₦airaland Forum

Gombs:
Between the lines shey?
Sarcasm, shey?

So, it is safe yo conclude that you said faith don't always work. #Noted

I have bookmarked this page for future reference.

In other news, I have found a cue to the old WoF page, a place where folks like Goshen, shedemidemi , Drummaboy now WinsomeX made monumental blunders, just like you've done now...I screen grabbed it, I kept it, no tsunami can take it away now.

I'm working on raising the thread back. You'd see funny discussion like Wof building, Wof piano, Wof guitar

Meehn, it's almost time for Communion Service oo

Mr librarian, what I mean by that is this, that you have great faith doesn't mean God will grant it to you, it's will & sovereignty is the deciding choice

Do you think David didn't have faith when he prayed that God should spare the life of his child? Yet the child still died

When God revealed to Paul that no life will be lost excerpt the properties in the ship, why didnt he change it, after all pastor has said when God reveals something, then you can change it, if he doesn't reveal it you can't change it

Bottom line:ITS GODS SOVERIEGNITY THAT COUNTS

Image123:
lol, the nanny herself.

Actually on a more serious note, not knowing the most appropriate time to say this. i think y'all should start winding up with these petty discuss about words, it's not helping anybody in the big picture. It's not a command oh, na advice to all parties.

I'm not angry, you will notice I haven't really insulted anyone. I see it as a discuss

you say something, I check it out & say mine

That way my convictions are being checked

mbaemeka:
Let me help you out a little. If God decides to give you a house without you asking him for it, it is his sovereignty at work. Now if you decide to ask God for a house you would require FAITH to get it from him. That's what he said. So now infuse that into your references above and you would learn a thing or two today. For example, Zechariah had faith for a child. It might be little but he did and God obliged his request.

13 But the angel said to him, Do not be afraid, Zachariah, because your petition [k]was heard, and your wife Elizabeth will bear you a son, and you must call his name John [God is favorable].

Sit down I said, his petition was heard but at the point he was told he will received, he the. Doubted!! Why then did he still receive??

When the church was praying for Peter, when the girl said Peter was at the door, they said maybe it was his ghost!!

Isn't that unbelief, here they were praying or his release & they are now being told that he was at the door, they conclude it was his ghost

If they truly believed that their prayers were truly heard why did they offer that explanation ?

Yet God pulled through in all

Gombs:
Apology not accepted. What's the excuse now? a mix up again? You can't keep making blunders and apologizing ma'am. If you have not learnt enough, be humble to ask, and learn, nothing wrong in that. What is wrong is when half baked brethren want to teach, when they themselves are inept.

You can't keep shooting your foot and telling us it was a mistake. I gave you an advice earlier on, I said: writing is the most expensive form of communication, and the least forgiving.

anyways, it's Sunday, apologies accepted

Go & sit down, that's sacarsam!!

What am I apologizing for, if it was one why am I challenging him

Next time, learn to read between the lines

mbaemeka:
Faith doesn't work all the time? Wow.

I'm sorry, it works all the time, I hereby join vooks in challenging you:

Please pray away Boko Haram not next week BUT NOW. Or Ebola.!!

Pray away Bad governance instantly, oh man of great faith!!

Luke1:18-20
18 And Zacharias said unto the angel, Whereby shall I know this? for I am an old man, and my wife well stricken in years.
19 And the angel answering said unto him, I am Gabriel, that stand in the presence of God; and am sent to speak unto thee, and to shew thee these glad tidings.
20 And, behold, thou shalt be dumb, and not able to speak, until the day that these things shall be performed, because thou believest not my words, which shall be fulfilled in their season.

Zach did not believe, did Gods word still come to pass? Mr have great faith!!


When namman was entering the river, Shebi he had great faith?


2kings4
16 And he said, About this season, according to the time of life, thou shalt embrace a son. And she said, Nay, my lord, thou man of God, do not lie unto thine handmaid.
17 And the woman conceived, and bare a son at that season that Elisha had said unto her, according to the time of life.

Shebi this woman was also expressing faith

Gombs:
Excuse me!
And So? I follow the bible, Pastor Chris preaches and teaches I go back and search the book if these things be true, and they always were! Dont make it sound like he is my benchmark for marking anything scriptures right. Please point me to the message. Thanks.


Can anyone receive anything from God without faith? A yes or no would be fine. Thanks

FAITH TO CHANGE YOUR WORLD, that's the title of the teaching, it wasn't a service persay, more like a Talkshow between Pastor & Rev Tom. About 4 vcd's or so

Pastor taught that, the man's statement was that of unbelief & Jesus healed the boy because of the following verse

Mark 9:25
25 When Jesus saw that the people came running together, he rebuked the foul spirit, saying unto him, Thou dumb and deaf spirit, I charge thee, come out of him, and enter no more into him.


He healed the boy out of compassion & the folks that were coming to witness Gods healing power!!

How can "Lord, I believe, help my unbelief " be a statement of faith"

If someone believed you could do something will he be asking you "if thou can" isn't that unbelief?

I hope the above answers the second paragraph of your quote!!

Bidam:
Unlike you i like being silent where scripture is silent.

If the above were true, then you wouldn't have said that it was Paul's prayer that made God have mercy on Epaphroditus. The scripture was silent on that.

We weren't told that Paul prayed for his healing neither were we told that there was a praying, all that was stated was God had mercy on him

Paul statement can be likened to a husband who says God had mercy on his wife & on him(saving him from the sorrow of becoming a widower)

Will it be right to the. Conclude that it was the husband prayer that worked?

If faith works all the time? Why didn't trophimus faith work or why didn't Paul use his own great faith to heal him, rather he left him sick?

Bidam:
Look at the verse you quoted slowly without adding your prejudices to it. notice the large fonts i highlighted. It was actually as a result of Paul's prayer God had mercy on epaphroditus, not the other way round.

The question now is did Paul pray for Epaphroditus? Good. Go back to chapter 1 of Paul's letter since Epaphroditus was a fellow believer at Philippi before he was sent to Paul by the Church.

Philippians 1:3(NIV)


3 I thank my God every time I remember you. 4 In all my prayers for all of you, I always pray with joy

Oh lord, so it's now Paul's faith that caused God to heal epaphroditus?

wow


An excerpt from the verse:

But God had mercy on him, and not only on him but on me also, lest I should have sorrow upon sorrow

if God had mercy on both of them, why the. Should you single out Paul's prayer?

Why rule out epaphroditus prayers?

are you telling me he too don't have faith?

What about trophimus that Paul left sick?

What happened Paul didn't have faith?

Just questioning your line of reasoning!!

Bidam:
So Hezekiah prayers stayed the hands of a merciful God, he stayed back 15 years instead of going home to be with the Lord, and what was the result of all the work he did? No legacy, his sons shattered it.

Off course he had faith that why he cried unto God but that wasn't the reason God gave him 15yrs!! Did he ask for 15years?

Are you telling me it was his faith that moved God?

Gombs: God is moved by faith ONLY, not mercy! If mercy moved God to change situations, why hasn't His mercy changed the situation in Syria?


What healed the man? What moved God to heal that man, Faith or mercy? Without faith, you CANNOT get ANYTHING FROM GOD ....Oya quote Mark 1:41 for me!

Mark9:20-24

20 And they brought him unto him: and when he saw him, straightway the spirit tare him; and he fell on the ground, and wallowed foaming.
21 And he asked his father, How long is it ago since this came unto him? And he said, Of a child.
22 And ofttimes it hath cast him into the fire, and into the waters, to destroy him[b]but if thou canst do any thing, have compassion on us, and help us[/b]
23 Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth.
24 And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said with tears Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief

Mind you I know pastor Chris's interpretation of this & I can refer to the message.

Q1.but if thou canst do any thing, have compassion on us, and help us

&

Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief.

Are these statements of a man with great faith ?

Q2.At the end, his son got Healed, was it as a result of his faith or God's mercy & love?

by the way, vooks just showed you a verse that buttress the mercy of God at work, but you ignored that & pulled up the one that buttresses faith!!

nobody is disputing that faith works, but what I'm saying is, it is God mercy/love & sovereignty that counts at all times

Bidam:
Your problem lies in your definition of Faith. Faith is NOT an option when praying for results.

Can you show me how your response addresses my post?

nlMediator:
The reality is that there are many cases of people getting instant answers to prayers, especially as they exercised their faith. The woman with the issue of blood? Blind Bartimeus? Five loaves and two fish? Wine at the wedding? Indeed, virtually every case of healing or miracle by Jesus was an instant response to a need or request.

I believe there are so many roads that leads to Rome!! ie when faced with a challenge, a Christian has many option to tackle it.

He can pray, fast, worship, praise or a combination etc any can work depending on what he was led by the Holy Spirit to do at that time

BUT to say that one can get instant result as a result of one's great faith in all situations is something I will not agree to!!

There is nothing that suggest from the scriptures that Hezekiah got instant result because he had great faith(rather it was Gods mercy at work & the way he wanted things to go)

Where then is the instantness in "intercessory prayers"?

I asked earlier on, the bible shows that Hanah's family went up yearly & I'm sure(even though it wasn't stated) that she went to the temple to pray or at least have been praying year to year

was it just the recorded one that made God answer her prayers?

If yes, does it mean she didn't have faith in all her previous prayers?

As shown from scripture how men defied the laws of nature(Jesus walking on water, his ascension, Philips transportation, the sun being set back etc) I also believe the same can happen in the life of a Christian, YES his faith can make this happen but it's more of Gods mercy & Sovreignity!!

the foundation of this teaching lies in the diety of man & how he can get what he wants & when he wants it, so long as he has the God kind of faith

This teaching is dangerous because God has been left out of the picture, his will has been left out(there is a teaching out there that says praying according to the will of God is praying in the name of Jesus, what's the meaning of this? anything I ask in the name of Jesus with great faith will be granted?)

Hope you get the thrust of my post

L

Gombs:
Yeah, Hezekiah got an instant reply... you doubted, why?

Was the instant reply a function of his great faith or Gods sovereignty?

Gombs:
my pleasure

very convenient 'mix up'. When you were typing on that thread, you must have been fatigued? your 'mix up' now has left your memory? a sudden amnesia i must say. Well, it's alright



no need for that ma'am. a little advice: Writing is the most expensive form of communication, and the least forgiving. Always remember that.



you just lost integrity ma'am. I cannot completely trust your details anymore. If you say good morning to me now, i mst check my watch to be sure it is morning.



i already did that

Now mademoiselle, we can move on! where were we? Aha! Hezekiah and faith things, right?

I have seen it, my apologies then

I was supposed to write 18yrs & not 8. Was born in the Catholic Church & left when I was eighteen.

if you like double check my words, it doesn't change who I'm & what I know(you can even double check this again)

Do the maths, you will know my age, so I'm not some kid

Where were we again, hezekiah care to explain

Gombs:
I find it a bit disturbing, that your posts are contradictory. I'm beginning to doubt your honesty.

You once said you were a Roman Catholic and you left 8 years ago ( holla if you need proof), Now after 4years in mathematics dept Unijos, I find that math you're trying to pull here disturbing.

Being in CE for 11 years readily shows you joined 2003, right?
Leaving RCC 8 years ago means you left 2006, no?

If you left the RCC in 2006, how then did being in CEC equate 11years?

I am thinking Someone lied or is lying. Mind explaining?

pls kindly, show me where I stated it that I left The Catholic Church 8yrs ago? There must be a mixup somewhere

where it not for the fact that I don't have my baptismal cert & foundation school cert here, I would have uploaded it

eitherway, I don't need to prove how long I have been there or whether I'm truly a member.

I'M A MEMBER OF CHRIST EMBASSY!!!!

Pls show me where I stated that I left RCC 2006 or 8yrs ago

Gombs:
Before we continue, I asked a question before, maybe you answered and I missed it, but I'd re-ask. How long did you say you've been in CE? 11? Right?

[size=14pt]Oui Monsieur [/size]

can we continue now?

Gombs:
No, it was because he was a king.

So all those who don't get instant harvest was because of little faith? Where then is the role of Gods sovereignty?

Gombs:
No, it was guess work.



You should visit that Hannah's story again.



Go visit that story again. The child was illegitimate, and it was the line that'd bring the Messiah. The line had to be pure! After David married the lady, she had a son, find out the son's name, and what was God's testimony about the child.



Visit that verse again. Paul knew less, but when God told him His grace was sufficient, guess what happened to Paul's mindset!

So you mean to tell me hezekiah got instant result to his prayer because of his faith?

mbaemeka:
.....and yes Hezekiah got an instant harvest. This is just off the top. I am sure you would find many if you only studied properly.

As long as the earth remains seedtime and harvest will not cease- God.

Which means the Harvest is not always predicated by time unlike seeds. I believe God's word.

Hezekiah getting an instant harvest was a function of his faith abi ?

what happened to Hannah, hasn't she been praying all those years? So the recorded act of her making a vow to God, that brought Samuel was the one that she had great faith abi?

When David prayed & fasted, yet his child died. Didn't he have strong faith to have a harvest?

Paul thorn nko(whatever that torn might have been). Didn't Paul have great faith to cause a change?

mbaemeka:
You used a car as an example. Who am I to question such a level of faith? Same way Martha and Mary had FAITH that Lazarus will be resurrected on THE LAST DAY but Jesus (having greater faith than they) compressed the time and brought Lazarus back in the present.

Mr A can pray for a healing and expect to get healed on the bye and bye. 5 years later he notices all symptoms gone and he praises God. Mr B prays for a healing and expects it now. He sees the symptoms shrivel immediately and he praises God. Both Got their harvest but the time was not set.

Faith doesn't say I WILL get something from God. Hope says so. Faith gets it now. Faith is higher than time and that's why God said seedtime and harvest will always remain.

At the point A & B got their healing, wasn't it "time" so what the fuss about no time being tied to harvest or harvest time??

Keep deluding yourself that all seeds sown(prayer, finances, time, love etc) can be harvested NOW, if one has great faith

The church didn't have faith when they prayed against Bokoharam?

so there wasn't one Christian with great faith that could sow seeds of prayer against Bokoharam at its incipient stage to have stopped it then?

Ebola nko, the kidnappings going on nko, what about the robberies? Bad governance nko? Haven't Christians been praying about all of these things? yet none had great faith to harvest an instant harvest of peace & health

showme someone who sowed anything in scriptures & reaped immediately(even the Hebrew hallmark of faith doesn't have any)

God wasn't put into the equation, it's just the individual's faith that is the determinant

Bidam:
Good, now you are coming up to my scriptural level of reasoning, who set those natural laws in place?

when u click on the start button on a windows OS, who/what causes the options to appear, bill gates or the programmer or the OS itself that has been programmed to do such?

When you fall from a cliff, is it God or Gravity?

mbaemeka:
In the same vein the Harvest mustn't always come at a set time. It could just come when exactly you want it to and it takes radical faith to actuate it

Caveat: the seed in question must not always be money. It could be seed of prayer, seed of acting faith, seed of working hard, seed of patience etc.

this was an excerpt from my earlier submission:

Inspite of the fact that, the verse was talking about natural events, some folks have applied it to sowing of money, while I don't have a problem with that, they stretch it further to say that, when you sow your seed now, you can reap it now because the bible only talked about seed time & not harvest time but harvest

based on this teaching, if I give a car now, a new one will & can come now, today today

No time for trekking or experiencing inconveniences

So Gombs, from the bolded, I can sow seeds of prayer, money & hard work etc & also determine when i will reap the harvest! only if i have a "high level of faith"

Wake up please!! It's time to start examining what you profess

We have left "seed time" & "harvest", its now famine!!

First things first, Gombs why did the bible say seedtime & harvest(without time) ?

mbaemeka, care to join?

LambanoPeace, also comment because you started the whole thing!

Bidam: Seed time is set by MAN, the time for harvest is SET BY GOD

Time for harvest=harvest time

the above is true, when it comes to sowing of time, energy, money etc but not entirely true when it comes to crops as used in the genesis verse, God has already set laws in place that governs that

when u click on the start button on a windows OS, who/what causes the options to appear, bill gates or the programmer or the OS itself that has been programmed to do such?

vooks:
2. Seed time and harvest time are set by natural laws. You can't sow any time of the year and expect a harvest. Harvest time is different for different plants

Inspite of the fact that, the verse was talking about natural events, some folks have applied it to sowing of money, while I don't have a problem with that, they stretch it further to say that, when you sow your seed now, you can reap it now because the bible only talked about seed time & not harvest time but harvest

based on this teaching, if I give a car now, a new one will & can come now, today today

No time for trekking or experiencing inconveniences

Bidam:
I am not a CE member, Let me help your scriptural ineptitude...Seed time is set by MAN, the time for harvest is SET BY GOD, whatever meanings you read into scriptures ARE your insinuations. Paul planted, Appolo watered, who gives the INCREASE

maybe you should read my initial post, it was directed at lambanopeace & not you. I only asked you to check the post with reference to your question

speaking on ineptitude, that verse again talks about the natural course of events & wasn't talking about sowing seeds as churches have used it to preach.

I believe in application of the word, even if that verse is used to buttress sowing & reaping, that time, was not added to "harvest" is inconsequential, the same way "time" was not added to the other things listed, even though they were all times & seasons & phases.

This is just semantics, the same way someone can say seed phase or seed planting phase, will you cry out & say its not biblical

It is churches that are twisting that verse to mean that when you sow seeds, there is no set time for your harvest, it can come any time, just because there was no time attached to "harvest" in that scripture.

Bidam:
What you said was seed time and havrvest time. Genesis never said such..it said seed time and HARVEST. There is a reason time wasn't included in the harvest,care to explain it to us?

Sorry to Cut in, read my post, therein lies the explanation. vooks quoted it again on this page

LambanoPeace:
Olodo rabata, there is no such thing as the above bold in the Bible. Oya argue let me embarrass you with Scriptures. There is seed time, but nothing like harvest time. Where did you pull out seed time and harvest time law from?

I'm sure you are from CE, what you just said about harvest not having a timeframe is what you were taught but you haven't really studied it for yourself.

Genesis 8:22 (KJV)
While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease.

The above scripture is talking about the natural events in life. If you claim based on this scripture that there is a time to sow seeds but harvest can be any time, can you explain why crops have seasons when they are available?

Can you sow cocoa & reap it any time or there is a time frame to harvest it?

even though the bible did not add "time" to summer or winter or day or night, aren't these seasons & time

Eg summer time, winter time, day time, night time etc will you now say these aforementioned words are wrong because time was not attached to it in the bible?

Ecc3:2

2 A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted

A TIME to pluck up that which is planted = HARVEST TIME

it time you start studying for yourself all the words/statements you have been taught in church

A perfect thread was derailed for something that had nothing to do with the subject of the thread

To think that a Mod who ought to have known better(justwise) helped in derailing it.

Goldenboy007, please kindly start from where you stopped.

Gombs:
I'd work on that thank you

Ok, mentioned you elsewhere like to get your view

jdilight:
THE GATE OF HELL AGAINST THE PROSPERITY OF THE CHURCH OF GOD

Zechariah 1:17, "Cry yet, saying, Thus saith the LORD of host; My cities through prosperity shall yet be spread abroad; and the LORD shall yet comfort Zion, and shall yet choose Jerusalem.

pls to understand this verse, you have to start from verse 1. This chapter is talking about the typical scenario where Israel will stray from God & the typical suffering/woes that normally comes with it & the blessing that comes later when they repent as evident based in Vs 2-4 of this chapter

2 The LORD hath been sore displeased with your fathers.
3 Therefore say thou unto them, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Turn ye unto me, saith the LORD of hosts, and I will turn unto you, saith the LORD of hosts.
4 Be ye not as your fathers, unto whom the former prophets have cried, saying, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Turn ye now from your evil ways, and from your evil doings: but they did not hear, nor hearken unto me, saith the LORD

here is what some translations has to say about V17

17 And again let your voice be loud and say, This is what the Lord of armies has said: My towns will again be overflowing with good things, and again the Lord will give comfort to Zion and take Jerusalem for himself.

17 “Proclaim further, saying, ‘Yahweh of Armies says: “My cities will again overflow with prosperity, and Yahweh will again comfort Zion, and will again choose Jerusalem.”’”

17 “Also announce the following: ‘This is what the LORD of the Heavenly Armies says: “My cities will again overflow with prosperity. The LORD will comfort Zion once more and will choose Jerusalem again.”’”

hope you get what God is saying, when they turn back to him, the cities will be filled back with prosperity

notice the later part of Vs17

The LORD will comfort Zion once more and will choose Jerusalem again

why is The Lord comforting them & choosing them "again"??

When they turn back to him, they will prosper then he will comfort them & they will become his again.

my leader taught me this, I know you heard vs 17 from your pastor, now go study along these lines & ask your questions

Gombs, I call upon you because you asked this questions before!

jdilight:
THE BENEFITS OF TITHING

1. To bring increase from that where the tithe came from.
By the tithe Abraham paid, he was immune from being defeated in any war he will go into.

2. To stop the devourer from devouring your possession.

based on point 1 & 2, we can safely infer & conclude that any Christian that suffers any woes or is in lack isn't a tither?

Pls wake up!! tithing does not guarantee the above points, there are faithful Christians that have not experienced increase or who have lost their possessions

The Christians in Jos, whose houses & properties were burnt in the religious crises, weren't they tithers?

as for abraham being immuned from further wars, I don't know where you got that from, chapter what, verse what please?

Abraham give from the spoils of war as an act of worship & thanksgiving!! C'est fini

He didn't do it because of any benefits or immunity, it is such promises that the church has used in trapping people into giving of tithes.