₦airaland Forum

laudate:
Ignorant mind, Google is your friend. Don't you have it on your phone? Or you are not smart enough to use it?

Anuofia.

35824L:
Iboe land is no more than Enugu and abia. Anambra is Igala land leased to you people some parts are even edoid as I can remember some of them bear Bini names like Oduah, Obaze, Imo is extension of Ikwere land and Ebonyi are fake iboes who migrated from Benue and cross river. Yoruba will never be a afraid of a disunited landlocked enclave that is currently being ravaged by gully erosion. Even if we concede that the 5 states belong to you people, all of them added together is still smaller than Oyo state. Iboes should stop trying to steal the lands of the minority tribes. That's what made 3 million of your ancestors to die for nothing. You haven't learned your lesson. Continue.

What gives you the impression that Imo state is an extension of Ikwerreland?

cc. ChinenyeN

18-20-year-olds: legal children

21-to-24-year-olds: young adults

25-to-34-year-olds: young men

35+: men

That’s how I see it. Of course age is relative and a 38-year-old’s very much a child to a 70-year-old who lived through the Biafran war.

Or at least what age does it seem conventional to refer to him as at least a young man/adult if not a fully grown man? 18? 21? 35?

PaulH07:
You might want to claim them for yourself too and say they're Igbo people.

The same way your Ojukwu wanted to but met his Waterloo at Ore.

You people are like Iron Borns, you do not sow, you only take what belong to others. That's why you'll continue to be the most hated tribe, not only in Nigeria, but in the world at large...

Yeye people

Ondo and Ekiti people are different though.

What exactly does it matter that Yoruba’s third after Igbo? Should they be relegated to number 10 instead? What’s there to fight about?

bigfrancis21:
The Chinese are located mostly in China and Hispanics are scattered across several countries in the world (Argentina, Spain, El Salvador etc) but the Chinese outnumbers all Hispanics put together by at least 2 or 2.5.

Also, English is the most widely spoken language across the whole world but Chinese (spoken mostly in one country) has way more native speakers than English (native and second language speakers put together).

Being spread out doesn't automatically mean more population.

They’re still less in number than Igbos according to that list so it’s not something I’d fight about either way.

You have to remember that Yoruba people aren’t limited to the confines of Nigeria. Their numerical position in Nigeria and in Africa as a whole (taking into account their populations in Togo and Benin) are two different thing.

Focusmind:
Oga Probz, did the guy offend you?

Yes. By saying that Nigerians have to oyibonise even our own foods.

nony43:
Op it depends Umuahians are more of Methodist, Bendes are more of Presbyterians and SDA, Ngwa are more of Catholics, Qua ibo SDA and other Orthodox churches, Mbaise in Imo are more of Catholics and Anambras are more of Catholics and Anglicans

And I did mention the tendencies of non-Abian Igbos. Everyone knows that Abians are more into Methodist and SDA than anything else.

Get out of here.

Eulalia:
Wow nice info. Never knew ogbono is an Igbo word until I saw the breakdown now.

What did you think ogbono was if not Igbo?

musa7m:
it is arondizuogu not Atondizuogu

It was most likely a typo.

RedboneSmith:
This doesn't make much sense. Ika isn't the same as Ukwuani, either. All the three Igboid dialect blocs in Anioma are distinct from each other, even though they have all blended around the edge. What's your point?

Again, this is unnecessary digression, given that all I am interested in, as far as this post is concerned, is that the obsession of incessantly talking about south-south Igbo-speaking peoples by our SE brothers is becoming unhealthy

But the both of them are collectively separate from Enuani in the sense that the latter’s an indisputable dialect of Igbo proper and the first two aren’t even though they’re different in themselves. It’s like Igala and to a lesser extent Itsekeri being collectively separated from an Ijesha dialect if all three lects happened to be spoken in one state.

Liliantalks:
they r very much the same , the difference is there closeness in geographical borders with anambra people,, a typical asaba man can never call himself an Igbo man . Mind you I am from there . The language ain’t that understandable like u make it look

And how divergent is Enuani from standard Igbo compared to Nsukka or even some distinct Anambra lects (Awka, Nnewi)? Why isn’t Enuani classified as anything other than a simple dialect of nuclear Igbo unlike Ika, Ikwerre and even the Abakaliki ‘languages’?

Whatever about cultural affiliation but Enuani people have no grounds for Igbo denial linguistically. Compared to large chunks of southeastern dialects your dialect (and that’s really all it is) is as central as they come.

RedboneSmith:
Identity goes beyond language.

Also you're managed to digress from the point of my initial statement on this post.

But the point is Enuani people aren’t the same as Ika/Bendel/Ukwuani people.

RedboneSmith:
I see you're still holding on to this simplistic view that Enuani all identify as Igbo and the rest of Anioma doesn't.

Not so much that as the fact that Enuani people have less grounds for Igbo denial than Ika and Ukwuani people (linguistically at least) and that’s not something that can be readily denied.

liberalchick:
OP please know your history. Biafrans invaded and occupied the region. They installed Igbo army generals to control the region. They needed that region to take the fight to Lagos. The region was not consulted and no allegiance was given. Biafrans were defeated at Ore, they retreated and blew up the bridge, essentially trapping Asaba people with the invading Nigerian troops. The massacre that ensued is the fault of Biafra and the Nigerian troops.

ANIOMA is not Igbo. We have a very different culture and lifestyle, “Delta Igbo” is a misnomer. Unfortunately, our fathers were not proud of our heritage so they gave their kids Igbo names to blend with a dominant culture. ANIOMA people have their own first names. We have names like and they sound nothing like Igbo.
Anupu, Isama, Otunniya, Okwanuzor, Ishicheri, Okwubiri, Ebinum, Egwenum, Osanebi, Ossai etc

Most ANIOMA languages and Igbo is not even mutually intelligible.

Some Languages in ANIOMA have Benin in them, phenotypically, ANIOMA look nothing like the Igbos, also River Niger would have made it much more difficult for the migratory trend to have been from the east. After migration and later trading is responsible for the Igboid in the ANIOMA group of languages.

Remember not to lump Enuani (Asaba/Oshimili people) with you Ika/Bendel/Ukwuani people. Most eastern Igbos understand Enuani better than a good chunk of Anambra state dialects because their dialect is as close to central Igbo as it gets.

RedboneSmith:
I have one small question for our Southeastern brothers. Is it possible for you guys to let this go? Like, just leave it alone and chill?

It's beginning to come across as sad. And this is coming from an Anioma guy who identifies as Igbo.

You’re Enuani so why wouldn’t you identify as Igbo?

cc. ChinenyeN, RedboneSmith

Aside from the conservation of certain bizarre features found in Abakaliki no other Igbo clans do better at preserving certain cultural features (aka Igbo men rightfully wearing wrappers and not jeans for traditional functions) than the Abia-Ebonyi cluster. That’s probably at least in part because the Igbo sub-groups found in those two states tend to be a lot more tangible and distinct than a lot of northern Igbo subgroups (aka the so-called Wawa clan of Enugu - culturally there’s not much divergence between them and general northern Igbo).

ChinenyeN:
Probz, I feel that that dialect and cultural region has been severely neglected by modern Igbo people, especially those who are strong proponents of a homogeneous Igbo culture and language.

I also feel that they get treated rather unfairly. I would not blame them if they opted to dissociate as non-Igbo. There is enough cultural and linguistic leverage for them to do so.

I also personally believe that their lect is amazing, despite the fact that I don't understand it when it's spoken to me. I can only say this after the fact, because I managed to get my hand on a morphology, syntax and grammar book about the cluster. Their morphology and grammar is divergent in some key ways (particularly that of Izii), but that opens up the possibility for other modes of speech to expand Igbo linguistic expression if we so choose.

Ditto. The more colourful and distinct cultures and lects found in Abia and Ebonyi are a lot more interesting than the monolithic Anambra-Enugu township-generic Imo baseline we use as a yardstick for Igbo cultural markers. I say that as someone from Anambra.

Are there any tangible grounds for labelling every wa-clan except for Awka Waawa and seeing them as a distinct sub-ethnic group purely because of their dialect or could we all agree that it’s an inaccurate and a wholly artificial designation?

ChinenyeN:
The difference between a language and dialect is arbitrarily based on socio-politics. There is no universal criteria to distinguish between the two. As such, linguists have opt to say that all languages are in fact just dialects (or, to avoid all socio-political implications, lects). Everyone speaks a dialect. Whether your dialect is counted as a language is ultimately arbitrary and subjective.

Probz, to answer your question. The Igbo languages sit on a continuum. As such, there isn't one that is "most divergent". The only exception to this it seems is Ekpeye. Ekpeye also is part of the continuum. It just shows more consistent divergence than other lects. However, you seem to not want to include Ekpeye. So with that, we can say that divergence can definitely be arbitrary.

Determining which is "most divergent" would depend heavily on who you ask. It would depend on their (positive or negative) views with respect to other Igbo groups and depend on their primary lect, and even how exposed they may be to other lects.

But, if I am to answer the question personally, for myself, I might say Abakaliki. Granted, someone from Abakaliki equally said the same to me about Ngwa, even though I believe there should be other lects that rank higher than Ngwa as far as divergence.

And how do you feel about the Izzi-Ezza-Mgbo-Ikwo cluster in general?

bigfrancis21:
Most divergent Igbo dialect rather. A language is a full fledged language of its own, unlike another. Dialects are versions of the same language mutually intelligible or non intelligible to their speakers.

To me, I’d say Ekpeye is the most divergent away from other igbo dialects. A quick look at the Ekpeye dictionary would reveal a ton of words different from other Igbo dialects. The Izzi-Ikwo cluster might not be as bad because their words are mostly the same as other Igbo dialects, just their different pronunciation that makes the lect hard to understand initially. Maybe next would core Ikwerre dialect. Not the one spoken in PH and environs that’s more centralized. The one spoken in their interior villages.

I discounted Ekpeye because even linguistic experts believe it’s a standalone Igboid language.

Ikwerre has an awful lot of distinct dialects for something that’s a mere dialect itself. It’s hard to measure here what constitutes a closely related Igboid language and a mere complex Igbo dialect. That’s why I initially put language in quotation marks.

okpalaAnambra:
I was thinking jókwa greetings was only exclusive to Afikpo people of Ebonyi, I didn't know some parts of Abia like Abiriba and Bende greets the same.

The “a” in Afikpo is the last letter of the acronym ABIA so it shouldn’t surprise you that Afikpo shares things in common with Abia. Try and look past artificial state boundaries.

okpalaAnambra:
I was thinking jókwa greetings was only exclusive to Afikpo people of Ebonyi, I didn't know some parts of Abia like Abiriba and Bende greets the same.

The “a” in Afikpo is the last letter of the acronym ABIA so it shouldn’t surprise you that Afikpo shares things in common with Abia.

And by that I mean the most difficult to understand of the lects which occupy the intermediate position between nuclear Igbo and Ekpeye (Ika, Ukwuani, Ikwerre and the Izzi-Ezza-Mgbo-Ikwo cluster of northern Ebonyi).

bigfrancis21:
Biologically, men donate the sperm (in equal numbers), however the containing environment of the female is what makes the final decision.

The man doesn’t determine which chromosome fertilizes. The woman’s body decides which one is successful.

https://newbornbaby.com.au/pregnancy/tips-on-how-to-conceive-a-baby-boy/

But the point is it isn’t something even the woman can knowingly or psychologically control since it’s purely biologically determined. Nor does it even half-justify that bastard’s actions.

Kimbeast:
I don't blame the man. Female children are mostly useless.

You’ll realise that’s not the case when you leave your nonsense bubble.

bigfrancis21:
Men donate equal amounts of x and Y chromosomes but in the end the woman’s body decides which chromosomes survive more than the other. Some women have higher acidic pH internally and the Y chromosomes do not survive long in acidic environments, thus the woman’s body will be selective for mostly female children. Also, the X chromosomes for girls do not survive well in alkaline environments, thus the woman’s body will be selective for mostly male children.

But the point is the outcome’s purely biologically determined. It’s not within the female or male’s conscious control.