Comes naturally to me NOT to forgive easily,i ignore instead..Sorry.Maybe i'll change in future.

I would advice the lady to move on and forget you as this marriage will definitely turn into a nightmare for her in the not too distant future.
She is an excellent person from all you write and i'm sure will find a man deserving of her,who even though will want her a bit more polished won't view her failings in this as such a huge deal.

Nothing you do will polish her to the extent you want..being 'local' from birth really has no cure.She will clean up a lot but will never be posh posh,so this your exercise in changing her to suit your taste is a waste.

See all the changes you want her to implement just to suit you?How are you yourself?When you go out and see all them fly chicks who speak properly and know how to use a fish knife you'll start tormenting the poor woman.

You are also stating that she will have to meet your standard so you won't cheat.I wonder how she feels having to jump so many hoops for a mere man?Very depressed i presume but will be smiling through it all.It wont get better ,you will be frustrated because you will always be correcting her and for her she will get irritated at having you sniping at her feet every second.

Nothing wrong in what you want,i just question your wisdom in embarking on changing a person completely and then giving conditions ontop.Go for someone who meets your approval,who wont be suffering through walking on eggshells in the bid to please you.The poor girl will definitely have a massive chip on her shoulder by the time you are through with her.

This union is dead on arrival,i suggest she leaves you for her future sanity.Yes it will hurt,but it will be better for her in the long run.But will you both listen? NO. I'm expecting stories that touch soon.
Cheers!!

To be honest, being a friend to an abused person is emotionally draining.You keep talking,supporting,helping and yet years pass by and the same cycle occurs over and over.It kills your morale totally repeating the same things over and over.Leave- you become the enemy,you are even reported to the abuser. In fact,in one case I had to cut off ties to preserve my sanity. How do you help someone who's so damaged that she refuses to be helped? The irony is that all the ones I know work as professionals,so its not even about financial dependence.


On the flip side,I have never seen a man who has come to report his wife for beating him. it may feel like a blow to his manhood to be battered by a female.Imagine how ridiculed he would be if he enters naija police station to say his wife beat him up? How many people would even intervene if a woman is beating a man?

I witnessed this one on the streets of UK,this man was being punched by his lady. They were both standing outside the car and she was shoving him and landing blows,all he was doing was raising his hands to fend off the blows.He didn't even try to walk away and people were looking and passing. This was an able bodied man o and a slight looking lady.She was just screaming and punching him.
To my greatest shame and regret,I didn't do anything,didn't dial 999,nothing. I just told myself if this man as huge as he is can't defend himself from this woman is it now me that will risk my life? I walked on like many others,don't know what eventually happened.I know if it was a woman I'd have been more proactive and I can bet passersby would have jumped in sharply and even dashed the abuser a few blows.
Domestic violence against men should also be taken seriously.

Thanks for this thread cococandy,fantastic! Can you also touch on how we can render help to victims who we are close to without going mad.

May her soul RIP
I wonder how she managed to jump out of a building or jump in front of a car,damage one side of her body then walk to the house or where she was found then put a cellophane bag over her head
HOW THE HELL IS THAT POSSIBLE??
Not to point fingers o but if the person she's living with is a pathologist,isn't it remotely possible (if im to assume the worst)that the whole thing was staged and a story cooked up? And then for an autopsy to be carried out by the colleagues of the same person in this naija??
A thorough investigation should be carried out if possible by pathologists in a totally different place for the case to be unbiased because already the story doesn't add up.if she was murdered,it could be a thief,musnt be her husband that killed her.Let murder be ruled out first then suspects arraigned.

For those saying he's gentle,he's kind,please how do people that perpetuate domestic violence look? Do you expect them to carry placard saying I beat my wife or I beat my husband?? NEVER!! It's usually people who you would never ever suspect.Marriages where all appears to be too perfect.

So now it's now being said that she was suicidal because she's dead and can't defend herself? Chaii. Depression is an ugly disease so when did it start? What drove her to cutting herself? Where are her friends? Where did rumors of domestic violence come from.If indeed she was being beaten up and there are whispers that means she at least told someone.Are they afraid to speak up?Theres definitely someone who knows.And families are always quick to avoid scandals because fingers will be pointed at them for allowing and maybe coercing their child to remain in a bad marriage.Who knows?

For someone to cut herself or be so depressed it means she was deeply unhappy,This extent of depression is hard/ impossible to hide infact functioning on a day to day basis qould have been difficult for her.How come none of her friends knew she had this sort death wish? Then again if she was being beaten up,chances are that she was isolated from friends and family.

Unfortunately this is Naija so chances of justice or at least a clean investigation are zero.

I hope she's finally found peace.

Nb someone said jumpers cover their faces before jumping,why class her a jumper? Has she jumped before?How many jumpers cover their faces?So she secured the bag tied it well well then jumped?

Her wedding dress was sleeveless so no cuts on her wrists so that at least shows that she became severely depressed after marriage, does that not at least say something?A very happy marriage with a suicidal wife?

Many doctors are depressed and are getting treatment I don't see how that would destroy her budding surgical career after all she was carrying out her duties excellently despite her misery.Where is the psychiatrist and where are her notes?I hope this is investigated and a statement put out.

All the explanations sound so convenient,too perfect but then who am I to judge?

^^^

I'm not really a strong believer in predisposition or passion being a persons guidance towards career choice.I save my passions for my hobbies.Especially when you are not gifted enough to be an entrepreneur.If you are going to join the salaried work force,you'd best pick one that's financially rewarding at least.
Very very few people are lucky enough to be passionate about their jobs and make a good living out of it.

I believe that theres no course or subject that cannot be conquered with constant practice, discipline and focus.If you practice maths often,it becomes easier. Yes,you may not feel the maths oozing through your veins but you will be comfortable and do well enough.

I was a bloody whiz at literature and found the arts easier but I did the sciences..Yes there are some people gifted with deeper understanding of those stem courses but with persistence you can be as good.

My mother drummed into her children to choose courses which are relevant no matter what part of the world you are in.

The girl child should be taught from day one that theres NO course of study specifically made for men,theres no job she cannot do. If physically tasking,is it not women that are body builders?Nurses are great but why be a nurse when you can put in extra effort and become a doctor?She should always push and push till she gets the best out of herself.If physics ,chemistry are a bit tricky,put in more energy and you will do well.
Yes the arts are relevant but won't build planes or find the cure to cancer.

Nothing will stop him.
I say so because he has reached the point where the woman's feelings are more important to him than those of his wife and children.
And why not really?? It's not like his marriage will even change after the act if his wife finds out,he knows she will be pressured to forgive and go on.So what's the incentive not to go ahead sef??
10 whole years,hehehehehe.Highest na to say sorry to wifey and life resumes as usual.Then when she weeps tears of joy at your funeral them go say na witch.
Do it already and spare us the long story.

@drt
How am I being negative? I just wrote about how a lot of us came to the UK for Plab2
Nawa oo,this kain aggression.
I'm out of here o jare.
Just know that your destiny is in your hands,no uncle or Aunty helped many of us.We saved like crazy, did plab2 and entered the system.
Your uncle may not want to invite you cos along with the letter he will have to give you his bank statement to prove that he will be able to sponsor your stay as well since you cannot show your own finances.
I'm pretty sure he wouldn't want to do that cos that would mean you'd be privy to his financial situation and its not like you are close to him at all.

Best you forget he's there and forge ahead alone.
Good luck.

@drt
You do not need invitation letter or accommodation from your uncle to be able to do your plab2.
I believe there is a visa available for people who need to come to the UK to do their exams.
You will need to go for the plab classes,you get accommodation around there and pay for it,don't know what you need your uncle for.All man for himself, its what all your fellow doctors did and are still doing.
Good luck.

So u will die without bj? ;DD
Foolish man. Divorce naaa..

Who wants to bet that this man got hiv by sleeping around? I'd bet my big toe.If it was through other means he would have been more forthcoming.

So he wants her to stay abi? Yet was a heartless monster by not telling her for months and probably hoping shed catch it so he'd pin it on her naija style.Na God catch am,wicked soul! He should have given her the option to stay or go by confessing and coming clean.Imagine if it was her that was infected first, hed have thoroughly disgraced her and thrown her out.

Have seen soo many cases where the hiv patient would try to coerce the doctors into forcing medication on their spouses and also telling heavy lies to cover up.I refused to take part in such.Even cases of the infected partner refusing to tell the spouse ( more rampant in men). So depressing.

Thank God for STD trace here.It is a crime to purposely infect someone.If you have an STD,you are counselled and asked to inform your partner. If you refuse or are not comfortable, the clinic invites the partner & all sex ual contacts, runs tests and administers treatment.If una reach house make una kill una self but an epidemic must be prevented.

Abeg woman pack your things and gerrout. No children ontop so what's the point in staying.Next thing you'll wake up to see him hovering over you with a syringe filled with infected blood. This man de find who go de change him pampers when gbege go set.Totally against him cos he was playing Russian roulette with her life.Wicked thing.

A useless man who waits to be served hand and foot is worse.

Theres no way your wife is actually overdue as such and you are still typing here.I hope you realise the chances of a still birth are increased.Can you imagine this man delaying and leaving his wife at home cos he wants to do effizy of private hosp ontop money when him no get,risking the life of his wife and baby.Don't worry, by the time labour starts no one will advice you.

I find it quite odd that you expect people to donate 200k for you to birth your baby privately when you can go to a general hospital for a quarter of the cost and at a general hosp you have ALL the consultants there meaning you are actually safer incase of complications.

Funny enough,the people you want money from probably don't go private for their own delivery. You CANNOT afford it.CUT YOUR COAT ACCORDING TO YOUR SIZE.

This OP cannot be for real.
RUBBISH!

Everyone's home is different.
If a woman feels like its just not her cup of tea to dish out food,it's who she is.Does that make her a bad person?NO.Does that make her home less happy than yours? No.
If the man grew up in a home where his mother dished the food and gazed adoringly at her husband while he ate every morsel,it's understandable that he'd expect to see the same replicated in his home.
If 2 people like this jam whats the solution? They must meet mid way or resentment will build up.
I'd be offended if i'm told 'I wont eat because service is not complete'..wtf? Some other person would laugh it off.I'm not also one to be bothered if food is rejected...I grew up seeing my dad doing this very often so i became immune to it so if i was the wife in this situation declining to eat would be wasted on me.
In our home we eat together most times,sometimes he dishes for me sometimes i dish for him..Depends on what's happening.I may just not be in the mood to fix anything and he takes over.Does it make his blokos shrivel?NO.Does it make me grow a blokos?NO.Point is we are serving each other happily.

Forcing someone to do something makes the person more resistant and resentful.We shouldn't force our expectations on others.That your father or ancestor did it doesn't mean your partner will want to do it.Happiness of a home is dependent on compromise and every member feeling included.
The fact that someone may view this as a form of slavery is up to that person affected,after all everyone comes from a different place and from different standards.If Ms A feels she's too busy to dish food or sit around chatting,i don't know her situation so cannot judge. However,meal times are a good time for a family to bond. If she feels she has to provide 'service' by forcefully dishing the food and waiting on him hand and food while he eats,its easy to see how she won't want to spend extra time in his company.. If such an act does not come from a loving place,its useless.

I grew up watching my dad served hand and foot in this kind of manner,it was a chore to my mother. Ofcourse I resented such an act and knew I wouldn't be forced into doing such a thing.However,I went and married a man who is so chilled and didn't make a big deal of serve me and watch me eat.It just flowed for us cos I know he'd do same for me and the kids without batting an eyelid.

Different strokes different folks.If a man lovingly leads by example,or kindly shows what he likes, his wife will turn into certified mugu for him.
Simple as ABC

That's the myth that's perpetrated to keep driving a wedge between women.
If i have conflict with someone,its about personality and opinions not gender.
I hear a lot of people say they prefer to have male friends bla bla women are this women are that,their own cup of tea.I actually view such people as odd or with a chip on their shoulder but i still respect their choices.

Not being able to manage relationships with people of your gender in my opinion speaks more about you rather than them.
I actually prefer being friendless,reduces potential for strife..

Cheers!

mascaraWand:





Thank you.
But I didn't say I was going to sleep with him.

Pardon me for that assumption.I just feel that tangled emotions and being in close proximity with a man you are in love with for a period of time will most likely lead to s ex.I could be wrong.All the things i've read on NL have made me believe that if you even go to visit a guy you are asking for s ex.I hope he shares your views too

Good luck and please update when you finally decide.

What's special about spending the night with him? Must you do that?All the chatting and hugging and smooches can happen without you sleeping over.
Your bond will not get stronger at night time,so use the days you have wisely.I don't see the point in telling lies to your parents about a guy who you've not even introduced to them all because you want to play wife at night. Just saying oo not judging you.There's no parent that would gladly wave you off and wish you safe journey if you tell them you are going to sleep with a man ,they'd only be comfy if you are married to him.Spending weekend = s ex.I'm sure no father or mother would want that image in their heads.

If you really must have s ex please remember to use protection.It's not like you'll have a better or gasm at night.All na the same no matter what time of the day it is.

Good luck..

Thank you Salsera,Sagamite,Tearoses.
Much appreciated and will try my best.
Salsera please can you tell me the author of the books and if I can purchase on Amazon?

@ Discussion
North of the border,theres a much higher percentage of benefits claimants compared to the general population.
The SNP are agitating for independence,their people want money to be collected from the rich and dashed to the poor.For some reason the rich are vilified and blamed for every problem,and those lower down the rung continue to stay there,no ambition as long as the benefits keep coming.
They have been promised some sort of utopia by SNP where the well off will be taxed to death and a more equal society will materialise with excess money for benefits.

Unfortunately there's no money to keep all the promises and taxing the rich much higher will only cause them to pack their things and escape.

In 2016 we will now have our own tax rates,people are waiting to see what will happen,whether there will be tax raises to punish the well off or whether things will be left alone as usual.if they want to raise taxes,they must start from the 20% rate so the less better off will still be hit.

An implosion is pending,I don't see any other way.Over tax the higher earners they run,don't raise taxes SNP core voters will feel betrayed.Even the anti-english sentiment on the rise every corner you go.

When the bite begins to set in for real,the main casualties are usually immigrants who will be blamed for taking up the jobs and taking their social housing and taking their benefits

Funny thing they don't know is that any Non Eu immigrant who hasn't settled and is on a work visa CANNOT claim anything. In fact, you are banned from claiming 'public' funds while being taxed so heavily.A £200 pounds/year Nhs fee has now been made compulsory.Is this in the news and publicised? No.The visa fees for settlement increased from 1093 to 1500 without warning.Did anyone hear about it? No. Everyday migrants are slagged off because there needs to be a scapegoat meanwhile pesin dey busy treating them in hospital from morning to night without better pay yet no gratitude.

People are tired of being taxed so much to support people who appear not to want to work.No one wants to handover money for people who sit on their as ses all day.Channel 5 isn't helping with all those programmes.I can't be working myself to death and someone is busy going on hols 24/7 and wearing designers with massive flat screen tv.People are tired and I wonder what the outcome will be.

There are people who are genuinely poor but the echoing sentiment is that people are getting hardened and not so caring anymore.
What these people need is aspiration, if you are poor you musnt stay poor or die poor,you can aspire for your children to do better and leave the cycle of poverty.But for some reason they feel theres no way out.
This is where Africans differ completely we want our kids to do better.We don't believe a poor man must die poor,theres this natural hope we have even when things are bleak.

My children must be better than me abeg that's why I'm asking all these my questions.

Can't say if im submissive or not,I know I have things which I have very strong opinions about and its hard or almost impossible for me to accept anything different.Dh is much more flexible.

It's a crazy but happy mix.I feel that when you are with a sensible man who you know loves you and would hurt himself first before hurting you,its easier to say okayyyyy make the final decision.Even if you are not happy with it,but you know that final decision is coming from a good place.

I prefer compromise,a little of my opinion and a little of his.That way, everyone feels they've contributed something and that their opinion counts.

We also have our strengths and weaknesses.There are some things that I absolutely have the final say in as I am more of an expert in that area.There are some things I can't even argue about and he definitely beats me hands down.The point is that the most sensible option wins out in the end.

I know i will not bend to anything that fundamentally repulses me.If you want to fall into a ditch,i will NOT follow you there because of submission,lai lai.

Maybe I'll change later and be more submissive as the Bible commands? Sometime in future?Maybe when I'm 90.

We are happy with our setup and that's ALL that matters to me.We have never even discussed this submission thing ever.What we do works for us.

Live in a way that you and your Dh get the best out of each other.

*back to troll mode*

cococandy:
Just like in my area but we plan to send the kids to visit home as often as possible.

You might wanna do that. There's really not much you can do about promoting your own culture when singled out among people of other culture.

Thank.you cococandy..Kids are actually come with their own complications.

Nice discussion.
What would be the suggestion for black children who will most likely be the only black child in school,only black.child/children in the neighbourhood?

There are very very few black people around here,in my area we are the only ones and to be honest I'm quite worried about the kids.

How do I instill excellence and self confidence in them?A sense of identity too?

I am actively now considering shelling for school fees in the belief that it may bring some sort of advantage to my kids? Straight from primary down to Secondary.

Theres no grammar schools here as they believe segregating children according to ability is not right

I am afraid of the inevitable why is my hair this way why is my skin this way question.What are the answers to give?

Then what books to read to keep their sense of Africa alive? Should I actively seek out black people?

We have even considered moving to England just for the kids not to feel alone.The blacks we know here are just like 4 or 5 and live far away in other counties.


How to raise kids to excel in a place where they are the only African children essentially is the question.

In my little nuclear family I reign supreme. I am the queen bee.Any challenger will be stung into submission.

My parents n his parents have only the roles of advice and support when and if requested and of course spoiling the grandkids.

I'm sure in Mils home she is also the queen,no questions asked.Same with my mother.

Translate it how you want.Once in my domain its my way or the highway.When I'm in her territory, I also follow her rules or manipulate myself smartly out of things that don't please me.

In the end we blow kisses in d air both fake and real then move on.

Toks2008:


lol

well we have madams also sleeping with maids gatemen as well as drivers so its not an endemic situation to guys.

the shook i shook part got me wandering because commiting adultery is not the best revenge on a randy hubby

When it's a woman you remember to label it 'adultery' abi? Yet oga sleeping with housemaid is trivialised because he cannot help himself.

Anyone who employs a child to work as a maid is wicked.No child should ever be in that position.And to now suggest using children as maids instead of a consenting adult just because a man cannot have self control is hideous.

For how long will you chase after such a man? Will you also ask your sisters and friends not to visit because d prick can't stay in a place??

Theres money to be made o jare,building a future for my children, not chasing after an irresponsible man.

If I were single and my bf makes these sort of excuses,na to dump am sharp sharp.Marry a man of like mind to avoid stories that touch.

Same old excuses to keep a woman slaving from dusk to dawn in the bid to keep the hot maid away..I hope the same will be said of me if I fall for the nubile muscular hardworking and handsome houseboy.

The maid is in a vulnerable position,she's there as a paid help.probably because she has no other option.Taking advantage of her and abusing your position of trust is absolutely wrong.Theres no excuse.

Anyone cleaning and cooking like ayamatanga because she wants to save a supposedly helpless man with roaming chukuchuku from himself dey long tin.You will age faster than him and he will still sleep around..

Can never have high bp or stress myself, lailai.Always endeavour to look good just incase.He chooks ,I chook my own.After that we move front and sin no more.amin

He was nice and kind to you, why would you invade his privacy by taking pictures of his sacred prayer corner and his brideprice list? Except he gave you permission to post it..



Anyways,with that list he needs to stay on the mountain 24/7.He probably can't afford it ,that's why he's doing intense prayers.

At least you are now sure that the 'closeness' was all an illusion
You need to realise that in-law is in-law .She's not your mother,he's not your father and they aren't your bloody siblings.They are your in-laws.When you understand that you learn that you have to treat them with certain finesse.You can't crack the same jokes you crack with your mother with her,she will take offence.You can tell your mother mom you are looking like a bat today Oo please try it with your MIL and see if you won't go with 10 rams for apology.
Know your place!!!!

Not your place to worry about BIL,he's not your problem unless you are burning money on him and he's constituting a nuisance to you directly.No need to do ajayi ,see where you have landed yourself because you want to do sister omoge concern.You don see am naa.

Your only responsibility to in-law is to concur with what hubby wants for them except its not feasible.Polite ,respect,helping hand when it's due and dazzit.Any other extras when and if necessary.

All this love her like your mother love him like ur fada no de work cos they cant love me like their daughter.No matter how nice and loving you are, when the chips are down they will pick their children first before you. Stop forming closeness and mind ya bizniz.You and your parents don close finish? You don open bizniz for your own broda and sister so?

I don't expect anyone to love me like their own mother ,that's a tough one to request from someone who doesn't know me from Adam. Love and respect grow with time.Let's just be courteous with each other and drop all forms of pretense.No need for eye service and ajayi work.


The gifts you are talking of highest plate,pots,tray,glass cup and warmers. Stop having heart attack about them ,consider them gone and start afresh.


Yes,some people have lovey dovey in-laws praise jah but your own no follow.

Dress yasef and move forward.Hope ya eye don clear well well.Good luck

One thing I find common in some of our country people is that they believe that once you visit,it indicates some kind of sexual interest. Many victims who went to visit are not able to speak out cos people will ask what the expectation from the visit was and then blame her for visiting and causing the assault.

Does it now mean that there are no decent young men that a female friend can visit without incidence?Ofcourse not but seeing as the world is today,if you must visit buy iron pant and leave the padlock at home just incase.

We should train our children properly and let them know that NO means NO. I have seen many cases where some guys feel that saying No is initial gra gra and will continue the sex ual pestering till they have their way or the girl escapes.
If someone says no,there are many fishes in the ocean who will say yes and at the worst there are se x workers who you can pay.I don't understand how a sex ually reluctant partner can be a turn on in any level.

Se x should be between two WILLING & CONSENTING partners.

A guy can also be raped but unfortunately is harder to prove and less rampant than se xual assault on females.Many men would be too ashamed to even confess that they were raped.

halfrica:



Not saying she is lyin bt callin it rape is d lie u dont just give a situation a name cos u feel it shd be writing letter sef is annoying why nt sue like ordinary result p whr a girl was expelled she sued d course adviser let alone a molest
did he insert his manhood into her pusssyyy?

I hope no person who has been a victim of se xual assault comes to you for help.
It's either you are very young and think the world is black and white or you are just plain ignorant.Maybe you are Baruwas daughter,wife or son.
Either ways,there are many women like you roaming around and causing victims of rape not to speak out for fear of the kind of bile you spew.
One day,you will come to realise that there is no excuse for rape.There is no excuse to violate a person physically and leave them mentally scarred forever.

@lastpage

I don't think you've ever met a rape victim before.If you have you will realise that response to assault can vary wildly from shutting down,going blank as a result of shock to fighting with everything you've got.
Shock affects people differently and that's why even a thin person can overpower a fit person in such situations especially when te assaulter is a person in a position of trust.
Terror can shut down the fight and flight response and change a normally vibrant person into a vegetable.
One size doesn't fit all.

No rapist carries a tag screaming "I'm a ra pist".. is there a particular way a ra pist looks or dresses?They masquerade as nice respectable members of society,that uncle or Aunty,that family friend or cousin,that friendly neighbour.
Most se xual assaults are carried out by people who are familiar with the victim.If you like wear Babariga,tie your eyes and ears a pevert will always be a pevert.

Youth today tend to dress a bit more provocatively but does that mean they want to be violated?? Many naive young girls wearing midriff tops bum shorts etc Is that an invitation to ra pe? NO.YeS the outfit may attract more attention but does that now mean they deserve to be pounced on?The difference between us adults and teenagers should be clear,self restraint and the fact that many teenagers are not mature enough to know better.You can remove your eye if you see stray boo bs and nyash.

Anyone can be rap ed regardless of attire.The ones that ra pe children nko? Were they also moved by the child's pyjamas?A ra pist will always have an excuse and try to blame their victim for "seducing" them.

If we want to say attire how come mentally deranged women walking in the streets are raped?Are they also dressed provocatively? How about those raping goats and cows? Are they also flashing boo bs?

The ra pist enjoys the fact that they can overpower and render a person helpless,that's the turn on.some people get thrills from a victim struggling and screaming for help.It's not about attire most of the time.Power over a victim,pure and simple.

Blonchilli:

I really don't understand ppl. Some said was there a lion in d office? I just read the other girl's experience with the same man. He's strong. Imagine a 18 year old girl trying to fight a matured man off who has raped several matured girls. NO means NO but nobody understands

This is one of the reasons why victims don't speak out.An attacker doesn't even have to be old muscular or big.A thin person can ra pe too.It's hard to explain how terror can shut down your flight response and numb you down to accepting your fate.

There are now soo many alleged ra pe cases so much that an app was developed to record consent before any se xual act just in case.Can't remember the name of the app.
In developed countries,if you sleep with a drunk person he/she can say they were ra ped because while drunk they don't have the capacity to make decisions. That's automatic jail sentence for the perpetrator.

When someone says No please pack and go. Konji does not kill.