₦airaland Forum

Juliusmalema:
Well I have given him his Origin as read by his Oba.

He should go and debunk what his oba, a Yoruba man ruling Benin said.

Even if it was an Ijaw ruling Benin, we have no issues with that as far as you can prove it. The problem is lack of prove for you claims. Anyway you won't be allowed to distract from the main story from Reno.

Reno specifically Mentioned Igbo and produced a video evidence to back his claims. You can't shift it to the Ikas and Ndokwas without providing your own prove just the way Reno did.

Ofunwa111:
Ignore this Samuk guy, this particular one expects even the Fulani to claim Bini origin. The Bini guys I know , don't even want to be attached to any other tribe .

No matter how you guys want to twist it, Reno wasn't referring to the Ikas. If you have prove that he was referring to the Ikas, please provide it.

It's amazing how the Igbos have tried to twist Reno Omokri narrative to mean Ika of Anioma. Reno wasn't referring to the Ikas, some of who are very proud descendants of Benin and can trace their ancestral home/history back to Benin.

Some even went as far as to mentioned the Dein of Agbor, forgetting that the current Dein of Agbor at the age of 2 and a half was crowned by Benin chiefs under the instructions of late Oba Erediawa and his throne was protected until he was old enough. Why would the Oba of Benin do all this if Agbor people were slave descendants.

Reno was talking about a small population of about 200,000 within the wider over 5 million population of Delta state and Anioma alone accounts for millions.

Now who are those Reno was referring to? The answer is very simple, these are the people within the Anioma community that identify themselves as Igbo, they will even tell you their ancestral home of migration from the east to Delta state, what they don't usually say is the circumstances that brought them to Delta state, this is what Reno has just exposed. Some of these guys that are active on nairaland and other social media platforms are usually very hostile to Benin history and the reason as now shown by Reno is not far fetch.

I don't particularly blame them because very few will be favourably deposed to those that enslave their ancestors.

Most Ika and Anioma always make it know to all and sundry that they are not Igbo even though their dialects may be similar.

Reno was only referring to a minority Igbo clan in Delta state. These Delta Igbo clans people have variously claimed Igbo on nairaland and the Ikas and others who doesn't claim Igbo should be left out of this guesswork and mischievousness by eastern Igbo. Ikas are Ikas and Igbo are Igbo, don't miss apples with oranges. Stop pretending not to know your tribesmen Reno was referring to.

It's amazing how the Igbos have tried to twist Reno Omokri narrative to mean Ika of Anioma. Reno wasn't referring to the Ikas, some of who are very proud descendants of Benin and can trace their ancestral home/history back to Benin.

Some even went as far as to mentioned the Dein of Agbor, forgetting that the current Dein of Agbor at the age of 2 and a half was crowned by Benin chiefs under the instructions of late Oba Erediawa and his throne was protected until he was old enough. Why would the Oba of Benin do all this if Agbor people were slave descendants.

Reno was talking about a small population of about 200,000 within the wider over 5 million population of Delta state and Anioma alone accounts for millions.

Now who are those Reno was referring to? The answer is very simple, these are the people within the Anioma community that identify themselves as Igbo, they will even tell you their ancestral home of migration from the east to Delta state, what they don't usually say is the circumstances that brought them to Delta state, this is what Reno has just exposed. Some of these guys that are active on nairaland and other social media platforms are usually very hostile to Benin history and the reason as now shown by Reno is not far fetch.

I don't particularly blame them because very few will be favourably deposed to those that enslave their ancestors.

Most Ika and Anioma always make it know to all and sundry that they are not Igbo even though their dialects may be similar.

Reno was only referring to a minority Igbo clan in Delta state. These Delta Igbo clans people have variously claimed Igbo on nairaland and the Ikas and others who doesn't claim Igbo should be left out of this guesswork and mischievousness by eastern Igbo. Ikas are Ikas and Igbo are Igbo, don't miss apples with oranges. Stop pretending not to know your tribesmen Reno was referring to.

It's amazing how the Igbos have tried to twist Reno Omokri narrative to mean Ika of Anioma. Reno wasn't referring to the Ikas, some of who are very proud descendants of Benin and can trace their ancestral home/history back to Benin.

Some even went as far as to mentioned the Dein of Agbor, forgetting that the current Dein of Agbor at the age of 2 and a half was crowned by Benin chiefs under the instructions of late Oba Erediawa and his throne was protected until he was old enough. Why would the Oba of Benin do all this if Agbor people were slave descendants.

Reno was talking about a small population of about 200,000 within the wider over 5 million population of Delta state and Anioma alone accounts for millions.

Now who are those Reno was referring to? The answer is very simple, these are the people within the Anioma community that identify themselves as Igbo, they will even tell you their ancestral home of migration from the east to Delta state, what they don't usually say is the circumstances that brought them to Delta state, this is what Reno has just exposed. Some of these guys that are active on nairaland and other social media platforms are usually very hostile to Benin history and the reason as now shown by Reno is not far fetch.

I don't particularly blame them because very few will be favourably deposed to those that enslave their ancestors.

Most Ika and Anioma always make it know to all and sundry that they are not Igbo even though their dialects may be similar.

Reno was only referring to a minority Igbo clan in Delta state. These Delta Igbo clans people have variously claimed Igbo on nairaland and the Ikas and others who doesn't claim Igbo should be left out of this guesswork and mischievousness by eastern Igbo. Ikas are Ikas and Igbo are Igbo, don't miss apples with oranges. Stop pretending not to know your tribesmen Reno was referring to.

Fred Pearce wrote the following about the Benin City wall in the science magazine New Scientist: “In all, they are four times longer than the Great Wall of China and consumed a hundred times more material than the Great Pyramid of Cheops. They took an estimated 150 million hours to construct and are perhaps the largest single archaeological phenomenon on the planet.”

The Guinness Book of Records (1974 edition) described the walls of Benin City and its surrounding kingdom as “the world’s largest earthworks carried out prior to the mechanical era”.

Benin City was one of the first cities on Earth to have a semblance of street lighting, with huge metal lamps, many feet high, built and placed around the city.

In 1691, the Portuguese ship captain Lourenco Pinto observed: “Great Benin, where the king resides, is larger than Lisbon. All the streets run straight and as far as the eye can see. The houses are large, especially that of the king, which is richly decorated and has fine columns. The city is wealthy and industrious. It is so well governed that theft is unknown, and the people live in such security that they have no doors to their houses.”

In his personal account, 17th-century Dutch visitor Olfert Dapper wrote, “Houses are built alongside the streets in good order, the one close to the other. Adorned with gables and steps … they are usually broad with long galleries inside, especially so in the case of the houses of the nobility, and divided into many rooms which are separated by walls made of red clay, very well erected.”

“[The walls are] as shiny and smooth by washing and rubbing as any wall in Holland can be made with chalk, and they are like mirrors. The upper storeys are made of the same sort of clay. Moreover, every house is provided with a well for the supply of fresh water,” he continued.

https://thisisafrica.me/politics-and-society/african-marvels-the-walls-of-benin/

............................

Show our colonised countrymen the above underlined when next they show you some stupid colonial contraption from 1907 as the ''first storey bullding in Nigeria''.

GerogeI:
Like I referred earlier, the so called Great Benin Kingdom was grossly over estimated by the British as they were larger for easy entry and control through a monarch. A kingdom with no evidence of it existence East of the Niger and immediate west of the Niger, nor in Dahomey. Today we know well where they started and ended, unless you are alluding to someone having defeated the Oba of Benin and taken away the so called vast empire post 1400s, with no evidence of the wars. Even at that if you add all the fringe groups around Benin to its territory, it's not really much for greatness.

Benin was already declared great by various other Europeans centuries before the British even found their way to Benin.

So like the early Europeans called everyone they saw along the coast of Biafra Eboes, they easily referred to everyone close to Benen as part of Benen Kingdom. And by the way, it was a kingdom, not and empire.

You keep mentioning the British. The British were late entrants into Benin kingdom. If you are really interested in Benin history, research the first Europeans, the Portuguese that first visited Benin in the 1400s and the Dutch that followed later, they kept historical records of the vastness of the empire and the sphere of influence of the Oba. These are historical records that will remain for eternity and whatever any body says today is irrelevant.

Benin was already recorded as great by various Europeans countries for centuries before British even found their way to Benin.

It was recorded that the Oba could assemble 100,000 army within 24 hours. Do you even know the logistics that is involved in this? The food, water and transportation of their armaments.

The Benin moat was the greatest man made structure on earth when it was built according to the Guinness book of world records. There were nowhere else on earth with such great man made monuments.

The Portuguese and Dutch served in the Benin army as recorded by them. Yet you equates present day Benin to Benin empire.

The history of Benin was recorded by various Europeans who were eyewitnesses to it. They were not told, they saw it themselves.

Before the Benin Bronzes were exhibited in London, September 1897, the British actually taught black Africans were savages without history. The Benin Bronzes changed that perception and gave the black person and black Africa some sense of pride.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rp8flCwvoAU


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05d287NGqp8&feature=youtu.be

GerogeI:
The colonial era referred to anything around the Niger delta as Benen Kingdom. Even today, Geologist refers to most of the base rock under the Niger delta as Benin Formation. Simply because the British identified them as monarchies like themselves, and further hyped them, hoping to do with them what they did with the Emirs of the North

As a the time of the write up, when Olaudah was an accomplished adult, the borders and extent of Benen kingdom were still unknown as he stated clearly in his write up. So the broad use of Benen term at his time. Oluadah clearly identified himself as Eboe in his introduction, so his village was not in or part of Benin. But used Benin as the nearest location mark familiar to his audience of 17th century Christian in London. He goes on to describe in details how everyman was the highest authority in his own home- (an Igbo enshrine value system). He also spent entire paragraph on the similarity of his peoples culture with that of the Jews). Never in those descriptions did he mention any sort of reference or reverence to Benin. You can not rule a people in absentia. So like he said, Benin kingdom ( of which he knew as an adult) was probably too far as it had no influence in his village while he was a child.

If you followed his journey down to the seas, he was traded among people who spoke same language as him until he got to the sea. It's a shame, but it was Eboes that raided and kidnapped other Eboes as slaves, no outsider could have done it successfully as Reno Omokri claims. The British with their guns could not accomplish that talkless of Itsekiris.

You mistake 1400s to 1800s Benin kingdom described by early Europeans writers with present day Benin city. Present day Benin city is the area around ring road and hardly even form a single local government area.

The Benin kingdom is something else entirely. The Benin kingdom run along the coast for over 200 miles to Dahomey. Lagos and the entire south and some part of middle belt were all part of the Benin kingdom Oluadah described.

The Benin kingdom and Benin city it's capital are not the same thing in terms of land mass. You can't call Delta state Benin today, but it was part of the Benin kingdom likewise Lagos.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05d287NGqp8&feature=youtu.be

Itsekiris and the Binis had Igbo slaves for centuries before British colonialism. After the British banned slavery, we were forced to set them free. Some of them returned to Igbo land, others remained with us and gradually formed a new language called ******* (an Itsekiri word which we used to call them while they were our slaves). There are about 200,000 ******* still with us.

(I will not reveal the name of this tribe called *******, because I do not want to offend them, but they are in Delta state)

If they speak, an Igbo person will understand some of what they say, while Itsekiris, Binis and even European Portuguese people will understand them too. Those of them who chose to return to Igbo land have Igbo names that sound like Itsekiri or Benin names, for example Iweka, and many names beginning with Oba or Iken.

That is how some of our names and also Benin names went into the Igbo lexicon.

We have century old carvings in Ode Itsekiri and Benin depicting Igbo slaves, which we sold to the Portuguese via our ancient pre colonial port called Ogidigben. The grandfather of the present Oba of Benin showed some of these carvings to the world famous British anthropologist, Sir David Attenborough in 1973. The video is on YouTube. When you see the carving, even you will have no doubt that the person is Igbo.

Because of the sheer number of Igbo slaves we sold at Ogidigben, the Portuguese named the town Escravos, which means slave in Portuguese. Till today, many people still call Ogidigben Escravos.

We also sold slaves in another town called Burutu, which the Portuguese renamed Forcados (meaning forced labourer, which is a nicer way of saying slaves).

Obviously, I am not too proud of this history. I wish it never happened. History is not always pleasant. I am only revealing it to you because you are getting the wrong idea of linkages between our two peoples.

#RenosNuggets


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05d287NGqp8&feature=youtu.be

Find below one of many reasons Odua Nation, if granted, may become the hotbed of tribal wars and competition for supremacy. This is a petition written by a section (a group of tribal regions) of Yoruba land against another section (another group of tribal regions) of Yoruba land, but cleverly shrouded in a demand for state creation ����

___________________

PETITION FOR THE CREATION OF YORUBA CENTRAL STATE [20 JUNE 1967]

—A Petition Submitted to His Excellency General Yakubu Gowon by the Alaafin of Oyo, Chiefs, and People of Oyo.

I
“We, the Alafin [Oba Bello Gbadegesin Ladigbolu] and Chiefs on behalf of all the Chiefs and people of Oyo Division would like, first, to congratulate Your Excellency [Yakubu Gowon] on your present promotion to the esteemed position of the Major-General of our Armed Forces. We also wish to thank you for the progressive and courageous step taken by you in carving Nigeria into twelve component States.”

II
“Sir, as people of the Yoruba Central State, we have been very sorry and abject victims of an aggressive oligarchy from outside Ibadan; while our population is five and one quarter million of a total of nine million in the newly created Western State we are completely shut away from our natural rights and amenities and we are reduced to the position of mere second rate citizenship in a state of our birthright.”

III
“In Yorubaland it is the traditional right of the Alafin and the Yoruba Obas and Chiefs to appoint one of their sons to the exalted Office of the Are-Ona-Kakanfo. This ancient tradition was recently attacked by the appointment of a Leader of the Yorubas a direct affront to our tradition as Yorubas, and undue recognition being accorded a certain personality by the Military Government of Western State. It is no exaggeration to say that the minority in this State today controls our Civil Service, the Police Force, the Local Government set up to the detriment of the indigenous from the majority section which are the proper Oyo and Yoruba Ibadan Provinces.”

IV
“It is a pointer to the success and superiority of self-rule, that only when the Late Chief S. L. Akintola himself a native of Central Yoruba area, became the Premier of Western Region that some of the towns in the area have pipe-borne water and electricity. Since the Army take-over [in January 1966], harsh hands of neglect have gripped our area and we are choking under the throes of a ruthless Ijebu and Ekiti Officialdom.”

V
“The only solution to the problem is the creation of Central Yoruba State by DECREE to comprise the Old Oyo and Ibadan Provinces. The Central Yoruba area is now facing economic strangulation. In Government Contract awards, our people receive no patronage. Most industries which were in the Government blue-prints and which were earmarked for Central Yoruba Areas were taken to Ekiti and other areas. A case in point is the new textile factory at Ado-Ekiti. A shoe company for which the Government of old Western Region had subscribed £60, 000 and which should have been producing by now is decidedly put in the ‘frigidaire’ because it is located at Ogbomosho. This, we are sure, is a way of stifling the economy and prosperity of Yoruba Central Area.”

VI
“The wave of violence, arson and atrocities unleashed on Central Yoruba Area over the last four years is unprecedented and alien to us. The perpetrators come from Ijebu, and Eastern Nigeria. They are abetted by the arms of law. These atrocities never rear their heads in Ijebu Areas. This is one way our people have been gagged and muzzled so that the minorities can retain their predominance. We are confident that in our own State these injustices and horrors will cease. It baffles us how so few a group of people can have so much and not be contented. The Ijebus are out for a rule of terror and intimidation.

The so-called Western Leaders of thought is an Ijebu-Ekiti dominated assembly which claims to represent us. Opposition elements were bungled in prison – their papers were banned, their leaders blackmailed. This is how the minorities obtain their mandate to impose their views on the majority. The Federal Military Government is for a country ‘where no man is oppressed’ and therefore we are claiming our just right; freedom from a minority rule, personal intimidation and economic strangulation. It is only the creation of a Central Yoruba State that could solve the problem and save the country from future political eruption.”

VII
“We are not expressing mere sentiments. We have no chance of survival in the new set-up of things in the Western State. Nothing short of the creation of a Central Yoruba State will satisfy our aspirations. We have the unflinching support of our people. We wish your good self all succour and zest needed at this crucial moment. Our faith in you and your Government will grow from strength to strength; and we implore you to invoke your authority now and right-away to create for us and our children the Central Yoruba State which will include the old Oyo and Ibadan Provinces—a population figure of 5.2 million.”

VIII
“In conclusion Sir, We like to emphasize that the creation of the Central Yoruba State is being sought on the principles of: (1) historical and traditional ties (2) economic viability (3) overall interest of the Federation as a whole—the principle being that no one State should be too large to become a terror to its neighbours. On behalf of ourselves and our people we remain, Sir.”

SOURCE:- S. K. Panter-Brick, Nigerian Politics and Military Rule: Prelude to the Civil War (London: Athlone Press, 1970) pp. 267-269

nengibo:
But Opc ,Edoid groups, Politicians and even companies are involved, it isn't an internal affair

I bet you can't point to any prominent Benin chief that is against the selection of Tsola. Read my previous posts above for the reasons.

Naturally, any Itsekiri prince contesting the position of Olu will always look towards Benin for support, so there may be some Benin individuals or Edo groups that may lend such support.

The Benin royalty is not part of such internal affairs because whoever emerges remains a descendant of Benin since the royal house itself is of Benin. It's just same Benin descendant brothers contesting the same position. There is nothing extra for Benin to gain or lose whoever emerges. It's like two Benin politicians contesting to be the governor of Edo state. I am sure you saw the fight between Obaseki and Ize-Iyamu in the last Edo election.

nengibo:
So if they're Yoruba, why then this issue of having a Yoruba mother disqualifying a Prince

The royalty or the Itsekiri monarchy is Benin.

If the Itsekiri monarchy was Yoruba, there wouldn't have been an issue of disqualifying a prince with Yoruba mother.

The Benin don't care about the tribes of the mothers of the princes, that's Itsekiri internal politics/affairs.

YungMillionaire:
Yes, they did. They worked hard with Ayiri to reverse Tsola's enthronment.

Educate your father first, then we shall see if you are fit to educate me.

And so? Where did I say otherwise?


And so?


And so?


And so?

You make me laugh. No be only sympathy. Try again.

If they didn't care, why did they impose it when we were in Bendel?

Irrelevant.


If only you know how close to the events I am, you will cover your face in shame. But yes, assume away. Nothing spoil.


Yes. To the average Bini person it makes no difference. But to the Bini revisionists include their promoters chiefs that promote their madness it means everything.


No be only offshoot na oncross. Next go and bring a Bini man to come and become Olu. Make we see how e go be now


If it is irrelevant why did you include an anti-Yoruba clause for Olu when we were in Bendel?. Keep yarning dust. I am enjoying your futile attempts.


I don't know and I don't care.


We don't claim Yoruba. We are a Yoruba people. See the difference. You only claim what is in dispute. The only dispute is in your skull not ours.


You get mouth o! First, wetin concern Warri with Ilorin? Secondly, this is the 21st century, nobody is subjects to nobody. Again if you are sure say na Bini get the throne bring a Bini to come and be Olu - If Ogun no reject am make my yanch swell

Finally, go and sit down. I am sure you are one of those miscreants that were making mouth saying Tsola will not ascend the throne. How far?

Your response above shows that you are either not Itsekiri or your parents are some of the recent Yoruba migrants to Warri and as a result your are not very well informed and clueless about the relationship between Benin and Itsekiri monarchy.

I asked you which Benin chief/chiefs interfered in the selection of Tsola, you can't mention any name. Incase you don't know, not everyone in Benin is a chief, to some of you outsiders and because of Benin status as the foremost royal city in Africa, you assume every Benin man is a chief. So by claiming that a Benin chief was against Tsola, you are trying to give your lie weight and present it as authentic. Yoruba have always used Benin royalty to give their lies weight. You guys can't tell your stories, lies and fairytales in isolation without disingenuously pointing to Benin royalty for authenticity.

Benin didn't write the edict that prohibited any Itsekiri prince whose mother is Yoruba from ascending the throne. The Itsekiri ruling class wrote it themselves and like I said before the Benin care less.

I already told you that countless senior and hereditary chiefs in Benin have mothers from various tribes across Nigeria. Several Iyase of Benin have been, Urhobo, Ijaw, Akure etc. If Benin was comfortable with this why would they care about Tsola's mother's tribe?

No Benin chief will work against the interests of Captain Hosa, a very prominent Benin son who is very close to the Benin Palace. Like I already told you, Captain Hosa is the father inlaw to Tsola and his grandchildren and great grandchildren stand the chances of becoming future Olus. Why would any Benin chief work against this.

Who else amongst the other candidates have these additional Benin advantage, interests, sympathy as Tsola. Tsola brings the Olu throne even closer to Benin than any other of the princes.

Learn how to use your brain to think. Don't get confused by social media ranting, it's very different from the reality on ground.

Guy, look for somewhere else to tell your lies. It's obvious that you are one of those anti Benin people with chips on their shoulders.

Go back to my earlier post on this topic and read them, I have been consistent. Tsola is the closest to Benin and Benin interests amongst the contestants. If there has been any Benin person that have argued against his selection they were not well informed and certainly no Benin Palace chief would have worked against what is obviously Benin interest.

davidnazee:
Tsola's children are even more Benin than Yoruba since their mom is Benin.. next Olu will be more benin than yoruba..
These yorubas are just trying to feel important..

They like to dabble into subjects they know very little about instead of thinking about how to get Ilorin back from their Fulani overlord.

YungMillionaire:
Tao na you dey waste your time. All these Bini revisionists have by invited (by me) several times to come and meet me in Warri so they can show me prove on ground that we are not a Yoruba people. Not one has ever taken me up on it. They are very loud on social media but when it comes to real life they lose their confidence.

Permit me to give you a breakdown of how the whole thing unfolded:
Their (Bini revisionists) attack on Tsola (who is widely admired across Itsekiri land) has backfired spectacularly. I warned them not to get involved because Ologobosere (Ayiri Emami who is very pro-Yoruba by the way) has lost the confidence of the people. Ayiri was never opposed to Tsola until it became clear Tsola was determined to move slightly away from him and seek more the wisdom/advice of the Iyasere of Warri Kingdom (Johnson Atseleghe who is very pro-Bini). So right there you know it was never about Yoruba vs Bini. And we have never had Yoruba vs Bini issue ever. Ayiri made it is so purely to get back at Tsola since it was becoming clear that a Tsola Kingship would look more towards Iyasere than Ologbosere.Then the Bini chiefs got involved to test their powers and Ayiri decided to use Bini influence to embarrase Tsola. But he ran into the wall of Tsola's high popularity amongst Itsekiri people. Now, he has decided to join legal forces with junior which of course is a futile effort. So by driving the Bini vs Yoruba narrative, Ayiri in effect pushed more Itsekiris to meditate on their Yoruba heritage. People who hardly think about their Yoruba connection are now accusing Ayiri of trying to insult their Yoruba heritage. Plus most people still blame him for the missing crown. In effect, the average Itsekiris are now more pro-Yoruba than they were before Ayiri politicized the whole thing. If I was a conspiracy theorist, I would say Ayiri was playing 3D chess to move Itskeiris more towards Yoruba heritage. But the reality is that he did all this for his own selfish drive for power nothing more. The bini chiefs have put eggs on their face. And come August when Tsola is officially installed their embarrassment will be complete. If they had stayed out of this, their dignity would have been intact. But their lust for power entrapped their minds.

Guy, are you okay? Which Benin chief/chiefs interfered in what is going on with Tsola.

Incase you are not aware, let me educate you and hopefully cure your ignorance.

1. Tsola is married to the daughter of Captain Hosa, a Benin billionaire.
2. Tsola was made a director in Captain Hosa's company.
3. The current Oba of Benin as a prince was the royal father in the traditional marriage between Tsola and Captain Hosa's daughter.
4. Captain Hosa is very close to the Benin Palace.
5. Tsola probably have more Benin influence and sympathy for the aforementioned reasons than the other interested parties.
6. Captain Hosa can't divorce himself or show lack of interest in his son inlaw becoming the Olu of Itsekiri and by extension his grandson could also become an Olu in the future.

What makes you think the Benin people care about who the mother of any Olu of Itsekiri is? In Benin, your mother's tribe is not as important as your father's tribe.

You are probably carried away by the social media and lacks the understanding of the politics at play with regards to who becomes Olu of Itsekiri.

The Itsekiri royal family and all Itsekiri prominent chiefs traces the Itsekiri monarchy to Benin, so what different do you think it makes to the average Benin person if Tsola mother is Portuguese. It makes no difference and it will not change the fact that the Itsekiri monarchy is and will continue to be an offshoot of Benin. Where the mother of any prince comes from is irrelevant to us. I personally know of numerous hereditary chiefs in Benin whose mothers are Igbo, Yoruba, Ijaw, Urhobos, etc.

The current Iyase of Benin is of Urhobo ancestry, the current governor of Edo state is of Anioma ancestry. Benin have no issues with Itsekiri, they can claim Yoruba or Fulani, we care less. But the monarchy remains Benin just as the Ilorin Emir remains Fulani with majority Yoruba population.

The simple fact that the selected Olu is being challenged because his mother is Yoruba have exposed Yoruba lies about the the Itsekiri monarchy being Yoruba.

People that haven't been able to claim the Itsekiri monarchy as Yoruba despite the similarities in language are claiming the Benin monarchy as Yoruba.

Sewgon79:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKLTie7LhKQ

Don't forget that the reason they are fighting the newly selected Olu is because his mother is Yoruba. If these people or the royalty see themselves as Yoruba why will they be against a prince whose mother is Yoruba.

The reason they are fighting the selected prince whose mother is Yoruba is because the Itsekiri royal family is not Yoruba but Benin.

Dartilo:
Funny or not it doesn't change the fact that Prince Giniuwa the son of Oba Olua and sons of Benin cheif founded the warri kingdom tiil date...it's funny that the Benin family have been king over warri till date,it's funny that those that are all fighting for the throne are all descendants from Benin Paternally....it's funny that from now till eternity those that can have access to warri kingship must surely be descendants of Benin

I don't get Yoruba busy body posture in the quarrel between and amongst princes who are paternally Benin.

Simbrixton:
oba did not send his son anywhere it's clear u dont know d history reason why una dey constantly talk trash modern day olus are olus of itsekiri and not for any external group I advise you to focus on the ijaws disturbing u at obazuwa and gelegele in general

You can't be an Itsekiri person, if you are, then you are one of those whose parents just migrated to Itsekiri land. The Itsekiri royalty including all the chiefs know that the royal family is of Benin ancestry. Just incase you missed it the first time, below are Itsekiri high chiefs telling their history on channels TV.

The Itsekiri princes should settle their differences in peace or their royal father in Benin should intervene and help them find peace.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=di7n4nqTOHA

Simbrixton:
itsekiri is itsekiri the overbearing and irritating mentality of Edos is becoming a problem for everyone in the region

Well I would love to see u cowards come to warri to crown oyowoli

Whoever is crowned must be a prince from the royal family and the royal family is of Benin ancestry. The Itsekiri crown will continue to be of Benin ancestry irrespective of were the mother of the crown prince comes from, even if his mother is Japanese or Chinese.

The dynasty hasn't changed since the Oba of Benin sent his son and sons of Benin chiefs to go and rule over Itsekiri land. If the Itsekiris no longer want their current Benin royalty, they can start another dynasty which is not of Benin ancestry. Until then, whoever becomes the Olu of Warri will always be of Benin heritage.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=di7n4nqTOHA

TAO11:
You must think everyone else is partially amnesiac just like you are.

You saw the iNsULtS but not where you & your whole comment were challenged & dragged as shown in the link below:

https://www.nairaland.com/6567039/bini-ife-seniority-crises-science-rescue/1#102646159

I am not interested in your insults, if you have anything new bring it to the table, not the usual unsubstantiated myths and fairytales of how the tortoise used to speak the Igbo and Yoruba languages or how Oduduwa climbed down from the sky with a golden chain.

Cheers

Olu317:
I'm not interested in your egocentrism, so never mind. Enjoy your Bini fanatasy....

Atleast you throw in the towel without the usual insults from our Yoruba debaters.

Cheers.

TAO11:
Nairaland Binis, aka morons.

The insults were predicted and expected, you guys never fail to confirm what you are. Benin no longer debate fairytales. Whenever you have anything substantial, bring it to the table.

Olu317:
All the times you see the truth, you keep propagating false information which can never stand the test of time.

The issue you keep raising up has been dealt with several times. Read more from the following writers :

Esmeraldo de Situ Orbis, the well-known Portuguese explorer Duarte Pacheco Pereira 's travel account

Henry Drewal and John Pemberton III with Rowland Abiodun

John Affons d’ Aveiro's account when hen he visited Benin in 1486

J.D. Barros, Da Asia (Lisbon, 1552)

A.F.C. Ryder, Benin and the Europeans. (London: Longman, 1969)

R.E. Bradbury, Benin Studies (ed.) Peter Morton Williams (Oxford University Press, 1973)

Michael Ediagbonya; INTERNATIONAL JOURNAL OF HUMANITIES AND CULTURAL STUDIES : (A study of the Portuguese-Benin Trade Relations: Ughoton as a Benin Port(1485 -1506)

Could you show us from your 1485 to 1506 citations where Benin was said to have had any relationship with Ife. Let me even make it easier for you, show us any citations or references from 1400 to 1800, a period of 400 years that says Benin had relationship with Ife.

2. Show us where Ife, Oduduwa and Oranmiyan were mentioned in Benin history in the 400 years before 1826.

You don't come here to throw around references without any specifics, pretending to know what your are saying, we have gone beyond that.

If you are saying Benin had any relationship with Ife between 1400 to 1826, you have to point it out in your citations and references.

Benin history was written down. You guys have been mutilating it to your advantage since you knew how to read and write.

I can bet you that none of your pre 1826 references even mentioned Ife specifically by name. If you say I am lying show us.

What you guys have been doing is pick a story/place from Benin history books and claim it as Ife not minding that the name, distance and direction of the place mentioned have no semblance to Ife.

The relationship Benin had with western Nigeria before 1826, was with eastern Yoruba, Ekiti, Owo, Akure and others such as Oyo and Lagos. Infact Benin already annexed and had a military garrison in Lagos that reported back daily to the Oba of Benin as early as 1602.

I repeat nothing in either Benin or Yoruba history books before 1826 mentioned Benin in connection with Ife.

Benin/Ife connection is a political history written in the late 1890s. This is why the relationship can't be proven earlier than the 1800s. Others like yourself have tried to prove it and failed woefully in the past, maybe you can take a stab at it and prove me wrong.

Others like yourself usually retorts to insults after failed attempts before running away from the thread, hope you will be different, please bring forth the evidence of Benin/Ife relationship before 1826.

I pity you, only if you know the beating TAO11 has received on this same subject in the past one year

Olu317:
Liar

Benin history was written down by various Europeans explorers, traders, priests, etc, that were eyewitnesses to it from the 1400s to 1897. It's can't be fabricated. No one can play politics with Benin history because it's cast in stone. The Benin know the difference between our real history and the created political history which Yoruba like to propagate as gospel truth.

People like us are not interested in the fairytales that started after 1897.

Unfortunately for you guys, Benin history is archived in the various European countries that encountered Benin including the Catholic church, all your lies will remain lies that can't be backed up earlier than the 1800s. In the future any serious historian and researcher can access these materials from European archives.

Most of what have been written since the 1800s have no semblance to what was written down by those that actually witnessed Benin history being made between 1400s to 1897.

ChukwukaKazaore:
This is by all standard the best account so far. No sentiment

Few undisputed facts for you.

1. The Portuguese arrived Benin City in the 1400s, other Europeans followed. Between 1400s to late 1800s, the history of Benin was extensively documented by several Europeans and by 1600s the Catholic church established a post in Benin city with resident priests that continue to document Benin history.

2. From 1400s to 1800, Benin was not once documented by various Europeans to have had any relationship with Ife.

3. Between 1400s to 1800, Ife, Oduduwa and Oranmiyan were never mentioned in Benin history.

4. 1826 was the year the hinterland of Yoruba was first visited by the British, 400 years after the Europeans first visited Benin City. The Alaafin that was visited in 1826 told the British that he was waiting and relying on the Oba of Benin for military assistance to help with the war he was fighting with his neighbours.

4. In 1826 the Alaafin told the British that the Oba of Benin was his friend not his brother.

5. In 1826 Ife was not even mentioned to the British.

6. Ife only came into prominence after 1826 when it was recognised as a spiritual home to the Yoruba. Ife was where most people went to consult the Oracle and the Ooni was nothing but a priest.

7. Benin had no connections with Ife before 1826. No one can present any reference were Ife, Oduduwa and Oranmiyan were mentioned in Benin history in the 400 years before 1826.

8. Everything written after 1826 and referenced by the author are mostly fabrications upon fabrications by various writers. None of the 19th and 20th centuries references referenced by the author is supported by the Benin history that were documented by Europeans in the previous 400 years.

9. Benin/Ife connection is a modern day political fabrication and fairytale that can't be found in Benin history earlier than 1826.

10. Benin/Ife connection was fabricated after the fall of Benin kingdom/empire in 1897.

11. Organe Kingdom mentioned in Benin history in the 1400s was described as a distance of 20 moons/months from Benin and it was east of Benin. This was not Ife because Ife is west of Benin and not east as described, the distance from Benin to Ife was less than 20 months. Ife was not mentioned but Organe.

12. The author can only deceive the less informed about Benin history.

13. Benin documented history is 400 years older than Ife history that started after 1826.

14. It's funny when those that are not just your junior but 400 years your junior begin to claim seniority, this can only happen in Nigeria.

15. No matter how many times a lie is told by many people, it can never become truth. Benin history from 1400s to 1800s, a period of 400 years is very well established and doesn't support modern day Benin/Ife fairytale.

This is what Yoruba historical greats recorded about the Ooni in late 1800s and early 1900s.

in his book The History of the Yorubas Samuel Johnson wrote that the Ooni of Ife was a descendant of a mere shrine keeper, rather than real royalty (a myth which had actually been prevalent in other parts of Yorubaland even before Johnson wrote his book.

The historian Robin Law cites other instances of this myth about the Ooni of Ife being some kind of shrine keeper or non-royalty existing in other parts of Yorubaland dating from before and after Johnson's book was published).

The Ooni was nothing but a chief priest or babalawo before his political elevation.

Fezz:
I'm well aware of this.. I know their tricks and I laugh all the time when I see them stealing Benin history. It's laughable but at the same time quite sad. How can a bunch of people be so desperate to fabricate history. It is fun to watch though. It just shows how important the Benins are to certain ethnic groups.

Benin history is very important to every tribes in southern Nigeria that is why Yoruba is trying to steal it by all means. Benin is the historical calendar by which other tribes dates their history.

If Oduduwa and Oranmiyan existed beyond myths and legends, only the Benin and Oba of Benin have the authentic history. If Yoruba want to share from our glorious past, they are welcome but unacceptable for them to try to steal it.

Fezz:
This is laughable.. you just stated not long ago that the Europeans visited the awories and ijebus in 1472 and 1500's. The story of oranmiyan would have easily been recorded by the Europeans if they truly visited yorubaland in this era. You keep on shooting yourself on the foot. Oranmiyan left the Benin shores around 1170 and was ruling oyo in 1200AD. So you can see it's around the same time line as your so called Europeans visited the awories . If the Europeans didn't write down the ancestorial history of the "so called" yorubas at that time, please tell us what would have been more important for them to write about ? This is becoming really laughable.

Also don't forget that Benin who was supposed to be related to the Yoruba through Oduduwa was visited repeatedly since 1400s and by 1600s the catholic church had a permanent mission with priests in Benin city who documented all aspects of Benin lives yet Oduduwa and Oranmiyan were never mentioned.

If she is arguing that Yoruba history wasn't sufficiently documented, what about Benin history?

There in no mention of Oduduwa and Oranmiyan in either Benin or Yoruba history as being humans that actually lived before 1800s.

The best you can get before the 1800s is Oduduwa and Oranmiyan being legends and unsubstantiated myths.

Fezz:
Nice one Sam... Benin Oghene is completely different from the Yoruba Ooni. What the yorubas have done is take parts of the Benin history and claimed it as theirs. It shows how desperate they are to be part of Benin kingdoms history.

Yoruba eyewitness written history began proper in 1826. This was the year the Alaafin received his first European visitor who started documenting the hinterland of Yoruba. Benin eyewitness documentation was already 400 years old by this time. To catch up with the Benins they came up with the Benin/Ife connection.

They went through Benin historical archives and started distorting it by misrepresenting names that have nothing to with Ife and Oduduwa as being Ife and Oduduwa.

Whenever you are debating them on Oduduwa they keep going into their distorted Benin historical archives to support their lies.

Show us Oduduwa and Oranmiyan in Yorubas history before 1800s, they cannot provide us any evidence of Yoruba history of Oduduwa before the 1800.