₦airaland Forum

mzilakazi:
SA sells thousands of small arms from rockets, hand grenade, firearms, missiles, artillery shells, boats, and many more.

Lol. You are arguing with a 100 % troll. He was already defeated pages ago. Maybe he grew up without knowing his father, now he wants attention from other men. This whole thing started regarding the Denel top 100 link. Ask him what products Denel makes most of its revenue from, and he goes back to talking about the SA defence industry. He's not stup.id at all. He's just looking for attention.

...

So to summarize and conclude.

They listed the top 100 defence companies in the world based on REVENUE, Denel came at 100. But if they were to list say the top 400 defence companies based on REVENUE, a certain someone says there is no proof whatsoever that Denel cannot end up at 320 or something random like that. One then wonders why which ever NEW companies end up ahead of it in the 400 list, wouldnt have already been ahead of it in the 100 list.

Perfect logic. Otherwise known as bitterness, jealousy, and trolling.

Henry120:
LMAO!!!

That list without india, Pakistan, Brazil isn't a true reflection of weapons traded. "Exports" only gives you a false sense of gratification.

You are ahead of Australia, buhahahahaha, a country entirely dependent on British and American companies. The only popular export product from Austrialia is the............................ You guessed right............ Bushmaster MRAP!

So then now what do you want from me? In what way can i assist you?

Henry120:
Like i said, it isn't a true reflection of arms traded . I'm not talking exports.

The link is talking exports. I am talking exports. You come in NOT talking exports. So now what must i do for you? Lol

Henry120:
India, Pakistan, Brazil, Egypt major arms manufacturers aren't on the list. The amount in Arms indian and Pakistani militaries procure each year is more than the combined total of all weapons outputs of all countries in Africa.

That list isn't a true reflection of total arms traded.

India "exports" arms to India? Pakistan "exports" arms to Pakistan? I never knew, thanks for educating me.

Henry120:
You nag like a woman.

No stress my man. As i say have fun.

http://www.africandefence.net/a-history-of-south-african-uavs/

Had the good fortune of seeing this baby up close while doing my vac work at Dynamics a few years ago. It's really a sexy beast. Unfortunately it didnt work out. Although i have a sneaky suspicion that the new Skua target drone under development will be along similar lines.

Henry120:
The South-African Industry makes most of it's revenue selling MRAPs. YES!

You spend most of your time complaining and nagging like a woman, that's not a great character trait.

Keep playing dum.b. Completely up to you. You've chosen not to answer the basic question about Denel, so no stress. Have fun.

frumentius:
Just thought I'd leave this here:

Top 20 Arms Exporters, 2010 - 2014

http://www.sipri.org/googlemaps/2015_of_at_top_20_exp_map.html

And out of all those countries with all their defence companies, certains people will still attempt to put us down, claim we are "stone last" "pathetic"....when they themselves are nowhere to be seen. Just look at the circles SA rolls in.

http://itweb.co.za/mobilesite/defenceweb/home/item_id-40248/

And just on queue, this Defenceweb article adds another slap to his face. So the Denel division that actually makes MRAP's only contributes 28% to total Denel revenue

[b]"Denel Land Systems' (DLS) billing as a consolidated, project-based, systems designer and integrator of combat turrets, artillery and infantry systems, small arms and armoured vehicles is upheld by a recent maintenance, repair and overhaul contract for 1,900 police assault rifles and the sale of 1,000 SS-77 machine guns.
...
These, along with other DLS work including the new infantry fighting vehicle for the SA Army, saw the Lyttelton, Centurion headquartered business division contribute 28% of Denel's revenue in the 2014/15 financial year. DLS has, according to the latest Denel annual report, for the 2014/15 financial year, completed maintenance, repair and overhaul of 1,500 SA Police Service R5 assault rifles with 400 still awaiting refurbishment in the year under review.
...
Other work DLS' 630 employees were involved in during the year under review included bringing industrialisation and production on phase two of the new infantry fighting vehicle - the Badger - ahead of schedule and a renewal of interest in the new generation Casspir (NG2000) particularly from African countries."[/b]

patches689:
hahahahah

Those double standards!

That cognitive dissonance!!

DICON is older than Denel... yet it has ZERO major exports and is nowhere on any lists.

South Africa is amongst the top 20 arms exporters in the world

Denel is amongst the top 100 Arms Manufacturers in the world

The OLDER Nigerian company is NOWHERE

Deal

With

IT

Ouch

Henry120:
The South-African industry which Denel is one of the major players generates most of it's revenue from selling MRAPs.

We are talking about Denel placing dead last, not DICON.

Simple question...does Denel make most of its revenue selling MRAPS? Yes or no? If you cant answer that then have a good day, i personally wont waste any more time on this topic. You aren't a stup.id person, you're just being a troll on purpose. If it makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside, then good on you. Have fun.

Henry120:
Your Defence industry depends primarily on MRAPs for it's total generated revenue. This is the fact!

Denel placing last in a least of 100 companies is also not an achievement. Neither does the list contain exports as a primary criteria for judging how companies were placed.

Who is disputing your fact? Does DENEL make most of its revenue from selling MRAP's? Yes or No?

How many international defence companies are there? 100 in total? Where is Dicon?

Henry120:
You are dead last in the list, for a country that has been in the business of arms for the past 60 years, that's not an achievement.

Brazil has not purchased any A-Darters.

Lol there was a Kentron/Denel in 1955? I love this guy's "facts". Shame

Henry120:
Again, you are dead last on the list. For a Country that has supposedly been in the arms manufacturing business for over 50 years, that's simply not an achievement to celebrate. Again, excerpt you are South-African were mediocrity is celebrated!



You have been unable to dispute the facts, your industry depends on the sale of MRAP vehicles for over 85% of it's entire revenue. You sleep, eat, dream and walk MRAPs. This is it, all you are good at, is churning and churning out MRAP vehicles.

I'm embarrassed at you coming in at last place.

Which fact am i even trying to dispute? Its you who is going on a tangent. The article is about Denel...not the South African defence industry. Denel does not make its money from MRAP's. So why are you talking about our industry at large? Which MRAP's does Denel produce pre 2015?

If your jealousy is at such a level that you want to play dum.b, then so be it....i cudnt care less. How many defence companies are there in the United States and Russia alone? 5? 20? Or hundreds, if not thousands. Its a damn good achievement for Denel. Taking into account they were excluded from international participation up until the early 90's.

Henry120:
When you post comments, i just can't help but feel that you are a girl. The pettiness in your comments are always very apparent.

The fact is, the South-African defence industry depends primarily on the sale of MRAP vehicles, and they constitute over 85% of all total revenue generated by said defence industry in each fiscal year. I mean, these are indisputable facts.

Now carry on selling your MRAPs, everyone makes and sells those these days anyway.

Unfortunately for you, the article is about Denel Pty (Ltd) making the top 100 list. Not the South African defence industry at large. Denel does not make the majority of its revenue from MRAP's, hence their purchase of BAE Land Systems this year to increase that capability.

You tried to be clever, and left with a bloody nose...."everyone makes and sells those these days anyway"....lol, such desperation. You've tried to shift the focus away from Denel, to our industry at large. Denel makes the majority of its money from selling high end defence products abroad, and about 40-45% selling to the SANDF and the South African Police Service.

Again, enjoy the ride in your imaginary MRAP. There was no need to try and sound clever on a Wednesday morning, no one forced you to comment. So enjoy your embarrassment.

Henry120:
Congratulations, you made the list of top 100 selling MRAPs. Not much of an achievement, but since you are South-Africans, what more can i say. Keep selling those MRAPs.


By the way, we've already started exporting vehicles to both Rwanda and the South-Sudan, and our company is still very young.

Sometimes it's better to find a quiet spot to go and get jealous alone, then come back to the group confident, pretending as if you dont care. Otherwise you end up looking pathetic.

If you had read the article it says the list is based on 2014 revenue. You now desperately stumble with an answer claiming it's because of the sale of MRAP vehicles. Really? BAE Land Systems outsells Denel when it comes to MRAPS. Besides the Casspir, Denel itself doesnt actually produce a lot of them. Which is why Denel bought BAE Land Systems this year to increase that capability.

So where did the 2014 revenue come from? Turrets to Malaysia, Mokopa to Algeria, maintenaince and repair by Denel Aviation, etc etc etc. So get into your imaginary MRAP and drive off into the sunset.

jln115:
Denel makes international top 100 of defence companies

"Denel is ranked number 100 on the list of global defence manufacturers and the second largest in the southern hemisphere."


http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=40225:denel-makes-international-top-100-of-defence-companies&catid=7:Industry&Itemid=116

And then some on here have the nerve to say Denel produces crap. They can speak to us when their own companies get into the top 1000....in 2050.

Busy days in the Bay over the past few days. Pics by Doug

https://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx267/Jerrycan_photo/IMG_5648%20C_zps1zvbemne.jpg

https://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx267/Jerrycan_photo/IMG_5682%20E_zpsr3ioaxsq.jpg

https://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx267/Jerrycan_photo/IMG_5952%20P1567_zpshafrnoyx.jpg

https://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx267/Jerrycan_photo/IMG_6014%20OPVs_zpsonntsopo.jpg

http://itweb.co.za/mobilesite/defenceweb/home/item_id-40204/

Denel Aerostructures ready to support Rooivalk II

https://itweb.co.za/mobilesite/defenceweb/cache/images/White_Rooivalk_400x300_Guy_Martin.jpg

Denel Aerostructures is ready and willing to support manufacture of a new Rooivalk, and is currently making drop tanks and small components for the existing fleet of 11 serving in the South African Air Force.
...

Kleynhans confirmed that Denel is in discussions with the South African Air Force on the upgrading of the current Rooivalk baseline and the feasibility of a new Rooivalk Mk II development with an export component.

Kleynhans said that although Denel Aviation is the original equipment manufacturer of the Rooivalk, airframe design and production would typically take place at Denel Aerostructures. Denel is however looking for co-development and co-manufacturing with partner countries to further develop Rooivalk exportability.

agaugust:
It's called discernment between truth and falsehood. One man can lie today on one issue and say the truth tomorrow on a different issue.

And that's exactly why if a witness or defended has been known to lie before, his testimony is regarded as unreliable. Even if deep down he knows he is telling the truth this time. A reasonable jury simply cant trust his judgement anymore.

You clearly aren't a reasonable judger of character. You chose to side with a man that you yourself have called a liar, simply for your own greedy needs. How do you know if Hietman doesn't have hidden financial ties with one ship builder, publicly says bad stuff about another ship builder, in the hope that his buddies will be seen as more favourable bidders?

You see how your desperation is so obvious? Congrats on digging your own hole. My work here is done.

agaugust:
Was Helmoed himself inside the battlefield recording the Seleka Vs SANDF firefights?

Helmod is quoted when he agrees with me, if he writes propaganda, it is a lie. He was quoting SANDF parabats propaganda from C.A.R. where he himself never saw the battle. For other things that he can verify, yes I will quote his truths, not his lies.

Lmao!!!

"Judge, even though my client is a mass murdering, evil ,stealing man, I promise you....this time he is telling the truth. The other times no, but this time i promise"

agaugust:
You rotate same crews from ship to ship....dummy. Both ships were not sailing same time and firing all weapons same time...fool !
.

That's exactly what i said. The navy flew F145's crew from Simon's Town, dumped them in the Indian Ocean to take over from the ghost/imaginary/voodoo crew who was conducting post-refit trials on F145, and sailed it back to Simon's Town. So why are you arguing?

http://mobi.iol.co.za/#!/article/how-deadly-car-battle-unfolded-1.1493841

Oh and since Augustine is now best friends with Helmoed Hietman, why doesn't he recap what Helmoed said about how brave our troops fought in CAR. Read it again nice and slow and enjoy.

agaugust:
Operation of a ship is not same as sailing it around at home.

Do you have all BATTLE STATIONS ABOARD FULLY MANNED ? Nope.

So you CANNOT go to war with more than one ship one sub at a time. Defenceweb published the report not me. Go sulk all you want
.

You are a "researcher". Tell us how you conduct sea acceptance trials without a full crew. The whole point is to test all systems. How do you test all systems without every sailor manning his positions? So which one didnt have a full crew F145 or F147?

F147 in Simon's Town a few days ago

https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3753/19923108068_480736d2a8_o.jpg

Then yesterday F145 arrives in Simon's Town from Durban after its major refit.

https://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx267/Jerrycan_photo/IMG_5428%20F145_zpsywze6rae.jpg

Since we can only operate one at a time according to some here, i guess it was a ghost/wizard crew who took part in sea acceptance trials in Durban. The navy then flew F147's crew via SAA to the Indian Ocean to take over from the invisible crew, and finished the rest of the journey to Simon's Town. Aha...exactly how it happened.

http://itweb.co.za/mobilesite/defenceweb/home/item_id-40159/

Then some on here have the guts to say Denel produces crap. Talk to us when the likes of Airbus approach you for a partnership. Otherwise stop making noise.

https://itweb.co.za/mobilesite/defenceweb/cache/images/SAWS_EC635_400x300_Guy_Martin.jpg

The Iraqi Army Air Corps' EC635 light helicopters are now armed with machineguns, cannons, rockets and Ingwe missiles provided by South Africa and Airbus Helicopters.
....
Some five years ago Eurocopter, as Airbus Helicopters then was, approached Denel Dynamics about integrating the missile onto its EC635 as part of the Stand Alone Weapon System (SAWS) weapons kit.The SAWS was jointly designed, developed, manufactured and supported by Eurocopter and Advanced Technologies and Engineering (ATE - now Paramount Advanced Technologies). 

EVarn:
What is outrageous my comment?
Pakistan does not even have a developed automobile industry; yet they have made tanks,missiles and a modern combat aircraft that can strike anywhere in west asia without refueling,while india is still grapling with tejas.
We have successfully built surveillance drones and unmanned ground vehicles,an IFV and light surveillance aircraft are already in development: it takes high technological know-how to achieve such feats.
My comment was issued based on increasing technical capacity of AFIT,i didnt say we will build a combat jet overnight,but we will,especially by partnering with any technology power.

Again. You are out of your depth when it comes to this topic. And I'm not even trying to be rude to you, just being honest. The so-called technological know how needed to build what you have built does not come close to anything needed to design and built a 4th gen fighter. How many Phd's does Nigeria have specializing in flutter control for example? How many Nigerian doctors can submit a paper on super sonic shock formation tomorrow? It will take much more than 3 or 4 of such skilled people to even begin conceptual design.You said soon. Even with an international partner, Nigeria is simply unable to develop such a system even for the next 20 years. Its a simple fact.

EVarn:
My guess is that you are jealous and butthurt.
Whatever you say doesnt change the fact that AFIT is building a light surveillance aircraft locally.
Soon,Nigeria will build Africa's first 4++ generation combat aircraft.

This statement pretty much sums up the quality of posters for this topic. It's either a genuine, innocent misunderstanding of the immense complexities involving the construction of a 4th generation fighter (engineering capabilities that a decades away) OR you are purposefully making outrageous claims just for the sake of being a troll.

agaugust:
Those are some of the shows that make up your 200 hours flight for Gripen fleet....you see half the time is for ceremonies.

Unarmed Gripen, flying over the head of clapping civilians, no combat opponent, no combat training....dropping flares for people to cheer.

SAAF = Ceremonial force.

6 Gripen pilots fly 10 to 20 hours per year....ZERO combat qualification

Thanks for proving my point with that ceremony video.

Like i told you, if you want to turn this military thread into a circus go ahead. If you want to make stuff up, have fun. I have no interest in debating with you anymore. I'm only posting pics, vids and articles for those who are genuinely interested.

For the aviation enthusiasts....SAAF Gripen.
What he does at 05:29 looks so damn sexy


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thUaVt5hcA8