₦airaland Forum

I wonder where the Europeans come into all this. If one wants to discuss traditional medicine, one can do it without making comparisons to the Arabs, Chinese, Europeans, etc. It comes off as if one is more interested in how one stands relative to the Europeans than in the subject (African traditional medicine) itself.

comnsense: Point 3, I am no expert in but at some point in the past, something would have had to come from nothing or from something that cannot be created.

You say this because. . .?

Some schools point to this something as the zero point energy (potential energy) that was there before the bang.

What schools are these? Reference?

CAMEROONPRIDE: did u look the map ? did you read the links or it was too long for you? i keep telling you that i'm not claiming Nigerians/cameroonians now nigerians people....all i want it's the land that you guys are occupying .....during the past decade many territorial modifications can be made .....just like in Cameroon where the country is now divided in regions,district has been linked with departments etc...as a Cameroonian i really don't know how your territory is divided now .....my bad to that but the issue stay the same you still own us km2 ...MAYBE IT'S LESSER than 300 000 ....but what i know is Cameroon was about 700 000 km2 when the germans come there now it's only 4750 442km2+bakassi

You don't seem to understand what I'm saying so it's like you just read what I'm saying without thinking about it and reflecting over it. I think you should look for books on the colonial periods of both countries to gain some understanding because I don't seem to be making any progress explaining things to you. Later.

Cheikh, I think that with enough time and consultation, peaceful agreements can be worked out between all parties on who will or will not align with who and what countries will be formed. If this isn't carried out, Nigeria can still survive, but whether it will thrive and prosper is another matter.

CAMEROONPRIDE: according to the maps left my the germans and the britain calabar to enugu belogs to us..i want it back as soon as we reach the 50M people i will claim it

Calabar, Enugu, etc. belong to the inhabitants of those areas, whether they claim Cameroonian or Nigerian nationality. So what you're essentially claiming is that they should be Cameroonian. That's fine, but it seems they've never declared or asked for political allegiance to Cameroon.

You haven't shown any evidence that there was some dispute between the Germans, British or French over the territorial extent of the southern protectorate of Nigeria that involved those places you keep mentioning, so I don't think you really have a point. You've repeated this 300,000 sq km claim on several threads, and I thought there might really be something behind it, but I think you're a bit too unfamiliar with the history of some of the places you're talking about and it's resulted in you promoting a completely implausible claim.

CAMEROONPRIDE: you make it difficult ....those states have been recently created .....

They were created out of a preexisting region, that was created out of a preexisting protectorate, which was officially part of Nigeria. That's all I'm saying.

CAMEROONPRIDE: nope you do not understand .......they decided to be Nigerians and i respect their choice ..but they live on a cameroonian land and i claim the land ..they are illegal immigrants.

Well you still haven't explained how the land was Cameroonian.

I read the links. It's not at all clear from those links how Cross River state or Abia state was Cameroonian land.

If I understand you correctly, you're claiming that the Cross River state and Abia state peoples should be Cameroonian.

I don't know what their opinion on being Cameroonian would be as an outsider - I would guess that they probably would have preferred it to being Nigerian.

But what I do know is that both Cross River state and Abia state and the area "from oron/calabar to Enugu" were part of the Eastern region of Nigeria and were part of the southern protectorate of Nigeria during colonial times. So I don't think there's an issue of land being officially owed that involves these areas.

Seun:

                                          `-.`'.-'
                                       `-.   ₦₦   .-'.
                                    `-.    -./\.-    .-'
                                        -.  /_|\  .-
                                    `-.   `/____\'   .-'.
                                 `-.    -./.-₦₦-.\.-      '
                                    `-.  /< (()) >\  .-'
                                  -   .`/__`-..-'__\'   .-
                                ,...`-./___|____|___\.-'.,.
                                   ,-'   ,` . . ',   `-,
                                ,-'   ________________  `-,
                                   ,'/____|_____|_____\
                                  / /__|_____|_____|___\
                                 / /|_____|_____|_____|_\
                                ' /____|_____|_____|_____\
                              .' /__|_____|_____|_____|___\
                             ,' /|_____|_____|_____|_____|_\
,,---''--...___...--'''--.. /../____|_____|_____|_____|_____\ ..--```--...___...--``---,,
                           '../__|_____|_____|_____|_____|___\
      \    )              '.:/|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_\               (    /
      )\  / )           ,':./____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____\             ( \  /(
     / / ( (           /:../__|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|___\             ) ) \ \
    | |   \ \         /.../|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_\           / /   | |
 .-.\ \    \ \       '..:/____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____\         / /    / /.-.
(=  )\ `._.' |       \:./ _  _ ___  ____ ____ _    _ _ _ _ _  _ ___\        | `._.' /(  =)
 \ (_)       )       \./  ₦\/₦ ₦__₦ ₦___ ₦___ ₦___ _₦_ _₦_  \/  _₦_ \       (       (_) /
  \    `----'         """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""       `----'    /
   \   ____\__                                                              __/____   /
    \ (=\     \                                                            /     /-) /
     \_)_\     \                                                          /     /_(_/
          \     \                                                        /     /
           )     )  _                                                _  (     (
          (     (,-' `-..__                                    __..-' `-,)     )
           \_.-''          ``-..____                  ____..-''          ``-._/
            `-._                    ``--...____...--''                    _.-'
                `-.._                                                _..-'
                     `-..__           ₦₦₦₦₦₦₦₦₦₦₦₦₦₦           __..-'
                           ``-..____                  ____..-''
                                    ``--...____...--''

lol

If Nigerians can be "resettled" and moved from Bakassi on the basis of the claim from colonists that Bakassi belongs to Cameroon, I don't see why the same cannot happen to Cameroonians living on what is claimed to be Nigerian land. If you support one instance, then you must necessarily support the other. Nevertheless, you have yet to give any evidence to suggest than any part of Cross River state or Abia state was originally or properly territorially Cameroonian or that Cameroonians were moved out of that land. The burden of proof is not really on me here, and I don't have access to all material relating to land disputes or the Cameroon-Nigeria referendum at my fingertips or even enough to engage in some sort of exhaustive research of the issue, so I'll just forget about it and move on if you can't bring the evidence.

CAMEROONPRIDE: the cross river state and Abbia state .....belong to us.

Where in Cross River state and Abia state exactly?

If you are or if Ahidjo was trying to claim the entire area of those states, then maybe that's why the French told Ahidjo to be quiet. Such a claim does not make any logical sense.

Ki-Katanga:
Can Nigeria settle its tensions or is a peaceful separation the best way forward?

The obvious answer to the question in the title of the thread is that yes, Nigeria is better off split. I didn't use to think this way when I first joined this forum, but I quickly learned how irreconcilable our differences were.

The only real potential problem is splitting the country on terms that are favorable to every group.

You did not answer my question at all. State exactly where this land that you think is owed is located. If you don't know the name, give the coordinates of the boundaries of it.

Cam pride,

What/where is this 300,000 sq km that you keep going on about Nigeria owing to Cameroon? Are you talking about land or territorial waters or atmosphere or what?

kikuyu1: Actually,everyone,the OP is right! As strange as it may sound blacks who lived in Europe in appreciable numbers,not just slaves as the MSM would have us believe,were also part of the nobility. Those of you living in the US can test the hypothesis of a black European presence. Find out how many AA friends are actually derived from Europe. How many traced their origins there or alternatively have one or 2 start the geneological route map. You'd be very surprised at the results! Most of the history books are complete bs.

Dude, that's due to white men molesting or exploiting black women while slavery was going on. Most AA Caucasian ancestry is from white males. Even MLK's ancestry was Irish.

Pretty much everything the OP posted was garbage.

You people are in a world of deep self delusion. See some fool even mentioning Edo as if a single Edoid name (not just claiming Edo as state of origin/residence) has been linked to Islamic fanatical terrorism.

Face reality and try to put some of your boko haram al queda brothers up north in check.

alanmwene: Nigerians cant do that!They have only the guts to be prostitutes,419ers,drugs dealers,etc...They dont have the guts to stand for matters of principles!Come to think of it,nigerians men(yorubas,igbos,....) were the favorite sexual partners of slaves masters.In brazil congolese like zumbi(nganga zambi)fought hard and set up independant states for runaway slaves whereas yorubas ,igbos,..were just sitting all days crying baba oluwa,...and gettign bleeped in the arses by white men.Silly gays!

Read about Candido da Fonseca Galvao and also the Imale/Male revolt in Bahia and try to get a more realistic perspective.

Anyway, what this woman did was silly.

Very cool pictures Sybellah.

shymmex: Your analogy is flawed!!

The richest African Americans are also a face for corporate White America. Most of the people behind Oprah Winfrey's success, Bob Johnson's wealth, and the wealth created by Hip-hop - are the corporate White America... If the wealth from hip-hop was 'built from the scratch' like you want us to believe - then, old hip-hop heads like; Kool Herc, Rakim, AFrican Bambataa etc.. should be billionaires by now - and most of the hip-hop executives should also be AAs... Even the few record companies owned by blacks, are still subsidiaries to bigger white owned/controlled companies.... America is more intertwined than you asserted in your post, and once you get white executives involved - it's easier to create wealth in their capitalist economy than it's in Nigeria...

Another example is how people make noise about the rich NFL and NBA players, but forget that 99.9% of all the NFL and NBA teams are owned by white people... They're the ones who create the wealth - the black 'millionaires' playing the sports are just employees, who can be discarded when their services are no longer required...

You need to give Nigerian businessmen credit, brother... It isn't easy to break the barrier, and create wealth in a developing country like; Nigeria...

A Dangote, or Michael Adenuga is more savvy when it comes to creating wealth than an Oprah Winfrey, or a Bob Johnson...

I think you may have missed my point, or maybe you got my point but just think I'm underselling Nigerian millionaires. I didn't really take all credit away from Nigerian businessmen, but explained why there had been and still are Nigerian millionaires from everything from transportation to timber, rubber, cocoa, banking, etc. and of course, oil, within Nigeria - Nigerians are fully immersed in the society and not in any way on the periphery politically or socially and so they can more easily exploit existing vacuums where serious profits can be made. They know what is needed/wanted/popular/useful and how to profit from it. To do the same thing would be harder for African Americans in their society (America), but easier for white Americans. That's all I was saying. It's about being able to know what the entire society - not just your subgroup - wants or needs and being in a position to capitalize on that.

^^

Thanks for the correction.

I don't think they were "influenced" at all, because the way I see it, diversification/differentiation of languages was the reason for the split of Bantu from non-Bantu and the Bantu languages are just a more recent unique subgroup of "Niger Congo" that attained a very large size/population of speakers.

Looking at the specific languages you mentioned (Yoruba, Edo, and Igbo), when either read or pronounced, they seem very different from (many) Bantu languages, and this difference (which is apparent not just for Yoruba, Edo, and Igbo, but for other West African languages) is probably why there was some initial resistance on the part of professional linguists to claiming that there was some sort of deep relationship between West African languages and Bantu languages, before they finally joined them. I believe there is a relationship, as attested to by the shared roots of several words, but this relationship doesn't mean that words shared between Bantu languages and non-Bantu West African languages are due to influence of one upon the other, but just that, sharing a recent origin in the same place, they diverged from a common root. However, some other language groups came from the same relatively recent common root as well.

A good example is the word you brought up in your original post, the word "omo/umu" meaning "people" or "children". Far from being a Bantu or Proto Bantu remnant/aspect of Niger-Congo languages that was derived in non-Bantu West African languages from "muntu" or variations on "muntu", I would actually see it as a remnant of an even older original language from which Niger Congo languages and Afroasiatic languages emerged. Look at the word and compare it with Hebrew and Arabic (Afroasiatic languages):


Yoruba:

omo - child (omo is also child for Edo and umu is child for Igbo)

Edo:

omwan - person

emwan - people

Igbo:

umunna - children/descendants (umu) of the same father (nna)

Arabic:

ummah - commmunity or nation

Hebrew:

ummah - nation

wikipedia: Ummah (Arabic: أمة‎) is an Arabic word meaning "nation" or "community". It is commonly used to mean either the collective nation of Islamic state, or (in the context of pan-Arabism) the whole Arab world. In the context of Pan-Islamism, the word ummah is used to mean the diaspora[citation needed] or Commonwealth[citation needed] of the Believers (أمة المؤمنين ummat al-muʼminīn), and thus the whole Muslim people

Origin

The phrase Ummah Wāhidah in the Quran (أمة واحدة, 'One Community') refers to all of the Islamic world unified. The Quran says: “You [Muslims] are the best nation brought out for Mankind, commanding what is righteous (معروف Maʻrūf, lit. 'recognized [as good]') and forbidding what is wrong (منكر Munkar, lit. 'unrecognized [as good]')…” [3:110].

On the other hand, in Arabic Ummah can also be used in the more Western sense of nation, for example: Al-Umam Al-Muttaḥidah, the United Nations.

The Constitution of Medina, an early document said to have been negotiated by Muhammad in AD 622 with the leading clans of Medina, explicitly refers to Jewish and pagan citizens of Medina as members of the Ummah.[1][2][3][4]

In modern Hebrew, the word Ummah (אוּמָה) means "nation", from the root[citation needed] ʿam (עַם), or "people".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ummah


There are other examples, of course. Another one: iya (Yoruba) - mother, nwanyi (Igbo) - woman/female, iye (Edo) - mother, eym (Hebrew) - mother

And there are others, though it would take quite a while to dig them all up.


There is a very fierce (kind of) debate I've come across that is still ongoing where some anthropologists and linguists are trying desperately to "separate" Afroasiatic from other African language groups and group Proto-Afroasiatic with proto-Indo-European or just consider Afroasiatic an isolated language family separate from other African language groups - and part of this debate revolves around (not always explicitly, but it's a relevant factor) whether one specific group, the Egyptians, are to be seen as some unique East African group with Western Asiatic influence or as some kind of "racially" Middle Eastern/Semitic/Western Asiatic group with East African influence - an argument which I don't think that those trying to change/distort the existing classification will win in the end. You can't just have Yorubas, Edos, and Igbos, totally and undoubtedly black African groups, sharing some roots for very fundamental words (not obtainable through trade) with some Semitic languages without Proto-Afroasiatic sharing the same ultimate origin with Proto-Niger-Congo. The weird thing about the debate is that it is rarely acknowledged that human languages are not discrete, but form a kind of continuum with languages in between different extremes or endpoints with respect to different aspects/features and words, so classifying a language as being closer to one group than another does not really cordon off that group into a "separate" branch of humanity like some people involved in that debate are making it seem. At the end of the day, every group is just a subgroup of an older original group until you go back to the very start of humanity.

Balyz: You can you ever dream of being a professor, talk much less of a vice chancellor?

lmao @ this

Yeah, actually I can. Maybe for you it's impossible, but then again, you and me are not peers.

mkmyers45: In The Science Delusion, biochemist Rupert Sheldrake lays out what he calls the 'dogma of science'. I thought it might be fun to post them and see what you all think of them!

1. Everything is essentially mechanical. Dogs, for example, are complex mechanisms, rather than living organisms with goals of their own. Even people are machines, “lumbering robots”, in Richard Dawkins’s vivid phrase, with brains that are like genetically programmed computers.

Well, no. This is not any kind of dogma of modern science at all.

2. All matter is unconscious. It has no inner life or subjectivity or point of view. Even human consciousness is an illusion produced by the material activity of brains.

Usually one goes with the simplest explanation until evidence for a more complex explanation is provided.

3. The total amount of matter and energy is always the same (with the exception of the Big Bang, when all the matter and energy of the Universe suddenly appeared).

Whether there is conservation of energy over the entire universe is not clear or some kind of dogma.

4. The laws of nature are fixed. They are the same today as they were at the beginning, and they will stay the same forever.

Actually, it's believed that forces (electromagnetic, strong, etc.) diverged from an original force and then diverged some more after that. Meaning that the forces at work were different from what obtains now.

5. Nature is purposeless, and evolution has no goal or direction.

If a mutation increases the biological fitness of an organism, that is evolution. Increasing the fitness of an organism is definitely a goal/direction.

6. All biological inheritance is material, carried in the genetic material, DNA, and in other material structures.

And what else would "biological inheritance" be carried in?

7. Minds are inside heads and are nothing but the activities of brains. When you look at a tree, the image of the tree you are seeing is not ‘out there’, where it seems to be, but inside your brain.

?

What does this even mean? Is there supposed to be some sort of projection of the image of the tree that you see out in the real world?

8. Memories are stored as material traces in brains and are wiped out at death.

I'm not sure this is "dogma." It's more like logic. But there are dissenting voices:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Stevenson

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty_Cases_Suggestive_of_Reincarnation

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reincarnation_research

9. Unexplained phenomena like telepathy are illusory.

Has telepathy ever been conclusively demonstrated/proven to have occurred?

10. Mechanistic medicine is the only kind that really works.

Sometimes a medical treatment is effective before people really understand the exact mechanism behind why it works. Any medicine that has some positive effect, no matter how slight, has a reason that it works. Even supposedly "non-mechanistic" medicines that show some positive effects could eventually be explained mechanism by mechanism down to the final effect.

Another relevant source:

http://www.sil.org/silewp/2004/silewp2004-005.pdf

their migration point started from the areas around Eastern Nigeria and Western Nigeria

I think you meant Western Cameroon here.

http://linguistics.byu.edu/classes/ling450ch/reports/niger-congo.html

^^^

This may be of some help.

PStylish: @Onatisi

Dude why are you using a Yoruba username or yoruba-sounding username if you are not one.Thats too bad.

Any real yoruba person knows that yekini is a muslim name (abdul yekeen) and not a yoruba name.

Besides, some of those ebira folks do bear yoruba names like Alao,Oniwon,Aina,Lola etc

So drop your useless insinuations. They are irritating.


PS: Your username though yoruba sounding irritates my ears. I'd appreciate if you could use something more friendly to the ear. Thanks.

Joowilliams: Yekini is a muslim name and the guy is an Ebira from kogi state.

Well that clears things up.

*edited*

The man is an Igala going by the last name (Isah). But maybe he has some Okun (Yoruba) connection/ancestry and that's the source of the first name. Just speculating.

Wow. Totally missed this thread.

samkoro: Mohamed Fawehimin is the son of the late Gani Fawehimin.He is not as intelligent as Gani.He often struggles to be as radical as Gani but Gani's shoes are too big for him. When he talks ,you see it in him that he is wearing oversized shoes. So oversized that his knees are almost inside the shoes.A son cannot be equal to his father. A son can only be greater or lower than the father.Obasanjos children will attest to that.As part of the oversized shoe metaphor,Gani's chamber is like an oversized warehouse and library to him(mohamed).He doesn't know where to get the relevant law reports.He is just lost in that chamber.

So,I'm not surprised to hear him make irrational statements to a president that is facing a turbulence that no president has faced.Ask him for suggestions on how to tackle insecurity and his head0will go blank.

To him,GEJ is weak because of the following.

He is not assassinating journalists who have sold their conscience to the opposition

He doesn't send letter bombs like IBB,Jail Journalist like Buhari,bomb innocent villagers like OBJ.

His power reforms are working.Just imagine having a 24 hour light for about a month now

He is not assassinating political opponents

He prefers to give free and fair election without rigging

He gives fair hearing to every body without being carried away by sentiments

Good post.

I like how everybody is being claimed to be either Senegambian, Akan, Yoruba, or Igbo.