₦airaland Forum

PhysicsQED: Actually, in the U.S.A. there was something called the eighteenth amendment to the U.S. constitution, i.e. Prohibition. Look it up. The law of the land did have to be changed to make selling alcohol illegal. Then there was the 21st amendment to the constitution which served as a correction to the previous ban on alcohol.

I should have known that you would dig up the only such reference one can find on the issue. My point remains valid.

PhysicsQED: And what's your interpretation of the following:

""44. (1) No moveable property or any interest in an immovable property shall be taken possession of compulsorily and no right over or interest in any such property shall be acquired compulsorily in any part of Nigeria except in the manner and for the purposes prescribed by a law that, among other things -

(a) requires the prompt payment of compensation therefore and

(b) gives to any person claiming such compensation a right of access for the determination of his interest in the property and the amount of compensation to a court of law or tribunal or body having jurisdiction in that part of Nigeria."


Are you telling me that the Sharia laws in Kano require anyone possessing and/or selling alcohol to be compensated in accordance with the amount they think is appropriate and that this has been carried out and is still carried out in Kano?

No, that's not what I am saying at all. I repeat : If you can find any constitutional provision violated by the Kano law, take Kano state to court and the law you are concerned about will be overturned.

If Ogun state attempts to enforce this crazy law, the state will be challenged in court and elsewhere. Shi kena

PhysicsQED: @ ndu chucks

Can you provide a quote from the section of the constitution of Nigeria which states that the selling or possession of alcoholic beverages by non-Muslims is prohibited in a state where Sharia law is applicable?

BTW, you will not find any constitution in the world which would state that the selling of alcoholic beverages is prohibited or allowed under any circumstance. Neither will not find it in the Nigerian constitution.

What you'll find in Chapter IV of our constitution, is a list of Fundamental rights of Nigerians which cannot be violated by the federal government, state government, or any other entity. Look it up. The list includes:

(1)Right to freedom of movement.
(2)Right to freedom from discrimination.
(3)Right to life.

There are 11 more fundamental rights which I have not listed. Ogun state's action violates the rights of the herdsmen to freedom of movement - its that simple.

Which of the fundamental rights listed in Chapter IV was violated by the Kano law? If you can find any, take Kano state to court and the law you are concerned about will be overturned. You should find it interesting that no one has filed a single lawsuit challenging the Kano law.

Ogun state will be challenged in court and elsewhere upon its first attempt to enforce this sad law/rule.

Dede1: The public have been warned not to seek any legal help from Barr. ndu_chucks mushroom chambers. The litigator in chucks is an embodiment of quack.

Dede1, we are not talking about revising Biafran history, an act filled with subjectivity, embellishment of truths, and attempts to prove that one won a war which was actually lost. What we are talking about is defending the constitution of the Great country Nigeria. How would you like your people who are migrating to Zaria to be told to leave all their tools of trade behind, if they want to be admitted into Zaria? This is not lawyering but common sense, which we all know, is not common with Abriba people.

Katsumoto: If stakeholders are unable to voice their concerns, frustrations and opinions on an anonymous forum such as this and are attacked by party faithful, how then do the party faithful question/challenge the leadership?

The answer to your question is that, the party faithfuls do not question/challenge leadership. The leaders are essentially idols who are worshiped and never truly challenged. My understanding is that, in Lagos, for instance, when Fashola appeared to be promoting programs that are not in Tinubu's interests, he too was threatened with impeachment e.t.c. Truly leaders like Tinubu have played their roles in the SW and its time for them to get out of the way and let the Fashola and Mimikos to take control. I believe Northerners will be more comfortable with these younger politicians who do not have Tinubu's kind of baggage.

[quote author=Dudu_Negro]The constittional review is not on account of fulani. The constitution speaks for all, not fulani. Fulani is a subset of "all". Therefore what is applicable to Obi, an igbo trader in Kano is applicable to Hassan, a fulani herder in Ogun.

In as much as the commercial interest and way of life of Obi in Kano is not violated by a state that says he cannot sell beer in the state serves to protect the traditions and interest of Kano, whatever those interrsts may be.....and the provisions of the constitution are not violated, then it is legitimately applicable to this position where Ogun state has said the traditions and interests of its domain are not in harmony with the transport of goods by fulani and by extension it posesses the sole right to bring about a harmony and order on its land in the best way possible.

What Ogun has done and what Kano has done are rights which the Federal Constitution reserves to the states, so far it does not counter any Federal law to the contrary.[/quote]

PhysicsQED: This says it all right here. End of discussion.

Not so fast.

Bros Dudu_Negro, you, of all people should know by now that joining unrelated issues as a way of muddling up the waters, never works against me. What Kano did was supported by specific constitutional provisions found under Sharia and until our constitution is amended, no court can reverse those actions by Kano.

There is no specific provision which enables Ogun to effectively restrict the freedom of movement of these herdsmen. This law or rule by Ogun will not stand the constitutional test in any court. As law abiding citizens we must respect the law and elect representatives who will modify the constitution to suit our interests.

We have rules against theft, destruction of people's properties, violent crimes, e.t.c why can't Ogun state enforce those laws first? If you find herdsmen who have committed crimes, arrest and prosecute them! This immature and senseless restriction of freedom of movement of innocent Nigerians must be resisted by all means necessary.

BTW hundreds of thousands of herdsmen enter and leave Ogun state yearly without issues, why punish them because of the actions of a handfull (possibly 0.000001%) of these nomads. For every unfortunate victim of a herdsman, you people have killed and maimed thousands of your own state residents. Why don't you put everyone under house arrest because you have armed robbers and other criminal in your state?

[quote author=Dudu_Negro]You cannot cite the constitution as a basis for the defense of fulani rights and then dismiss the same constitution as inadequate to address the ancient customs of fulani. which one u dey?

If everyone would return to their ancient customs fulani would be confined to the hills of futa jallo , their ancestral home. Ogun state is not their ancestral home but it is a market for their goods and a path along yheir transit to the coast. If the rules and regulations iof the market is unbearable for the transients then tell them to ship goods to market through other openly acceptable means like rail, trucks......... Ogun state has responsibility to Ogun citizens, not herders from futa jallo.[/quote]I can most definitely cite the constitution as a basis of defense especially when there is no ambiguity in the cited provision. The dismisal of the same as inadequate to address ancient customs of the herdsmen, as you put it, is also in order. You should know that the constitution is under review as we speak to address some of these issues.

Ogun state cannot impose laws or rules which are unconstitutional, willy nilly.

@Abagworo, I have seen Port Harcourt and Ariara/Enyimba. The road conditions there were deplorable as of 4 weeks ago. Did you or did you not pass through these areas?

[quote author=Dudu_Negro]Even myself, honorable Chief Negro, when I piss off the Igbos I sometimes turn around and appease their bruised senses.

However, for you to carry on with her for as long as you have done , going into maybe the 10th or 11th page now since you started, speaks more against you as a man than it does to portray her in any negative manner. You are respected here as well and you have a credibility to guard......if two or three women get in here and jump on her side they will tear that image to shreds, trust me!

I am not biased.....I present it the way i see it. Do you have the fulani heads yet? .....if no fulani grab a gambari. grab ndu_chucks . [/quote]@bolded, ewo lo kan mi pelu oku Iya Adunni

DANILSA: Barr Ndu_chucks pls translate this;
44. (1) No moveable property or any interest in an immovable property shall be taken possession of compulsorily and no right over or interest in any such property shall be acquired compulsorily in any part of Nigeria except in the manner and for the purposes prescribed by a law that, among other things -
(a) requires the prompt payment of compensation therefore and
(b) gives to any person claiming such compensation a right of access for the determination of his interest in the property and the amount of compensation to a court of law or tribunal or body having jurisdiction in that part of Nigeria.

There is nothing wrong with the constitutional provision above. If this is the provision you are citing to legitimize Ogun state's illegal rule then, using the popular phrase of Offa peopple, yio ba furo e.

We need our own system of government devoid of these borrow borrow oyibo institutions. Sometimes I wish our very own Sergeant Doe would emerge and force the needed restructuring of the government.

[quote author=Dudu_Negro]The movement of property and belongings by persons must be categorized under shipment and haulage. You transport belongings from one location to another for commercial gains. The fulanis are in this case suppliers to a market. Therefore these movements have commercial values. The choice to transport these cattles by foot instead of over the road trucking or rail is the individual supplier choice. Whether transported over road, rail or by foot, the goods will arrive in the market. By making the choice to transport by foot does not in anyway absolve the suppliers of responsibilities towards the states and domains and territories through whih their cargoes are transported.[/quote]This view is insensitive and naive and ignores the fact that these herdsmen are nomads and have been nomads before the creation of Nigeria itself. Their way of life is what you are threatening without remorse. These herdsmen have been transporting their cows and families on foot, before you people knew what commercial trade meant.


Ogun state or any other state has no right to arbitrarily impose a restriction of the freedom of movement of the herdsmen or anyone else.

Identify the laws which are broken by herdsmen who are yet to enter Ogun state and I'll support the prosecution of the herdsmen. Here, you people and Ogun state are imposing a punishment when no law has been broken.

[quote author=Dudu_Negro].......thank you sir! The constiution did not enumerate any rights of movement for cows. The people yes, it is silent on their cows. So how do you expect to move forward where the contention is on the cow and not the persons?[/quote]Sir, if the state restricts your right to move your possessions for no reason whatsoever, and these belongings are essential to your survival, then, by any measure, the state would have violated the said constitutional provision. Ko kwa?

I don't believe this story. Post a link if you want us to believe it.

That's the photograph of a man who is insane and needs the care of psychiatric professionals. If it turns out that the story is true, then the abusers who chose to humiliate the man by forcing him to pose with those vultures need psychiatric help as well. SMH

Iolo: Stop bin silly. Did you see cow mentioned in the constitution? Fulani can come freely to Ogun state but that strips them off the title herdsmen right?

Every governing entity owns the right to protect its citizens.

Fulani + cow = BaNned from Ogun state
Fulani - cow = Not banned.

You don't mean to say the cows are also fulani do you?

Are you a cretin? Moving freely means being able to move with your belongings. If you are allowed to move, but without your belongings, how is that free movement? mumu

Desola: Every citizen and not "citizen and livestock"

Do you want me to sight provisions which prevents the government from restricting the movement of your legitimate goods freely throughout the land? Please understand that I am not from anyone detroying people's properties without facing certain repercussions. Lets enforce the laws which prevent the wanton destruction of properties first before announcing this foolish and illegal rule.

People should also learn to protect their properties with barbed wires and the like. How would you like me and my people to suddenly claim that the Benin/Ore road which you've been using for decades belong to us, hence we'll ban you from driving your cars through the road? ehn, da mi lohun.

For the education of the quack intellectuals on this thread, I submit an excerp from our constitution;

Chapter IV Fundamental Rights

41. (1) Every citizen of Nigeria is entitled to move freely throughout Nigeria and to reside in any part thereof, and no citizen of Nigeria shall be expelled from Nigeria or refused entry thereby or exit therefrom.


If the herdsmen are yet to commit any crime, no one has the right to restrict their free movement throughout Nigeria.

double post

You people missed the memo. The dog ate the report.

hmmmm. una sure say uncle Gbawe no be de real Oju Yobo himself?

naijababe

@Gbawe, if a relative of mine offends you and refuses to apologize and I apologize on the relative's behalf, under what condition would you accept the apology?

You people need to lighten up. One can't even craftfully inject distraction into the thread to ease the tension. BTW what is wrong with Owambe parties? Those are more enjoyable than clubs or bars. oro eyin people yi ti su mi.

The fight for the soul of the SW will be bloody because the players are now intellectual "Adedibus". They are smart, stubborn, and savvy. The downside is that they love money and Owambe parties, and those characteristics will ultimately be their weakest link.

Hear one of their intellectuals: "ati Thursday lati ma mo ti Weekend ba ma dun" translation: na from Thursday we dey take know whether weekend go sweet. If that is not a reference to owambe party, I don't know what is.

Very funny story. Let me return to the "Tinubu Calls For The Abolition Of The Senate" thread abeg.

They may be a far cry from their Western counterparts fighting for the acceptance to breast-feed -- or go topless -- in public, but two girls clobbered a cleric recently in a small town in Iran when he admonished one of them to cover herself more completely.

The cleric said he asked "politely," but the girl's angry reaction and some pugilistic double-teaming with her friend landed the holy man in the hospital, according to an account Monday in the semiofficial Mehr News Agency.

Hojatoleslam Ali Beheshti said he encountered the girls on his way to the mosque in the village of Shahmirzad for noon prayers in late August.

He told one of the girls to cover up, the report said.

"She responded by telling me to cover my eyes, which was very insulting to me," Beheshti said. So he asked her a second time to cover up and also to put a lid on what he felt was verbal abuse.

She hit the man of the cloth, and he hit the ground.

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/09/20/article-2206051-151C55F8000005DC-603_468x316.jpg


"I don't remember what happened after that," he said. "I just felt her kicks and heard her insults."

Beheshti, who emerged from the infirmary three days later, said he did not file a complaint against the girls.

But he doesn't mind the local prosecutor's investigation into the matter either "as long as the case helps the cause of Islamic hijab."

The girls may have put the "jab" into "hijab," but fighting with morality police or private individuals telling women to cover up is rare in small towns. It's more common in larger cities, where women are more likely to take a stand.

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/09/20/world/meast/iran-hijab-fisticuffs/index.html

You intellectuals and elitists should be ashamed of yourselves for promoting the violation of human rights of fellow Nigerians instead of spending energy to prevent same.

This action by Ogun state cannot be enforced and will be resisted by force. The state official who made this announcement is irresponsible and just playing for cheap publicity - I await his enforcement of this rule.

I'll probably work to organize herdsmen to dare authorities to enforce this rule. Nonesense!!!

I actually thought that NLers are not among those Nigerians who survive on N2 per day. What in the world is wrong with relaxing in the evening with a glass of wine or 2 and having your portrait painted? Complainers should find something meaningful to rant about.

No wahala. You people were pi ssing me off with the great points you were making. If many SWesterners have your points of view, then the other regions will need to buckle up.

get a cubicle already

You don't run the economy as you do a political system through a democratic process, olodo

[quote author=Dudu_Negro]What the rest of the country struggle to achieve in strategy, the Northern states working together can accomplish with a single vote.

If we cannot obtain regional partitioning we must work a plan to break the 2/3 monopoly held by Arewa states.[/quote]How do you plan to chieve this impractical and seemingly unachievable feat? You need the 2/3 number to do this. shey you get?

When will you people give up this addiction of yours to tribalism and bigotry? smh

To be honest with you, I would have preferred Tinubu and others, if they are going to be making bold statements, to call for the scrapping of the entire national assembly and offer a realistic and practical framework for a way forward - SNC with dissollution of the union, being off the table, would have impressed me the most.