₦airaland Forum

Badgers14:
I never said their was.

The purpose of my post was to say that it could be a possibility.

Also plea deal are 'not always' advertised in court documents..

Recall, the court case was over 30 years ago and the guidelines then and now are not always the same.

So you just imposed plea deal on the case. If there is no evidence of a plea deal, there's no need to suppose it. Court deals only with facts.
Besides, in a drug crime case, a plea deal doesn't mean you wouldn't serve your prison terms. If you have examples to the contrary, you can post it here.

Badgers14:
I am not arguing with anyone..
I just stated my opinion... you can state yours as well and we can always agree to disagree..

In real life scenario, prosecutors often offers a plea deal with a suspect.. basically if you make their life easy... they make yours easy as well..

Someone that was picked up as a suspect in a crime depending on the complexity of the case and the corporation of the suspect.. prosecution sometimes offer them a soft landing..

But there is no evidence of any plea deal in the court papers. We all know what a plea deal is.

Badgers14:
Prosecutors sometimes structure a plea deal like that.. 'make our jobs easy and we make your life easy..'

But there's no evidence of any plea deal in the court report.

Emusan:
I didn't you're the one going in circles.

The forfeiture came from NARCOTIC RELATED OFFENCES.

Okay so how does that invalidate it from being a civil forfeiture?

princejohnard:
A CASE SCENARIO

Mr. T just move to chanchanga from Lugbe to start life after rounding up his YOUTH SERVICE at Niger Water board. Mr. T got employed by a local rice mill in the neighborhood.

Due to the high house rent in Chanchanga, Mr T opted to squat with a family friend, Mr. K.

One day Mr.K brought some large amount of money home and asked Mr T to HELP him KEEP IT at it was a well known fact that Mr T is good with money. As a form of favour returned, Mr T collected the money with probing Mr k about the SOURCE of the money.

Few months later, Mr K was ARRESTED for robbery, and charged to court during the investigation by the Minna City Police, it was discovered that some of the PROCEED of Mr K crime is with Mr. T .

Note; Mr. K NEVER mentioned Mr. T as part of his robbery gang and the money the police met in Mr T account is MORE than the suspected CRIME PROCEED.

Throughout the investigation, Mr T was never linked as member of Mr K robbery gang.

Though Mr K NEVER admitted the amount he gave Mr T.

Mr T account was frozen.

During phone investigation with Mr. T admitted SOME PART of the money in his account belong to Mr K .

After a long court case, Mr. T account was unfrozen and the SUSPECTED CRIME PROCEED amount was withheld by the Niger State government.


Please ;

Is Mr T a thief ?

Does the WITHHELD money by the Niger State government from Mr. T account make Mr T a criminal?

If Mr T is indicted how come his company didn't SUSPEND or TERMINATED his employment ?



If you can answer these questions TRUTHFULLY, then you have your ANSWER to whether Tinubu is a criminal or not.

ENOUGH OF ALL THESE POLITICAL WAHALA....

MAY NIGERIA be great!!

Thank you very much. A respectable organisation like Mobil would have terminated Tinubu's employment immediately if he was indicted.

Emusan:
But the main point is narcotic.

What about narcotic? Read my previous submissions. Stop going round in circles.

Emusan:
That was the content of the forfeiture case.

Nigeria visa or Guinea?

He has travelled to the U.S several times since then. Infact, in 2012 during coronation of Obama, he was invited by the Democrats and given honours by them.

Emusan:
You keep saying client client...


What business was Tinubu doing to make him have a client?

He was a Treasurer in Mobil. Do you know who a Treasurer is?

Emusan:
But the case is narcotic related.

Which the witness agree with.

So come with another lie.

It was for both. You go read the full court document.

Emusan:
American court did and the reason for the forfeited of that huge amount.

What business was he doing when he is also working with a company?

Many of you will just try to defend without looking at the statement critically.

If American court found he was also involved in the drug ring, he would not only have forfeited, he would have been extradited to America to serve his term. Especially in a time like 1993 when there was all out war on drugs and racism against blacks was more of a thing than now.

Additionally, America wouldn't grant him visa after that to enter their country anyhow he sees fit.

Badgers14:
Witness admitted under cross that it was as a result of illicit drug business.. that was the highlight..

I don't know what you are arguing. No one ever denied it was about illicit drug business but rather was Tinubu involved in it to warrant a criminal forfeiture plus jail? or he just innocently kept money for his client in America who was involved, which would then amount to only a civil forfeiture of the funds without further Penalties?
The latter scenario was what happened.

AskNgige2:
A judge who is a family friend told us that the judges would have loved to help Tinibu but the evidence against him is surplus...

It's like when u accidentally killed one person and when u killed 10 people..

D matter chock then for neck

This one came from your vivid imaginations. 😄

Emusan:
It's evident you didn't read it.

He agreed that the forfeiture is narcotic related case.

This iss the part the Media trying to hide from his witness statement.

It doesn't matter. Narcotics related money entered his account but his defense was that he only received money from a client living in America. Judges could not prove whether or not was involved in the Narcotics. If the American judges couldn't prove that, how should our courts go about proving that?

Akwamkpuruamu:
So a middleman in yahoo yahoo is not a criminal right? An azaman is not a criminal

What if as an accountant you have clients abroad who for years sent money to your business account in Nigeria, so they could have some savings in Nigeria and you never cared to ask them the source of their funds?

Remember, Tinubu was a Treasurer in Mobil at that time but he had contacts and diaspora clients in U.S and London.

Nakedtruths:
Guy you dey funny, take that advise that novarisammy2 gave you

In a civil forfeiture in America, the charge is against the property. Tinubu was not a defendant in that case. His entire account was.

Out of all 10 accounts seized initially, only the Heritage bank account was deducted according to American law when there's a suspicion. That doesn't translate to criminal forfeiture because the judges could not prove either way that he was involved or that he innocently kept money for his friend who was involved. The real culprits who were involved were already indicted prior and charged to court.

It's just like you working in Mobil in Nigeria as an accountant and contacted by your friend in America to help him save money in a business account owned by both of you.

It's possible you didn't question the source of those funds because your friend in America was always known to be rich for years. America arrested the drug peddlers who worked for your friend and in tracing the money worldwide they also traced it to your account and blocked the account.

Eventually, because of how huge the savings were they deducted 460,000 dollars because they are allowed by law to deduct not up to 500,000 dollars in case of huge funds.
In this civil forfeiture, you don't have to be proven guilty.

Shma2023:
Al-buraq still holds the highest speed title at 357kph_ I don't think there is any new train in Africa that can beat that record. Trust me, trains depreciate in speed. Give it 3 weeks of service and you'll see 290kmh or even lower. Our SGR was doing 160km/h when tested, it's now lower than 140km/h.

Al-buraq is 300kph from my findings.

Shma2023:
Egypt 🇪🇬 has more skyscrapers than SOuth Africa 🇿🇦.
Fastest train is in Morocco 🇲🇦 .

Fastest train was acquired in Lagos since 2021.
That of Morocco is 320km/h while the Red Line Trains acquired in 2021 for the Red Line is in 330km/h.

theenchanter:
I already know u guys never belly up to the bar.

But the Ghana u're trying to shade appeared on the list 4x, while urs doesn't even appear. The joke is on u.

Let the man breaathhe 😄

Likoya:
Omo, Nairalanders make Una pray for me oohhh, Client wey I don dey chat with for almost five months now, she don promise to invest 50k dollars worth of BTC with me tomorrow.. God!!!!!!!!

Hope say nor be wetin I dey think?

Obaaderemi2:
The guy doesn't know much. He must either be very young or quite unenlightened. And he is new to these pan-african threads that have been on for almost ten years. If not he would have known that there are guys here who would tear him to pieces with information of every kind. He's lucky the thread has simmered down considerably.

Exactly. If he was here during the old version of this thread in 2018/2019, he would have had much more to learn.
The sad thing though is that he thinks he knows shit 😄

Stoplying:
I have successfully proven that you are a fool, yet you still believe you have things to teach me and that I need to humble myself...to learn from a fool 😅

Also, stop putting words in my mouth, I chose my words carefully, so I don't appreciate when some mentally disabled people put words in my mouth. But I guess when you are outclassed and can't respond logically to what someone is saying, then you need to start replying insinuations and start putting words in the other person's mouth.

Up till now, no logic, no back up to your claims, no substance, just insults. Disappointing.

Luzebox:
I don't know much...but how many countries were far better than France and uk..wen they were competing

My point is that: They've always competed even before they became powerful.
Their competition was not necessarily only because they saw themselves as the best in the world but also because they have been rival neighbours even when the Ottoman Empire and other kingdoms were better. I tried to paint history to buttress this point but it flew over his head.

Stoplying:
So it is not completely true. Ok, so what is not completely true ?
Did I say that there is a date before which the French and the British were always the strongest countries in the world?
Do you understand that by "the past" I only meant a limited period of time, not an infinite time span ?

You said we Africans should compete with the best of the world and that EU and USA didn't develop by competing with themselves.

You went on to buttress this point by saying even when France and UK were competing with themselves, they were already world powers.

All I have done is challenge your knowledge of this history and so far, it's clear you just made an assertion from your ass, and you don't know what you are saying.

Unfortunately, you are not humble enough to learn some things.

Stoplying:
😅 So you are replying my "insinuation", not my words ? 🤣 I can't make this shit up.
I think having a logical conversation with you is a pipe dream.

Do you often reply people's "insinuation" instead of their words ?
What other voices do you hear in your head ? Don't do what they tell you to do.

You edit your quotes per second much more than I do.

So what words from you have I not replied to? I think you are confused.

Stoplying:
😅 So you are replying my "insinuation", not my words ? 🤣 I can't make this shit up.
I think having s logical conversation with you is a pipe dream.

This is funny because you made claims without backing them up with facts. Yet I'm the illogical one, 😂😉😄

Stoplying:
😅 So you are replying my "insinuation", not my words ? 🤣 I can't make this shit up.

Okay, these are your words:

"France and the UK were the two strongest countries in the world in the past, that explains why they were competing with each other".

This is not completely true and I have given you scenarios from history.

Stoplying:
I don't know if I should reply this or not, once again you are completely out of topic. It seems you may have some mental illnesses, but I'm not a psychiatrist. It might be that you are just incapable of focusing.

This is just adhominem attack. It doesn't elevate the conversation unfortunately. You can do better.
You are the one not willing to keep up with your initial assertion.

You insinuated:

Europeans, in order to develop and become what they are today, were not competing amongst themselves to outshine themselves but were only competing with the best.

I am challenging your knowledge of that history. I am saying that's not completely true by giving you facts and examples.
You made a claim and haven't backed it up with facts from history. I am backing up my claims with scenarios from history which you haven't challenged or are incapable of challenging/wrapping your head around.

So what's off topic about it?

Stoplying:
Lived in France for more than 20 years, schooled in France since I was 10, I know European history better than most Europeans.
I am tired of morons like you.
What does this your nonesense have to do with what I am talking about ? Will you next bring up prehistory to justify African mediocrity ?

Please let me know why you guys always make stupid assumptions on those whom you are talking to ?
And why don't you ever make sense ?

Living in France doesn't mean you know history. Before Europe became France, England, and Germany of today, they were just societies called barbarians by the more civilised Romans. Those barbarians only thought about looting and fighting. Even African kingdoms and the Islamic Ottoman Empire (later on) were more civilised at a time.

Stoplying:
I don't need to respond to you but, let me just do you this favour:
France and the UK were the two strongest countries in the world in the past, that explains why they were competing with each other.

What I hate about you guys is your arrogance, which would be fine if you weren't so ignorant...

I think you need to read more about European history. Theirs was even worse.
Before they became world powers, they didn't just compete verbally or by writing, they hated themselves and they fought wars.
At least we are only debating, we are not fighting wars.
The advantage Europe had was that they had a religion that emphasized:

1) Going out into the world, all in the name of converting souls for their God. This meant they also got to be exposed to other societies and resources and sadly they also went all out to conquer for resources they didn't have.

2) The Religion was then later interpreted to mean that everyone (even to the least man) must read the bible for themselves to gain salvation. This increased their literacy rate several folds in 100 years. With the way our society takes religion seriously today, just imagine making knowledge of coding (for example) a prerequisite for escaping hell. Imagine how superior we would almost all become in the tech world compared to the rest of the world?

That was what happened with the reformation of the catholic church in the 16th century, beginning from Germany and then to England and France. It increased their literacy rate several folds and gave their societies the advantage.

Obiano13:
Very wrong but correct to some small extent. America was driven by the need to outdo Europe, Japan was driven by the need to outdo European powers, China was driven by the need to outdo Japan, it's local humiliating superior. Japan was never the best globally. It's only now China has become a superpower that they can dream of beating the US. At the heart of it you start by competing with yourself first, then your local rivals before trying to compete with real juggernauts, otherwise you run the risk of 'kupasuka mkundu'. Find out what that means. It would be childish for any African country to start competing with the US or Europe at the moment. We should first compete among ourselves, directly and fiercely, then the competition will spring cooperation. We Africans are notorious for never cooperating, largely because we are trying to catwalk for the west, erroneously believing they will pull our behinds from poverty. I can tell you for a fact the competition between Ghana and Nigeria for instance has made both countries just that little much better than their sleepy French controlled neighbors. Similarly in the east the competition between Kenya and Tanzania has meant that a once 'lazy' country can now actually do something for itself that's worth mentioning. Competition breeds progress but only when it's with the right opponent.

You are wrong. French neighbours are not sleepy. Ivory coast and Senegal are developed countries too by West/East/Central African standards.
Togo is small but efficient country in their own way.
Benin definitely doing better than Sierraleone, Liberia, and even Gambia.

Obiano13:
Thought so too...for instance when he says fastest train in Africa is in Nigeria he should tell us which one it is. It's an interesting list, not least because Tanzania and tiny Gold Coast are nowhere to be seen, cementing how their contributions here are irrelevant and a waste of neurons for everyone else.

The list is maybe 80% correct. Fastest train in Africa may likely be that of Lagos (330km/h) which would become available for commercial use from August 2023. Currently however, Morocco has the fastest train in Africa operating at 320km/h.

Edit : The Lagos trains (at 330km/h) have been acquired already for the 37km Red line undergoing construction (over 80% done).

The Blue line though would commence commercial operations from August 2023.

mzansiboy:
1) Largest country in Africa by land mass - Algeria 🇩🇿
2) Largest country in Africa by population - Nigeria 🇳🇬
3) Largest movie industry in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
4) Largest democracy in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
5) Richest Black man - Nigerian 🇳🇬
6) Richest African woman - Nigerian 🇳🇬
7) largest single solar power plant in Africa - Morocco 🇲🇦
😎 Largest Museum in Africa - Egypt 🇪🇬
9) Tallest building in Africa - Egypt 🇪🇬
10) Largest rice mill in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
11) Largest fertilizer plant in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
12) largest oil refinery in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
13) largest fish farm in Africa - Egypt 🇪🇬
14) largest cement plant in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
15) largest tea farm in Africa - Kenya 🇰🇪
16) largest music industry in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
17) largest stadium in Africa - South Africa 🇿🇦
18) Fastest train in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
19) longest subsea gas pipeline in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
20) largest city by population - Nigeria 🇳🇬
21) Largest news network in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
22) largest car race arena in Africa - South Africa 🇿🇦
23) largest pharmaceutical industry in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
24) Fastest woman in Africa - Nigerian 🇳🇬
25) Fastest man in Africa - Kenyan 🇰🇪
26) largest stock exchange by market capitalization in Africa - South Africa 🇿🇦
27) largest stock exchange by number of listings - south Africa 🇿🇦
28) longest concrete road in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
29) largest airline in Africa - Ethiopia 🇪🇹
30) most streamed musicians in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
31) most awarded artist in Africa - Nigerian 🇳🇬
32) largest mall in Africa by structure - Morocco 🇲🇦
33) most valuable tech startup in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
34) most valuable company in Africa - South Africa 🇿🇦
35) largest economy in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
36) Most tribes in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
37) most languages in Africa - Nigeria 🇳🇬
39) largest seaport In Africa by size - Morocco 🇲🇦
40) largest university in Africa by area - Nigeria 🇳🇬

Not a bad list. Although largest pharmaceutical industry in Africa is that of South Africa estimated at 3.9 Billion dollars not Nigeria. Nigeria is however 2nd in Subsaharan Africa.