₦airaland Forum

By their fruit we shall know them.

Public opinion turn polytechnic into what it is. It made me what I am today.

Thank you, are an HND holder like me? The thing get as he be for NIGERIA Kai I do not think GOD made HND. Polytechnic is not a school for Pastors or Immam

Good talk

Only old people, discribe HND as inferior now such people may be risking five years . Even some OLDER university now respect and accept Good HND

This is from UK not Nigeria, ishmael he get am?

Those that trained me in 1988 are all retired now. Those that started this equality of HND with BSc in 1976 are now above 70 years old. So to change policy is not always easy. But let fight on brother one day will be one Day it may be you or me.

We shall get there.

This silenced me. I just had to send it out to all the thinking people I know,

VACANCIES IN NIGERIA
Do you prefer imported products? Please read this:
Ever wondered why it's so hard to find a job in Nigeria ?

Chukwu Emeka had just been retrenched from a high flying job, and now he
set out hoping to bounce back into the job market. He started the day
early having set his alarm clock (MADE IN JAPAN) for 6a.m.

While his coffee pot (MADE IN CHINA) was perking, he shaved with his electric razor (MADE IN HONG KONG), and bathed with his sponge (FROM SOUTH AFRICA) and soap (from Ivory Coast ) and sprayed his designer perfume (from France ).

He put on a dress shirt (MADE IN ENGLAND, IMPORTED FROM DUBAI), designer
jeans (MADE IN SOUTH AFRICA) and tennis shoes (MADE IN KOREA).
After
cooking his breakfast on his new electric cooker (MADE IN INDIA) he sat
down with his calculator (MADE IN MEXICO) to see how much he could spend
today.

After setting his watch (MADE IN TAIWAN) to the radio (MADE IN JAPAN)
according to BBC(BROADCASTING FROM LONDON) time, he got in his car
(MADE IN GERMANY AND REFURBISHED IN BELGIUM) and continued his search for a good paying NIGERIAN JOB.


At the end of yet another discouraging and fruitless day, Chukwu decided
to relax for a while. He sat on his leather couch (MADE IN CANADA) reading
a best-seller novel (PUBLISHED IN USA).
After a while he wanted to
refresh himself. He put on his sandals (MADE IN BRAZIL) poured himself a
glass of wine (MADE IN FRANCE) and turned on his TV (MADE IN INDONESIA),
to CNN (TRANSMITTED FROM AMERICA) and then wondered why he can't find a
good paying job in, NIGERIA, !

This is food for thought. Keep this circulating, !

LEARN TO PATRONIZE MADE IN NIGERIA GOODS SO THAT WE CAN CREATE MORE JOBS
FOR OURSELVES

STOP HND DISCRIMINATIONS TODAY

To hell,

ishmael, You know that Common sense is not always common.

I have no time for this donmayor kind of person.

I always ask GOD to punish anybody who will not respect polytechnic product.

Let their car spoil without a mechanic to help.

Let them have no shoe to wear for no shoe maker will help them. Shoe makers belong to us

Let them never have clocks as Orology stand to be one of the courses that was removed from yaba tech in yhe olding days

May they never have light in their street and any where they use polytechnic and Technical product turned

But if you love polytechnic product, he go better for you. Amen

ishmael:
Hnd-holder, when will polytechnics start running Msc and MTech programs in nigeria??

Kaduna Poly has started something. Not untill the laws are changed. Some Universities may be for advance studies only, as we are looking at it.
I do not think there is any need to start something that will not be accepted.
Let us go to the available university with our HND. Some poly already had the PGD and Phnd.
Regards

i heard some  fed. Polys now issue Btech in some courses & they go 4 housemanship, is it? What re d names of those schls. Are some state polys involved?

Yes they do that with understanding with some university. Yaba tech, Kadunapoly may be some state poly, but I will post the facts later.
What do you mean by "they go 4 housemanship"

Both HND and Bsc will go for the engineering SIWES and SITSIE page 9 section 2.3e of the Government white paper of Octomber 2005.

Is it true that a HND student with Distinction or Upper credit can go 4 masters directly¿

There are types of masters degree , Professional and academic

You can go for Professional Masters direct with any HND
eg
MBA,MMP,MPP, MSW,MCA MILR, Msc Finace or Msc . Also known as Terminal Masters it is for both HND and Degree holders.

Academic maters allow you to do PhD you must scored above 60% to do that in your masters.

So for HND to do academicmasters he must cross to academicwith PGD.
So a BSC with 3rd class will do PGD again if you want to cross from Education you must do PGD.
Again if you want to go to Education you must Do PGD E In education.

ALL we are saying no more POLY

Arrogance first before fall yes they say.

zebra:
HND holders should be allowed to compete favorably with even people with masters degree, that is what we want.

donmayor:
They would compete favorably in your dreams

To go into university you seat for jamb.
you graduate with degree

To go into polytechnic you seat for jamb.
You graduate with National Diploma

For Higher studies

You buy form from the university
you Obtain Higher Degree

You buy form from the polytechnic
you Obtain Higher National Diploma (HND)

You buy form from University
for PhD

You also buy form from the polytechnic for PGD

But arrogant people made the equation not to balance.

Many HND holder compete in life even with PhD holder
Check yourself  Esteem before insulting somebody  donmayor you look like Aje  Butter.

Remember the fastest horse may not come first.  Obasanjo, Bill Gate , Henry Ford, Galileo etc never had university degree yet  the compete with degree holders and even became their boss.

Donmayor , please if you are not psychologically sensitive, learn how to avoid frustrated person.
We frustrated HND holders  try to make ourselves happy but you chose to annoy us the more.
By the way you sabi book? no be buy you buy your certificate!

National assembly and presidency are on it, we are waiting for the white papers and the law.

NBTE Assist HND Holders
From Juliana Taiwo in Abuja,

The National Board for Technical Education (NBTE) is to assist holders of Higher National Diploma (HND) to secure direct admission for Masters Degree programmes in the United Kingdom.
The Executive Secretary of the Board, Engr. Dr. Nuru A. Yakubu stated this while receiving report of the Committee on Modalities for the Removal of Ceiling on Career Progression of HND holders in Kaduna .
In a statement signed by Lawal Y. Hafiz, NBTE's Head, Media & Publicity, Yakubu said talks had reached an advanced stage with HERIOT WATT University in Scotland which was established in 1821 and the eighth oldest university in UK to admit Nigerian HND holders into its two-year Masters Degree programmes.
The decision, according to the Executive Secretary was reached following the University’s belief in the capabilities of Nigerian HND holders.
He lamented the refusal of Nigerian Universities to admit HND holders into Masters Degree programmes, saying, the action cannot be justified.
The Executive Secretary further stated that by next year, entry requirement into Polytechnics would be increased to five credits to bring it at par with Universities. Yakubu thanked President Olusegun Obasanjo for the directives to remove the ceiling placed on the career progression of HND holders in the country, pointing out that the constitution of the Committee was geared towards actualizing the presidential directive. The Chairman of the Committee, Engr. Ahmadu Rufai Mohammed in his remarks, decried the discrimination against HND graduates saying only Nigeria discriminates between HND and degree holders.
Mohammed welcomed the President’s directive, pointing out that with the effort to remove the ceiling, the nation’s quest for technological advancement will begin to manifest.

NABTEB lauds FG over BSc, HND parity
Ben-Ose Ogbemudia
The National Business and Technical Examinations Board (NABTEB) has lauded the Federal Government for taking a decisive step to remove the disparity between the Bachelor of Science (B.Sc) degree and the Higher National Diploma (HND) awarded by universities and polytechnics respectively.

NABTEB, in a release issued by its Chief Executive, Prof. David Awanbor, described the Federal Government's resolve to give priority attention to technology education as a major breakthrough in the nation's quest for sustainable technological development.

Prof. Awanbor, current Executive Secretary of the Association for Educational Assessment in Africa (AEM), lamented that the age-old quest for technological advancement suffered a major set back occasioned by the discrimination against holders of HND in the public service and the consequent disdain for technical/vocational education by the unwary citizenry.

Prof. Awanbor also commended the present administration and the Federal Ministry of Education for encouraging universities, polytechnics and colleges of education to accept the National Technical Certificate (NTC) and the National Business Certificate (NBC) awarded by NABTEB for admission purposes.

It would be recalled that the able leadership of Prof. Awanbor, has taken various measures to enrich its examination syllabi and sanitised the conduct of its examinations in a bid to enhance the credibility of its certificates.

As part of the measures aimed at stemming the tide of examinations malpractice, the board adopted a holistic approach to plug all the loopholes often exploited by examination cheats.

Apart from the various machineries put in place to prevent examinations misconduct before, during and after the conduct of its examinations, NABTEB went a step further, last year, by involving members of its Governing Board, led by the Chairman, Senator Ahmed Tijani Ahmed, in the monitoring of the 2005 November/December examinations

Tell me anybody that got there and never swim in billions? Not because he own HND but he is human not a saint. You can start another topic on him. All I know is that this is first time ever that President and his vice will fight corruption to their own door steps.  OBJ has done his own we awaiting you as a saint to rule this country.

The issue is the mass rejection we HND holders face. Regards

Yes it is so funny that people eat food planted and process by hnd holders, they live in houses constructed never by degree holders and yet they hate HND holders it is so funny. We will not allow them too to rest.

donmayor:
Polytechnics should be privatised .As long as govt is involved in its running it won't be seen as relevant to the society.The head of Nigeria is a product of one and he has not to me been a good head .

It is the University system that is now been privatized, yet not a single leader a university degree holder has ever head the country well may be shonekan for how many days self? no basis. Technologist Olusegun Obasanjo FNITE go on we appreciate the little change at least GSM is now working.

I want someone to let me know a university degree holder who got to the post of NIgerian President

No Nigerian leader has ever been praised. I love the present one he is a GOOD leader. Polytechnic apart
Is Abacha HND holder?

That now clear us because of HND he was not promoted, several cases we are looking at now where  level 14 hnd holders are made to report to level 8 Degree holders what an example of
"HND Certificate Embarrassment"   
That is why we are talking that CLOSE down the polytechnics or make them relevant.

HND can not head a degree holder in public service, that is the point of our topic as he can not go beyond level 14 because of his HND so after 10 year the degree holder that can go beyong that shuold have be OGA now.

Take this true story as example of what we HND holders are going through:
http://nigeriaworld.com/columnist/oyeyemi/011303.html

"On May 15,2002, Mr. Okeke who was the Head of Administration of the ACSC was appointed as its Acting Secretary. The acting appointment took effect on May 28. He was supposed to be confirmed after six months as the substantive Secretary. Rather than being confirmed, he was returned to the old position where he has served meritoriously for ten years. During that ten years, one of the officers he supervised was Mr. Hassan Ahmed who was an Assistant Director (Administration) in the Kwali Area Council of the FCT.

Mr. Okeke has not only supervised Mr. Ahmed for the previous ten years, at least three times he (Okeke) has been on the panel that interviewed and promoted Mr. Ahmed. Mr. Okeke has a University degree. Mr. Ahmed has HND, which according to the Civil Service Rules could not go, beyond Grade Level 14. Now he (Ahmed) has been promoted over and above his boss (Okeke) of more than ten years as the substantive secretary of the ACSC without even the benefit of the Acting capacity that Mr. Okeke had".
Never again will this happen.

What made it to that point will sustain it. For your information no GOOD material slept with only HND. We have degrees as well.
Government only solution is to close the leprous Polytechnics or make it relevant.  Gone are the days you have mesangers HND holders are now up the step.

donmayor:
NO be today

ishmael:
E don tey sha; no be lie.

What? wetin don tey, let us know o

Polytechnic heads fight for HND holders
By OYIN OSAWE
Monday, September 25, 2006

http://www.sunnewsonline.com/webpages/news/national/2006/sept/25/national-25-09-2006-06.htm

The Council of Heads of Polytechnics and Colleges of Technology(COHEADS) rising from its 105th meeting held recently at the Lagos State Polytechnic, Ikorodu, Lagos has called on the National Assembly to hasten consideration on the bill addressing the parity between B.Sc and HND holders in terms of employment and remuneration.

In a communiqué signed by Dr. J.E.O.Ovri,, Rector, Delta State Polytechnic, Ogwashi-Ukwu, Delta State, the body also noted that the accreditation of a new course, Mechatronics by the National Board for Technical Education(NBTE) was a welcome development but cautioned about the availability of employment opportunities for products of the programme.

The body, reiterating the need for the 70:30 ratio for Science, Engineering and Arts in programme offering at their institutions to be achieved, said the teaching of science must be encouraged from the primary schools. “This will enable adequate cropping of students for TVE programmes in tertiary institutions.
Noting the gross inadequacy of university graduates who are the main raw materials for the polytechnics as academic staff, the body resolved that the National University Commission should be more critical in the accreditation of their programmes especially in Science and Technology.

Declaring open the event which held from September 19th to 22nd, Governor Bola Ahmed Tinubu,urged the COHEADS to take more seriously the policy guiding their institutions about admissions of more technology oriented students than management oriented students.

Giving the admonition on behalf of his boss, Prof. Tunde Samuel, Special Adviser to the Lagos State government, said the meeting of the COHEADS should be used as a platform to fashion out an enduring solution to the myriad of problems confronting the technology education sector, and also to put the nation on the path of irreversible development.

On his own part, the Executive Secretary, NBTE, Engineer Dr. Nuru A. Yakubu, who was represented by a director at the organization, Chief A. Oni said, the board sees the COHEADS as an indispensable partner in the continuously challenging efforts at building a successful and formidable polytechnic system in the country.Thus, the effective and efficient management of polytechnics is a cooperative responsibility involving NBTE as the regulatory agency and the management of the polytechnics as managers.

Yaba was the first known higher school in Nigeria. It must be from Yaba,

Poly Students Demonstrate Certificate Inequality

From Donald Andoor in Abuja, 01.19.2006 Reporting for thisday newspaper
[i][/i]
Polytechnic Students all over the country staged a peaceful demonstration at gate of the National Assembly to protest the discrimination of polytechnic graduates in favour of those of the universities.
The students numbering about 200 also demanded that the government should immediately take steps to address the issue of allowing polytechnics to award Bachelor of Technology degrees as well as the issue of job progression.
Bearing placards of different inscriptions some of which read "farewell to certificate inequality," "Thanks to NPC (National Polytechnic Commission), HND certificate now have a say," and many others, the students who came from different polytechnics across the country urged the National Assembly to intervene by expediting action on the bill to bridge the certificate dichotomy that is before the two chambers of the National Assembly.
Speaker of the House of Representatives, Alhaji Bello Masari, Deputy Speaker, Austine Opara and the Chairman, House Committee on Education, Dr. Ahmed Lawan who met with the students commended them for the peaceful way they have expressed their grievances, promising the House was concerned about bridging the dichotomy and giving polytechnic graduates a sense of belonging.

He explained that already the bill to give a legal frame work of bridging the dichotomy has undergone several legislative process and was at the stage of being passed and assured that it would soon be sent to the president for his accent.
The students however could not meet with the Senate President, Senator Ken Nnamani as they were told by his aides to seek for a proper

What we know they will never know. But what they know we knew better. Now we are PhD holder How many of them can handle simple house work or want to acquire simple skill? Them be DANFO DRIVERS with their degree. The end of the road.
How many can afford to go to USA? so HND is for us.
"whereas polytechnic students aspire to acquire university education, the reverse is not the case with the university student. However, Dr. Nuru Yakubu said the impression is wrong".

Omofineboy, I wonder if you are realy fine as you are not patrotic, Hear Yakubu on this issue because you want the polytechnics closed.

"HND and Bachelor degree holders":

The impression in many circles is that the university degree is much higher than the Higher National Diploma (HND) obtained from polytechnics. What is more, they say, whereas polytechnic students aspire to acquire university education, the reverse is not the case with the university student. However, Dr. Nuru Yakubu said the impression is wrong.

The executive secretary says the purpose of both systems of education are equal. But whereas one emphasises the use of more knowledge, the other is more concerned with the practical use of that knowledge. Hear him: "If you take the graduate from the polytechnic system, an HND holder and you take a Bachelor degree holder from the university, taking into consideration the purpose of the university training and that of polytechnic, they are equal. But these two people are different. One is aimed at using more knowledge, while the other is more concerned about the practical use of that knowledge.
"The problem with Nigeria is that, unfortunately, because of our historical practices, we lack the appreciation of the ability of people. We pay more attention to paper qualification."
Yakubu says he is very competent to make the comparison and that having worked in both systems makes him a more appreciative arbiter in this whole matter of which system is better.

"I have worked and taught in both the university and polytechnic system. I do know what happens and we interact. This is a national problem. In fact, it has gone beyond national to international problem.
"The difference is that other countries have made big progress and moved away from not appreciating people who can do things and are competent. They now place more premium on what you can do. What you have proved you can do and the skills you posses rather than what you are being assessed on paper to indicate that you can do. This is the major difference.

"We have studied the system very carefully and we know the problems. In Nigeria, this has been with us since colonial days and what we have resolved after interaction is that we are going to do two or three changes to make things better.

"In Nigeria, unfortunately, it is not the product that is important, but the input. You may put in excellent input, which may come out not good enough. But because the input is excellent, they say this man is excellent. Let me be a little bit more practical. What I mean is that people should be judged based on what they can do after they have gone through the process, rather than what they have been assessed to be able to do before they go through the system.

"The point is that somebody who has aggregate six in SSCE or NECO, but comes out with very poor degree or somebody with not so good SSCE who comes out with First Class. It is the product that is more important. We tend to measure too much of the input and not bother about the product. This is the bane of education in this country. If we can sort out this problem, then the product of polytechnics should be smiling all the way."