₦airaland Forum

Empiree:
I really dont need to bother myself. Evidences are abound in your bibles. I didnt say old law are false. I simply said Jesus did not change nor relax old testament laws. So called new covenant are question when it's crystal clear from same NT that....
“For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” — Matthew 5:18-19

“It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid.” (Luke 16:17)

“Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place.” (Matthew 5:17)

The law he referred to above is Mosaic law (Law of Moses)

“Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law” (John7:19)^

Keep in mind, this is Jesus Christ saying this–in the Bible that all Christians own and cherish. Don’t take my word for it; look it up–it’s all there.

Deuteronomy 31:25-29New International Version (NIV)

25 he gave this command to the Levites who carried the ark of the covenant of the Lord: 26 “Take this Book of the Law and place it beside the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God. There it will remain as a witness against you. 27 For I know how rebellious and stiff-necked you are. If you have been rebellious against the Lord while I am still alive and with you, how much more will you rebel after I die! 28 Assemble before me all the elders of your tribes and all your officials, so that I can speak these words in their hearing and call the heavens and the earth to testify against them. 29 For I know that after my death you are sure to become utterly corrupt and to turn from the way I have commanded you. In days to come, disaster will fall on you because you will do evil in the sight of the Lord and arouse his anger by what your hands have made.”

Jesus did not come with a new law. Some must have rewrote your bible. Why all the Bible (books) according to this and that and NOT according to Jesus himself?. All chronicles are hearsay...I got more evidences against you people. I can bring them up as i deem fit.

As for Quran, there is no abrogation in Quran. Verses of Quran that talks about abrogation simply refer to previous revealed Book like Torah and Gospel. All laws in those Books are abrogated by Quran as it's the final testament.

Empiree:
Honestly, i dont have time for you guys. I see you people as arrogant as you can be. I have made up my mind to ignore you and few others cus, your writings are neither friendly nor professional but attacks and blasphemies. I know you 've been throwing questions all around seeking answers but people ignore you because when they answer you and others call them liars, taqqiya as you fondly call it. If i want i will answer with precedent and i wont care whether you are satisfied with it or not.

By way, if you believe that verse of Quran is true, why dont you then accept Quran as the word of God? Why are you yourself acting like a double standard hypocrite to quote a verse from Quran and yet deny Quran as a LIE? If you really think that Quran 10:94 is true, why then you dont reject the religion of falsehood and corruptions called Christianity with that for Islam?

Empiree:
author=dolphinheart



But because of their breach of their covenant, We cursed them, and made their hearts grow hard; they change the words from their (right) places and forget a good part of the message that was sent them, nor wilt thou cease to find them- barring a few - ever bent on (new) deceits: but forgive them, and overlook (their misdeeds): for Allah loveth those who are kind. From those, too, who call themselves Christians, We did take a covenant, but they forgot a good part of the message that was sent them: so we estranged them, with enmity and hatred between the one and the other, to the day of judgment. And soon will Allah show them what it is they have done.
(Quran 5:13-14)

There enough evidence displayed already that your book is corrupted. It's not just translation. They practically removed original words and replaced them. Remove the mole from your eyes to see what we see

No abrogation?. You kidding right?.

When one studies the Hebrew and Greek scriptures, it becomes clear that omnipotent and omniscient God did make mistakes and repented. This means that the God did not know his own actions and the outcomes of the actions. According to Bible... Now for some fine examples.

Now start with Old Testament. In the story of Noah(P), it is mention that:

And the LORD smelled a sweet savour; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground anymore for man's sake; for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; neither will I again smite any more everything living, as I have done [Genesis 8:21]

And in the story of Moses(P), we read

And the LORD repented of the evil which he
thought to do unto his people [Exodus 32:14]

Oh no! that is Old Testament, cries the Christian. The New Testament has replaced all that. Yes, in the New Testament, the monotheistic and henotheistic God of Israel, Yahweh, suddenly starts to be interpreted as Trinity. So, the concept of monotheistic and henotheistic God itself got abrogated in the New Testament as the Christians allege! So we have to assume that the monotheistic and henotheistic God of Israel did not know that he was Trinity and made a serious mistake or he simply changed his mind or in the worst case scenario, he cheated the People of Israel.

Definition of abrogation: ab-ro-gate: v.tr. repeal, annul, abolish (a law or custom)

[b]In the context of the will and law of God (Holy is He above all that is attributed to Him) as expressed in Scripture, it refers to the nullification of an older Law or concept in favour of a newer and more appropriate one.

We might ask whether an omniscient God, if He is the one who sent Torah and Injeel, might employ such a concept as abrogation? Surely an all-knowing God would be able to impart His will in entirety without recourse to change? Doesn't the idea of abrogating, or nullifying, a previous law in light of a better one suggest that the Author is not all-knowing?

What these questions don't take into account, is that whilst God is all-knowing, unchanging (e.g., Malachi 3:6, with lots of problems with the concept of Trinity), His audience, humanity, is not. The very concept that Christianity holds so dear, of the difference between the old covenantal relationship of law, as opposed to the new covenantal relationship of grace relies on the understanding that human beings as individuals and in human societies are in fact subjected to change in condition.[/b]

According to Matthew, Jesus(P) said:

" Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven " [Matthew 5:17-19]

And surprising, Jesus(P), the omniscient Yahweh incarnate (allegedly!) suddenly had to change the,

* Laws of Divorce
* Justice
* Oaths
* Changing his own mind

Abrogation Of Divorce

In the Old Testament we find the following law concerning divorce:

" If a man marries a woman who becomes displeasing to him because he finds something indecent about her, and he writes her a certificate of divorce, gives it to her and sends her from his house, and if after she leaves his house she becomes the wife of another man " [Deutronomy 24:1-2]

Now without going into the minute of this particular law of divorce, one thing becomes immediately clear. Not only is divorce permitted by God, it is legal for her to remarry.

However in the time of Jesus(P), the rules of divorce seem to have taken a U-turn.

"It has been said, Anyone who divorces his wife must give her a certificate of divorce. But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, causes her to become an adulteress, and anyone who marries the divorced woman commits adultery" [Matthew 5:31-32]

Here Jesus(P) abrogated the former permission to divorce according to the husband's displeasure and strictly allowed it under one condition - adultery. He even went so far as to legislate that divorcees were not permitted to remarry, clearly abrogating the former permission. But what is the reason given for this abrogation? Had God changed His mind? Is this evidence of God not being omniscient? Or more importantly, is this evidence that in fact God was never the author of these laws? Well Jesus(P) himself explains:

"Why then," they asked, "did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away?" Jesus replied, "Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery " [Matthew 19:7-9]
Anyway, Jesus(P) points to the fact that God designs laws that are suitable to the needs and exigencies of the time and audience.

Haba! adultery for marrying divorced woman?. Let me give you another one.

I got more and i can go on and on like Law of Oaths, Law of Absolute Justice etc


kindly. I am not aware of them. However when you people asked and we answered you said we lied. In that case, answers seized. Rilwayne provided nice details up there and tola as well.

Ifeann:
His wife convinced him that he was a prophet. .. the same man that says women are half intelligent as men... the same man that says the majority of people in hell are women. ..Mohammed was a "funny" guy..

Empiree:
@bold suggests that islam was right all along when it says:

"And indeed, there is among them a party who alter the Scripture with their tongues so you may think it is from the Scripture, but it is not from the Scripture. And they say, "This is from Allah ," but it is not from Allah . And they speak untruth about Allah while they know." Qur'an 3:78

So when muslims say Bible is corrupted they say the truth. You exposed Christianity here big time. Book of God should be one. That's. There should be no addition or omission. That book (Bible) is hell of culprit. And we have a lady here pointing finger and accusing islam.

The Hadith (sayings and actions of Prophet Muhammad in Islam) as well point out to Biblical Corruption. Consider these hadith:

Narrated Abu Huraira: The people of the Scripture (Jews) used to recite the Torah in Hebrew and they used to explain it in Arabic to the Muslims. On that Allah's Apostle said, "Do not believe the people of the Scripture or disbelieve them, but say:-- "We believe in Allah and what is revealed to us." (2.136) (Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Number 12)

Rilwayne001, tola9ja, true2god...see how they exposed themselves.

zeezahbee:
Islam made my life better Mr man, for your info, I am a pharmacist and I live in the USA,#NotBragging# it's only a jobless person like you that run around NL to cuss people. Don't quote me in your posts again.

rationalmind:
My mum is a Nurse and I've heard her say the same thing. How they started praying when they had difficulties trying to carry out delivery on a woman undergoing labour.

johnydon22:
Sweetheart, you try so hard to believe this even when you dont have evidence for it or seen it before...
anyway i charge you to know more so that you may stop being scared of abstract things that only exist in the mind of those who think they do..

johnydon22:
lol so this god created hell for you then gave his son to save you from what he created for you... nawa ooo!!!

malvisguy212:
you have said nothing,the abrogate verses are still in the quran


Asbab al- Nuzul, p. 19, al-Suyuti wrote:
“Ibn ’Abbas himself said, ‘Sometimes
the revelation used to descend on
the prophet during the night and
then he forgot it during daytime,
thus God sent down this verse:
2:106.”

Empiree your lies has been exposed by this verse;
Surah 16:101: “And when We put a
revelation in place of (another)
revelation, – and Allah knoweth best
what He revealeth – they say: Lo!
THOU ART BUT INVENTING Most of them
know not.” (Pickthall)

This Qur’anic verse shows that a number of people living during the time of Muhammad were troubled at this
concept of abrogation. In response to. the claim that new revelations superseded the older ones, they said to Muhammad, “THOU ART BUT INVENTING MOST OF THEM.” And they are absolutely right. Your knowledge of the quran is weak or maby you just want to prevent the truth.this verses of abrogation was not talking about the scripture.


What happened to the other revelation? Why are the abrogate verses still in the quran? How can Muslim know which verses are abrogated? Even Muslim scholar argue about the abrogated verses.

malvisguy212:
A teacher is using the "scientific method"
to teach the class about evolution...
TEACHER: Tommy do you see the tree
outside?
TOMMY: Yes.
TEACHER: Tommy, do you see the grass
outside?
TOMMY: Yes.
TEACHER: Go outside and look up and
see if you can see the sky.
TOMMY: Okay. (He returned a few
minutes later) Yes, I saw the sky.
TEACHER: Did you see God?
TOMMY: No.
TEACHER: That's my point. We can't see
God because he isn't there. He doesn't
exist.
A little girl spoke up and wanted to ask
the boy some questions. The teacher
agreed and the little girl questioned the
boy.
LITTLE GIRL: Tommy, do you see the tree
outside?
TOMMY: Yes.
LITTLE GIRL: Tommy do you see the
grass outside?
TOMMY: Yessssss (getting tired of the
questions this time).
LITTLE GIRL: Did you see the sky?
TOMMY: Yessssss.
LITTLE GIRL: Tommy, do you see the
teacher?
TOMMY: Yes
LITTLE GIRL: Do you see the teacher's
mind?
TOMMY: No.
LITTLE GIRL: Then according to what we
were taught today in school, she must
not have one!

The above joke is a good lesson in the
problem of trying to prove the existence
of God using the scientific tools available to us. A Creator God, if He exists, must, by definition, exist beyond the limits of the universe in order to have created it. The laws of physics tell us that we cannot make measurements beyond the limits of this universe. Therefore, scientists can conclusively determine that we cannot ever detect God using any of our instruments.


However, God is not restricted to our limitations and could choose to reveal part of Himself to us. God could not reveal His entirety to us without causing
major problems in our universe. The sudden appearance of dimensions and matter(?) from outside the universe would destroy anything in the vicinity and maybe even destroy the entire universe. This is why the Bible says that nobody can see God and live.

However, God could reveal His nature by communicating with humans and
sending an incarnated version of Himself. This is exactly what Christianity
claims - that God gave messages to
humans (through the prophets) and sent an incarnation of Himself (His Son), who took on the form of a human in order to interact with humans directly.
Although you cannot see God directly in
this life (but you will see Him in the next) , you can experience Him through your spirit. This is the claim and promise of Christianity that accounts for its popularity. When you accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, you enter into a relationship with Him through the Holy Spirit. The indwelling of the Holy Spirit, which you will directly experience when you come to faith, confirms both the existence and the power of God to the believer. It is through this relationship that we can enter into the joy of the Lord and experience the fullness of the Christian life.

If you are not a Christian, you will not
believe what I just told you. I know,
because when I was an agnostic for 33
years, I did not believe that you could
have a relationship with God. Since 1988 I have been experiencing the joy of the fellowship of the Lord and I want the same for you. Don't wait! Get your
questions answered and come to faith
based upon the facts, and enter into the
joy that cannot be found through
anything else in this world.
Well, its your choice. Do you see your
mind?
http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/notseegod.html

johnydon22:
Hahahahahahaha why is it that you guys dont read stuff before writing it...
Big bang is not an explosion bros...
The Big Bang theory is the prevailing cosmological model for the birth of
the universe. It states that at some moment all of space was
contained in a single point from which the Universe has been expanding
ever since. Modern measurements place this moment at approximately
13.8 billion years ago, which is thus considered the age of the universe .
wikipedia encyclopedia.
The time they are talking about here is the start of the universe and not the start of time itself.
Approximately 13.8billion years ago now if you say time started at that period then i say what about 15billion years ago before the universe started.
so you see it can go infinitely backwards and infinitely forward.
And then lastly i advice you go study about the big bang so you dont make jest of yourself next time abeg...

johnydon22:
lolz i just asked you a simple question!

johnydon22:
and the period before the big bang is called?

johnydon22:
And where did any of these sources indicate time had a beginning?
I dont think you understand what is meant by time here, Do you?

johnydon22:
Time has a beginning can you please show me the source where you read this from?
scientists that proposed it?
The field of study?
Provide them let me see for myself please bro

johnydon22:
lolzzz Constant assumptions!!!
Timeless and eternity
nawa ooooo!!!

johnydon22:
nothing can come out of nothing but you believe this ur deity (god) came out nothing right? now if nothing can come out of.nothing it means this ur god cant come out of nothing so who created this ur god and who created the god that created ur god and so the chain keeps going?

Ifeann:
Lol, why did u bother to reply him.. Ok maybe for the other ignorant Muslims he may mislead.

I tot it wise to ignore the fellow because his argument defeats him better. Look at the excuse he gave for not following the example of his prophet marrying Aisha at 6 and sleeping with her at 9 . What does germination have to do with anything.

On another note, how is ur weekend. Have u seen my latest post.
Shalom.

lepasharon:
It may be so that you saw Jesus...but didn't he tel you his name isn't Jesus? Nobody called Jesus walked this earth and the name Jesus means nothing in any language. Surely he must have told you you're calling on a false name?