₦airaland Forum

Farki:
Christianity was legitimised in the empire by Constantine. Before then there were numerous religions, cults and schools of thought in Europe which were eliminated.

Mithraism
Manichaeism
Arianism
Zoroastrianism
Worship of the Greco-Roman pantheon
Celtic Religion.
Norse religion



After Theodosius became emperor and deemed Christianity the state religion of Rome he sought to destroy any and every religious influence which wasn't Nicene Christianity. Statues were destroyed, places of worship converted into churches and local gods and festivals syncretised into devotion of saints and Christian holidays. Through various crusades and inquisitions The Catholic Church managed to kill, silence and brutally subjugate anyone in Europe who wasn't a Christian yay.

Your ignorance is showing.

Guy you are the ignorant fellow.

Was it only Europe that was existing in the whole world.

Besides Christianity had its roots in Asia. And there were more Christians in Asia than Rome at the time.

Your thought process is alarming.

Farki:
I can say with all certainty that if the Romans adopted Manichaeism instead there would be no Christians today.

So Christians came from rome?

You need to study.

There were other religions back then, why do they still exist today?

Farki:
Ahura Mazda said where he came from in the Avestan.

He said, He is the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the End.

I understand the human curiosity to try to understand all things. But I believe we have an over inflated ego of intellect. Because of what we see in our so called advancement of knowledge.

But the truth is that, we humans have no way of measuring how truly intelligent and advance we have become because we have no other intelligent race like us on other planets for instance to compare.

Now why do I say that?

Because I am sure the origin of Ahura Mazda I gave above will not satisfy you.

But Ahura Mazda in the Avestan doesnt go deeper in explaining things He knows humans wouldn't get.

There is a concept called infinite regression of things. Which is not possible and which cant be understood by the limited human mind. Infinite regression isnt possible because it still has to point to an infinite source that had no beginning.

What could be this thing or being that had no beginning?

Guess what, the Ahura Mazda of the Avestan is the only God in all religion to give the ultimate origin of everything. He says He is the ultimate source. No beginning before Him.

You cant put that in a test tube


If the Romans adopted Zoroastrianism as the state religion and imposed it on the empire and subsequently colonised Africa you would be saying the above instead. There is nothing unique about Christianity aside from the way it spreads like a disease. Your religion is neither true, special or original.

Oga bros. Many of us Christians were Atheists before we had our own encounter with God. Not everyone was born under the influence of religion.

So find another argument.

Isinweke:
What is wrong with Nigeria?

South Korea is testing 15,000 people daily!

See this article from Yahoo today.

I always try to tell Nigerians, anytime you see discharged cases in the day, just know more confirmed cases are coming in the night.

Besides Nigeria has not even tested up to 7000 people.

wirinet:
You are being dishonest here. You stated that ancient Babylon started 2300 BC bit ancient Greece was around 800 BC. When can ancient Greece be said to have started? Read about the Greek dark ages which is between 1100BC - 800 BC. This was the period homer wrote about in the iliard.
The 2300 BC you stated could not be said to be Babylon. That was when Babylon was a little village in the Akkadian empire. Babylon did not become an established empire until the 19th or even18th century BC. It was after the reign of Hammurabi in 1750 BC that the whole of southern Mesopotamia came to be known as Babylonia. The Babylon empire lasted until it was conquered by Cyrus the Great, king of Persia in 539 BC.



Nearly all scientists (97%) say humans and other living things have evolved over time," while only 61% of the public agrees, according to a new report (PDF, p. 37) from the Pew Research Center for the People & the Press. Asked which comes closer to their view, "Humans and other living things have evolved over time" or "Humans and other living things have existed in their present form since the beginning of time," 97% of scientists responding chose the former option, as opposed to only 2% choosing the latter option;
https://ncse.ngo/views-evolution-among-public-and-scientists-0

So what will you call the type education in the school of medicine in Alexandra (311BC)?



You guys keep confusing Atheism with science. Lots of Atheists don't care about science. My own first role model Tai Solarin had no idea of evolution or big bang. Atheism simply is a disbelief in God(s). There are many scientists that are theists and many theists that are scientists that accept evolution)

I am too tired right now to type long thing...but anyways...

Even though Pew research has been criticized for its biasness towards the Abrahamic religions and Hinduism, I would ignore that and give you an excerpt of the largest study on the issue at hand.

[b]"Ecklund and fellow Rice researchers Kirstin Matthews and Steven Lewis collected information from 9,422 respondents in eight regions around the world: France, Hong Kong, India, Italy, Taiwan, Turkey, the U.K. and the U.S. They also traveled to these regions to conduct in-depth interviews with 609 scientists, the largest worldwide survey and interview study ever conducted of the intersection between faith and science.

By surveying and interviewing scientists at various career stages, in elite and nonelite institutions and in biology and physics, the researchers hoped to gain a representative look at scientists' views on religion, ethics and how both intersect with their scientific work.

When asked about terms of conflict between religion and science, Ecklund noted that only a minority of scientists in each regional context believe that science and religion are in conflict. In the U.K. - one of the most secular countries studied - only 32 percent of scientists characterized the science-faith interface as one of conflict. In the U.S., this number was only 29 percent. And 25 percent of Hong Kong scientists, 27 percent of Indian scientists and 23 percent of Taiwanese scientists believed science and religion can coexist and be used to help each other.

In addition to the survey's quantitative findings, the researchers found nuanced views in scientists' responses during interviews. For example, numerous scientists expressed how religion can provide a "check" in ethically gray areas.

(Religion provides a) check on those occasions where you might be tempted to shortcut because you want to get something published and you think, 'Oh, that experiment wasn't really good enough, but if I portray it in this way, that will do,'" said a biology professor from the U.K.

Another scientist said that there are "multiple atheisms," some of which include religious traditions."[/b]


As for your babylonian and Greece argument, you mention dark Greece age like that is when they hopped on the babylonian science. Google the difference between Dark age Greece and classical Greece.

Classical Greece is where we have the philosophers like Plato e.t.c.

Besides:

PhD. Filon

...many of the achievements of Greek culture in the fields of astronomy and mathematics did not spring, fully armed, from the Hellenic brain, but had their more remote origins in the civilizations of the ancient East.' There is available now sufficient evidence to show that a great deal of the astronomical knowledge which has come down to us from the Hellenistic period (c. 500 B.C. to A.D. 150) was not initially discovered during that period; and such new empiric discoveries as were made in that time were not all due to Greeks, for important contributions were still being made by Babylonians during the Seleucid Era.

Luckydubby7:
My only issue here is that he didn't even tell us when exactly it will end. Hmm no hope oooo
This year nawah ooooo

He can't tell you when it will end.

There are a lot of factors to consider.

Farki:
You clearly didn't read my post properly

1, How has something that has been around for 3000 years which is half of recorded history fairy new?

2. It seems you didn't read my comment properly. This priest believes that holding crosses will cause Covid-19 to disappear. Of course this is pure nonsense yet this would be what the church had been endorsing for centuries.

3. The idea that germs spread disease is also a theory, gravity is also a theory, the earth orbiting the sun is a theory. It seems you don't understand the definition of theory within the scientific community.

4. The church had a large amount of wealth, influence as it was intertwined with the politics and Royalty of Europe since the late the Roman Empire. Whatever research undertaken needed the funding and approval of the Church unless the researcher wanted to be branded a heretic.

5. If you read my comment well you would see that I am giving an example of modern science that would be hindered if the church was as influential over the state as it was in the past.

6. Finally religion does not require logic just obedience. This is why amazing claims and are accepted wholesale as truth. Asking for proof of supernatural claims are seen as wrong in the Bible. I have a question for you where did God come from because I'm sure you know as much about that as the average atheist?

God said where he came from in the bible.

He said, He is the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the End.

I understand the human curiosity to try to understand all things. But I believe we have an over inflated ego of intellect. Because of what we see in our so called advancement of knowledge.

But the truth is that, we humans have no way of measuring how truly intelligent and advance we have become because we have no other intelligent race like us on other planets for instance to compare.

Now why do I say that?

Because I am sure the origin of God I gave above will not satisfy you.

But God in the bible doesnt go deeper in explaining things He knows humans wouldn't get.

There is a concept called infinite regression of things. Which is not possible and which cant be understood by the limited human mind. Infinite regression isnt possible because it still has to point to an infinite source that had no beginning.

What could be this thing or being that had no beginning?

Guess what, the Bible God is the only God in all religion to give the ultimate origin of everything. He says He is the ultimate source. No beginning before Him.

You cant put that in a test tube.

wirinet:
False statement.
Ancient Greece - 12th–9th centuries BC.
Ancient Babylon - 18th and 6th centuries BC
Although Babylon was older by about 6 centuries, the two civilizations did overlap.
How can you say a civilization that was 3000 years old fairly new? In that case which civilizations then would your consider fairly old?


Another false statement. If you paid attention during science class in secondary school, you would have known that in science a theory is an established fact. It is an hypothesis that ishe still heavily under study. Scientists are not decided on the theory of evolution, up to 98% of all scientists (natural science ) accept evolution as fact. All universities in the world teach evolution as a fact. It is a few religious fundamentalists and fringe scientists and their supporters that struggle against reason to reject the theory of biological evolution.




Senseless. Who says education originated from Rome? Western education originated from ancient Mesopotamia, then Babylonian, then Egypt, Greece, Rome...


The Nothing they are talking about is not nothing in English. Nothing means something else in the quantum field. The same thing with religion, Your God came from nothing and suddenly started creation. You would say your God have always existed. Atheist scientists would also say quantum fields have always existed.

This man you are confusing yourself.

Ancient Babylon started 2300 bc while Ancient greece was around 800 bc. They were no way close to each other.

Secondly, Mr Man, you have started your assumptions again, where did you get your 98 percent of scientists from?

Your third statement on western education has been misunderstood by you. What is western education? Western education is 15th century. Western education has nothing to do with the foundation of Science.

Finally, I love to talk about your last argument. I.e The origin of the universe. But anyways, who told you those Atheists know about quantum fields. I have spoken with most of them. They never mention that all I hear is nothingness.

Farki:
I never said Einstein was an atheist I said he wasn't Christian.

You also didn't read in the same article that Aristotle first philosopher who developed a systematic study of logic?
Of course the early ideas were not accurate but they gave the foundations of science you attribute to the Church. Many claims endorsed by the church such as Geocentricism were proven to be false yet you are awfully silent about them.

If you research about the history of atheism you would know that such thinking was present since the time of ancient Greece.

Once churches had been separated from controlling state affairs and education was available to all science advanced. If the church was still in charge of everything there would be no stem cell research and no theory of evolution because they contradict Catholic teachings. We would only be allowed to talk about the things the church permits.
Worse still is we could have idiots like this who believe religious processions cure disease.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDgHCn702qg

Of course you say Wikipedia isn't a valid source of information but a picture of a quote is. You do realize that the articles have citations in them?

1. Ancient Greece was way after the babylonian times. So Atheism is fairly new.

2. You went off tangent with your last statement with the video.

3. Theory of evolution is a theory not a fact, still heavily under study. And scientists are divided on the issue. Especially biological scientist who study DNA and the process of natural selection.

4. As for Church and state affairs, you speak of only Rome.(that is another argument for another time). Most of education and what we call science did not originate from Rome.

5. Stem cell research is late science that does not concern whether the Church is in power of state affairs or not.

6. As for your last statment again, Of course there will be religious people who do not apply logic in some matters. It doesn't negate anything. Afterall, there are many Atheists who believe everything came from nothing.

Oracle23:
The majority of dem in our generatio aren't religious oga, they are predominantly atheists n irreligious people.

It was only in the olden days that there were mostly Christian's, back in the days wen the atheist n irreligious movement was none existent.

Give backing to your claims sir.

Farki:
Didn't I reference miraculous healing of the Bible you said didn't exist?

With Christians they demand so much that we disprove things they said when we ask for them to give evidence. When they do give evidence it is always the Bible and very bad science and history.

Your claims of Greeks not being scientists can be easily disproved with a simple search

https://www.ancient.eu/Greek_Science/

You seem to be ignorant of the fact that being an atheist was a very quick way to get killed or exiled in the past. Plus the Catholic Church controlled a large amount of money and garnered the interest literate people. If you weren't on good terms with the church your ideas would be deemed as heresy just ask Galileo.

Just look at the rapid advancements in science once the church wasn't in charge of everything.

Have a look at these atheist scientists who are responsible for a lot of the modern science we use today.
Einstein was not a Christian.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_atheists_in_science_and_technology

Einstein was not an Atheist Sir. And he wasnt a founding father of modern science. (See his quote in the screenshot below)

Secondly, you didnt read the link you posted. Its says the greeks built their science on the foundations of the babylonians and Egyptians. And out of that came Greek philosophers like Aristotle e.t.c your link also ended up with some of Greek science methods being flawed.

Like I said earlier those who started the science of old, belived in Gods as shown in the link you posted. There were no Atheists in Babylonian and Old Egyptian times. Please do a research on the history of Atheism.

Also, your talk on the advancement of science without the Church has no basis.

Lastly, wikipedia is not a source of credible information when it comes to scientific debates. So always get links from elsewhere. (Especially scientific journals or press releases).

Farki:
I only need repeatable and testable evidence that faith healing works. So far there has been none aside from the tales by the moonlight you expect me to swallow from your religious texts. If I were to think this way about everything then any mythical story would be treated as valid until disproved. Can you disprove that Jack and the beanstalk?

Science has shown that many of the claims in the bible are false and not more valid than the claims of other religions. The 7 day creation story and great flood were shown to be nothing more than myths.

Science was started by the Greeks not Christians. Modern science was started during the Age of Enlightenment where scholars opposed the dogmatic reasoning of the Catholic Church.

Even today Christians deny science of evolution,astronomy, 5G and stem cell research. Belief in the supernatural does not follow the scientific processes just adults in dresses playing make believe under the guise of 'having faith'.

Okay, from your statements, I have seen something, you are also one of those guys I debate with who love to talk without showing references to back up your claims.

You have been wrong about science disproving the bible, the Greeks (The Greeks were not known for science but were literary scholars and philosophers), even the opposing of the Catholic church and science- When we had Da Vinci, Tycho Brahe, Copernicus, Rene Descartes, Kepler e.t.c who were Catholics and also fathers of modern science.

You now went off the diving board with the generalization and assumptions of your last statement.

Why then should I continue this discourse??

Farki:
So what you are telling me is that science works. Alcoholic beverages were mixed with water to prevent disease for thousands of years. These practices are not unique to Christianity. I am however yet to see the miracles reproduced for all to see.

Because you have not seen a miracle doesn't mean others havent seen Mr. Man.

One of the scriptures I quoted there has already answered your question.

And until you can prove that not a single soul in the whole world has encountered a miracle from God, then you don't have an argument.

And you talk of science as if it somehow denies the existence of God and it separates itself from God. When all science does is try to understand the "how" of the laws of the universe put in place by an intelligent mind.

Btw, when the science of old started, there were no irreligious humans. All believed in a certain higher being or beings which ushered them into all manner discoveries as some tried to combine that with what they called magic.

If we are talking of modern science, then that was also started by Christians.

So mentioning science and its discoveries does not help the argument against a God.

Farki:
1 Kings 17:17-24

2nd Kings 5:14.

Matt 9:19-21.

Acts 3:6-10.

Luke 5:17.

1 Tim 5:23

Maty 15:38

Rom 11:20

Like 4: 25_29

Deuteronomy 24:8-9

Lastly, read the whole book of Numbers.

OtemAtum:
Firstly, it is not my book. It is the BOOK OF UNIVERSAL HISTORY, written by many beings from the past world, even to this present world. Secondly, those who have read it are now free from religion and mind slavery. Or do you think it is by coincidence that today many people in Nigeria are now kicking against religion? Some of these people you see here kicking against religion have benefited from the book. On nairaland alone, it has more than 140,000 views without making frontpage. How about that?

Lol, who are the many people in Nigeria?

140k views does not mean 140k converts.

I might have viewed it sef just to see how deep in delusions some humans can be.

You found some articles on the internet and claimed it as your truth. Smh.

Farki:
Since they believe in the efficacy of prayer they should have prayed for the people choking on mucus hoping that God in his infinite mercy will heal them without ventilators like they did in the Bible.

If miraculous healing was real no Christian would be living with AIDS.

Well, the God or the type of Christianity you are speaking of, I dont know if you created them in your mind.

You should get a hold of a bible and gain more understanding on these matters.

OtemAtum:
When a child asks questions, it's because he wants to hear the answer. I'm very happy for that. First of all, you have committed an error by equating popularity with the truth. Your question is like saying, how come the corruption prevalent in Nigeria since independence is still in Existence today even after being attacked and contradicted by several humans of integrity? It's like saying, viruses and bacteria are holy and righteous because ever since humanity had existed, they had been causing sicknesses and diseases, attacked with several drugs, yet they still prevail and remain in Existence till these days?
Now back to your argument, if you are conversant with the Book of Universal History, you will understand that different gods(beings) are given different times to reign and become well established. Then when your time to reign in the minds of the people is over, you have to pack your load and go. So, at the moment Jehovah and Allah, having reigned in the minds of humanities for about 2000 years and 1500 years respectively are packing their loads away from minds currently and by the year 2625, you will need a 'microscope' to spot a Christian or a Muslim in the world. Reason is this, brains are evolving and leaving religions in millions, according to the Thummim of the GREAT LIGHT.
I can list hundreds of gods who have ruled the minds of humans for you from thousands of years back till these days, but when their time expires, they pack their loads and go.
I can specifically tell you that Jehovah your god is now caged and will remain caged for 996 more years for the rapacity of the brains of humanity to evolve. Go and read the BOOK OF HOMO SAPIENS, from the BOOK OF UNIVERSAL HISTORY. There you will see lists of gods like Jehovah and Allah who have ruled many parts of the world in the past and are no more heard of.

This your universal theory book that has deluded your mind, how has it benefitted mankind?

We see peoples lives radically changed as a result of the bible, what has your book done?

Farki:
And the ventilators keeping them alive did God manufacture them? The protective equipment preventing other infections what about them?

Silly questions.

The clothes that Christian's wore in the bible, did God sew it for them?

Those who recovered in their houses did ventilators and PPE cure them?

Oracle23:
Bring up the list of all nobel prize winners for science from 1999 - 2019, dont rope in lists from 1900, everyone in europe were Christians back den, But in recent memory, scientists are predominantly predominantly irreligious.

Oga you have not countered anything. And you have jumped into all sorts of assumptions already with your last statements.

Someone up there asked the same question and I already provided an excerpt of a scientific journal on the majority being religious and how it influences their practice.

OtemAtum:
Believing in a god or knowing a god doesn't amount to the fact that cure to sicknesses and diseases are given by the god you believe in. For example, I know and I have seen more than 3000 of these gods humans believe in, yet I know that cures don't come from them, but from the humans themselves who use their brains diligently. That's why I've been asking you to state the god who will do the cure, because there are more than 10,000 of them. Some of the lists are Atum, Moloch, Allah, Jehovah, Olorun, Vishnu, Euchlydes, Chaleb, Chukwu, Mazda, Nzame, Nyame, Nyakopon, Mazda, Brahma, Enki, El, Enlil, Ereshkigal, Ephradite, Aluna, Shiva, Earthus to mention but a few. So which of them are you talking about in particular?

You don change mouth.

If you were logical and were able to apply constructive criticism.

Logical deduction should have pointed you out to the true God. But most of you are not deep thinkers.

I will just give one example.

How come the book which for centuries, had the most attacks, was burnt, banned, even those who held the book and those who wrote it, got killed and persecuted, how come it is still the bestseller today and the most popular book?

Is it trying to tell you something.

OtemAtum:
Pls give me the data that a good number of doctors are Christians. And when you say god, which one is it you worship, Allah or Jehovah or Vishnu or Mazda?

Okay Sir see below.

"Survey on physicians’ religious beliefs shows majority faithful
By John Easton

Medical Center Public Affairs

The first study of physician religious beliefs has found that 76 percent of doctors believe in God and 59 percent believe in some sort of afterlife. The survey, performed by researchers at the University and published in the July issue of the Journal of General Internal Medicine, found that 90 percent of doctors in the United States attend religious services at least occasionally, compared to 81 percent of all adults. Fifty-five percent of doctors say their religious beliefs influence how they practice medicine"


Do you want the reference??.

Oracle23:
Ur post and ur chart are very fake.

Lol. Counter the claim. Dont run.

I am ready to run you references.

OtemAtum:
Who made the drugs used for suppressing the symptoms? Your god? Hell no!! It's the gods called scientists that made it, pls find out. God Almighty, the creator of Jehovah, Allah and the rest of them doesn't make drugs for humans, rather humans have to find the cure themselves. Read the BOOK OF UNIVERSAL HISTORY to understand better.

Well, most of those scientists were inspired by God as a good number of them were and are Christians.

Nothing new here, it's been happening since the Old testament when God gave the Israelites through Moses instructions on how to treat some maladies.

OtemAtum:
Sorry, they actually recovered by medically treating the symptoms they had such as cough, fever etc. They treated them with drugs and when the symptoms left, they became free. By the way, when we say God, who or what is God, is it Allah or Jehovah?

Oga.

The were treated with drugs to suppress symptoms not to cure the virus.

Drugs and ventilators are used to prolong life and make it easier to bear the sickness while the immune systems battles the virus on its own.

Btw, You know the true God already.

Oracle23:
Nope, science have found the vaccine already, vaccines are very very easy to make...The hard part which takes 12 - 18 months to perfect is making the vaccine to be compatible with all humans irrespective or their genetic make up or race...By january/February, that would be perfected and a vaccine delivered.

Stop spreading false news.

There is no vaccine yet. What we have are clinical trials.

OtemAtum:
Those who have recovered so far, did they recover in the church or from hospitals? Ask yourself that question.

The recovered as a result of their immune system which was created by God.

Please do research on how patients recover.

We are not ready in this country.

The lockdown will be months. Just to prepare some of you minds who thinks the virus will just be gone in two weeks.

freeze001:
Bottom line is that he was infected with the virus and also infectious, it is likely he infected other persons with the virus and not his underlying ailments; some who get infected may not have any underlying issues or may be managing them successfully until this new invasive infection aggravates their existing issues and knocks them down or out! No need to downplay the severity of this virus...

You are very intelligent. Unlike these people who like to think with their emotions.

petra1:
Sure it does make sense. GOD can turn you into a fly. He is God . Read the book

Why do you guys answer these people?

Myer:
You've suddenly lost your confidence?
That's Contradiction number 2.
And I've not even started.

Light means knowledge, it means truth. So how can you invite me into your light when you have neither?

Isolation has affected you.