₦airaland Forum

lordnicklaus:
This is my first post on this lovely, mind-awakening thread. Fear is the basis for religious superstition. Labeling people as witches is rampant in my state of origin, Akwa Ibom. When a child has a compulsive sleeping habit, he or she is considered as one versed in witchcraft, sorcery and clairvoyance. It pains me to see children with sleeping disorders labeled as so-called nocturnal beings with powers to harm people who fall into their snare. Cultures which believe in such are to be considered as still in the Dark age if not the Stone age. Such beliefs are still common in local churches which we term "Fire-fire churches". Such errant, superstitious beliefs are intrinsic to the belief in vampires, werewolves and leprechauns which originated with Slavic and Celtic cultures. Cc johnydon22 hahn Seun

Superstition is cowardice in the face of the divine - and the divine is no more than the ignorance of man when faced with the mysteries of the web of causalities for the effects he witnesses.

Superstition is a product of ignorance.

chacoonder:
This is a precise expression... well done

Thanks

Cc. Pdizzle hahn.. here it is

Pdizzle:
I'm interested in that too. I'll see what i can get.
This thread is really enlightening.

I have a thread on it, mention me when you put yours up

https://www.nairaland.com/2854125/africa-foreign-religions-cultural-genocide

HIbreed:
It's sad though, but since many
people don't want to reason, let them continue.

Brother freecocoa is an atheist.

I believe in a creator who loves me.

And he made hell just in case you don't love him back or believe it exists - what a loving creator.

Forceful love and blind conformity.

urahara:
U must be sick

Hahahahaha

HardMirror:
I am bewildered at how a supposed religion of love and compassion finds it convenient to shout "praise God!" When others perish

It is consonant with basic human compassion and sympathy. . .

OgundeleT:
lol
i think you said you wont reply my mention again? see your life now. well i don't av you time anymore

LOL.. Easy ni oo

donnffd:
Yes, we do agree on alot of things, i was originally of the opinion that you dont approve abortion no matter the situation. So let us narrow it down to the rape victim scenerio.

Nope i approve abortion when it is medically recommended to save the mother's life.

This is difficult and the choice ultimately falls back to the victim, but i would stand beside and support a victim who chooses to abort, why?

I wouldn't even though i recognize it is a tough choice for her to make.

Well, let start with what you said about a foetus being a human, i disagree, i dont claim to be an expert on it but i do know that at some stage, a human foetus is no different from a fish foetus, at a stage it still has gills, tails and many features from our evolutionary past. Can it really be called a human?, i doubt it. Now you might ask, so at what point does it become a human?, i dont know and i am sure there is no universal answer,but if i was to bet, i would go for the time the brain has formed well enough to register pain.

Even as a fully functional human you still have tails only seating on it, My argument is based on the feotus being a functional system of cells, an off spring of humans and at that i reserve a right for them to live.

Which brings me to my second point, personhood. Who is a person?, i dont think people are given right to live just because they are humans(hitler was a human, serial killers are humans), i think they are given right to live because they are persons(again, my opinion).
Whats the difference?, Well, a one month old baby is as much a human as a 32 year old, but not as much a person. The 32 year old has a complex array of emotions, knowledge, relationships, goals and beliefs that surpasses that of a one month old and would gladly give his or her life to save that baby from harm, thats personhood.


If we go further back into the development of a foetus, we realize that its not much of a person as the victim who was raped and as goals, and plans for the future. Like i said earlier, the sole choice would rest on the hypothetical victim, but if she decides not to keep it, she would be justified because first and formost, she is far more of a person than a 2week foetus and her future should be considered first.

I do agree this to be a delicate matter and it's understandable if the mother chooses to abort the feotus at this juncture being a result of a forceful act, but i also do believe that every baby deserves as much chance to live like every other.

She still has a future even the baby you may say different from the original plan but we all know the eventuality of achieving a desired goal is still under the confines of chance.

This is my philosophy, this is my belief - thus future is uncertain, that you'd live tomorrow is still even under heavy chance, so i believe in living in the moment which is directly why i ask for patience and perserverence on the part of such 'ill fated unready mothers".

something beautiful may yet come from it, that baby may still be the beacon that lights her future.

Lastly, many fertilized eggs fails to get implanted on the womb wall!, Many women naturally abort more times than they know it, but noone notices

Nature kills us everyday, why then do we complain when a human kills another - because this time a mind is involved, a decision was taken.

So you would not react same way when a land slide occurs and a boulder smashes someone to death AND when a boulder was pushed deliberately by someone else to smash another to death.

so why should a victim of rape not be allowed to choose how she wants her future to be shaped just because she has a foetus growing in her?!.

I do believe she has every right to and by all means do - my sentiments are from the direct tilt of my emotional moral principles.

Helping others to survive as long as it does not directly endanger your own life

deekseen:
@Seun, the moral judge.

My over 9 years here tells me that if you were God you'd do worse.

You ban people for insulting with words as 'subtle' as "Id!ot", but promote obscenity and Pornography (that insult the mind and psychological makeup of a person) on your homepage.

While nothing much may be wrong with that, it clearly shows your preference. Insults don't get the traffic, obscenity and Pornography do! They are part of your main tools. They are vital in your money making course.

In the scripture you quoted, Peter and the early Christians setup a camp outside the city and wanted a common wealth everyone would have access to, no one richer than the other. The instruction was for everyone to submit every possession. Ananais and his wife went against that.

Remember, these were first generation Christians and they couldn't start off on the wrong foot.

About Peter and The couple, Peter was a useful tool in God's hands (same way you use obscenity and Pornography) to propel the gospel, while Ananais and his wife were used to caution others (same way you ban people for using 'subtle' insulting words). God forgave Peter and empowered him (same way you empower the O and P on your forum) and killed the couple (you delete or hide posts at your discretion).

Now, tell me Seun, are you not much like, if not worse, than the God you always condemn?

And the bolded doesn't bother you - you have a supposedly all powerful god that is so petty that you can compare it in character with such a vulnerable and flawed creature as man?

KingEbukaNaija:
God is both a loving God and a consuming fire . Are you just knowing this ?

Deuteronomy 4:24
24 For the Lord your God is a consuming fire

God keeps telling us what he'll do the wicked to show you how much he hates sin .

I wonder how you manage to jam the word "Love" and "wicked" in the same sentence to portray a "loving god's" potential action towards the supposed "beloved"..

I keep wondering how you lot do it - the only explanation is that your belief have no idea of what love is.

Blood and ruin, threat and obedience comformity, wrath and sadism is nothing near love.

KingEbukaNaija:
You do realise that if he gets saved later on and you do not you will suffer
in Hell for this extremely foolish decision .

You have summed up the totality of the basis of christian belief.

the basis of your beliefs is the fear of hell fire and not really because you actually think a god exists.

It baffles me how none of you can't see the outright pettiness, monstrosity, sadism and chronic egoism in a concpet of a god who is so keen on blind belief that is plans to burn people who don't give it.

Tiri gbosaaa for you guys !!!

His write ups in fact have
increased my faith in God

We understand. trust me, we really do.

weblord1900:
I'm really confused..
I have thought about it deeply, after thinking I always finds him right.
I have also prayed many times asking God to show me that he really exist even if it's in my dream if can't do it physically.
But no sign... Will he put me to hell just because I don't believe in him?..

Good question

kevoh:
Someone is trying so hard, too desperate to defend Only you 4 to 5 unreplied posts already on just this first page, quoting everyone desperately. Seun must have said the truth then.

Its a tough Job defending biblical inconsistencies and obscenities, i sometimes pity the hard workers.

Twalle for them ni oo

kingcity:
when will u stop attacking christians.?

If this is an attack against Christianity then the bible is certainly an attack against christianity then - and you should probably address your question to the bible.

Beautiful and educative - please carry on

zzzzy:
I would like to know.

Exactly same with your views on using Thursday named after the Norse God Thor.

Thor's day.

---

Between though i hold a view that a man probably named Jesus existed within that timeline, possibly a revolutionalist who was insubordinate to the jewish priestly class and roman colonial authority and for that was possibly crucified by the Romans, the one on whose all these legends were heaped on, by his followers.

This doesn't mean i believe of such a figure being a deity or son of a god, that is the obvious myth in the fable.

He's not the first man to be deified by the enthusiastic followers, in fact being born of a god was the highest conferment of honour on an individual.

There have been several hundreds of men in history deified and said to be born of a union between a god parent and a human parent.

That's totally rampant during those days.

betterABIAstate:
there are no alligators in Africa, alligators are found in Americas and China, that's a crocodile. Meanwhile, its wrong to have killed it

Please tell me how it is wrong to kill a crocodile or an allogator which ever that is? what makes it wrong?

Let me answer and chip in my own thoughts within these subtle thoughts -

0ubenji:
1. It’s an incredible con job when you think about it, to
believe something now in exchange for something after
death. Even corporations with their reward systems don’t try
to make it posthumous. — Gloria Steinem.

It is indeed an incredible con job, a remarkble testimony to human idiocy when grasping more on the emotional aspect of our cognitive lean.

Isn't it stupendous that people never stopped and thought - Yahweh chased Adam and eve out of the garden so they wouldn't eat the fruit of Immortality and live forever because they now had the knowledge of good and bad [according to the bible] now turns around and promises you immortality after you are dead

Its the most sinister and genius con job i know, because after selling immortality for 10% of people's income nobody can ever come back and ask for a refund when the product is not delivered.

2. Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by
the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. — Edward
Gibbon.

It is useful because a social order is needed, religion is one of those tools.

3. The whole thing is so patently infantile, so foreign to
reality, that to anyone with a friendly attitude to humanity it
is painful to think that the great majority of mortals will
never be able to rise above this view of life. — Sigmund
Freud.

It is a suffocating sad fate to the intellectual evolution of our species.

4. A man is accepted into a church for what he believes and
he is turned out for what he knows. — Samuel Clemens.

Because "belief" is about uncertainty, when ever you profess belief, you are affirming uncertainty on the subject of belief.

You cannot accept what you know by belief - knowing is certainty.. And the worst part is - most cannot even tell the difference between "Belief" and "knowledge". that which they believe becomes the totality of what they know.

5. I believe in God, only I spell it Nature. — Frank Lloyd
Wright.

spinoza God, very worthy concept.

6. The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no
more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is
happier than a sober one. — George Bernard Shaw.

Ignorance at a time is bliss, knowledge is a burden that needs to grow more, a burden that batters you with the uncaring whips of reality.

I think most people are comfortable with the "Myth" pill, you know take the drug that provides you with that cozy, warm and okay feel rather then look and accept the cold reality as it is.

7. Faith means not wanting to know what is true. — Friedrich Nietzsche.

Exactly: Cus one has already substituted what "he/she wants, feels to be be true" for "what actually is".

Faith is a dishonest position, makes people feel it's okay to pretend to know what nobody actually knows.

8. Creationists make it sound like a ‘theory’ is something you
dreamt up after being drunk all night — Isaac Asimov.

Theories can still be wrong even at that…

9. I don’t believe in God. My god is patriotism. Teach a man
to be a good citizen and you have solved the problem of life. — Andrew Carnegie.

Surely, to ensure societal well being and continuity.

10. All thinking men are atheists. — Ernest Hemingway.

Not necessarily true.. not all thinking men are atheists and not all atheists are critical thinking men.

11. Lighthouses are more helpful then churches. - Benjamin
Franklin.

In the realistic point of view.

12. Philosophy is questions that may never be answered.
Religion is answers that may never be questioned. –
Anonymous.

The blackcat analogy
Philosophy is like being in a dark room looking for a blackcat wondering where it might be.

Science is like being in a dark room looking for a blackcat with a torch light.

Religion is like being in a dark room looking for a blackcat and shouting "i've found it" but yet cant produce the cat.

13. With or without religion, you would have good people
doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for
good people to do evil things, that takes religion. – Steven
Weinberg.

It goes both ways, let us not always dwell on the negative side - that'd mean dishonesty.

It also takes religion to make evil people to do good things.

14. Since the Bible and the church are obviously mistaken in
telling us where we came from, how can we trust them to
tell us where we are going? – Anonymous.

If you are looking for answers about nature and you visit religious books, you almost certainly have the wrong answer.

15. The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.
– Delos B. McKown.

In a way but not always true.… Just because you can't see something doesn't mean it's not there.

16. Two hands working can do more than a thousand
clasped in prayer. – Anonymous.

Truer than true.

17. Blind faith is an ironic gift to return to the Creator of
human intelligence. – Anonymous.

Best quote of the lot.

Let's assume there is a creator who made man and gave man reason and intelligence - it/she/he would expect we use it - dumping reason and analytic intellect for blind faith as a boat of piety to an intelligent causer of man's intellect would be a very huge insult to it's intellect.

If there is actually a god or gods: theism is more so an insult to it than atheism.

18. What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed
without proof. – Christopher Hitchens.

Gbaaam

19. I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one
fewer god than you do. When you understand why you
dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why
I dismiss yours. – Stephen Roberts.

I'd contend that nobody actually believes in one god, even the so called monetheic religions also acknowledge other deities in their terminology, mostly as a counter deity [an evil counter part to the good one] or triune gods

Polytheism acknowledges the existence of many gods - so as long as you acknowledge the existence of other deities like satan in your doctrine then it's not monetheism even if you do worship only one.

Polytheism is about whether more than 1 deity exists not whether you agree tk worship them..

A critical look at this shows there is nothing like monotheism.

20. It ain’t the parts of the Bible that I can’t understand that
bother me, it is the parts that I do understand. – Mark Twain.

The outright abhorrence and lies - its sad that most people end the need or reach of their intellect on such primitive book.

21. Atheism is a non-prophet organization. – George Carlin.

I contend that atheism is an organization.

22. Absolute faith corrupts as absolutely as absolute power
but absolute power is corrupt only in the hands of the
absolutely faithful. – Anonymous.

This is deep.

23. Gods are fragile things; they may be killed by a whiff of
science or a dose of common sense. – Chapman Cohen.

Very fragile, more so that they need man in order to be relevant. Cant even speak or act for themselves.

24. When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called
insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion it is
called religion. – Robert Pirsig.

If you believe yout hallucinations are real then you are insane but if a group of people believe some else's hallucination is real, they are religious.

25. Animals do not have gods, they are smarter than that. –
Ronnie Snow.

or they have less the ego of humans to make themselves the apex of the entirety of creation or make a copy of themselves and put them behind the purpose and causality of the cosmos.

the Gods or God are just an imagined copy of man deified.

26. Most religions prophesy the end of the world and then
consistently work together to ensure that these prophecies
come true. – Anonymous.

Prophecies are so vague that astrology begins to sound even real.

27. Religions are like pills, which must be swallowed whole
without chewing. – Anonymous.

If mastigated within the iron clad teeth of reason, you will discover how bitter it is and may spit it out without swallowing.

28. If I were not an atheist, I would believe in a God who
would choose to save people on the basis of the totality of
their lives and not the pattern of their words. I think he
would prefer an honest and righteous atheist to a TV
preacher whose every word is God, God, God, and whose
every deed is foul, foul, foul. – Isaac Asimov.

If people are to invent a God let them at least invent ones worth my worship and respect.

29. Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by
the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. – Seneca the
Younger.

appeared twice.

30. Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is
malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence
cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call
him God? – Epicurus

Noble thoughts of Epicurus still remained unanswered...
https://www.nairaland.com/3200618/epicurean-argument-evil-god

donnffd:
I cant say for certain if Abortion is moral or not, it would all depend on the situation but i am certain I stand for women being given the right over their own bodies.

Thank you for opening up this open debate between you and i on the subject of Abortion. I am a humanist to start with and i'd say nothing i say is a universal truth but an opinion based on my moral philosophies as a humanist.

We all do have fundamental rights over our own bodies but when a right entails ridding of someone else's right, that selfish exercision of our own rights becomes detrimental to others.

I do believe we also have the rights to live no matter the age of such human and in this regard knowing fully well that a feotus is already a complex system of cells therefore a living being just like us, i do not support ridding them of that right to live just to satisfy an unruly exercision of right by some folks.

When the issue of abortion arises, it becomes very sensitive and people lean towards different views, but i believe that an abortion could not only be carried out but must be carried out when it is absolutely necessary. Some women can have complications in child-bearing costing them their lives

This is the one time i support abortion - when the life of the feotus is directly detrimental to the survival of the mother.

, some girls still in school are victims of rape and having that child would be a dream-destroyer.

I know this can be a difficult position to be in but i do think that we humans tend to develop an unbound love for offspring no matter how it comes about, Children are like money, always welcome even if it comes in a dirty sack.

Even though i do agree this example is delicate and there is compelling drive to get rid of the feotus, i also implore patience and perserverence, something beautiful may yet come out of the ugly situation after all.

A child is beautiful and deserves love..

Now you might say, every embryo has a potential of becoming a human-being, i agree, it has the potential but it is not yet a human(i.e embryo that are not yet fully developed).

This doesn't negate the fact that it is a living being and in fact i'd argue is human.

It doesnt know anything, it cannot feel pain or joy, but the mother can, so i feel the mother's safety and well-being should be put first and if that means terminating a not-yet formed human, then so be it.

Yes the mother's well being should be put first but only when this well being is threatened, only when her safety is threatened.

Denying a feotus right to live in order to satisfy an uncharted recklessnes from a girl or woman or a couple is something i cannot support.

cc Johnydon22
NB: I dont condone reckless abortion, only necessary ones.

There are instances when abortion is medically recommended to save the mother's life.

even the Igbos has an adage that says let the water pour away and not the pot, as long as we still have the pot we can fetch another water.

So only when the mother's is at stake, let the baby go - anything other than that is consonant with my own opinion and views

Goddys:
Otem, the fact remains you twist events to favour your course.
I was I inspired to ask for favour and somebody who God touched favoured me by financing my law school programme. If you claim to be self righteous,stop twisting events to your favour and be straightforward.
If my spirit ministers to me to again to ask for favour online ,I won't hesitate because my God can supply my needs through any means He deems fit.
Stop portraying yourself as self righteous when all you do is manipulate events to satisfy your devlish doctrine.
I'm still praying for you and my God will deliver you from the entanglement of eartum. My book shall expose everything.

Lmao . . . that is one funny prophecy boomarang

donnffd:
Ok bro, i would create a thread for it, is that ok by you?

it's all good though i have my busy times when i am at work, i wont be able to come online.

So i'm free from now till 12pm today and from 4pm down i am free also... you may choose a better time from that brother

donnffd:
I would love us to have a discussion on this topic

I am open to it

Amberon11:
Dunce! what is pulling things towards the ground? why is gravity unseen?

Nothing is pulling anything, its rather an effect of the object's mass on space..

Let me give you a practical example you can do at home to get the idea : If you have a rubber sheet or something similar, spread is finely suspended in air, then place a heavy probably metal orb on top of it, you'll notice the orb will dent the rubber sheet.

Place a lighter orb within the horizone of the dent, you will see the lighter dent will slide towards the center of the dent made by the bigger heavy orb.

That is gravity.

are unseen things physical??

Physical doesn't necessarily mean seen, it goes with anything that manifests in the material realm or having to do with Physics [which sums up the entire universe, seen or unseen]

are radio waves physical?

Yes it is, it is propagted by Photons, radio waves are just another spectral wavelength of light .

And is very very very very Physical.

Go study about the history of physics. And watch some YouTube videos on "energy is everything" to cure your ignorance.

Very irrelevent to what's being discussed - next time do not be so quick to lash out insults on another when you don't know any better than them.

Make your points without having to insult cus truly none of us comes fully prepared.

carmag:
Is there anything that makes a religious person better than an atheist?...that's my question

religious people have been ruling Nigeria since 1960 till date, it has not impacted on her citizens rather it impoverished them the more

Try and appoint those who claims holier than though in a position of authority and they'll embezzle the funds in their care undermining
their religious principles

we are among the most religious country and among the most corrupt society in the world today, religious leaders don't preach against corruption bcs they benefits from the system

if an atheist become our leader tomorrow there will be a radical change starting from law enforcement and order,.. stringent laws will be passed to tame corruption

the over celebrated religious institutions will be compelled to pay tax which would rake in billions of Naira annually,
how can one justify the fact that the biggest industry in a nation is exempted from paying tax while the operators are cruising in private Jets

it will help to improve our social amenities, equip our Hospitals, Education etc

I totally support the idea of religious organizations paying taxes because they make the most money - an immoral distilation of wealth from the sweat of the poor masses

I will not vote an atheist just because he's an atheist, i will only vote the person i believe to be the most credible candidate.

Everyone can delude themselves with the notion of moral superiority and better pinciples - One thing is certain:

We are all humans and we each are alike in emotions, fear, greed and our need to to survive and we each have equal potential to great good that can change the world or terrible evil that also can.

No matter your beliefs, religiosity or irreligiosity

Bolustic:
No, I wouldn't!!!
Despite our leaders being hypocritical Christians and Muslims, they are still in every way better than an atheist.

An atheist would see nothing wrong with GAY marriage, abortion and other conventionalised sacrileges.

I am an atheist and a humanist and i see everything wrong in Abortion

Niflheim:
I was born into a christian home!!! My day was Catholic!!! It was after I discovered the writings of T.Pain(not the muslim one who is in love with a stripper , I am talking about Thomas Paine), that I knew that religion is over in my life!!!

Thomas Paine really killed and buried Christianity with that "Age of Reason"... have only read the starting page though but it was already too obvious.

Though Thomas Paine was a deist as he affirmed in the book - his belief in God was due to the uncertainty of causality [Argumentum ad ignorantum]

GeneralShepherd:
Gravity may be not be physical (?) but it is a consistent force that can actually be measured. It even has its own unit of measurement. It can be objectively observed by anyone, anywhere.

Just like magnetism, gravity and other forces can be independently observed by many people and they will come up with answers very close to each other.

Same cannot be said about God and Gods

WTF do you guys mean that gravity is not physical.. I want to know that means?

Gravity is a physical value for goodness sake.. Jeez!!!