₦airaland Forum

honesttalk21:
You have identified a valid theological question, but you have not established the conclusion you want from it. Islam does not deny that Jesus is uniquely extraordinary. It denies that uniqueness entails divinity.

honesttalk21:
The Qur'an gives the framework. Jesus is called a word from Allah and a spirit from Him, but it never says he is an eternal divine person. In 3:45, Jesus is called a word from Allah, while 3:59 explains his extraordinary creation by comparing him with Adam. A person brought into existence by Allah's command is not thereby identical with Allah or His speech. Likewise, calling Jesus a spirit from Him (4:171) does not mean that he is a fragment of Allah's essence. Shared vocabulary does not imply shared nature.

The same principle covers Jesus creating a bird and raising the dead. The Qur'an says these occurred by Allah's permission (3:49; 5:110). Jesus is the servant through whom the sign occurs; Allah remains its source. So Jesus does not break the Qur'anic challenge in 7:191 and 22:73. Those verses concern beings invoked besides Allah who cannot independently create. Jesus is never presented as possessing independent creative power.

honesttalk21:
The virgin birth doesn't establish divinity either. Adam had neither father nor mother; Jesus had a mother but no father. Qur'an 3:59 uses that comparison precisely to block the inference that an unusual mode of creation makes someone divine, not to support it. Any claim that this makes Jesus not a descendant of Adam is your own inference, not the text's. However you may want to put it, is he not a descendant of Mary who is definitely a descendant of Adam?

On witnesses, whether the virgin birth or ascension had named witnesses is a historical evidentiary question, separate from the theological one. The Qur'an does not specify witnesses to Jesus being raised (4:158). Nor does the absence of named witnesses in a particular passage establish that the person involved is divine. That argument simply does not get you from evidence to ontology. Is Moses divine since no one witnessed his burial or know his grave?

honesttalk21:
You demand a why beyond revelation, yet scripture itself doesn't always provide one. In Job 38:2 to 7, God doesn't give Job the explanation he demands; God challenges Job's standing to demand one. Paul states the principle directly in Romans 9:20 to 21:the potter doesn't answer to the clay for what he makes. Your demand for an exhaustive revealed reason isn't itself a biblical requirement.

honesttalk21:
The Qur'an nevertheless gives what reasons it gives: the virgin birth as a sign and mercy (19:21), and the miracles as signs by Allah's permission (3:49). It doesn't follow that every divine decision needs a further, exhaustive rationale. A lack of additional explanation isn't evidence the action was thoughtless, or secretly proof of incarnation.

You repeatedly turn uniqueness into divinity. But uniqueness only establishes uniqueness, not ontology.

honesttalk21:
The decisive challenge you still haven't answered is what is the necessary principle that says whenever God gives a human an unprecedented miracle, an extraordinary birth, hidden knowledge, or an unusual status, that human must therefore be God rather than a uniquely chosen servant of God? If such signs were sufficient to establish deity, you must explain why other prophets who received extraordinary signs are not also divine. If they aren't, you've already conceded that extraordinary divine signs don't logically entail deity. And if your answer is simply that Jesus is divine because these things happened to him, that's circular. You've assumed the very conclusion you were meant to establish.

honesttalk21:
Your own scripture supplies the counterexamples: Solomon spoke to animals (1 Kings 4:33); Samson had extraordinary strength and died like any man (Judges 16:30). Neither was treated as God for it. What rule exempts them but suddenly makes Jesus divine?

honesttalk21:
Keep the three issues separate. Why did Allah choose Jesus uniquely? The Qur'an names him a sign, Messiah to Israelites, and messenger. Why was he given extraordinary signs? To authenticate that role, by Allah's permission. Why does that make him God? That's the missing step, and you have not established it.

honesttalk21:
As for comparing Jesus and Muhammad to argue that the greatest prophet answer doesn't add up, that's a separate claim requiring its own argument. It doesn't follow from anything established here and isn't a why question at all.

You've shown Jesus is extraordinary. You have not shown extraordinary means divine. And if you insist an answer is inadequate unless it produces the conclusion you already hold, you haven't set a standard of proof. You've defined adequacy as agreement with Christianity.

Until you establish that missing principle independently of the conclusion, your case for Jesus being God remains an assumption, not a demonstration. And declaring in advance that Muslims will never find the true answer because it would take them out of Islam is not an argument. It simply announces that no response will ever count as adequate before one has even been given. That is not confidence in your position; it is insulation from having to test it.

doffman:
You will explain tire seh ahaaa.

You don cast guy .

doffman:
Even you casted yourself . Shioor.

I have bursted you already and I am done with you.

You can be crying shaaa🤣

doffman:
Trash 🚮

I am not responsible to cure you from all your viruses nah .

You will deviate tire .


You have lost .

Shioor

doffman:
You don cast nah .

You are now in deviation and repetition mode .

You will do that tire .

Pele unbeliever! 🤣

doffman:
🤣🤣🤣 see this one that was stripped completely . Even your Ai finished u off .
You are too small . You don cast . I have known the size of your 🧠 now .

This is you after severe banger 🤣🤣

honesttalk21:
Oh! So sorry for your*blind*, *unreasoning* self?
1.Word/Spirit from Allah (4:171
The Qur’an gives the decisive answer. Jesus is Allah’s servant, messenger, and Messiah sent to the Israelites not Allah (Quran 4:171).

honesttalk21:
2 & 5. Virgin birth as a sign, Adam parallel
Islam's purpose is not to undo Christianity, but to restore the prophets' original call which is worship the one God. Jesus' extraordinary birth and miracles serve that purpose; they do not make him God. Here's the challenge to you; dhow where uniqueness logically entails divinity. Adam also had no father and the Qur'an calls him just a man (3:59).

honesttalk21:
3. Miracles by Allah's permission, not co-creation (3:49; 5:110)
Jesus’ extraordinary birth and miracles are signs from Allah and confirmation of his prophethood, not evidence that he is Allah. The Qur’an even uses Adam to make this point. Jesus’ unusual creation does not make him divine (3:59).

Word from Allah, virgin birth, miracles, being raised by Allah, and knowledge revealed to him all demonstrate that Jesus is extraordinary. But none establishes that he is God Himself. The Qur’an repeatedly states that his miracles occurred by Allah’s permission (3:49; 5:110).

honesttalk21:
4. Raised by Allah, not deathless by nature.

honesttalk21:
5.Knowledge of hidden things as a granted sign. Is also in above 2 quote reference.

6. And so is 6

So you have been answered but only hold on to your denial.

doffman:
tenq

Whe I said you don cast guy; did I lie .

You don’t have anything to say again ; I have broken all your manipulations wings . Shioor


You stylishly japa from this where ChatGPT also bursted your lies and you quickly start deviating and throwing more questions and lies . I will not entertain that nah .


You should know I am smarter than you nah and you have been casted .


Now , I will reunite you with your fellow unbelievers with your stamps 🤣🤣.

Na throlling you guys will be receiving now .

doffman:
Trash 🗑️

🤣🤣🤣🤣 give yourself challenge to embrace the truth and stop all this your deviating tactics .

You don cast guy .

I can feel your pain . Even if you create 10 differrent posts , you will continue cry because you have already casted .

doffman:
Kininwi ahaaa
🤣🤣🤣 , even you self know you are typing as a person who drank something ahaaa.

You can never comment on how the ChatGPT bursted you right ? No be you challenged me to use another Ai Ahaaa

Do you think I will be the one to be teaching you everything ; No nah .

I am not responsible for you being an unbeliever o .

Your case need help from the Allah that created you . Even if someone explain things to you in thousands times , you can’t never listen nah . Even Ai bursted you , you still refuse the truth ; chai . Shioor

This verse is working on you guy :

Surah Al-Baqarah 2:6-7)"As for those who persist in disbelief, it is the same whether you warn them or not—they will never believe. Allah has sealed their hearts and their hearing, and their sight is covered. They will suffer a tremendous punishment.


See your life , Allah said you can never listen ; who am I to make you see the truth .

You need help shaaa.

Pele guy .

Shioor

doffman:
Trash 🚮.

Dey play o .

You don’t know anything seh 🤣

You will carry your own sin yourself and you will be in that grave alone . You will be judged accordingly and if you kpai in this your unbeliever , status hell fire for life . Your body go tell you .



Ezekiel 18:20: "The soul who sins is the one who will kpai. The son will not share the guilt of the father


“Jeremiah 31:30: "Instead, everyone will kpai for their own sin.

"Galatians 6:5: "For each one should carry his own load"

🤣🤣 how far now , do you still expect jesuuu to carry your sin. Your eye go clear well . Just kpai first ; you go understand .

Surah Al-Bayyinah (98:6): "Indeed, those who disbelieve from the People of the Book and the polytheists will be in the Fire of Hell, to stay there forever. They are the worst of all beings."

You being a polytheist , your body go tell you unless your repent .


Shioor

doffman:
Trash 🚮 as usual .

Your opinion is valueless nah . Who are you to question the choice of the God ! 🤣

Can unbeliever understand well ni ?

Not possible nah .you don cast


Even your Bibeli finish you :

ZEPHANIAH 3:9
KJ21
For then will I return to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the name of the Lord, to serve Him with one accord.

Shioor Tuehh

Expanse2020:
You don run...

I asked you did your 3 in 1 God
Created good and evil
Did he created Satan too

🤣🤣🤣
Abi you never found answer since these days
Help your boss antiislam

honesttalk21:
Stop false claims about evasion. You asked six questions, and answers were given. You have not demonstrated that those answers are inadequate; you have simply repeated the questions because you want a different conclusion.

You now say your real challenge is that Allah supposedly created a problem through Jesus and returned centuries later to undo it. But that contains the very assumptions you need to prove:

Where does Islam say Allah created Christianity? Where does Islam say Muhammad came to correct a divine mistake? And where does either Scripture establish that a long interval between prophets proves that God's earlier purpose failed?

Your own six questions were explicitly introduced by you as the basis of this argument. So this is about you diverting an already incorrect thread title into your own hijacked argument..

The Islamic answers are straightforward: Jesus is called a Word and Spirit from Allah; his virgin birth is a sign; his miracles occur by Allah's permission; he was raised by Allah; and knowledge of hidden things was given to him as a sign. None of these requires Jesus to be divine.

And your 600 years point does not rescue the argument. A chronological gap is not evidence of divine error unless you first establish the rule that God allowing centuries to pass between prophetic missions means His previous purpose backfired.

So the issue is no longer whether your six questions have answers. They do.

The issue is whether you can establish the assumptions that turn those answers into evidence against Islam.

Repeating the questions is not establishing them. Until you actually establish those assumptions, there’s nothing further to add here.



I was sharing my thoughts with a fellow Muslim, not bothering with the OP's unsubstantiated claim. That's the only reason you had an opening to respond to me. The OP titled this thread around Muslims curse Jews and Christians 17 times daily in prayer; your six questions about Jesus are a hijack into something else entirely, and your standard for adequate on that diversion is just whatever agrees with you; a tautology, not a standard.

That said, I've already answered your six questions across previous posts. The Word/Spirit, the virgin birth, why co-creator is your mislabel, the raising, the knowledge given as a sign. None of that has been engaged, just repeated back at me. So there's no point continuing this branch further.

honesttalk21:
Repetition doesn't establish your hidden premises. Every why question smuggles in a verdict that Jesus' extraordinariness caused a problem, that Christianity's growth was damage, that the gap before Muhammad was correction. None of that is demonstrated; it's just asserted through word choice.

The Qur'an states the actual purpose. Jesus' signs confirm his prophethood, performed by Allah's permission (3:49; 5:110). They don't make him divine, the text makes the same move with Adam created from dust, told Be, and he was (3:59). No further objective is claimed.

Your 600 years argument fails on its own logic. If a gap before the next prophet proves a prior mistake, the centuries between earlier biblical prophets and Jesus prove the same about them. You don't apply that standard there so it isn't a real standard, it's special pleading against Islam alone.

Neither text treats human misunderstanding as divine failure. My thoughts are not your thoughts... saith the LORD (Isaiah 55: says exactly this on your own side. The Qur'an states it directly; Allah is not questioned about what He does (21:23). Romans 9:20-21, which states that God is the potter and we are the clay; He has the authority to do as He pleases without being questioned.

So mistake, backfire, correcting Himself aren't conclusions your evidence reaches, they're the premises you started with, restated as questions.

And naming it plainly, no answer will ever be adequate for you, because you aren't actually seeking one. The six questions here aren't even a fixed script; across years and threads you rotate through different verses, hadith, and reinterpretations, but the underlying accusation never moves from Islam is built on a lie, and whatever text gets cited next will be twisted to fit that conclusion regardless of what it actually says. That's not inquiry, it's a loop with interchangeable inputs. The test of good faith is simple; does a specific rebuttal ever change your next move, or does it just find a new verse to recycle the same charge through? History says the latter.

honesttalk21:
You keep asking why Jesus is unique, as though uniqueness itself proves divinity. That is precisely the point you have not established.

Islam does give answer. Jesus’ extraordinary birth and miracles are signs from Allah and confirmation of his prophethood, not evidence that he is Allah. The Qur’an even uses Adam to make this point. Jesus’ unusual creation does not make him divine (3:59).

Word from Allah, virgin birth, miracles, being raised by Allah, and knowledge revealed to him all demonstrate that Jesus is extraordinary. But none establishes that he is God Himself. The Qur’an repeatedly states that his miracles occurred by Allah’s permission (3:49; 5:110).

So the burden remains with you to show where scripture says that being uniquely created, miraculous, or specially chosen makes someone divine.

Otherwise, you are not proving that Jesus is God; you are assuming the conclusion.

Address that foundation first. Then your repeated questions about Jesus can be meaningfully addressed but not on premises you have yet to establish.

honesttalk21:
Islam's purpose is not to undo Christianity, but to restore the prophets' original call which is worship the one God. Jesus' extraordinary birth and miracles serve that purpose; they do not make him God. Here's the challenge to you; dhow where uniqueness logically entails divinity. Adam also had no father and the Qur'an calls him just a man (3:59). Unique doesn't equal divine, even by your own text.

greatseed:
Then who created the world ? Allah in Arabic means God in English

Richtaiwo:
Does the comment you quoted says Allah is his Father.

Richtaiwo:
May he find peace with the Father of all Creations.

honesttalk21:
Well, your six questions don’t expose an Islamic contradiction; they expose a logical leap in your argument. None establishes, therefore Jesus is God. The Qur’an gives the decisive answer. Jesus is Allah’s servant, messenger, and Messiah sent to the Israelites not Allah (Quran 4:171). You cannot turn Allah’s miracles into evidence against Allah’s sovereignty.

dofman:
Pele guy 🤣🤣🤣

Was your Jesu not nailed and kpaid ?

Yes or no ?

Chai . You don suffer on

dofman:
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 guy , I just love you Dey collect on this thread ahaaa.

Now , I have used ChatGPT


It says the same things that I have been teaching you for the past weeks . Chai .

Truth can never be manipulated nah .

You don cast totally .

Pele guy

dofman:
Trash 🚮

Kininwi 🤣🤣

After this unbeliever has been bursted , he is now in severe pain o .

You think you can deviate me to different topic . Dey play

Omo, e be like say ; you drank something ahaaaa.

You can’t sleep

Do you expect me heal you from all your virus , no nah . Pele

Even if someone dedicate thousands of years to educate you line by line , you can never listen nah .

Have you seen an unbeliever to listen to the truth ; no nah . Pele


I always know you always portray and manipulate lies . Instead of me to take my self low to your half knowledge status, let me ask your deep seek to burst you 🤣🤣🤣

See your life and lies now . Shioor

Lobatan

Go copy another lies from your WhatsApp group nah . Oti lule pii

dofman:
Guy stop disgracing yourself nah .

Does Allah said he can’t understand all languages ? 🤣🤣

He is the creator of all languages.

If Allah chooses Arabic for Quran , what is your problem nah 🤣🤣🤣


Omo ; you need deliverance o

Even your bibeli confirm the uniqueness of single language for worship .

Shioor

Your opinion is valueless nah. .Tuehh

dofman:
Guy stop disgracing yourself nah .

Does Allah said he can’t understand all languages ? 🤣🤣

He is the creator of all languages.

If Allah chooses Arabic for Quran , what is your problem nah 🤣🤣🤣


Omo ; you need deliverance o

Even your bibeli confirm the uniqueness of single language for worship .

Shioor

Your opinion is valueless nah. .Tuehh

dofman:
🤣🤣🤣 can God be kpaid ?

Yes or no ? Ahaaaa

But your own god was nailed nah and you even proud of him , don’t you ?

Chai

You are finish seh

dofman:
Trash 🚮 as usual

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 Omo this one has entered repetition mode after he as knocked out .

Pele . I can feel your frustration shaa.

Now that I have broken you into pieces wait for my next action how I will combine you with your fellow unbelievers.

honesttalk21:
A rigid misinterpretation of the truth by those seeking only justification for their mischief. No matter the truth brought to them (these group who identify as Christians) they only have their fixations in their baseless lies and only amuse themselves in their fallacy fantasy.