₦airaland Forum

jln115:
Denel partnering with TKMS on upgrading SA Navy’s frigates and submarines

http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=47108:denel-partnering-with-tkms-on-upgrading-sa-navys-frigates-and-submarines&catid=51:Sea&Itemid=106

I keep forgetting we have four...

Very silly to only buy 3 OPv's... would love to see their business management plan, no idea how they plan on consistently keeping one on station

One would assume we would need one on station on either coast at any one time... and thats ignoring the waters off some of our island territories, which are no doubt being ra.ped

DaV8King:
Wrong Sir. Your own cited SIPRI states 43 total, with none coming post-2015

23 modernized T-72 B came from Ukraine between 2014 and 2015
20 T-72 M1 from the Czech Republic in 2015. Check the logs again.

And fellow Naija ppl, edakun, why are all our T-72 used and so few,new thing no dey sweet us?!!

If I am correct we once bought 100+ Vickers MBT without any pressing need, so why all this piecemeal purchases at times of war?

O sh1t, you are correct. I checked 2015-16 and forgot to cross-check with 2014 included.

Apologies.

Henry240:
T-72av's total from Ukraine are 23 - 25, total exports to Nigeria. Nigerian government panel confirms around 50 T-72s in all.

I don't see the D-30s listed either in the report.

T72's are 20 total

You got the D-30's in 1966

If you want to make assertions, post citations.

TrueHeart365:
because we can do better than them and it's disgraceful that a country we feed can get things done.

just look at uganda

Uganda only has 50K soldiers

Less men = more money for equipment

Hence why I said it was bad for Nigeria to expand the army to over 100,00 and why I argued for a reduction in the size of the landward arm of the SANDF

jakeporeshenko:
You just proved your argument of Nigeria having only 20 T-72s wrong, first deliveries of this tank started in February 2015 by air, An 225 made 3 round trips to Kano airport, these deliveries were by Czech company Excalibur group. Later on dear year T-72 Av came by sea from Ukraine (confirmed by their own MOD). Add these to the 20 SIPRI managed to track.

There are only 20, those are the 20 tracked by Sipri

Sipri has now included 2016 in their database...

Nigeria:
- 3 Super Tucano's listed
- 3 JF-17
- 10 Super Mushtak
- 12 Mi-35M (delivery to end in 2018)
- 10 BM-21 Grad 122mm listed as purchased last year ()
- 20 BMP-1 (BVP-1)
- 20 T-72's (@Henry120)
- 79 assorted MRAP's from South Africa

Thats all the new stuff for you guys that was interesting, read it yourself for more detail lots of stuff I missed or didnt find interesting
http://armstrade.sipri.org/armstrade/page/trade_register.php

South Africa didnt buy anything last year

africaken254:
Kenyan female Staff Sergeant during Catholic celebration of Ash Wednesday

Catholic?

Blue Chasuble!?!?!

Heresy.

tdayof:
SOF does not exist. As the term SOF is the exact same thing as SF.
The US uses SOF to distinguish between army SF and those under special operations command.

Apart from that, In an international scenario SF is SOF. they're just different terms.

So certain Royal Marine Commando's = SAS??
Jaegers = Green Berets?

The you are correct as to the technical origin of the term, but it has evolved in modern parlance and usage. Go to any other military forum and start calling elite light infantry SF and you will get your arse chewed out.

Henry240:
At no point have i ever claimed i was in the military. However it is apparent i know way more than those who claim to be in the military.

I make no apologies for that.

"Im clever, because I say so"

Classic Augustine120 move.

Henry240:
It doesn't help when your military men don't know what they are talking about and require schooling from a civilian.

When they are largely ignorant. I find that to be quite problematic.

"They professionals dont know what they are talking about, ONLY I KNOW WHAT IS WHAT"

The level of fvcking stupidity from this guy.

Augustine120 confirmed.

Henry240:
I don't know if I'm supposed to repeat myself at every turn.

SOF does not exist. As the term SOF is the exact same thing as SF.

Because you have received additional training in some sort of speciality does not necessarily make you an SOF. You're just a more mobile infantry or a Quick Reaction Unit.

Your MRS is nothing more than a Naval Infantry. If this was the case, every Naval infantryman in the Nigerian navy would be referred to as some special super duper soldier.

They arent Naval infantry

Therefore they *must* be SF

See the problem?

Henry240:
Naval infantry for your MRS. I don't know the job roles or training of the others.

Military intelligence is not SF.

Like I've stated countless times, there is nothing like SOF and SF. There is just SF. Those titles are used interchangeably to mean the same thing.

1. MRS arent Marines - by your definition they are SF

2. Tacticall Intelligence are scouts - by your definition they are SF

see the problem?

(Hint: The problem is that you are talking out of your ass)

jln115:
Just for the sake of interest....as what would you classify South African Navy MRS ,Pathfinders, tactical intelligence regiment?

Depends how Gucci their kit is

Henry240:
This is more of the fact that there is only SF. SF is SF, no difference.

Pic 1 = Pic 2 according to our man Augustine120

Henry240:
Dude, there is nothing like SF and SOF, there is just SF. Special Forces.


The usage of SF units in the Middle-East is a clear indication that warfare is fluid and can change, so strategy and policy makers have to keep with this constant change of warfare.

SF units were initially created to deal with the Soviet threat or the possibility of Soviet Invasion of Western Europe. Since this never happened and the Soviet Union collapsed the application of SF units changed to deal with the threat posed by extremism and radicalism in the late 80's and early 90's.

Your claim that operations in the M.E do not represent the core of SF operations is absolute nonsense.

Nigerian units are relatively young, but in that short period they have engaged in countless operations not just in Nigeria but across Africa which has helped to define the doctrine they operate by. With each changing threat, doctrine would be improved upon as warfare isn't static.

The IPV launched by the Nigerian army is one of such steps geared towards enhancing operational capabilities.

Ops are Intelligence driven, this is why Recon is one of the roles of SF units, not the only role.

Like i said previously, mission type would determine mission equipment. Quick raids or Airborne raids would be carried out by so called SPVs, Direct Action raids which SF units also carry out would be prosecuted with equipment that sooth that role. Hence the use of a wide array of vehicles by SF units, not restricted to Recon alone.

1. Maybe for Nigeria or Russia there is no differentiation, but for the rest of the world there is.
[Yeah yeah, semantics, I get it. The fact is, however, that making the differentiation between SF and SOF makes life simpler. By Henry120's wide definition Royal Marine Commandoes would be classified as SF, as would American Rangers, as would Marine FAST teams, as would the SANDF's MRS or 7th Provost or Tactical Intelligence Regiment. Its so broad that it encompasses basically anyone who isnt a basic infantryman]

2. No, the deployment of SF in the middle-east has followed the core tenets of what their role is: Gather intel, train locals, capture HVT's. Again, there are lots of different units deployed - you seem to paint them all as SF.

3. No, SF were formed in WW2 for operations behind enemy lines - primarily intelligence driven, but with side roles in raiding. American SF were devloped in the early 1960s (Snake Eaters) by John F Kennedy to fight in wars where he could not deploy regular soldiers - primarily as trainers of local troops. Delta was formed for CT purposes in the 1970's. The SAS were actually DISBANDED and repurposed as a purley recon based formation for a long period of time. The Americans did the same with their OSS - disbanding their only special forces formation from 1945 until 1961 (they fought a huge conventional war in that period)

The rest of your response is a straw-man argument. No one is making the points you are trying to refute.

Stop de-railing this thread with your vitriol.

Henry240:
There is nothing like SOF and SF, they are all the same thing. Stop confusing yourself.

An SF unit can be deployed in direct and indirect action roles. As the mission demands they deploy.

Tons of examples abound, the Nigerian navy SBS conduct direct action, indirect action and Recon. Air Force Regiment the same thing, including Forward Air Control. AFSF also conduct the same types of raids.

In Syria we see Russian SSO conduct direct action and indirect action in that battle space, same thing for the French in Mali, Direct and Indirect. US navy seals in both Iraq and Syria. We've seen that in Manbij, Mosul etc etc. We've also seen the same thing play with the Turk's in Al-bab and elsewhere in Syria. In this battles we've seen Special Forces deploy vehicles from Pick-up trucks to Striker IFVs, and anything in-between, that's Tigr LAV, Jankel SPV, M-ATV and the likes. From the photos seen, only the British in Syria and the French in Mali have used SPVs.

The Russians in Syria deploy in Tigr and Pick-up trucks, the Americans deploy in Pick-up trucks, M-ATV and Striker IFVs.

So, LTGEN is also right, in those scenarios where it is mostly going to be direct action raids, SPVs arent the sort of vehicles to deploy.

In Nigeria, Special Forces deploy in MRAPs or Pick-up trucks. Special forces vehicles like the Honker are used only as base defence vehicles by NAF Regiment.

1. SOF and SF is an actual distinction pertaining to role and usage. Special forces may have job over-lap with Special Operations Forces, but Special Operations Forces are certainly not Special Forces.

2. No one is saying that. Did you even read his post?

3. Your main mistake is classifying everyone you see with Gucci kit as "Special Forces". For example, the guys in the Stryker in Iraq are from the 82nd Airborne Division.

frumentius:
It's military police, what can one say?

I saw the gun, then instantly looked to see if her holster was empty... MP's and their Gucci kit

Also... since she is an MP... where is her Yellow Bib? Everyone knows MP's derive their power from their yellow bibs

frumentius:
My last Armed Forces Day 2017 pics.

Pic 3: The woman has two pistols!!!

kenpaul0:
Hi Patches, can you please explain why the US retired its fighter bomber fleet. From my little understanding it has to do with a change of warfare strategy

Because with the advent of guided munitions and targetting pods a B-1 can now do what a F-111 did.

More payload, longer range, longer loiter time and safer.

Another example is the USAF using the B-52 in place of the A-10.

Hrmnn:
Onsbok APC.

This exact vehicle was the first purpose-built armoured personnel carrier to ever be manufactured in sub-Saharan Africa.

It is the second APC type to be built on the continent as a whole, since the Egyptian Walid was the first.

The Onsbok was made in RSA in the late 1960s using parts from the Eland series and based off the Panhard M3. Three were produced but the original prototype (this one) is the only known survivor.

The project was shelved due to the Ratel programme.

I see the ring mounting

Turreted as standard?

Henry240:
My problem is with the stupidity of the South-African response. My post clearly stated "No longer" meaning i am aware that the F-111 is no longer in service or I am aware a US Air Force Fighter-Bomber was in service, but that is no longer the case. Only for me to get a mention that makes absolutely no sense with some smug picture.

...And I'm suppose to say "well done lad?". Unfortunately i can't do that.

*FACE-PALM*

Dude, seriously?

You: The US has no equivalent of the Su35
Me: The US is so advanced they retired their equivalent of the Su35
You: WHAT DID HE MEAN BY THIS?!?!?!

They have moved beyond the need for a "Su35", and hence, retired their "Su35".

Vikkie14:
You guys are going haywire again right?

NafeesaAA, Henry's body cells aren't playing the right cords and i was told you know his "Password".

Patches you're being pathetically pathetic in your response.

We don't want another Insane argument please.

Factual information is now pathetic?

Frankly, Henry120's constant lashing out at whomever corrects him is what is pathetic. If he doesnt want to be told he is wrong, he should not offer his opinion.

This should have been an issue that was contained in 2-3 posts.
Him: I think this
Me: Well no, because that
Him: [either] O wow, I didnt know about that [or] I disagree because this,

Instead we get autistic screeching

Henry240:
Most times you post comments that are so senseless, I begin to wonder why i even bother replying you.


Yes, according to you, Targeting Pods aren't integrated on Russian made fighters, the Russians also don't have an indigenous pod under development and the Russian Air Force doesn't have the license to produce the Thales Damocles targeting pod.

Word of advice, perhaps you should always endeavor to avoid my post in this thread, and quite spamming my mentions.

Why are you so rude?

The Russians dont have any pods for their strategic bombers. Please dont obfuscate the issue by making misleading assertions. Very rude. Very untruthful. Very sad. (Many such cases!)

Here is how it goes:
Step 1: The Russians develop a pod that compares with the AN/AAQ-33
Step 2: They fit it on the Tu-22M
Effect: The Su35 becomes doctrinally obsolete (inferior bomb load, inferior loiter time, inferior survivability, inferior deployability)

Which is exactly what Russia is looking into (google: Tu-22M-3 Backfire C Growth Paths, Sapsan-E Targeting pod)


B1 + F15 > F111

hence

Tu-22M + Su30 > Su35

You need to work on your attitude. And your contextual knowledge. Augustine120

Henry240:
That's why there is specifically a No Longer in my post. We all know the F-111 is no longer in service, hence the "no longer" in my reply.


First try understand english, then you understand my post, then you respond. Doing this 3 aforementioned things would lead to less conflict in this thread.

The irony of this post.

I suggest you take your own advice:

Henry240:
The Americans no longer have a fighter-bomber of this class.

BECAUSE:

Patchesagain:
They are so far ahead their version has allready been retired

If you applied your own rules, you would realize that I was referencing how recent advancements [Sniper Pods + JDAMs] have rendered Heavy Strike Fighters obsolete.

But no, you didnt read my post, you dont understand what I was talking about and instead you would rather insult forum members and try de-rail the thread again.

The only reason there is conflict in this thread is because you do not know how to behave.

Be better, Augustine120.

Henry240:
Both countries have similar type kit in every category. The only area where I think there is a disparity is with the SU-34. The Americans no longer have a fighter-bomber of this class.

They are so far ahead their version has allready been retired

RG-35 showing the beating it can take

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gT3IndWXYs

Henry240:
The waters are very uneasy and rough down south in South-Africa, however i won't go as far as crediting the SA navy for the lack of pirate attacks in those waters. If this was the case, illegal fishing by foreign vessels won't also be an issue, but it is in South-African waters.

The thing with Southern African waters is, Pirates don't exist in those areas. Operation Copper is a good example, there hasn't be any single SA navy pirate take down in Mozambique were the SA navy is deployed in nearly 1 -2 years of deployment.

That's basically the difference.

No piracy because piracy has been pre-empted.

Fishing is a DWAF not SAN issue.

**OFF TOPIC***

(i dont know how to pm people, so I will just leave this here)

@Henry120 @AngryEastAfricanWhoAllwaysWantsPeopleToAskTheirMothersQuestions

We were talking about these guys a couple months back.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOvBTPvsXAU

chkil:
it's the same with algerian ones , i read it's because Meko A200 frigates use the Combined Diesel and Gas, CODAG-WARP propulsion package , known for its superior performance regarding acceleration, size, economy and range, along with a very innovative exhaust layout.

Seems their Meko has the same marks.

I bet its watever the Europeans use to cushion the vessel while its alongside the quay.

I think we just somma just use big tires

OMG MY BPENIS JUST EXPLODED

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9l_NnvsB-g
#MyPenisIsGone

ActivateKruger:
What did they miss?

Look at the video again.

When the 2 Olifants are firing.

They both miss.

ssaengine:
SANDF


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvQAr2H3EI8

They missed....