₦airaland Forum

Henry120:
Actually, it's the fact that for every refit, your inept military handlers have to fork out 100 million rand in corrupt kick-backs.

So allegations are now fact?

Henry120:
The same corruption that brought you 26 Jets you cannot fly after 16 years, the same corruption that has left your inept navy with only 1 operational frigate, that same corruption has lead to a 100 million rand in corrupt contract for the re-fit of a single ship.

This is the "And so".

Anyway, corruption in the South-African military procurement process is common place.

First - the navy is currently running at planned operational numbers. Only people whom lack knowledge on the topic think that peacime navies can run at anything other than an average of 1/3 strenght - just look at the german navy for example

Second - there is alleged corruption not actual corruption

Third - 14 gripen and growing is 14 more 4th gen platforms than nigeria

agaugust:
The same whitemen professional researchers did NOT declare and publish the United Kingdom as a failed state when IRA terrorist waged a 27 year old religious war against Great Britain on British home-soil, but now white men list a black Nigeria as a failed state when we fight a religious war at home. Racism means double standards, so the whites have a new vocabulary that applies only to black and colored nations.

If those publishers can publish that the U.K. was a failed state for 27 years fighting IRA terrorists, then we will accept the same definition for Nigeria.

Oh, I forgot, South Africa too was a failed state for 30 years while fighting ANC terrorists
.

Augustus - terrorism is not the only criterion, they use hundreds

You cannot argue with the work of professionals who have dedicated their lives to work on the topic.

Nigeria is currently the 16th most failed state on earth. Deal with it.

Henry120:
Only 1 of your 4 Frigates is operational
Only 1 of your 3 submarines is operational.
All 26 South-African Augusta helicopters grounded
Only 3 C-130's are operational.
9 Gripen pilots for 26 jets
10 helicopters for a country with a 1.2km area

Makes a person wonder, why South-Africa even bothers with a military in the first place .

Thats one more frigate than nigeria
Thats one more sub than nigeria
Augusta were temporarily grounded
3 C130's is more than you
Over 14 gripen pilots - thats 14 more 4th gen platforms than you
Those 10 attack helicopters are more advances than anything you have - their superioirty over the hind has been shown in combat

Dude, you just pointed out how we are better than nigeria

agaugust:
Where did I say SA should crave for war? I said you crave for combat experience which you DON'T have in your Hollywood SANDF.

Crave for war or not, there is war all over Africa, SANDF should wake up like real men and go fight to save smaller African countries like C.A.R Bangui where you ran away because Seleka teenage boys showed that real war is different from military photography album production.

Stop making excuses that South Africa has nothing to gain in C.A.R, why should you only help weaker African brothers if you are promised mineral wealth for deploying SANDF, is your SANDF a mercenary force.....soldiers of fortune and rewards?
.

So this is what a childs mind looks like

Henry120:
Sunday Times, December 14 2014


[b]Arms deal vessels marooned by neglect
ONLY one of South Africa’s four arms deal frigates and one of three submarines are operational — and some are falling apart.
One frigate has a cracked rudder, another needs an engine replaced and a third has been under repair for almost a year, the Sunday Times established this week.
This comes just days after Armscor gave details of a R4-billion tender to build six naval patrol boats, prompting doubts over the navy’s ability to maintain its fleet.
The new naval shopping list, dubbed Project Biro, is a boon for local shipbuilding companies but a potential disaster for taxpayers who will have to fund maintenance and repairs for years to come.
The naval dockyard in Simon’s Town is understaffed and undercapitalised.
Andrew Feinstein, an ANC MP who quit when the government curtailed a probe into the arms deal, said: “These revelations come as no surprise. The arms deal has been a monumental waste of money.”
The DA’s David Maynier said: “We don’t need another arms deal-like disaster where we acquire vessels we know we cannot operate or maintain.—[/b]

This is standard for any navy in the world

The so called 1/3 rule

We just finished major naval exercises, repars and maintenance must be done. Vessels suffering damage during a year of high tempo operations is not unheard of and is to be expected.

Further, that Valour Class that has been under maintence for a year is about to become operational again - and the Amatola will take its spot and begin refit

Also, a damaged engine does not prevent a Valour Class frigate to perform training operations in false bay (Spionkop had an engine removed when it was slated for refit in 2009 and performed training ops in the bay for a whole year while waiting its chance jn dry dock)

This is how professional navies run - maintenance, maintenance, maintenance

Maybe if you followed our lead the Aradu would put to sea once every 5 years


And as a final point, the fact that the Warrior Class OPV's have come on line and the naval base in durban is nearing the end of refurbishment means that soon the valour class will not be not be needed for 24/7 patrol of the Mozambique channel - meaning the maintenance backlog can be adressed and that wear and tare on the vessels will be more than halved

And let me remind you - 1 combat ready frigate and 1 combat ready sub is one of each more than you [will ever] have and is enough to defend against any nation in sub saharan aftica

Henry120:
The cost of the SAS Amatola’s refit may have been inflated by R100-million

THE Department of Defence has funnelled R406-million for ship maintenance and repairs to a private company because it says it can no longer look after its own fleet.
And the fortunate recipient of taxpayers’ cash is a company chaired and co-owned by the founder of the Friends of Jacob Zuma Trust, Don Mkhwanazi.
Southern African Shipyards, in which Mkhwanazi has a 48% stake [/b]together with its CEO, Prasheen Maharaj, has benefited from six naval contracts in the past three years, including a R335-million deal to refit the arms deal frigate SAS Amatola.
The department said it had had to outsource the work because of “capacity constraints” at the Simon’s Town naval dockyard. But the Durban company’s lucrative relationship with the military has raised concerns and prompted a call for a probe by the auditor-general.
The Sunday Times has established that:
The R335-million Amatola refit tender has ballooned to about R360-million because of “unforeseen events”;
[b]Several industry experts said the original contract amount was inflated by between R60-million and R100-million;
The cost — one of the most expensive navy refits by a private firm — prompted questions in parliament by DA defence shadow minister David Maynier. In a written response two weeks ago, Defence and Military Veterans Minister Nosiviwe MapisaNqakula confirmed that R406million was being paid to Southern African Shipyards; and
Unlike the latest frigate refit tender issued earlier this year, the Amatola tender was not handled by Armscor but by the navy’s own procurement centre. Despite insisting the Amatola contract was put out to public tender, the navy has steadfastly refused to clarify queries about apparent irregularities.
Mkhwanazi and other Southern African Shipyards shareholders insist it is above board — and has nothing to do with Mkhwanazi’s ties to Zuma. Responding to the Sunday Times in writing, Mkhwanazi said: “The president does not award tenders . . . Any relationship with the president cannot be linked to contract awards made via a public tender process.”
Maharaj described as “sour grapes” the suggestion that the deal was politically motivated.
“Every government contract we have won, whether it has been Transnet or South African Navy, has been won through a public tender process,” he said.
“We don’t think our offer of R335-million tender was overpriced. In fact, it was the cheapest bid received via an open public tender process,” he said.
Maynier, who called for an independent probe, disagreed: “First, the cost of the SAS Amatola’s refit was stratospheric and may have been inflated by as much as R100-million.
“Second, the SAS Amatola’s refit brought the local shipbuilding industry to its knees because the dry dock was effectively shut down.
“And third, it’s strange that [R400-million] would be sunk into a private company in Durban, rather than into the South African Navy dockyard.”
Southern African Shipyards has also received a R1.4-billion contract to build tug boats for Transnet.
Mkhwanazi, a Southern African Shipyards shareholder since 2006 and Transnet director between 2010 and 2012, said he had declared his shareholding on the day he was appointed to the Transnet board.
“The tug contract awarded to Southern African Shipyards became effective on 1 August 2014, more than two and a half years after [my] tenure as a director of Transnet ended,” he said.

And so?

Henry120:
Screaming and shouting like a dog on the internet, doesn't prove your message is credible.

Message is 100% credible

That "unimportant fob" was protecting a town of 10 000 souls

Boko haram captured this VITAL position with ease and then proceded to burn and loot and slaughter their way through the area

All the while the NA is unwilling or incapable of mounting a response

Henry120:
Actually, Augustine hit a home-run with every sentence he made.

Where do I place South-Africa with your 69 murders a day?

Far higher than you

And the fact remains - you are the 16th most failed state in the world. As confirmed by professionals in the feild

[size=15pt]Remeber that FOB the Nigerian army got pushed out of?

Remeber how the Nigerians on this forum said it was not a big deal that they lost it? It was "just in empty desert"

Well - the loss of that FOB has allowed Boko Haram to perform one of the biggest acts of terrorism in history

16 towns destroyed - a city of 10 000 souls allmost completely lost
http://www.businessinsider.com/boko-harams-deadliest-terrorist-attack-2015-1

Where are the NAF attack helicopters? Where was the Rapid response teams? Not even fire support from the palmera!!

This is final and complete proof of the incompetance and uselessness of the nigerian military!![/size]

agaugust:
No failed state seats on UN Security council seat, Nigeria seats there, and is top contender for permanent UN elite security council seat.

Failed states don't lead ECOWAS and AU military missions

Failed states don't host World Economic Forum meetings.

Failed states have NO defined political structure. Failed states don't hold fee and fair elections.

Nigeria is just state at war, Somalia is more like a failed state. Nigeria has a central government and it enforces law.

So United Kingdom was a failed state for 27 years because IRA rebels were waging religious war on British home soil? Fool

War experience comes by fighting, Nigeria has that experience that South Africa is craving for and not getting

@Patches has a FAILED BRAIN
.

Augustus

You cannot argue your way out of this

Professional researchers and acadics have found that nigeria is the 16th most failed state in the world

This is hard fact - indesputable.

agaugust:
Cheetah jet is French made Mirage.

Alouette Helicopters form France.

European artillery, and any Impalas (Italy made) and naval boats you may have re-sold.

Also many smaller arms , go check on SIPRI

This guy doesnt know how we modify equipment

I suppose he thinks the Kfir, Cheeta and Mirage are all the same thing

agaugust:
SAAF Mirage was modified into Cheetah jet by ISRAEL not you !
.

[citation needed]

agaugust:
Show us where the same Reuters journalist revised SANDF casualties to 13 by his own account.

All I see are South Africans revising Seleka casualties to 1,000 via laptop and internet.

Show us the Reuters witness's revised report !
.

Been posted many times

ChukwuCantDie:
What is SAcan slangs? All those companies you named are small time, stup1d zulu.

Lol

He says zulu like its an insult

Zulus killed more english soldiers in one battle that all the tribes of Nigeria combined in your nations entire history

With regards to your nonsense about white south africans, i reply with the words of the great former president Thabo Mbeki "no one dares contest when i say, they are africans"

agaugust:
[size=16pt]


ANC had no courage or brains to sustain full scale terrorism and suicide attacks in South Africa, if the did, Pietha Botha would have surrendered in 1980s. Apartheid would not have waited for Nigerian led sanctions to quench it.

The only two major attacks on South African soil were 100% successful, if ANC had done 100 bombings in Pretoria and Johannesburg they would have all been successful.

SADF, Police, BOSS intel were all caught flat footed and reduced to ZERO by illiterate ANC terrorist attackers.

No war has ever been fought on South African home soil in modern times.

If ANC gave AK-47, 23mm Cannon trucks, and RPG to 1,000 black men and they take over white area of Durban city at 3 AM dark night, South African military will wake up the next day and will not be able to rain artillery or jet fighter bombs on Durban city for fear of killing their fellow Boer white civilians in the city .

South Africa has ZERO threat at home in the magnitude of what Nigeria faces.

Meanwhile, the lone man bicycle rider put South African military and intelligence forces on world history map as the ONLY country that failed to protect a nuclear reactor from one single ANC Rambo guy that even has no car to operate, he could have even used a donkey to mess up your country's freaking useless defensive and intelligence network
.

[/size]

They only managed two attackes because out intelligence networks were so effective you clown

There was no nuclear reactor present during the bombing - it was a building site. He got away long before the bomb went off

South Africa faced greater challenges as over 90% of the population were agaisnt the government

No war has been fought on our land due to the exellence of our security services.

Yet again, facts are facts:
- 1,6 million displaced
- nigeria tops world terror ranking
- multiple military instillations overrun
- multiple towns lost, most are still in BH hands
- vast ammounts of military equipment captured by BH
- huge groups of BH fighters roam the north completely unapposed by the NA

Your military is (based on factual evidence) a complete and utter joke.

agaugust:
[size=16pt]

Koeberg nuclear reactor, I posted the newpaper reports here many times last year. Also SADF Air Force HQ was terrorist blown up and people died, posted it here with photos and detailed analysis.

South African military 100% INCOMPETENCE on homeland soil, failed your only test against weak terrorists riding bicycle.

http://www.sahistory.org.za/dated-event/anc-attacks-koeberg-nuclear-power-station-0

http://www.sahistory.org.za/dated-event/car-bomb-explodes-outside-air-force-headquarters

You Southies need Nigerians to teach you both Mathematics and ANC history, no wonder you didn't know Mandela was trained in Nigeria...we made Mandela, you worship a mere man that is made in Nigeria !

[/size]
.

The building site for the nuclear reactor was bombed - no nuclear material was present and the facility was years away from completion.

Airforce HQ suffered minor damage and casualties

By contrast there have been hundreds of bombings in nigeria and dozens of military instillations overrun

We also never lost a single inch of soil tp the enemy - in contrast bh has set up a massive caliphate

agaugust:
South African nuclear reactor was blown up by ANC terrorists inside South Africa by one man who escaped on bicycle under the noses of all South African military and intelligence forces.

South African air force headquarters was blown up inside South Africa by terrorists in broad daylight.

What makes you better than Nigeria? We fight suicide bombers, you fight an enemy that is not even bold enough to kill himself.

Book Haram will wreck South Africa if they operate from among your citizens
.

The building site for the reactor was bombed - so that as usual is a lie

The airforce HQ bombing resulted in minor casualties and minor damage

By contrast there have been HUNDREDS of bombings in Nigeria and numerous military instillations overrun

Henry120:
Are you blind?

Tell me why we should be impressed

iterator24:
[size=15pt] this kids killed 19 and injured 27 of SANDF after breaking through a 400 man SANDF force , seize their vehicles and made them run to the French forces like a ~itch,

[/size]


they have been reduced to forces that take Hollywood pictures to show off lol

We lost 13 men

Total combat force was 200 men

We only left the base for the french held airport after Seleka agreed to a cease-fire

agaugust:
F-7 jet uses S-8 to S-13 series of rockets, the details and ranges are on wikipedia analysis, 3km to 6km.

F-7 is as fast as Umkhonto SAM, we will never be hit, you waste ALL your missiles then F-7 will rocket ALL SAN Valour frigates to kingdom come !

SAN has bad air defence on ALL Valour frigates, if you sail in force projection, your Frigates will be sank by even a MiG-21
.

Show us what missiles you have - why are you unable to substantiate your cliams?

F7 will be flying towards the frigate when engaged - so it matters not how fast it is

agaugust:
[size=16pt]The whole of Kruger park is controlled by invading Rhino poachers from Mozambique etc, they rule your homeland including portions of land owned by SANDF itself
.[/size]

[citation needed]

agaugust:
What's so important about a remote area lonely FOB ? As if the place should be defended like a gold and diamond mine, that fvcking FOB was in no man's land between two countries, dry semi-desert with nothing at stake worth dying for.

We should send NAF F-7 jets to defend sand and lake Chad water? Na goldmine and diamond mine?
.

Why?

Because nigerian soldiers were there and needed help - that is reason enough

Second, why set up a FOB in an area unless it has value

agaugust:
How many were your freedom fighters from Soweto nation? Book Haram is estimated at about 20,000 men in West Africa.

Your 1980s freedom fighters were AK-47 hunters, they don't even have mobile phones talk less of having Boko Haram satellite phone, ZSU-23 Shilka and T-55 tanks.

Islamic insurgents frustrated USA/EU out of Afghanistan.

SANDF was frustrated by ordinary Rhino Poachers
.

Boko haram are only well armed because your army is constantly allowing equipment to be captured

They only muster large figures because you are unable to inflict losses and cut off ther recruitment

Rhino poaching is on the decrease and SAnDF has done what nigeria cannot - secure our borders

Henry120:
It simply means assets are deployed to areas where they are most required.

Remote FOB's can be allowed to be overran while the army re-strategies and lays siege t on the area.

Wtf did i just read?

Allowing positions to be overrun?

Seiges in COIN?

No wonder you guys are unable to win

Henry120:
An impressive LAV no matter the language you speak or whatever lens you choose to look at it.

Your eyes can pop into your butthole if they choose to........ I just don't give a Fvck!

Why is it impressive?

Henry120:
A remote FOB would get attacked, and most likely get overrun if an enemy numbering over a thousand attacks it.

The rest of your comments are a whole load of horse sh1t!!

His comments are extreamely valid

agaugust:
It's much easier to attack an air force base that has parked helicopters, than to attack an army base defended by T-72 tanks. I ask again, how old are you sir?

Maybe you should substantiate your claims before you start questioning others

agaugust:
From inside your bedroom in South Africa, you see situation on ground inside Northern Nigerian towns 5,000 km away, your juju strong o !
.

And you can?

agaugust:
Photos show so many bullet holes on the walls of SANDF base, and your own soldier @Andrewza boasted here about SANDF killing Seleka men that climbed over the walls.

You see how fraudulent you people are?

The battle ended with the defence of the base you clown

agaugust:
Israeli army does not face attack by hundreds of insurgents hitting a small remote FOB, what they face is rocket firing across borders by Hamas.

No soldier can fight without bullets, he has to withdraw. The Israeli soldiers who were not smart enough to withdraw when heavily outnumbered and running out of ammunition got captured by Egyptian army in their last Arab-Israeli war.

Break army tactical rules, suffer death or captivity.

The soldiers in Baga FOB were well trained in combat tactical rules, so they knew when to withdraw as ammunition finished. If they are cowards as you guys wrongly say, they won't stand and fight for 7 hours until last bullet
.

SANDF ran out of bullets in bangui

We still held our base at the end of the battle

agaugust:
SANDF abandoned it's base at jet speed and ran to the airport to seek French army protection

Only after we forced the rebels inyo a ceasfire