₦airaland Forum

Alabo7978:
So because a white man came and said something, does it mean he is right?
Na the white man born am?
Show me a testament, and you're showing a white man thesis who didn't even know everything about the land they came to exploit.
Mr Man show me a testament.
Same white clans who called ijo
Jo men, and called the Nembe/brass/kula/bille etc brass men.
Without knowing they were plenty several different tribes.

Those same white men counted from one to ten in Igbo, and were correct.

You are also writing your stuff here in the white man's language. You don't see anything wrong with that. But when they accurately tell us, based on their observation, that Bonny is Igbo territory, you want me to discount that, because they didn't claim it was Ijaw territory. You want me to believe Alagoa. Iyasikwa

Alabo7978:
I am not sure you read and understand that document well. Calm down and understand me.
I acknowledge the presence of ibo's, but they were MOSTLY SLAVES.
The document ALSO SAYS THAT BONNY IS CALLED IBANI,UBANI BY THE IBOS[NOTE] BY THE IBOS
BUT BONNY IS CALLED OKOLOMA[NOTE]OKOLOMA BY THE INDIGENES
You should ask yourself three questions here.
1) who are the indigenes?
2) who are the IBO SLAVES?
3) why did they speak OKOLOMA which is the language of the indigenes instead of(IBO, kwam, ATAM and the other languages)
Why?
This is first hand information from the indigenes as shown in that document to be taken to the British royal archives.
I'm sorry, but your white buddy's thesis you showed us was just HIS OBSERVATIONS AND OPINIONS, and other white men will also reference him in their own thesis.
The indigenes know themselves better.

Why are you finding it difficult to also confirm that the ruling house was also Igbo?

So while the kings of Ubani were Igbo speakers, while the slave merchants there were also Igbo speakers, and while the slaves were also Igbo speakers, you are hellbent on trying to confuse people into thinking that it was only the slave class that were Igbos.

How come those that attacked Diette-Spiff were speaking a Brass language, that could be understood 100% by every Igbo speaker?

How come a more ancient memoir written by Crow, that was decades earlier than the one written by Crowther, not critical enough for you?

Ubani and Kalabari traditional institutions are led by Igbo lineages. This cannot happen unless you are trying to say that the Igbos invaded those areas, and established Igbo kingdoms over the non-Igbo natives. We all know this didn't happen.

You still have to scale the hurdle of Igbo traditional leadership in Bonny, and the fact that Crow's memoirs was more ancient than Crowther's writings, hence more reliable as a source of how things were.

Alabo7978:
Shut up, I read that stuff, the writer only flatly said the above kings are ibos.
It didn't show a testimony from the kings saying they were Igbo themselves.
So if I say you're from Ghana, and I publish it, does it mean you're Ghanaian?
Show a personal testimony, I repeat SHOW A PERSONAL TESTIMONY.

But both Captain Crow and Dr. Baikie in their unrelated works, both confirmed the Pepples were of Igbo ancestry.

So you want us to abandon this fact, because it doesn't sit well with your tales

Ekealterego:
If not that I want to add sources that are as neutral as possible in this thread and from writers who explored the Niger first hand.
If I present the works of Beale Africanus Horton, in 1861 here, the Ijo people would have committed suicide since.

Please post materials from Africanus Horton, after all, they have brought in Ajayi Crowther.

Horton's take should be admissible as evidence. It is important

Ekealterego:
Don't commend him. Do you believe that Ijoh can bring anything original.. He stole it!

I uploaded it in a thread, that was just a section of the upload. I uploaded from my own very book.

That was just a section of the book.
Tell him to reference the book.
It was in the same book that King Pepple admitted he was of Igbo descent. in the book Crowther wrote alone, it was also clear in a letter Pepple wrote to the crown in London to bring Christianity. Pepple specifically mandated Crowther in coalition with a Rev at Onitsha (I will remember his name later) to create an Igbo Bible.

Now, why will the king of Bonny request for a church and Bible in Igbo language?

Good work nnaa.
9Pluto I see you also

Alabo7978:
Would you then explain why pepple and crowther maintained that Bonny speaks the Bonny dialect instead of the Igbo dialect or any other dialect.
From your explanations, it entails Bonny was some sort of Lagos in those days with multiple tribes(I agree) but who owned Bonny?
We can't deny the fact that the yorubas owns Lagos, and Yoruba is spoken there even by other people.
This document from crowther and pepple should tell clearly that Bonny were owned by the okoloama people who spoke the okoloama dialect which is THE SAME EXACT LANGUAGE SPOKEN IN CALABARI.
This isn't hard for Bleep sake.
Lagos is what Bonny is in those days, and just as Lagos is owned by the Yoruba people, Bonny was known as okolo-ama by the ORIGINAL INDIGENES.

But the Pepples were of Igbo ancestry. Thankfully both Captain Crow and Dr. Baikie confirmed this fact. Of course, Crowther in his true Yoruba form, possibly chose to hide this fact. Unfortunately, neutral Europeans, in their earlier records, did make it clear that the ruling families of both New Calabar and Ubani, were of Igbo ancestry.

Another fact being that Captain Crow's memoirs' compilation really started in 1790, which is many decades before Crowther was born.

What this means is that Crow's memoirs will always be a superior source of information with regards to the true origins of Bonny

JANK23H:
And you just ranted like what?
Why the obsession with Opobo and Bonny?
What have you done with your land?


On the contrary,if you've had time to go through this thread,you'd see the Igbo are the haughty ones.

Igbos are irrelevant in the scheme of things,and we don't give a flying Bleep about them.There are no Igbo kith and kin in those areas you mentioned.Get you brains out of your asse.s.

But Dakuku Peterside, the most well known Opobo politician has already told Ohanaeze Ndigbo to recognise the Igboness of Opobo people.

We, Igbos are now waking up to our responsibilities, following Dakuku's plea

SlayerForever:
Yes, Ama is common with Ijaw town names.

I know AMA exists in Ijoid town names in Rivers and Bayelsa. I now need someone to confirm whether such town names also exist in Ijaw areas of Delta, Edo or Ondo state. I suspect AMA could be a shared word between Igbos and Ijaws.

JANK23H:
Check the meaning of Ama and Amakiri

The dictionary is not really a definitive proof.

In the Igbo dictionary, you may even see TEBULU, as meaning TABLE in English.

I need to know whether there are Ijaw towns that exist outside Rivers and Bayelsa state, with AMA as a part of their names.

It will definitely prove that AMA is a word Igbos share with Ijaws.

JANK23H:
Ama mean the same thing in all Ijaw dialects.

Are there Ijaw towns outside Rivers and Bayelsa state with AMA attached? Ama could be a word that means the same thing in both Igbo and Ijaw, but to confirm it, I need to know whether there are other Ijaw towns outside Rivers and Bayelsa state with AMA, as a part of the town name.

OGBE seems to means the same thing in both Igbo and Idu (Edo)

9Pluto:
This is an interesting submission. Now does Ama mean the same thing to the ijaw in Delta, Edo and Ondo or is it only in Rivers State?

We may soon need the support of an igbo-speaking ijaw and an Ijaw-speaking igbo.


Please, guys let us try to keep the conversation as civil as possible.

You have asked a very critical question. Does AMA mean the town of to the Ijaw in Delta, Edo and Ondo?

Because AMA means compound or territory in Igbo language

EzeCanada:
How about Waikirike i.e Nwa Ikirike ( There is a highland tribe known as ikirike in Enuugwu)

I know Ikirike village. It is on a hill. Very close to where public executions used to take place in Enugu.

ChinenyeN:
Then I implore you to indulge yourself in reading the bibliographies of these text to find the references you are looking for.

You are the person to provide these bibliographies, after all you have access to these modern books by Alagoa and the rest.

We also look forward to any pre-colonial documents from the Portuguese, Spanish or any neutral European operators in Ubani, that you may be basing your assertions on.

In this forum, I was able to show translated snippets from Portuguese explorers, written about 550 years ago, to prove that the NRI kingdom was the cultural and religious overlord of Benin empire.

All you need to do, is to provide a few pre colonial documents to back your assertions

Ekealterego:
These are very recent publications.

Where are the historical references?

What does the phrase mean?

Who established this link ethnographically first?

All our reference here came from 1800s or before 1906.
Algoa's reference from 1970 just at the end of the war is laughable for obvious reasons that we know.
Yeah, you have other references from 2011... Do you have older references? before 1910 at least.

Immediately I saw Alagoa and 1980, I knew it was gonna be ajambene

DitariDisciple2:
Professor Ebi
Alagoa one of the greatest and well known Nigeria wide,
Ijaw writer, is from Nembe and they use Amayanabo.

Diete Spiff Brass use Amayanabo.
He was
First Governor of Rivers State.
Diete spiff that sent all Igbos out of PH after the Biafra war and declared their properties abandoned properties, carry all their houses dash Ijaw and Ikwerre people.
Go and tell him he is Ibo.

He is the present Amayanabo of Twon Brass clan.
Bayelsa State.

Some Igbo speaking Brass youths chased him away from his palace a few months ago, and raped his ugly daughters while looting his stolen wealth.

He may have returned, but he could be attacked by his Igbo speaking subjects in the near future.

If some of his people are Igbo-speaking, I'm not surprised he uses Amanyanabo.

Brass and Nembe are not core Ijaw territories, so the title of their traditional rulers cannot be a definitive proof

ChinenyeN:
No, this would be incorrect. It's actually well established that the Amanyanabo system in Bonny comes from Kalabari. Okrika and Bonny adopted the Amanyanabo system by the 17th century. It is an Ijaw expression, not Igbo.

While I am not really an expert in Kalabari traditional institutions, you didn't really provide any proof that Bonny adopted the Amanyanabo title from Kalabaris and Okrika.

Also if I am not mistaking, I believe both Kalabari and Okrika have ancient Igbo links. In fact, it's clearly documented that the Kalabari ruling family was of Igbo ancestry.

Maybe these Igbo-influenced areas had two kings initially, which Bonny also adopted, hence the AMANYANABO title. But they all now have one king.

I was reliably informed that the Ijaw word for king is PERE.

More research needs to be carried out, especially to determine the veracity of the ancient Igbo links with Kalabari and Okrika

Ekealterego:
For the Bretches, this is why archaeology and Museums are important.
See this mask. I believe it's Igbo-Ukwu or around those areas. See this Igbo art dated by scientists to the 9th century (1100 years ago). This is the same facial marks for those set of Igbo men.

You are correct.

That's a pendant worn by ancient Eze Nris around their necks. The ICHI marks are so obvious.

The actual cutting is carried out by Umudioka people, as Nri people were not meant to touch blood, so they can remain sacred. But the sanctification of the initiate must be carried out by an NRI priest.

Th Umudioka people ( of the MGBURU-ICHI fame)were collectively a major pillar of the NRI civilization, along with the Awka blacksmiths.

Back in those days, when an NRI priestly party was traveling to any part of Igboland for any priestly duties, there will be Umudioka facial cutters and Awka blacksmiths in the party.
The Umudiokans carried out the actual facial cuttings for the ICHI, while the Awka blacksmiths produced the NGWU AGILIGA for the Nze and Ozo title takers, all of whom were ordained by the NRI priests

Ekealterego:
The described Bretches in my thread Empire of the Igbos.

The only living "Bretche" today celebrated his 100th birthdaz some weeks ago
The first picture is a Bretche living in Sierra Leone in 1850s.
The Bretches were responsible for most of the ship revolts during the slave trades because they were already titled and rich.

Thanks for sharing this. My grandfather and his elder brother were MGBURU-ICHIs.

It is a part of the Ikenga cult and in the past, to be an Eze NRI or or an Ogiso, or an Attah or an ancient Benin oba, the person must be an MGBURU-ICHI.
Eze NRI was their oga kpatakpata

By the way, the BRECHEs are the MGBURU-ICHIs. They are a class of titled Igbos, usually from the Nri sphere of influence.

They had elaborate facial scarifications. Olaudah Equiano's father was an MGBURU-ICHI, and they were highly respected around this period.

Usually, when Igbo towns were at war, it was the MGBURU-ICHIs that mediated and made peace in those towns.

Eze Nri was the head of the MGBURU-ICHIs all over Igboland and Igodomigodo and elsewhere

cc:
9Pluto
Igboid
Slayerforever
Eastlink

Nbotee:
Why is Ojukwu's head transparent?

Because he had nothing to hide

I think it will make sense if dealers in mkpulummili will introduce it to the Fulani-herder communities.

It is obvious DSS brought it into Igboland. Igbo dealers can ensure it gets to the Fulani communities throughout the length and breadth of Nigeria

Ruggman:
The game is already on, many clandestine and secret meetings are going on to form alliances and choose candidates for the presidency come 2023.
We on this wonderful forum must not be left behind because I believe that nairaland has become so influencial and can contribute meaningfully to the search for a better and More credible candidate for the presidency.
So make your choice of 5 candidates / vice.
MINE are
1). Dr Peter Obi / Aminu Tambuwal
2) Dr George Moughalu / Professor Zulum
3) Dr Ogbonnaya Onuh / Alh. Mai Bunu
4) Ike Ekweremadu /. Bukola Saraki
5) Dr Orji Uzor Kalu / Yahaya bello
This is my choice in this order, go ahead and make your own

FIrst of all Peter Obi is not a Dr. unless he got an honorary Phd from somewhere.

2 should be Prof Kingsley Muoghalu and Prof Zulum

Personally, I prefer 2, followed by 4

whatdoIknow:
Why so much delay in issuing international passport to Nigerians.
I have been told since three months and still counting that immigration offices across Nigeria are short of booklets so I have to continue to wait till only God knows when.
Why so much embargo on people's career in this country.
Mr Rauf Aregbesola, the interior minister should please explain to us what is happening in his ministry.

You have to know this is the level of competence of those that ganged up to remove GEJ from office.

They don't care about your predicament. All they want is just to occupy Aso Rock.

kinibigdeal:
GTB still remain one of the formidable bank in Nigeria. Despite access bank acquiring of Diamond bank, they are yet to match GTB. Agbaje did a very good job at GTB. GTB actually opened the eyes of many banks in Nigeria

I think you are totally missing the point. And I fear this your perspective was exactly what Agbaje had, that gave him a false sense of security to the extent that he has now made GTB a debtor to Innoson.

In business, the customer is always right. It is a mantra. Of course we know the customer is not always right, but an effective CEO of GTB would have nipped this problem in the bud right from the onset, by making the customer feel appreciated and pampered. Other customers are looking on.

The money that they now have to pay Innoson in compensation destroys whatever positive innovations, Agbaje may have brought to GTB

Asour:
He (Segun Agbaje) is no longer the MD.

GTB should really approach Innocent Chukwuma for a proper out of court settlement. Any direct or indirect shares that Segun Agbaje has in GTB should be forfeited. All his lackeys in the current board should be shown the door, and a new management team put in place to carry out the negotiations with Innoson.

Segun Agbaje ran this bank aground, by picking an unnecessary fight with Innoson, and on top of that, using their links with the seat of power, to hound Innoson.

But I think it can be remedied, if the current GTB board make the right wise conciliatory moves

GTB should settle out of court. But the CEO that brought this bank to this unnecessary awful state should be sacked

SlayerForever:
DSS working overnight shifts.

Just yesterday, I rightly pointed out that this is a Fulani-run DSS operation to bring in Nigeria into the Ambazonian conflict.

Nigeria and Cameroon are under immense diplomatic pressure, with threats of being labelled sponsors of terrorism, due to IPOB and Ambazonian activities.

Nigeria and Cameroon now want to frame up the Ambazonians. Already Nigeria's attempt at tarnishing the image of IPOB has not worked, and in fact, the international community seem to be gravitating towards the IPOB stance.

Their next game plan is to try and rope in Ambazonians, and hope that the weaker Ambazonian propaganda structure will crumble.

It is a good thing Choo Ayaba has debunked this allegation swiftly.

Gbagura:
Lol


Dont remind us, we know ordinary malt and 'figo' can buy votes in Anambra, home of zillionaires.

A state where N5,000 and N10,000 could not buy a single vote for APC. Anambra state is dope.

In your brown roof state, Tinubu bought your brains with just one spoon of groundnut oil

This has the signature of DSS. Yet another attempt at giving a dog a bad name before hanging it.

Nigerian terrorist government is under pressure internationally. These pressure points are contributed by IPOB and Ambazonian diplomatic activities, so this is obviously an attempt by Nigeria's Fulani-run DSS to implicate the Ambazonians, to justify incursions into Ambazonian territory by both the Nigerian and Cameroonian government.

This DSS plan is obviously not working in Igboland, so they now want to try it with Ambazonians, hoping the world community will be hoodwinked into thinking this attack was actually carried out by Ambazonians.

This was majorly why ESN was born.

RIP to my fellow Igbo brothers and sisters. Umu Asa na Ndoki ndonu.

Wike must pay in blood for the massacre of our Ndoki and Asa brothers.

But he described it as a massacre with no bodies.

This guy can lie