₦airaland Forum

Techobeys:
Dear friend, stop being unreasonable, Revelation 14:4 is pretty clear. Don’t add your own religious doctrines to it so you don't perish at the end.

Jesus had already said that saying is not for everyone bc some will not marry bc of heaven. The 144000 didn’t marry for heaven’s sake and they’re not everyone. They’re different.

.

Techobeys:
Save your soul from the shackle of religious indoctrination so you might see clearly.

Please, remove the rafters in your eyes.

If Jesus gospel of Matthew 11:11 and John 3:13 is "indoctrination" in your eyes, please stick to your delusion.

TenQ:
Don't twist scriptures my dear!
Isaiah 66 vs 1 - 2 is still saying the same thing: the THRONE of God is in Heaven not here on earth.

All the references to the throne of God in His temple are in heaven.

As a reference again,


Rev 4:2:
"And immediately I was in the Spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne."


Rev 16:17:
"And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done."


Rev 15:1
"And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvelous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God.

Rev 15:5
And after that I looked, and, behold, the temple of the tabernacle of the testimony in heaven was opened:"


Speaking about the New Jerusalem on earth

Rev 21:22:
"And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it."

No temple here

Everyone on earth,as it were, are "standing before God's throne".

A throne is always on elevated platform above all other objects, and seats or persons around it, that's the imagery Isaiah 66:1-2.

Revelation 7:9-10 says the Multitude are "of all nations, kindred and languages."

Is this truth not simple and straightforward for your grasp?

MaxInDHouse:
I will like others to learn from the highlighted!

In the beginning God created Adam and Eve but this two as a couple needs their privacy so God doesn't pay attention to them always after all they've been given FREEWILL that's why God could ask Cain "where is your brother?" {Genesis 4:9} after man's rebellion God's attention was taken away from mankind in general because their deeds saddens Him each day {Genesis 6:5-6} our happy God {1Timothy 1:11} can't withstand the evil done by humans to their neighbours {Habakkuk 1:13} that's why He empowered some angels with spiritual eyes all over their bodies {Ezekiel 10:12} these are the ones reporting to Him when a person decides to make a U-turn and start doing what is good, so when people are doing evil things don't think my God is present there it's only His eyes (angels serving as investigators) that are moving everywhere to report back to Him when man's evil deeds is getting out of hand! Genesis 18:20-21


But when all evildoers has been exterminated God will be present both in heaven with Jesus and his 144,000 co-rulers as well as on earth with the great crowd worshiping Him night and day.
As at that time if anyone choose to be wicked our God will permit him or her to taste life in Paradise for just a hundred years and they will die as youths! Isaiah 65:20

God's throne in that context means God's PRESENCE!

MrPRevailer:
The 144,000 Jews are the chosen remanants that God will hide in the wilderness from the Antichrist in the time of the Great Tribulation or Jacob's trouble.

JW, Romans Catholism, Mormonism are false/counterfeit Christian religions

Kobojunkie:
Not trying to hold brief for the other, but both 144,000 and the multitude stood before God's throne right here on earth — none of them were in heaven at the time described by John in Revelations 7, and yes, at the time of the resurrection, God's throne will be visible from right here on earth. John reveals that He will be worshipped from right here on earth, day and night by the multitude.

TenQ:
Exactly like Muslim You never cease to amuse me by your evasive manoeuvres.


Can you confirm that according to Rev7:9-11 that the THRONE here is on EARTH?

And therefore,
1. The LAMB was here on EARTH and
2. The Angels were here on EARTH and
3. The Elders were here on EARTH and
4. The Four Beasts were here on EARTH


Where is the LOCATION of this THRONE according to Rev7:9-11

The location of God's throne is in heaven, the Very throne king Solomon sits ,1 Chronicles 29:23.


You are desperate to claim the multitude were in heaven but 1 Chronicles 29:23 burst your delusion.


For the same reason that Psalm 95:6 & Ephesians 3:14 burst your delusion.

Do you agree that Paul was in heaven bowing to the Father?
Or David was in heaven bowing down and worship Jehovah?


Max was right to explain to you that "standing before the throne" meaning in God's presence because @ Revelation 21:3 God himself will be with men (residing in the new earth ) because they are in His presence not seeing God face to face .

@ Revelation 21:3-5 Is God dwelling on earth when God removes sickness, mourning and pain?

This screenshot here says it all.

TenQ:
When people twist the clear scripture to say what humans will to say, we can at best show them the scripture even when we know that they wouldn't listen because they are already in the cage of Satan!

EMILO2STAY:
seems like you lack comprehensive ability. read what I wrote again and you will realize that my point is that the kingdom of God talked about in the entire bible is not talking of heaven the throne of God but the earth. a renewed earth where God reigns sovereign just like he is reigning in heaven now and that is the essence of Mathew 6:10.

EMILO2STAY
I never said any one is going to heaven [/b]your error is thinking the kingdom of heaven mentioned in the scriptures i is talking of heaven the throne of God.


[b]EMILO2STAY:
check very well ,I never claimed that 144,000 will go to heaven. my stance on this is that the saved will inherit the new earth

My Brother, MaxInDHouse shebi you are seeing something in the highlighted from this Emilo posts.



The same man wey say JWs no understand Bible he can't fathom that Jesus Christ at Matthew 5:5 referenced the renewed earth as the inheritance of the righteous meek , Revelation 21:1-5 & Psalm 37:29

TenQ:
Why are you tongue tied and evasive. We are looking SPECIFICALLY at Rev 7:9-11


Can you confirm that according to Rev7:9-11 that the THRONE here is on EARTH?

And therefore,
1. The LAMB was here on EARTH and
2. The Angels were here on EARTH and
3. The Elders were here on EARTH and
4. The Four Beasts were here on EARTH


Where is the LOCATION of this THRONE according to Rev7:9-11

FxMasterz:
Verse 4 of the scripture you screenshot says the 144,000 are the firstfruits to God, not the only fruits. In verse 6, the same scripture says an angel was seen proclaiming the everlasting gospel to men. The everlasting gospel was meant to receive more people into heaven. If you don't seek knowledge, you'll be responsible for wherever your ignorance leads you in the hereafter.

EMILO2STAY:
you don't understand the bible. the phrase kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God sometimes called the kingdom of light mentioned over 80 times in the bible is talking of the same thing( Mathew 19:23, Mathew 19:24) and that is the renewed earth where God rules sovereign and Christ is king.

The Kingdom of God can be summarized as the
everlasting realm where God is sovereign and Jesus
Christ rules forever. not only or necessarily heaven the throne of God

The concept of a Kingdom of God is not primarily one of space, territory,. or politics, as in a national kingdom,
but rather one of kingly rule, reign, and sovereign control.

John the Baptist began his ministry announcing that the kingdom of
heaven was at hand (Mathew 3:2 ). Then Jesus took over: “From that
time Jesus began to preach, saying, ‘Repent, for the kingdom of is at hand. Mathew 4:17

this indicates that there is a coming system of rule to the earth where Christ will be king and God will reign everlasting.

Jesus urged his followers to pray for the coming of theKingdom: “Pray then like this: ‘Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your
name. YOUR KINGDOM COME, YOUR WILL BE DONE, ON EARTH AS IT IS INHEAVEN.’ ” (Matthew 6:-10,)

lastly every saved soul will gain entrance throw the gates of the new Jerusalem which came down from heaven to the EARTH. (revelation 21.)

EMILO2STAY:
stop making unecessary arguemunt. the scriptures you put up did not say some will go to heaven and some earth. you are wrong mr

EMILO2STAY:
stop making unecessary arguemunt. the scriptures you put up did not say some will go to heaven and some earth. you are wrong mr

Kobojunkie:
Yes, God dwelled in the temple here on earth before He destroyed the temple. And God will restore His dwelling place when He makes His Jerusalem a holy city. This is written right there in scripture for those who have eyes to see and understand.

Techobeys:
Revelation 14:1-4 is talking about virgins who have not defiled themselves with woman and they’re just 144000. They of those people who were taken from the earth to serve a special purpose, and they have never lied.

Are you a virgin? Have you not ever lied? Have you not never slept with a woman?

Why do you think it’s talking about JW where you marry yourselves off to each other? You really need Christ in your life dear friend. I know that you don’t have understanding but I hope you’ll let God save your soul soon.

TenQ:
The Question is extremely simple. Where is the LOCATION of this THRONE according to Rev7:9-11

Can you confirm that according to Rev7:9-11 that the THRONE here is on EARTH?

And therefore,
1. The LAMB was here on EARTH and
2. The Angels were here on EARTH and
3. The Elders were here on EARTH and
4. The Four Beasts were here on EARTH


Where is the LOCATION of this THRONE according to Rev7:9-11

Kobojunkiee:
And mount zion happens to be in Jerusalem, here on planet earth. So?

Does Jehovah God dwell on earth?

Oga,can your mumu komot from this forum.

GoodIsGod:
Jehovah is God
Jesus is Lord
It takes deeper revelation to call Jesus God.
He is God though He is Lord because the Father who is God loves the son who is Lord and gives Him Jesus who is Lord the benefits and power to be called God which belongs only to Jehovah.
.

GoodIsGod:
Only God can forgive sins but He gave only Jesus the power to forgive sins..

GoodIsGod:
Only God can give life but God gave only Jesus the power to give life. Not this life alone but the one to Come.

God the Father is God
Jesus the son is Lord
They are two different Beings.
But it's no sin to call the son God because He and His father who is God are one.

I hope I have been able to convince you and not confuse you about the difference between God and Lord.

MaxInDHouse:
First of all you thought the 144,000 are natural Israelites until i asked you to crosscheck the original at Exodus 1:1-5.
Both of them are in God's presence that's what it means but the four living creatures makes a difference because the four living creatures are in heaven each standing at the right, left, front and back of God's heavenly throne {Ezekiel 1:1-11} only the 144,000 are in the same place with the four living creatures! Revelations 14:3
That's why it's logical to conclude that only the 144,000 will go to heaven.
There is one thing i've noticed about you and it won't help you if you don't change:
You're always trying to find fault with whatever the JWs teaches whereas you can never ever find any group of worshipers as studious as JWs. That's why i keep telling you to go out there and find the meaning from any other religion if their opinion satisfy you continue worshiping with them. Your opinion can't and will never count before JWs unless you're able to present a better performing group with the things you think you know!

1 Chronicles 29:23 knocked out his claim that "standing before the throne" means the Multitude & 144000 are in heaven , nah the claim the guy man dey aim at.


King Solomon sitting on Jehovah's throne NEVER means Solomon ruled in heaven (or was in heaven) in the same manner that
standing before the throne"
NEVER meant 144000 & the Multitude were in the same place.

TenQ:
Is it a false claim by me that JW believe that ONLY 144,000 people will go to heaven?

YES or NO!

TenQ:
Check again in RED




Again:
Are the TWO THRONES in different places?

TenQ:
Your claim is that ONLY the 144,000 will be in heaven. I have showed you that the Multitudes are ALSO in heaven. That is why you want to redefine heaven as the presence of God.

TenQ:
Here again are the 144,000 before the THRONE

Rev 14:1-3:
"And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Zion, and with him a hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads. And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps: [color=red]and they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth."

Here is the Multitudes ALSO before the THRONE.

Rev 7:9-11:
"After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; and cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb. And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God,"

Are these TWO different THRONEs?

TenQ:
Is it a false claim by me that JW believe that ONLY 144,000 people will go to heaven?

tctrills:
What do the verses say oga.

Techobeys:
Has it ever crossed your mind that JW might be totally wrong on the subject?

tctrills:
Forget this talk about the number of people to enter heaven. Jesus Christ has already told you what to do to qualify for heaven.
You need to be born of water and the spirit.
You need to overcome.
Just do your part and you will qualify for his kingdom.

emerged01:
Is it misconception to believe that all the people who believe in Jesus Christ will make Heaven?
According to JW,God selects a limited number of faithful Christians who, after their death, will be resurrected to life in heaven. (1 Peter 1:3, 4) Once they have been chosen, they must continue to maintain a Christian standard of faith and conduct in order not to be disqualified from receiving their heavenly inheritance.—Ephesians 5:5; Philippians 3:12-14.

oteneaaron:
Lol.

He calls it a "misinterpretation".

I know you can't speak without raining insults.

It is your modus operandi.

Kobojunkiee:
You are obviously reading that book upside-down-inside-out. The passage you quoted there does not state that only the 144,000 will enter into Heaven. Verse 1 states that the 144,000 stood with the Lamb on Mount Sion. Since when did Mount Sion on earth become synonymous with Heaven?

The rest of the passage speaks of the 144,000 having been the first fruits redeemed by the Lamb meaning that there were others who were redeemed as well. The 144,000 were the first who were marked by Jesus Christ and sealed as well so they were guaranteed Heaven from their beginning. Then they were sent out to all corners of th earth to.teach God's New Covenant and Law to all their brothers and sisters -- Israel --- in every tribe, every tongue and every nation of the earth.

Mount Zion is the place where Jehovah (the God of His servants) dwells,Isaiah 8:18; Psalm 74:2.

The 144,000 are in heaven to rule with Christ.

Deluded WAILER

oteneaaron:
During my days as a Jehovahs Witness, we were taught that these 144,000 "annointed" are made up of Jehovahs Witnesses who would rule with Jesus in heaven over all mankind.

We were also taught that these 144,000 are the true "born again Christians" and they would be at the side of Jesus when he comes back to kill billions of people who are not Jehovahs Witnesses in the war of Armageddon.

Back then, we were taught that only this 144,000 are part of the "new covenant" and therefore only them could eat and drink the bread and wine served during the memorial of Jesus's death.

We were also taught that these only 144,000 are the true "sons of God" while the rest of us were only "friends of God".

Looking back, I find it hard to imagine that I used to believe in such crap doctrines of men.

Well, that is what years of endless indoctrination does to you.

Religion is such a powerful tool for mind control.

2 Thessalonians 1:8-9, will Jesus Christ save Oteneaaron?

Deluded Trinitarians and atheists WAILING in sifia pains.

Kobojunkie:
Kills billions of people who are not JWS? WHAT-THE-FK !

Matthew 24:37-39, is Noah a servant of Jehovah God with his family?

Acts 3:13, whose servant is Jesus Christ, Isaac, Abraham and Jacob?

2 Thessalonians 1:8-9, will Jesus Christ save those who rejected his Father's worship?

Sifia pained WAILERS

TenQ:
It's okay then. The JW organisation is prone to misrepresenting the scriptures to suit their doctrines.
Their doctrines break down when you slow them down to look into the scripture rather than what they have memorised.

Thanks for bringing this subject up

Kobojunkie:
1. So, according to you, Jesus Christ, who instead said that judgment for those who belong in the Kingdom of God— the goats and sheep alike — will take place only after He returns, lied? You are having us believe that the fate of the goats was decided over 2000 years ago, and the fate of the sheep will instead be determined later on, even though the narrative Jesus Christ gave has it that the Sheep will receive their reward before the goats receive theirs?

2. Your personal delusions regarding what Paul posited there in his letters aside, Jesus Christ's return during the millennial reign is to rule over the righteous of [b]God's Old Covenant — His rule then will be as King of Israel, not the Kingdom of God. The judgment of those who are of the Kingdom of God will, according to John, will take place after the 1000-year rule will have concluded. [/b]

God's promise to all of the righteous of the Old Covenant was clear that they would live a long life in the Land of Canaan which He promised to them — Deuteronomy 30 vs 15 - 20 — and Jesus Christ will come back during the millennial reign to fulfill that promise to all the righteous of Old. However, after the 1000-year rule is over, the judgment of the Kingdom of God will eliminate those of them who do not make the cut-off mark as far as the Kingdom of God — the goats — from among them. They may be found unrighteous as New Covenant is concerned, but that does not remove from the fact that they were made righteous under to Old Covenant Standard when Jesus Christ redeemed/bought them from the Old Law.

By the way, God's "Old Covenant" angry Judgment on the Nation of Judah — the destruction of Jerusalem along with the cursing and scattering of the rest of Israel, the Jewish Nation — began during the first century as prophesied by the Prophets and Jesus Christ Himself.