₦airaland Forum

adsonstone:
Perhaps, he also declared that Christians should now venerate and pray through her.

So you said. Can you pretend that your grand pa is not venerated?

How and where was he buried? How was his will treated? Was it religiously adhered to...or was it discarded?

in what condition is his grave site? Neglected or well taken care of?

adsonstone:
...and if tomorrow, I say 'I have no doubt that my late grandpa is in Heaven,' I have canonized him...wrong?

Yes. You've done what is done at Canonization: declaring that, without a doubt, your grand pa was right with God at his passing, and is now in heaven.

Jusmudi:
God reward dose wu blivs in him nd always defends dia faith. U are 1 of dem, God bless u

Amen.

adsonstone:
Okay.

So, according to you, Pastor Adeboye has canonized H.I.D Awolowo by giving his opinion about her afterlife, right?

He has made her venerable?

Continue.

Yes. That's what Canonization of Saints is: declaring that, without a doubt, someone was right with God at their passing...and is now in heaven with God.

The same thing that Pentecostals like you demonize, you're now practising.

And it isn't only Adeboye, there are other 'pastors' of yours who are going as far as charging a fee to tell you if your name is in the book of life or not.

adsonstone:
Okay...maybe.

I know every 'Christian' is a Saint when alive and if he dies as such, he remains a saint and will live with God and like God after his transition...even without being 'Canonized' by any religious body.

We all know that. No need to re-inform us.

This thread is about the hypocrisy in the pentecostal 'churches.'

A Pentecostal leader has done the same thing that Pentecostals demonize the Catholics for...and there is no outrage from pentecostals.

And this hypocrisy is not limited to Canonization. It cuts across Catholic doctrines and practices...as we have shown so far.

That is a fact you're unwilling to engage.

adsonstone:
Show me where I 'demonized' Canonization of Saints and show me where I have condoned or practised it.

When pentecostals like you demonize the Catholic Church for its opinions (like Canonization of Saints), then condone (and even practise) the same opinions when your "pastors" start to copy it.

If you haven't done it, the ones who do it are pentecostals like you.

I sure expect the few pentecostals who are bold enough to come to this thread to deny ever demonizing Canonization of Saints...now that Adeboye has 'Canonized' 'St. HID Awolowo.'

Maybe you will condone and practise it when Kumuyi 'canonizes' his own 'saint,' if you don't already do so...since you're a Deeper Life member (that's if you haven't ported to another 'church')

adsonstone:
"I have no doubt that Mama is resting
with the Lord."

- E.A deboye.

That's obviously a personal opinion.
He, Adeboye knows that saints on earth go to heaven.


Do you have any issue with his opinion/knowledge?

The issue I have is written in my OP.

When pentecostals like you demonize the Catholic Church for its opinions (like Canonization of Saints), then condone (and even practise) the same opinions when your "pastors" start to copy it.

After many years of "Pentecostals" demonizing Catholics for the practice of Canonization of Saints, one of their most revered "pastors" Adeboye, has now declared that he has no doubt that HID Awolowo is in heaven (the same thing that the Pope does in a Canonization).

Now the same "Pentecostals" that call the Pope and the Church evil for daring to declare that a person is in heaven...are telling those criticizing Adeboye not to speak ill of a "man of God."

Does Adeboye now believe in Canonization of Saints or does he believe that his own Canonization is holy and that of the Pope is evil?

This is the same hypocrisy that pentecostal exhibit on virtually every Catholic doctrine. E.g Holy Communion, Celebration of Christmas, Easter etc. They criticize...then they copy it.

Hypocritical pentecostals are free to run away and pretend to didn't see this thread, as usual.

Annunaki:
You are just a vile pathological liar like mohammed, that statement you are attributing to Jesus about slaughtering his enemies was said in a parable and you know it. Why are you coming to nairaland to display how chronically foolish you are Telling lies like this to bring Jesus down to the level of mohamed is concrete proof that you are ashamed of the history of your evil prophet and the wise thing to do if you are ashamed of him(sbuh) is to renounce the useless religion he invented to keep people in bondage rather than trying to justify what you are ashamed of.

Let's not forget that Muhammad was a deranged rapist too who Married a 6year old and had sex with her when she was 9 and he was about 55.

mamsong9:
Your problem is that you Christians don't read your bible.

Your problem is that you lie about everything as Muhammad told you to.

gimakon:
Thier religion doesn't tell them everything

People like him will one day lie that people in Maiduguri, Baga, Gwoza, Mosul and Raqqa were living well and peacefully under BH and ISIS, until Christianity went there to fight them and rape their women.

Those are the kind of lies that Muhammad asked them to be telling.

Ask yourself, if the Christians are mindless killers like Muhammad and his thugs, why are Muslims from Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya etc fleeing to Christian countries in Europe...while Muhammad's country Saudi, Kuwait, UAE, Qatar, Oman, Brunei which are all super rich Muslim countries are taking zero refujihadists.

Because deep down, the countries know that the Muslim refujihadists are evil and the refujihadists know these muslim countries are evil. They know Christians are better than them.

mamsong9:
your religion only survived on lies, and people are not buying it anymore.
JESUS is a human being, you people are trying hard to elevate him to God status.
Then Islam came and destroyed the lie, now you think you can destroy Islam by sponsoring terrorism and blame it on Islam.

Oh! Now he says it is Christianity that is sponsoring ISIS and Boko Haram to read the Quranic verses of terror, the shout Allahu Akbar and shoot and bomb people.

Lying (taqiyya) is prescribed by Muhammad and you're his true follower.

mamsong9:
Now you lied again.
The crusaders never protect the Jews communities, instead Christians once killed and send Jews people into exile from the holy land, before Muslims later took hold of the land under the leadership of Salahudeen.

This true Muslim when he defeated the crusaders, he allowed the Jews and the Christians to practice their religion.

But you Christians are liars right from the beginning of your existence and you are still lying.

So what the crusaders did was right even after they raped innocent women, killed innocent babies, you are still proud of them.

When would you Christians get healed of the double standard diseases of yours.

It is easy to know who is lying.

From the time of Mohammed, Muslims had sought to conquer the Christian world. After a few centuries of steady conquests, Muslim armies had taken all of North Africa, the Middle East, Asia Minor and most of Spain.

By the end of the 11th century the forces of Islam had captured two-thirds of the Christian world. Palestine, the home of Jesus Christ; Egypt, the birthplace of Christian monasticism; Asia Minor, where St. Paul planted the seeds of the first Christian communities — these were not the periphery of Christianity but its very core.

And the Muslim empires continued to press westward toward Constantinople, ultimately passing it and entering Europe itself. As far as unprovoked aggression goes, it was all on the Muslim side. At some point what was left of the Christian world would have to defend itself or simply succumb to Islamic conquest.

Do you deny this?

mamsong9:
We know people like you, your are nothing but hypocrites. And you think that you can spread your fake religion through demonizing Islam.
when you quote those verses and Hadith, you know deep down in your heart that you were quoting out of context.

But I don't blame, because if you don't do that, you can never answer the name Christian.

Do you also know that your peaceful Jesus also said that "Bring my enemies to me who said I shall not rule over them, and SLAUTHER THEM IN FRONT OF ME "

I won't tell you the verse, because I want you to research it yourself, for I know that you would discover many terrible things in the bible.

Where did Jesus say so?

mamsong9:
What do you have to say about the Crusaders?
Small liar.

The Crusades were absolutely necessary and good. It was conducted in defence of innocent Christians and Jews (inhabitants and pilgrims) who were being killed and raped by Muslim vampires just like ISIS is doing today.

If the Church were bombing ISIS today, you would surely criticize them too.

gimakon:
Catholics ke?

Don't mind him. Very soon, he will say ISIS are Catholics.

Lying to deceive non-muslims is permitted in Islam.

^^^

So much to respond to.

1. The Old Testament is Judaism. The New Testament is Christianity. Two different religions. I'm a Christian, not a Jew.

2. The Bible is not the teacher of Catholic Christians. The Church is. It is the duty of the Church to interpret the Bible and tell us how it should apply to our lives.

3. The Church has done so in its Catechism and other teaching documents. These, like the New Testament clearly eschew violence and intolerance.

4. If you say it was Jesus that sent Moses, you're saying Jesus is God. If Jesus is God, why are you not worshiping Jesus?

Rilwayne001:
Good of you. I hope you won't - in a later date - bring up this verse by translating it the way your anti-islam master would want you to see it, just as you have tried to deceive us here .

The deceitful one is you. I have Quranic verses where "fitna" is used as "unbelief" or to refer to 'practising other religions.' should I post them so that you can manufacture another Taqiyya lie?

Rilwayne001:
[b] Point of correction, Q9:29 didn't enjoin muslims to perpetrate murder. Verse 28-129 of that chapter refers to muslims of that particular time, it is clear that it was sent down by God to Prophet Muhammad (p) to fight against the Byzantine (Roman) empire, who mobilised troops in order to attack the.Muslims.

Here is what a christian Reverend one of the staunchest critics of islam had to say on the chapter :
" Vers. 29-128 refer to the events connected with theexpedition to Tabuq, which occurred in Rajab of
A.H. 9 . They were not, however, all enunciated at one
time, but partly before the expedition, partly on the
march, and partly after the return. Vers. 29-35 may be
referred to the time of arrival at Tabuq, when the
Christian prince, John of Aylah, tendered his submission
to Muhammad, paying tribute (Jazya). - A comprehensive commentary on the Quran – By.Reverend E. M. Wherry volume 2 page 274

Read more here https://www.nairaland.com/2538115/examining-quran-9-29-islam



No one manufacture lies than the catholics

Another lie. No you want to claim that the Muslims were enjoined to murder in self-defence when the verse clearly shows that only conversion could spare the lives of the victims, not surrender...and you have no proof that anyone attacked or threatened to attack Muhammad and Muslims.

I have another one (out of dozens) for you to lie about.

Look at the picture and lie again that it was "fitna" or "tabuq" that made Muhammad vomit such evil...or manufacture a new one.

One-sided story.

A man started punching his girlfriend because she said she wanted to attend her mum's birthday..?

Abegi!

Rilwayne001:
[b] What you posted there has been mistranslated.
Let's read a better translation for Q. 8:39:

Pickthall Quran 8:39 And fight them until persecution is no more , and religion is all for Allah. But if they cease, then lo! Allah is Seer of what they do.


The ‘fitna’ mentioned in the above verse (Q 8:39) means persecution, oppression, as shown by Pickthall’s Quran translation. When the verse says, “And fight with them until there is no more fitna”, it gives Muslims permission to fight until there is no more persecution (fitna). Critics elude to this passage claiming that the Arabic word ‘fitna’ used here does not really mean ‘persecution’ or ‘oppression’, according to these self-made scholars who have no formal education on Islam, to them the word ‘fitna’ means ‘unbelief’. When it is used in that sense, they’re trying to portray the verse to non-Muslims who don’t know the Arabic language that the passage sanctions Muslims to fight non-believers on account of them of being non-Muslim. However, when we consult Arabic-English dictionaries critics’ deception is exposed. In the following article which can be seen here , I have provided many Muslim and non-Muslim scholarly evidences that the Arabic word ‘fitna’ means,‘persecution’, ‘oppression’.

In short, Verse 61 destroyed your claim:

But if they incline to peace, incline thou to it as well, and place thy trust in God: verily, He alone is all-hearing, all-knowing!
[/b]

I hear you. There is no "fitna" mentioned in v9:29 yet it enjoins Muslims to perpertrate murder.

Manufacture another Taqiyya lie!

JMAN05:
Just wanted someone to see the rafter in his eyes, while he is busy pointing out d straw in his nabors eye.

Only, you failed to point out any rafter.

There is can be no rafter in God's doctrine.

JMAN05:
Just wanted someone to see the rafter in his eyes, while he is busy pointing out d straw in his nabors eye.

Only, you failed to point out any rafter.

JMAN05:
I don't scour the internet to criticise ur church. I was just showing ur brother how wrong he was.

He totally debunked you and showed how you don't even understand what you were talking about.

JMAN05:
The info was not frm the internet. I didn't see u talk when ur brother was harping on the protestant contradictions, but u flared when it is about ur church. Well, thats understandable.

Because the Protestants' doctrinal contradictions are obvious.

But your attempt to manufacture Catholic doctrinal contradictions are weak and futile.

JMAN05:
But it pays to change when one has discovered a mistake, than react emotionally cos it is ur church. We witnesses do make mistakes. We are not ignorant of them, we admit it.

Typical dubious 'Jehovah's Witness.'

They aren't "mistakes." they're outright evil lies, heresies, false prophecies from your organization.

And you don't admit your error when you're busted, you try to circumvent the truth by claim that your "light is getting brighter."

JMAN05:
I believe when Jesus pointed out the error of the pharisees he wanted them to change. It was not hatred for them. Dont u think u and i shud have the same humble attitude? To accept and change?

I believe we should have a humble attitude in believing God who said "The Church is the Pillar and foundation of truth."--1Tim3:15.

It cannot teach error like the Jehovah's Witnesses and the Pharisees.

Jusmudi:
Chapter 4
Art 3 titled: MUST NOT TURN FROM "TOIL AND HARDSHIP
Dere ll b a place or a tim were catholics who do d work of God must b prepared to face d instruments of death or torture. And legionaries are part of d church, Smtimes wen we go 2 home to home visitation or Oda work, we shld hv it in back of our mind dt wat is done 2 Our Lord Jesus nd d Oda Apostles might b done 2 us. We must also note dt wen we face any of d problem d apostles encountered, we shld nt run away 4rm it or we shld nt deny Jesus in d presence of men because he ll deny us in presence of his Father. Finally even if u ar nt persecuted or tortured, we might b insulted, rebuffed, ridiculed nd adverse criticism. Pain we get 2ru d work, d cold nd rain in project or in doing ur work, unpleasant smells u get in sm houzez, bad environment, nd many odas we face in d race of serving God, just Bliv God is recording ur work. Tanks.
HAPPY CHRIST D KING
To ALL

Indeed, God rewards all that we go through for love for Him and our neighbour.

God bless you.

kellybently:
In an interview with Lithuanian newspaper Rausva
Plunksna, the leader of the Catholic Church explains
that since gays are part of God's creation, they
deserve the same rights and respect as all human
beings.

www.codewit.com/north-america/12887-pope-francis-says-he-supports-gay-marriage

And YOU believe you should have more rights than them abi?

Because your sins are different from theirs abi?

You want us to call and beg you for the price?

And there are dozens more of such evil verses from Muhammad in the Quran and Hadiths.

Liar!

See the Quran and Hadith!

Jolliano:
Elizabeth had always been Protestant. Mary tried so many times to make her accept Catholicism but Elizabeth never did.

So how did she denounce or renounce a faith she never had?

With Olaadegbu, anything is possible.

It's one lie after the other.

Just keep your fingers crossed and wait for the next lie.

Evathyst:
What a dignified response from the woman! Experience has taught me that one doesn't need to be emotional when arguing with a fo*l.


Especially those ones that hide under the cloak of 'Manhood'


Proudly a feminist! 100%!

What is "feminism?"

I have been looking for a feminist to educate me.

@accountable,

I told you that we share in God's omnipresence, omnipotence and omniscience.

You refused. You said God's omnipotence, omniscience and omnipresence cannot dwell in us because it's too big for us.

Then I showed you from the Bible that we share in God himself, in all his fullness. In fact, we don't just share, he actually dwells in us.

Suddenly you remembered that your God dwells in us.

Now does God's omnipotence, omniscience and omnipresence dwell with God in us...or does God leave it out before coming to dwell in us?

In other words, are we partakers of God (with his '3 omnis') or are we partakers of God (without his '3 omnis)?

These are all the questions you've been dubiously dodging...Yet you are shamelessly calling me 'insincere.'

@accountable...

1. You say it couldn't have been Jesus that was held down in Persia because Jesus had not come in the flesh. Who then was held down by Jacob? Jesus or an Angel?

2. Who touched Jeremiah's lips? Jesus or an Angel?

3. You say at the time of Daniel, Jesus hadn't come in flesh. Are you aware that Daniel was being told about future events?

3. After reading Daniel 10 and Rev 1, do you still insist that it wasn't Jesus but an Angel that spoke in Daniel 10?

@accountable,

1. 'All the angels' the Psalmist is talking to in Psalm 103...are they in heaven or on earth? Are they all in close proximity to the Psalmist? If not, how did they hear him?

2. You said angels and saints are aware of the events on earth. Are our prayers not events?

3. You said saints gain the kind of glorious body that Jesus and the angels have. Do glorious bodies have the ability to hear prayers on earth and move to and fro heaven and earth?