₦airaland Forum

aManFromMars:















But na true na... you're dead to this world.

I have heard.
If I begin to dey tok now, you go tok say I dey repeat the same thing over and over, so make I keep quiet first.

Mr Troll: It is amazing how a person can be so foolish and blind to reason. josh is a perfect example of how religion deadens your common sense. Josh will never have sense. Its a real pity.

didn't even see this post till now.

^^^

1 timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
(KJV)

1. I'll ban the dreaded spambot till 3042, the godfather of nairaland who operates behind the scenes.

2. I'll ban seun to see how he will take being banned from his own forum ()

Can't think of anyone else.

I don't get it.

aManFromMars: I guess these are the real questions you intended to ask.

no actually. These questions came up in our discussion.

My original questions still stand and are adressed to you.
What do you think happened?

aManFromMars: Learning what? How to build an argument for God based on the ignorance of man?

Neither you nor the OP's here to learn.

"What happened before [/b]the big bang? What [b]led [/b]to the big bang? Where [b]did the energy come from?"

what do you want then?

I'm actually learning a lot from kay17.

Kay 17: You didn't discuss Job at all and the examples I raised, including that of rape.

If a baby is deformed and dies painful as a result of the deformity caused by its mother's addictions, there is no sin of the Baby to justify its suffering, so he suffered for no reason other than God chose it suffer.

he suffered for no other reason than his mother chose him to suffer.

Kay 17: So it throws out your argument that the sins of others on us is justified since others suffer from our sins.

I never said the sins of others on us is justified. I said we cannot blame others(like adam) completely for our suffering when we actually sin and cause others suffering ourselves.

Kay 17: Ok what does sin have to do with our knowledge.

I've been asking the same question. What is man looking for with his knowledge?
What has it got to do with his basic problems and needs like sin and suffering? Or does sin and suffering not demand our attention?
How does knowledge of the complex universe deal with the first basic problem we all have?

What is the basis of mans curiosity for knowledge of who knows what?
What is man truly looking for? What is he truly seeking to understand?

Kay 17: Why is Job's case different?!

Didn't he suffer from the theft, misfortune, diseases, sinful wife, sinful friends? Why didn't you simply say adam's sins made job suffer, just as an innocent foetus.

An innocent child suffers from the hand of the mother doesn't deserve it because he suffers from forces beyond his control.

You don't seem to appreciate the wide ranging effects of suffering, I believe Suffering is a more fundamental issue than sin, because undeservedly suffering from sin is suffering too.

we can discuss job in another thread.

I like the way you think.
I understand the wide range of suffering like you do.

We all suffer because of adams sin. And also because of our sins. But we are being decieved if we blame Gods judgement of sin and don't look toward our own sins ourselves. The innocent child suffers and he doesn't deserve it. Its beyond his control. But it is not beyond his mothers control. She decides the fate of her baby. And she chose to make him suffer.

I believe sin was what brought about suffering.

Adam was given a responsibility, just as the mother is given a responsibility to care for her child. But adam jeopardized mans future by engaging in sin, which brought about suffering. Just like that mother.

But we cannot term ourselves as innocent children, because we have also brought about suffering on others because of our sins too. Its like a person with an addiction. He bemoans his predicament, but instead of seeking a way of freedom, he sinks deeper into his addiction because of the temporal pleasure it brings.

Suffering and sin is very fundamental. That's why people don't like the subject when its brought up. Its because its not just adam that is guilty, we're all guilty. Adam started first sin, and we continued. We lie and steal and hate and profane. The suffering in the world has immensely increased because of us. But when the solution is proffered, men spite and reject. Could it be that they enjoy sin?

Kay 17: Sin has nothing to do in this thread, we were discussing the nature of knowledge, and you seem to believe the big ban.g theory is entirely false

my thoughts on the big ban.g are irrelevant sir. The thread asked about your thoughts on how the big bang came about. Where did the energy come from.

It was as we were discussing the nature of knowledge and mans tackling of the universe's complexity that sin came up sir.

I was only giving my opinion of what mans problem really is.

Alfa Seltzer: what is sin?

please answer the question posed at the beginning of the thread.

aManFromMars: umm, you were the one who started ranting about sin.

she(or he) asked me a question and I answered. She asked me what the disease was and I answered. Or do you want me to start mincing words? Or be ashamed and hide?

Femmymata2: . AN ALL KNOWING GOD CURSE the whole world For the disobedience of two individual DESPITE KNOWIng the Future IMPLICATION WHICH WILL REQUIRE IT TO SEND HIMSELF OR iT$ ONLY BEGOTTEN SON JESUS(GOD) TO COMMIT ASSISTED SUICIDE TO mitigate THE FIRST CURSE. GODS FOOLISHNESS IS BETTER THAN THIEST WISDOM

an allknowing God who is a judge cursed the earth and man because of sin. Sin brought suffering and death.

Man continues in sin. He will bring judgement once more.
But he sent his son to be a substitute to judgement and wrath to those who accept him.

Kay 17: Assuming you answered Job of the Bible in this same way, "why am I suffering", do you think Job would be satisfied that he is condemned for Adam's sins or the sins of others?! Rather he would further ask "why the injustice of suffering for the sins of others" which is a form of Suffering!

job's case is unique on its own.

Suffering for the sins of others is injustice? Think carefully. A pregnant mother who takes drugs causes suffering on her infant, who is born with the same drug addictions. Our different sins affect others in ways we cannot even imagine.

It affected the innocent son of God in the worst way. He was condemned and killed for our sins.

Sin affects others. Its a disease. Its contagious.
Injustice is continuing in sin and not looking for salvation from it.

aManFromMars: 1 Samuel 15
18 Now the Lord sent you on a mission, and said, ‘Go, and utterly destroy the sinners, the Amalekites, and fight against them until they are consumed.’ 19 Why then did you not obey the voice of the Lord? Why did you swoop down on the spoil, and do evil in the sight of the Lord?”

1 Samuel 15
26 But Samuel said to Saul, “I will not return with you, for you have rejected the word of the Lord, and the Lord has rejected you from being king over Israel.” 27 And as Samuel turned around to go away, Saul seized the edge of his robe, and it tore. 28 So Samuel said to him, “The Lord has torn the kingdom of Israel from you today, and has given it to a neighbor of yours, who is better than you. 29 And also the Strength of Israel will not lie nor relent. For He is not a man, that He should relent.” 30 Then he said, “I have sinned; yet honor me now, please, before the elders of my people and before Israel, and return with me, that I may worship the Lord your God.” 31 So Samuel turned back after Saul, and Saul worshiped the Lord.
32 Then Samuel said, “Bring Agag king of the Amalekites here to me.” So Agag came to him cautiously. And Agag said, “Surely the bitterness of death is past.” 33 But Samuel said, “As your sword has made women childless, so shall your mother be childless among women.” And Samuel hacked Agag in pieces before the Lord in Gilgal.

Summary: Saul spares a man's life and is rejected by God. To make amends, Saul ends up killing King Agag. He is forever rejected by God and God sends evil spirits to torment him.



Then another example.
2 Samuel 11
2 One evening David got up from his bed and walked around on the roof of the palace. From the roof he saw a woman bathing. The woman was very beautiful, 3 and David sent someone to find out about her. The man said, “She is Bathsheba, the daughter of Eliam and the wife of Uriah the Hittite.”
4 Then David sent messengers to get her. She came to him, and he slept with her. (Now she was purifying herself from her monthly uncleanness.) Then she went back home. 5 The woman conceived and sent word to David, saying, “I am pregnant.”
14 In the morning David wrote a letter to Joab and sent it with Uriah. 15 In it he wrote, “Put Uriah out in front where the fighting is fiercest. Then withdraw from him so he will be struck down and die.”
16 So while Joab had the city under siege, he put Uriah at a place where he knew the strongest defenders were. 17 When the men of the city came out and fought against Joab, some of the men in David’s army fell; moreover, Uriah the Hittite died.

2 Samuel 12
5 After Nathan had gone home, the Lord struck the child that Uriah’s wife had borne to David, and he became ill. 16 David pleaded with God for the child. He fasted and spent the nights lying in sackcloth[b] on the ground. 17 The elders of his household stood beside him to get him up from the ground, but he refused, and he would not eat any food with them.
18 On the seventh day the child died. David’s attendants were afraid to tell him that the child was dead, for they thought, “While the child was still living, he wouldn’t listen to us when we spoke to him. How can we now tell him the child is dead? He may do something desperate.”
19 David noticed that his attendants were whispering among themselves, and he realized the child was dead. “Is the child dead?” he asked.
“Yes,” they replied, “he is dead.”


Summary: David sins, the child gets killed.

samuel killed king agag actually.
God rejected saul as king of israel

Can you answer the questions posed at the opening of the thread? What do you think? What are your speculations?

Kay 17: What has sin and knowledge/Big Ban.g got to do with sins?! You seem to derail your own thread.

aren't you following the conversation we were having?

^^^
Here's his profile:
https://www.nairaland.com/ihedinobi

@ dimples: good morning.
I think you could pm ihedinobi.

Kay 17: How would he know that, if he is probing about in the dark.

Wouldn't more questions promise more answers?

What disease? Curiousity?!

no ma'am.
The disease is sin. Man in this day and age chooses to ignore this disease that has sunk into his very nature. He chooses to ignore this disease that has ravaged the world with suffering and grief. He refuses to acknowledge or even treat this basic problem in this so called modern age, and he prefers to waste much of his resources tackling the symptoms. He calls those who recognize this problem and look for a solution foolish and unenlightened.

I do not debunk curiosity, but let man be curious about the right things.

Kay 17: Put yourself in the shoes of a one year old in war ravaged area, she is starved, deprived of parental care and love, and close to death. Now you have provided your answer for the cause of suffering, saying it is a curse from God against Adam and his offsprings, and that God also made subsequent Adams imperfect.

The child's condition is solely as a result of God's curse, she suffers physical pain as well as injustice, which she does not deserve. She is at the mercy of wicked warmonging dictators and mass killers.

So I will recouch my question, why is there injustice?

no ma'am, this is Gods curse:

He cursed the serpent and proclaimed mans salvation.

He cursed womankind to have sorrow in childbirth.

He cursed the ground because of man, and made him reap in sorrow and die.

These curses God put because of mans sin, but man didn't look for Gods ways of salvation.
Man instead became exceedingly sinful and commited murder, lacked love and became greedy and covetuous and started wars. All we see is because of sin, not God. Gods duty is to punish sin, this he will do. And cause repentance and salvation, and a change in mans nature. This he has done.

That one year old did not suffer because of God's curse, its because of mans sin

Kay 17: By travelling to the stars man seeks knowledge!

Can a question pertaining to knowledge be wrong? No

does man seek knowledge in the wrong place? Does He not misunderstand his problem?

Is the problem not basic? Man tries to deny and ignore and justify this problem, this disease that intertwines itself in his life.

The holy scriptures have been revealed. It was all about Jesus you see. Anyone who calls the bible irrelevant and accuses it of treachery is only foolishly spreading falsehood evident to all. If you read the bible, you'll see life lessons there. You'll see God-speak there. No other shows man how to have his sins forgiven.

From the beginning, it was about Jesus. In the end, it was about Jesus. When Jesus came and got salvation and showed man the judgement top come, the scriptures to (revealed was finished. Complete.)

There is no single contradiction in the bible. Them who think there is contradiction should open a new thread with the aim of innocently finding out and not foolish mockery.

Even the rise of muslims was prophesied in the bible. Was told of.

The prophecies come to pass and still come to pass. The word has been fulfilled in peoples lives.

The revealed words have been complete sir. They started and ended with Jesus. At the end when Jesus showed man the future, it was closed. That was it.

Please do not pride yourself in "being smart and capable of rational thought" and think youy're better than others or smarter than God. Some people have done that and have shown their foolishness in their lives and even the words they speak to justify their twisted made up views.

If you're a real christian, you'll realize that the bible was a closed book, opened up to you when you were saved. As we read, God himself, the author, teaches us and reveals to us all truth. And if you truly are a christian, you wouldn't ve trying to debunk God because of unanswered questions, because you'd know him personally. How can you be trying to debunk a person you know?

You'll rather go to him, and have your questions answered.

texanomaly: My day was amazing. I have been working on Sundays because the day person quit. My boss finally hired someone. I went to church today. I have missed it.

thank God ma'am.
Its in the quiet of the night and the early mornings that my soul whispers reality to me.

I'm filled with thanksgiving, saved from sin, we are continually blessed and given all things by God.

Blessed be the name of the Lord.
God is good. Yea his mercy endureth forever.

Kay 17: Yet to suffer for someone's else sins is injustice, hence injustice comes prior to committing sin. And injustice is a form of suffering, so my question still stands. Why the suffering and injustice in the world, why do we suffer for Adam's sins?!

this is a very good question ma'am.

We were not at the garden of eden, we did not commit the original sin, so why do we suffer for it?
God will not hold a man in judgement and punish him for adams sin. He will punish him for his sins.
Of course, adams sin still affects us today. Peoples sins affect others. The reckless driver's sin causes others to die in a crash. I mean, we inherited the sin nature. We are by nature sinners, in a sinful world. Some people use this oppourtunity to be bitter against God or criticize adam, but what about our sin? What has this knowledge of the terrible thing sin can do to a man done to us? Has it made us to look for a salvation from it(Jesus Christ)? Or have we kept commiting sin that affects others also more than we can imagine. We were made imperfect, God made us perfect in Christ Jesus. The curse God placed on the earth was a result of sin. He drove adam out of his prescence because of sin, he pronounced death because of sin. How could man be trapped in this fallen nature forever?

Ma'am. The consequences of adams sin(which is simple reality, not complex stuff, sin is the simple problem that causes man suffering every day) should not make you bitter against God, but should make you appreciate and embrace Gods way of making us perfect again through Christ Jesus.

texanomaly: hello Josh. How are you?

fine ma'am
Had a wonderful day today.
How was yours?

ARareGem: Mr Mars, body dey inside cloth.

Good eve, Josh and everyone.

Royally, it's been a while.

Good evening ma'am.

Good evening tex. I see you viewing.

Good evening everyone, and good night.

Kay 17: The Big Bang Theory is the forefront of human knowledge, it burst a bubble of questions, we only have more questions and questions. We ask questions even of ordinary meanings and try to redefine them. Such as time, space, beginning, nothing


We are faced with a proposition of vertical time, which blow our minds as to its conception. We ask questions about time travel, distances, even the human psyche, our observation bias, causality.

And above all the psychological demand for certainty.

question, questions, questions. I paticularly love the bolded statement.

The psychological demand for certainty.

Could it be that man has been shooting himself in the foot? Could it be that he's been asking the wrong questions in trying to decipher reality all this while? Could he have been looking from the wrong perspective? Could he be making the wrong conclusions time and again?

Is he in a never ending cycle to find the certainty of objective truth?

Are you focusing on the correct thing ma'am? Are you asking the wrong questions and blowing up basic conceptualism?

Could man have gotten the wrong idea? Could he be wanting "complex answers" as he sees the universe's complexity? Is the answer to the many questions quite simple?

What are you looking for?
What is man looking for?
Has man been distracted from basic reality because of his longing to understand infinite complexity?

[quote author=2s£xy]To you, that's what it seems like. What do guys get when they do the opposite? A weakling, a pest, a no good wretch without a future...

Do whatever pleases you, bro.[/quote]So selfless loving makes you a weakling and a pest without a future?
And being selfish guarantees you a future and strength?
Strength lies in selfishness?

I think not.
Selfless sacrifice and love is true strength. It stands the test of time also.