₦airaland Forum

rationalmind: Which miracle? I can't see any. Which one can you see around you.

You didn't attend any of the monthly miracle programmes this year? There were some frankly mind-blowing testimonies this year...

@divepen sorry for intruding...

Atheists claim God does not exist, but for some reason are obsessed with religion, particularly christianity...

Reyginus: Lol. Keep your sermon to yourself. The simple question has developed into the assumption that He really exists.

Actually, the first question was already initially based on said assumption.

However, what I am trying to say is, show some courage and prove to yourself once and for all that God doesn't exist. Open your mind and try to find him. Only try Jesus first accept him into your life as prescribed by the bible and study/follow his precepts for finding God. If you give it a while you still got nothing, you can at least know that you tried... There is even some benefit for you in this - a stronger atheist conviction!

Like you said, all evidence does not have to be scientific. C'mon I know you can do it, pls pls pls pls pleeeeeaase?

Reyginus: I think there is no better way of determining if what a people is saying of a superior is true than by comparing his supposed qualities, with the quality of service those under him are receiving.

I would have to see the absolute benefit of following god in his followers before I even begin to consider to follow him.

Assuming there is a company, 'rapture international', with the tenets of a healthy and happy life if you are loyal, as expected of you. But on the contrary you see their loyal workers living a life of penury in all ramifications, would you in your right senses join such a company?

You're saying all christians "live a life of penury in all ramfications"? This is both logically, mathematically and physically impossible. It even contradicts common sense.

For example, the president of the USA, Germany, a lot of other countries and even our own dear GEJ are publically proffesing christians.

*childish nursery school voice*

Present, Sir!

Well, he is not called the King of kings and the Lord of lords for nothing now, is he?

Reyginus: I will ask him why he made himself so invisible?

He didn't make himself invisible. It's just that you guys are going about finding him the wrong way.

Like you rightly admitted, "he cannot be discovered by existing scientific capacity". Knowing this, why not try the other prescribed way - Jesus Christ. Accept him into your life and God will reveal himself to you. He may not go the whole popping-his-head-out-of-the-sky-and-saying-"checkmate atheists" route, but he will reveal himself to you opersonally...

Hmm...

it's either a camera artifact/poor photoshop hoax or something profoundly spiritual.

Depending on which side you're on...

Whichever, I am saving it.

I think you should seek counsel from your local pastor or any other seasoned man of God within your reach. You wouldn't get the best of advice on in here...

Most usually hold counselling sections after church or something. Take advantage of that...

Atheism is an euphemism for "being in denial".

Ok

As an atheist, if you met God right now, what will you say to him?

@reygenius
Expired drugs is what @thehomer is on?

Ok I take back my offer.

thehomer: Any questions?

Yes. Can I have some of what you're on?

thehomer: The six month old babies that drowned in Noah's flood. And the ones that died in the genocide he commanded.

Where exactly did the bible record six month old babies?

thehomer: I know the meaning. But you see, due to the difference between humans and programs, your metaphor is too weak to work.

I guess there is more than one way to say "I don't understand the metaphor"

thehomer: Well why didn't he? It looks like he does in Heaven so what was the problem?

The problem is he doesn't? Everybody in heaven still have their free will. Only they've chosen to follow God. The dfevil was once in heaven too, wasn't he?

thehomer: I'm sure you can too if you try. For starters your God drowned a lot of people in Noah's flood. How many did the devil drown?

God destroyed his initial creation for their evil. Like I've asked you before, how is destroying an bad thing a bad thing?

How many did the devil drown? Let's see, since the devil is the originator of sin, and he spitefully passed on his evil to mankind, and those people were drowned for indulging in said evil, can we not say it was partly the devil's fault they were destroyed?

If the devil had taken his defeat and banishment from heaven like a man, and maybe gone off to go create his own intergalactic empire, and had not sought to get back at God by corrupting his creation, who knows, maybe sin would never have entered the world, and we wouldn't have had to be dealing with boko haram...

thehomer: Really you should try to know your Bible.


1 Kings 22

19 Micaiah continued, “Therefore hear the word of the Lord: I saw the Lord sitting on his throne with all the multitudes of heaven standing around him on his right and on his left. 20 And the Lord said, ‘Who will entice Ahab into attacking Ramoth Gilead and going to his death there?’

“One suggested this, and another that. 21 Finally, a spirit came forward, stood before the Lord and said, ‘I will entice him.’

22 “‘By what means?’ the Lord asked.

“‘I will go out and be a deceiving spirit in the mouths of all his prophets,’ he said.

“‘You will succeed in enticing him,’ said the Lord. ‘Go and do it.’

Jeremiah 4

10 Then I said, “Alas, Sovereign Lord! How completely you have deceived this people and Jerusalem by saying, ‘You will have peace,’ when the sword is at our throats!”

Ezekiel 14

9 “‘And if the prophet is enticed to utter a prophecy, I the Lord have enticed that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand against him and destroy him from among my people Israel.


Are those quotes from the Bible satisfactory?

There are many ways to kill a rat?

Ahab had that coming, and God could have destroyed him using any means he chose, including frying him with a thunderbolt sango-style. Maybe he was up for some soap opera...

Destroying a good thing=evil

Destroying an evil thing=good

For example, if God decided to destroy Assad by sending a deceiving spirit to deceive him to his destruction, how is that evil?

thehomer: Nothing there says that the devil wanted to overthrow God. He was already in Heaven and isn't God's throne supposedly above the stars?

O boy...

thehomer: Are 6 month old babies evil? Are they bad things?

What six month old babies?

thehomer: Are you? So there's no important difference between you and a program?

Maybe you should look up the meaning of metaphors?

thehomer: Why isn't their free will perfect? After all, their free will is supposed to be perfect in Heaven so what is the problem?

Their free will is perfect. It's the choices they make using said free will - that's the problem. Next you'll ask me why didn't God make all their choices perfect.

thehomer: Well humans are very different from soup so you need a better comparison.

Really take a look at the metaphor thing. This does not look good on you.

thehomer: Now let's take a look at the characters of God and the devil. Which one of them has killed more people?

Who has been keeping score, you?

thehomer: Secondly, why does God use evil? If he uses evil, then it means that he wanted to have evil in order to use it.

God uses evil? Generalisations like that sound wacky without facts backing them up.

thehomer: Go ahead.

Isaiah 14:12-15

12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.

Now go ahead and admit you are wrong and post a retraction.

thehomer: So God has caused more destruction than the devil. After all, the devil hasn't been able to match God's destruction and killing.

God has caused much destruction of evil things. How is destroying a bad thing a bad thing? Like when the americans shot Osama, was that murder?

thehomer: Firstly why would a perfect God create imperfect creatures?
Secondly you're not a program.
Why does he have the right to destroy it?

Why pretend you don't understand I was only using a program as an illustration? Anyway, for what it's worth, a program is a creation, I too am a creation, it's called a metaphor.

God didn't create imperfect beings, he created perfect beings - and then gave them free will

Why does he have a right to destroy it? Maybe because it's his creation? If I told you that you don't have the right to throw out your own soup that you cooked that has gone sour, what will you say?

thehomer: How did the devil spawn all evil? Why does God use evil at all?

Well technically, before the devil had his hare-brained idea to takeover heaven, there was no sin or evil. All the creation lived in peace and righteousness. God exalted him to be the chief of the angels, and he got proud and decided he wanted to be the oga@dtop. That is the first record of sin in existence.

^^^


Where do you guys get the time and energy to write these long textbooks?

thehomer: Last time I checked, the Bible said he rebelled against God not that he tried to take God's throne.

Check again. He said "I will ascend to the highest throne bla bla bla", I'll find the reference in the bible for you later when I gat the chance...

thehomer: Secondly, it was God who destroyed his own creation. Do you recall Noah's flood? What has the devil done that is even comparable to that degree of destruction?

You are taking this the wrong way. God destroyed the bad parts of his creation. It's just a shame only Noah was found righteous. If say I write a program to add 1 + 1 = 2, and it keeps giving me 3 as an answer, I can very well delete it. If I build a robot to fetch me water and it keeps irreparably glitching and not working, I'll have to junk it...

Whatever God created, he has a right to destroy...

thehomer: Try looking for what the devil did to people. God has already done so much but what did the devil do?

Spawn all evil?

thehomer: So what were the actions he performed that made you conclude that the devil had a worse character than God?

Well, in the beginning, he did try to usurp God's throne, got his treacherous butt tossed out of heaven, then proceeded to destroy God's creation out of pure spite...

Doesn't sound like Man of the year material to me...

TONYE001: My brother na Owukpa o.. One secondary school for the interior village.. It's a border village.. You?

That one na punishment for prison break season 1. Owukpa? So close to Cameroun!!! You can practise you french...

thehomer: So how do you know that the devil was actually evil? If you don't have enough information about the devil being evil yet you conclude that he must be evil, then you're committing the fallacy of an appeal to ignorance because ignorance of the devil's actual character doesn't mean he is evil.

I said the bible didn't go into too much detail about his specific actions, not that it didn't give any detail. It gave enough detail to make a veritable conclusion.

...For we are not ignorant of the devil's devices...

@thehomer

You should realise that the bible was written about God, not necessarily the devil, so it doesn't go into much detail about specific actions of the devil.

If it did, it would cause nightmares...

R.I.P. Mandela

You personified the good in all of us and showed how much of a difference an individual can make if only he never stops believing...

If only you had been Nigerian...

Hmm...

Why did somebody not capture it or something?

Hmm...

*get's chair*
*rushes out to buy popcorn*
*realises he don't gat enough money*
*buys groundnut instead*
*settles down*

Aya continue...

What happens when your butt itches? You know you are about to shit?

@op what happens when your left and right hand both itch at the same time?

rationalmind: Yea. I go to church on sundays when I'm at home. I just laugh most times within myself during the messages and during prayers.

W. O. W.

Which church do you go to now, still DCLM? Will you go 2moro?

It says he created light, which you gotta admit is what plants basically need...

Reyginus: Don't add 'yet'. I mean he cannot be prooved by scientific means if it is true.
It is illogical for anything to be prooved by the very means it really cannot be proved.




God, if he exists as the christain god, cannot be discovered in the real by our scientific method.

We can only discover with our scientific methods that we cannot discover him with our scientific methods.

You make some really solid and valid points.

Then you go ahead and contradict yourself.

rapture_ready: Why then do atheists go about
claiming he does not exist as if
they have proof?

Reyginus: I think it is normal if we do so. There is no evidence. Very simple.

If God cannot be proved by any scientific means or method, why then do you guys ask for evidence/proof?

Let me rephrase that other question for you

If God cannot as you say be proved by any scientific means or method, does that then mean God cannot and does not exist?

What about verse 4 and 5?

So what, you just go to church every sunday and sleep? Eh?

Kay 17: Beautiful! Just one day in the shoes of an atheist and you read his mind well!

Bullshit rey, they are just complimenting you, so you go join them...

Chei yaa.

Anyway, what about your dad, what does he say now?