₦airaland Forum

frosbel: You do not fail to exhibit your ignorance time and time again.

how sir?

seriallink: @Image, did you play the video at all? *Smh* !!

no sir, not necessary in this case.

musKeeto: Ultimate Yahweh slave and troll, congrats.

what's the meaning of troll, muskee?

Kay 17: Do you have to demean your opponent before discussing with him? Just argue on your points

at question, NO

It takes discipline, that's all. Then don't overtalk or overeat or dance so much you're dozing when preaching starts. Also rest well the previous night if the service is in the morning, not gist or browse or watch tv into the midnight.

repentance and forgiveness happen at salvation. There is NO salvation without the two. You can't use one and be saved, they are irrevocably intertwined.

Logicboy03: Dearie? You gay?

are you?

Logicboy03: The same bible that supports slavery or lies to me that the first man has a hebrew name(Adam)?

there you go lying again. you need some rest again dearie.

soccerinfo9ja: Simple. There is no logical proof that a "god" exist.

see how satan is using this one's head to tap soccer! There's yet no logical proof anywhere that God doesn't exist, newsFLASH.

Logicboy03: lol....you know it aint true

You know the Bible says you are a fool, and that the Bible is truth. you know it common.

ol boi, country hard oh. iamsuccess don turn iamsuicide. All will be well.

double post

Israel is God's chosen and will be saved. As for you, even yourself no sure of anything. You are also a cause of pain, confusion and disappointment to some.

Logicboy03: lol......and you are the sensible one?

you remain THE FOOL.

i see Gosh is enjoying the soliloquy. Where are those his fans dem?

i see tislight is also enjoying his hobby. Everyone seems happy at last, thank you Jesus.

disbelief in God is not a mark or proof of intelligence. All these kids wey no sabi anything for school coming here to claim genius because théy read something on net about atheism.

truthislight: *sigh*

the next time it will be 51 and 59.

People like us we dont get easily deceived.
Peace

Rather, people like you cannot swallow your pride and accept you made a mistake.

ijawkid: Image oooooooo......how envy take enter this tori??.....

I just gave bro OLA some sound advice......

he's persuaded, you're not.

ijawkid: Until the end comes no one is sure of his or her salvation.........it is he that endures to the end that will be saved....besides someone like you who supports wars and killings in this present world might not have his name in the book of the lamb.....you better scrutinize your stand...........

envy.

@Gosh

Clearly from this scripture, the historic Melchizedek did not appear as a type and shadow in order to receive tribute or tithe from Abraham BUT to bless. How much more the fulfilled Melchizedek?

Did He receive tithes from Abraham? i believe that issue is also clearly stated.

Melchizedek met Abraham returning from the slaughter of kings and the scripture simply records that he blessed Abraham without first demanding tithe or tribute from Abraham. In like manner, the fulfilled Melchizedek (Jesus Christ) blesses Christians without first demanding tithe in order to bless them, Christians are blessed by the sacrifices of Christ.

Did Melchizedek receive tithes from Abraham?

What then is “biblical type or shadow”?

What has this got to do with anything? Christ is of/after the order of Melchizedek. Where does the shadow come in oooooooo? i'll leave your theories on Melchi is not Jesus, they smell very irrelevant to this thread.

Every word of this writer is extremely important.

Sentiments. i hope you'll remember this soon though.

Abram gave (not pay) tenth from the spoils of war.

This is trivial and unwarranted. The Bible uses the words 'give' and 'pay' synonymously in this context.
Heb 7:9 And as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, paid tithes in Abraham.
When Abraham gave tithes, it is believed that Levi also gave tithes in Abraham.
2Ti 2:14 Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.

It will be scripturally wrong to teach that giving of tithe/tenth is what makes God bless someone under the new covenant even as it wasn’t like that in the case of Abram and Melchizedek as type and shadow of better covenant.

There is always blessing for doing good and for obedience, whether OT or NT. Teaching that tithes is a means to salvation, forgiveness, or justification would be wrong. If you obey, it will be well with you, even if it is your parents.
Eph 6:1 Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right.
Eph 6:2 Honor thy father and mother; which is the first commandment with promise;
Eph 6:3 That it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth.

The apostles often leaned on the law for foundation and ratification of their teachings, they were not bent on destroying it or making it irrelevant. That is what they referred to as scriptures, including Jesus. Today, you guys say the opposite. All because of 10%
1Cor 9:8 Say I these things as a man? or saith not the law the same also?
Psa 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

To add to your exposition,
Heb 7:2 To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;
Melchizedk was King of righteousness and King of peace. Jesus is also the same. He is the Lord our Righteousness, and our King of Kings and Prince of Peace. Melchi was BTW the King of Salem, which is now Jerusalem.
Psa 76:2 In Salem also is his tabernacle, and his dwelling place in Zion.
Jerusalem is the city of David, and Jesus is the son of David. Make i stop for there, na tithe i come talk for hia.

@tislight
i don't usually reply you as you're usually around to cheerlead without any originality of any kind, or you go on a quoting rampage of quoting posts without brake. But let me make a bit of a comment.

Infact jesus talked about offering and said that any one that is taking his offering to the temple and remembers that his brother so have something(complains) against him, he should leave his offering there at the temple and go make peace with his brother befor coming back to do the offering.

I dont know they dont obey Jesus words here and do animal sacrifice and others but decicded to do tithing alone

Offering or gift is not limited to animal sacrifices. Thank God they also gave money and other things in Jesus' days, we for no hear word at all.
Luk 21:1 And he looked up, and saw the rich men casting their gifts into the treasury.
Luk 21:2 And he saw also a certain poor widow casting in thither two mites.
Mat 5:23 Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath aught against thee;

@Gosh

Offering as it is in the NT is NEVER, I repeat NEVER based on the OT.

i wonder again at what you mean by NT. NT is Matthew to Revelations plus X.
Well,giving also has this scripture in view. Let me limit it to 2 for now though ALL scripture still remain valid for teaching and instruction in righteousness. i wonder why you're trying to limit it to one, perhaps based on your prejudice?
Mat 5:23 Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath aught against thee;
Mat 5:24 Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.
This verse has an angle that your one and only doesn't. Also, this.
1Co 9:11 If we have sown unto you spiritual things, is it a great thing if we shall reap your carnal things?

It is based on this scripture sir. Take a look,

New International Version (©1984)
On the first day of every week, each one of you should set aside a sum of money in keeping with his income, saving it up, so that when I come no collections will have to be made.

i believe you are referring to this scripture below?
1Co 16:1 Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order to the churches of Galatia, even so do ye.
1Co 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.
i see in that scripture, a command and order to give, falling the hand of your touted NT giving must be 'if you like'. It says I have given order. It also says every one of you. Imagine a pastor saying everyone of his congregation is ordered to give something today. Imagine Oyedepo saying that, or Benny Hinn. You for don open office thread for here. Yet that is what God is basically saying in this your model verse. And the giving is proportional as God hath prospered him. Good News says "in proportion", Darby calls it "degree". It shows that there is nothing absurd about proportional(percentage or fractional or certain portion) giving in the NT.

This is what the NT offering of the OT is based upon. It will be best to show the world where NT Christians offer offerings like the OT.

Brother, forget all this showing the 'world' thing and make your points. NL no be the world, no disrespect to the forum. There are less than 1million ids here, and many people have multiple ids. Plus not everybody is on the religion section reading tithes. That's why i was 'tickling' your friends who organised a seminar the other time, where they had was it 20 people or so attending, after all the mouth of how they had changed the whole of mankind to 'finding the light'. Lets just talk ehnn, forget the people clapping and liking, lets have an honest and openminded scriptural discussion.

What you call offerings in churches and place of worship today is replaced with MONEY giving and we are instructed to "set aside a CERTAIN PORTION of our income" on the first day of the week. This is where giving so called "offering" in churches comes to be. It is NOT talking about the OT kind of offerings!

Na this kain quote your teacher for write SEE ME. i don't understand the quote oh. Are you against people giving money in churches or what?

@zikky

yep, the Hebrew verse refers to Levites.

The moral lesson is that tithe was received after the law and nobody complained about tithes except you folks trying to force your dislike into the Bible. i hope the below no apply to you.
Rev 22:18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

whether weightier or lighter is not relevant here. If the weightier matters of the law is not relevant to Christians, why should we be bothered bout the light weights. The simple truth is that the Law is not applicable. Don't tell me you are still adhering to the matters of the law? If you are you better comply 100% o! So when is the next burnt offering taking place at your end

conjectures. Deal with the below.
Mat 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
By the grace of God, i still adhere to the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith. Do you?
Until you guys figure out that the law done away with is ceremonial, you will continue to stumble at the Bible. First, they advice me to throw away the OT. Now they say make i join Matthew, Mark, Luke and John put for dustbin.Sorry, i don't take ungodly advice.
Psa 1:1 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful.
Jer 6:16 Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein.

this your statement is not complete. Let me help: Jesus commended and approved the practice of rendering a tenth of agric produce to the Levites in accordance with the law you don't have to thank me, afterall that's what friends are for

And where did you conjure this complete statement from again?

Thank you, if they are still adhering to the matters of the law, they should also apply death sentence to adulterers! Na so na! Why only tithe huh? Smh

Its not only tithe na. Honour your father and Mother, add that one too. We adhere to that as well. As for death sentence, grace don come save them. Grace doesn't excuse disobedience to the law of God though. The NT gives them a chance at forgiveness and repentance, not that it erases adultery or robbery as wrong.

@debor

Please point out the verse in Hebrews 7 so this can be specifically addressed in context.

Heb 7:5 And verily they that are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes of the people according to the law, that is, of their brethren, though they come out of the loins of Abraham:

Heb 7:8 And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.

i'm certain that you know the differences between present and past tense. This practice was going on under the noses of the apostles as it were, yet none of them ever condemned tithes or spoke ill of it. Jesus commended it, unlike the holier than Jesus folks here screaming like giving tithes is the criteria to damnation and falsehood.

Secondly, Jesus referred SPECIFICALLY to tithes given according to the law and not any other tithe - yes or no?

i don't know the criteria or rationale behind determining the tithes Jesus specified. Tithes, Mercy, Faith and Judgement were before the law, and also commanded by the law. Jesus commended all four.

"You can't fail to see the weightier matters of the law and be bullying the light weights."

What does this mean?

"You" refers to 'one' or closer yet, 'you guys'. One can't/ought not to ignore the weightier matters while always yapping about the tithe light weight. Anytime someone quotes a scripture against the scripture, in order to disregard tithes, always note that such is also disregarding the weightier matters.

Again, did Jesus condemn wave offerings and heave offerings? Yes or no?

Did Jesus condemn going for the Passover festival in Jersualem? What other 'commendation or approval' for attending the Passover festival do you need beyond Jesus himself attending it? Jesus also commended and approved it didn't he?

Is it wrong to do any of the above? i await your answer, mine is NO, IT IS NOT WRONG. The onus is on those that condemn what God never condemned.

If the argument is that the Scripture 'plainly teaches', then how come there are no teachings to give tithes in any of the accounts of giving contained in the NT church? Why can't we conclude that the Scripture 'plainly teaches' that tithing is no longer relevant as it has ceased to be (recorded as) practiced?

It teaches because they had been upgraded. The passover and its ilk had been upgraded to the sacrifice of Christ. Christ and His sacrifice is now what is needed and perfect for sins, as opposed to the former. There are no teachings for many things in the NT, there's hardly a direct scripture on offering either. The simple point you and your likes continually fail to take in is that tithe is a form of giving and an offering.

@Gosh
As much as possible, can you keep it simple? i guess the goal of exposition is for us all to 'get it' or understand it more. Remember, you're trying to talk to sheep. Keep It Simple. We happen to love the simplicity that is in Christ, thanks.

Okay, let’s get started right now!
Jesus is not Melchizedek and Melchizedek is not Jesus.

i agree with most of what you wrote, so i'm just picking SOME of what you wrote that need some tweak. The quoted is not stated and is not necessary in this thread. There is no need to generate unnecessary issues and diversions.

Melchizedek was a man

And Jesus was what? a woman?

Melchizedek was a man (Heb. 7:4) and no man fall from heaven, he had to be born of a woman

Jesus was also born of a woman. What's this?
Gala 4:4 But when the fullness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

On the contrary, its Melchi that we are told that he had no human parents!!
Heb 7:3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.

Jesus was made like Him, and He was made like Jesus.

Now, who is this Melchizedek and what is it about him that made Jesus to “become” High Priest forever “according to the order” of Melchizedek? Let’s not guess. Let the writer explain to us since it is written.

This is Melchizedek below.

Heb 7:2 To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;
Heb 7:3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.
He was a priest and a king at the same time. That is the SIMPLE order that Jesus followed Him in, the rest na jara.

Woofff, the thread too broad, reducing greatly the chance to gain anything important or new. Was initially encouraged by the op's claim on Hebrews7 but it appears na same same. Well make i see if my eyes go still permit me reply some posts.

.

OLAADEGBU: He has certainly forgotten the dream he had in his teens where God showed him of His second coming.

very true.

Logicboy03: You need some truth in your life

sure, we all do, don't we?

debor
Tithe was before biblically before the law, during the law, and after. Hebrews 7 mentions of men that RECEIVE tithes. my church also still receives tithe, clap for us. You can't fail to see the weightier matters of the law and be bullying the light weights. Jesus is our Passover and sacrifice. The Scripture plainly teaches of the sacrifices we should offer in the NT which are better and more acceptable. It does nothing of such for tithes, instead Jesus commended and approved it.

Logicboy03: Keep trolling!

Your god is nothing!

you need God in your life.

Peter says "he has forgotten".