No answer on the subject of where blue eyes come from?

Why are we discussing glossolalia as being just a Christian practise.
It's well-known to be used by other cultures.

Martian:

I think because you didn't include the fact that they stored the gold on Mars and I'm the last of the "Ancient Aliens".

Take me to your leader!!!!!!

Joagbaje:

You made a great point deep sight . The bible is not only a spiritual book. It's also a hystorically accurate documentation, the bible had actually helped apmany archeologists in their findings.

Didn't you read about the historical contradictions in the Book of Daniel?
After all, the thread is about the Book of Daniel, not the contradictions in the NT.
Can we please stay on topic?

Of course you're right!
When does the mothership arrive to take us 'home'?

FXKing2012:

What really baffles me is how somebody could just come up to claim that a pastor is false even without any evidence; the claims are based solely on hearsay and rumours. It's just crazy!
What about the testimonies of those that were healed, why is that their testimonies are not accepted by the skeptics? Why are the skeptics so quick to believe those that say the pastors are false (even with no evidence) but will never believe those that have been touched and have testimonies to share.
It simply tells me it's the devil at work.

It's actually very, very simple.
The prophetic and the healing videos are such crude hoaxes anyone with any experience in the world has to see them as the fakes they are.
Testimonies can be made under many different circumstances, even under utter conviction.
Surely even you can see that doesn't make their testimony true.

There are even people who are convinced Derren Brown and David Copperfield are 'real' magicians, pathetic as it may sound!
And will 'testify' their belief!

FXKing2012:

Jesus was always surrounded by his disciples and some of them carried swords - in case u dont know.

Some of them?
Tell us about it.

Let me educate you on the Bible: Jesus never performed any miracle where the person does not display some level of faith. In all His miracles He always said "your faith has made you whole".
It's even recorded in the Bible that Jesus couldnt perform much miracles in a particular city cos they lacked faith. So dont expect pastors to go about the street healing every Joystick 'n' harry even without any faith in them.

Wrong again.
Have you ever heard of the Resurrection?

Deep Sight-
Read the entire discussion about the gold needed for the reported structure

The total volume of the image is a whopping 270 cubic yards of gold. Not only would that be more gold than possibly could have been in Nebuchadnezzar's royal treasury, it is probably more gold than was in the combined treasuries of all the kingdoms in the middle east of that time. But, another astonishing factor to consider is the weight of such a structure.

I called several jewelers regarding this question and got a figure of 3 ounces for one cubic inch of gold. From there I figured that if there are 1728 cubic inches in one cubic foot, a cubic foot of gold would weigh 324 pounds. A cubic yard of gold, which consists of twenty seven cubic feet, would weigh 8748 pounds. Therefore, a structure comprised of 270 cubic yards of gold would weigh a whopping 1181 tons.

We're talking about 270 cubic yards of gold and 1181 tons.
It's simply not on.
The measurements stated in the text are crook.

For me, however,the most convincing arguments were the really striking historical errrors.
And that the language and 'theology' of the text is more accord with the second century BC, not the sixth BC.

FXKing2012:

@PA1982, I've seen people levitate and this was done on the street in broad day light. Pls u need to leave Spain and visit India to see some of these things with your eyes cos it's obvious you've spent too much time in the west and now u think everything must have a scientific explanation.

Now you are claiming Indian fakirs are for real? You are very funny.

Where was the last time I read of a group which subscribes to an opinion like the one I bolded?
Hmmm. Yes.
Boko Haram!

Once again u have chosen to avoid addressing the fact that you added to the Bible. Sarah was never told she would have a son the following year, she was told she would be visited in her lifetime.

Once again you you have chosen to avoid adressing the fact that I presented links to translations.
I've neither added nor changed anything.
I only wish I could better your reading skills.
And yes, she was told she'd have a child within the year.
We all know that didn't happen and her husband, for a second time, pimped her out to a foreign prince.

And yes back to Oyedepo's curse, as pointed out in the Bible, a curse or pronouncement or prophesy does not have to happen immediately, sometimes it takes years or even decades to manifest. And we are already seeing the effect of the curse on BH as an organization; the group is breaking apart while the leaders are being caught and confessing. I'm even very surprised the curse started taking effect almost immediately.

No leaders have been caught and cenfessed.
That 'interview' you based that mistaken idea on has been shown to be a hoax.

Even if you're in denial that neither Oyedepo nor David Copperfield have magical powers, you should at least recognise what is happening now:

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-879325.0.html#msg10269908

Here's another account of the same:

A series of explosions and gunfire has echoed through the northeast Nigerian town of Gombe.

Reports said the blasts happened around the time of evening prayers, quickly followed by gunfire.

"It started around 1830 GMT and it kept on going off," said Jimam Lar, a Phd researcher doing field work in Gombe
who heard the blasts from his hotel room.

"I've heard several bombs. It's a good number. I can't say exactly how many, but it went on for over an hour at intervals,"said Lar to the Reuters news agency.

Witnesses said people were fleeing an area of the city near a prison and police station. It is not clear if there are casualties.

Gombe has previously been targeted by the Islamist sect Boko Haram. In January, an attack on a church in the city left six worshippers dead.

Boko Haram, whose name means "Western education is forbidden" in the local Hausa language, is carrying out increased attacks in its campaign to implement strict Shariah law in Nigeria, a multi-ethnic nation of more than 160 million people.

It has been responsible of a series of deadly attacks and assassinations across northern Nigeria in the past 17 months.

According to an Associated Press count, in 2012 alone, Boko Haram has been blamed for killing at least 310 people.

Gunmen also launched simultaneous gun and bomb attacks on a prison and a police station in Gombe as well.

The attackers staged what residents said appeared to be coordinated attacks on a main prison where some Boko Haram members are believed to be held, and on a nearby police station.

"We are under siege. A large number of gunmen have encircled the prison, shooting and detonating explosives. It is clear they are Boko Haram," a prison warden told the AFP news agency from inside the central prison in Gombe.

Five killed in Kano

In a separate incident on Friday, suspected Boko Haram members shot dead five Muslim worshippers at a mosque in the northern Nigerian city of Kano.






Gunmen on motorcycles entered the mosque in the Tudun Maliki area of the northern city during evening prayers on Friday and opened fire, killing five people, including the head of a state-funded local vigilante group.

"Two gunmen on a motorcycle opened fire on a congregation in a mosque around 1730 GMT and killed five people," said Kano state police spokesperson, Magaji Majid.

He refused to speculate on who was behind the attack.

However, local witnesses blamed Boko Haram, saying the vigilante chief was their chief target.

"It is clear the attack was carried out by Boko Haram, Sule Kwaram (the vigilante head) was their primary target," said witness, Baffa Hayatu.

Local vigilantes have joined the special security unit set up to curb Boko Haram attacks in Kano following the January 20 deadly attacks where 185 people were killed by the Islamist group.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/africa/2012/02/2012224223132369404.html

Hmm. The historical accuracy of Daniel isn't quite so evident, you know.

THE BOOK OF DANIEL

I believe that the historical reliability of the Scripture should be tested by the same criteria used by all historical documents - Josh McDowell

Louis W. Cable

The Old Testament Book of Daniel plays a very important role in Christian theology. It is viewed by many Christians as a reliable source of information foretelling future events thereby greatly enhancing Bible credibility. In fact, Christian apologists maintain that because it mentions the coming of an "anointed prince," Daniel 9:24-26 actually foretell the coming of Jesus. Also, the Book of Daniel served as a model for the writers of the New Testament Book of Revelation as well as for the "Olivet Discourse" found in the 24th chapter of the Gospel of Matthew. But just how reliable is the Book of Daniel?

According to the story, the book was written by the prophet Daniel who, as a young man, was among the captives taken to Babylon following the defeat of Judah by King Nebuchadnezzar in the 6th century (1:6.) Daniel, again according to the story, remained in Babylon for the rest of his life where he eventually rose to a high government position as a result of his God-given ability to interpret dreams and visions (1:17.) He went on to serve under four kings: Nebuchadnezzar, Belshazzar, Darius the Mead, and the Persian conqueror, Cyrus the Great.

While in Babylon, Daniel claims to have experienced a series of mysterious visions revealing the future of the Jewish people and the tribulation they were to face. These prophetic visions span the time from 587 to the period of Jewish persecution under Antiochus IV (174-164). However, some investigators maintain that the Book of Daniel is a forgery written by an unknown author or authors between 168 and 164 long after the events "foretold" in the alleged prophetic visions had already occurred3. It is also widely believed that the "prophet Daniel" is a fictitious character who, in reality, never existed. The purpose of this paper is to present a summary of the evidence supporting these charges. But, first, let us briefly review of the history of that period.

Nebuchadnezzar, the second king of the Babylonian empire, ruled from 605 to 562. In 587 he defeated Judah. As a result many Jews were carried off into exile in Babylon. However, in 539 the Persians under Cyrus the Great defeated Babylon and allowed the Jewish exiles to return to their homeland thus ending the period known as "The Babylonian Exile." For the next 200 years the Jews enjoyed a period of religious freedom.

In 334 Alexander the Great of Macedonia defeated the Persians, and the conquered lands became a part of Greek empire. Following Alexander's sudden death in 312, the Greek empire split into four smaller realms. Palestine came under the domination of the Ptolemies. In 198 the Seleucids, under the leadership on Antiochus the Great, took control of Palestine from the Ptolemies. The subsequent imposition of Greek Hellenism threatened traditional Jewish culture and religion. This development, along with increased taxation, led to widespread unrest and resentment among the Jewish people throughout the region.

Antiochus IV, known to the Jews as Epiphanes (the madman), ascended to the throne in 174 and decreed that all Jews must accept Hellenization. The Jewish religion was outlawed, Jewish scripture was forbidden, and unclean swine were sacrificed to the Greek god, Zeus, on the alter of the Jerusalem temple. This provocation became known as the "abomination that maketh desolate" (Daniel 11:31). As a result, the Jews revolted under the leadership of Judas Maccabaeus in what became known as the Macabean Revolt. Antiochus was defeated, and in 164 traditional Jewish worship was restored throughout Palestine. Thus ended the period covered by the so-called prophetic visions of Daniel.

The claim that the Book of Daniel was not written until after these events had already occurred is very convincing. The later date is evident from its contents and style, and from comparison to other ancient data. The evidence is given below in summary:

Literary Style: The Book of Daniel is written in both Hebrew and Aramaic. These language did not came in to general use among the Jewish people until long after the Babylonian exile. Also, the book contains several Persian and Greek words that were not known in ancient Babylon.

In Daniel 9:2, Daniel is pictured studying "the books," wherein the prophecies of Jeremiah are contained. There was no such collection of sacred books in the alleged time of Daniel.

Daniel Not Among the Prophets: In the Christian Bible Daniel is considered a major prophet. In the Hebrew Bible, however, Daniel is not included among the prophets. This exclusion indicates that both the book and its author were unknown as recently as 200 when the prophetic canon was fixed.

Daniel is not mentioned in the Old Testament: Outside of the Book of Daniel the name "Daniel" never appears in the Old Testament. There are, however, several references to a Dan'el. These references point, not to the Babylonian Daniel, but to a very ancient king who is classified with the likes of Noah and Job. Scholars suggest that these references are most likely based on King Dan'el mentioned in the Canaanite Ras Shamra tablets of the fourteenth century.

No Reference to Daniel Before 200: There is no reference to Daniel in any non-canonical literature before the second century. There is also no reference to Daniel on Babylonian, Median, or Persian monuments and inscriptions. This is an odd omission indeed considering Daniel's purported high rank plus his alleged service under four kings as is claimed in the Book of Daniel.

Theology is too Advanced: The theological ideals and conceptions of Daniel more closely resemble Jewish teachings and writings of the second and first centuries than of the time of the exile. For example Daniel's idea of a heavenly kingdom more closely resembling that of the New Testament.

Historical Inaccuracies: The historical blunders evident in the Book of Daniel are not only numerous they are also very revealing because they are ones that a person living in that age would never have made. For example, Daniel gives the succession of Babylonian kings as 1) Nebuchadnezzar 2) Belshazzar, whom he misidentifies as the son of Nebuchadnezzar, 3) Darius the Mede, and 4) Cyrus the Great. The historically accurate sequence is 1) Nebuchadnezzar, 2) Evil-Merodach, 3) Neriglassar, 4) Nabonidus, 5) Belshazzar, son of Nabonidus, and 6) Cyrus the Great5. Nebuchadnezzar's reign was not succeeded by that of Belshazzar's as Daniel claims.

The most obvious historical error, however, concerns the fictitious Darius the Mede. The writer of Daniel mistakenly inserts Darius the Mede as king of Babylon between the reigns of Belshazzar and Cyrus the Great (Daniel 5:30-31). All efforts to identify Darius the Mede as an actual historical person have thus far failed. There were Babylonian kings known as Darius but they came after Cyrus.

Daniel's Predictions Analyzed: The most conclusive evidence for a Maccabean date for the writing of the Book of Daniel is found in the analysis of Daniel's visions and the prophecies arising from them. The visions pertaining to events between the fifth and third centuries are brief, sketchy, and historically unreliable. Actually, they amount to no more than clumsy attempts to portray known historical events in a prophetic style. The writer did not predict the future so much as he reiterated the past. As the author approaches his own era, however, the details in the visions and the events they claim to prophesy become much more precise . The events immediately prior to and including the reign of Antiochus IV (175-164) and his persecution of the Jews are historically accurate. But, events extending into the author's immediate future do not agree at all with known history. For example, instead of dieing in a battle somewhere between Jerusalem and the Mediterranean Sea as the writer predicted (11:40-45), Antiochus IV actually died far to the east in modern day Iran6.

Some Glaring Omissions: The writer of the Book of Daniel was convinced that he was living in the "last days". But he was obviously wrong about that. In fact, the most trying days of tribulation for the Jewish people lay ahead. The Judao/Roman war, still considered the most devastation war ever to have occurred in the middle east, began in 67 CE and ended in 70 CE with the total defeat of the Jewish people and the destruction of the Temple. No Judas Maccabaeus arose to lead them in a successful revolt against the Romans as had happened in the Maccabean period. Yet Daniel, the self-proclaimed prophet of Jewish tribulation, said nothing about this tragedy. Nor did he mention the Nazi Holocaust, another devastating atrocity for the Jewish people. Both of these historically documented episodes far surpassed the persecution perpetrated upon them by Antiochus IV.

Some famous stories from the Book of Daniel analized:

In addition to it's lurid visions and amazing "predictions," the Book of Daniel contains several astounding stories tirelessly repeated by Christian clergy. These stories are widely known throughout Christendom and enjoy great popularity. Included are, "The Golden Image", "The Fiery Furnace", and "Daniel in the Lions' Den". So, let us now take and objective look at these stories.

The Golden Image

Daniel 3:1 ~ Nebuchadnezzar the king made an image of gold, whose height was threescore cubits, and the breadth thereof six cubits: he set it up in the plain of Dura, in the province of Babylon.

No clergy person, as far as I know, has ever sat down and computed the volume of the king's golden image. So, let's see just what we are dealing with here. At eighteen inches per cubit the image would be 90 feet tall by nine feet wide. Although the depth is not given, a conservative estimate would be nine feet because in order to be stable when set upright the structure's depth would have to be at least equal to its breadth.

The total volume of the image is a whopping 270 cubic yards of gold. Not only would that be more gold than possibly could have been in Nebuchadnezzar's royal treasury, it is probably more gold than was in the combined treasuries of all the kingdoms in the middle east of that time. But, another astonishing factor to consider is the weight of such a structure.

I called several jewelers regarding this question and got a figure of 3 ounces for one cubic inch of gold. From there I figured that if there are 1728 cubic inches in one cubic foot, a cubic foot of gold would weigh 324 pounds. A cubic yard of gold, which consists of twenty seven cubic feet, would weigh 8748 pounds. Therefore, a structure comprised of 270 cubic yards of gold would weigh a whopping 1181 tons.

Gold smelters normally are rather small things because they usual process relatively small amounts of the precious metal. So, no gold smelter in the world could have handled such a project. Even if they had, it would have been impossible to have moved it with the primitive technology of that day, let alone sat it upright.

Christian apologists might offer as an explanation the possibility that the image was made in small pieces like a jigsaw puzzle and assembled at the site. But, even if the amount of gold needed for was somehow make available, such a project would have tied up the best craftsmen in the entire middle east and would have required many years to complete. The cost, in addition to that of the gold, would have been outlandishly enormous. Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego would, in all probability, have died of old age before the subject image was completed.

It should also be noted that in all the royal Babylonian archives that archaeologists have so far discovered, not a single reference to such an image as this, or any decree to worship it, is yet to be discovered.

The Fiery Furnace

Daniel 3:27 ~ And the princes, governors, and captains, and the king's counsellors, being gathered together, saw these men, upon whose bodies the fire had no power, nor was an hair of their head singed, neither were their coats changed, nor the smell of fire had passed on them.

First, if the story of the golden image is debunked, that of Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego (hereafter referred to as "the three stooges" surviving the fiery furnace is debunked also. But let us consider some of the more preposterous aspects of that outlandish story.

Because they refused to obey the king's order to worship the golden image, the three stooges, who had only a short time earlier been appointed by the king to "rule over the affairs of the province" (v49), were to be cast immediately into a fiery furnace. In his rage, the king directed that the furnace be heated to seven times hotter than normal. They were then cast in. By that time the furnace was so hot until the king's men carrying out the order were killed.

The king, however, was astonished to see not only the three stooges standing unharmed amidst the flames but a fourth stooge had mysteriously appeared and was standing with them. The king was so amazed that he went right up to the mouth of the furnace to get a better look. Although the intensity of the heat had killed his men, he somehow remained unharmed. About that time the three stooges came walking out, probably arm-in-arm, completely unharmed.

In verse 28 we learn that the fourth stooge is an angel - a "guardian" angel, no doubt. Anyway, the king was so impressed that he issued a decree that "every people, nation, and language, which speak anything amiss against the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, shall be cut in pieces, and their houses shall be made a dunghill: because there is no other God that can deliver after this sort". He then promoted the three stooges, but to what is anybody's guess.

So much for the fiery furnace episode.

Daniel in the Lions' Den

Daniel 6:22 ~ My God hath sent his angel, and hath shut the lions' mouths, that they have not hurt me".

In this story King Darius was informed by certain of his followers that Daniel had been caught worshiping a god other than that of the Babylonians. Because this was a capital offense, Daniel was cast into a den of hungry lions. But, God protected him. When King Darius saw what had happened he was so impressed that he decided it was time for a little reverse justice. Whereupon he ordered that those who had informed on Daniel be thrown into the lion's den along with their wives and children.

As noted above there is absolutely no historical, archaeological, or literary data to prove that there ever was a "King Darius" of Babylon. Darius is a myth, therefore, the story of Daniel in the lion's den is another Bible hoax.

____________________________________________________________________________

1 Compiled by Louis W. Cable.

2 All dates are BCE (Before the Christian Era) unless otherwise noted.

3 Greenberg, Gary; 101 Myths of the Bible, 2002, pages 287-289.

4 Shepherd, Brodrick D., Beasts, Horns and the Antichrist, Cliffside Publishing House, 1944, p. 21.

5 Greenberg, Gary, 101 Myths of the Bible, 2002, pages 287-289.

6 Encyclopedia Britannica 2002 Deluxe Edition.

7 Till, Farrell, "Silliness in the Book of Daniel"; The Skeptical Review, vol. 9, no. 6; Nov/Dec 1998.

8 Benson, Andrew D., The True Origins of Christianity and the Bible, Prudential Publishing Co., 1997, p.17.

http://www.websitesonadime.com/ffwic/bookofdaniel.htm

^^^
Well written!
Learned gossolalia is a world-wide phenomenon.
It's a basic shamanic practise and it is considered the sign of a 'true' shaman (jujuman, if you will).
Taoist energy healers use it, too.

I've found the thread most interesting, especially for the Corinthian context of Paul's recommendations on the subject.

OLAADEGBU:
,
• God's character absolutely forbids evolutionary methods.  God's holiness demands truth, and His omniscience demands perfection.  He cannot know what is best and then "create" something inferior.  He wrote that He took six days to create the universe (Exodus 20:11).  And He cannot lie!

Where do humans with blue eyes come from?
http://www.livescience.com/9578-common-ancestor-blue-eyes.html

Nice photo shop work, but,
No, those photos don't convince me.

This 'falling' or 'pushing' is a technique used by Chinese martial arts practitioners, too.
We were taught how to do this in a chi kung workshop I took some years back.

You can see it done on Youtube.
http://www.mind-energy.net/archives/288-Nei-kung-telekinesis-video-by-John-Chang-student.html

It has nothing to do per se with any particular religion or philosophy.
I'd recommend going to another church where the pastor doesn't indulge in this sort of theatrics.

FXKing2012:

My friend this is not a matter of translation, this is pure distortion. How does "according to the time of life" mean the same as "at this time next year"? This is nothing but distortion.
Do you think all Bibles out there is the genuine thing? Some have been badly distorted by men who translated them just to suit their own purpose.

And to answer your question, according to the time of  life means in your lifetime.

http://bible.cc/genesis/18-14.htm

Check out the original hebrew.
So now if a Christian uses a different translation or interpretation of the bible, they are not worthy of the name?
How about people who read the bible in languages other than English and thus have no connection to the KJV?

Spanish
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%2018:14&version=LBLA
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%2018:14&version=NVI

French
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%2018:14&version=BDS

Italian
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%2018:14&version=NR2006

Interestingly enough, Martin Luther interpreted the passage that way, too
German
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%2018:14&version=LUTH1545

Welcome to planet Earth and remember, David Copperfield does NOT make airplanes disappear.

But this is a digression, yet again.
Back to Oyedepo's 'curse'.

Errr, back to the OP topic?

^^^
Cheap insults don't prove your point.

helpee:
,  When God told abraham he would beget a child, do u actually think that the prophecy was real after about 50yrs wtout fulfilment. ,

@helpee
Err,  go back to the OT

<< Genesis 18 >>
New American Standard Bible
8He took curds and milk and the calf which he had prepared, and placed it before them; and he was standing by them under the tree as they ate.

      9Then they said to him, “Where is Sarah your wife?” And he said, “There, in the tent.” 10He said, “I will surely return to you at this time next year; and behold, Sarah your wife will have a son.” And Sarah was listening at the tent door, which was behind him. 11Now Abraham and Sarah were old, advanced in age; Sarah was past childbearing. 12Sarah laughed to herself, saying, “After I have become old, shall I have pleasure, my lord being old also?” 13And the LORD said to Abraham, “Why did Sarah laugh, saying, ‘Shall I indeed bear a child, when I am so old?’ 14“Is anything too difficult for the LORD? At the appointed time I will return to you, at this time next year, and Sarah will have a son.”

You've misunderstood the prophecy. 50 years didn't pass before the prophetic pronouncement and the  birth of Isaac.

What people have been trying to explain here is that Oyedepo has declared war, cursed BH.
It's been claimed the natural splintering of this terrorist group is due to this MOG's intervention.
Many readers, I among them, call deceit and misdirection.
Terrorist group naturally splinter.
This process doesn't depend on cursing and pretending it does is either delusion or conscious deception.

Worse yet, those of us who defend our right to say 'the Emperor has no clothes' are been insulted, threatened, and in my case, actually cursed.
iI or my family was supposed to suffer some misfortune within a week of the curse's pronouncement, which would 'prove' Oyedepi is a true MOG.

That was over a month ago.
No result, of course.

^^^
I'm glad you've had a giggle.

How's the curse working out?

^^^^
Thanks for defending our right to expose illusion and misdirection when we see it.

On the subject of TB Joshua's footie prophecies-
It's already been gone over in this forum, you know.
https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-776199.0.html

I've seen the 'prophecy' videos available on Youtube. You can be in the UK or Spain or Paris or Lagos and see them for what they are- a showman working the crowd.
And the 'healing' videos are even worse.

FXKing2012:

She's an atheist, cant u see it written all over her posts?

Well, this particular poster is so ignorant he can't tell the difference between someone who dares to call his favourite MOG a tired fraud and an atheist.

Wesley, I'm Catholic.

I'm not saying Christians have not had issues in the past (such as the Spanish Inquisition) but these happened a very long time ago, you dont hear of such things anymore. Civilization has changed all that.

Your BBC link talks about BH storming a prison to release prisoners. But are u aware that most of those prisoners have been recaptured? Or u chose to ignore that.

The poster who wrote that must be blinded by their brainwashing.
Doesn't the poster see the significance of the BBC link's content?
Very sad.

FXKing2012:

God bless you tooooo much, some of these folks dont know the consequences of the things they say. They just come here spitting dust thinking they are intelligent or funny - or perhaps both.

You really can't bear knowing lots of people are reading just how badly you're being taken apart here, can you?
And by the way- you haven't commented on that BBC video I've posted and re-posted for your benefit.
Is there a reason you don't want to recognise BH's recent activities?

@PA1982, terrorism may be associated with poverty only to an extent but it is 100% associated with Islam. Let's not beat about the bush, say the truth which u know deep down in you: Islam promotes terrorism.

And the argument of occupation of a land/country is only an excuse. The northern part of Nigeria is not occupied by foreign forces yet we have suicide bombers there; Pakistan is not occupied by foreign forces yet suicide bombers operate on a daily basis there; Egypt is not occupied by foreign forces yet suicide bombers have stuck there a couple of times, etc etc.
So let's call it what it is. . .Islam promotes terrorism and violence.

There you go, hate mongering again. Please read up on the causes of terrorism and suicide bombing. You might learn something.
Get a grip, man.

And the case of Kamikaze pilots during the 2nd world war has nothing to do with terrorism. It was a war situation and they were only fighting with the last drop of their blood just like everyone else.
How is their action different from that of the soldiers who, though know they have been circled by superior army and have absolutely no chance of escaping or winning, still fight till the last man drops? It is what real soldiers do - they fight till the end! And that should never be confused for terrorism.
The Kamikaze pilots were not attacking civilians, they were attacking enemy soldiers with the only thing they had left - their planes.

You really don't get it, do you?
You have so much to learn before you can be counted on to make a post which doesn't expose your profound ignorance of the world around you.

Are u aware Muslims kill and torture Christians in Muslim majority countries like Iran, Egypt, Pakistan, etc. But u never hear of Muslims being persecuted or killed in Christian majority countries. Why is this so?
Are u also aware that Muslims have fought and keep fighting with every other religion? Muslims fight Christians in Nigeria, Philippines, etc; Muslims fight Hindus in India; Muslims fight Buddhists in China, etc etc.
What does all these tell u about Islam?

It tells me much more about your willful denial of the world.
Have you already forgotten the Srebrenica massacre?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre

The organised rape of Muslim women by Christian soldiers in the Serbian Croatian conflict?
Are you in denial or simply a rabid bigot?

You mention people living wt fear of terrorism in Spain but it is being perpetuated by the Muslims.
You talk of armed robbery and gangs, these are petty crimes and they are in every society in the world just like any other crime.

Truth be told: without Muslims in this world, the world would be a much peaceful place. I'm sure u know this fact albeit you may wanna deny it.

You're parading your ignorance once again. Spain's terrorist problem has to do with ETA not Muslims.
And again, you are hate mongering.
This is serious and could lead to people discounting what you write becouse of your ignorant bigotry.

You talk of my ignorance on the subject of science. Well, my dear, any endeavor of science which promotes evolution or extraterrestrial intelligence is an attempt to disprove the existence of God.
Of course you dont know this cos you are unable to see the big picture, all u see is their theories and conclusions.

In answer to the bolded bit- can you possibly be serious here?

^^^Deal - At least d first part is. But if u think I'm going to waste my bundle watching some "psychic videos" online, dat one na lie o!

I'm very sad you don't want to learn just how you have been taken in by this man's show.
There are excellent videos which explain in depth how public 'prophecies' work.

I'm watching a video at the moment of the TB Joshua prophecies for 2012.
How embarrassing to think anyone is taken in by this.

FXKing2012:

Let me tell u a short story: some years back I was having a particular ailment and I'm talking of something that was very serious. I got invited to the healing school of Christ Embassy and after the session which lasted about a month, pastor Chris came to pray for us and he laid his hand on every one of us, and I got my healing that same day. I saw so many others who got healed and got up from their wheelchairs and beds and all. These were people I had come to personally know cos we were in the school together for almost one month.

My point is it is easy for me to believe cos I have experienced it first hand; it may be very difficult for u to believe cos u have never experienced it.

Do u believe in magic? Have u seen David Copperfield where he made a plane to disappear and where he was flying in the sky? I saw it myself alongside several other people and there was no special effects cos it was live.
Go to India, you will see all sorts of spirituality at work. You will see people turning into snakes and all sorts of spirituality.
Now, if these things exist (and they belong in the dark world), what makes you think they dont exist in the light as well? The devil is not more powerful than God, so if the devil could do those nasty things it only goes to show that God can do even much more.

Miracles exist, prophesies exist and some people are blessed with these spiritual gifts!

Are you actually telling you don't understand David Copperfield is a stage magician?
It does explain why you are so gullible.
Everyone knows about those Indian fakirs' trick- is it possible you believe in them?
This an absurd post, FXKing2012, even more so than most of your's I've read.

As for the other posters- I'm astonished people take these prophecies so seriously here.
I'll take the trouble to post up links to explanations of how and why people allow themselves to be convinced by 'prophets'.

I was trying, and very courteously, to explain the mechanism which has taken you in.
When I get back from work I'll dedicate 30 minutes to what you ask.
In return, I ask you learn about
confirmation bias (Google it)
and watch videos of debunked psychics (Youtube)
OK?

FXKing2012:

@PA1982, Joshua was led to do the things he did. He didnt just wake one day then decided to take matters into his own hands, he was led!

That was my point. He butchered in the name of God.

If u say terrorism is about poverty and has nothing to do with religion then u must be living in fantasy world. Mutallab (the Nigerian underwear bomber) came from a very rich family; the perpetrators of 9:11 in the U.S. were Saudis and they were very very comfortable; we've seen many terrorists in Jordan, Lebanon, Iran, Iraq, etc who happen to be professionals making very decent living yet they turned out to be terrorist. And only one things is common amongst all these people : they were all Muslims.
Pls tell me of any suicide bomber who is not a Muslim, just one pls! I'm sure u cant mention even one yet you proof yourself daft enough to say terrorism is not about religion.

A fantasy world, no. One rather wider than yours, yes.
Of course I see your point about events in the Middle East, unfortunately what you DON'T see is the extremely sad case of the Afghani suicide bombers- they are in their majority youths who have lost limbs in previus bomb attacks.
You've forgotten the most famous case of suicide attacks in history, that of the Kamikaze pilots in WWII- hardly Muslims, I think.

Some associate terrorism not with poverty, but with the lack of freedom.
It's the ultimate response to invasion and occupation, even if the invading nation is 'led' in God's name.
It's a tragic loss of human potential and my most sincere prayer is that no human ever feel compelled to do this again.

Of course this is a digression.
The subject of the threat is Oyedepo's ridiculous curses against BH.

All the Christian countries u mentioned live in peace. You dont hear they are fighting and shedding blood despite the economic problems they are going thru. Before Serbia was formed (when it was still part of the defunct Yugoslavia), they fought a bloody civil war and that was because there were many Muslims there at the time.
Call me whatever u like but u cant deny that I say the truth.

I see you don't follow the news much!
Spaniards still live very much with the effects of terrorism. And fear of it.
Armed robbery is up. Because of poverty.
Fortunately there aren't the Uni cults there are in Nigeria, but South American gangs (very much Christian) rule many streets.
Your analysis of the Serbian Croatian conflict is so defective I can't even face it today. It'll have to wait til tomorrow.

[/quote]And yes, scientists are still very busy trying to disprove the existence of God but all their findings have Biblical explanations. And any Christian who accepts the devilish concept of evolution is definitely not a true Christian.
[quote]

Well, that's news!
You, rather than the Almighty, decides who is a Christian!

Your ignorance on the subject of scientists and their goals is hilarious, of course, but perhaps it explains which you imagine a curse can have any effect.
I'm amazed you can bring yourself to use a computer.

I read your reply with great attention.
Of course you are right to suggest that we have better internet connection here in Spain than in Nigeria, so indeed I do have access to many videos via Youtube, many articles, blogs and commentaries via Google.

It's precisely because I can compare TB Joshua's video to others that I say what I do.
Check out the videos of debunked mediums and psychics and see just how similar they are to TBJ's videos.
It's not pretty viewing, I can assure you.

One basic principal of human error is very much at work here, you know. It's called confirmation bias.
It's when we pick out something that confirms what we WANT to see.
Such as seeing the apparently accurate prophecy AFTERWARDS and not registering, even forgetting, the many unfulfilled ones.
Try writing down ALL the prophecies uttered, not just the ones edited and published by his church and you'll quickly see what I mean.

FXKing2012:

, Yes the curse is working but u can only see it working if u choose not to be blind to it. Our security forces are now getting on top of the situation, thanks to prayers of Christians. You may not accept this fact but it doesnt change the truth

Right.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-17059895

Hang on, this thread is about Oyedepo's curse, not the prayers of Christians. Don't confuse things!

So then u ask: of what purpose did the uprising serve despite all the blood that was shed? When humans think they can run their own affair without God leading them, it leads to chaos and mayhem with trails of blood.

Err. You haven't read the OT lately, have you?
Joshua slaughtered in the name of the Lord, didn't he?

In Nigeria today, yes standard of living may be low but at least we live in peace. You wake up and go to the market or visit your friends without the fear of being separated from your family as a result of war.
The only part of Nigeria where there is serious problem is that part where the population of Christians is very low and the leaders of that region are non-Christians.
I dont know if u can see a trend here?

You are mongering hate again.
Saying that terrorism is related to religion is to show your total ignorance.
Terrorism had NOTHING to do with religion. Everything to do with power.
And poverty.

Again I put it to you, name one predominantly Christian country that is in a state of disarray or blood of people are being shed.
Whether u agree wt me or not, the fact remains that Christians countries live peaceably and this definitely has something to do with the religion.

Ireland, Spain, Serbia, Croatia come to mind.
Christian countries leave peaceably?
Wrong.

I'm amazed you made mention of the Lord when u dont even believe in Him.

And you know that why?

Anyways, since u keep wondering why I made mention of Darwin I'll explain it to u.
Darwin, being the father of evolution theory, has deceived so many and has led so many to hell. Evolution attempts to disprove the existence of God by claiming we evolved from animals and that the animals actually evolved from a sea creature. This is the most silly thing I have even had to deal with.
Now by claiming we evolved from apes, he tries to make the book of Genesis a liar where God created Adam and Eve.
So I brought in the case of Darwin cos scientists use it to try to disprove the existence of God who created us.

I dealt with this earlier. A shame it went over your head.
Obviously I don't write just to answer you, but to invite Nairaland members to learn for themselves about the wonder of our lives.
I'll go over it again.
Science has gone far beyond theories and speculation on the subject of life on this planet.
Genetics? DNA? RNA?
Do you understand what those terms mean?
Scientists have much more interesting things to occupy their lives than 'disproving' the existence of God.
Get serious.
Many Christians accept evolution. Obviously they aren't damnd to Hell, except in your imagination.

No one has to claim anything. Just look at the evidence being unearthed everyday around the world.

In any case, this IS a digression.
This thread is dedicated to Oyedepo's curse on BH and it's effects.


And wat BBC link are u referring to?
[quote][/quote]

Just more proof of your 'special' memory or a testimony to the fact you don't read the posts in the thread you started?
It would seem you haven't figured out how to scroll up in a thread.
Here's the link:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-17059895

A serious business, that.

FXKing2012:

You keep saying I am digressing from the original post. Well, that is because you guys are unable to see the big picture. Bishop Oyedepo and the issue of curse is but a very small part of the discussion/argument.
You need to expand your view in order to grasp my point. Even though the OP talks about Bishop Oyedepo and the curse on BH, but u need to understand that it is only a precursor to a wilder argument on the existence of God, power given to men of God and the potency of such power.

I know this may be difficult for some of you to comprehend as u are unable to expand your view and scope. You can only operate at the level of the exact words that were used.

Intelligence and logical reasoning require the ability to bring in issues that are outside the original argument and incorporate them perfectly into the original argument. So quit being so primordial or elemental in your arguments - try to see the wider picture by expanding your view.

As to the bolded section- surprise us!
Be coherent!

You've had every single one one of your arguments debunked thus far.
You've resorted to every debater's trick in the book and finally fall back on repeating this empty threat about the power of a MOG's curse.


You try to defend frauds and hoaxes in a vain effort to shore up your empty threats.
And you even stooped to dragging Darwin into the discussion, the Lord only knows why!
You're astonished no-one takes your threats seriously and surprised posters wonder if you're drunk when you post.

And I notice you've not mentioned the BBC link I posted up.
THAT is a most serious affair.

^^^
Please restrain yourself from insults, OK?

Oh pls spare me that BS will u? He said in the 25th minute an opportunity that would have handed them the cup would be wasted and it would be just BW the player and the goalkeeper! Oh, he also said the ball wld be played "over". so u were saying?

And the other missed opportunities?
Not mentioned.
Not in the video that was posted up, anyway.

As other posters have said, the man uses techniques used and beloved by conmen everythere.
It's called cold-reading.

Too bad u see that as an abuse, I thot it was a rational deduction. Perhaps u've not seen the video of the prophecy that's y you're still here saying stuff like this pls try n view it. He was very well specific, mentioning the time a goal scoring opportunity that wld have handed the cup over to CIV wld be lost as well as the manner. How u manage to see a match BW a side with at least 5 very world class players and a Zambian side whose only professional player plays for a second rate SA clubside as a battle BW equals is beyond me.
There are many questions we can raise Abt TB Joshua and they might sound tenable but one of them certainly isn't the genuineness of his predictions, there, he has proven himself BEYOND REASONABLE DOUBT! Any aspersions are just ignorant or malicious.

More snide insults.
No problem.
Are you seriously saying this video proves TB Joshua as an authentic prophet?
Then so am I!!!
I bet on Zambia 1-0.
Get serious.

You might as well claim that 'healing of an ulcer' video proves him a healer.
Get serious.

Dear me, I thought warring was frowned upon here!
My allegations of fraud?
Based on that vicious hoax of a 'miraculous healing' video that was posted up here in another thread.

Cruel and heartless.
Is calling out a fraud 'nasty'?

FXKing2012:

, You had better quit attacking MOG if u dont wanna draw curses upon urself.

Please keep these empty threats for your mirror.
The subject of 'curses' has been gone over plenty of times why bring it up yet again?

Azibalua:

Read for yourself and stop basing your judgement on someones idea

I do read for myself. The thing is, I read more than religious tracts.

Your explanation of the ROR is very fake and shows lack of spirituality,

I disagree with you. Reading, questioning and thinking have to be part of the spiritual experience.
Insults do not.

FXKing2012:

Why is it that you people just dont get it? Does it matter how many times the same message is preached? Somebody may not get it the 1st time a message was preached or perhaps the person's spirit wasnt ready or wasnt alert the 1st time it was preached. So when the person hears it again and again, then it finally sinks into the person.
Before I got born again same message of salvation was preached to me over and over again.

Why do u expend so much energy on irrelevances?

And as for crossman9, he's only

an obsessed young man who seem lost.

Ah, FXKing2012, we can alway count on you to misunderstand any thread, even your own!

Before I got born again same message of salvation was preached to me over and over again.

You've got the wrong end of the stick, you know.
The point is that the parishioners of the church claim ROR is a book with a readership rivaled only by the Bible.
This a spurious claim.

an obsessed young man who seem lost.

Do give us the advantage of your rebuttal of his analysis, please!
Not just insults.

You're very funny.
I'm amused you defend a fraud's prophetic ability by abusing those who see through him.