₦airaland Forum

Mad cow - container houses? You cities are slumpolis. Not comparable to Kenya cities. Your housing problem is gigantic. You need to build brand new cities from the scratch. You cannot fix Accra. You'd have to do what Rwanda did...mass demolition and displacement of people. You literally need to flatten your cities and start a fresh.

A city should look like this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TP_-IuyK9SE&t=799s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zQvPTPpPps

Nairobi we have small problem - Just 5 percent of the land mass.

Just40:
you mean an endless number of well planned communities with beautiful homes..

Those can't be compared to your nasty slumscrapers, zinc and mud houses that fill your city...

West Africa contained that problem far back in the 70s hence why it hasn't become a huge mess like in Kenya where everything is a slum.. That is why you won't find huge slums in most west African cities like you find doting all over Kenya


See the beautiful affordable homes that people are getting at 13,000 dollars
This is the power of the private sector

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDhrN9Cy4DQ

We have completed a few thousands - many thousands are under construction now. If our president was not half-drunk most of the time - we should have done a lot of work.

samorobo:
We heard this four years back and the years before yet nothing. You had the knowledge so what’s stopped you from harnessing. I expected by now you should have erected those structures.next year will make it 5 years y’all were screaming “by 2023 we will have 500k affordable housing units” almost 5 years now and we haven’t seen a concrete block.

See you're mad cow - because you dont even read but proceed to make crazy arguments devoid of any factoid.

In first place your housing sector is even worse than kenya - there is barely any private sector involvment.

It's informal sector completely - people building their houses in different colours and shapes - and creating huge mess - which worse than Kenya slum problem - because it create an ENDLESS SLUMPOLIS of tin shacks like ACCRA, KUMASI AND NIGERIA CITIES How do you even begin to address your housing problem? Everywhere is just ramshackle of tin shacks mixed with offices and churches - sprawling endlessly.

Kenya at least has problem that can be contained before it become west african mess.

And it can only be contained by BIG DEVELOPERS BUILDING THOUSANDS UNITS IN ORDERLY FASHION.

You cannot call private sector - informal sector - where everyone wakes up - buy land - start building slowly and slowly - over 20yrs - and create a huge mess.

Countries that have developed leave that job to insurance companies, large housing companies - talking 10,000 units estates, pension funds and such private housing sector who can deploy ECONOMIES OF SCALE.

People in developed world dont even know how to build a house because they just buy a house through mortagages - it's not Africa dotted with hardware shops with everyone building their thing on their own pace on their own taste - INFORMAL HOUSING SECTOR.

Just40:
I don't have time to read all your nonsense...

The private sector knows how to build affordable housing at 11,000 to 20,000 dollars beautiful homes and they still make profit.

Private sector is profit driven. They are not going to build low end housing units that are affordable - but are market driven - because they borrow money from banks - and have to repay loans - and make profit.

What kenya is doing is simple - de-risking the private sector.

Public sector or gov will NOT BUILD ANY HOUSE.

Kenya gov is de-risking the private sector that want to involve themsleves in AFFORDABLE housing - not build luxury units.

What kenya gov will do is to provide free land (30% of cost of unit is land) because gov has lots of land - and secondly it also going to allow zero rated building materials and zero taxes on profit (that is another 30% down) - lastly the gov is going to build horizontal infrastructure within housing estates (roads, water pipes, sewage, etc) - another huge cost cut.

That drastically cut the cost of housing for those building affordable units....and they can deliver a two bedroom for 20K usd.

That fixes SUPPLY SIDE.

Then we move DEMAND side...effective demand. How do we get poor people driving trotos or driving okada to afford 20K usd unit.

Simple - like you have done for your National Health Insurance - we have similar housing levy - that provide them with deposit - say 2,000K usd - sort of IMPOSED COMPLUSORY SAVINGS for their housing need.

Then give them 15-20yrs mortgage - that should be equivalent to the rent they pay now as okada rider renting a house.

These people pay maybe 50-80USD for slumscrapper unit. Now they will pay the same - and it will be mortagage - not rent.

Now the developer build these cheap houses - the gov uses the housing levy and commercial banks to issue loans - and where loans are not affordable - the kenya mortgage refinancing will TOP UP.

This model that is already working - we just need to scale it.

Just40:
Ghana even started building the 10 billion dollars 200,000 unit project all across the country and then infighting happened between the partners just after a month which landed in a huge court battle.

Now the private sector is leading the effort with over 2 million units under construction.
The solution to affordable housing is private sector led... The 60s to 90s are long over

Anything would fail in zoo like Nigeria or Ghana - even basic stuff like electricity supply. Affordable housing was working in Kenya until IMF/WB SAP led to it's abandonment in late 80s and early 90s - and housing sector went informal.

So this something that has worked before...Singapore is good example of how it can work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dBaEo4QplQ

Before we abandon affordable housing - we built estates like buruburu, umoja, name them - nyayo high rise

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzhMtGkrEdM


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwgVhL7kAVg

The zoo patronizing Kenya Really Nigga. Zoogeria can NEVER EVER tell us anything. I rather listen to a South African.

samorobo:
All I keep hearing is promises,future tense,we will,Chinese will,Kenyatta will for the recent years. I still remember how you,jonrad,Tylaan ,stevoh18,yobeezy made this same exact noise with thesame exact lines 5 years ago.Fastforward now and pictures are still failing,you are left with empty words from 4 years back in 2022. Aren’t you ashamed of yourself? Stfu and rest.

Bla bla de bla. As always please keep it pictures and videos. You're obsessed with Nairobi because it better than anything in Nigeria.

Like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TP_-IuyK9SE

samorobo:
No you lie,everywhere outside your 3cbd is a slum or rather a demeaning unimpressive settlement and this is prevalent across your country.

Let’s just say Nairobi extremely numerous (becos everywhere you turn to is a slum) occupy 5 percent,then the decent areas are like 1%(remember 85% of ur urban populace lives in what is regarded as a slum).the rest is forest that has t been deforested.so that noise on 5% is dead on arrival. The slum will keep ballooning into the forest as more rural-urban migration happens. So I predict 12% in the coming decade.

Deal with your Buhari first before you demand action. Are you now a Kenyan?

There has been action - lots of action - but not as fast as would have been ideally.

The affordable housing model is tested - it's just the execution that has been as fast.

Chinese developers were willing to put up 750,000 units - and all gov provide them is free land, zero taxes on inputs and on profit - gov to also build roads and all horizontal infrastructure.

That will make those units very cheap - and then Kenya Mortagage Refinancing - would issue mortagage - so cheap almost every kenyan would afford - because it will equal to their current rent - 100 dollars or even less per month - sort of Tenant Purchasing agreement.

The biggest failure was inability to get Housing Levy to pass in parliament and court.

Once this is done - Kenya can build a million housing units - and Joburg will look like a child to Nairobi.

samorobo:
We don’t indulge in cheap political promises,we want visible action not carrot talk.

FACTS are stubborn things.
Slum occupy only 5 percent of built up area. Yes it houses millions - coz of their density.
Nairobi is actually a deceptively developed city - you will not see those slums - maybe Kibera is one that is very visible from Langata.
Nairobi has three if not five business districts.
Nairobi middle and upper class residence is more than half the city. The other half - Eastland - half of it also very decent.
Slums and slumscrapper occupy very small land.
The problem is contained and easy to solve.

68816419:
same promise promise shiiit, the fact still remains that, Nairobi tiny CBD shouldn't equate the whole of Nairobi CBD

If the current president had focused on Big 4 agenda that included Affordable Housing - we would be somewhere - but he choose to focus on fighting his deputy and attempting to change the constitution.

But if we get right president - Nairobi slums can be eliminated in 5yrs - while providing employment to 2 million people.

Below has been epic failure - although he is claiming to have build 185,000 units - I doubt if he even achieved 20,000 units.

Our slums appeared in late 80s and early 1990s. The solution is simple. Ruto who is running for president this year has promised to eliminate all.

Slum arose because kenya gov got out of social affordable housing.

https://www.the-star.co.ke/news/2022-01-12-ruto-ill-do-away-with-slums-if-elected-president/
“We will employ 400,000 youths to take part in the construction of the new units as we plan to move the people of Nairobi from the slums to the modern houses which will have enough water and a proper sewage system.”

68816419:
Stop celebrating small victories, ; Nairobi will never be a developed nation because the majority of the city is underdeveloped and the tiny developed parts are not even habited by the majority of the population who are blacks. What will you do with locations like Mathare, Githurai, Kawangware, Waithaka, and Zimmerman, as well as significant swaths of Nairobi? tiny section of Runda is good, but Mji wa Huruma behind presents a different picture, Karen is an affluent area for those who want and can afford high life( mostly British whites and few Politian) , but right beside it is Kuwinda slum with dwellers surviving on a lot less than a dollar a day, what do you
1- Huruma an area adjacent to Runda 75,498 persons(2019)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EEPUZQ8MrE
2- Kuwinda slum just behind Karen

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T21VBBGrYhM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfKmiFjU3gs

Dead on arrival. We are approaching 20yrs. How many people reside in that city

samorobo:
No city in Africa,I repeat no city in Africa comes close to this in beauty,infrastructure and the list goes on. Just look at those beautiful canal,and the water goshh!!!!!! So fvcking beautiful.

You're the next to go bonkers after Just30 madman. The signs are there.

samorobo:
@rvp 1.3b ksh is roughly 1.3usd. You are a bloody joke. Log off already.your sgr have been running into losses since inception just like KQ.

Do you have have functional cargo train in Nigeria?

68816419:
Do u even know that the value given was only for passengers and not the Cargos?

The raw anger - and we just go started. Construction to start this year. Nairobi might become the World Most Dynamic City.

samorobo:
Stupid update. This will remain in design stage up on till the next century just like konza tea farm joke.

I think we are beyond impressing you - you've basically dug every slum in Kenya to try validate your slumpolis.
Polite reminder that it's complete .
And that 8 - now 9 towers of River Estate are coming up very fast.
And many more

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOKbv-X8aq0

samorobo:
Oh I have seen both of this videos. What where you expecting to impress me in this videos?

Bla de bla of bleating goat.

Just40:
you are running mad .....

The Kenyan economy is 80% public sector run..


The Moroccan and Algerian economies are more private sector run .. on the level of SA

Sorry kenya is not going to provide company for your misery
You wish Kenya Railways was ferrying 400 passengers per day like Nigeria hopeless Railway
My friend Kenya Railways - Nairobi Commutter rail alone ferries close to 15,000 if not now 30,000 people in Nairobi alone - daily - each pays 100shs.
Kenya SGR run more than 15 cargo trains every day from Mombasa to Naivasha. It carries about 2 million passengers annual. 4 passengers train daily - all full.
The old MGR run cargo trains from Mombasa to Malaba - the border with Uganda.
Old MGR now run passengers services from Nairobi to Kisumu and Nairobi to Nanyuki

68816419:

Last year - Jan-June - SGR alone - 80M dollars - run by Chinese AfriStar . There is MGR and Nairobi Commuter rail run by KR.
https://www.businessdailyafrica.com/bd/economy/sgr-posts-33pc-rise-in-jan-june-revenue-3517802
Revenue generated from cargo and passenger services on the standard gauge railway (SGR) rose by 33 percent in the six months to June, lifted by a rebounding economy, official statistics show.

Data by the Kenya National Bureau of Statistics (KNBS) shows that the passenger and cargo trains generated Sh7.936 billion in the period, up from Sh5.963 billion in a similar period last year.

Jamestown123:
Lol. Does kenya railway make 200m dollars per annum? Since you seems to know it all, why don't you simplify this things for me to understand?

Please this beyond your paygrade. Wait until I get to pictures and videos. Then you will make meaningful contribution.

Jamestown123:
Kenya railway service 761m shillings. 200m dollars annually is about 22b shillings. The question is, does kenya railway service make 22b shillings annually?

Kenya GDP is 110B. Not 100B. That was in 2019 when it hit 99B. You cannot compare Kenya with Algeria and Morroco in some aspect. Both Morocco and Algeria have big problem in structure of their economy - its entirely public sector - with very little private sector. It's why Algerians have escaped to France and Europe. Both of those countries need to figure out how to grow private sector like kenya has done.

My prediction - Kenya will overtake Morroco in 2 - max 3 yrs. I hope we shall be hear. Now the gap is just 20B dollars or less.

obaaderemi:

Even with faking, Kenya's GDP is less than $100bn.
He and his hangers on have failed to post any credible source to back up their claims. Instead they resorted to their usual ad hominem.

You're arguing like an idiot. Ihub was co-founded by one my friend and classmate. There are many hubs in Nairobi. It is just a building - a co-working space. What is big deal about it.

Let talk data. Data we have suggest Nigeria start up have worse failure rate than in Kenya.

It plain obvious - they probably spend more time worrying about generator fuel than working.

obaaderemi:
RIP, all this noise does nothing against the fact that your startups are doing badly. Look at ihub for example. It is your biggest innovation hub yet had to be rescued by Nigerians. Facts are stubborn things, skeleton.
Don't have time to type a novella this morning.

Kenya is receiving decent investment in tech - swinging with hopeless NIgeria for top spot the last few years. When it come to FDI that typically come to Africa - that natural extraction - of course we are doing badly - and we couldnt be LUCKIER. We have avoided the Nigeria or Congo or Africa natural resources curses...instead we have built a well diversified liberized market economy that is almost BULLET PROOF...not even COVID can take it down...maybe civil war.

We are attracting FDI in sectors that create jobs. We are also second to South Africa in Sub Saharan Africa for investing in other Africa countries.

Just40:
why is Kenya not attracting any serious investment?

I have and answer based on your country reality but I want to see what you think

Kenya is not a zoo. If you want to study the Kenya Railways financial statement - they are available.

Kenya Railways is one prime assets of Kenya gov - with assets of nearly 8B dollars.

Of course it has liability of 5.2B dollars from Chinese - that it borrowed to build Mombasa-Nairobi-Naivasha SGR and it's rolling stock

It also generate now more than 200M dollars annually - although it making huge losses - as the loan repayment to Chinese has to be factored in financial reporting.

Kenya gov is only the guarantor...but we expect Kenya Railways not only to become operationally profitable but to eventually pay for it's debt.

FACTS are stubborns things.

obaaderemi:
So what's that fool, RIP barking about?
Their sgr has lost money consistently.

Obaboon, Kenya was at nearly 50 in world in ease of doing business - Only Mauritus, Rwanda and Morrocco was better. Nigeria as always is clustering with worse in the world. It start from electricity, lack of basic infrastructure, totally incompetent gov, insecurity - how can you as start up thrive in such circumstance.

And yes i have seen data that most Nigeria tech start up - fail the most. Your nigeria diaspora are pulling silicon valley funding but trust me they will leave without their shirts.

I hope they dont besmirch other thriving African countries in the process by thinking business in africa will fail.

obaaderemi:
You have to blame little India for this anomaly. They claim to have many tech firms, and they're not making money. Their ihub was recently taken over by Nigerians. So I know what I'm talking about.
Useless country.

Nairobi Railway city - regeneration of Nairobi city get UK funding of design - Kenya gov to fund the construction that start this year at 250M dollars

https://www.theeastafrican.co.ke/tea/business/uk-firm-set-design-246-6m-railways-city-in-kenya-3686766

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=935Y-PMNlQ8

https://cdn.standardmedia.co.ke/images/tuesday/mhetolixu6s4wjszsrs85f293414cc3e9.jpg


''The construction of this project will be fully financed by the Kenyan government. UK's firms KPMG and Atkins Global are only handling the research and design work,'' Ford said in a press interview.

Yesterday, Atkins Global presented a preliminary design for the multi-model urban development project to be referred to as the Nairobi Railway City.

“UK firm Atkins Global has been appointed to design Nairobi’s new Central Train Station and associated public realm, which will provide the centrepiece of Nairobi Railway City,” Ford said.

Samrobo I see you're desperate for my attention with your juventile rants - I got big reply for all your nonsense. It is in this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zQvPTPpPps

And it's night version

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3geimRsiQDE

That is revenue. You havent even factored the cost of building the railway because you're a zoo that use oil money. In kenya we expect the rail to eventually pay for itself after turning profitable.
Revenues of 5M dollars is big joke for a quarter.
Kenya Railway monthly revenues are about 30m dollars.

68816419:
Sad looser always shifting from one point to other, previously you said it wasn't making profit at all and the patronage was too tiny, I debunked your lies, now you changed the sentence to the profits made are too small while not considering the fact that the figures given were monthly values and not yearly.
Do u also know that the Cargo services hasn't started?

Check return on investment. Kenya startups make money. Nigeria do not make money. Anybody stupid to invest in a zoo has himself to blame.

theenchanter:
oh, u blame Nigeria. I thought u doofus usually claim to command the largest share of start-ups investment? Why put the blame on Nigeria?

Explain to me like a kid.
Red line is 37 kms with 12 stops.
That mean a stop every 3km.
Why would you go shopping for high speed train?
How stupid is your entire gov?
You need a train that runs at 30kms per hour....not 330KPH
High speed train will cost more money to buy , more money to run, more money to maintain.
That is probably why Chicago didnt buy it.
Now spanish found bonobos from African to sell it.
330KPH is good if you were deploying express services btw say Lagos and Ibandan or even better Lagos - Abuja.

theenchanter:
if not that u're suffering from chronic intellect deficiency, wouldn't u know that trains doesn't necessarily need to run at their maximum speed?

Nigeria! I blame Nigeria. Anybody stupid enough to invest there will cry. They will spend more money running generators than doing anything

Appisko:
African startups return the least to investors.

This is quite bad for Africa. Startups need lots of education.

But seriously who bewitched you. Why would YOU need 330KMH train for metro line in lagos. That will be hopefully stopping every few meters if not kilometers.

You went and bought train that was meant to commute btw Milwaukee and Chicago - a distance of 150kms - to use it in Lagos slumpolis distance of 40kms - with 12 stops.

It will be a spectacle. 330Km high speed train stopping every 3kms. Man

theenchanter:
He was even economical with the speed rate. The speed of the train is actually 330km/h.