₦airaland Forum

BitCraftman:
I agree with OP so much. The Muslim core north are very cohesive when it cones to suppressing others around them. Though his estimate of Christians in north is slightly exaggerated.

Can you kindly state what part of the estimate of the Christians in the north is being exaggerated?

jumper524:
I've know you to be a religious bigot and also an agent of destruction. So all those berom and gade muslims boys in plateau and nassarawa wearing jeans does so because of fear of discrimination by the majority christains if I go by your antics right?
People no longer adapt to the lifestyles of communities where they live because of adaptation but rather because of fear going by your antics right?
Leave Nepotism and bigotry you won't listen.

pls ill urge you go into details.
You shouldn't have stated the above if you can't go into details

you had to include my state in your lies? Pls tell me where and when do my people in Abuja keep having violent religious clash with northern muslims?
I hope Niger does not involve in your etc claim as there are large chunk of christian there who still live peacefully.

do you even do statistics atall? You think reputable positions are being given? Permit me to say jos people are also marginalizing the minority people in the state as no muslims has ever govern them or do I call the south east champion of marginalization cos no Igbo Muslim in politics or academia or even clergymen.
Pls be rational in your ascertion.

If you continue in this pace like I told you the other time, you'll definitely discriminate even sizes of shoes

TooMuchStuff:
[b][font=Lucida Sans Unicode]you had to include my state in your lies? Pls tell me where and when do my people in Abuja keep having violent religious clash with northern muslims?

@TooMuchStuff, Thank u very much for telling that deluded soul about the Abuja he is making noise about.

@jumper524,. I know where you are coming from, I was once there. I was once in your position. I once believed a United Arewa with every ethnic group, Muslims and Christians could be possible and fruitful... Only that I have snapped out of that dream long ago. Now I don't even believe in a united Nigeria anymore.

See, for a group of people to be United and progress together, there must be a uniting factor which unites them all and which they all put ahead of all their differences for a common good. This is how nations work.

Now can you tell me what holds your imaginary one Arewa together? Islamic religion? Hausa language? We can't even say religion cos we all know at least 35% of Northern & Middlebelt states are Christians.
If we say Hausa language, Kogi, Benue & Kwara people do not speak or understand Hausa.

Now let's still go ahead with Hausa language and completely ignore Kogi, Benue & Kwara as if they don't exist.

Hausa language would have been a good uniting factor for us in the 16 northern states and FCT who speak Hausa as a 1st & 2nd language, but you see, Hausa fulanis & Kanuris (core northern Muslims) do not see the unity of Hausa language before Religion, rather they see religion first and while this helps them to unite themselves and even further unite with tribes like Nupes & Ebiras who do not even speak Hausa as a 2nd language in their majority, it further alienates we the Christians and it pushes us further and further away.

The Yorubas are of different religion, but they have managed to use a common language as their unity factor and put it ahead of them before religion and that is why a state like Osun which is 50/50 or even likely Muslim majority voted for a Christian-Christian government in the past and the muslims never saw it as an issue to even consider.

So my brother, the more you see me as an ethnic or religious bigot trying to divide your 'phantom United Arewa' the more it is a problem to you.

When Sayawa people of Southern Bauchi had the first ever ethno religious crisis with Hausa-fulanis in 1956 and the early 1980s, then all the rest of us couldn't really understand why.

Then it was Southern Kaduna people who had the next serious ethno-religious crisis with Hausa fulanis in Kafanchan & Zangon Kataf in 1987 & 1992 and the rest of us were still asking why?
Only for the same crisis to visit Jos in 1993, 2001, 2008 & 2010. Then it visited Taraba, Adamawa and even your so called FCT.

The core north and the predominantly Christian Northern minorities of the Middlebelt area are a clash of civilizations, a clash of cultures and a clash of everything. We cannot coexist as a people and make progress. Heck the whole Nigeria is a clash of value systems and ideologies.
Maybe people like you can continue deceiving yourselves in a 'forthcoming peace & progress' but people like me cannot continue towing that pipe-dream.
The signs are clear and the handwriting is on the wall. Northern Nigeria and Nigeria as a whole is a ticking time bomb. If we are wise and sensible, we come together peacefully to restructure this country and decentralize it with the option of seccesion for every region or we continue in stupidity and greed until we all self destruct and bite our fingers in deep regrets in the future.

Kapilta:
Every tribe can't practise one religion even if one can overshadow the others.

Even the jews that have judaism as their ethno religion still have a minority christian and very tiny muslim convert.

And not everyone in North is hausa, there are a whole lota tribes there. The hausas just overshadowed them all.

Who doesn't know these though?

Hausas overshadowed no one in the real sense. Fulanis conquered and are ruling the Hausas and use Islam as a tool of unification.

And for the records, Jewish identity is an ethno-religious one, you cannot be a Muslim or a Christian and still be a Jew, there are identities like that.
You can only be a Christian or Muslim of Jewish ancestry.

darfay:
But why is the North so linguistically diverse. There are supposed to be at 3 ethnic group with at least a million people


Who are the real hsusas if everybody in the north seem to be a northern minority

The north is not diverse except for the area you see encircled in red in the map below.

Hausas, Fulanis, Kanuris, Shuwa Arabs, Nupes, Gbagyis, Igalas, Ebiras, Idomas, Tivs & Borgu/Baribas are all at least 1 million to tens of millions of people each.

The area encircled in red is very diverse because it is a highly mountainous and hilly terrain which acts as a natural defense and isolation between tribes, hence giving room for longer evolution and isolation with this.
In anthropologist evolutions, it is common knowledge that mountainous areas usually tend to have a higher diversities and longer surviving languages because the mountains tend to serve as a great source of refuge to weaker civilizations and barrier to invading forces.

Didn't you see that butt naked tribes were still discovered in Adamawa & even Bauchi just few decades ago? This is because they are on the high mountains and hardly came down.

Most tribes in Plateau, Nasarawa, Southern Kaduna, Taraba, Adamawa, Southern Borno, Gombe, Bauchi are very much related to one another. They just weren't unified by the colonialists cos the colonial masters were interested in a Hausa fulani hegemony over these tribes and uniting them of course will make them stronger and much more resistant to Hausanization and Islamization.

Otherwise, in Plateau for example, the difference between Ngas, Mwaghavul, Mupun, Mushere, Pan, Goemai, Miship,Montol, Pyapun & Tal is just like the difference between Isoko, Uvwie, Okpe, Udu, Agbon, and Ughelli speakers of Urhobo, or betters still Ekiti, Awori, Ijebu, Igbomina, Oyo, Egba of Yoruba.

darfay:
Do they speak a distinct dialect?

No, they don't. They speak the dialect of their locality. The only thing is that some of them still retain and practice ancient Hausa traditional cultures and festivals which the Muslims have stopped.

namiji2598:
this is my local govt u are talking about sir, where I spent more than 20years out of my age

And so? That doesn't mean I should let a false statement slide.
Is there any of the indigenous tribes of Southern Gombe that is 40% muslim? Hell no. So how do you get your figure?
Yes Kaltungo has many muslims. The town is around a 50/50, but the LGA as a whole is predominantly Christian, then by the time u bring in Biliri, Shongom & Balanga which are overwhelmingly Christian, how can u get your 40% Muslim in Southern Gombe? It's ridiculous.

This is the same way Muslims will tell you that Plateau state is 40% Muslim just because of the Muslim settlers in Jos.

This thread was on frontpage yesterday

https://www.nairaland.com/5600225/indigenous-hausa-christians-kano-mark

And from the comments on this thread, it is very very clear that majority of Nigerians especially the Southern Nigerians and shockingly even some Core-northern Hausa fulani muslims do not even know the difference between Hausa Christians and Northern/Middlebelt christians who speak Hausa as 2nd language. I had to correct an uncountable number of people on that thread.
How can Nigeria progress as a nation when people do not even know and understand each other very well?

There is a very big difference between the two for those who don't understand.


FOR STARTERS, If you have a Christian friend from the states of PLATEAU, NASARAWA, FCT, TARABA, ADAMAWA, SOUTHERN KADUNA, SOUTHERN GOMBE, SOUTHERN BORNO, SOUTHERN KEBBI, EASTERN & NORTHERN NIGER, SOUTHERN BAUCHI & SOUTHERN YOBE, he or she is not a Hausa person and can never be a Hausa person no matter how much Hausa he or she speaks or no matter how Hausa their names appear.
These people have their own native languages and cultures which have no relationship whatsoever with Hausa, they only learnt to speak Hausa as a 2nd language.

All the areas mentioned above are predominantly Christian except for Southern Bauchi, Southern Yobe and Niger where the Christians are in a slight minority or a 50/50 indigenously.

So if you have a friend or acquaintance from this area, you can do well to ask him or her what tribe he/she is, rather than ignorantly concluding him to be a Hausa person because he speaks Hausa or has a Hausa name.

But if your friend who is a christian is an indigene of Katsina, Kano, Jigawa, Zamfara, Sokoto or Zaria (northern Kaduna) and Northern Kebbi, then it is most likely that your friend is a real Hausa Christian who has no other ethnicity, culture or language other than Hausa.
(Except in some rare cases when the person may be from these areas and still NOT be a Hausa person, because there are communities of Southern Kaduna and Southern Kebbi tribes that spill over into Northern Kaduna, Kano & Zamfara states.)


Real Hausa Christians are quite few in number but they number at around 2 million or more people and are mostly found in the rural areas of
KATSINA (Kankia, Kafur, Malumfashi, Funtua e.t.c LGAs)
KANO (Sumaila, Bebeji, Garko, Doguwa, Tudunwada LGAs) and
NORTHERN KADUNA/ZARIA (Makarfi, Kudan, Ikara, Zaria & Sabongari LGAs), where they have their largest numbers and fewer numbers in Jigawa, Zamfara & Sokoto states.

These Hausa Christians are almost invisible to the eyes of even their core-northern Hausa-fulani Muslims and neighbouring northern Christians from other tribes because most of them dress like Muslims and use Muslim names in order to avoid discrimination. You can never guess that some of these people are christians unless they tell you themselves (especially in the urban areas). These are some of the reasons why many core-northern muslims even argue of their existence.

These people are the most persecuted minorities in Africa, but in order not to violate certain rules of Nairaland, this thread will not go that direction.

They together with the Fulani & Kanuri Christians of the Core-north (yes you read it right, FULANI CHRISTIANS) have a national association called the MASIHIYAWA COMMUNITY.



The other northern Christians from different tribes who speak Hausa as a 2nd language and most Southern Nigerians tend to address as 'Hausa Christians' run into the tens of millions in population (around 20- 25 million people) and these are the ones who regularly have violent clashes with core-northern muslims in Bauchi, Plateau, Southern Kaduna, FCT, Adamawa, Taraba, Nasarawa, Gombe, Kebbi e.t.c.
This is because most of these tribes never came under Danfodio's jihad, their tribes are predominantly Christian, and they still have a strong sense of ethnic independence unlike the Hausa Christians who see themselves as a helpless minority in the midst of an overwhelmingly Islamic ethnic group.


There is no reputable Hausa Christian in politics or academia for such a population, except Clergymen This is due to the extreme marginalization.

Summary,
ALL HAUSA CHRISTIANS ARE NORTHERN CHRISTIANS BUT MAJORITY (90%) OF NORTHERN CHRISTIANS ARE NOT HAUSA CHRISTIANS.


Lastly, if you are a Southerner and you have a christian friend from Benue, Kogi, Kwara or Nupe (Niger south) and you still think he/she is a Hausa Christian, then you need serious help with your ignorance.
This is because people from these areas have no business or relationship whatsoever with Hausa language. Any of them you see speaking Hausa has traveled to live in the Hausa speaking areas of the north and learnt it there just as you will travel to the north to learn it there.

Thank you for making my point. However they are from sub northern ethnic groups not hausa sub ethnic groups. Hausa is an evolved identity, if you havent gone through that evolution, you dont qualify.

You are not making any sense. Maguzawa are Hausa pagans who converted to Christianity. Chikena.

VaughnSangrey:
Hausa you have to understand is an amalgamation of a set of ethnicities. Including Abagayawas and other people of sahelian stock, Part of the hausa identity was morphing into the hausa culture a great subset of which is the religion. They are simply maguzawas, not hausas.

You are wrong because Maguzawa was a term used to describe a wide range of Hausa people from different Hausa sub-ethnic groups who rejected Islam. They are of one origin or one stock. That is why they don't have a United Homeland in one spot.

There are Maguzawa among Zazzagawa (Zaria indigenes), there are Maguzawa among Kanawa & Katsinawa (Kano, Katsina indingenes).

Those in Kano, Katsina and Zaria do not share direct boundaries with each other.

VaughnSangrey:
Objectively based on what i've seen during recent events and migration patterns. A generous 35% goes to the christians. The local governments they dominate are obviously less populated. All the metropolitan areas are dominated by muslims especially migrants from other northern states.

Go and check the population of LGAs like Zangon Kataf, Kachia, Chikun & Jemaa from 2006 census and come back and tell me that SK is not populated. Who told u that?

Christian were the majority in Kaduna state immediately Katsina was carved out of the state. Political manipulations had to be done to weaken them and higher immigration of Muslims from other states.... Even at that the Christians are still not less than 40%. It is more like a 45-55 to me, but if it is based on indigeneship, Christians are more.

VaughnSangrey:
You contradict yourself. What on gods green earth is "maguzawa hausa"?

Like you or someone else said on this thread, Maguzawa people were a clan of pre-islamic Hausa people who were never Islamized by Danfodio.
If they are not Hausa, what tribe are they and how come they are found in the middle of Hausa land? Hausa is the only language and culture they have.

VaughnSangrey:
LOL By God, You people are so funny. 50% of southern kaduna? sure. 50% of kaduna? You're on crack.

Christians dominate 10 LGAs in Kaduna, Muslims dominate 11 LGAs while 2 (Lere & Kaduna south) are about a 50/50.

So, what percentage do u want us to give oga?

Osaze007:
Overall the fact only 2 Yoruba states have a majority Muslim population out of 8 Yoruba speaking areas already tells you they are a majority christain tribe

Yorubas are like 60-65% christian in my opinion. Although they would have been predominantly Muslim or 50/50 if not for strong evangelism and missionary work.

myobjective:
But I am Yoruba from birth, would you know Yoruba more than I do?

Ondo and Ekiti state is the only Christian majority state in the southwest and even in these state particularly in Ondo state, Muslim is still a majority in the Akoko axis a geopolitical zone with like four local government, there sizeable Muslim in Ondo town and Owo. Muslim will be at least 25% to 30% of Ondo state. The last governor of the state was a Muslim by birth.

Oyo is the most populous state by the indigenous population in the south-west, they are a majority Muslim state 60%

Osun state are majority Muslim state 70%

Ogun 55%

Lagos is hard to call but among Yoruba there, about 45% should be Muslim.

Since around 75% of Kwara population is Yoruba, Muslim should 75% of the Yoruba populprodominatle

Kogi west is predominantly Christians

Why do people usually think that Osun has a higher Muslim percentage than Oyo?

Osun East is overwhelmingly Christian, while the other parts have a significant Christian minority (like 25-30 %).
Osun is more like a 50/50. It is Oyo that clearly has more Muslims.

bashir1451:
This your assertion is not true, there is no Local govt. In the north that is entirely christian even in Taraba and Plateau states.

Lol, Plateau and Taraba are even too far. Let's start with Southern Kaduna & Adamawa.

In the whole of Jaba & Zangon Kataf LGAs in Southern Kaduna, there is no mosque. All Muslims were chased out in 2011 from both LGAs.

In Adamawa north, Michika LGA chased out all Muslims from there. Same with Numan, Lamurde & Guyuk, although few have managed to come back and remain in Numan.

In Bauchi south, all Muslims were chased out of Bogoro LGA and Tafawa balewa town during the crisis between Sayawa and Hausawa.

Most of these religious cleansings happen due to ethnic crisis.

In Plateau state, there are at least 4 LGAs without a mosque and in Taraba state, Muslims are not allowed into Wukari ( the largest city in the state), they are only allowed on the outskirts of the town.

That of Benue cannot even be discussed cos it is 98% Christian as a state. Islam only penetrated 1 LGA in the state which is Agatu LGA and many of them have reverted to Christianity, so Christians are now majority even in Agatu LGA.

Cc darfay

9jakool:
I just want to be clear. Are we talking about the core North or the geopolitical North? Because only geopolitical Northwest is where Hausas are majority and not in geopolitical Northeast and North-central.

Hausa majority/plurality states in the "North": 7
Sokoto, Kebbi, Zamfara, Kano, Jigawa, Katsina and Kaduna (North)

The rest of the "North": 14
Yobe, Borno, Gombe, Bauchi, Benue, Plateau, Nassarawa, Adamawa, Kaduna (South), Taraba, FCT, Kogi, Kwara and Niger.

So tell me how you arrive that the North is predominantly Hausa Muslims?

Alfredo1 was clearly wrong here, thanks for your correction.
The minority tribes in the north clearly outnumber even Hausas & Fulanis combined, let alone Hausa alone.

Besides, even Kebbi state is a 50/50 between Hausas and other tribes. Infact, Hausas will be a minority of u don't add Fulanis to their population.

The entire Kebbi south senatorial district with 7 LGAs is predominantly non Hausa (although Yauri people have been Hausanized). You have many Zarmas and fulani LGAs in the central and northern parts of the state.

myobjective:
I am the guy he quoted and I can easily differentiate between an indigenous Hausa Christians and animist from other Northern minority Christians.

Christians from Northwestern states like Kano, Sokoto, Katsina and Zamfara have these indigenous Hausa Christians/animist population while Hausa speaker from elsewhere in the North will have their ethnic group.

Oooh, never knew it was you. Of course u know the difference. I've been liking your comments.

VaughnSangrey:
Yorubas regardless of religion have their interests aligned. Northern christians are hateful, distrustful and hypocritical. Ultimately they are unreasonably counterintuitive towards consensus northern objectives.

What u have just used in describing northern Christians is what northern Muslims are x10.

alfredo1:
Kano, Katsina, zamfara, jigawa and Sokoto are pure Hausa/Fulani states with a very few indigenous Christians.
Other northwestern states have other minority tribes that are predominantly Christians with fewer Muslims. There are also few Hausa Christians in these states.

Southern Kaduna is predominantly non-hausa who are mostly Christians with few Muslims. There are also Hausa Muslims in southern Kaduna. Kaduna state deputy governor is a Muslim from southern Kaduna.
There are also Hausa Christians in northern Kaduna.

The bottom line is the north is predominantly Hausa Muslims with a sizeable Hausa and non-hausa Christians.

All the Hausas in Southern Kaduna are settlers just like you have in Jos too.
Besides, the deputy governor of Kaduna is not a Hausa woman, she is Nungu by tribe from Gwantu, she is only a muslim.

Sirjamo:
Indigenous Kano Christians! In which of the 44 Local governments? Those are migrants from some middle belt states.

Sumaila, Bebeji, Doguwa, Tudunwada e.t.c have a large indigenous Christian Maguzawa Hausa population. Same in Katsina and Zaria.
These are not Plateau or Southern Kaduna immigrants.

MoIbrahim:
There are Haisa Christian's in the entire northern states including Katsina, Jigawa, Zamfara, Kebbi, Kaduna and Sokoto

Most Christians in Kebbi and Kaduna are not Hausa by tribe, unless you mean northern Kebbi and northern Kaduna.

Akpacha:
Yakubu dogara former speaker is a Christian from bauchi, another guy called Joshua was a senator from gombe.

Bauchi and Gombe Christians are not Hausa by tribe. They are just like Southern Kaduna and Plateau people.
The real Hausa Christians are those who are indigenes of Zaria, Kano & Katsina.

namiji2598:
there is a clear difference between a northern Christian and a hausa Christian.
the former exist but their is nothing like a hausa Christian sir!!!
am a Northern Christian too.....their is no way ur gf can be a hausa Christian, only if her parents are Muslims and she could call converted to Christianity, or she is jus a Northern girl not hausa girl

A northern Christian cannot be making this ignorant BS.....

There are not less than 2million Maguzawa Hausa Christians spread all over Katsina, Zaria and Kano and what are u saying?

Asour:
It's self descriptive.

The Op means Indigenes of Kano who are Hausas and Christians.

I must confess I didn't know that there were Hausas who are indigenes of Kano and also Christians. I knew there were in Kaduna though.

The Maguzawa Hausa Christians in Katsina state even outnumber those of Kano state and Zaria. They are up to 2 million people combined

TooMuchStuff:
Don't know what you problem is but whatever....
My Rev gentleman while in ABU Zaria was a pure Hausa from Kano ...Rev.Prof Richard.

Wusasa area of Zaria is hausa Christian community. Zuru people have sizable Christian hausas.
Oppressing non Muslims is the style of Fulanis whenever power slips into their hands.
Buhari is changing every organ of Federal government with Hausafulani Muslims headship even though Muslims are minority in Nigeria

Zaria, Katsina and Kano have entire LGAs where the majority of the rural population are indigenous Christians.

As for Zuru people of Southern Kebbi, they are not Hausas by ethnicity. Many of their elderly in the rural areas do not even speak Hausa. They are just like Southern Kaduna and Plateau people.

Chartey:
Some people don't understand your point but you're also not being honest. There are pure Hausa people who are Christians. A sizeable indigent population of places like Malumfashi and Mani local govts in Katsina are pure Hausa and Christian. They have no other ethnicity. There are other places like that across the core northwestern Hausa and Fulani States. I'm not talking about people like the Zurus in Kebbi, I'm talking real Hausa. It's something Muslim Hausa people don't like to admit and it's true that they're marginalised in their own states. It's the same way Igbos don't like to admit there are real Igbo Muslims in places like Ebonyi and Enugu.

Thank u for hitting the nail on the head. The amount of ignorance in Nigeria is appaling.
Most people think Southern Kaduna people are the Hausa Christians being talked about. ...

However, Igbo muslims are not as real as Hausa Maguzawa Christians cos Islam never penetrated or held sway in any town, community or part of Igbo land, unlike Hausa land where you have dozens and dozens of villages who are all christians and never accepted Islam at any point in time.

namiji2598:
Stop deceiving ya self, I have stayed in all those places u mentioned, am a southern gombe boy, kaltungo to be precise. base in kano, lived in kaduna south before,
40% of southern gombe are Muslims, 20% of southern kaduna are Muslims, 20% of sabon gari Kano are Muslims

40% of Southern Gombe being muslims is the biggest joke of the century. They are not even up to 20%... Do u think Southern Gombe begins and ends in Kaltungo town? Have u travelled through the interior villages of Southern Gombe and see that majority of them don't have mosques?

People just like to conclude the population of an entire place based on the roadside of the town, forgetting that there are dozens of villages before and after a town.

GuestLog:
They are non indigines of Kano but settlers from various tribes. Understand the topic and get your facts right.

No, those are indigenes of Kano. They are not the Southern Kaduna or Plateau kind of Christians.

Goalnaldo:
Hausa Christians are so nice. I used to have a friend here in ibusa by name Hannah. I think she's from Katsina or Nasarawa. Very nice girl. I still regret not asking her out. They relocated to Warri few years ago.

If she is from Katsina, she is a Hausa Christian, if she is from Nasarawa state, then she is not Hausa, rather she speaks Hausa as a 2nd language.

Neoteny:
You're right

Though Wikipedia says they're sub-hausa..... Whatever that means.

They are not sub Hausa rather they are the real pure Hausas who never intermixed with Fulanis or adopted Islam. They still practice the original ancient Hausa culture which most Islamized Hausas of today have abandoned.

D1zion:
some indigence of kano are Christian but they are very few.

They are not as few as you think. In Kano alone, they are not less than 500k, likewise in Zaria & Katsina too.
You just don't know they are Christians because they answer Hausa Bible or Arabic names and dress no different from the muslims in order to fit into the society.

VaughnSangrey:
There's no such thing as a Hausa Christian. Maybe some northern minority but not Hausas.

This is the most ignorant post anyone could make.
There are not less than 2 million indigenous maguzawa Hausa Christians spread across from Zaria to Kano and Katsina and few in Jigawa & Zamfara.

These Christians have no other language and culture apart from Hausa.