₦airaland Forum

kambo: evolution , predtermined tht they shd b a man after Nonlife birthed Life!
Evolution wrked dramatically weavg amazg strands of new life until it reached its magnus opus: man and his baboon cousin.
Then slowed dwn. And stopped being so ambitious...
Man caught religion and now the evolution police it out to spread the word..
The gud news tht we came frm monkeys. Share a common ancestry with chimps..
Time is d great cause agent in this case..

Wrong. Revolution has neither goals nor foresight. It is a completely blind, undirected process. The only reason why humans have evolved our level of intelligence is because it gives us a survival advantage.

Its not as if evolution intended to make us intelligent. Intelligence and complexity are not the goals of evolution.

Bacteria have been evolving for 3.5 billion years and they haven't become intelligent. That's because intelligence is not required to be successful in their own biological niche. And from a sheer numbers perspective, they are much more successful than humans.

Also, human evolution hasn't stopped. our species is still evolving. We're just not seeing it because the changes happens over hundreds of generations and nobody lives that long.

*Kails*:
as for the topic,
those are not true believers in God. These people are fraudulent and hide behind
theism to justify their disgusting nature. it's people like them why atheism is on the rise (well for weak folks who can't differentiate true faith from "faux-religious barbarianism" ). #spits!

Ooh, great answer! You really are a true scotsman. [/sarcasm]

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/no-true-scotsman

kambo: ^^^
wow, "30 000 000 different combinations" of the dna makes man distinguishable from primates.
assuming,i'm not a scientist, the combination of these 30 million atg's or cells or watever,
is fixed for all mankind. i.e it is universal dna trait peculiar to humans,
then the possibility of selecting this combination from the 30 million possible combination
would be very small.
And the selector you say is - randomness. nature working its random picks.
the possible combinations wold be a very large number. 30 000 000!.
factorial of 30 000 000.
even a powerful hand calculator will tell give an error message if you try to generate the factorial of 100.
a wrong selection wuld have created beings probably worse than the chimps
but the choice selection , suprisingly made a wise pick...
ridiculous.
randomness doesnt possess such intuition.

Oh for fück's sake, not this nonsense argument again!

Read this post slowly, so you understand. Natural selection is not a random choice. In fact it is the opposite of random. It is a natural way of picking the most viable option out of countless possibilities.

You mentioned 30 million genes which seperate us from apes. It is true that any one of these genes could become mutated, but what you haven't recognized is that most of those mutations would result in a non-viable organism. Over 75% of all humans ever conceived end up as miscarriages mostly due to genetic mutations.

Of those mutants that survive long enough to be born, most would have diseases that render them sterile or prevent them from reaching adulthood or sèxual maturity. sickle cell disease is a mutation of one single base pair (out of 3 billion) yet even with the best medical care, most sufferers don't live past early adulthood, and very few get to have children.

Only a tiny fraction of your 4^30 million possible mutations could produce a viable adult human capable of reproducing, and that is where natural selection comes in. Living things are constantly competing against each other and its the strong that survive. If you happen to carry a mutation that puts you at a disadvantage to others (eg one that gives you a big ugly nose) you'll be less likely to have children because only ugly girls who can't get normal looking guys will be willing to slèèp with you. And if any kids you manage to have inherit your big nose gene, they'll have the same problem as well. With time your big nose gene will become very rare or die out completely.

On the other hand, the genes that gives you an advantage over others will do the opposite. Imagine a gene that makes African children resistant to malaria. With each generation, more malaria resistant babies will survive, while more of their "normal" mates die. As long as the mutation doesn't have any major disadvantages, it will become more and more common until it eventually becomes the new normal.

And that's the short version of how natural selection, genetic drift and evolution work.

Any questions?

^^^^
I'm not even going to bother arguing with you since you clearly don't want to think rationally.

You think human beings are interchangeable like 10 naira notes? You think its okay to kill people to win a bet? You that the presence of Satan absolves god of responsibility for the evil acts he visited on Job and his family?

And maybe you should look up the definition of psychopathy in that your dictionary. I think you'll find that it fits your god like a custom made condom.

An0nimus: Re-read the OP. He was Agnostic and then became an Atheist and went on to say "the God I had diligently served" ...maybe he doesn't know the meaning of the terms or I didn't read it well

Atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive. Most atheists are agnostics by definition. I don't believe in the supernatural and don't buy any of the cock and bull stories that religion teaches. Nevertheless, it would be wrong of me not to at least consider the possibility that there are some things about the universe I'm not aware of. You should never assume that you know everything. A rational mind must maintain its humility.

Atheists need to be careful not to succumb to the same brain disease that is ravaging the religious folk. Blind faith, in defiance of logic.

striktlymi: LB taught you well...

You guys really need to teach me how to turn 'white' into 'black' and make people believe it...

Due respect to Logicboy, but he didn't teach me jackshiat. I was a skeptic and an atheist long before I first set eyes on Nairaland. Believe it or not, but many of us became atheists through independent thought and not by being spoonfed by others.

An0nimus: He was Agnostic and became Atheiest??


Interesting

FYI, agnosticism and atheism are essentially the same thing.

Also, who are you talking about? I hope its not me.

Deleted

PAGAN 9JA:
Pagan point of view :

A God is a Spiritual Force. you cannot see a force.

but you can see the effects of the force.

For example the Creator God is manifest in everything that involves creation.

This is why we Pagans worship the Gods through nature, etc.

Gravity is a force. Electromagnetism is a force. The strong nuclear force is a force. Yet nobody has any doubt that those things exist.

If god(s) existed, then it would be easy and straight forward to detect it/them. Even if you couldn't do it directly, you should be able see the effects of their activities.

Simple question: Why don't Christians have a significantly lower infant mortality rate than the general population? After all, they all pray for their children's health and safety, and god answers prayers. And jesus loves the little children. So why do christian children die at the same rate as heathens when you adjust for variables such as social status, country of residence, and ethnicity? Why is there no sign that the prayers are working?

ijawkid: Lol............I knw your kind.....pharoahlike!!!!..

You're suggesting that you god is messing with my thought processes so he can have an excuse to murder thousands of innocent kids in their beds? I certainly hope thats not the case!

Lol.......Í don't think so.....you guys are the ones who go about yapping about your infallible logics and reasonings........

Nonsense! There is nothing infallible about the big bang or any other broadly accepted scientific theory. The limits of big bang theory (as well as those of general relativity) have been well documented. It;s religious poeple who claim they know everything and reject every possibility that they could be wrong.

If God didn't mean anything to obstinate individuals in d past who did experience God first hand,of what use would he showing himself be
to persons who have chosen to be independent today.....you guys are stiff necked to the core.......

You mean when he showed himself in all those fictional bible stories that didn't really happen. Okay!

Its hardly a myth but it is a myth.....the big bang explain§ zilch........

The big bang theory correctly predicted the presence and frequency of cosmic background radiation. It also predicted to extreme accuracy the relative abundances of light elements (hydrogen, helium, lithium) in the universe most of which were produced by big bang nucleosynthesis. It predicts the distribution and evolution of galaxies and is the only plausible explanation for the expansion of the universe. If you have a better explanation that envelopes all these phenomena then please post it here and I'll be happy to take a look at it.

Did you miss alfamanns thread on hÓw useless the big bang is??.......your fellow atheist debunked the folly behind the ¡ig bang theory.......

Right!!! Some random nairalander called alfamann has managed to debunk almost a century worth of physics. The works of Edwin Hubble, Albert Einstein and Stephen Hawking have all been countered by this brilliant poster on an obscure African forum. All the findings of the Hubble space telescope, the Cosmic Background Explorer probe and the Planck space probe should be thrown into the toilet. Somebody give alfamann his Nobel prize!!!

My bro you are gulping dÓwn one huge MYTH if you ask me........

You can believe in the big bang but you can't believe there is an intelligent designer who formed the universe.....

Like I said, the Big Bang is the most plausible theory for the origin of the universe, which is why I accept it despite its limitations. So far nobody has seen any credible sign of god(s) or any sign of anything it/they have done. As long as that is the case, I'll stick with the explanations that make sense.

Tpfkakambo: @evibrain
job had seven children who died in satan's attack. U think they vanished into thin air like atheism makes u belive. They went to heaven. Then God gave him seven more children, makg 14 children altogether! How com u cudnt see this!

Well why don't you kill your own children then? So they can stop suffering in this world and go to heaven. By your logic,we should all be killing each other and thanking Boko Haram, armed robbers and drunk drivers for sending people to heaven. Did it ever occur to you that some of those children may have wanted to live a little bit longer?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMaK6k4oZ20
And FYI, Job had 10 children. 7 sons and 3 daughters. Girls are people too you know.

Besides,dyu know of d passages tht say "watever u find doing do it with ALL Your might..." (ecclessiatis) , "do u see a man diligent in his business.. He shal stand before kings and not before mere men "(psalms). "the hand of the diligent shall bear rule... " . Is there any of this scriptures thts obsolete today?

The bolded is strong evidence that you've never read through the bible before. I guess you're one of those Christians that cherry-pick selected verses and only read them out of context.

Dyu know, the 3 hebrew captives in book of Daniel, were outstandingly brilliant! - so much for religion being counter productive.

Dyu know that the book of Daniel is just a work of historical fiction? If thats all you have to counter the claim that religion is counter-productive, then you can't blame me for not taking you seriously.

You like other atheists always want to make ur distorted points appear logical. U mentioned job's children but ddnt mention the restoration of his wealth, the increase of his years. Y not com out plain and admit, u are not seekg honest debate but just want to cuss and reject God-even if he exists. Even if he is lovg and good and all tht.

Of course, I should have focused on the restoration of Job's wealth and ignored the fact that your psychopathic god killed 10 innocent bystanders (and that's not counting all the servants who also got slaughtered) just so he could win a bet. What kind of moral does this (albeit fictional) story teach? And please the explain how killing and tormenting people for giggles fits the definition of "loving" and "good".

You must be using a very different dictionary than the rest of us.

ijawkid: If God showed himself to you will you abide to his principles and commands??

Of course I would. Why wouldn't I? If the biblical god is real, that means that hell is real. Even though I object to all the evil it has done, it would be foolish to oppose such a powerful being.

......what difference would it make??....you guys aren't contrite individuals so God showing himself to you would be a waste of time........

You discredit yourself by making these kinds of broad generalizations. Yes, some atheists come across as proud, but so do many religious folk. At least, you don't see many atheists trying to legislate their beliefs or force them on others. You don't see atheists calling for the deaths of those who make fun of their beliefs. And any person who claims to know anything with 100% certainty is far more likely to be a religious nut than an atheist.

So you believe in the big bang theory myth??....

Yes I do, and its hardly a myth. At present, it is the theory that best explains the properties of the known universe at a cosmological scale. When you manage to explain the universe's expansion and cosmic background radiation using biblical principles, I'll take your theory into consideration. Until then, I'm strongly pro Big Bang.

Logicboy03: Seen.


But ur an atheist

Yeah, but but I don't want to justify their belief that religion is the default position and I'm the one who is deviating from it.

There's no reason why there should be a word for someone who doesn't believe in something that doesn't make any sense. If life was fair, the religious folk would be called acommonsensists and atheists wouldn't need a label.

ijawkid: Would you believe if he showed himself??......are you ready to let God reveal himself to you or within you you just want to be independent and useless................

I knw even if God revealed himself to atheists they would still stick to there madness........

So take this crappy write up and shove it right in your brain...........

why would you say that? Afterall, atheists don't deny the existence of anything else once they see proof of it.

Plenty of atheist scientists didn't accept that the Higgs bosun existed, but once it was detected at CERN, pretty much all of them admitted they were wrong.

Einstein didn't believe that the universe was expanding, or in the Big Bang theory, but as the evidence mounted he changed his mind.

Most doctors didn't believe that ulcers were caused by germs or that any germ could even survive in the highly acidic stomach. But once Barry Marshal and Robin Warren proved them wrong, they admitted their mistake, rewrote all their textbooks and gave them a Nobel prize.

You claim that atheists won't accept evidence that god exists? Why don't you show us some of this evidence then instead of assuming we'll reject it?

And only valid, verifiable and reproducible evidence please. No fake TB Joshua miracles.

I don't like labels either. But when people ask, I just tell them I'm not religious and let them make of that what they will.

musKeeto: I think it's to address the abuse of the 'freedom' on campus.. On some campuses, no empty class/space is spared for vigils and crusades of all sorts. Directives such as this coming from the school administration would help trim down these irrelevant activities.

If so, then they should ban all religious activities and not make an exception for Anglicans and Catholics. You can't cherry-pick which religions you like and discriminate against the ones you don't. Especially if you are a government funded institution.

This policy is unconstitutional and just plain wrong.

musKeeto: If true, great move..

I hope its extended to the Cats and Angels too...

You don't pass Jamb only to go and start leading Holy Ghost revivals on campus.. Smh..

As ridiculous as campus fellowships may be, we can't allow people to start selectively banning them. Freedom of religion is guaranteed in our constitution and is a basic requirement for any stable multi-religious society.

If we allow this type of nonsense to stand, don't think atheists, agnostics and skeptics will be safe for long. I'm more worried about the bigots in power who introduced this policy than about the clueless prayer warrior students who are its target.

The enemy of my enemy is my friend. This time I'm on the side of the clueless prayer warriors.

Rubbish!

They should either have banned all religious activity on school grounds, or allowed all of them to operate freely. To allow only Catholics and Anglicans is clear-cut religious discrimination.

Nobody has the right to decide on the validity of any religion or denomination. All the various subtypes of christianity, Islam as well as animism, Buddhism, Eckankar, Scientology, and even devil worship (if such a religion actually exists) are equally valid in the eyes of the Nigerian constitution. No one, and especially not a publicly funded school, should be allowed to favour one over the other.

Somebody needs to sue these clowns!

ijawkid: I am religious but have never failed an exam............I go out preaching , engage in constant bible reading and still passed all my exams and still look forward to excelling when I start my msc...........

Good for you. Note that I didn't say that religious people couldn't pass, I said that prayer and god are not requirements.

The OP no just know where dey pain am for body.....only lazy people fail exams....

Not true. Plenty of reasons why people fail exams other than laziness. Praying without ceasing can be hard work, but if that's all you do to prepare for JAMB, you'll end up as a very hard-working olodo.

And who is sky daddy by the way??......it seems your evil brain has got some problems.......who knows if this your evil brain did not make you cheat to pass your exams..............

Skydaddy is the invisible, undetectable being who helps good Christians cheat during exams if they happen to be too dumb to pass via their own intelligence. It's not by power, it's not by might. It's by skydaddy says the lord.

kambo: hmmm interestg. Heard of a girl/woman who passed Waec @ 8th attempt. She didnt bcome atheist. Wont this guy take jamb again? God is 2 blame! How about d devil? If d devil was to blame for his dull brain, his action wud b diffrent. Poor guy. In d bible, job was offered d opportunity to become atheist! But thnk God , he knew better. And in d end , he recovered all plus mor.

All of Job's children died and they didn't come back to life after god decided to stop playing games with his life. How is that recovering all?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVgZqnsytJI

IMHO, religiosity is a major cause of exam failure. If people would spend the same amount of time reading their books as they waste going to church and praying, I bet that they'll score a lot higher than 156.

The last time I prayed before an exam was my common entrance, yet I haven't failed an exam since. I only wrote JAMB once and got my first choice school and course (Medicine, UNILAG); no god required. The way to pass is to read your books, start early, answer plenty of past questions (if possible all of them) and to use problem oriented reading.

If you're relying on some invisible skydaddy to cheat for you by revealing answers or changing your marks, then you are in for some disappointment because your skydaddy doesn't exist.

tobechi74: Almost EVERY BELIEF IN THIS WORLD IS BASED ON FAITH


you are taught in biology that the a cell contains vacuole ,nucleos etc. Without doubting your teacher, you accepted.

Many of us didnt even get the chance to look at a cell in a microscope., we just belived.

We read various textbooks and were told an atom contains proton neutron and electron. We never saw one but since every body agrees and it sounds reasonable to our ear and head. We belived. Has anyone here seen electron?
Did u touch, smell or taste it ?

You are told charles barbage is the father of computer.you werent alive that year. But those who were told you he existed and you belived he existed . Whats your proof?


This world is centered round faith.

Nonsense. Maybe you didn't go to a good secondary school with a decent science lab. But those of us who did knew that we could buy or build our own microscopes to see the vacuoles and nuclei ourselves. You can devise your own science experiments to test most physics theories if you just apply your mind.

That you think science is based on faith is just proof that you had a poor quality education.

tobechi74: we arent comparing both. We are just saying ATHEISm is based on faith too

Atheism is not based on faith. You don't need faith to dismiss a claim that has no evidence backing it. If I told you I was the king of Uganda, would you need faith to believe that I was lying? You would just believe that I am the king of Uganda without at least asking a Ugandan, or looking at the Ugandan government website to see if my picture is there.

If someone makes a claim that is demonstrably false then faith doesn't come into the equation. Even when the evidence isn't clear, you can still weight the probabilities and decide whether a claim is likely to be true or false. Its only when you don't have the intelligence or resources to evaluate a claim that you need to resort to wishful thinking faith.

If god truly existed and was active in the lives of people, then his influence would be the easiest thing in the world to demonstrate. That fact that nobody has been able to find a shred of evidence that any god of any kind exists anywhere is all the information I need to dismiss Christianity, Islam, guru maraji worship and all other faith based religion as the steaming piles of bullcrap they are. No faith needed.

Edit: How to prove that god is real beyond a reasonable doubt:
Use census data from any large developed country. Calculate the under-5 mortality rate for families who report themselves as Christians. Compare what you get with that of the general population as well as of other religions. If god is real and answers prayers, then far fewer children from Christian homes would die compared to those of unbelievers since practically all Christians pray for the safety of their children. This is a simple study that you could probably do in minutes and it can show that god is real and prayer works.

Show me evidence that god is real and I'll convert.

Pastor Olu T: @frank

Rather you are the one relating faith with just about God with your statement above. There was never a point in time i related faith to just believing God and a xtian thing, or ever insinuating it?

Faith is is believing in a thing by putting your trust and hope in it. When i said atheists have more faith in what they believe than xtians.

what i meant was that for you to be an atheist you have to believe in science which many at times are inconclusive, but when one comes to truly believe in God there are no more incompleteness for everything is made plain.

Right, so science is "occasionally inconclusive" abi? What about religion? How come the bible doesn't tell people to boil water before drinking it? After all, the old testament is full of rules about what not to eat, and how to isolate lepers, menstruating women, and those who give birth to girls. If the lord god is was so concerned about the health of his people, how come he didn't give them the this most simple of advice which could have saved the lives of millions of Israelite/Christian children over the millennia?

And how many diseases has religion eradicated? Scientists can brag about small pox and the plague. Polio, measles and whooping cough are on their way out and old killers like scarlet fever are now extremely rare; all thanks to science. Add all the religions in the world together and tell me how many diseases they've managed to wipe out. Why don't you guys pray to Jebus to kill all the mosquitoes in Africa and prevent the 1 million deaths a year malaria causes?

Why don't Christians apply the wisdom in the bible and use it to invent something useful like a new type of computer, or plane or ballpoint pen? Einstein's relativity was able to predict the existence of black holes decades before one was actually detected. Why don't you Christians come up with you own theory and predict something?

Science may be occasionally inconclusive, but religion constantly so. If you need faith the size of a mustard seed to believe in the science that gave you the computer you're typing your rantings on, then you'd need faith the size of Olympus Mons to believe in religion that has produced little or nothing of use to anyone who is not a pastor getting rich off the gullibility of others.

It's late. Stop talking nonsense and go to sleep.

Dear Iya Witch,

What is your opinion on the way our traditional African religions are being misrepresented, badmouthed and demonised by the followers of imported faiths (and especially Christianity)? Is there any way to counter the constant association of animism with evil-doing in home videos, newspapers and popular culture? Do you believe that our old religions are at risk of eventually disappearing completely? And what do you think would be the implications of this for the traditional way of life?

Thanks for taking the time to read my questions. I look forward to your response.

Best wishes,

The Evil Brain

I confess!

My disbelief in the earth being flat is based on faith.

The thing I don't get about religious people is why they are so unwilling to check if their prayers and rituals actually work. I mean, how hard could it be?

Just compile a register of an equal number of Christians, Muslims, animists any other religion, atheists, and a random control group. Make the groups similar in all ways except their religion to avoid bias. Track them for 10 or 20 years and measure some objective, quantifiable parameters to see which group is doing better.

How many of them are still alive? How many have developed serious illnesses like cancer? How many women in each group died in childbirth? What's the infant mortality rate in each group? What's the average life expectancy? What's the divorce rate?

If some god is answering prayers then one or some of the religions should be clearly better than others. After all everybody prays for their children to be safe, right? So the true religion should have the lowest infant mortality rate since god answers prayers.

This way we can finally put to rest which religion is the true one, stop arguing on Nairaland, and concentrate on kissing the one true god's behind.

Of course is our study shows no difference in many areas or if the atheists are better off than the religions in those parameters where there is a statistically significant difference, that would pretty much confirm that there is either no god or if there is, there is no point praying to him because he doesn't answer.

They should check the public water supply in Abuja. Somebody must be pumping some serious hard drugs into it or something. That's the only way I can explain the type of insane behaviour our politicians keep displaying.

Some people went around planting bombs. They blew up churches. They blew up the UN building. They deliberately targeted and killed innocent who were just minding their own business. And your response is to start giving them money?

After this, I don't think there's anything Jonathan can do that can surprise me. Even if he pulls down his trousers and defecates in front of the camera during his next speech, it still wouldn't be half as crazy as giving amnesty to Boko Haram.

Sometimes, Nigeria makes me feel so sad.

How can we allow the government to just write off the lives of the thousands of people who have been killed by these criminals. Are we now going to be using our public money to settle bombers and killers of women and children? And what's to stop them from continuing to kill seeing as our useless government doesn't even know who they are, where they're based and who is sponsoring them?

In sane countries, the mob would hang any leader that even suggests rewarding such cold blooded killers. Where is our sense of outrage?

From [url]greenlight.com.ng[/url]

By Ayodeji Olaleye

One of the reasons why civil justice exists is to bring aggrieved parties to a restful closure.

Amnesty for Boko Haram will not be complete without due compensation for the hundreds, thousands of lives killed or maimed by their evil actions. Too many people have lost breadwinners, loved ones, and had their hopes and dreams destroyed, some will remain maimed for life. How does Nigeria intend to pacify them? By not only granting their tormentors amnesty but rewarding them financially as well? Which is rather surprising that a few Nigerians, including some prominent ones are requesting amnesty for the Northern insurgent group, Boko Haram.

They have idly continued to see it as a North-South thing, going as far as comparing it to the Niger Delta militant crisis, and daring to suggest that since Northerners as well have been killed, Southerners are not the prime target(s) of Boko Haram’s terror attacks. What makes it the more surprising is that those calling for amnesty have never been heard to call for the recompense of the victims.

Need they be reminded that the Niger Delta militants did not attack defenceless citizens, they didn’t burn schools, churches, shrines or mosques for that matter. They refused to see the enemy as a tribe or a religion as some leaders would have us believe. Despite being a ramshackle militia, they allowed themselves to be guided by the nobility of their cause, that is, better living conditions for the Delta people.

As for Boko Haram, perhaps they do not even have a cause. They show no mercy. All cries or pleas are drowned in explosions. Victims do not have opportunity to negotiate for peace. There are no warnings, no conditions for surrender, no time to consider even a change of faith. That is why amnesty for them probably amounts to grave injustice and felonious malfeasance.

However, if the government finds itself so pressured that it foresees no way out of this crisis other than granting amnesty to the insurgents, then such a programme must incorporate into its objectives, and indeed make priority the full compensation of all those who have been directly or indirectly affected by their actions. This is to include the compensation for the families of those who lost their lives.

In deed, this ought to be the case, whether the amnesty programme comes to light or not. This would ease and sufferings of their victims, and it is the very least we should be able to offer them in absence of full justice.

http://greenlight.com.ng/2013/04/08/amnesty-for-boko-haram-but-what-about-justice-for-the-victims/

Intelligent Design is just creationism couched in big grammer. The concept only came into existence when some American fanatics wanted to pretend creationism was a scientific theory so they could teach their religious nonsense in public school science classrooms.

ID is not science. It is concept that has more holes in than a laundry basket. No serious minded biologists give the idea any credit, and it can be easily disproved by simple experiments or just a few moments thought.