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How does something then pop out of nothing? If God can create from nothing which is logically impossible, its fair to conclude god is logically impossible

Did God create everything from nothing?

Gender is culturally defined same as God its invention.

991: Human life was never, has never been and never will be created. life FORMS.

I feel that!

joe4christ: So what's the name of your god's son?

Gods are just like humans, they smell, they talk, they see, they have sons, they have marriages, sometimes they have sex, they also smile. I guess if god has a human reflection.

nyameke: well that view is flawed..there is few stuff that you said in your earlier post about why the evil nature in Satan and man and this one that I will answer you tomorow... have an appointment so can't really write right now

Sorry, forgot to add Satan who god wired to rebel and a snake given the free will to talk.

I think most skeptics lend 'God" legitimacy and credibility by calling him God.

Since Adam and Eve were imperfect, God would have also been imperfect, since the creation is a reflection of the creator. That accounts for the conflict in instructions. God gave incestuous Adam and Eve the free will to do whatever they liked including eating the tree of knowledge. Also due to the noise and confusion in God's head, he gave a conflicting order to adam and eve not to eat from the tree of knowledge and obey him forever.

My view.

nyameke: When you think evil and do what people term as bad things where does it originate from? No where or from your mind?

Satan as a creation of God used his free will mind to think evil..he sinned by thinking he can become the Godhead. That was his sin. When we also do not believe in the Godhead and sin we will also be condemned.. You are here to have a human experience and also make a choice..You either believe in God and by God I mean Jesus Christ as the Godhead or you don't and become your own god.. we all have freewill..
I think the reason why people get so confused and start blaming the devil or God sometimes for all their sins is that they think they have no choice but the truth is that Satan has no power over anyone..Satan wants both believers and non believers to think he is the cause of their problems..it is not Satan that makes us sin. It is us because we create our own realities as godlike creatures.. the only power Satan has is the power of deception..
When one decides to kill or steal it is a thought that originates from the mind of that person not Satan or anyone else..

The simple question the whole world is asking is: why did Lucifer and man have the potential for evil, which the creator doesn't have or bequest on his creation?

nyameke: To answer you God created everything through pure thoughts/intent..that's why In the bible its says God said let there be this and that and it was.. Everything is mind/spirit and all minds are One mind..We are all individuated aspect of Mind/God/consciousness. And as such we all spirits having a human experience .. And since we are all individuated aspect God, we are all Co-creators with God..
Therefore everything that you have ever experienced on this plane of life was created by you and only you through your thoughts /intent .. you create your world/reality all by intent.

Did he create existence??

And if everything needed to be created, who created God??

If God created existence, then how did he manage to exist before creating existence?

DeCleff: what i meant was heaven where Jesus is, was opened and i saw Him. Meanwhile science can't prove this but its not an earthly event

Of course, you wouldn't be able to prove it, because ignorance lives outside knowledge.

snthesis: off topic, accept Humans have a God first before we discuss about His attributes.



you finally get my point
yes it means Computer programers are Gods unto the Programs they create
Scultpors/ Potters are God unto the artforms they create - they can choose the dimension, color longevity of the works of thier hands and guess what the Creations have NO SAY!!!


its not logical fallacy if the point of contention is the origin of the specie not the

everything is either yes or No, there are no maybe's

so you agree that Humans are born in otherwords not Self_created which means the Very 1st Human was fearfully and Wonderfully created by a God. We are the works of His Hands.

will reply other posts later brb

Try to spring your premise together. What's is the design in man? What is his purpose?? WHO is his creator? Why does he need to be created??

^^^

LMAO!!!

God is wise, uh? God gave man freewill, but what about the sense of good judgment to use the free will? At least it would be used wisely.

If Sin is disobedience to God, and God hates sin, wouldn't a perfect creation be a robot??

Abrahamic religions are such a pain in the aZZ, too fuckin intolerant, to an extent that they can't live under the same roof. Yet Islam is peace. #irony

joanana: It is wrong n any marriage dat practice this is doomed to fail oooo. However, a woman does noy have a chur h or a place of worship until shes married. Whatever church ur hubby attends thats where you wil go. He is the man of the house n the head of the house.

And as a woman you accept that?! Being an inferior to a man? Aren't all marriages a partnership??

LagosShia: it is the fear that men have the ability to be as stupid as you are or that men like you will mislead them.

Ok Islam is the same with Christianity, got to get them young and jam their heads with trash.

The Christian God created Evil?? I knew it all along that Yahweh (I'm that I'm) was the Satan too, playing both sides and fucKIn with the minds of his bitc.hes! I love the drama called Christianity.

By the way, why do Muslims keep posting shitt in bold letters like they R screamin like a muezzin?! Ugly claims of one god must be PROVED!!

LagosShia: you are an irresponsible man.freedom of religion is fine in allowing your wife go astray.but it is absolutely wrong by you neglecting your role as a father and head of the house and not guiding your children properly.apparently,being from the core-north is no ticket to guidance or sanity in life matters.

IF Islam is the way of Truth and Reason, why is there the need to indoctrinate them?? They would find the way to light through knowledge, wouldn't they?

ivoice247: I agree with you but not totally. Firstly, we'll have to categorise non-muslims into 2 categories;- (i)Mushrikun (i.e. unbelievers and atheists),(ii) people of the scripture (i.e. christians and jews, who are called kufars or disbelievers).

The non-muslims who are Mushrikun are totally forbidden for muslims to marry, as allah stated in the glorious quran [ch2 v221]:-

And do not marry Al-Mushrikat (idolatresses, unbelievers etc.) till they believe. And indeed a slave woman who believes is better than a (free) Mushrikah (idolatress, etc), even though she pleases you. And give not (your daughters) in marriage to Al-Mushrikun till they believe, and verily, a believing slave is better than a (free) Mushrik (idolater etc), even though he pleases you. Those (Al-Mushrikun) invite you to the Fire, but Allah invites (you) to Paradise and Forgiveness by His Leave, and makes His Ayat (proofs, evidence, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.) clear to mankind that they may remember.

Now, the other non-muslims (i.e. christians & jews )called kufars or disbelievers, cannot marry muslim women, but the muslim men can marry them. That is, a christian man cannot marry a muslim lady but a muslim man can marry a christian lady. As Allah states in the glorious quran [ch5 v5]:-

Made lawful to you this day are At-Tayyibat (lawful) foods, which Allah has made lawful. The food of the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians) is lawful to you and yours is lawful to them. (Lawful to you in marriage) are chaste women from the believers and chaste women from those who were given the Scripture (Jews and Christians) before your time when you have given their due Mahr (bridal-money), desiring chastity not committing illegal sexual intercourse, nor taking them as girl-friends. And whosoever disbelieves in Faith, then fruitless is his work; and in the Hereafter he will be among the losers.

Any book advocates intolernance and inequality is the word of a "demon". So is the Quran. Why would Islam find a man on the basis of beliefs/superstition superior to another??

Why is Muslim superior to a Yoruba traditionalist?

Enigma: Not my problem. I simply reiterate that evangelical atheism in particular has been proven conclusively to be a religion --- from intellectual and legal/judicial perspectives.


By the way it is threadS not thread.

I actually saw that as a continuous rant from you.

dahonestboss: @herakari

1. since Biblical morality, and the assertion that a God is responsbile for defining and dictating actions as moral by many Christians is a point of contention and is frequently used in arguments on the matter. This issue is compounded by the fact that the morality as defined by the Old Testament is different than the morality defined by the New Testament which is different than the morality exercised by most people today (in general, people today believe the Bible is immoral, including many Christians on many points such as slavery, the killing of homosexuals, and so forth).

As an atheist, if you are to be consistent, then as I see it, two scenarios follow depending on what you believe. If you are a moral relativist (you do not judge other cultures, such as the Iranians, because their moral code is different than your own), then you must necessarily also not use the morality argument as a reason to be an atheist – simply because the morality of Scripture was practiced by a now extinct culture does not mean it alone can be judged. If you believe in universal morality, then the answer to another question becomes central to your belief system: who or what determines which actions are moral and which are not? This is my dilemma. I do believe in absolute morals, but I cannot reconcile the fact that I do not trust any human being, no matter how smart they are, including myself, to prescribe to me what is moral and what is not. Sure, I go by my gut, and I consider myself a pretty moral person, but I am also not so arrogant to believe that I uniquely know what is moral and what is not especially since I will readily acknowledge that the older I get the more moral I become – actions I would have considered moral 10 years ago I consider immoral today, so how am I sure that I will not also think that actions I take today as moral will not be immoral to me 10 years from now?

I have seen a few atheist writings about this topic that attempt to create some logical formula for judging an action, such as this one from ebonmusing: “Always minimize both actual and potential suffering; always maximize both actual and potential happiness.“

I am not convinced. Although his essay is thorough and attempts to explain how and why morality can be universal and where it comes from, I don’t buy most of it, nor do I even think his rule is valid. I have several simple examples which defeat it, and I’ll post them in a comment if you can’t come up with them on your own (they are trivial).

This example shouldn’t distract you from the fact that question above still isn’t sufficiently answered. Think on it. I think you’ll be hard pressed.

2.What I mean is this: how much do you actually know about the science most atheists parrot? Most atheists know as little science as most Christians know as little theology. Just as a Christian trusts his priest to tell him what he believes, an atheist trusts scientists with a Ph.D. tacked to their name to tell them what they believe. But how many times have the scientists turned out to be wrong? I only ask this because it seems this is central to the problem that most atheists have. They are repulsed by the phrase “believe” – they are addicted instead to the phrase “know”. But honestly, do you really know, or are you just believing what you’re told? I would like to remind you that in the 1970′s the scientists of the day were seriously concerned that we were about to enter an ice age, and less than 30 years later they are now convinced Earth is about to turn into a desert.

Unless you’ve observed something yourself, or observed and interpreted the evidence yourself and drew your own conclusions, you are just as guilty as faith as any religious person. I will demonstrate this fact by asking you, the atheist, the following questions.

These are all questions that would typically appear on a 100 level biological anthropology couse taught in universities around the world. They relate to your favorite topic: evolution. I will post the answers (and the reasons why you should believe me) at the bottom of the post:

Name the major extinct hominid species from which human beings are presently believed to have evolved.
How long ago did the modern human (Homo Sapiens Sapiens) come into existence?
How long ago did early hominids leave Africa?
How long ago did hominids split from the other primates?
Which biological feature is believed to be the most important in the evolution of man, and why?
Name one phyisical trait or behavior that is unique to the genus Homo.
Who were the neanderthals? Where did they live, when did they live, and why are they gone?
A major event occurred approximately 70,000 years ago very relevant to the evolution of humanity. What was the event, and why is it significant?
If you can’t answer these questions, I think my point is illustrated. And please don’t dwell on the fact that even if you don’t know the answers, the answers exist. Because if you could answer these questions you would know enough to know how little we actually know about these topics.

3. so what are your proof to your common sense ? since you dont believe in science, did the world just came up by itself ? for example, if you are walking by the road and you saw a pen, did it just appeared ther by itself ? did the sun and the moon just came up ? without any supremembeing behind it to make it happpen? your eyes processes millions of colours in less than a milli seconds, your DNA process over billions of codes, how would you classified these or make me believe that there are no God to mke all these things works out? your common sense is the cause of your believe, its deceiving you bro, step up

4. you are very wrong, very very wrong. you common sense as you,ve always claim has made you blind to see. i should be given you proof of these, but it would soon be classified as scam by you, so whats the need ? unless you wont

5. if you said that i culled it from somewhere, can you tell me what is wrong with that? you should answer them regardless of where it came from.
This belief is fundamental to the atheist position. You must answer yes to this question or you have a very hard time denying most, if not all, religious beliefs. However, you should also see how absurd this statement is. The fact that it is always impossible to prove that something does not exist does not change the fact that it cannot be known that something doesn’t exist. So mustn’t you be agnostic? I’ve heard responses to this one too, but they have so far been illegitimate and unsatisfying.

6.i said ''what does the atheism position offer you? NOT what does the atheist religion offer you ? get it right. and why on earth would you believe that ''because finland, etc is not a christian country, thats why their standard of living is so high'' ? I live in Finland, and if you say that they dont practice religion here, then you are a big liar and makes me doubt any of your next post.
there are many world developed countries out there that practice christianity and are still developed. it should not be a basis of your argument.

7. your common sense is deceiving you. pls deal with fact and not what you are mde to believe by your common sense

8. I have heard very few atheists intelligently debate this issue without bringing up the Bible. Let’s assume that it is totally allegorical and Christians didn’t literally believe in Jesus and believed only that the Bible books were stories told by God to illustrate his word. Would this change how you viewed the belief in God? If not, why not?

9. now you are passing through the corner

10. I saved the best for last. I want you to think long and hard about this. We have as little or less evidence that E.T. landed in Roswell than any evidence we have for the truth in any part of the Bible and yet almost every single atheist I meet believes that we are not alone in the universe despite there being no evidence whatsoever. They hand-wave me to death with stories like, “even if only one in a trillion stars had planets and only one in a trillion planets had life and only one in a trillion planets with life hosted intelligent life there would still be eleventy-gazillion earths in the universe”, or they make up fairy tales about Area 51.

If you are an atheist, I am going to require that you also do not believe in E.T. And if you acknowledge that E.T. has not been observed but is likely to exist, I demand that you also acknowledge that God has not been observed but is likely to exist.

have you think the bible is written by ordinary men? many of the things that were in the bible are all coming to pass, the bible is so complete and its the best and widely read book in the world. pls correct your common sense, it goes beyond that.

WAITING

Morality is culturally defined of what's acceptable and what's not. Not good and bad. I think all acts have the inherent value of either being good or bad. Its not left to culture or gods.

The problem with the bible is; as long as it records extraordinary events as true, its always going to be false. The bible doesn't seem considered in separating the truth from superstition. The beauty in Science is how it works. Its assumptions are simple and basic, follows the nature of reality and knowledge. It accepts the need to filter facts from errors.

Common sense deals with very simple premises: I exist. Everyone uses it.

As to the Paley's watch and your pen: I agree every complexity requires a simpler cause, not everything requires a cause. Existence/Reality wouldn't require one. If the universe is broken down to the most basic bits (the background/material that forms everything), I would say those bits are our Cause.

God is anything, thus must be defined. I'm an atheist to well defined gods/religions like Islam.

Commonsense and Reason = thinking. Faith = is definitely not thinking.

Miroslav klose: guy dont deceieve yourself.

If u strongly believe that there exist no God/god and Someone else believes strongly that there's a God/god, what's the difference between u two?

I actually think its nothing.

Enigma: ^^^ I said take your time ---- and read the threads.

seen the thread before. Wouldn't worth it to read again.

^^^

Preexisting matter expanded!!

Now to you.did God create everything from nothing??

Enigma: For discussions and proof that evangelical atheism is a religion (indeed, a fundamentalist religion), please take time at your leisure to go through the following threads.

https://www.nairaland.com/546562/atheism-religion/5#7135281

https://www.nairaland.com/298119/30-keys-being-effective-atheist/3#9580290


https://www.nairaland.com/765094/heard-there-different-kinds-atheism/2#9227593

"Actually, there is a point to what Olaadegbu said though perhaps it is preferable to substitute "rationalism" for evolution (EDITED: though we can actually stand atheism on its own without necessarily relating it to either evolution or even rationalism). For example, let us take thehomer's own preferred definition of "religion" (even though Jesoul has already shown the intellectual inadequacy of sticking to one of four definitions offered by the same source):

A collection of practices, based on beliefs and teachings that are "highly valued or sacred".

I will pause to let that sink in!"

From your definition, I can conclude that the promotion of family values or promotion of science or general knowledge or feminism is RELIGION! Anti-slavery falls under that too.

If so, it would be entirely ridiculous. Ok some atheists feel they are obliged to warn others "forceful" of the evils of religion, why would that make them religious? Like labelling anti communists communists!

Propagation of highly valued views is not the trademark of religion. Some religions don't propagate their beliefs - Jainism. A good human is with a sense of purpose will have some values!

Ayomivic: The bible is not just an history book,it is words of God to all human being on earth.The problems i noticed with the athiest on this thread are these they did not believe the existece of God,they did not believe in miracle and they did not believe in someone recods but in what they see with their eyes.They are like someone whom the told that your grandfather gave birth to your father and your father gave birth to you but he says i don't believe that my father have father for i did not see him but i believe in wy father that i see.But the true is that he has a grandfather weither he believes it or not if he does not have grand father how did is father come on earth?

All the questions the athiest were asking here the answer are the bible.Some one asked that 'why can't God appear in the sky and answer the questions?' When he did to Israelite on mount Sinai what did they say?They said the don't want to hear his voice so that we would not die, and that Moses should speak to them instead and whatever God tells him and he speaks it to them they would believe him.These are the people that heard his voice,saw his miracles still some of them did not have total believe in him, like you.

Many athiest wants proof of God existence and when they see one they won't believe it.They did not believe that donkey can talk, that 2 loaves of bread can be fed 5000 people,that virgin can get pregnance without sex because they were not there and they did not see them.They believe in power and ability of men because they can see it,they believed that cars can move with man stearing it and without man stearing it,that remote can on electonic garget even though they did not know what make it works like that but the power and the abilities of God their creator that they are seeing every time they did not believe or have you ever thought of where the hair on your head come from ?,the nails in your fingers and toes where are they store?What make women belly protube when pregnat without busting? What did God use to make eyes that look like eggs or who makes all these things be like that tell me? You can not believe in God for Satan had blindfold you.

Know this God does not think as man think he does not look as man looks so don't ever equate your way of thinking with his.God called Abraham to teach him his way and through him to make know of his way to all the universe it does not matter if you believe all the emisaries he sent to you wiether you believed or not one day he shall judge you and you will not have chance to repent if you do not repent now and your athiesm would not be able to save you,then you we know that you are not wise but foolish.

My advice for you,if you want to travel to some where you have not being to bèfore and someone told you that it is extremly cold at where are going but you think it will be hot there. What will you do in preparation for your journey? i were you i will take along the blanket should in case there is extremly cold there as i was told .Think wise before it is too late for you.

Mr Ay, sorry to bust your bubble. First the bible is not the word of God, its the word of man. At least hearsay testimony as to the wishes and intents of "God". It can't be said to be a communication from God but just another man's idea and view of what God is all about. Just like the Quran.

Second of all: We understand reality, by its order and anything that goes against that is bound to be false. A claim that the Sun dances to Azonto is obviously because its beyond the behaviour of the Sun. Same with donkeys, snakes and tortoises; they don't talk!! Whoever says that is an obvious liar.

Third point: there is no God, but priests and pastors lying and pretending to be his mouthpiece. And if there is God why would he want you to believe rather than KNOW he exists?? Disbelief wouldn't stop him from existing right?

snthesis: d proof is in d eating of the pudding right

here's is my proof


if a creature was not self created it implies it was made, it has a Maker , a God.
now if a creature is self Created, then it is a God unto itself

now the following are hard facts not theories:


Man didnt decide to exist and it came to Pass.
Man had no will to its Creation
Man had an external factor in its creation.
Man is not Self Created thus this implies it was made

the first problem: is every effect an deliberate act by a purposeful and activating mind?

Second problem: if every effect is a result of a deliberative mind, when does the infinite regress halt?

Enigma: And so too evangelical atheism involves dogma, morality, faith . .

Anyway, I say again that it has been proven conclusively that evangelical atheism is a religion --- from both intellectual and legal/judicial perspectives.

pls do provide such characteristics which prove evangelical atheists are "religious"

melek: " D fool hath said in his heart, there is no God" Psalm 14:1
Christ is waiting patiently for u to confess ur sins &accept His FREE salvation, which cost Him His life @calvary. He won't force u, He only wants u 2come by choice. The Lord is long-suffering towards us, not willing that any should perish,but that all shd come 2repentance. 2peter 3:9. How I wish u'll get wiser, make d right choice &save ur soul @last.
I pray 4u!

Don't you realize that, there wouldn't be the need for salvation if your God wasn't incompetent enough to lose control of his creation.

snthesis: **typing really really slowly** when i make reference to "you" i expected with the level of intelligence spewing around here that the "You" refers to our specie, Man"

"humans aren't created, they are born" and who gave birth to the 1st human?


are u saying u are a piece of stone

anyways i am teaching based on everyday analogies the "intelligent " folks here can relate with, no need to talk on Virtual particles, radioactive decay, photons bla bla bla.

i defined d word - God.
and gave an explicit relationship between God and the creation.

if you "Man" create a robot
you "Man" are a god unto the robot
and the robot is ur creation.

i also gave an analogy on the attributes of a creation
anything that was not self-made is a Creation and has a Maker, a God.

and i asked simply were you "Man" self made?
if you say yes, then man is a God unto itself, otherwise Man is a creation with a Maker, a God.

I disagree with you. Man is not an object of creation. Ok prove otherwise.

Enigma: Are you tryng to argue that someting called a doctrine or belief is outside the scope of religion or theory?

Meanwhile, I see you are silent on the other point that evangelical atheism in particular has been proven conclusively to be a religion ---- both intellectually and legally/judicially.

Hmmm. . . Theory/doctrine is not = religion.

No matter how evangelical some atheists are, its still not a religion, the same way Stoics, communists aren't religious. Its just a position as theism which is not a religion either. Religion goes beyond a one dimensional position, it involves dogma, morality, faith. .

^^^
In your mind you ve said sometime.

snthesis: basically, because you seemingly feel purposeless about your life - it translates to Self-Creation

No it does translate to that. And self creation is as impossible as miracles.

snthesis: you are jumping the gun.
First step is to determine if you were Created or Self Created
if you admit to being Created - this implies that you have a Maker, a God

Its obvious there was a natural process involved in our emergence into the world: reproduction. that's not God.[/quote]Enigma's quote:
The doctrine or belief that there is no God.

Thus a religion??