₦airaland Forum

I could not get this issue out of my mind. President of the federal court of appeals, Justice Ayo Salami, not only turned down what is supposed to be a promotion to the Supreme Court of Nigeria, but actually went to court to reject the promotion in strongest terms.

That got me thinking.

I always believe that when an honest Nigerian shows up for duty, we may not recognize him/her until it is too late.

Is the good judge really as honest as I hope, or is he part of what I suspect is a sinister plot to pervert justice?

Methinks that someone is trying to remove him from that strategic position. He on the other hand, is resisting for either professional or dubious reasons, because he may ( ) also be hoping to be "settled" by politicians contesting the results of the April poll.

I don't know what to think. One thing is clear enough for me; the chief justice of the supreme court of Nigeria should not have elevated a man without first seeking his consent. Abi na by force again?

We Nigerians seem too distracted to notice when someone actually steals the entire foundation of the country.

I know we've passed too many shock stages, but believe me a lot can still go worse. I don talk my own. 

Why won't he be better off in Nigeria? Which Nigerian has enjoyed his "luck"?
Problem with the man is that he sees the world as a PERSONAL zero sum game where everything must be gained or lost by Obasanjo.

I suspect an oduduwa republic will never accommodate folks like him.
Meanwhile Nigerian press love him. .

Posted by: ChinenyeN

On the whole Ijo/MEND/Igbo topic, I read a reference to Igbo suppliers as middlemen. Which kind middlemen? Was it not Abala that was manufacturing the weapons MEND and other militant groups are/were armed with? That aside, I'm not so sure how Igbo would fare, in this day and age, in a war against Ijo, especially considering how MEND is a rather cohesive, stable, well-armed and well organized unit, and how such a structure is currently not present among the Igbo (unless there is something I don't know).

Yes! There is a HELL OF A LOT you don't know. For instance, we've dropped the issue and moved on to Fulani cattlemen issue. 

@ chyz,

So yes, Christianity is not an excuse not to fight for your survival. In fact I would say it is an excuse used by weaklings sometimes.
I believe you must be alive first to go to church.  

If I were to encounter Fulani herdmen in my farm, I would first organize a massive statewide campaign against them  before descending on the ones trespassing my farmland.

Posted by: Chyz*

This is to clarify things. We were sought for by the Ijaw's for help after yaradua gave the deadline of unleashing the full might of the law on the militants. The deadline I believe was October 4th. When that day did come most militants(MEND) gave up and gave up their arms at "accepted amnesty". If they would have refused they likely would have been destroyed.

Bros Chyz I'm sorry I snapped earlier. This issue is pretty much simple to understand. I'm now convinced that the guy I was arguing has dubious intentions.
Thanks for the post.

@my Igbo brothers,

I had to clarify this issue because I've run into some Ijaw folks who thought they've enslaved us in the past and can "deal with us" today. Let everybody know his place. That's all. We are neighbors and will continue to be provided no one starts being st00pid.
If we are like the Fulani, I don't think anyone would make such incendiary comment.

I rest it now.  

Posted by: eku_bear

So your hypothesis is that

   * with Igbo support, MEND can also (C) upgrade from instead a terrorist group to a force that can legitimately challenge Nigeria's territorial integrity?
   * if Igbo were happy in Nigeria, (A) and (B) would be impossible for MEND to do, and thus MEND becomes irrelevant?
   * the North considered Igbo presidency to pacify Igbo, and thus cause MEND to become irrelevant?


Just trying to understand your hypotheses first, before I consider how plausible they are.

The MEND problem is what the Igbo would call "a tse tse fly perched on a man's scrotum".
If you kill it violently, you can break your balls. If you leave it, it will continue biting you.

To answer your question, Nigeria would have loved to conduct a FULL MILITARY campaign against MEND, and flush them out. Nigeria couldn't do that because of the point I made.
It is one thing to blow up pipelines. It is another thing altogether to face the FULL MIGHT of the Nigerian military.

You can't do that if your closest neighbor who is a big resourceful tribe is not on your side.

Must I be this explicit for you to understand, or are you feigning ignorance for mischievous reasons?

Posted by: ezeagu

The Ijaw are not going to war against the Igbo so everyone should just shut up.

Of course they won't, unless they are fools. One of them made a st00pid statement in another thread and I cited that as an example of how an armed ant can suddenly assume that he can "deal with" a self-avowed pacific lion. The lion can simply disavow his non-violence, and what you get is an armed ant and an armed lion.

That is why we are having this conversation.  

Posted by: eku_bear

So sure, it makes sense that they'd be afraid of more allies for the militants. By this statement of yours is extremely strong. How exactly are the Igbo what is preventing MEND from being eliminated?

This your bolded statement tells me that you really don't know Nigeria. I'm disappointed I must say.

Look, when you want to assess a military challenge, you start with calculation of possible alignment of forces, real and potential. The truth is that Igbo are not happy in Nigeria, and may want out. The Ijaw are also not happy and may want out too. So, can't you see a common goal? Ijaw did not support the Igbo in Biafra and they remember that. They are also not sure of Igbo role.

If two groups that are neighbors share common goal, what do you think would happen if either is pushed too hard?
The prospect of Igbo joining MEND in large numbers is real, and that is what aboki is calculating.

You have to believe that if Igbo is happy in Nigeria, THERE WOULD BE NO MEND. Simple.

That is why the north seriously considered an Igbo president of Nigeria.
MEND pretty much knows this fact. That is part why they accepted amnesty without getting what they were fighting for.

You sound as if they won. hahaha. They didn't win anything. Status quo remains.

Posted by: eku_bear

[b]Again, I'm not at all impressed by #s. [/b]The progression of time and history has made #s less important in warfare.

Anyway, it is what it is. I've said my piece. That is my analysis of the situation. You are welcome to have your own.

You better be because when EVERYBODY is EQUALLY ARMED then numbers can help.
Also, I hope you don't believe that they are better military strategists than Igbo (please speak for your Yoruba people).
And they are BY NO MEANS more militant than Igbo.

Our own is just don't provoke us and give us a reason to fight. We are militant and highly resourceful.  

Posted by: eku_bear

2+ million barrels a day of oil, $200 million in street value per day. No force in Nigeria can defeat them militarily if they are able to use this resource fully to prosecute a war. Not even Yoruba, Igbo and Hausa combined. With that much money, 1 million people can defeat and enslave 100 million.

And this is the most ridiculous statement you've ever made on nairaland! 
So if that is true, why did MEND accept amnesty and disarm?
Ol'boy if they are that strong, they would NEVER have accepted anything.
I will say this again, MEND is only "powerful" because aboki is concerned about Igbo involvement. If aboki is assured now that Igbo won't get involved, MEND will cease to exist OVERNIGHT.  

I keep saying aboki because they are the ones more eager to stop secession of groups with oil.
Igbo man is only interested if you threaten our lives. If they try it, we would not only defeat them, but ensure they are sent packing from our backyard.

Posted by: eku_bear

That is just not how warfare works, man. Check the income of those ND states. Bayelsa for example earned sh1tloads of money. Absolutely none of it was spent on the ground. Instead it was carted off overseas and/or spent it on arming the militants.

The Ijaw man probably has the 2nd best military force in Nigeria right now, after the Northerners. Warfare is not about which group has the largest number. That Igbo outnumber the Ijaw does not mean they cannot make you their slaves, if it ever comes down to warfare.

If things were just about #s, then Israel wouldn't be the dominant military force in the middle east, Rwanda wouldn't be dominating its neighbors, the white SAs wouldn't have dominated the black SAs, etc, Pizarro wouldn't have conquered the entire Inca empire with 200 men, the Mongols wouldn't have conquered China and most of Asia  Undecided

2+ million barrels a day of oil, $200 million in street value per day. No force in Nigeria can defeat them militarily if they are able to use this resource fully to prosecute a war. Not even Yoruba, Igbo and Hausa combined. With that much money, 1 million people can defeat and enslave 100 million.

I wish to quickly clarify that the guy who made the claim meant during the slave trade era when Aro slave merchants were selling captured slaves to Ijaw middlemen. That is settled now.

About getting armed today, ol'boy, do you think only Ijaw can access HUGE sums of money for arms?
YOU MAKE ME LAUGH!

Do you know that Igbos are the largest Nigerian diaspora, and remit about 5 - 10 BILLION dollars to Nigeria YEARLY?

Do you know that there are MANY rich Igbo men involved in arms trade?
Do you know that Igbo traders actually arm MEND?

Ol'boy, you don't know the Igbo man at all.

If Ijaw picks a fight with us, even that Oil in his land will not be sold for arms, because we will ensure they never accessed it.
How can they stop MILLIONS of Igbo diaspora?

This your statement proves my point (and yours), that being peaceful leads ants to think they are lions over you. I swear.

LOL.

@Chyz

I am a Christian - a JUDEO-CHRISTIAN; i.e, the type Americans practice. If you want to be secure and live in peace, you must be better armed than your enemies. Simple.

Humans are animals with pretenses of decorum.
Remove the facade, and all you are left with is an ordinary animal. So, how can you expect an animal to understand that you are being peaceful because of God? He can't understand that. EVER.

So, be armed and be prepared to fight to death ALWAYS, else, humans would turn you into a subhuman.

So, there is no need to attack the whole Christian religion because some animals are running around killing women and children and demanding respect in return. All you need is make sure they never escaped. That's all.

Posted by: eku_bear

The only way to gain respect in Nigeria is to kill liberally. If you are gentle and non-violent, you will not be respected.

Nigerians respect armed robbers, policemen, military, Fulani marauders, rampaging almajiris, and Niger Delta militants. The OPC is respected as well, since they are not afraid of violence and will kill if necessary.

I'm not saying that Yoruba people should necessarily become more violent, but they need to study how Nigeria works a bit better and learn from it.

EDIT: I don't mean "respect" necessarily in the sense, "Hey, I want to become like you." But more like, "This is a force that I'd better not fck around with."

I have to accept you are 100% correct. To illustrate further, I've seen some Ijaw on this forum boasting about how they "dealt with Igbo" or how they enslaved some Igbo clans in the past.  When I read those things I started wondering whether our good nature and respect for minorities has been misunderstood for weakness. I had to ask one of them whether he believed that his people can defeat Igbo in a war, he didn't respond.

But attitudes like that proves your point. He obviously thought that because of MEND, the Ijaw is now invincible. I reminded him that MEND lasted at all because aboki was concerned about possible Igbo involvement. Then I warned him that if Ijaw EVER picks a fight with Igbo, we would do so much killing among them that they will effectively cease to exist in Eastern Nigeria.  

So yes, being peaceful in Nigeria doesn't make sense. It lionizes otherwise ordinary ants.

Posted by: sbeezy8

haha if not biafra there would be fulani-igbo-hausa-calabar.

infact it can still happen very wel

My friend you must really be going crazy because your posts are making less and less sense. Abi Becomerich bite you?
lmao.

Posted by: naijaking1

I have said that we all work and labor for Fulanis!
Is it true that there is a law granting them right to graze their cows anywhere in Nigeria? If so, then you'll understand why they act as if Benue, Plateau, Imo, Oyo, and Cross River states belong to them.

I am not aware of any such law. Most laws follow some form of logic. Does it make any sense to grant a cattle herder unfettered access to all lands in Nigeria? NO.

Let them go to Obasanjo farms and graze there, lets see how they fare!

I also notice that the Fulani cattle men always return FAR MORE violence than was actually meted out to them.

You kill a few of their cows, they come back to raze down hundreds of houses and kill hundreds of people.
So, you see! These are not the type of people to accommodate in a civilized discourse, or restrained response.
So, before asserting your property rights by killing trespassing cows, better be ready to kill any Fulani in the entire state.

By the time you do this, I assure you they would NEVER repeat it.

The truth is that nature abhors vacuums. Any sign that nobody is a efficient or effective occupier of a piece of land will always attract trespassers. In America (I don't know about Nigeria), there is a law which entitles a person to occupy and consummate an empty land or property. By that I mean a land not fenced or in effective use -a house or a farm abandoned for 5 years or so. You can simply file a "quiet title" suit in court and be granted a legal right to start living there without paying a dime, minus property tax of course.

So, in Nigeria you have the Fulani cattle men roaming both used and unused land as if they are the same, going through wilderness and farms the same way. And you have airheads here trying to justify it with dubious logic.

One of the things I like about white people is that all their actions are thoughtful (good or bad). For instance, you don't see a white farmer who is not heavily armed. They all maintain weapons rooms (armory) and have men paid to secure the farm. These are large farmers of course, but even local farmers can organize to arm themselves to the teeth and wait for the next band of desert thieves to show up with their cattle.

Until someone actually teaches these Fulani cattle men a bitter lesson, they will continue this.

Hoping on Nigerian government to solve this is like waiting for the AIDS cure.

Posted by: Andre Uweh

@Uchenna: Did he get his calculations right or wrong?. For example, he calculated that Biafra will not win, loss of lives and properties.
He was older than all the Easterners involved in decision making at that time. So he was not coward enough not to tell the truth.
Having said that, he did not join the enemies to fight against Biafra. So in my own words, he wasn't a traitor.

Here's my take on Zik and Biafra/Nigeria; I would say he was powerless and a little irresponsible; not treacherous.

I say that he was irresponsible because at the end of the day, Biafra was his home, nobody was targeting him, and the majority of those dying were innocent women and children. He should NEVER have crossed over to Nigeria under any circumstance. On principle. That is what an icon would have done.
To be honest, Zik was not that type of a leader. I excused Ojukwu going on exile because, he was basically bundled onto that plane by Biafran high command who wanted to deny the enemy the joy of capturing or killing their leader.
Capturing or killing Ojukwu would have dealt an unimaginable blow to Igbo psyche and possibly make us slaves permanently in Nigeria. Firstly, the verbal no victor no vanquished happened because Ojukwu did not die, and Nigeria wanted to avoid a possible resurgent Biafran guerrilla campaign which could have dragged out the war. So, I applaud the wisdom behind that.

Nobody was pursuing Zik. He should have stayed in Biafra till the bitter end, like most top Igbo leaders of the 60s.

Well, I think that Enugu is doing well. It is not an oil state,yet I don't see the state in the top list of top debtors.

Anambra is not an oil producing state and has done some serious road works, yet remain among the lowest debtors.

Methinks that debt is a thing of principle. You either want it or you don't, depending on your goal and character.

At least it is good to know when these governors sold us all into slavery.
Watch out and check your state on the list of foreign debtors.

[size=16pt]Lagos, Kaduna, Cross River top foreign debt list[/size]

Lagos, Kaduna and Cross River states are top on the list of the states of the federation that are indebted to foreign institutions.

According to the list, obtained from the Debt Management Office in Abuja on Thursday, the three states owe $612.64m (91.90bn) out of a total $1.84bn foreign debt of the 36 states of the federation, including the Federal Capital Territory.

The debt of the three states represents 33.26 per cent of the foreign debt owed by the 36 states and the FCT. The three states’ foreign debt liability also represents 13.51 per cent of the nation’s total foreign debt.

Lagos State, according to the breakdown, is the most indebted state of the federation. With a total foreign debt of $369.20m (N55.38bn), Lagos holds about 20 per cent of the country’s sub-national foreign debt stock.

The state’s foreign debt stock also represents 8.14 per cent of the country’s total foreign debt stock, according to the list.

Details of the facilities showed that the foreign debt liability of Lagos State had been ballooned by a World Bank facility obtained with the support of the Federal Government for its urban renewal programme about four years ago.

Kaduna State followed on the list, with a liability of $143.45m (N21.52bn), while Cross River had $99.99m (N15bn).

Other states in the top league include Oyo, $88.16m; Ogun, $73.72m; Katsina, $72.72m; Osun, 59.81m; and Akwa Ibom, $59.48m.

The least indebted states were Borno, $13.58m; Delta, $16.6m; Anambra, $17.9m; Taraba, $19.07m; and Benue, $23.66m.

The 36 states and the FCT account for 40.62 per cent of the nation’s total foreign debt liability.

Some states have also resorted to internal borrowing through the capital and money markets to shore up what they receive from the federation account. But the DMO has not yet captured the total internal indebtedness of the states.

Worried by the possibility of sub-national debts growing beyond a sustainable level, the debt office recently issued guidelines for borrowing by the 36 states of the federation and the FCT.

One of such requirements is obtaining approval from their legislative arms of government. The Office has also helped some states to establish their debt management units.

The Director-General, DMO, Dr. Abraham Nwankwo, recently put Nigeria’s total debt stock, as at December 31, 2010, at $34.6bn (about N5.19tn).

Out of this, a total of N4.5tn or 86.71 per cent was raised from within the shores of the nation.

Much of the domestic debt was incurred through the Federal Government of Nigeria Bonds with maturity dates ranging from three to 20 years, issued by DMO on a monthly basis.

Meanwhile, activities of the agency for the month of January showed that it raised a total of N60bn for the Federal Government through the issuance of FGN bonds.

Through the FGN bond with a maturity date of February 19, 2013, it raised a total of N30bn. The bond has a 10.4 per cent rate.

Through another bond with a maturity date of April 23, 2015, it also raised a total of N30bn. This bond, with a longer maturity period, attracts an interest rate of 11.13 per cent.

http://www.punchng.com/Articl.aspx?theartic=Art20110211044590

I was hoping your post won't be too long. . 

Anyway, you are still basing your argument on a lot of "if"s.
One thing I would never accept is that the northern counter-coup plotters were even remotely interested in being seen as fair or nationalistic.
There is only one reason they didn't march on Enugu, and that is because they had lost the element of surprise (which frankly could only have taken them so far anyway), they would have lost the battle for Enugu if they tried, because the East was bitter and hurt and was spoiling for a fight, which is why Aburi was even possible.

For a long period after that coup, Ojukwu refused any contact or talks with the counter coup plotters until they produced Ironsi, dead or alive.

@PhysicsMHD

Nzeogwu in Prison

For his role in Nigeria's first military coup, Nzeogwu was imprisoned by the military regime of Major-General Aguiyi-Ironsi at the notorious Kiri-Kiri maximum security prison in Lagos.  His co-conspirators were also initially detained there but many of them were later moved to prisons in the Eastern Region: including Majors Ifeajuna (Uyo prison), Ademoyega, Onwuatuegwu (Enugu prison), Captain Gbulie (Abakaliki prison), Major Chukwuka, Captain Nwobosi (both Owerri prison).  Nzeogwu was the only officer among the plotters that was moved to Aba prison.  After Ironsi was overthrown in July 1966, Nzeogwu remained in prison until he was released in March 1967 by the Eastern Region's Military Governor Lt-Colonel Ojukwu.  
http://www.kwenu.com/publications/siollun/2009/who_killed_major_nzeogwu.htm

So how couldn't Ojukwu have used these guys if necessary?

@PhysicsMHD

Now that you raised the point, where was Nzeogwu in July 1966?

How did the counter-coup plotters allow him to be transferred to the east?

Answer these questions.

Posted by: PhysicsMHD

Going for weapons? He could have done the same thing at Enugu but he left because Enugu was at risk and he was to be killed (as military governor) just like Fajuyi was if the other coup plotters went to the East and rallied the Northern soldiers there to take Enugu. A sensible decision on Ojukwu's part to flee, but he had a luxury some other people in the West didn't have courtesy of the coup being stopped at Enugu. Had the northern soldiers succeeded in actualizing Murtala's instructions to complete the coup, Ojukwu would have been a dead man, and the East open for play. That's what a fair commentator would have realized (what you refused to acknowledge).

I don't see how its unfair to state that but it's somehow fair to imply that Ogundipe just ran for the border, which is simply false.

And Nzeogwu was jailed in Kiri-kiri, Lagos and the January plotters were somewhat spread around the country.

The coup failed at Enugu. BOTTOMLINE.

Wise counsel on Murtala to stay away from Enugu also helped save the July coup.
You talk as if you don't know Ojukwu.
Murtala Muhammed was one of the worst military men of that time. He was not Ojukwu's match and would have certainly been defeated by Ojukwu in Enugu.

Those who knew better sitting in Lagos advised him.

Posted by: alex101

Bia Onlytruth!
so you have been to the town of my ancestors? The bolded is my home town. Damn, you don go around Alaigbo. Well, i hope they treated you well!

Nna hapu kene!  Anyi etiligo obodo Igbo ofuma ofuma. 

That town is home to one of my best friends EVER.  I used to hit there during the "mass return" football games, and boy did we make hay! chai! 

Posted by: TewMuch

You guys are saying a lot here oooh! Its too much abeg. The insults are not productive. Let's get back to the facts

Hmm. .  I never thought I could see you get nauseated by junks jumping out of your brothers' foul mouths.

Okay o.

Posted by: PhysicsMHD

Actually, [b]Ojukwu fled to Onitsha and stockpiled arms [/b]after the July 1966 counter coup. Murtala was prevented from "marching on the East" by more cautious coup members when they learned that the July counter coup had failed in the East. Had he attacked early on, the coup might have been successful in the East.

The Westerners did not really have such an option of building up a resistance since the counter coup was immediately successful in the West and had its genesis in the West. It's pretty simple, from my point of view, how their hands were tied.

Do you see any contradictions in the bolded?
A fair commentator would say "Ojukwu rushed to Onitsha, or Ojukwu went to Ontisha". He has going for weapons wasn't he? Did you see him near any NNS or SEME border? NO.

And let me help complete the logic you left out.

The ENTIRE coup could have started failing in the East for real, hence the caution. Ojukwu could have rallied remnants of the January plotters (Nzeogwu and co) to not only defeat Murtala in Enugu, but pursue him to Lagos and the seat of government.
There was no war yet then remember? They were still ALL NIGERIANS. No Biafrans yet.

So think and be fair in your analysis.

Posted by: Abagworo

@obiagu and onlytruth just analyse the bolded and understand what I have been trying to hit at all along.

I had already called the guy out. He was wrong, and I believe he has already retraced his steps.

Look, I am what you will call IGBO MADE. I was born and grew up in Igboland. I don't want to reveal much, but suffice it to say that some of the most memorable times in my life were spent at:
Onitsha where I basically grew up with people from ALL parts of Igbo land. We all lived in fegge and spoke the same "onicha Igbo". Houses in Onitsha are owned by every Igbo group. I drank my first full bottle of beer ( A star- ) at Abakaliki (to celebrate my graduation from UNEC after obtaining my first degree); went to my first REAL love trip to Aladimma estate in Owerri (still my favorite part of Owerri); played hide and seek at Isiekenesi (Ideato) and Umunkwo Mbano. My family lived at diobu Port Harcourt; my DEAREST auntie is from Ogwasi -ukwu( delta), my campus babe was from Inyi Achi in Enugu state, I schooled in Enugu for 5 years (which is how I came to adopt the town as my home). . . I can go on.

So, you can now understand why I was so pained by your "Igbo are not one people" remark. I was very angry because based on PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, I know you are wrong. So, I beg you in the name of God to NEVER use such language in a forum where enemies of Ndigbo are lurking around.

Thank you.

Ojukwu nwa nna! Idi egwu! Odumegwu!

If the northerners had killed Obasanjo for instance, how high would Ogundipe and Adebayo's legs be going as they head for SEME. hehehe!