₦airaland Forum

TheArchangel:
In your statistics, it was old west and old east? Now, SW, SE,etc. Be consistent. Lumping two geopolitical zones to arrive at a high figure and to serve as basis for state creation isn't gonna hold water.

I initially used old East and old West to compare, then I used Midwest, SE, SW and the 4 non SE old Eastern states, then the NW, NC and NE. Is anything wrong with that? It is just to have something that shows the real picture. I believe anyone that wants independence in a separate state should have it but not on others.

TheArchangel:
What's the point of this thread??
Chest beating? Huh??

Real statistics that are dependable are scarce in Nigeria, so when I see something like this I am happy. There are always talk that the North is a desert and etc, then that the SE should have one more state on the rest of us. This post shows that the area cheated by representation is mainly the SW followed by the NW and etc. I am advocating for the country to breakup, so that new states will emerge that are ready for nation building with seriousness. Why do you think it is chest beating?

Ravenwolf:
And your point is??

Don't come here post stale facts or more like facts bended to the whims of your warped and tribalistic mind.

In your haste to make sense you are redrawing boundaries and assigning provinces...


One question for you, how many of those students in your highly 'Hallowed' Southwest are native to the area. I keep saying it, Lagos should not be used as the sole parameters to assess the south West. Lagos is different. It's a mini nation on its own where constituent ethnic nationalities have worked real hard to make it what it is today.

I agree with you that Lagos is up to 30 percent non Yoruba and it is true that no such cosmopolitan city exists in the SE. The most cosmopolitan are Onitsha and Aba but they are not as much so as Lagos but in the SW we also have Ibadan and even Ogbomosho is a large metropolis that is not even a capital, bigger than any where in the SE, so it means the SE could have done it as well and can still do it. Igbos are in the SW but so are Hausas, Ijaw, Benin, Chinese, Europeans, Indians, Lebanese and etc. Igbos are in SW politics but they have not contributed more on a per capita basis than the Lebanese, Indians or the Chinese, even not more than the Hausa. So there is no big deal, Yorubas are also in Kaduna, , PH, Onitsha, Jos, Abuja, New York, Paris, London and etc. I wonder what percentage of Lagos population you think is Igbo or what percentage of Lagos properties is owned by Igbos? Port Harcourt is also an Igboid city and it is as cosmopolitan as Lagos and no one is raising the argument you people raise on Lagos. Do you want Lagos to separate from the West or how long do you think it will take to turn Lagos to an Igbo city?


If you remove Lagos from SW, Lagos alone is still Yoruba in identity, and the other 5 states are more than Lagos. They are almost 200 percent of Lagos. Kaduna too is like that in the NW.

PapaBrowne:
I don't exactly understand your postulations, but anything that puts Edo and Delta with SW is a no no for me. We are in the South South. And that is that. Pls leave us out out of the SW

I put Edo and Delta together as Midwest after analysing old West and old East. MW is more than half of SE for instance and less than one third of SW. Edo is like 120 percent of Delta.

I doubt if SS can be together, even Delta Ibo will probably be Biafra.

In 2014, the number of students who registered for WAEC in the old West and Lagos consisting of the SW states, Edo and Delta, making 8 states was 518,536. The old East comprising of the SE and the 4 remaining SS states totalling 9 states was 414,947. So the 8 states of the old West and Lagos has a total population more than the 9 states of the old East by those real figures. The 8 states of the old West and Lagos is like 125 percent of the population of the 9 states of the old Eastern region. The old Midwest is just over half of the SE (5 states), the SW population is like 180 percent of the population of the SE and like 350 percent of the MW, like 250 percent of the old non SE 4 Eastern states of Akwa Ibom, Rivers, Bayelsa and Cross River while the SE is around 120 percent of the 4 states of the non SE Eastern state. The figures from the North are not reliable because of the Almajiri population but it shows that Kaduna is higher in population than Kano since there are Almajiri in the two states. Those are real estimates that are reliable.

However if it is assumed that 30 percent of NW youth are Almajiri and that 100 percent of SW children go to school, then the NW will be 99 percent of the SW population. The 7 states of the NW are 99 percent of the 6 states of the SW in population going by that estimate.

The SW and NW are around 135 percent each of the NC in population and the NC is 131 percent of the SE in population. The Almajiri system is not prevalent in the NC.

If it is assumed that 20 percent of NE children are Almajiri, then the NE population will be around 45 percent of that of each of the SW and the NW while being 80 percent of the SE.

Broken down into ethnic nationalities, there are Yoruba or Yoruboid groups well entrenched in the three zones of SW, MW and NC, Hausa in the NW, NE and NC, Igbos in the SE, 4 non SE states in the old East and Igbos in the Midwest. Ijaws are in the 4 non SE Eastern states, in the Midwest and in the West and etc.

A group of even 50 thousand population are in good standing to be an independent nation where interests are properly alligned and where there is unity, understanding and camaraderie that will make nation building automatically easy.

The issue of the depreciating Naira must be continually flogged until permanently grasped by the majority of the elite who will then explain to their followers.
It must be done in as simple a language as possible. Maybe then people will wake up, rise and then change the country.

Let us look at it this way. The income of the Nigerian government is in US dollars by a portion up to 80 percent. So let us say it is entirely in US dollars because the main way Naira comes in is through the revenue coming from the customs. So if the income was 40 billion dollars when crude oil sold for 100 dollars a barrel, the naira equivalent will be 8 trillion naira if the exchange rate were N 200 to a dollar. Meanwhile all government expenses are in Naira while income is in dollars. The budget will therefore be within the range of 8 trillion Naira. If after a year, oil prices fall to 50 dollars a barrel from the earlier 100 dollars a barrel, what this means is that Naira income will become 4 trillion naira gotten from 20 billion dollars instead of the earlier 8 trillion Naira gotten from 40 billion dollars if exchange rates remained thesame. Where the problem lies is that government expenditure can not go lower than the 8 trillion Naira of the previous year, so the only solution for a government afraid to raise Naira revenue through taxation because they do not want to be accountable to the masses is to devalue the Naira to N400 to the dollar, so that 20 billion dollars will provide thesame Naira value that 40 billion dollars did last year. So by that method, 20 billion dollars will be equal to 8 trillion Naira. Problem solved, but it is the masses that will suffer it as the price of imported goods skyrocket.

The only solution is to ban government from having any revenue in dollars or any foreign currency. That is the only way there can be sanity. The only way your currency that is in the custody of your government's CBN will be a reliable store of value.

The way to end all this bondage is to put an end to the country Nigeria, so that people that can allign their interests can join hands and work together.

I don't dislike Jews but I don't support Wannabe Jews (Christians and Muslims) who are bent on bringing everyone down with them to believe and practice thesame illogicalities as them.

Jesus was in many ways worse than Mohammed.

He claimed to be God and son of God.
He claimed to be able to forgive past and future crimes you commit against others.
He said you should love your enemies eg someone working against or trying to kill you including predators like human ritualists.
He said you must go 40 miles with someone forcing you to go twenty.
He said when slapped on the left cheek, turn the right.

And many others. Those are antichrist teachings from the pit of hell, designed to derail humanity.

Not one of those positions can be supported by a real Christ like Osiris who was a perfect Judge and ruler.

Adolf Hitler was some people's Fuehrer for some time, however short. Key office holders in Nazi Germany swore allegiance personally to him and not to the advancement of Germany or that of humanity. People generally tend not to like any group that hold themselves separate or look down on others as kind of unclean, especially if the 'clean' people are a minority. So, Jews were not liked in Europe. They were driven out of Spain, banned in Britain and etc even Shakespeare wrote a play to spite Jewish money lenders. All what was brewing for centuries in Europe was what Nazi Germany brutally brought to a head by killing 6 million Jews in concentration camps across Europe within a few years. Despite this carnage, the Nazis only got into trouble because they invaded Poland and tried to invade Russia as well, not because of their treatment of the Jews and the alliance against Germany and her allies was not made to save the Jews, but after everything, when the National Socialist party had been overthrown in Europe, Western powers rallied around the Jews and supported them to have a state of their own in Palestine, then Hitler was post humously condemned for the excesses of the Nazi regime, surviving Nazi topshots were tried in Nuremberg Germany and today, Adolf Hitler remains persona non grata everywhere including Germany. He is no one's hero and nobody wants to associate with his legacy. If he had played it cool, avoided tangling with Stalin and persuaded Japan to cool down also, consolidated Nazi hold on occupied Europe and pursued trade outside Europe, he may have gotten away with the Jewish holocaust, just like the Turks got away with the Armenian holocaust in thesame area and later allied themselves with the US in NATO. The US could not initially bring themselves to declare war on Germany and Russia had signed a peace treaty with the Nazis, Stalin would of course rather ally himself with the Nazis than with the capitalists. So despite that 6 million Jews were slaughtered by the Nazis, things would have been different if Hitler had applied caution and may be he would be a hero today or just one of those bad guys in history books who left clouds of bad karma behind on their exit. So if Adolf Hitler can be declared persona non grata across the globe, so should heretics like Prophet Mohammed and Jesus Christ whose teachings, hypnotism and mind manipulation has caused much more misery for humanity as well as the death and victimisation of millions. Christians and Muslims have thesame attitude of Jews of believing they are better than others because of some meaningless and irrelevant rules they follow and illogical things they believe but they are more dangerous because they want to convert the whole world while being programmed to believe they have the absolute truth when no such thing exists. They are also brainwashed to believe those who don't follow them are lost while Jews are different in that they go about their business without trying to convert others or preaching to them, Muslims and Christians go about preaching heresy as truth to all they come across, they spread fear, hatred, prejudice, turn children to bigots and zombies and etc. This is why all nations that still have the chance ought to ban their activities immediately and declare their God, son of God and last prophet persona non grata in their space.

bigfrancis21:
The same way one can argue that the artifacts found at Ife may not have been built by the Ife people but by some external form of civilization. By your logic, there is no proof the Ife constructed those artworks. Just because they were found in Ife doesn't mean they belong to Ife. These examples you gave are possibilities but in this case they do not apply. And like you said before, this is your opinion or just how you feel. Nobody is going to take that from you. However, standard scientific knowledge has been clearly stated out regarding the origin and date of the Igbo Ukwu artworks.

Like I said before, it would be laughable for the Ife to claim Igbo Ukwu artworks when they cannot or did not replicate the same in their own territory. What evidence then do you have that the artworks were made by the Ife people, other than just 'I want to believe that Ife did'?

Moreover, almost nearly nothing connects ancient Igbo and Yoruba ancient history whatsoever. The sudden clamour for Igbo-Ukwu arts by some Yorubas is quite laughable indeed.

To the best of my knowledge, the Nri have not laid any claims to any artifacts from other Igbo areas asides the one clearly known to belong to Nri. I am not sure where this is coming from.

Would you say the Benin bronze made in Benin but learnt from Ife were not made in Benin then? And we know Benin was a big city and Ife was a big city. Both were capitals of empires but Nri was nothing of that sort. Infact Benin is Ife too because the real name is Ife Ibinu. I hope you see why I believe the Igbo Ukwu bronze were made by an Ife people.

bigfrancis21:
There's nothing intricate about Ife artworks. They are simple in nature and mostly head works, indicating a specialized artistry of Ife metal workers in producing just heads only. On the other hand, the Igbo-ukwu creators were more diversified in their skill producing a wide arrays of art works. By mere reasoning of this fact alone, Ife could not have attempted nor created Igbo-ukwu artworks in anyway when they could nearly not replicate the same in their home turf. It is the same as the US claiming they 'own' the cocoa production in Nigeria because they are a world power when they barely produce cocoa.

You have every right to feel the way you do. It is your right. Nobody is going to take that from you. But objectivity becomes important when discussing history and ancestral connections.

The long and short of it is that finding something buried in Anambra does not mean it was made by Nri Igbos. Even the remains of a man of European origin was found in the Americas and it predates Columbus by I think over a thousand years. So finding something somewhere is not conclusive on its origin. Take Lokoja town for instance, just in the 18th to early 19th century, it was an Oyo Yoruba town for slave dealing. Nowadays, it no longer has that identity. So if artefacts are unearthed there in the compound of some Igbo villagers in 2000 years' time, the Nri Igbos will lay claim to that artefacts as made by their ancestors? I hope you see my point.

bigfrancis21:
Lol. Do you have any academic proof of this, albeit small whatsoever? Are you insinuating that the lost wax method is only unique to the Ife people?

I love your continued insistence to lay claims to Igbo Ukwu artworks even when you have no evidence whatsoever. Keep it up bro.

That method is used worldwide but the Ife bronzes made with that method are more intricate. Others are not as intricate and the bronzes are not a surprise to Ife or Benin people. That is the point. To the Yoruba, Ife has always existed and there is no way some people will be making such bronzes in Igbo Ukwu that Ife will not know about it. Infact they will be Ife people. No Nri city that has always been there, Nri is new. Ife may have changed locations severally but it has always been there from the beginning of time when the first civilized humans landed on Earth, so this is why the Igbo Ukwu bronze were made by Ife people. Only a highly organised nation with central authourity like Benin, Ife can make those works. The name even sounds exactly like Forest of death in Yoruba, then Yoruba and Igbo languages are cousins and there are people who were ancestors to both Igbos and Yoruba.

I may be wrong though but that is how I feel about it. Ancient Ife people were not Yoruba. They are ancestors of all. They did not speak Yoruba, their language is lost but modern Yoruba are their linear successors just because they kept the history.

If bronze art cast with the lost wax method were found buried in Europe, it will be attributed to Ife. Not to talk of when found in nearby Ugbo Ukwu buried in the compound of subsistence farmers and villagers.

If there was a certain ancient Ife in Anambra, then that might explain it. An Ife chief may also have gone on exile or was returning to a more ancient Ife with the bronze works then died on the way and etc. Those are what should be considered because the lost wax method is Ife property and there are definitely more bronzes scattered, buried all over the country yet to be discovered. If some are found in Kaduna in 50 years' time in the compound of subsistence farmers and villagers, it would still be attributable to Ife.

The Igala did not use the lost wax method and the Benin has never denied that they learnt the art from Ife. So Ife is the owner of the style undoubtedly at least in the modern context that we can relate with but go back further like 5 thousand years ago. No distinction between Igbos and Yoruba. So it is all mixed up and it can not be denied that the Yoruba are the custodians of the history of those ancient ancestors. Nris have no history farther back than ten centuries ago or so. There were no state funded institutions to support the preservation of history. The Ifa corpus maybe the largest body of poetry in the world passed down meticulously over thousands of years. Without organisation that can't be possible, the creation of such bronze works will also be more impossible.

Also, the Eze Nri did not take tribute. It would be wrong to suggest that. They got donations and never used force on anyone. The Eze Aro, Attah Igala, Oba of Benin and etc were the tribute takers in those areas in the past. Not the Eze Nri who was a priest.

gatiano:
All colours comes out of Black, There was never a time when a non-black became black depending on weather conditions or geographical location, there will never be a time that such would happen. Except if a white or a non-black intermarries with a Black person. Eledumare can make the sun come out of the west, can do all things except one thing, no colour will ever produce Black. Black will always and forever till eternity produce other hues and colours. Even light can never beat darkness, Never! Light can be switched on and off, Darkness/Blackness will remain permanent forever.

Esu was grafted out of the non-blacks, They do not have the Esu Orisa, That was why they had to call Him/Her(Esu) devil or satan. They do not have Obatala too, If one does not have These two Orisas, that person can never see God/Eledumare; Thus, they do not have Eledumare. To have Eledumare, The Body of the person must have that Throne where Eledumare can sit as The Originator that He and/or She is. This throne is the source of melanin which is responsible for our Blackness.

Esu is not a trickster, which was the excuse they laid their claims upon that Esu is satan. Esu in every Black person is extremely intelligent, and clever. Very observant and nothing get past Him/Her. He/She is not concern with good or evil, His/Her duty is to ensure that we have what we need and ofcourse if we pay attention to Esu.

Esu has only two masters.
1) Eledumare: This is Esu main master, Esu takes all orders from Eledumare.
2) You The Black person: The order Esu takes from you depend on that which He/She(Esu) receives from Eledumare. If what you want align with what Eledumare wants, then things would be smooth, if not, then a lil bit rocky. Esu may also take orders from you.

Non-Black people definitely have a kind of Esu they use, but the Esu belongs to their Makers, The Elohim (60,000 of them, Male/Female and all Black people).

A Scandinanvian who spent only one year doing outdoor activities in West Africa, say Yoruba land will look remarkably different from one that did not leave Europe. The former will be noticeably darker. Now, if the entire population of the Yoruba were removed and replaced with Scandinavians who then bred in West Africa for ten thousand years, by 22015, they will look exactly like the Yoruba today, assuming other variables remained constant including diet and most importantly climate. People landed on Earth from outer space most probably but how those people looked is anyone's guess.

Please stop the racism. It makes no sense. The white people you are always slighting have done a lot to revive the Yoruba culture while most of our people remain sub humans.

gatiano:
Only The Black People have the Orisa Esu in them; Nobody else. Esu is a wonderful and glorious Orisa. There is not one Esu. If there are 1 billion Black people, There are also 1 billion Esu, 1 Billion Iponri, 1 billion Eledumare. They are all within every Black person's construct. Look within to find Them, never outside!

All humans are thesame and any human can use the Yoruba culture successfully and Yoruba can use any human culture. Also every indigenous culture on Earth have the equivalent of Esu in their mythology.

Then we are black because of our habitat. Some of our ancestors that landed on Earth thousands of years ago might have been white, depending on the climate on the part of their home planet that they took off from before they landed here led by Ogun osin imole (Iba o!). Within a few thousand years, they would have become black. That is certainly a possibility. So no big deal in being black or white. Infact we are more closely related to the Scandinanvians than to the Australoids despite that Scandinanvians are white while Australoids are black.

Divine grace, divine favour, forgiveness of past and future sins, condemnation of deifying nature, ancestors and etc are bad theologies that our ancestors never heard of. To Olodumare there is nothing like random salvation or salvation by luck or grace. You are saved by your character. Olodumare does not grant divine favours to anyone but stands firmly and resolutely behind honesty, labour and truth, no matter what. Olodumare is never swayed from supporting any human being operating with honesty, truth, gentle character and the like. Olodumare is not a petty character, crook or buffoon who grants divine favours, asks for gratification or forgives future and past sins. Olodumare is never upset when you deify nature, your ancestors and notable people who moved humanity forward. That is not part of the theology of our forefathers. Olodumare is not a jealous, evil or malevolent God. Neither is the God known to all ancient people that kind of God.

If you set up a business and organise it well and you are moving forward, Olodumare will send helpers/investors to you automatically who will team up with you to help you achieve your dreams. That is no divine favour but Olodumare doing his part. A Pastor may attack your business because you don't pay tithe but Olodumare will neutralise such an attack as part of his job. That is also no divine favour. When you start anything good, you are continuing the work of creation which is the work of Olodumare and Olodumare will be obliged to support you. Ase.

The Mohammedan Allah or Christian Yahweh should never be confused with Olodumare/Ubangiji/Chukwuabiama/pre Mohammedan Allah or any of the names the real God has been known by, for thousands of years before the evil innovation of Christianity and Islam.

If what you do for your children are not divine favours, then it is obvious you have been misled to believe Olodumare involves himself in such pettiness.

May Olodumare free us from the evil machination of demonic forces. Ase.

Slikbae:
How does that affect you Sire? and who is the real God to you?

If people are following irrational doctrines, threatening unbelievers and dissenters with hell, attacking and killing them atimes, that is a cult. It is more dangerous than a cult because it is to do with the mind, turning people into zombies, then the leaders of those cults sometimes know what they are doing and are outrightly evil people especially the ones we have in Nigeria sitting atop huge church empires as emperors living in extreme luxury, those kind of people do send assassins after people that oppose them. They do this to maintain their hegemony and strangle hold on their followers. Many have died, then we have ther problem of Muslims who are more honest by physically attacking dissenters. All these people are not serving God. The real God is a Gentleman father of all. People who are well trained do use the power to help others, then charge them. These practitioners do not claim to possess absolute truths like Muslims and Christians, they are scholars, they are like scientists and they are work in progress and they never fight others over God nor build spiritual corporations to deceive people. Instead of corporations they have unions of practitioners. The evil of Christianity and Islam must be frontally attacked. They themselves are not relenting from trying to pull down indigenous cultures inaugurated by God.

It is more complex than you think. There is another matter, undecipherable, undetectable and there must of course be life forms formed from it as well. It is called dark matter.

Ordinarily, placing high tariffs on imported goods is never justifiable except under certain circumstances. For instance, the EU tariffed steel imports from China at a point, citing as reason the fact that Chinese producers pay a fraction of European wages to their workers, so Europe will not allow them to impoverish their workers and wipe out the European steel industry as well. Outside that consideration, that particular duty on imported steel from China would not have been justifiable. Steel from Japan could not be blocked in thesame manner for instance because any price reduction would be due to an improved expertise and not on economic cheating. Also, imports can be restricted if they do not meet up to national standards but outside all that, the customs should not be mainly for revenue generation in any country because trade helps both participating parties develop and grow. Ideally, importers should be charged only handling and warehousing costs, if other things were equal. Once a country is on its feet, more or less everything can be produced in the country either by locals or foreign investors bringing in expertise. The practise in Nigeria of imposing a certain percentage of the value of some imports as import duty is morally wrong because government is not the one providing the capital. It is why an automobile worth USD 10,000 will end up being sold to Nigerians for around USD 20,000. Government may claim to be doing this to encourage local producers but this is also an untruth like most government statements in Nigeria. It is an untruth because even the FG imports automobiles and do not patronise the plants set up in Nigeria. In the future, there shall be free trade and free movement globally with borders there only for administration. Europe is the region that has achieved this and it will surely become global standard in the near future. The source of government revenue should be frontal via income taxes and ideally it should never be through the backdoor.

herringbone:
Beautiful and apt,please permit me to share this to other fellow Africans to read and maybe wake up,you will be fully acknowledged as the real author and this site will be referenced.

Go ahead. No need to ask permission to share an article on a site like this. I already shared one of your articles.

Speechless3:
Please forgive whoever offended you.

You sound pained

I agreed that some Christians have offended me but I am not a Christian and I don't forgive people their past and future sins. Those are antichrist teachings. Not from God. Many people are trapped in Christianity and Islam, I would like them to abandon those evil spiritual practices and revert to the real God.

According to Chief Okey Nwosu, PMB is a dollar billionaire meaning he deceived Nigerians and have been getting people killed by his rioting supporters for nothing. Over 800 youth corps members and INEC ad hoc staff the last time. This is why the least the man can do is to resign immediately.

Muslims and Christians do not worship thesame God. Greeks, Egyptians, Romans, Mayans, Persians and etc did, because they never had cause to condemn others over God and never dictated to people how to worship God, God's name and in what language to address God. The question should not even come up at all. Sunnis and Shiites do not worship thesame God, neither do the Ahmadiyya and other Sunni, Mormons and Catholics, Jehovah witness and Protestants and etc. So Muslims and Christians don't worship same God. All are basically following the Jewish tradition of condemning idolatory but with an innovation of condemning dissenters to hell fire via threats and spiritual terrorism which is the basis of physical terrorism. So ancient people worshipped God and were children of God but Christians and Muslims do not worship God at all but demons and there are legions of demons controlling those two spiritual practices, not just a few. God is not involved at all.

When I see many Africans who seemingly want Africa to progress go on about how all Africa's woes were caused by the West, I wonder who they are working for and what their real motives are. It can not be to help Africans of course. Someone based in Europe or Africa taking swipes at Europeans, saying they caused all Africa's woes can not be serious as there is no evidence to support such an assertion.

There are bad Europeans as well as good Europeans just like Africans and most are good because if most were bad, they would have self destruct. It was an European nation, Denmark that laid the foundation of the Japanese military whose navy then went on to destroy the Russian fleet in 1904 being the first time a non European nation will defeat an European nation in battle. It sent shock waves across the world and opened the eyes of Asians to new possibilities. Japan has not stopped ever since and has surpassed most European nations in many respect. Cultures come into contact with each other, rub off each other and come out better. As far as the modern system of doing things is concerned, Europe is being copied by all. Europe copied from England who copied from Spain and improved on it, who copied from the Andalusians who copied from the Romans and Greek/Persians who copied from Egypt and etc etc ad infinitum.

When the British came to West Africa, they came as traders and traded with licenses issued by the existing nations back then as did the Germans, French and others, prior to that, West Africa was conceded to Portugal by the Catholic church and most of the Americas to Spain as a result of an arbitration by the Pope. When Portugal and Spain declined as empires and other European nations rose, the concession to Portugal was ignored and all of them entered the fray to compete for trade. It was not until the 1890s that Nigeria became a part of the British empire like India. It lasted until 1954 in Western Nigeria and it afforded us the opportunity to unite for the first time since the exit of Oduduwa many centuries ago. British colonialism/imperialism lasted for less than 70 years in Nigeria. Nigerians fought for the British empire during the first and second world war and I have late family members that went to those wars. The old system was abandoned and we adopted a parliamentary system like Britain, throwing up Chief Obafemi Awolowo as Prime Minister and chairman of the Action Group. It must be noted that whoever was thrown up would have achieved essentially thesame results. The ancient government structure was still there which was the Ogboni and their function was to brainstorm on how to move the nation forward. Without the Ogboni, a party like the Action Group could not have come into power easily as it was newly formed. The Action Group was Africa's equivalent of Singapore's People's Action Congress led by Lee Kuan Yew.

I now believe that if Chief Awolowo had alligned properly with and deferred to Britain and the US, seeing them as allies instead of inhibitors, the story of Western Nigeria, Nigeria and even Africa would have been different. Chief Awolowo once said he has reasons to believe Great Britain does not have the interest of Nigeria at heart because a colonial officer advised him to prioritise the acquisition of vocational skills by the masses above free and compulsory formal education of the masses. He was shocked, he argued that well educated and enlightened people are more easily administered than others. He said that the incidence confirmed his suspicions and made him to draw a definite line between himself and the British authourities. He however discounted the popular remark of the British PM, Harold Wilson, that Great Britain would be very lucky to have him, Chief Awolowo as Prime Minister of Great Britain. CIA files also credits Chief Awolowo with being an excellent debater. However, Chief Awolowo already drew his conclusion which probably determined the fate of Western Nigeria and Nigeria and maybe Africa. Instead of alligning with Great Britain, he alligned himself with Ghana's Kwame Nkrumah who was removed from power in the middle of the alliance.
It must be noted that in actual fact, technical know how and expertise and not nominal formal education are what builds a nation. You can all be masters degree holders, and not be able to produce basic things in your country. The old USSR experienced series of serious famines when education was top priority in the government's agenda and when most citizens had degrees. The USSR took education more seriously than the USA but the US economy was more efficient than that of the USSR. Many times, the USSR would make certain research breakthroughs but get stuck because there is a missing link which only an industry in the West has developed, they would then deploy capital through Swiss banks to place orders. So, everything is indeed a delicate balancing act. Both Chief Awolowo and the British colonial officer that advised him were right in their own way. The Western capitalists that later became welfarists saw the AG as communists, so the AG distanced themselves from them, leading to the Nigeria and Africa we have today.

However, it was the AG that should have warmed themselves into the hearts of the people who are on a superior pedestal than them, not go about berating them as saboteurs in a shouting match. Of all socialist states that were energetically founded, only Cuba maintains the status today, having no millionaires, but they are managing at a per capita income level that is around the global average. However, the Western state of Nigeria was not a socialist state in the USSR or Cuba sense of it, there were world class millionaires back then but there were also very capital intensive socialist interventions by the state especially in the education and health sector. It was a mixed economy.

Great Britain left an excellent system for Nigeria, unparalleled in the World. A federation of three states, each state, essentially a separate nation in its own right, maintaining a police force and embassies in foreign nations. The premier of each state was more important than most African Presidents and the economy of each state bigger than that of most African nations. The states were moving forward. To create a new state, the interested constituents will petition the House of Representatives through their representatives and a date will be set for a referendum, the result of which would be final. The Midwest was created in this manner without much fuss and if not for the 1966 coup d'etat, the North and the East would have been split in thesame manner as well. Farmers were financially buoyant enough to sponsor their children in European and US universities and there were Europeans and Americans in our universities as well, unlike today that our people are scattered all over the world as economic refugees. A teacher in London would be paid wages similar to a teacher in Ibadan or Ilesa in those days. The civil service was of good standard. There was a minimum wage law in the Western state in 1956. So the British created a good nation for the Yoruba and created an European Union like arrangement called Nigeria, so wherever we have found ourselves today is definitely not the doing of Europeans. This is my grouse with pan Africanists whose sing song is 'Europeans under developed Africa'.

I am an Ijesha man, that is the nation I belong to and we are members of a loose confederation of states, we used to call ourselves 'omo ile kaaro ojiire' and now we call ourselves Yoruba. As an Ijesha man, the British or any European nation have never been our enemies or detractors. Our opponents were the Oyo, the Benin, the Tapa, the Fulani and later Ibadan in recent memory. Those were the people we had to contend with, against whom we mobilized armies and etc. Never Britain or any European nation. The British entered Ijesha land to broker peace after a 16 year long civil war with Ibadan. It was the British that united the Yoruba under one umbrella after over a thousand years. So if people claim they want Africa to move forward but spend all the time abusing Europeans as if they could have done better or as if whatever they are so pissed off about were not done by their own ancestors, even worse things were done by their ancestors, one have to stop and wonder who those kind of people are working for and what exactly do they wish to achieve? No nation can do it alone and there is nothing you want to accuse past Europeans of that past Africans are not guilty of as well and if certain wrongs were committed and the offenders are now late, then you should let the matter rest. Discuss it if you want but don't blame present day Europeans for the inadequacies of past Europeans just as you should not do thesame for Africans. That is the only way to hit the ground running as per nation building.

What Britain left in Nigeria was an arrangement very similar to today's European Union, an arrangement acceptable to all. If we are now stuck with a strange constitution written by the military and so therefore can not move forward, that is entirely our fault and not the fault of Europeans.

Ken4Christ:
How can you be a member of any religious group that denies the bodily resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ which is the very basis of our Christian faith? The Jehovah's Witnesses deny the bodily resurrection of Jesus Christ. Instead they teach that Jesus' body was dissolved into gases. Charles Taze Russell, founder of the organization taught, "The man Jesus is dead, forever dead" (Studies in the Scriptures, Vol. 5, 1899, p. 454).

Do not be over impressed by their dedication to their evangelical activities. They do it on two bases;

1. That it will earn them salvation. So they do not believe that salvation is a work of god’s grace as the scripture teaches. “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.”(Ephesians 2:8-9)[/i]. But the JW believe they have to work for their salvation hence the much effort they put in evangelical work.

2. They put fear in them that Armageddon will soon come and God will destroy all the wicked. Memories should fail us to remember how many times they have predicted the date of this doom day but never came to pass.

Please give your life to Christ by acting on Romans 10:9-10 which reads; “That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation”[i]

There is no reason for annyone to give their lif to Christ under the expectation that their past and future sins will be forgiven. That will be demonic and immoral. The only way to remain on the right path with God is to have good character by always considering others before doing anything. All cultures knew this before Christianity and Islam started spreading their psychopathic teachings portraying God the almighty as irrational.

Today is the anniversary of the first coup d'etat in Nigeria, though the first treasonable felony convictions were in 1963 of AG politicians including Chief Obafemi Awolowo and 18 others among whom was my granddad, Chief J.O Lawanson who was the first organising secretary of the AG. If any political party could have made Nigeria into Singapore or South Korea, that was the AG, but they were rigged out of power in the West and jailed for treasonable felony. My granddad was in Ikoyi prison while Chief Awolowo was in Calabar and etc. After post election riots had subsided and quiet achieved, the five Majors struck, four Igbos and one Yoruba, they took out the main actors holding the country down. The main culprit was the late Sardauna of Sokoto, Sir Ahmadu Bello, leader of the NPC and Premier of Northern Nigeria, most others were somehow victims of circumstances but they were all brutally slain by the coup plotters who were later arrested by their superiors in the Army led by General Ironsi who was an Igbo man like the majority of the coup plotters. Gen Ironsi assumed power despite being a political feather weight, he left the AG politicians who provided the motivation and moral justification for the truncation of the first republic in jail, probably believing he does not need them. He then unified the country with a decree and neglected to properly try the coup plotters who were reported to be living large in prison. Before long, he was assassinated in a counter coup by Northerners, many Igbo officers went down with him in a shameless mutiny where officers and men turned on their fellow officers who were Igbos and massacred them for being Igbos. Gen Gowon was pushed forward as a compromise head of state and he immediately announced the release of the AG politicians from prison. All surviving Igbo army officers and men withdrew to the East and refused to recognise Gen Gowon's leadership. The stage was set for the secession of the Eastern state. Chief Awolowo was released in Calabar as a result of the federal Government's directive amid tensions and he held a meeting with the military Governor of the East, Col Ojukwu where he clearly stated that if the East secedes, the West will go too since it would be foolish for the West to remain. He then returned to the West. Col Ojukwu was summoned to Lagos, but he expectedly said he will not go to Lagos or anywhere where there are soldiers of Northern origin. So a meeting was fixed for Aburi Ghana to iron issues out. Agreements were reached to maintain the regions as they were but Gen Gowon reneged on the agreement and split the Eastern state and other states by military decree. Naturally it degenerated into a secessionist war. The war was originally between some Northerners and the Igbo dominated Eastern region, also, some Eastern minorities supported the split of the Eastern region by the Gowon regime. It became a civil war, a struggle between the North and the East with the Midwest and the West looking on until the Easterners moved troops into the West, forcing the West and the Midwest to join the war on the Northern side. It lasted for 3 years and over 3 million lives were lost before the Easterners surrendered due to a blockage. There is no event that can be blamed for the unfortunate turn of events than the rigging of elections in the West by a coalition of Chief Akintola's NNDP and Sir Ahmadu Bello's NPC and no one to blame than the main decider, Sir Ahmadu Bello. It is a lesson for all. Do not try to ride roughshod over others, do not think you are superior to others or better than them. The only reason to be in a position of authourity and responsibility is to serve others and improve their lives with the kind of mindset of those early missionaries that came to Africa, many of them dying of tropical diseases, it should not be to rub your ego. This is the only attitude that can save your own head.

Many Ifa verses were made up and names were substituted. I have heard of Ifa verses claiming Oranmiyan created the Earth. My belief is that Orunmila, Oduduwa and etc are all incarnations of aspects of Obatala.

Ifa is not absolute truth, nothing is, it is just stories and perspectives. If you arrange Shakespeare's stories and consecrate them, Olodumare will guide you with them as well.

The pyramids were not built by the Annunnaki's technology but by humans like us around 5 thousand years ago

Observing the practice of having tutelary deities among groups like the Yoruba, some Europeans opined in alarm that 'the Negro makes and breaks his God at will!'. Among the Yoruba, tutelary deities are normally thrown away upon the demise of the owner. When I was in Ile Ife, a man from Edunabon who described himself as a devout Christian but who also has a tutelary deity at home that he offers a cock and some palmwine to annually explained to me how tutelary deities are acquired under the auspices of the Alagba or chief priest of the main Edunabon deity named Abobiakuro. The man got his tutelary deity from Abobiakuro's chief priest, he throws a mini party for it every year and even has a masquerade for it. When he dies, the tutelary deity will be thrown away while Abobiakuro remains. The man described his tutelary deity as very powerful just like Abraham would describe the God of Abraham. This was the liberal way ancient people approached the God concept. The God of Abraham was nothing more than Abraham's tutelary deity.

FOLYKAZE:
Everything you posted is related to the gap theory which explain that the world was once created by the Gods and civilization was already in progress. But at a point, the whole civilization was destroyed by the Gods and the whole planet was leveled and left to ruin. So later after some eons, the supreme God charged the gods to recreate the planet.



The difference here is that you called the fall of satan in Gap creationism fall of Meteors. I think ifeness share this kind of view.

And this what I got from internet concerning Ife-Oodaye and Gap theory.



So Lawani, I can humbly say you got some points.

@ 9jacrip, the reason why I said your argument was related to that of lawani is because your statement on the first and second Ife points to gap theory.

How is Oodaye the first? Why do we have second Ooye?


Lawani. . .I will like to know if Oodaye and the gap theory can be substantiated. Was there any record or findings that prove there has been some civilazation in the past which was destroyed? Is there any evidence there was worldwide flood? Can you proof some of your claim with Ifa verse, scientific findings?

There was an article I read about an ancient ruin in South Africa, a city of over 100 thousand population, apparently built to mine gold, something was installed there to represent the four cardinal points but it has shifted because of Earth's movement and it was possible to calculate how long ago it was properly alligned. Calculations showed over 200 thousand years ago.

The epic of Sumer claims there was an advanced civilization that was wiped out by flood. The pre flood Kings ruled for thousands of years each and their names were recorded in the epic of Sumer King list. They were called the Annunnaki. The story is very full having been written thousands of years ago. The story is referring to Ot u Ife. Atlantis in the Kemitic narrative is Ot u Ife.

After Ot u Ife sank, all the knowledge did not go away at once, it went gradually. So we do not know what our ancestors were capable of. If a society does not buckle up, they lose knowledge gradually. For instance ancient Yoruba could write.

There is this penchance to be saying Olodumare destroyed the Earth, I don't necessarily agree. Our Karma can destroy us, not Olodumare. We have nukes already that can destroy us many times over, we just need to start a religious war, if we finish off ourselves in a nuclear holocaust and only a few thousand people survive, they will build the Earth again and possibly pass on the story that Olodumare destroyed the Earth which will not be right. The Earth was destroyed but not by Olodumare, more by man's foolishness. That was the view of the wise men of Kemitic Egypt about the collapse of Atlantis which I believe is same as Ot u Ife.

The cycle has been going on since Earth became habitable is what I believe. The last time Earth was destroyed, the first place to have a civilization while others were nomads was Ife Ooyelagbo and the capital was shifted from place to place. They had no competitor initially. Hence the title Olofin aiye.

Anybody can bring their perspective but given the passed down stories in Ife, I believe what I rendered. The present people in Ife have no idea of what legacy was passed to them to protect.