₦airaland Forum

Alwaystrue: I am sure the scriptural quotes linking to how the priesthood has changed to that of Jesus, using Melchizedek as description was not lost on you. I am also sure what you see changed there was just the priesthood.

If you agree the priesthood changed, then you MUST AGREE that the law MUST ALSO CHANGE. Hebrews 7:12.

The law that regulates the entire priesthood MUST ALSO CHANGE. One of such law is to TAKE TITHE. Does the law to take tithe still remain while the priesthood is changed? We need an answer please.

Alwaystrue: The intent or the reason why God instituted tithe remained, the receiver changed. That is all.

Anyway, I would like to hear the reponse from the OP, Drummaboy based on what he posted and what the scripture shows.

Again, the receiver changed right? So MUST THE LAW CHANGE! Do you know the Levite don't exist IN THE BODY OF CHRIST NO MORE. If the receiver changed, so MUST THE LAW (to receive tithe) TOO CHANGE. Or the entire law that governs the receiver. The levites were to take tithe and give tenth part to Aaron, Numbers 18. Where is that practiced today in the church? Those who work to assist the pastors are equivalent of Levites. We do not have Levites among the body of Christ. We have Apostles, Prophets, Teachers, Evangelist etc. For you to agree to that receiver changed, then you must agree the law regulating everything about the receiver too MUST change.

18For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.

Now, this is the third use of the word "commandment" - it is still singular. However, the writer had used 2 commandments aforehand - verse 5 & 16.

Goshen360: Therefore, we have two "commandmentS" BUT the writer doesn't use both in PLURAL as in with -s. Since we have TWO "commandment" showing us in the context, one should have expected to have both in plural but no, it is not. This is because BOTH are taken as a WHOLE OR ONE just as the WHOLE 613 laws of Moses is being refer to as ONE - law, not lawS in many scriptures.

Now, what is the "commandment" going before that is dis-annulled in verse 18? Definitely it MUST include "commandment"...TO TAKE TITHE & "commandment"...to be MADE A LEVITICAL PRIESTHOOD, that is requirements to be a Levitical Priesthood. Oh my God, this is so powerful revelation. The Bible calls ALL believers NOW KINGS AND PRIEST UNTO GOD and yet WE ARE NOT FROM FROM THE TRIBE OF LEVI. We don't have to meet that requirement no more. Why? Here is the answer,

12For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

When the law changes, the priesthood changes. When the priesthood changes, the law regulating it must also change.

Now, some folks argue based on some translations like NLT of verse 18 that it was ONLY the priesthood that is disannulled. All we have to do is go back to those verse even from NLT. They even made it clearer.

5Now the law of Moses required that the priests, who are descendants of Levi, must collect a tithe from the rest of the people of Israel,a who are also descendants of Abraham. New Living Translations

From NLT, verse 5 says the PRIESTS MUST COLLECT TITHE.....this is the "commandment" that is spoken about in verse 5 from other translations and in Numbers 18.

16Jesus became a priest, not by meeting the physical requirement of belonging to the tribe of Levi, but by the power of a life that cannot be destroyed. New Living Translations

Verse 16 confirms the REQUIREMENT we talked about. One MUST belong to the tribe of Levi. You getting it?

Now, verse 18 in New Living Translations says in Grand finale,

18Yes, the old requirement about the priesthood was set aside because it was weak and useless.

Now, if we take this verse to argue that it is ONLY the requirements about the (levitical) priesthood thst is SET ASIDE. It destroys the whole context and where the priesthood was established. The context of verse of verse 12 is ALSO DESTROYED from the NLT.

12And if the priesthood is changed, the law must also be changed to permit it.

Now, if the OLD REQUIREMENT ABOUT THE PRIESTHOOD IS SET ASIDE, What happens to the LAW that permits it? Scripture says the LAW MUST ALSO CHANGE If it is the priesthood requirement that is set aside, the law governing it or that permit it MUST also change. One of the laws that permit or govern the priesthood of Levi is, to take tithe - THAT MUST ALSO CHANGE. Another law that permit or regulates the Levitical priesthood is to minister before the altar. That too MUST change! There's also a law that the priest must collect tithe and give tenth part to Aaron, THAT TOO MUST CHANGE. There's a law that the priests must not do other work or own a land, ALL THOSE MUST CHANGE. etc.

FInally, everyone MUST read Numbers 18. The commandment there was for the LEVITES to take tithe and then from what they collect, they give tenth part to Aaron the priest. In today's world, if tithe is to be practiced as commanded, it is the church workers that fits the perfect description of Levites then and they are the ones to collect tithe and the church pastors will fit Aaron the priest to receive tenth part.

Those who say it is ONLY the priesthood that is set aside, and the tithe remains. To whom was the tithe commanded to? If that priesthood is therefore set aside, it automatically follows that the tithe too ascribed to the priesthood is also set aside along side the priesthood they claim is set aside. The priesthood cannot be set aside aside and the tithe remains. If they know how that is done, that the priesthood is set aside and the tithe remains, they should explain to us.

Thank you!

Let's put Hebrews 7 in a very clear perspective before some folks say we only have head knowledge and not revelational knowledge as if you must not understand the text before we can properly apply it or get revelation out of it. It's very simple and eternally clear - Hebrews 7 ENDED TITHE. You can call all your pastors or theologians together to contend what is written in Hebrews 7. Here's is it,

5And verily they that are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes of the people according to the law, that is, of their brethren, though they come out of the loins of Abraham:

Here is where it started from. Here we have the first use of the word "commandment". It was ascribed to tithe. That is, every COMMANDMENT IN SCRIPTURE is ALWAYS SPECIFIC. In this verse, the COMMANDMENT IS TO TAKE TITHE by the sonS (many) of Levi and these sonS of Levi are those who functioned in the Levitical Priesthood and Aaron being the priest. A must read to understand this concept is NUMBERS 18.

16Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.

The second use of the word "commandment" is in verse 16 above. What is this commandment SPECIFIED for? The context tells us from verse 13-15 that, this "commandment" means the REQUIREMENT FOR BEING A LEVITICAL PRIESTHOOD. Everyone who takes tithe MUST be from from the tribe of Levi BUT Christ is NOT from that tribe so also Melchizedek because his genealogy wasn't mentioned or unknown. Hence, Christ in the order of Melchizedek came from the tribe of Judah and was not MADE AFTER THE LAW OF CARNAL COMMANDMENT, that is what not made a priest in the carnal requirement of the Levitical priesthood. Therefore, this second "commandment" is to meet the requirement for being a levitical priesthood - One must be born into the family of Levi. This is what God commanded in Numbers 18. Christ could NOT receive tithe BECAUSE he wasn't from Levi family, he would violate the law of Moses according to Numbers 18. The Apostles could NEVER collect tithe because they understand those who God gave the commandment of verse 5 to - to the Levites. They're NOT from Levi and so they can never take tithe. That's why the Apostle never taught it or received it and that's why it was NEVER recorded that the Apostles received tithe from anyone. NEVER!

Therefore, we have two "commandmentS" BUT the writer doesn't use both in PLURAL as in with -s. Since we have TWO "commandment" showing us in the context, we should have expected to have both in plural but no, it is not. This is because BOTH are taken as a WHOLE OR ONE just as the WHOLE 613 laws of Moses is being refer to as ONE - law, not lawS in many scriptures.

We can also know what the "commandment" of verse 16 is referring to if we are not sure by consulting other translations. Here is it,

Expanded Bible (EXB)
16 He was not made a priest by ·human rules and laws [or regulations about physical descent/ancestry] but through the power of his life, which ·continues forever [or is indestructable].

Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
16 He was made a priest, but not because he met the requirement of being born into the right family. He became a priest by the power of a life that will never end.

GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)
16 That person is a priest, not because he met human requirements, but because he has power that comes from a life that cannot be destroyed.

You can check more translations here: http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Hebrews%207:16&version=GW

to be continue

shdemidemi: More than enough portent warnings from the Bible.
This is definitely satanic.

THE TRUTH IS IN YOU!

frosbel: Thank you brother.

You might have noticed my recent zeal on this matter , time is very very very short.

We have a war to fight to free our brothers and sisters from Paganism, because that is what this simply is

Very sad to see how 70% of the world is PAGAN , plenty of work to do.

Grace (not law) is sufficient us.

^ Grace be MULTIPLIED unto you ^

^ Plus, using tithe as a means to curse God's people and threaten them for curse. A Christians is NOT blessed and cursed AT THE SAME TIME. We are already blessed because of what Christ did, not tithing CANNOT CURSE US OR BE A MEANS OF CURSE TO US.

debosky: If you abolish the requirement for priesthood, to whom do you give tithes? Where have tithes not been given to a priest? Even Abram's tithe went to a priest did it not?

If, by your assertion, the requirement for a priesthood has been abolished, then it follows logically that those acts associated solely with priesthood are also abolished. Do you agree?

Debo, I LOVE YOU SO MUCH MY BROTHER. This people are so blind to biblical truth. I was coming on the Hebrews 7 stuff and just for me to see you answered already. Hebrews 7 made it ETERNALLY CLEAR THAT TITHE IS ABOLISHED WITH THE PRIESTHOOD. They say it is the priesthood that is abolished, but verse 5 of Hebrews 7 says IT IS THE SAME LEVITICAL PRIESTHOOD THAT HAVE THE COMMANDMENT TO TAKE TITHE.

Now, if they are claiming or teaching the priesthood is gone, but verse 5 says it is the priesthood that have the right to the tithe, to whom then does the tithe go to, if the same people claim it is ONLY the priesthood that is cancelled? If the priesthood is gone, the tithe is gone. Every Christian is NOW a priest and king unto God. Old Levitical Priesthood that solely have the commandment to take tithe is ABOLISHED SO IS THE TITHE THAT GOES TO THEM.

debosky: No one is exercising a monopoly here - but your view is a dangerous one which can open the door for an 'anything goes' perspective.

I do not consider teaching tithing as mandatory for Christians because it is not recorded as taught in the biblical record of the early Christians as mandatory. That is not a matter of interpretation in my view.

However, I do agree the Holy Spirit can minister to an individual to give 1,5, 6, 10 or even 20% of his/her income. That is left to the individual and the Holy Spirit.

God bless you for the above highlight. This is what our out tithe brethren need to understand. What i highlighted is what Grace based giving is all about - Give according to how you are blessed and how you purpose in your heart. We do not have a law as per our giving that it MUST be 10% and mandatory. Thank you.

Image123: saying this lie repeatedly doesn't make it true. There is not one single passage in the whole Scriptures that is against tithes.
As usual, you think your salvation is hinged on tithes. i'm out.

LIES, there's bible verse that says tithe HAS COME TO AN END! Will you repent if we show you again?

Image123: useless head knowledge, strife of words and word jangling that takes one nowhere.

Go & sit somewhere if you have nothing meaningful to contribute. What's head knowledge you people scream about sef? If you can speak about the word without looking at the bible, isn't that a function of your mind that also works with your brain in your head?

Willzkid: If you know this, then what is the essence of this thread?
why not open a thread to expound the fatherhood of Abraham from your own perspective?
why resort to sensationalism, and thereby negate a Bible truth?
This thread and its title smacks of conceit ..there are better ways of expressing knowledge

Sir, you haven't told us yet what it means to be father of THEM THAT ARE OF FAITH. Maybe if you do, we can put things in proper perspective. Thank you.

ANYONE who still teaches tithe for Christians, can you please step forward....TWO MORE QUESTIONS FOR YOU PLEASE....from scriptures.

Bidam: mockery. i don't think you believe God exist you just have head knowledge of scriptures..no light no dunamis..enjoy your thread.

By God grace on me, I don't compete with nobody but function in my teaching call & Grace. You can't answer to what you teach. You should be ashamed of yourself. Tithing is according to the law of Moses and we are NOT under the law of Moses but of Christ. I have one more question, if you don't mind.

Bidam: the question actually looks like an atheist question "Does God exist?

YOU know I believe God do exist. Bidam, you can't answer the question, do us a favor, kindly STEP ASIDE, I need Image123 to STEP FORWARD NOW TO ANSWER THE QUESTION. Thank you.

[quote author=petres_007]Kindly define what you mean here by "principle".[/quote]We ALL know that is the LIES they always resort to when scrutinized. The bible calls it a "CAMMANDMENT", they call it "PRINCIPLE".

Bidam: you see where your problem lies..you were doing it as if it was a burden NOT JOYFULLY AND CHEERFULLY.YOU NEVER REALLY DID HAVE INSIGHT ON THAT PART OF SCRIPTURE DID YOU?

Lolz I know you CANNOT answer that question. On the contrary, it was when I caught the true revelations of Grace based giving of the New testament that I became MORE blessed.

Can you kindly step aside for the rest of the tithe teachers mentioned to come give us answers to my question. Thank you.

Bidam: Tithing is a scriptural principle that works just like prayer,faith,praise,worship.It is not legalistic, it all depends on the light(revelation,illumination,insight) a believer is able to receive from God's word..when a believer says he has been tithing for 15yrs and now realizes tithing is not scriptural i get sad..that means all he has been doing for the past 15 years is LEGALISTIC. A believer need to train himself to get illumination from God's word..it is like healing, without getting insight when reading "by his stripes i am healed" you might give up if you discover the pain is still there.We don't give up on God when things don't go our way that is the spiritual growth God desires for His children.Without passing a test of faith in your finances..how can God give you the nations? Luke 16:11 says, “Whoever can be trusted with very little can also be trusted with much, and whoever is dishonest with very little will also be dishonest with much.“

Bidam, is that the answers to where and when in scriptures Abraham's tithe BECAME A LAW for Christians to obey. Or you dont understand it means for something to BECOME A LAW FOR EVERYONE?

2. I used to pay tithe too in the past but it doesn't make me MORE blessed than those who don't pay. In truth, I am MORE blessed and rich when I began to practice the Grace based giving of the New testament.

Bidam: Are you inviting me into an argument that has been over flogged in this forum? Since the op is convinced that tithing is not biblical why should i obliged you? I have enough bible sense not to engage in such frivolities and to avoid foolish and unlearned arguments, which do gender strife, and the servant of the Lord must not strive.

Yes, I want you answer the question when and where in scriptures did Abraham tithe BECAME a LAW to Christ's followers.

Over 90% of Christians practice Judaism, the religion of the laws of Moses and mixes with the Grace, which is the testimony of Jesus Christ. Law was given to Moses but Grace and truth CAME by Jesus Christ. John 1:17

@ Christemmbassey, is that a FINAL answer or you want to ask the audience or call any of your tithe friends - Bidam, Image123, Ola, Joagbaje etc?

Yes, Abraham is the father of faith BUT WGAT DOES IT MEAN ? You have to understand what it means before you can APPLY it.

@ Op, go ahead....I will contribute fully from Monday, this week is busy for me. Many Christian need to what it means when scripture says Abraham is the father of them that are of faith....but Jesus said, "Do not say you have Abraham as your father because BEFORE Abraham is, I was...". And the Jews wanted to stone him. This is gonna be interesting but OP, make sure you finish before Monday because me, I wan step in from Monday, God willing. Thank you.

I have asked the tithe teachers this question but NEVER got an answer. It is mostly the law (of Moses) keepers that mixes Grace with the law of Moses but what does the scripture says? Cast out the bondwoman and her child.

When you expose the tithe teachers, they will run to Abraham's tithe and claim it was BEFORE the law BUT when the teach & practice tithe, they CANNOT BUT QUOTE Malachi to threaten folks which the Malachi text is according to the law.

Here is my question I have always asked again, hope ANY TITHE TEACHER WILL ANSWER US. The question is, Abraham lived and GAVE tithe when the law of Moses was not officially formal, WHERE AND WHEN IN SCRIPTURES DOES ABRAHAM TITHE BECAME A LAW FOR CHRISTIANS?

Tithe teachers, give us an answer please. Thank you.

Man of God, I will join you....just busy this week. Keep doing the good work sir.

Image123: ^
make her husband catch you. Wo, you go speak fluent French in tongues.

Sharap there joor. You think say her husband na like you wey no fit allow me his brother give your wife holy kiss? Mind you, her husband na my friend o. I don tell you make you get ready, when I come naija, I must visit you and your wife must be greeted with holy kiss in front of you. Make we see whether you go come open forum like this come talk for everybody

^ We're one in the Spirit but two separate individuals living in different part of the world. Due to my busy schedule for now, I will only come in once in a while and will fully contribute when I have enough time.

^ ^ Hey sweerie, welcome back.

^^ Are you a backslider? We don't want you back in the world because that's where you were called FROM in the first place. Tell me if you're a backslider and the word can prevail again in you. Thank you.

frosbel: Will address this brother after I have a small rest after a hard days work

I will also be alert for back-up. I'm also at work for now. We, working with our hands and managing our finance well, giving and being given; not tithing in order to be blessed because we're already blessed through the finished work of Christ.