₦airaland Forum

is daily manna now your bible?

The issue is not about Jesus winning soulsNIn his earthly ministry, he reconciled man to God by his death dear. He must get to the cross first.

John 12:32-33
32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. 33 This he said, signifying what death he should die.

if men could be born again before jesus died to reconcile man to God, what is the necesity of the shedding of his blood?. what do you understand by BORN again in the first place.  any sect that will teach that a man can be born again without the blood of jesus christ is a sect we should be careful about.

John 6:51
. . .and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

Speaking in other tongues will always be a part of the real church of christ. There are different kinds of praying in the spirit. There is a difference between speaking with tongues (to people) and praying in tongues to God(personaly) and praying to God( on behalf of others )

There Is tongues of men and tongues of angels. Praying in the spirit doesn't have to be in earthly language. it doesn't have to make sense, but in the spirit ,it is a mystery. Men don't have to understand it like the pentecost day.

1 Corinthians 14:2
2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

SirJohn:
Yes Jo, the scriptures above describe various demonic manifestations, this we know and have always known; I have seen quite a number of them too.
What is very puzzling and is indeed what the op is trying to put accross is that these manifestations are now seen amongst christians but this time around, they call it the 'glory of god'
Helloooooo! Barking like dogs, howling like wolves, wriggling and slittering like snakes the glory of god

SirJohn:
Are you saying you dont watch these videos? They're are far cry from what you quoted above take your time to watch these videos.

I agree with you on one thing, some of these things may be manifestations of demonic presence. But by the holyghost. The people in charge may not be so enlightened to discern when a demon is manifesting and when the HOLYSPIRIT is filling a person. I think that's where the problem is. I have ministered the holyghost to people and while some are speaking in tongues  some other manifested the presence of a demon. I had to cast the devil out of them. But if I couldn't descern I would take the demonic manifestation as the infilling of the spirit.

When holyghost is working in a meeting , demons get uncomfortable and it could result in certain disturbances . But my point is , it is the presence of the holyghost that cause these things.

I havent checked on these people. And I don't know about barking like a dog thing. But the holyghost sure manifest in different ways. People can sing in the spirit , laugh in the spirit , groan in the spirit. People can get excited in the spirit and make all sorts of noise. That shouldn't be atttributed to the devil.

1 Corinthians 14:15
15 . . I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

Romans 8:26
26 . . . the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

John 11:33
33 When Jesus therefore saw her weeping, . . , he groaned in the spirit, and was troubled,

I think this is it

34.16927N 73.24169E

aletheia:
^
What rubbish is this? Are you now telling us that Yoga is from God? What kind of delusion is this?

You are the deluded fella dude. Who says yoga is from God ?

newmi:
please explain your point

What I meant was that I wanted to locate the house Osama was killed through google earth. If any one has the coordinate to the house.

It's wrong tanybody like this. Did defend anybody? I only pointed issues out of scriptures. You don't blaspheme against the holy spirit because some non Christians groups do similar thing. You don't generalise on such matters. God is still God

 I've not watched Deren brown video because I thought it's one of the ones you sent to me before , If it's not one of them ,I will watch and comment.

He is not crazy. Only him knows what God has done for him. Ride on bros, display your joy! and gratitude

frosbel:
First of all I am all for healing, deliverance etc etc. But in the bible healing was never accompanied by violent shaking or other diabolic shows, ONLY demonic  possession exhibited such traits.

Do you cast out devils? I cast out devils and I see all manner of manifestations. When the anointing of God hits, the devils will react ,it doesn't matter what noise they make . What of the village churches? Does the pastor have connection with yoga to have manifestations of power.

These manifestations have been there and it's dangerous to attribute the power of God to devils . Jesus had these manifestations likewise the early church

Acts 8:7
7 For unclean spirits, crying with loud voice, came out of many that were possessed with them: and many taken with palsies, and that were lame, were healed.

Mark 1:26
26 And the unclean spirit, throwing the man into convulsions and screeching with a loud voice, came out of him.

Mark 9:20
20 And they brought him unto him: and when he saw him, straightway the spirit tare him; and he fell on the ground, and wallowed foaming.

Mark 9:25-26
25 When Jesus saw that the people came running together, he rebuked the foul spirit, saying unto him, Thou dumb and deaf spirit, I charge thee, come out of him, and enter no more into him. 26 And the spirit cried, and rent him sore, and came out of him: and he was as one dead; insomuch that many said, He is dead.

"he was as one dead" means he fell under the anointing.

Remrmber that not all jesus did was documented. We should be careful in criticising what we don't know. As much as there are wrong things in our world , we should not destroy faith of others in the truth. The other side is the danger of falling into blasphemy.

Mark 3:29-30
29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation: 30 Because they said, He hath an unclean spirit.

frosbel,
when you attribute the workings of Gods spirit to the devil, it is called blasphemy. why would church copy hinduism why can you think that the devil imitates the holyspirit as his custom is. the holy spirit works in divers ways. did jesus shadow heal the sick?. but peters shadow did. did jesu use handkerchief to heal the sick? no but paul did it. the fact that the egyptians magician turned rods to snake like Moses did not mean Moses was a magician. satan may have counterfeit for every truth, but that should not make us destroy the faiths of others by calling truths counterfeit.Jesus didn't tell the apostles everything. he sent the holy spirit to do the job. laying on of hands has always been a principle in God. the facts that certain religion practice should not make us destroy the original.

@newmi and Mabel

When foundational doctrine is faulty ,it will affect the entire structure. I can understand why some have issues with truth

John 6:51
51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

When did he give his flesh for the life  of the world? On the cross of course. How on earth will someone partake of the new life without the cross.

Romans 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.


What was the obedience of christ ? The cross. The bible was clear that it was his obedience to death on the cross that brought life. A testament it's only a document until the death of the testator . The WILL Jesus "wrote" could only be of effect after his death. He made promises to the apostles but he had to die first for it to be of effect.

Hebrews 9:16-18
16 In order for a will to take effect, it must be shown that the one who made it has died. 17 A will is used only after a person is dead because it goes into effect only when a person dies. 18 That is why even the first promise was made with blood.


If any man must mature as a christian , he should start studying Pauline epistles.

what of the part where he said "All of them are in the kingdom of God"

@OLAADEGBU

Thanks for the links, it should motivate one to interceed. they are still our brethren.God will grant them greater light.

How did God turn his back on the world

John 3:16
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son. . .

@OLAADEBGU

Quote from: OLAADEGBU on May 04, 2011, 02:54 PM
"But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels, to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are registered in heaven, to God the Judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect" (Heb.12:22-23).

Jesus is and has always been the central point of history.  In the OT, we read about the law that was given to the Israelites, and all the sacrifices they were commanded by God to carry out, all the festivals they were to keep, and all the feasts they were to conduct.  The reason for all of these is that they pointed to Jesus.

Since the Fall of man, when sin entered the world, everyone on earth thru faith either in Jesus who was to come or faith in Jesus who has now come has the opportunity for salvation through faith.  This is why the Jews had so many laws, festivals and sacrifices, which now have all been fulfilled in Christ, the Messiah they were looking forward to.  It would have been impossible for a Jew to do something without it having reference to the Messiah yet to come.  Praise God, the Messiah has now come.  We all need to make sure we have put our faith and trust in Him.

So the point is that people before Jesus Christ were saved by faith, and thus went to heaven when they died, and those who did not have faith were separated from God forever.

Try do a study on the new creation . The things under the old testament were shadows of the new. No old testament sain went to heaven except Elijah and Enoch . Every other person went to paradise which was beneath in hell . Because Satan still had the power of death.

Jesus was the first person to come out of spiritual death. He had to identify with man in man's spiritual state. He became sin. Which is spiritual death and separation from God.

In his earthly ministry. He preached about the kingdom at hand . The apostles and every other person only got saved when Jesus was glorified.

His blood brought life to us. If we could have life without the death of Jesus . Is there any point for his death. This is an insult to his blood. His life had to be poured out for us to be saved.

The old testament folks only got to heaven when Jesus resurrected with them. Pls read mattew 27


Matthew 27:52-53
52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, 53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.


After this incidence paradise was moved to heaven. When a chritian dies now ,he goes to heaven.

OLAADEGBU:
These are the last days that Jesus and His apostles warned us about and what we see unfold before our very eyes is what has been predicted in ages past.  Jesus warned us that:

"Not everyone that says to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father which is in heaven.  Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name? and in your name have cast out devils? and in your name done many wonderful works? And I will profess to them, I never knew you: depart from me, you that work iniquity." -- Matthew 7:21-23 (The Evidence Bible).

As you can see, a lot of professing Christians are fulfilling this prophecy.  They call Jesus "Lord" but they practice iniquity.  They profess faith in Jesus, but have no regard for the divine Law.  They tell  "white lies," take things that belong to others, have eyes full of adultery but they will say that the Moral Law is for the Jews that are under the law.  May God have mercy on us.

It was Jude that said:

Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write to you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write to you, and exhort you that you should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered to the saints.  For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ. -- Jude 3-4 (The Evidence Bible)

We should not lose sight of the mandate of the Lord Jesus Christ which is to contend earnestly for the faith.  The battle we find ourselves in is for the salvation of lost sinners.  False converts have crept in unawares and sit among us.  They think that salvation and sin are compatible.  They are actually workers of iniquity. 

It was Dr. Leighton Ford who said:

"When people inquire as to the relevance of our gospel, we must not be tricked into going on the defensive.  We must immediately take the offensive, for our Lord Himself has promised that the gates of hell shall not withstand the assaut of His Church."

Lay aside all these rubbish . Let's not derail the topic. Gossip and acusation of other Christians doesn't depict the fruit of the spirit. outward false humility is not Christianity. Your spirituality is not in this holier than thou attitude. Outward false piety with malice,junk,on the inside.

The fruit of the spirit is "LOVE" one of the signs of spirituality is the love for the brethren. You don't engage in gossip about your brethren, if any falls, go to him and restore . There is no perfect church.

All these "my church is better than others" is childish . There is no perfect church. People are people everywhere. A thread came up about a deeper life pastor despoiling a child , did you talk? we hear such cases of outward piety but inward dirty. But I am not in the habit of carrying such story. They are still my brethren even if we are not in the same ministry. We cant be taking communion with the blood of jesus and join the world in speaking evil of one another.So let's stop this child's play. When did apostles get born again?

^^^^
you and flattery, it's not a must to make a post. Knowledge is not common . But we should humble ourselves to learn.
I have given enough scriptures here to enlighten anyone who cares.

It is not possible to be saved without the shedding of the blood.

John 6:51
51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

His body has to be broken, his blood has to be shed for the middle wall of partition to be broken. For us to be one with God, Jew or Gentiles. There's no secrete and special salvation for apostles only. Until Jesus said "it is finished " on the cross . His life was poured out for us to be saved. When the work of salvation wasn't finished no man could be saved.

^^^
. I find it hard to believe they can say that. is there any proof or link to this claim?

@OLAADEGBU

OLAADEGBU:
so why ask questions that are not relevant when you cannot answer pertinent questions?

How can you say these questions are not relevant ?

5:8 learned he obedience. See note on Hebrews 2:10.When the Scriptures said that Jesus learnt obedience it means what He knew by omniscience, He "learned" by experience, thus "being made perfect," not as God (for as God He was eternally perfect, by definition), but as man.

In Hebrews 2:10 It says He was made perfect through suffering, and you may say how can the Holy God be "made perfect," the answer is that if He would also be a perfect man, He must learn obedience to the will of the Father, and true obedience can only be tested if it involves suffering.

There is no special salvation for the apostles. When it come to salvation, there is no preference. Same rule applies to everyone.

I answered the questions you ask me. I don't want to believe you're deliberately avoiding truth here. Jesus had to obey to bring salvation to all. His obedience is the death on the cross. Until that death was certified ,no one could be saved.

Hebrews 5:8-9
8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

He suffered on the cross. And by that obedience , life flowed to all. From the disciples to the rest of the world

Romans 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.


If it's possible to be saved without the blood, why did he have to die?

Enigma:
We have pointed out the below to Joagbaje before but obviously he will prefer to find a way to avoid the implication of the following two passages.
Jesus' words in John 3:3

Jesus' words in Luke 13:28

^^^

It's a futuristic prophecy but also the kingdom of God has always been but the kingdom of heaven started with christ. It's like a political party. The two are used sometimes interchangeably But I wouldn't want to go into that on this thread so as not to cause a derail.

@olaadegbu

Pls don't give a blanket response. I want you to answer each question and comment on each scripture below
.
(1) If the new life came through the death of Jesus . Why would people receive new birth before his blood was shed.
(2) of what necessity would the death of Jesus be if men could be born again without it.

Pls Can you explain the scriptures below one after the other.

Hebrews 5:8-9
8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

Romans 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Philippians 2:8-9
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. 9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

Romans 5:5
And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us

The highest revelation of Christianity is Christ in you, living out His love in you. That’s because love is the highest and topmost quality of God’s character, so much so, that the Bible says, “…God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him” (1 John 4:16). As a Christian, your life ought to be an outshining of God’s great love – His unconditional and self-giving love! You’re a testimony of the Father’s great love.

“But God’s love is too high; how can one ever attain to such high level of love?”
you might ask! Well, Jesus already prayed in John 17:26: “And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.” Sometimes I read this verse and cry because it’s just too much. Jesus asked that our heavenly Father’s love may be in us. We know God heard His prayer because in Romans 5:5, Paul tells us that the same love Jesus prayed about has now been shed in abundance in our hearts by the Holy Spirit.

So, you don’t need to try to attain to God’s level of love, for His love is already in you, and it ought to drive you into action for the Kingdom. The Bible says,

“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life” (John 3:16).
God’s love for the world drove him to give His very best for the salvation of others.

This also should be your testimony; the Father’s love in you should compel you to give your all to the Lord and dedicate yourself to the expansion of His Kingdom. It should motivate you to preach and give big-time for the propagation of the Gospel! The Father’s love in you should compel you to lay your all down for the Lord and live unto Him: “For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead: And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again” (2 Corinthians 5:14-15).

Prayer
Dear Father, thank you for bringing your great love into my life. Your love is shed abroad in my heart by the Holy Spirit and it drives me today to put in everything and do all that is required for the message of the Gospel to reach out to the ends of the earth, in Jesus’ Name. Amen.

Further Study
1 John 4:12-16
No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us. Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit. And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world. Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God. And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.

Romans 5:5
And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us

The highest revelation of Christianity is Christ in you, living out His love in you. That’s because love is the highest and topmost quality of God’s character, so much so, that the Bible says, “…God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him” (1 John 4:16). As a Christian, your life ought to be an outshining of God’s great love – His unconditional and self-giving love! You’re a testimony of the Father’s great love.

“But God’s love is too high; how can one ever attain to such high level of love?”
you might ask! Well, Jesus already prayed in John 17:26: “And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.” Sometimes I read this verse and cry because it’s just too much. Jesus asked that our heavenly Father’s love may be in us. We know God heard His prayer because in Romans 5:5, Paul tells us that the same love Jesus prayed about has now been shed in abundance in our hearts by the Holy Spirit.

So, you don’t need to try to attain to God’s level of love, for His love is already in you, and it ought to drive you into action for the Kingdom. The Bible says,

“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life” (John 3:16).
God’s love for the world drove him to give His very best for the salvation of others.

This also should be your testimony; the Father’s love in you should compel you to give your all to the Lord and dedicate yourself to the expansion of His Kingdom. It should motivate you to preach and give big-time for the propagation of the Gospel! The Father’s love in you should compel you to lay your all down for the Lord and live unto Him: “For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead: And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again” (2 Corinthians 5:14-15).

Prayer
Dear Father, thank you for bringing your great love into my life. Your love is shed abroad in my heart by the Holy Spirit and it drives me today to put in everything and do all that is required for the message of the Gospel to reach out to the ends of the earth, in Jesus’ Name. Amen.

Further Study
1 John 4:12-16
No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us. Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit. And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world. Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God. And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.

Kenyan 28:
A whole year-plus of divine health. Its actually 1 year 1 month today I am celebrating and enjoying divine health, after 8 years of sickness!!

There is no God like Jehovah****there is no God like Jehovah****There is no God like Jehovah****

What God can do, no man can! Thank you Jesus!

Congratulations, lady. You're a living testimony of the healing power of christ manifested in the healing school and every where the resurrected power of christ is believed .

@olaadegbu

I still want to ask you again .
(1) If the new life came through the death of Jesus . Why would people receive new birth before his blood was shed.
(2) of what necessity would the death of Jesus be if men could be born again without it.

Can you explain the scriptures below

Hebrews 5:8-9
8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

Romans 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Philippians 2:8-9
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. 9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

The question we should be asking shouldn't even be went the apostle got born again. But rather " when was the church born" the apostles didn't have special salvation than the rest of the church in their day.

Jesus was life was sown as a seed. To give birth to many. The church was born through his resurrection. Any claim that people partake of the package of the new testament when the blood that will ratify the covenant hadn't been shed is false . Jesus was the first to be born again. We are his brethren.

Jesus was not 100% perfect in his earthly ministry. His perfection came in the resurrection .

Romans 1:4
4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:

OLAADEGBU:
"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." -- 1 Peter 1:23

"That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word" -- Ephesians 5:26

Peter and Paul here use the word of God as the agent of the new birth here, another agent is the Holy Spirit.  It is a pity that you are being denied the blessings that are in the OT and the gospels.  The 66 books of the Bible is meant for doctrine, reproof, correction, instruction in righteousness so that we can be thoroughly furnished to all good works.

Peter only talks about new birth here, paul talks about cleansing the "church"  There is a difference between being cleansed by the word and being born by the word. Don't forget the Jews had relationship with God and by this they were acquainted with certain spiritual laws. The cleansing of the word has always been. That's what Jesus was talking about in John 15. 

John 15:3
3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.

And if you believe that was making reference to "born again" why would Jesus make similar statement in John 17

John 17:17
17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.


You have to be born by the word before cleansing by the word which is an ongoing process. We are also cleansed by the holy spirit .

Another good example is the blood of Jesus. The blood brought us salvation. But there is still an ongoing process of classing by the blood through christian fellowship. They are not the same thing.

1 John 1:7
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

OLAADEGBU:
You don't have to repeat yourself to make your point. It is clear to me that you don't attach much importance to Jesus' words except it is from Paul. Jesus said "Now," not you are going to be, so the cleanliness referred to here was a present experience that the disciples had and this was before the death of Jesus on the Cross and before Pentecost. Even Apostle Peter understood it well when he said:

"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." -- 1 Peter 1:23

So when did this rebirth take place is the question. You haven't addressed my question. The issue of this new life is in the death ,burial and resurrection. As newmi had said. A testament cannot come to effect until the testator dies.

If you claim people had ability to receive new life before Jesus could even shed his blood, then you're trampling on the blood of christ.

Jesus was speaking to his disciples . That has nothing to do with being born again.Jesus was speaking to his disciples . That has nothing to do with being born again. Cleansing is not recreation. We were created anew.

Psalms 102:18
18 This shall be written for the generation to come: and the people which[b] shall be created[/b] shall praise the Lord.

The word of God has always been a cleanser . From old testament time to the church age.

Jesus was speaking to his disciples . That has nothing to do with being born again.

The holograms cannot be used to fake the rapture. A holograme image requires a studio set up to work. A dark environment where it's light can shine to produce the 3d effect. There is no way to beam such lights into the sky.If such can be achieved for any reason, How many jesuses will appear?

The rapture is not the second coming, the rapture is a dissapprearance of saints from-the earth. If they fake the picture ,how can they make men disappear probably naked ,leaving their clothes behind.