him and in the demonstration of the Spirit and of Power. I do not seek miracles, they follow me wherever i go. Have you observed the prophet yourself and found him to be lacking in the fruits of the Spirit? From my own observations, he is humble, kind, soft spoken, not given to greed, or anger, patient, tolerant and full of love for God and his brethren in Christ including those who slander him openly to his face. Not to mention his fellowship with Christ in holiness and the power and authority which he demonstrates in His name. By their fruits we shall know them. The fruits i have seen all point to one Christ Jesus. My dear, stop looking afar off for the last days, for they are already here and God's annointing is working all over the world through ordinary men and women whom u will think do not qualify, drawing many to Him. Many will not witness this move of God's Spirit even in these last days until they learn to say, "blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord."

I have noticed that many do not even know what to think about this man. with one breath, they say he is mysterious, using the power of belzebub to work miracles; with another breath, they say he is faking them.

Why don't you belong to one camp and watch your theology blown away like shaft.

For those who say(or wish) it is fake, are you saying the dead are not being raised to day in Jesus name? Have you investigated the matter or you are just afraid to believe.

And for those who say He uses the power of demons, let us see you use the name of Jesus to call someone from the dead, then we will believe you

Matthew 10:8
Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give.

Click on the link below for highlights of the event:

http://www.loveworldchristiannetwork.org/Newsroom/Christian_Content.php?tag=Mjc0Mw==&cate=UmVsaWdpb24=