₦airaland Forum

onetrack:
This is not possible. It is a logical impossibility. If this god knows what will happen and is all powerful then it must be a result of his will.

All powerful but will not make you act against your will. Else why did He give you one? God is Love and He will only want our loyalty to Him to be also a choice of reciprocating His Love, not a programming from which the robot cannot depart.

folksync:
You mean God caused Adam to sin so that Adam would stop being in God's image and likeness?

No, nothing in my post suggests that God CAUSED Adam. God gave Adam commands on what to avoid and what to accept. God's purpose was clear as Genesis 1:26 shows. But He wont make man remain so without him wanting it so.

onetrack:
I require extraordinary evidence in order to believe an extraordinary claim. I need to see someone make time stop, for example.

I think its better to let such an One decide on what means He will give proofs else you might be expecting what He might choose not to do!
Your request for a sign echoes that of some men in the Bible (including Herod), somehow He did not act to gratify their curiosity

onetrack:
Lack of evidence of any particular god is my position. I cannot fake believe. I have no faith and don't see faith as a good thing. The Bible and the Quran are just books written by men.

In any case I have and have always had no interest in practicing any religion.

Indeed but how about meeting a Person?

folksync:
Should there have been the need for a tempter at all?

Yes. Adam was created in God's Image and Likeness not by Adam's choice. Now God will be violating His own principle if He made Adam remain like that for all eternity. Besides, the equation was balanced- God had commanded, the devil also tempted and man made his choice.
The tempter was not created so, he had become wicked by reason of his alienation from God.

As to who tempted the tempter? NOBODY! he made his choice.

onetrack:
Free will and an all-knowing, all powerful god are two incompatible ideas. If this god does not know the future then he is not all-knowing; if he does know the future then it is because it is what he wanted to happen.

He knows the end of either alternatives we will choose. He also knows our hearts and it's inclinations to either alternatives but the only influence He makes is to warn or encourage where applicable. This far the Bible reveals to us of His Omni-Science.

onetrack:
Though I don't believe the story of Adam and Eve one bit, I would have been rather happy to see Adam eat the apple so that we would not live a life of an ignorant zombie just passively existing without any challenges in some garden. What a boring existence that would be. It's for the exact same reason that the idea of Heaven does not appeal to me. No challenges and no meaning to existence.

Well since you dont believe it...

However, if the highlighted is your only reason then ...why rest the irreversible on a personal opinion/perception?

Besides, the real joy of a Christian (at least for me) is not Streets of Gold, Pearly Gates, Mansions...etc

JackBizzle:
You have no sense of morality. May your children not be killed for your sins

Why do you say that? And what is your reference point/standard for morality? Please answer both.

Man is not allowed to avenge himself. Who then takes vengeance? Who dispenses justice?
(Answer these too if you can)

JackBizzle:
A jealous God is good?

Sure He is.You need to realize that He knows what we get into when we forsake Him. He knows the enemy we expose ourselves to. Imagine Job going into idolatry, God knows the hedge of protection will be broken down and He will do nothing in preventing Job from facing the consequences of his choice!

A God that hardened Pharoah's heart?

Yes, see God gives man a long rope but when that is over, judgement takes many shapes! When tyrants like Belshazzar, Antiochus Epiphanes, Nebuchadnezzar, Manasseh, Jeconiah etc all had their chances. Some repented, others waited till it was too late

A God that killed the first sons of the Egyptians who had nothing to do with the crimes of the parents?

It was judgement! Israel also lost innocent babies to Egypt, cruelly enslaved innocent Israelites (death on a daily basis will be inevitable) etc

A God that killed King David's son to punish King David?

Rather, the message of the Bible is that our sins affect others negatively! This is an example. David killed Uriah hence he reaped judgement from God. Why didnt God kill David? He repented, but the consequences of his sins spread to all!

That is why God said, Vengeance is Mine!

onetrack:
If the father in this case happened to be all-powerful, all-knowing, and omnipresent, then yes, it would be his fault because he knowingly created a son that he knew would turn out to be troublesome, even though he could have prevented it without any problem to himself.

And till date is the Father bereft of ideas for a way out? Did He speak of the way out after brainstorming for some centuries after the fall or immediately after the fall?

From the proceedings in Genesis it is clear that what the Father wanted was that Adam would decide if he will remain in that state in which he was created! (Adam did not choose the state in which he was created, God did). And that is why immediately after the fall, he was sent out lest he took from the one that God did not forbid him from taking - the Tree of life and remain irredeemably in that fallen state forever.

If Adam had taken from Tree of life first, then there will be no need for the tempter because Adam's state would be positively irreversible!

JackBizzle:
Pastor


Is good also a created thing? You christians and your half baked logic.


God created evil. He is the almighty smiter. The punisher.


Yaweh the defiler

God is essentially Good and even after Creation, all was adjudged good by Him. Hence, evil has it's source when there is a separation from Him!!!

Those pix seem to relate to a group that openly claim that they hold to the Bible and OTHER traditions, ask them!

The passage in question is self explanatory, darkness/evil is the consequence of God withdrawing His Light. For example, man was not created with an evil nature.(Eating from the forbidden tree was not a question off morals but faith)
However, after the fall, man was separated from God and the heart of man became evil as a result Genesis 6:5

Meaning the creating of evil takes place as a consequence creatures being the determinants.

Olulinks:
Let comments start rolling in about the authenticity of this book.

Kindly take a visit here:
https://www.nairaland.com/2912069/gospel-barnabas-laid-rest

KingEbukasBlog:
They choose to accept that the bible copied other books but dont want to accept that other books copied the bible which is the truth

Indeed, even the Bible shows where they all started - Nimrod after the flood!!!

Just as we find in the failed gospel of Barnabas, they update their lies to resemble the truth from time to time.

After all, Enoch, Noah etc pleased God and were not trying to observe religion! The one walked with God (on HIs terms)while the other did similar and found grace before God and served Him on His Terms!

KINGinVAHALA:
I have been wondering if God really and actually created Heaven and Earth in 7 days.

According to the book of 2nd Peter 3:8
"But, Beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day."

So, does that means the 7 days is actually 7000 years if 1 day in the eyes of God is 1000 years to humans according to the book of 2nd Peter 3:8?

YES. Note the mention, " and the evening and the morning were....day" used in Genesis 1. Meaning it is not 7000 years.

tombravo:
thanks bro. i just cant wait till sunday. im 17 and i have no freedom of movemnt if nt, i wuld av gone to church today.

You can inquire of the Lord! He is a prayer away; no need to wait till sunday. I can relate your question to various experiences and knowledge and give you an answer but the best reply you can get is from He into Whose Presence you come when you pray and worship!
Stay Blessed.

Now it is basic knowledge that the devil is an expert in copying.

Bro, since you are relating with a Living Personality (not inanimate forces) you can inquire from Him directly or see your leaders in Church. Any answer given here will be ridiculed and the original purpose of the thread will be defeated.

reallest:
It's dear,d authors of Bible are confused and dats y d book of contradiction

Well, I wonder what contradictions? In the first century,people received Jesus as their Lord and Saviour and their lives were transformed and those around them saw it. People in the 21st century do same and get same results! What then?

reallest:
Confusion everywhere,why can't dis people see dat dis Christianity of a thing is a scam

Because it isnt!

Rather, the prevalence of divergence only underscores that there is the Truth! Even the Bible already foretold of these things so we are unperturbed thereby the only concern is those who are affected/deceived by the dissenters.

Now let the op and his assistant give us instances where Jesus Christ and His disciples and/or any contemporary Christian movement or Jewish movement 'fulfilled' those passages quoted with reference made thereto as source of inspiration!

Besides, those OT commands were given as a means of judgement execution because when the Nation of Israel became guilty of similar offences, other nations were allowed to do same to them! That is why we have Assyrian invasions, Babylonian captivity of Israel etc

meixili:
Salamalikum Shalom

Lol @ above , I'm smiling.

My answer is this, when prophet Moses peace be upon him came, many rejected him. Prophet Noah peace be upon him came, the rejectors were many. Prophet Jesus peace be upon him came, many rejected him. Prophet Muhammad Peace be upon him came, many rejected him.

This is nothing new, man has a track record of rejecting truth guidance and Prophets

You have not answered my question bro.

Scholar8200:
Now, what occasioned the persecution and martyrdom of many of Christ's disciples as recorded in Acts and history after His resurrection and ascension?

What teaching did the sanhedrin and the Jews persecute them for?
Dont refer to Noah, Moses etc we are talking of disciples here.

Scholar8200:
Now, what occasioned the persecution and martyrdom of many of Christ's disciples as recorded in Acts and history?
When prophets that came before Jesus prophesied of His death, He also prophesied of the same, why should we abandon that which was thus confirmed by many and stay with the claims of one man? Especially as such claims appeared to agree with the error being peddled by enemies of the Gospel - Gnostics?

I am patiently waiting for a direct answer to this question hockeyoiler meixili

meixili:
In the name of Allah the most gracious , master of the day of judgment

بَلْ رَّفَعَهُ اللّٰهُ اِلَيۡهِ​ ؕ وَكَانَ اللّٰهُ عَزِيۡزًا حَكِيۡمًا‏ 


(4:158) but Allah raised him to Himself. Allah is All-Mighty, All-Wise.


This is the truth revealed by God. What is categorically asserted here is merely that the Jews did not succeed in killing the Messiah, but that God raised him unto Himself. The Qur'an furnishes no detailed information about the actual form of this 'raising'. It neither states categorically that God raised him from the earthly sphere to some place in heaven in both body and soul, nor that his body died on earth and his soul alone was raised to heaven. Hence neither of the two alternatives can be definitely affirmed nor denied on the basis of the Qur'an. If one reflects on the Qur'anic version of the event one gets the impression that, whatever the actual form of this 'raising', the event was of an extraordinary character. This extraordinariness is evident from three things:

First, the Christians believed in the ascension of the Messiah in both body and soul, which was one of the reasons for large sections of people to believe in the godhead of Jesus. The Qur'an does not refute that idea but employs the same term, raf (i.e. 'ascension'), employed by the Christians. It is inconceivable that the Qur'an, which describes itself as the 'Clear Book', would employ an expression that might lend support to a misconception it seeks to repudiate.

Second, one might assume that either the ascension of the Messiah was of the kind that takes place at every person's death or that this 'ascension' meant merely the exaltation of a Prophet's position, like that of Idris: 'And We raised him to an exalted station' (Surah Maryam 19: 57). Had it been so, this idea would have been better expressed by a statement such as: And indeed they did not kill the Messiah; Allah delivered him from execution and caused him to die a natural death. The Jews had wanted to slight him but Allah granted him an exalted position.

Third, if this raf (exaltation, ascension) referred to in the verse: 'Allah raised him to Himself was of an ordinary kind, the statement which follows, namely that 'Allah is All-Mighty, All-Wise', would seem altogether out of context. Such a statement is pertinent only in the context of an event which manifested, in a highly extraordinary manner, by the overwhelming power and wisdom of God.

The only Qur'anic argument that can be adduced to controvert this view is the verse in which the expression mutawaffika see (Surah Al 'Imran 3: 55))is employed. But as we have pointed out (see Towards Understanding the Qur'an, vol. I, (Surah 3, n. 51), this word can denote either God's taking a man unto Himself in soul or taking him unto Himself in both body and soul. Arguments based on the mere use of this word are not enough to repudiate the arguments we have already adduced. Some of those who insist on the physical death of Jesus support their argument by pointing out that there is no other example of the use of the word tawaffa for God's taking unto Himself a man in body as well as in soul. But this argument is not tenable since the ascension of Jesus was a unique event in human history and, therefore, the quest for another example of the use of this term in the same context is meaningless. What is worth exploring is whether or not the use of the word in such a sense is valid according to Arabic usage. If it is, we will have to say that the choice of this particular word lends support to belief in the ascension of Jesus.

If we reflect on this verse in the light of the assumption that Jesus died physically, it appears strange that the Qur'an does not employ those terms which would exclude signifying the simultaneous physical and spiritual ascension of Jesus. On the contrary, the Qur'an prefers a term which, since it is liable to both interpretations (i.e. it can mean both spiritual and physical ascension), lends support to belief in the physical ascension of Jesus, even though that notion was used as a basis to support the false belief in the godhead of Jesus.

Belief in the physical ascension of Jesus is further reinforced by those numerous traditions which mention the return of Jesus, son of Mary, to the world and his struggle against the Anti-Christ before the end of time. (For these traditions see our appendix to Surah 33.) These traditions quite definitively establish the second coming of Jesus. Now it is for anybody to judge which is more reasonable: Jesus' return to this world after his death, or his being alive somewhere in God's universe, and returning to this world at some point in time?

Now, what occasioned the persecution and martyrdom of many of Christ's disciples as recorded in Acts and history?

When prophets that came before Jesus prophesied of His death, He also prophesied of the same, why should we abandon that which was thus confirmed by many and stay with the claims of one man? Especially as such claims appeared to agree with the error being peddled by enemies of the Gospel - Gnostics?

Pyrrho:
But there would be more men in hell than in heaven. Whoever made hell must have made a big mistake.

And how can I even begin to consider your baseless story.

Alright.

Hell and/or lake of fire was not originally made for man.

Matthew 25:41
Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into[b] everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:[/b]

But we have our choices on where we end.

And, while the absence of loved ones may be sad, there will be tears but they will be wiped off.

let me ask, have you ever lost a loved one? If yes, how long did it take you to grieve? If such loss now is not grieved throughout a lifetime, how much less in Eternity?

Besides, that is why earnest efforts are made to help such while they are alive and a change can still be made.

bingbagbo:
Why is God called the God of hosts?

Who are the hosts?

His creatures - the Angels.


FOOD FOR THOUGHT.
2 hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
Hebrews 1:2


who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
16 for by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
19 For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell
Colossians 1:13,16,19

Richirich713:
Genesis 1:26 is just more evidence of the trinity.

God bless you! The Op appears to believe Angels were God's partners in creation.

malvisguy212:
you miss the point completely, let me ask, how did human achieve this immortality ? The human NATURE is not immortal, it is the spirit and soul which is immortal. Immortality is achieved when the body of the
believer is raised and transformed and then united with the soul.

She is mistaking immortality for Eternal Life (The God-Kind)!!! Why then?
does the devil also have Eternal life?

promisechuks:
The main things that can keep you away from grace are HOILIER THAN THOU, SELF RIGHTEOUSNESS, LAW KEEPING because they will eventually end you up in SIN-CONCIOUSNESS, FEAR, GUILTY, CONDEMNATION and the next is death in hell.

Grab grace!

Bro, I believe her point was that we are saved, not by works, but by grace THROUGH FAITH. Now that faith , though abstract, expresses itself by love (includes holiness of life). Hence where the latter is absent, that faith is vain though it be professed with all vehemency!

That is why John the Beloved said:

He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
1 John 2:4,5

Note that this is not saying we are saved by keeping His Word; rather it says the proof of the faith by which He saves us is the fact that we walk in the Spirit thus fulfilling the Law by the Spirit's enabling. Hence, if we claim to believe but live sinful (lawless) lives, we deceive ourselves.

Jessicha:
don't u see a question mark? once again, u said without the salvation of Jesus , what humans have is shame

now its either Abel go to heaven or go to helfire ... if he go to heaven, is heaven a place of shame ?

or did he go to hellfire ?

Can you quote me directly before making your accusations? What's it about if Abel 'go to heaven' or 'go to hell fire'?

UV ran away from Daniel ... the point is clear.

The books are all in the Bible. What point?

o ma se o, man read verse 31 and understand what Christ is saying

Sure, but when God said that to Moses, were the men -Abraham, Isaac etc- on Earth? Why would God introduce Himself as the God of the dead? Answer!

error man
In Acts 13:36 Paul, speaking of David, says that he “was laid unto his fathers.” This all must acknowledge to be the exact equivalent of being “gathered to his people;” then the apostle goes on and adds, “ and saw corruption .” That which was laid unto his fathers,or was gathered to his people, saw corruption.

The flesh after burial must see corruption but not the soul.

However, can you expantiate on this:

And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

10 and they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Revelations 6:9,10