₦airaland Forum

aribisala0:
in yorubaland today there are many places called oke-oyinbo. oke is up or high and oyinbo is white man but oke-oyinbo would mean white mans hill or something like that. this would usually be an area where the native court and other administrative buildings would be located. i know of at least 5 in different states.
they are small districts not towns and have no real identity.
i struggle to see, though how the word oyinbo or ocha in igbo could have been part of the name of any town or district before the white man's arrival which suggests to me that that part of diobu that became known as igu ocha was either uninhabited or had another name that did not include the word ocha. i make no comment here about whether any previous name if any was in igbo or not but clearly iguocha is a name quite new i.e .not centuries old. compare this with many clearly old villages in port harcourt almost all have their names beginning with the prefix rumu-(there are a few that don't)e.g.eligbam,woji elikahia,ogbunabali which really are add-ons to port harcourt  much later but have occupied their locations long before port harcourt was named.it is note worthy that it was the terminal for a rail line for coal and the outlet into the atlantic through which this coal .was exported. diobu about a  mile away rapidly developed into a major trading hub which was dominated by igbo traders not of ikwerre origin. the ikwerres were not and are not noted for their entrepreneurial acumen. they are noted for other things. the other thing worth mentioning is there were several riverine ethnic groups occupying many of the waterfronts of what is now port harcourt e.g. okrikas,kalabaris.

whether or not the ikwerres are igbo i don't know but it is clear that by the time of the civil war diobu and that part of port harcout was dominated by igbos who were not ikwerre who were forced to flee because of the war and consequently lost a lot of property. this confirms one thing whether or not the ikwerres are igbo they did not have any qualms about taking over their property and this was justified by rhetoric that revealed deep animosity.in fact another prominent ikwerre son fought on the side of nigeria. i do not believe all of this can be brushed aside by polemics. clearly the matter remains a very raw one for many igbos and this makes if difficult to accept alternative perspectives. i think it is important when presenting ideas that might be hurtful to do this in a way that is sensitive and respectful. above everything we must always respect the igbos no matter what and i hereby express my utmost regard.i do not suggest anyone change their minds but i think all of us need to learn how to listen with tolerance to ideas with which we have a visceral disagreement. that is the only way to live in peace

Rossikk:
ezeagu said:

The image is from the tomb of Rameses III. An Egyptian would draw themseleves exactly asd aNubian because, (surprise surprise), Ancient Egyptians LOOKED LIKE NUBIANS.

Would you prefer one taken from a ''White Egypt'' web site?

By the way, there is A LOT of ancient eyewitness support for the NEGROID nature of the ancient Egyptian:


Aristotle (384-322 B.C.E.) Greek philosopher, scientist, and tutor to Alexander the Great.
Aristotle is said to have written 150 philosophical treatises.

"Too black a hue marks the coward as witness Egyptians and Ethiopians and so does also too white a complexion as you may see from women, the complexion of courage is between the two."
(Physiognomics, Vol. VI, 812a)

Aristotle makes reference to the hair form of Egyptians and Ethiopians: "Why are the Ethiopians and Egyptians bandy-legged? Is it because the bodies of living creatures become distorted by heat, like logs of wood when they become dry? The condition of their hair supports this theory; for it is curlier than that of other nations, and curliness is as it were crookedness of the hair."
(Physiognomics, Book XIV, p. 317)

The evidence of Lucian (Greek writer, 125 B.C.) is as explicit as that of the previous writers. He introduces two Greeks, Lycinus and Timolaus, who start a conversation:

Lycinus (describing a young Egyptian): "This boy is not merely black; he has thick lips and his legs are too thin . . . his hair worn in a plait behind shows that he is not a freeman."

Timolaus: "But that is a sign of really distinguished birth in Egypt, Lycinus, All freeborn children plait their hair until they reach manhood. It is the exact opposite of the custom of our ancestors who thought it seemly for old men to secure their hair with a gold brooch to keep it in place."
(Lucian, Navigations, paras 2-3)


Apollodorus, the Greek philosopher, described Egypt as "the country of the black-footed ones".

“Aegyptos conquered the country of the black-footed ones and called it Egypt after himself” (Apollodorus, Book II, paras 3 and 4)

The Latin historian Ammianus Marcellinus said "the men of Egypt are mostly brown or black with a skinny desiccated look."

Ammianus Marcellinus, Book XXII para 16


They MUST have been, if all the testimony of the ancients describes the Egyptians as black people!

The only pharaohs who were not black were the Hyksos rulers who invaded and ruled for 150 years during the Middle Kingdom, before they were driven out by the Egyptians.


An artistic convention in Egypt was to portray women in lighter color than men. Also, in order to show that non blacks were a substantial population on a par with blacks, you need to show a lot more artificat images of such people than of one light-skinned person here, and another there. These tomb images do not suggest that there were many non blacks around at all in Egypt's golden age.



"Ancient Egypt was a Negro civilisation. The history of Black Africa will remain suspended in the air and cannot be written correctly until African historians dare to connect it with the history of Egypt. The African historian who evades the problem of Egypt is neither modest nor objective nor unruffled. He is ignorant, cowardly and neurotic. The ancient Egyptians were Negroes. The moral fruit of their civilisation is to be counted among the assets of the Black world."

- Cheikh Anta Diop, The African Origin of Civilisation.

Rossikk:
You think it is fake because it shows Egyptians to be black people? It only seems that way because you assumed WRONGLY, that the first mural shows a non-black Egyptian. If you understand that blacks come in various shades, you would understand why the Egyptians would depict themselves in alternating shades of black depending on the artist.

Rossikk:
Actually, the Old Kingdom (2686 BCE – 2181 BCE) is known as the golden age of Egypt, and was the height of the pyramid/temple building era, as well as various scientific innovations. This was thousands of years BEFORE the foreign invasions of Egypt began, and so, Egypt would have been almost completely black during that period.

Also, there is no country where ''all the people are black'' or ''all the people white''. When we say Ancient Egypt was a black civilization, it means the vast majority of Egyptians were black people. Just like the UK is a white European civilization, albeit with substantial minority populations of black and Asian people.

Rossikk:
Irrelevant. I could easily present a statue of some black soldier or citizen in Ancient Rome. But we know Rome wasn't a black civilization.

Rossikk:
These tomb images shows the various shades of black to be seen in Ancient Egypt. It is obvious the population comprised mostly elements drawn from west, central, and east Africa/Horn of Africa.

Rossikk:
ezeagu said:


Those descriptions/definitions you give are wayyy too sharp. Fact is there is a lot of interloping and blurring of lines in the conceptualization and expression of the three.

Rossikk:
ezeagu said

Logograms are ideograms, which are pictograms.

Rossikk:
ezeagu said:

Not true.

''Egyptian hieroglyphs were a formal writing system used by the ancient Egyptians that contained a combination of logographic and alphabetic elements.''

Wikipedia

sbeezy8:
So Im not arguing whether there is more industry in the west or east. Im sayin I dont see the point in Migrating to the East/SE AINT NOTHING THERE WORTH LOOKING AT FROM MY POINT OF VIEW . . . If the industries were booming wouldnt there be more Migration to the SE? 

PhysicsMHD:
I think we may be getting into semantics, as I was really just distinguishing between picture based writing and (apparently) purely abstract writing, such as Sanskrit.

"A pictograph[1] (also called pictogram or pictogramme) is an ideogram that conveys its meaning through its pictorial resemblance to a physical object. Earliest examples of pictographs include ancient or prehistoric drawings or paintings found on rock walls. Pictographs are also used in writing and graphic systems in which the characters are to considerable extent pictorial in appearance.

Pictography is a form of writing which uses representational, pictorial drawings. It is a basis of cuneiform and, to some extent, hieroglyphic writing, which uses drawings also as phonetic letters or determinative rhymes."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pictogram


Finally, Jean-François Champollion made the complete decipherment by the 1820s:

“ It is a complex system, writing figurative, symbolic, and phonetic all at once, in the same text, the same phrase, I would almost say in the same word.[15]”

This was a major triumph for the young discipline of Egyptology.


"Visually hieroglyphs are all more or less figurative: they represent real or illusional elements, sometimes stylized and simplified, but all generally perfectly recognizable in form. However, the same sign can, according to context, be interpreted in diverse ways: as a phonogram (phonetic reading), as a logogram, or as an ideogram (semagram; "determinative" (semantic reading). The determinative was not read as a phonetic constituent, but facilitated understanding by differentiating the word from its homophones."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egyptian_hieroglyphs

^^^^

Granted anyone can write anything in wikipedia, but the above makes perfect sense to me.

PhysicsMHD:
Then again, if Egyptian hieroglyphs, most of which are just pictures (pictographs) are writing, perhaps it's not out of place to consider the Bini religious symbols as writing. If there were evidence of more extensive/extended use of the symbols, I think they would have been more widely accepted as writing.

bokohalal:
If one or two slipped through how are we sure they did not die during the voyage?

bokohalal:
Let me put it straight.I have lot of Black American friends of both sexes. I actually do not have a problem with them. But this issue of looking for your long lost brothers and sisters and making inexplicable conjectures about someone and their supposed ancestry is ridiculous. Some of my friends want to go to Africa to trace their roots. No problem. Just look beyond Benin for that.Our ancestors sold their fellow Africans because they did not know better.But the Edos did not trade among themselves. A criminal or witch was banished from the kingdom or sent to a particular place which still exist till today. As for wars, the kingdom had it civil wars before the advent of slavery. And even for human sacrifices they were non-Edos.

Jen33:
IKENGA

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/28/Ikenga.svg/200px-Ikenga.svg.png

The Ikenga may be nothing more than the ancient Egyptian god Khenmu



KHENMU

Other Names: Chem, Kemu, Khem, Khnum Patron of: the creation of people and animals.

Appearance: a man with the head of a ram.

Description: Khenmu formed a triad with Anuket and Satis, and was possibly a Nubian god originally. The worship of Khenmu dates to the earliest of times in Egypt, the Unas Pyramid Text indicates that his cult was already old when that ancient document was written. Called "the Great Potter," Khenmu was the creator of people. He sculpted them out of clay from the Nile, held them up so that Ra could shine his life-giving rays upon them, and then placed them in the womb. His wife was the lioness-goddess Menhit, and their son was Hike. Originally a primal force deity of creation like Ptah, his role was later modified to fit him into the pantheon of the state religion.

Worship: Worshipped throughout Nubia and Egypt, his cult centers were Elephantine, Sunnu, Abu, and Semnut.

https://usd316.k12.ks.us/projectfolder/samegypt/%20Egyptgods/khnum.JPG


http://www.touregypt.net/godsofegypt/khenmu.htm

bokohalal:
There is not a single black descendant of slavery that has a drop of Edo blood in him or her.

Justcash:
Nwanne m, Orutaturu ebe m bi, mana ano m na China mgbe obidoro. Chukwu m n'eso n'edu m ofuma. A'nam ekele ya nke ukwu, maka na obughi ike m zoputara m. Obu Ike Chineke bi na eluigwe. Ometuru investments m ntakiri. A tusara m ya atusa, maka na ama m na odi ihe a ga eme.

Justcash:
[b]All I'm saying is that, you cannot be against someone leaving you and yet against the same person staying with you. Igbos will not leave Lagos state or any other Nigerian State, as long as we all remain Nigerians.
I must say that it is quite unfortunate that some Yoruba folks are feeling threatened by the fact that the population of Ndi Igbo is becoming intimidating in Yorubaland, yet they don't hesitate to strut about and beat their chests about the exploits of their Yoruba fore-fathers .e.g. Adekunle, OBJ etc that murdered, violated and maimed Igbos to keep Nigeria as one.
Like I said in the past, Lagos belongs to Nigeria and not Yorubas. The proof is that Igbos don't need any visa approval to migrate to Lagos state and live as long as they want. So, why should we listen to some filthy warnings about the possibility of carrying out a genocide against Igbos? Sebi you think say we go lower our neck for una to cut? God help you sha.
We are Nigerians. We must be Nigerians until we decide to separate. That was what y'all wanted. Lagos is owned by all Nigerians, including Igbos. You can go and hug a wet transformer if that fact is driving you crazy.
If na oil now, all of una go dey swear with Ogun about the importance of being very united.
NO MORE ETHNIC BASHING. IF YOU FEEL THAT IGBOS ARE TAKING OVER YORUBALAND, COME AND TAKE OVER THE EAST IF YOU CAN! SHIKENA![/b]

alj harem:
[size=18pt]Lagos is home for all. We don’t need to integrate them because they have already made a home here. They are in various aspects of governance, from civil service to the judiciary.[/size]

scholes0:
^^ He looks Yoruba.

Becomrichn:
ezeagu, mo so ki ni ti won fe se  fu yi. ege inu naija.