₦airaland Forum

I don't know how people can't see this as not about Yaradua. Some people have been asking for proof about those more witnesses Buhari had, have you not been following the news? This tribunal had been on for months and everyday Buhari was there with even more witnesses and most of all, more evidence. They stopped him from bringing in more because they said they needed to speed things up, Doctored ballots signed by INEC officials, and much more, even with the whole Iwu perjury. It is not about Yaradua or Buhari or Atiku, i don't want to keep on repeating what i had been saying on the first two pages.  This is just deja vu all over again.

Well guys, i guess most Nigerians are willing to settle with the status quo. The professor at INEC will get national awards for a job well done, an event that would be graced with all manner of "important" people (he'll probably give a speech). He will continue to run his special brand of elections. Next three years or so from now, there will be another election and the winner will be chosen before hand by party touts. People who are foolish enough to go and vote will be abused and beaten up or even worse killed at the polling station by party touts, while INEC officials join hands and rig the elections in front of everyone. The funny thing in a very sad way would be that people will now come online  and complain that the election was rigged and that PDP or whatever parties are killing Nigeria, it is not democracy bla bla bla. When that happens, i don't think many people here should feel they have a right to complain. It has just been announced that election rigging in Nigeria is ok, i mean come on, let us be reasonable what is the worse that could happen to people rigged into power, another election tribunal? Those who claim to stand for truth and reality I have said it earlier, let all money that is meant to be used for elections next time be used to build the much lauded imaginary infrastructure instead of putting people through the farce called elections, let election in Nigeria stop because it is a waste of resources, and simply just a waste of time to be honest so let us stop living in denial and start accepting it, Nigeria is not a democracy.
Maybe people might become outraged when this thing happens again in four years or maybe the next 4 years after that, you never know.

LOL, i don't even know why i am laughing when my hope for the nation is dimming. @ dear03 I waited to hear that phrase all day and i was not disappointed. NATIONAL INTEREST? How do you know the elections will be better next time? please enlighten me? I am not trying to be annoying, i just need that response, do you know something we don't? I am tired of stating the obvious over and over again, but OBJs last election that brought him into power was rigged, election was upheld again by the tribunal, 4 years later, the worst elections in Nigerian history, tribunal has basically said, no it wasn't the worst and we were all dreaming, and now you say you think it would be better next time? @ ojimbo, there was no dilly dallying about presenting the witnesses and evidence, unless you were in the court and you can tell us otherwise. So why are they now saying it was an evidence issue? I really just don't know what to say. How many times must something in Nigeria occur before we begin to see a trend? This "National interest" spin and even the more popular one "For peace" are slogans politicians and leaders have used to justify everything bad they have done for the past how many decades. And yet we are still e go bettering *sigh*

ojimbo IV:
we should all understand that the tribunal looked at the evidence tendered before it and made a decision. if there was reason to annul the elections trust me jega and ogebe wouldn't have held back and that is what justice is all about.

lol, ojimbo, you just made my day with your last comment. Lack of evidence? Insult upon injury. Do you know why the court set this day for a verdict and not even two months further? They stopped taking evidence and listening to witnesses that Buhari provided. They came to that decision, in order to speed up the hearing because the evidence and witnesses were just too much. Everyday, a lot more witnesses and more evidence, and they are now saying something they actually stopped taking was in short supply? LOL, God please have mercy on us. It would have been less insulting if they said the ruling went the way it did because someone messed in court and they wanted to just get out of there fast

People keep using Kenya as an example, why is there violence in Kenya? Is it not because of a perceived injustice? It is only in Nigeria that reasoning will be upside down. This has nothing to do with putting someone else in Power and this is so much bigger then Yaradua, they couldn't just have asked for a re-run? When i hear the word democracy tagged to Nigeria i can't help but laugh.

But for real though, I seriously do think that since the majority seem to be so willing to settle with this, we should just stop deceiving ourselves and move to stop holding elections in Nigeria. Why do we spend billions and waste time on elections if there is no point? The assembly should seriously consider this, it would save us money in the long run. OBJ or IBB or Adedibu can just select our next leader in 4 years time instead of putting Nigerians through the farce and insult called Nigerian (magic) elections.

Why is there violence in Kenya? Is it not because of perveived injustice? Is this justice? How counterprogressive. Why on earth do they have elections in the country, i mean their is not point in voting so why are we spending billions every 4 years. Nigeria is not a democracy so people please stop throwing that term around and let us be real for once. Let us accept the bitter truth, we have no democracy. Next 4 years, OBJ can select the next leader.

I don't know wether you guys are not seeing that this was not about Yaradua, it was about the process by which he came in. People please let us stop extending sentiments because we think he is a nice guy or use flimsy arguements like he would have won anyway. If he would have won anyway, then why did PDP rig? It is not about Yaradua, we are now saying it is ok to rig elections and people will say the injustice was in the interest of peace, what a paradox. And he has been inactive for 9 months of 4 years, but all off a sudden, you think he will start fulfilling his duties more dilligently because of this? God Help Us

People keep on saying this was in the interest of peace, what a paradox. Injustice is in the interest of peace? Is it not injustices that cause people to go to war? that cause conflict? Why must the so called "common sense" in Nigeria be so upside down? People in power are taking Nigerians for a ride all in the interest of PEACE? Is this not exactly what happened after OBJs second election in 2003? It was rigged, tribunals still upheld it and nothing was done in the interest of peace? I am so shocked with the lame excuses i seriously don't know wether to cry or laugh. Well guys, i am guessing this is the status quo now, next 4 years from now, the elections will be rigged beyond all hope and nothing will be done again IN THE INTEREST OF PEACE!!!!

I don't even know what to say, i am just speechless. @ idupaul, you call this "common sense over justice"? So i am guessing you are admitting that it is injustice in the first place. I don't even want to go into details, but it seems politicians in Nigeria can rig elections and carry on as if nothing happened. Isn't this exactly what happened after OBJs 2nd term win? Election tribunal upheld that insult of an election. Well guys, i guess OBJ has his 3rd term after all, you never know i might be so blind as to believe this is good for the country tomorrow, but right now, i just don't know for Nigeria.

God forbid bad thing. Someone whose defence when accused of looting was that, yes he looted but OBJ looted more. Well, all will be revealed soon.

If it goes Yaradua's way it would also be a big blow for the rule of law. Basically if the verdict goes Yaradua's way without a proper explanation as to why, with all the evidence, then they would be saying that politicians can rig elections and get away with it. With the way Nigeria is, i am soo against the status quo of business as usual and i am looking forward to a day when business as usual in Nigeria will mean 'rule of law' as opposed to injustice and corruption. I eagerly await the verdict and perhaps moreso the explanation to the verdict whichever way it goes (although if Yaradua loses then there might be no need to explain why  ).

So US is important to us because they need our crude oil which foreign companies can extract in a nation that does not yet hold multinational corporations liable to environmental laws and humane practices? (Genuine question)

it is all over the news on the internet. You can get more detailed reports but this is just a brief, straight to the point one.
http://www.africasia.com/services/news/newsitem.php?area=africa&item=080225123550.xtzu5t1t.php

@tosinadeda, well, most of the elections were rigged. I mean, look at the case with David Mark, the PDP was so arrogant that they did not even bother to even rig well, LOL. David Mark got about less votes than someone else and yet David Mark was declared winner. They were so arrogant that they did not even rig well. So the fact that most of the election for all positions were rigged is a sign that the country was crumbling. How is addressing the problem with the judiciary a sign that things are getting worse as you seem to presume as opposed to actually getting better?

lol, you seem to continually contradict yourself or maybe i am not understanding you. i will call it a day for myself on this thread. You seemed to be against the court nullifying the election of yaradua, and i said that would be ignoring an obvious wrong. I asked if that meant you want the sham elections to be upheld as ok, you said not if it goes in yaradua's favour? You seem to be contradicting yourself or maybe i am not understanding you. Anyway, i think i will call it a day on this thread, good night and god bless. 

Which is equivalent to upholding the sham elections

Sorry, but i still don't get what your stand is on this. So are you saying the sham elections should be up held?

@deaor03, so you are saying that ignoring obvious wrong and failure will strengthen the judiciary? Isn't that a paradox? Won't annuling very obviously flawed elections actually have the effect of strengthening the judiciary? Removing the president of the biggest black nation on earth, how on earth won't that be a deterrent to the worst party in Nigeria to follow the 'Rule of law' slogan the the ruling party now ironically throw around? What you are saying to me is that turning around and ignoring something so flawed and wrong and pretending that it did not happen is for our own good. I am sorry, but i really don't see how it is. It is like ignoring a car crash or ignoring fire in your house and saying it did not happen while your house continues to burn. PDP needs to be thought that they can't keep bullying the nation into power. If we don't stop it now then please when do we stop it? Please, when?

@tosinadeda, how is justice causing the country to crumble? Or are you saying that ignoring the monumental calamity and thuggery that was last years election is a better way to go? Is that strengthening the nation, or better yet, is it in our 'national interest'? Jokes aside though, i am very interested as to why you think aknowledging the fact that last years elections were so terribly flawed is going to cause the nation to crumble? All the wrongs and evils that have been done to Nigeria and it has not yet crumbled, but it would be observing a wrong and serving justice that would cause it to crumble? If it has to crumble due to the evil, then so be it. Then we can begin to rebuild on a solid foundation.

@ deor03, i am slightly confused though, how would the verdict going in Yaradua's favour on tuesday strengthen democracy? I am not saying we are in a comfortable situation, but how would ignoring such monumental election malpractices and ruling in favour of yaradua strengthen democracy? Please do tell, 

but i am guessing this will just be for home use. It does not really give information on the dimensions of these panels. Solar power has to come a reasonable way before it is used as the only source in a house. most people use passive solar because i am not sure it can carry everything in a house at thesame time.

@ Kobojunkie, Lol. Sorry if i sound like a broken record. But i keep on mentioning Iwu because i just still can't believe he is there and i feel like i am the only one mad at the outrage. He is the most obvious person and the fact that he still believes that the elections were ok and keeps defending his performance and the elections in light of obvious failure is just crazy, he is the leader of INEC and he promised free and fair elections before the last year elections. The electoral body is meant to be fair and impartial without having any particular political affiliations. The fact that INEC even took part in the rigging of the elections, and that Maurice Iwu is now guilty of perjury, and that with such disastrous failure in terms of the election of A WHOLE COUNTRY he has not shamefully resigned is something i just can't understand. I just don't get how some people can have no shame. I mean, am i the only one that sees the outrage in the fact that he is still conducting elections? What on earth would be different? If he was removed last year you really won't hear his name from me that much, but i feel like i am seeing a car crash about to happen and the person causing the car crash is still in the drivers seat. So to answer your question, that is why i keep going on about Iwu. He is still a danger to the nation. Must we allow him to unleash another round of his special brand of 'elections' before we raise hell to kick him out? He just cannot be allowed to run more elections because it would just be back to square one.

This coming week is going to be very interesting and i am looking forward to it. I just hope it won't be an anti climax. All over the country the courts are saturated with election tribunal cases. I am guessing that is why we have not heard any news from EFCC cases (i hope that is the reason, as opposed to EFCC is dead). It is a very strainous process but i believe it is necessary and vital especially if Iwu is removed and fair elections are conducted. I really wanted to believe that Yaradua was genuine but when i look back at all the things he said he would tackle and then realise that he has not even attempted to tackle any of them, (not even the most basic ones that just require a signature) then you just have to wonder what 4 years of him would be like. All in all, i think that this is a necessary evil and it just goes to show how truely bad the elections were. Maurice Iwu must not be allowed to conduct the next elections, if he does it would just be inuslt on injury.

The only group in Nigeria who currently seem to be enforcing the laws is the Judiciary. The police seem to be easily bought and part of the problem. There are laws there, but those who are meant to be enforcing them are even soiled in the problem. INEC even took part in the rigging last year and yet Maurice Iwu is still going on to conduct more elections, God have mercy. Can't someone sue him for the perjury he commited a few weeks ago? People are not scared of the laws because they know they can get away with breaking them so the laws are not the problem at all. We just need someone with guts and courage in power, a disciplinarian to set the trend and i am sorry but i don't see Yaradua being that person can you? Let me stress some of the importance of a legitimate election. If the election is genuine, then whoever gets in power would hopefully see the fact that he got majority votes as meaning that the people he has to answer to are Nigerians and not a few handful behind the scenes. Then we can start talking of 'national interest'. Wasn't it in the news that yaradua called OBJ his president? We need leaders that are answerable to the people and are hence empowered by the people, and this is made more possible with credible elections. We need solid electoral reforms. Yaradua promised that when he first got in power and 9 months down Iwu is still leading INEC. One of the things that need to be gotten rid of is this whole zoning farce. I don't care were a leader comes from as long as he is the better candidate and develops the nation. The whole zoning farce just goes to show that Nigeria isn't completely united.

We have never been in this position before. I am beginning to think that Yaradua might not be completely clean because i just cannot see why on earth the so called 'professor' Maurice Iwu is still leading INEC. There are laws to curb all this nonsense but they are not being enforced. I strongly believe that thesame people have ruled us for the last 30 to 40 years. This people need to be shown the way out. They need to just leave Nigerian politics alone so that we can move on. Yaradua's government is seriously compromised and the irony is that if the elections were not rigged, with what people thought about him then, he would probably have won anyway. The point i am trying to make is that we can't just let this things continue to happen all for 'national interest' because we will continue to have wasted years and it is not in 'national interest'. Nigerian leaders have taken us for a ride for so long, you know why? Because they know our weakness. They know we just make noise for like 5 minutes then it is business as usual. This has been exploited sooo much, it is just unbelievable. When something happens we all make noise and raise hell for like 5 minutes, then it is business as usual. If things continue with the whole business as usual looting, abuse etc, then do you really think there is hope for Nigeria?

Actually, the Number 1, 2, and 3 citizens might all lose their position in the coming week. That is, senate president, vice president and the president. I completely understand people with fears about how this will affect the stability of the nation. I completely get it. But at thesame time, can we really keep taking this rubbish? I have said it before, the greatest insult by the Yaradua government is that Maurice Iwu is still leading INEC. He is still being allowed to carry out re-elections. CAN YOU BELIEVE THAT? Yaradua made so much noise about electoral reforms. What is Maurice Iwu doing differently from last year? Why should we expect anything different? Planting thorns and expecting oranges during harvest. Letting this slide with the excuse of stability to the nation and that most insulting of cliches used by Nigerian politicians "for the common good" would be similar to seeing wrong and turning the other way. Then in the next four years PDP will rig again after Yaradua's term, PDP will get in power and there will be complaints and another illegitimate president will be in power AGAIN. Then will we also use that same arguement 'for the common good' again? The potential threat of nullifying the election is significant, but personally i think the potential gain is worth it. I have nothing against Yaradua but i am for anything that is going to rid Nigeria of PDP before we have four more wasted years. We all know the election was a farce, we all know that, but the real question is are we all willing to ignore it and sweep the whole issue under the carpet for "the common good"? This illegitimate leadership has been going on for a very long time in Nigeria, so when is it going to be enough?

So at least we now know it was the Imo state governor. So because of a so called 'breach' a woman was assaulted and beaten up in front of her children? What i am most pleased about is that the story at least got in the papers. And the Imo state government is trying to defend this? I am speechless.

doyin, the UK government is actually trying to encourage more people to go to University not the other way round as you claim. I completely understand where you are coming from, like i have aknowledged before. But that has nothing to do with this. Not everyone owns a car but does that mean that the roads should not be maintained? Not everyone uses the airport, so i am guessing we should not maintain that either? You say quality education is a sort of luxury. Some medical students go through Nigerian institutions without ever using a microscope, but don't worry, at least they read a lot of books that were written 50 years ago. Is that 'quality education' ? Why do people sometimes suggest that we become miserly with luxuries we don't have in the first place? I don't see how education not being the path for everyone is an excuse for the appalling state of the Universities and education sector in Nigeria. What do you think?
bawomolo, sorry if you got the impression i said education is an automatic ticket to alleviation of poverty. It isn't, but it gives you that opportunity by equipping you with knowledge and skills which can be applied to the real world and be used to alleviate poverty. An example of this might be a Nigerian engineer, who understands the Nigerian market needs and designs a product which is in high deman for a Nigerian market. We have the money to pay attention to this sector so why isn't government investing heavily in such an important sector. bawomolo, again you said that anyone who goes through primary school without being able to read and write is retarded. So are you saying everyone that can read and write is educated? Government needs to invest in this and the fact that Katsina state had one of the lowest pass rates in the country under Yaradua's governorship of the state make me even more uneasy. We need to invest in education.

doyin, again, the whole idea of a University degree being a luxury means exclusion of even more people. More people who cannot afford it but are very capable. Have you really looked at the Nigerian situation? There are a lot of poor people to put it lightly, and government is meant to cater to the masses. I do understand where you are coming from and i aknowledged that in my earlier post but i don't think that is the issue here.
4 Play, you are quite right that we don't have enough universities to begin with. There are many countries with not up to half the Nigerian population but have 10 times more Universities than Nigeria does. A genuine question though. We have an education ministry and an education minister. What is he doing and what are his plans to address the situation in Nigeria? I hope it won't be a case of having a minister who only sees his job as paying lecturers their salary on time (which they don't even seem to be good at), because there is much more to the Education ministers job than that. But in general, what has Yaradua's government got planned for this sector?

doyin thanks for at least elaborating. If i understand you correctly, you are saying the tuition fees is going to weed out people who are actually serious about a university degree in the first place, from those who are there because there is nothing else for them to do? I see how that can also be important, but i really don't think tuition fees being increased is a good way for achieving that, what you would have instead is a situation where the people who really want an education and are very capable but poor are also punished as well in your proposed scheme. One way of achieving the seperation you speak of is by providing good and viable alternatives and opportunities for those who don't want to necessarily pursue a University education. But again, the universities should not suffer becasue of this, because they are very important on so many levels other than education. And again, Nigeria can afford it. Improving the universiies and developing viable alternatives to it that are still important the workforce are not mutually exclusive concepts.

doyin, that is a pretty radical stance, government is meant to cater for everyone not the few rich. I have said it again, the resources don't have to be meagre. Have you not seen news? Oil is now selling at just over $100. A record high, and the budget was based on a much lower estimate. Money is there, but is being squandered. The resources don't have to be small in the first place.

romeo, you got my point with the whole poor economy. If there are such hard pressing issues at hand, so many other important things that Solodu could be concentrating on, then why this? I think i should stop posting on this thread because it is just continuous repetition now, lol. But i will say this, this is just like the whole wahala with the house debating on dress code. Are they being serious? So much money was pumped into tinapa but have you been reading the news? Tinapa loses a lot of money to dubai each day because it is not open. The structure is there, some shops are there but don't sell, why? Because government has not signed a piece of paper that says tinapa is a free trade zone. Hence customs stop shops from selling. All the effort and money for nothing because the government cannot prioritise on the issues. Important bills like Freedom of Information bill have been neglected, yet they could pass bill in a matter of days or a week for increasing their salary. If Solodu has run out of ideas then let him allow someone else to lead before he overstays his welcome and turns the respect people might have for him into disdain. And if he still has good ideas, then let him focus on those. Again people, priority. You don't ask a man having a heart attack if you should buy him suya instead of calling ambulance. That is my 2 cents. God bless and have a nice day

doyin, i can't think of any country that sees education as the only route to descent employment. Experience is also very important and companies tend to look for experience too. But that is not the issue at hand. Does that really justify the appaling state of our Universities? Not everybody in Nigeria uses the airport but does that mean it should be a disaster? University education is not for everyone, but for those that want to pursue a university degree, it is useful and hence we should have something that passes for a university. Let me tell you my major problem with the situation. How much is it going to cost the Nigerian government to raise the standards of the Universities and improve it? Sometimes you have to spend money to make money and good universities would really have a significant impact on the economy. Do you want me to go into how it would impact the economy? We have all this foreign reserves and what is the point of having it if the country is in ruins? It is like a millonaire living in the gutter and begging for food. It won't cost Nigerian government an arm and a leg to improve the institutions, especially the federal ones. I believe Fashola is already addressing the situation with the state University in lagos a bit. Lagos seems to be the only place right now with a functioning government and no surprise too, it is not a PDP state.