₦airaland Forum

shadeyinka:
I needed to upgrade my bank account status and the KYC requirement involves verification of house address.

Normally, this is done by Utility Bill either for Electricity or Water.

The problem is
1. My house uses Borehole for water supply
2. We pay online for electricity supply.

Who knows another way out.

Urgent Please
Cc: Moderators: naijacutee, dominique, puskin, FOD

Why don't you ask the bank for alternatives

honesttalk21:
I will like to see this literature and or link to this please. Particularly your claim of the Saudi FBI.

The Sahaba did not accuse Prophet Muhammad pbuh of stealing. In Islam, the Prophet is regarded as the most trustworthy and honest individual, and the companions held him in the highest esteem.

Case File Introduction:
1. Mohammed the Prophet of Allah was accused of Stealing a Piece of very beautiful RED sheet/garment/cloth that was admired by many of the followers of Mohammed. Everyone who last saw the cloth saw it with Mohammed and by his antecedent, knew that Mohammed stole the cloth. Mohammed denied stealing the cloth but he had not a single evidence to back himself with. Those who saw him amongst his followers kept insisting that their Prophet STOLE the garment.
2. The story was getting out of hand with everyone insisting that their prophet STOLE the Red garment that Mohammed had to call on his (fictitious) Allah to rescue him.
3. Unfortunately, not one of the followers of Mohammed had EVER seen Allah nor Jubril nor did Allah give his prophet ANY KIND of Evidence such as a MIRACLE to authenticate his prophet “Mohammed”. As of this time, ANYTHING Mohammed said Allah said was considered as being from Allah.
4. Mohammed in defending himself gave forth a revelation he said Allah gave him. The verse was recited to Mohammed’s followers in Quran 3:161

Supposed Allah’s Testimony:
Quran 3:161
It is not for any prophet to embezzle (steal: Ghulul). Whoso embezzleth will bring what he embezzled with him on the Day of Resurrection. Then every soul will be paid in full what it hath earned; and they will not be wronged.

THE WORD Ghulul is PROPERLY TRANSLATED AS STEALING (Taking something that is not yours illegally and deceitfully)

Quran 3:161
It is inconceivable that a Prophet would ever misappropriate (steal) anything from the war booty. Anyone who does so will carry it with him on the Day of Resurrection. Then every soul will be paid in full what it has earned and no one will be wronged.

5. Even though the testimony should have been rejected outrightly because there was no signature of the testimony by Allah. Mohammed himself wrote the testimony on behalf of the so-called Allah and he signed the document as “Allah’s Prophet” we present you with it as the fact on ground.
6. Muslim scholars in their Hadiths and Tafsirs tried to EXPLAIN the genesis of the verse acclaimed to have been received from Allah by Mohmmed

Sunan Abu Dawud (English) 30, Hadith 3960
Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas:
The verse "And no Prophet could (ever) be false to his trust" was revealed about a red velvet. When it was found missing on the day of Badr, some people said; Perhaps the Messenger of Allah has taken it. So Allah, the Exalted, sent down (Quran 3:161) "And no prophet could (ever) be false to his trust" to the end of the verse

7. UP TILL TODAY, THE RED CLOTH HAS NOT BEEN FOUND!


The Questions of the Prosecution to honesttalk21:
1. Can you please find any EVIDENCE that Mohammed was actually truly speaking for Allah?
2. If Allah is All-knowing and Mohammed is his prophet, can you please EXPLAIN why didn’t he say WHO stole the garment (as the case would have been permanently resolved)?
3. Why is it that the followers of Mohammed could even think or imagine that their prophet could even condescend so low to STEALING of anything?
4. Is there any prophet of God that has ever been accused of such despicable low-life acts like STEALING or FLIRTING with their son’s wife? (It was reported that some verses were also claimed to have been revealed about this despicable act with Zainab to defend Mr Qutham aka Mohammed)
5. Where is this Red cloth in question?

honesttalk21:
Kindly define son in law.
Was Zainab married to this son when the prophet Muhammad pbuh married her?

Allah is clear that biological children are not the same as adopted which are a result of sayings.
Who makes you a gauge of moral standards? Did the numerous idolaters challenge the prophet pbuh then and what was his response?

Let's assume that Mohammed never adopted Zaid but Zaid lived all his life from childhood to adulthood AND Mohammed was the one who married Zainab to him,
Is it morally right for Mohammed to marry Zainab on the excuse of Zaid divorcing her?

1. Who caused the divorce in the first place?
2. Is it halal or haram for a true Muslim man to enter into the house of another married Muslim man's house when he wasn't at home?
3. Who said this statement:
Blessed be Allah who made my heart to flip (move for you)
Is it appropriate for any true Muslim to appreciate another married Muslim woman like this?
Do you need evidence for this?

Please, evil is evil and should be condemned not justified.

honesttalk21:
You have a statement with the condition or and decide which premise takes precedence?

You are trying too hard in a wrong direction.
Umar ibn al-Khattab the second Caliph of Islam and one of the closest companions of the Prophet Muhammad, firmly believed in the divine origin of the Quran as the literal word of Allah revealed to the Prophet.

Is the hadith Maudi?
Sunan Ibn Majah 1009
It was narrated that Anas bin Malik told that ‘Umar said:
“I said: ‘O Messenger of Allah (ﷺ), why do you not take the Maqam of Ibrahim as a place of prayer?’ Then the following was revealed: ‘And take you (people) the Maqam of Ibrahim as a place of prayer.’” [2:125]




Umar did not claim that he didn't believe in the devine origin of the Qur'an. What he was saying was that part of those devine Qur'an came ORIGINALLY from him.

He was simply stylishly accusing your prophet of plagiarism.


Do you want us to look at the Jinn making perfect Qur'an?

Or Iblis making perfect Qur'an that even your prophet couldn't distinguish from the Qur'an of Jibril

honesttalk21:
Too bad the Hermes and Hades of Greece have nothing to do with the propagation of Islam.

Pontius Pilate of Rome has a lot to do with Christianity, Zeus and the institutionalization of Christianity.

Thanks for pointing to another Zeus and other descendant of his are pointed to eating some meals.

Very much unlike Allah.

Do you at least admit that your most important core value for Allah is found with Hermes and Hades who are two greek gods that neither have wives nor have children.
Hermes and Hades are fathers to no one EXACTLY like Allah

honesttalk21:
Allah is a unique and transcendent Being, not limited by physical form or human attributes. Allah is beyond human comprehension and does not resemble any creation. As stated in the Quran, "There is nothing like unto Him"

Glad you are silent in show of acknowledgement that your god is not one.

In any case Allah is very much unlike Zeus. He begets or father's no one.

Zeus represents a powerful father figure who begets children through divine intervention or physical relationships.

Jesus from your books and Christian belief is literally begotten of a god. Is your begeting god not a powerful father figure?

Allah is never referred to as father.

The bold is the truth for once from your own mouth mouth.

The God preached by Moses , David (OT) and Jesus (NT) is a FATHER!

Meaning that this God YHWH is Not Allah!

FYI:
Hermes and Hades are two greek gods who neither have wives nor have children. Perhaps, Allah is one of them.
Hermes and Hades are fathers to no one EXACTLY like Allah

honesttalk21:
Perhaps in biblical theology angels ate food but do they regularly do this?
Angels may eat physical food during their interactions with humans but do not require it for sustenance as human beings do.

Angels do not eat in Islam as they have no need to.

This point is NOT whether Angels or God need food for sustanance (for no single Christian or Jew preach this) BUT in their ABILITIES.

Have you seen now that the God of Abraham COULD come as a MAN and EAT with His chosen IF He CHOOSES without ceasing to be God?

Can you now concur that this is an impossibility for Allah to do?

honesttalk21:
Of course you don't discern or differentiate that Jibril appeared in the form with 600 wings just once.

Was it just once Jibril appeared to reveal the Quran in 23 years?

Abu Bakr was present during some of the encounters with Jibreel and witnessed the divine revelations

Ali, Umar and Aisha also witnessed the appearances of Jibreel and the revelations of the Quran


You are yet to respond to the identity of that Prophet John the Baptist was asked of. It is outside the primary discourse to expantiate on the doubts about the crucifixion.

I have also pointed the OP to a lack of consensus regarding the shroud of Turin discovered in 1400

You didn't answer the question:


If Jibril came according to the description of Mohammed (just once when he filled the horizon), wouldn't there be several thousand witnesses?

honesttalk21:
You say accused. Please was this proven and how serious was this accusation? Perhaps another weak attempt at jest as yours?

The Question is:
Why would the Sahaba of Mohammed accuse this man of impeccable character of stealing an underwear?

Till today, the Saudi FBI is still trying to determine who stole the underwear

honesttalk21:
Who of prophet Muhammad's daughter's husband's wife did the prophet pbuh behave untrustworthy with?

You mean prophet Mohammad son's wife:Zainab?
It was a shameless ratification of gross immorality that even Idolaters don't do openly.

honesttalk21:
This is most unfounded and a desperate lie from you. Non of this claim of yours is true.

Is it a means to elongate your false discussion?

Are you feigning Ignorance that Allah did not copy the Qur'an of Umar, the Jinn and the Ants into his Qur'an?

1. Allah copied Umar in Three matters and put it in the Qur'an

Musnad Ahmad 160
It was narrated that Anas said, 'Umar said:
I agreed with my Lord, may He be glorified and exalted, in three matters - or my Lord agreed with me in three matters, I said: O Messenger of Allah, why don't you take the Maqarn of Ibraheem as a place of prayer? Then Allah revealed the verse: `And take you (people) the Maqam (place) of Ibraheem (Abraham) [or the stone on which
Ibraheem (Abraham) stood while he was building the Ka'bah) as a place of prayer` (al Baqarah 2:125). And I said: Why don't you tell the Mothers of the Believers to observe hijab, for both righteous people and evildoers enter upon you? Then the verse of hijab was revealed. And I heard something about the Mothers of the Believers, so I talked to them and told them: You should stop bothering the Messenger of Allah ﷺ , or Allah will replace you with wives who are better than you and are Muslims. Then I came to one of the Mothers of the Believers and she said: O 'Umar, is it the case that the Messenger of Allah ﷺ cannot admonish his wives so that you come and admonish them? So I stopped, then Allah, may He be glorified and exalted, revealed the verse: “It may be if he divorced you (all) that his Lord will give him instead of you, wives better than you Muslims (who submit to Allah), believers, obedient (to Allah)...` [at­-Tahreerm 66:5)



Thrice Allah copied Umar and he wasn't even a prophet.


Is this hadith FALSE?

honesttalk21:
You need to be reminded of different forms angels manifest?
How many times was Jibril seen in the very tall form with 600 wings?

Angels, are described in various religious texts, particularly the Bible, have the ability to manifest in different forms depending on their mission and the context of their appearance.
These include:
Human Form where they appear as human beings, specifically resembling adult males. This is evident in several biblical accounts where angels interacted with humans without revealing their true nature.

When appearing in human form, angels can look exactly like ordinary people or may exhibit certain characteristics that suggest they are more than just humans.

Heavenly Form where angels manifest in a heavenly form that distinguishes them from mortals. This form is often characterized by brilliant light or radiant glory.

Winged Beings in respect of certain types of angels are depicted with wings which symbolize their role as messengers of God and their ability to traverse between heaven and earth.

While these winged depictions are common in art and literature, it is important to note that when angels appear to humans in scripture, they typically do not display wings unless they are seen in a vision or heavenly context.

Sometimes Jibril took the form of a human and served to teach early Muslims about Islam from discussions had with prophet Muhammad pbuh in their presence

Tell me:
If Jibril came according to the description of Mohammed (just once), wouldn't there be several thousand witnesses?

Sahih Muslim 177 d
Masruq reported:
I said to 'A'isha: What about the words of Allah:" Then he drew nigh and came down, so he was at a distance of two bows or closer still: so He revealed to His servant what He revealed" (al-Qur'an, liii. 8-10)? She said: It implies Gabriel. He used to come to him (the Holy Prophet) in the shape of men; but he came at this time in his true form and blocked up the horizon of the sky.

Not one person saw Jibril apart from Mohammed!

honesttalk21:
Finally you admit the truth that the god/s you worship is not one.

In any case Zeus begets but Allah doesn't and isn't begotten.

The new testament god literally begets a son.

Allah is far beyond defining in mere physical or spiritual forms. There's nothing comparable to him

But Allah is physical!
Does Allah not have a leg with a shin?
Will Allah not put his foot on hell fire?
Did Allah not claim that he moulded Adam with his two hands?
Does Allah not have a shape?

Some of your books even described Allah as a young man in green dress.

Allah is PHYSICAL!


If Allah is not a Physical Being, why did your prophet compare Allah to the Dajjal?

Again:

1. Zeus is one just as Allah
2. Zeus is not a spirit just as Allah is not a spirit
3. Zeus is neither Omnipotent nor Omniscient nor Omnipresent exactly like Allah
4. Zeus is a physical being just as Allah is a physical being

honesttalk21:
Big lie. You sure don't know or understand metaphors used in your Bible. Even at that the metaphorical appearance of God never ate with Abraham unless you have now created your own bible edit

Gen 18:1-2,5-8:
"And the LORD appeared to him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day; And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, see, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground, … And I will fetch a morsel of bread, and comfort you your hearts; after that you shall pass on: for therefore are you come to your servant. And they said, So do, as you have said. And Abraham hastened into the tent to Sarah, and said, Make ready quickly three measures of fine meal, knead it, and make cakes on the hearth. And Abraham ran to the herd, and fetched a calf tender and good, and gave it to a young man; and he hurried to dress it. And he took butter, and milk, and the calf which he had dressed, and set it before them; and he stood by them under the tree, and they did eat."

Gen 18:16-17:
"And the men rose up from there, and looked toward Sodom: and Abraham went with them to bring them on the way. And the LORD said, Shall I hide from Abraham that thing which I do;"

Can you remind me what my lie was about again?

IamANigerianMan:
You talk like an animal, I was in UTH gwagwalada Abuja last week, these useless doctor abandoned people who needed emergency, some people who were burnt because one them was kidnapped...

For a person who thinks that animals TALK no sane conversation is worth the trouble!

Have a nice day!

mannobi:
Honestly this strike things are becoming irritating. Why must the first thing they think of as a union is to go on strike? Many of them have their own private ventures with terrible working condition for their staff. Do they strike at every disagreement?
I feel the national assembly should save the nation from all these unions always going on strike but still get paid eventually.

Have you considered that the FG deliberately ignores their complaints until they threaten a strike.

honesttalk21:
Please present proof that Prophet Muhammad pbuh wrote the Quran or even a verse.

There is abundant proof of those with him feeling the weight of revelation when it came to upon him.

There is NO single proof (outside Islam) that Mohammed existed outside the islamic narratives not to speak of evidence that he wrote the Qur'an.

Did any Muslim EVER ONCE see Jibril?
Don't forget that Jibril is very tall and has 600 wings: except if Jibril is indeed Dihyah Al-Kalbi

honesttalk21:
His impeccable character before and during the revelation.

1. If a man is accused by his followers of stealing an underwear: is such leader of impeccable character?
2. If a son-in-law cannot trust his father-in-law with his wife, is that an impeccable character?

Judge this now and respond to the questions!!

honesttalk21:
Has anyone lived up to the challenge of presenting anything similar to the Quran?

Yes, many people made the Qur'an and Allah copied them
1. Umar is one
2. The Jinn is another
3. The Ant is another

honesttalk21:
Concept of God in Islam is very different from Greek. There's adequate semblance between Christianity and Greek beliefs on this point.

The concept of God in Greek is similar to that of Allah of the Muslims.
1. Zeus is one just as Allah
2. Zeus is not a spirit just as Allah is not a spirit
3. Zeus is neither Omnipotent nor Omniscient nor Omnipresent exactly like Allah
4. Zeus is a physical being just as Allah is a physical being

honesttalk21:
Traditional Jewish interpretations reject the notion that any human could literally be considered divine or begotten by God in a biological sense. Is this not what is said of Jesus?
Throughout Jewish history strict monotheism is maintained a that does not accommodate the idea of God having offspring in any literal sense.
Jews do not have a concept of God literally begetting any human, they rather view such language as metaphorical representations of special relationships established through covenants.

But the God of Abraham appeared as a man and eat food with Abraham.
But Allah is limited: he cannot as he isn't the Almighty

honesttalk21:
I asked you who this verse refers and do not name anyone. My point is simple. Please explain who the Prophet that can neither read nor write described in the Torah and the Gospel?

I am certain you cannot so why refer to the verse in the first place?

Such a verse doesn't exist ANYWHERE in the old testament or new testament of the bible AND I challenge you to show the verses in both the Old testament and the new testament if you think they exist.

Moreover, Mohammed could read and write. I am surprised that you don't know this!?

honesttalk21:
Who verifies and or authenticates John's regarding himself as the disciple that Jesus loved other than himself?

Who verified Mohammed that
1. He wrote the Qur'an as received from Jibril?
2. Who verified that what Mohammed say was Angel Gabriel of YHWH and not a demon?

honesttalk21:
Extremely wrong comparison.
Zeus begets or fathers others but Allah is unique and beyond this. Allan is neither birthed not births and non can be compared to him.
The Greek fathering concept is synonymous to your christian belief. Prove otherwise please.

The Jewish kingdom and Hebrew existed well before the greek and God whose name is YHWH is a Father. Thus, you use a wrong comparison.

Unfortunately, the Greek kingdom wrote of their Zeus before the Arabs, thus
Zeus is the creator to the Greeks
Allah is the creator to the Muslims
Therefore,
The Muslims must have taken the concept of creator from the Greeks.

Can you see yourself?

honesttalk21:
Show me who the prophet that can neither read or write from the Torah and Gospel as said in Quran 7:157.

It certainly isn't Mohammed because Mohammed could read and write. I am surprised that you don't know this!?

You will note that there is not one verse in the Qur'an where the source of the book can be validated

honesttalk21:
Please why does your bible in the book of John in multiple places refer to just one particular disciple as the loved disciple?

Then you show me disciples according to your definition however this consist of just 1 of the disciples specially recognized as an apostle by Jesus in your bible.

Does the phrase the disciple that Jesus loved explain why only him of this 'promoted' twelve was there? Were the others aware they were less loved?

Then 1Jn 2:22 was originally written in Greek wasn't it?

John as the writer of the book of John refers to himself as such:
Unless you can refer to one place where Jesus claimed to love someone more than the other, shut up.

I asked you the questions:
Does Allah love Mohammed?
Does Allah love Mohammed more than Aisha?

honesttalk21:
In ancient Greek religion and mythology, the concept of god as father is primarily embodied in the figure of Zeus.

Zeus is an archetypal father figure often referred to as “Father” by other gods, signifying his position as a patriarchal figure within the pantheon. He is depicted as a sky god who wields thunderbolts and presides over justice, law, and order.

Does your Bible not tell you that you are gods?


In ancient Greek religious practices, rituals often included sacrifices to honor Zeus as a father figure. These offerings were made not only out of reverence but also out of an expectation for reciprocity by worshippers who believed that by honoring Zeus through sacrifices or votive offerings at sanctuaries dedicated to him such as Olympia, they would receive blessings in return.

Does this not resonate with the belief of the sacrifice to redeem mankind at the root of Christianity?

Was the Torah written in Greek?
God is the Father in the scripture of the Jews.

To Allah, you are just mere slaves: sorry!
Allah is not YAHWEH !

The illogicality of your question is this:
Zeus is the creator to the Greeks
Allah is the creator to the Muslims
Therefore,
The Muslims must have taken the concept of creator from the Greeks.

Can you see yourself?

honesttalk21:
Was this not ratified in the several council meetings in Rome which includes Nicea?

Is it not odd that this ratification wasn't done in Israel where Jesus actually lived and preached?

Indeed at the time of Jesus the Israelites were under Greek rule and after his departure they also took over and reformed his preaching into their own culture.

Keep struggling to protect this.

Unfortunately, except the following verses from your Qur'an are FALSE,
Can you explain WHY your God adopted a scripture supposedly corrupted because the bible says that Jesus created EVERYTHING seen and unseen.


It is a shame that Allah did not seem to know the verses you quote for Allah in his books and omniscience disagree with you modern Muslims.
Qur'an 7:157
Those who follow the messenger, the Prophet who can neither read nor write, whom they will find described in the Torah and the Gospel (which are) with them. He will enjoin on them that which is right and forbid them that which is wrong. He will make lawful for them all good things and prohibit for them only the foul; and he will relieve them of their burden and the fetters that they used to wear. Then those who believe in him, and honour him, and help him, and follow the light which is sent down with him: they are the successful.

Qur'an 2:41
And believe in what I reveal, confirming the revelation which is with you, and be not the first to reject Faith therein, nor sell My Signs for a small price; and fear Me, and Me alone.

Qur'an 2:89
And when there cometh unto them a scripture from Allah, confirming that in their possession - though before that they were asking for a signal triumph over those who disbelieved - and when there cometh unto them that which they know (to be the truth) they disbelieve therein. The curse of Allah is on disbelievers.

Qur'an 2:101
And when there cometh unto them a messenger from Allah, confirming that which they possess, a party of those who have received the Scripture fling the Scripture of Allah behind their backs as if they knew not,

You are simply concluding that Allah is not knowledgeable enough like you.


Are you saying that Allah is powerless to protect his books?

Too bad, you are the one who is struggling to respond because if the Qur'an is true, then the Qur'an is false because the Bible contradicts the Qur'an.

Let me show you just one verse in the Bible
Jesus said:
Rev 22:12-13:
"And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

honesttalk21:
Does this claim of Jesus loving a particular discipline not question if he loved the other disciples or apostles?

See you framing your question exactly like satan by implying that Jesus did not love the other disciples!
Do you have any evidence to this your implied assertion?

Since Jesus did NOT claim that He loved one disciple above the other, John has every right to claim as a human being of being loved the most by Jesus. Do you know what Jesus did for him that he was grateful for?
Of the twelve Apostles, Peter, James and John were the closest to Jesus

Does Allah love Mohammed?
Does Allah love Mohammed more than Aisha?

honesttalk21:
Apostles are a special type of disciples.
These group kept watch over Jesus before his arrest.
It seems some were around the trial yet only one witnessed the actual crucifixion?

How convincing!

Too bad for you. At least I could show you by names the disciples of Christ who witnessed His crucifixion.
Unfortunately, Your own prophet that gave you your narrative while feigning to be Allah
1. Was not even a distant disciple nor follower of Jesus
2. He never met anyone of the disciples of Jesus
3. He wasn't in the trial of Jesus
4. He wasn't close to the execution ground to assertain the identity of the one who was crucified
This prophet of yours is in fact one of the many Antichrists to come.

Before you cry,
Is Allah the Father!?
Is Jesus the Son of God?
1Jn 2:22:
"Who is a liar but he that denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denies the Father and the Son."
Tell me then how Mohammed is not one of the Antichrists!


How convincing!

honesttalk21:
In whichever way you choose to name it.

Who among the chosen 12 witnessed the actual crucifixion?

This is essentially the question you are unable to answer.

A question about the absolute truth of the alleged truth?

In the second coming of Jesus is he to establish the kingdom on Earth or Paradise?

Why is it absurd to do both and if he is to establish it in Paradise will he die again or actually truly die?

John the Disciple of Jesus was at the cross of crucifixion with Mary the mother of Jesus. John always referred to himself as the Disciple who Jesus loved.

This same John was at the last supper with Jesus

John 13:23-25
"One of them, the disciple whom Jesus loved, was reclining next to him. Simon Peter motioned to this disciple and said, 'Ask him which one he means.' Leaning back against Jesus, he asked him, 'Lord, who is it?'"

Mary the mother of Jesus loved with this same disciple after the death of Jesus Christ.

John 19:27:
"Then said he to the disciple, Behold your mother! And from that hour that disciple took her to his own home."

honesttalk21:
Wrong!
According to Hebrew text are the people earlier mentioned regarded as messiah or messianic?

Show me with EVIDENCE from the religious literatures of the Jews and Please be kind to tell me the Names of the TRUE Messiahs of the Jews.

Talk is cheap!

honesttalk21:
What then is the essence of specifically selecting the 12?

To be Apostles to him.

Luk 6:13:
"And when it was day, he called to him his disciples: and of them he chose twelve, whom also he named apostles;"

Ghostagain:
I don't like to exchange with mentally ill people, please move along.

You saw yourself in the mirror this morning?
LOL!!

Ghostagain:
My position is that I would like to remain alive and I would like my family members to remain alive and be there to bury me. I'm not a fanboy like you. I don't carry russian flag nor usa flag unlike you. I carry my own interests. That is a thing which you can't comprehend. This is not a football game !

So, again I say
Thanks be to mother Russia for preventing the USA from already nuking us in Africa.

Do you have Putin's bank account number so that I can send my token of appreciation?

honesttalk21:
Deep at sea without a paddle?

Is a companion the same as a disciple?
Are you forcing and equality?

Why does your Bible distinctly say 12 disciples?
Of this number how many actually witnessed the alleged event of the crucifixion of Jesus ?

It's not even up to 10%. Is this a statically acceptable number?

Khai!
Your ignorance of what you go against doesn't cease to amaze me.

An Apostle is first a Disciple: he is one chosen from amongst the disciples and SENT out by Christ

Luk 6:13:
"And when it was day, he called to him his disciples: and of them he chose twelve, whom also he named apostles;"

Sorry ehn!!

honesttalk21:
Does your question signify you agree with the other Hebrew classification of people that are messiah?

Show me that the Jews expect more than ONE True Messiah!
Please be kind to tell me the Names of the TRUE Messiah of the Jews.

BTW:
According to Allah and his prophet, what is the Messiah?

Ghostagain:
Talking to you guys is just like talking to a cow. A total waste, you refuse to even allow your brain to operate.

Will you be satisfied if I start cursing mother Russia!?

What response did you expect from me?
I just supported your position isn't it

honesttalk21:
Deep at sea without a paddle?

Is a companion the same as a disciple?
Are you forcing and equality?

Why does your Bible distinctly say 12 disciples?
Of this number how many actually witnessed the alleged event of the crucifixion of Jesus ?

It's not even up to 10%. Is this a statically acceptable number?

Do you for once think you have the authority to DEFINE as a Muslim what is meant by the term DISCIPLE!!?

You do not even need to take my word for it BUT at least adopt the Truth as presented in the Bible.

According to the Bible:
Are only the 12 Apostles of Christ His disciples?

Ghostagain:
If USA and Russia fight a nuclear war then USA population will be reduced to less than 5 million people (probably even less than one million people), why would USA allow Nigeria to have 200 million people in that context ?

Most of you are children who don't understand the world we live in, but you just like to talk louder than others even though you have nothing intelligent to say.


In a nuclear war, "everybody can get it". Nuclear powers will be distributing nukes like opera was distributing cars.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pviYWzu0dzk?feature=shared

Thanks be to mother Russia for preventing the USA from already nuking us in Africa.
Do you have Putin's bank account number so that I can send my token of appreciation?

honesttalk21:
Psalm 91 applies to everyone and by your doctrine isn't Jesus the first of who it applies to?

How then is it that
Surely he will save you from the fowler’s snare
and from the deadly pestilence not fulfilled?

Just as well For he will command his angels concerning you to guard you in all your ways.

Is it that the events pre, during and post the crucifixion narrative are excluded from the ways of Jesus?

James the Just was thrown down from a height and stoned to death. Was he exempted from the Psalms 91 or are these writings mere words?

Do you think that Ps 91 applied to David?
Yes or No!

honesttalk21:
The Essenes who aren't muslim claim an eyewitness account written by a member of suggests that Jesus did not die on the cross but instead survived his crucifixion. According to this narrative, after being taken down from the cross, he was revived by Joseph of Arimathea and Nicodemus, who were said to possess secret healing knowledge. This account portrays a completely human version of Jesus’ life and death, stripping away supernatural elements.

The Acts of John, which contains mystical elements and describes visions experienced by John during the crucifixion. In this narrative, it is suggested that what appeared to be Jesus’ suffering was merely an illusion or a mystery that could not be fully understood by those witnessing it.

Is the account of the Essenes TRUE or FALSE?

honesttalk21:
In the Hebrew Bible, the term messiah (from the Hebrew word mashiach, meaning “anointed one”) is used to refer to several figures who were anointed for specific roles or tasks, particularly kings and priests.

Cyrus is referred to as God’s anointed in Isaiah 45:1. He was the king of Persia who conquered Babylon and allowed the Jewish exiles to return to Jerusalem and rebuild their temple.

King David is often seen as a messianic figure due to God’s covenant with him, promising that his lineage would endure forever (2 Samuel 7:12-16). David was anointed by the prophet Samuel (1 Samuel 16:13) and is considered a model of kingship in Israel.

Solomon, David’s son, was also anointed king (1 Kings 1:39) and is known for building the First Temple in Jerusalem.

Jehu was anointed king over Israel by a prophet sent by Elisha (2 Kings 9:6). His mission was to eradicate Baal worship from Israel and fulfill God’s judgment against the house of Ahab.

You can see different characters associated and named messiah from the original language of the Hebrews.

The Hebrew Bible contains prophecies about a future messianic figure who will restore Israel and bring peace, often referred to in texts like Isaiah 11:1-10 and Jeremiah 23:5-6.

This restoration of Israel and bringing of peace is yet to occur hence this aspect of the messiah prophesy for the hebrews is still awaited.

You see how even the hebrew bible identifies different messiah and make nothing extraordinarily unique about what you lay claim to on Jesus.

The Quran did not claim to talk of all previous prophets as this may not be important to pass the essential message of God to man.

According to Christian theology, is Jesus coming back again?
For what purpose?


I hope you can be truthful for once

honesttalk21:
A believer in Christ is someone who has faith in Jesus.

A follower of Jesus goes beyond mere belief; it implies an active engagement with His teachings and a commitment to live according to His example. Following Jesus involves making Him a priority in one’s life and adhering to His commands as stated in Matthew 16:24. It reflects a deeper relationship characterized by obedience and discipleship. However note this verse is a direct statement to disciples.
Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me.

The term “disciple” comes from the Greek word “mathetes,” which means student or learner. A disciple is someone who not only believes in Jesus but also actively follows Him, learns from Him, and seeks to emulate His life and teachings (Matthew 28:19-20). Discipleship requires total commitment, sacrifice, and a willingness to share the message of Christ with others.

Mary of Cleophas appears in several passages within the Gospels but primarily as a witness rather than an active disciple. She is noted for being present at critical moments such as the crucifixion (John 19:25) and possibly at the resurrection (Matthew 28:1). However, her role does not align with that of a disciple who was called by Jesus during his ministry or who received direct instructions from him.

Same applies to your other alleged disciples.

Following your argument, Aisha , Zainab,Hafsa etc were not one of the Sahaba of Mohammed!

honesttalk21:
Interesting what you learn or are taught in your bible school and studies.

1. John 18:15-16
15 Simon Peter followed Jesus, and so did another disciple. Since that disciple was known to the high priest, he entered with Jesus into the courtyard of the high priest,
16 but Peter stood outside at the door. So the other disciple, who was known to the high priest, went out and spoke to the servant girl who kept watch at the door and brought Peter in.

2. Matthew 27:57
When it was evening, there came a rich man from Arimathea named Joseph, who also was a disciple of Jesus. He went to Pilate and asked for the body of Jesus.

3. Matthew 26:69-75
69 Now Peter was sitting outside in the courtyard. And a servant girl came up to him and said, You also were with Jesus the Galilean.
70 But he denied it before them all, saying, I do not know what you mean.
71 Then he went out to the gateway, where another servant girl saw him and said to the people there, This fellow was with Jesus of Nazareth.
72 He denied it again, with an oath: I don’t know the man!
73 After a little while, those standing there went up to Peter and said, “Surely you are one of them; your accent gives you away.”
74 Then he began to invoke a curse on himself and to swear, ‘I do not know the man.’ And immediately the rooster crowed.

Now analyzing these passages we see that:
John 18:15-16 indicates some disciples were near during Jesus’s trial.

Matthew 27:57 focuses on Joseph’s actions post-crucifixion without mentioning other disciples.

Matthew 26:69-75 shows Peter’s denial while he is outside during part of Jesus’ trial.

None of these passages provide direct evidence that any disciples witnessed the actual crucifixion event itself; they suggest proximity during earlier events leading up to it and an event post crucifixion but do not confirm witnessing it directly.

Really!?

But Mohammed witnessed the fake crucifixion!?

Ghostagain:
You are wrong tenIQ, the USA would nuke population centers in Africa.

Obviously paranoid!