₦airaland Forum

HardMirror:
Did moses receive instructions from God? Yes or No
Did shekau receive instructions from God? Yes or No.

Give reasons for your answer. Simple

instruction to kill steal and destroy is definitely from the devil.....my views......are you happy now

JMG1:
.....

So baptism of the Holy Spirit is for every one and Jesus said WE ALL who are believers must speak in tongues because He mentioned speaking in tongues as one of the sign that will follow us.

pls read 1 Corinthians 12

is not a must to speak in tongues....there are divers gift....and tongue is even the least and does not help the church except when another who has the gift of interpreting such.


I have been hit by the power of God.....i don't speak in tongues and i don't desire it......rather there is a gift i desire more.

is painful when i see church brothers who speak in tongue and still fornicates and drinks....the Holy Spirit is not in them.

HardMirror:
Christianity has been exposed. Guess you realize this is an argument you can never win. You condemn ISIS, BOKO HARAM, BUT YOU DON'T CONDEMN MOSES, JOSHUA, SAMSON and other psychopaths, why? bunch of hypocrites.

Cc mimzyy

Let me hear you people talk against islam again as if you are any better.

the truth is that...Christ condemned those acts too......Christianity is different from Judaisms ....the religion of the characters you mentioned.......Christians are followers of Christ....

Did Jesus Christ kill anybody......No...rather He went about doing good unlike moses and the rest of them.....and rather it was Christ that was killed.

HardMirror:
So you agree that isrealites should apologize to palestinians and admit genocide of their people.
Should moses story be seen as a story to teach people that invading peoples lands and murdering them is bad? Was moses really sent by god to kill all those people and take over their land?

was moses a christian

Anas09:
Satan hides my dear. This is where he comes looking very refined and sophisticated. We still know him.

yes we do

frank317:
U are a very irrational person and seriously, I pity ur future husband. Just were are all these rantings coming from just becasue 4kings asked simple question. Everything about u shows how sex starved u are, u don't even belong to this thread, u don't have the maturity to be here. Go somewhere and get laid pls.

you are not nice

Sarassin:
We have preconceived misconceptions about Spirits in particular, this is due mainly to the Christian concept that everything in the unseen realm is bad, or demonic. Nothing could be farther from the truth.

I had a first spirit possession at around 16. A little boy I had met in spirit was being constantly abused by some Elementals. They were projecting on him and causing his etheric form to liquefy. He told me in tears that he had been hurt. I performed a simple rite and returned him to a healthy state. He has followed me around ever since.

At the time he would get scared very easily so I told him that whenever he felt scared he should jump inside of me. At such occasions that he did of course his words and thoughts would begin to merge into my mind, and I would have his thoughts and awareness inside of me. He absolutely loved it.

I found the spirit playful, intelligent and sometimes mischievous, he blossomed into a wonderful being. He collected my memories into his form and projected them back into my mind, I never forgot anything, it was due largely to him that I was able to complete two degree courses virtually simultaneously.

what!!!!!!!

THIS IS SOME STRANGE STORIES.

spiritual matters....so difficult to understand......"jump into you".....waoh!!!

thanks LoJ for sharing.

i actually see dead relatives and i don't know how they manage to locate me......some three weeks ago i encountered my mother at the early hours of the morning between 2:30 am and 5:am... and was call at 8:am that same morning that she died early that morning between the hour of 4:30 am.

there is an astral plain where spirits try to communicate with those whose spirit are not heavy.... i had an encounter with a lady who died in the Dana plane crash..... she was relating her story and i was just writing....when i woke up i thought i physically wrote down things but actually did not......she told me how the fire engulfed her and her three children in the plane....

days later i went on line and found her photograph and her children......i learnt her name but i will not say it here.

some times the vision come before they die.

at the later part of 2008, i had a vivid dream that my parent where being buried. i was at the grave site when they where being lowered down,.... i did not protest my dad because as at the time he was sick, but i protested for my mum.....mainwhile ...i saw one of my younger brother in our palour covered in cobwebs while i was protesting that my mum should not be buried, when i woke up i called my mum and my siblings that there are two grave for the family that they should pray.

we were not spiritual so in one week i lost my dad and that my brother i saw in cobwebs......now i hate cobwebs whether in dreams or in physical....can't stand those things

OkoYibo:
There should not be issues out of this. Elijah handed over to Elisha. Jesus' ministry was for only 3 years before handing over to his disciples.

Any leader who failed to groom successors in his 20 years of ministry has failed. The church of God is not built around personalities, but the teachings of Christ.

Soldier go, soldier come, barracks remain.

that is so on point.

where in rome has the church become a family business....that they must hand over to wife or sons and daughters.

Jesus has earthly mother, brothers and sisters but did not hand over to them....... i wonder why Pentecostal pastors want to own the church......is all because of money... they see church as a huge financial investment not minding the spiritual aspect of it......... i began to wonder how the stepping aside will remove the power of the Holy Ghost from them

yedidiah:
Under what federal law was Religious bodies created?

Part C Companies and Allied Matter Act...they are registered as incorporated trustee.....charitable and non profit organisation.

you should begin to ask what is the purpose of setting up a trust.

Spidermon:
I am a Christian and I support this FRCN code.

Churches claim Non profit status but pastors are now competing with celebrities and politicians on wealth accumulation.

Let them open their books and pay taxes.

so on point.

not just taxes....let us see their weekly charitable commitment..... and we need external auditors empowered by the Govt to audit their account monthly.

we also wish to know the beneficiaries of the various trust account opened ......also a data of the members be filed at CAC so we will know how to apply the trust proceed when they fail or improperly apply it.

Realdeals:
No noise please!

Executive Secretary/Chief Executive Officer of the FRC, Jim Obazee, at the weekend said that though only 89 out of the 23, 216 registered churches in the country have complied till date with regulations, the council would be unrelenting till the right thing is done.

“In keeping other peoples’ money, you have to prepare account. That is why churches fought me so badly, took me to court as a person and then my office too. Mosques and orthodox churches freely complied, but those Pentecostal churches called me to ask questions. They said: ‘This church is church of God and we are accountable to God.’ And I told them: ‘Very good, so you must take this church to heaven, you can’t operate it here’. When public funds are involved, government needs to ensure proper accountability.”

The CEO explained: “Religious organisations are ordinarily set up as ‘not-for-profit’ and they remain institutions of public character. The challenge, however, is a trend where churches and mosques start dabbling into non-charity ventures like schools, hospitals and so on.

“When you set up a church, your motive is to ensure that people are well focused to go to heaven. Then the money in the church should be targeted at ensuring that people are helped to do that. If you want to set up a school, then it should be free for all your members’ children. If you charge any money, then you are in the same league with other schools outside that are paying taxes to the government.


READ MORE @ http://www.newsheadlines.com.ng/latest-nigerian-news/2017/01/08/nigerian-churches-financial-reporting-council-frc/

the Pentecostal churches have made church a family business....that is why they are finding it hard to comply.....

A church belong to the people,.....the trustee are accountable to the people....who are the real beneficiaries.....if the G.Os don't run church for their benefit , why are they reluctant to step aside.

the new code is actually mild and a welcome idea.

church leadership is different from their calling....they can still pray, preach, heal the sick, cast out demons and raise the dead which they are called to do

ooman:
The topic of mutual exclusion of omniscience and freewill is a topic that exposes many things about the nature of God.
This topic just didnt immediately mean that God does not exist if we have freewill, it also means that If God exist, then we dont have freewill. What we therefore call freewill is only a delusion because if Jack has two options - A and B, and if an omniscient being knows that Jack was going to choose B, then Jack MUST choose B, if not, the omniscient being is not omniscient anymore.
Jack, on the other hand would think that its his freewill to choose between A or B, but it has been decided long ago. Jack therefore has only the delusion of freewill.
This fact shows that if God exist, then man does not have a real freewill but a delusion of it. This therefore makes God a villain by making man believe that a delusion is reality. But isnt that what religion is all about? Religion is all about deception, and God is all about getting worshiped.

How exactly is God a fraudster? I will use two events in the bible to show how God or at least the idea of God has defrauded man.

1. The fall of man - According to Gen 3, God supposedly gave man the choice of eating or not eating from the tree of knowledge, out of which man ate and God got furious. In his furiousness, he punished man.
But if God is truly omniscient, then he must have known that man would eat from the tree of knowledge, why then did he get furious enough to punish man?? That is the problem here, the fraud.
God made Adam and Eve look stupid and God pretended as if he never knew they were going to eat from the tree and he punished them and sent them off Eden.

So, if God knew they were going to eat from the tree, why get furious again - this means he is a fraud by pretending he never knew.

But the religious will not agree with the above - this immediately suggest that God is not omniscient.

So it is either God is not omniscient or he is a fraudster, no other option is possible.

God defrauded man by making it seem as if it was man's decision to eat from the tree. This he did so that man would think he had disobeyed God and so owed God a lifetime of worship in return for his salvation that he offered us.

God inveigled the human race and made us think we are the villains when in fact he is the criminal. This is an act of fraudulent.

2. The betrayal of Judas - According to the Gospels, a man named Judas betrayed Jesus, he later committed suicide because he thought it was his own freewill at work.
But if God is truly omniscient, then he must have known that Judas would betray Jesus, but he pretended and played dumb.
The fraud here is this - Because God already knew that Judas would betray Jesus, since he is omniscient, and because someone must betray Jesus for God's dumb plan to work, then it is not Judas freewill to betray Jesus because it is either Judas betrayed Jesus or God is not omniscient anymore. Judas never understood this and after the act, he blamed his freewill and committed suicide.

God defrauded Judas of his life by deceiving him into thinking it was his freewill to betray Jesus when in fact he must for God's omniscience to remain valid.

This proves that if God exist, then we do not have freewill, all the evils in the world are just what God planned.

God is a fraud. He defrauded us into thinking we have freewill so we would think that all our mistakes are a result of our freewill and so feel like we owe him lifetime of worship in order to save us. For God, it is not about us, it is about him getting worshiped, this is why he defrauded us.

God is a fraud and we must do away with such a villain. Think and choose wisely

Act 17 vs 30

in the days of ignorance God winked ( allow to pass unnoticed) but now charges all people everywhere to repent.

The ill activities or drawback of religion does not make God a fraud.....Perhaps you should tell us who defrauded or 419ed you instead of giving God a new name.

Sarassin:
Many do not accept that spirits exist in a meaningful sense, I have never had that luxury. All my life I have had no choice other than to accept that spirits do in fact exist. One of my earliest recollections as a child of about 5 is that of my mother coming to tuck me in to bed at night and asking if she should turn off the lights to which I invariably replied, no. One night she insisted she would and I replied that she needn’t bother as the nice old man would turn it off later. As far back as I could remember, an elderly looking gentleman always materialised in my room just before I fell into slumber and asked if I was ready to sleep after which he would switch off the light and disappear. It was entirely natural to me. Even though Mum is a strong psychic, she never fully recovered from that answer.

I was about 8 years old when my maternal grandmother came to bid me goodbye, she wasn’t ill, debilitated or anything, she projected to me, sat at my bedside and told me she would be off with the “angels” soon. She pointed at my bedside clock and told me that the following day when the long hand was at a specific time she would have departed, and I was to come with my “ark” and lead her, she assured me that my grandfather was awaiting her.

I asked her how she knew about my “ark” since I had told nobody about it, she replied that I had told her about it in dream consciousness.

From about the age of 6, I have done “Soul guidance”, I project to sites of great conflict with a propensity for mass deaths and help lead departed souls to where their loved ones await. The “ark” she described was my distinctive carrier, others do this compassionate service too. Mama passed the following day exactly as she described she would.

I have 7 nieces and nephews, I met each and every one of them in spirit form long before they were born, I knew them even before their parents, my siblings, knew they would have children, they described themselves to me and what they would become. One told me that though she was ready, she would wait until my brother had dumped the then girlfriend and wait for the next one (whom he would marry) before she became born.

When I met my daughter she told me she loved me very much but would be taking on the looks of her maternal grandmother! I begged in vain. The spirit of my paternal grandfather appeared to me before my sister in-law gave birth and told me he would be returning as my brother’s son but that his mother would not “care” for him and I was to watch over him. Lucky for him he mentioned this, else he would have been toast.....literally.

Hospitals are a stressful place for me, but that's for another day.

We exist on a plane of interchangeability, we are constantly on the move, ascending, descending and expanding our circles, our familial ties are not accidental, they are by design, design for eternity.

I know that others have had similar experiences, do lets hear them.

Ha!
i am blasted!!!!!

this is some serious thread.

you have got some serious potentials.

Thanks for sharing......will share some of my experience soon.

Mccoynelly:
Source : http://leadership.ng/news/565748/2017-atiku-will-be-forced-out-of-apc-tinubu-may-be-poisoned-prophet-omale

WE HEAR.

but the prophet need to win the wife over to Christ....fake hair, fake eye lashes, fake face, may be a fake life too...bad example for a pastors wife.

wonukwuru:
I am adult married to a lady of 35years. We have been married since 2007. God has blessed us with 3 wonderful children( 2 boys and 1 girl). Before we got married, i agreed with my wife that i only want to have 2 kids ( I wouldnt mind if they just boys or girls. That means, Im not particular of the sex of the kids). My wife is a B.sc Accounting graduate, while myself, I am a Chartered Accountant, with a well paid job. My wife had a 3rd class degree. On several occassions, i have told her to go back to school for Post Graduate Diploma (PGD) in order to upgrade, but she plainly told me that she cannot go back to school again. When i asked her why, she told me that her brain cannot withstand any academic stree again. I also suggested to her, since you studied accounting in the university, why not enroll for ICAN program? When i said that to her, she told me that she could not go for PGD, is it ICAN that she can do? I have been thinking, what will i do for her to be like others.

Luckly, was transferred to Benin. I went with my family to Benin. We stayed over 4years in Benin. While we were in Benin, I told my wife to go and enroll for a 6months diploma programm in computer (because she is not computer literate). I paid over N110,000 for the 6months programme. My wife only went for the programme for 1month and stopped. She refused to complete the program. When I asked her, she told me that she will go back after she had "put to bed"( Then she was pregnant). Guys, its over two years now and the baby is even in pre-nursery school, yet my wife has not reminded me of going back to complete the programme.

Last year, she asked me to open a store for her, that she want to go into trading. When I asked her the nature of the business, she said, she wants to deal on selling rice, beans, yams, groundnut oil, etc. I now suggested that it will not be a problem, but she has to look for somebody who is already in the business so as to understudy the person for atleast 1month. She refused, saying that without her understudying anybody, that she can still make it. I told her that my reason of suggesting to her to understudy somebody was that, i wanted her to be selling in wholesale. My plan was to give like N1.5million. I told her, i cannot just release N1.5million to her for a business that she did not learn. I told her that N1.5million is not a small money. Brethren, that was why up til now, i have not opened the business for her.

My children's school fees is over N650,00 per term for the 3 kids. I provide for feeding. My wife does not want to do anything as to assist me in the family. I give her money for her hair, cream, bathing soap, panties and clothing. Im really getting tired. My salary does not carry the family again because of too much expenses.

Another problem now is, my wife's dressing is nothing to write home about. She dresses as if she is in her late 60s. I have complained to her on several occasion that i dont like the way she dresses, but each time i bring up the issue, she will get angry. People around, have meeting my sisters to tell them that my wife does not dress well as somebody that has gone to the university. Even in my house, my wife only tires wrapper. Nothing in her again attracts me to her. Infact, for the past 3 months, i have not slept with her. I sleep in the parlour while she sleeps in the bed room.

Else, i forget, my wife delibrately "took in" again since July last year. This is after we agreed that the 3 kids that we already have is enough. Her method is, each time i remind her of what to do as to be assisting me in the family, she will delibrately "take in".

My wife, went to the university but she cannot speak simple and correct english. She cannot write application letter. She cannot teach my kids who are in primary 2 and 5 respectively. I pay a lesson teacher N30,000 monthly for my kids but my wife is at home doing nothing. Since we got married, my wife has not sent me text message on her phone more than 3times. The ones that she sent, my brothers, there are lots of gramatical blunders. When i confronted her with the text message, she could not say anything. I was checking for some documents in my room last week, and i came across an application that my wife wrote to submit to a private school where she wants to teach. When i saw the letter, believe me, my brothers, one of my kids that is in primary 5 cannot write such rubbish.

What i thought she was before i married her, is not what she is. I cannot take her out for an occassion because she may embarrase me by her conduct in the public. I need a divorce but the problem now is, i did i court wedding with her. What should i do? Im confused.

I'M THE BEST DIVORCE LAWYER MONEY CAN BUY......PM ME LETS TALK

Idydarling:
na dia kind women go see young and innocent girl, come dey frown face dey preach about young girls not being Christ like, when from her dance step u don know who she been be b4

Can she be Christlike with fake hair.......just asking o

prophetess indeed

hopefulLandlord:
how do you propose this "change" can be made?

some organized bodies has to initiate a draft and seriously advocate on it......it is not a one man affairs.

CAN is suppose to be a contemporary of NBA, NUT,NUJ etc to set a standard, discipline and organize religion in Nigeria but is not empowered.

An association like CAN should be proactive and establish by statute, have various committees to deal with problems associated with churches,...... all pastors must be registered with this body and must pay monthly or yearly due to finance the full function of this body,...the disciplinary committee should be well established so that members of the public can petition any pastor for defrauding them.


CAN will not initiate a bill because the so call members are benefiting from its nonfunctional irregularities.....so...

members of the public should begin to stage an aggressive campaign for the dissolution or winding up of CAN ....and call for the establishment of a statutory body to regulate all religious bodies........there is so much to write but you know where i am heading

DeepSight:
Use your hands to touch your physical head. Touch it all round - from the back of your head, to your ears, to the top of your head, then to your temples, feel your eyes, nose, lips and chin. Circle the jaws and back to the back of your head.

What have you just touched and groped?

A Visor.
A helmet-like instrument designed to help the being within perceive its outer physical world.
This object will be taken off at death along with the rest of the instrument - the body: and the real being will exist in its real transcendental reality.

This is virtual reality. A simulated game we enter into at birth and be done with at death. Nothing you see in this world is real. It's all a simulation which [b]we [/b]will step out of at death.

OP seems scary....but I'm still trying to understand you.

at the bold......how do you describe the"we" that stepped out at death ......this seems to be your only reality... deepsight i really want to understand you because i have stepped out of my body severally....on an astral journeying...... which one of me is an illusion and which is a reality....help me please.

plaetton:
We are all just on the right side of history.

Right or left...lets be sure......which history by the way

i align with the Op though... i can feel his pains

plaetton:
My dear friend,
You ought to know that in Nigeria, religious matters and religious parasites enjoy official immunity from accountability.
Otherwise, Nigeria would not be the giant lunacy bin that it currently is.

I.mean, just under month ago, 200 innocent people had their skulls crushed by a falling Church building.
Did you see any Federal response ?
Any legislative response ?
Any commission of inquiry ?
Any arrests and prosecution ?
Any relief or compensation for the survivors and families of the dead ?

The answers to all of the above is a big fat NO.

Just imagine the sheer amount of money Adeboye, Oyedepo, Olukoya or Odukoya, the presiding clown at MFM, Oyaks , Okotie and all the millions of lesser clowns scattered all over the country Rob the Nigerian population every single week.
Just put your mind on the staggering figures.

Now, the most painful is that these parasites give absolutely Nothing back to the society, except for more empty, more fraudulent BULLSHYTES and schemes.

this can change...but not if we keep talking about it.....in Nigeria, religious bodies are not taxed...they are widely unregulated....no body audit their accounts... and their members are not known.....if you pick up their files in CAC, you will find out that only the trustees have a say and benefit....you will hardly find a church with 20 members......this is the reality.

they pay annual returns but just a token.....and 98% of them do not pay at all.....CAN a body that is suppose to at least regulate the activities of the churches in Nigeria has not been given powers to met out disciplinary actions on religious blood suckers and fraudsters,.... i did a search last week on the Body called CAN and believe me is just a Joke ....... since the Govt won't do anything, what can we do about it

plaetton:
Yes.
Any religious system, cult or philosophy that uses fear and blackmail as primary currencies to promote magical thinking, to promote the abdication of personal responsibility , is indeed contributing greatly to the social ills of our society.

You talk about people making bad decisions.
Sure.
But with what do people make decisions ?
Their minds.

A mind that is suffused with stone-age delusions will undoubtedly think and make decisions with stone-age mindset.
This is undeniably true in Nigeria.
....And this is my beef with stone-age religions in Africa.

Sir plaetton, is about time you take a criminal petition against these religious bodies and their so call Go's.....perhaps initiate a Bill for submission to the legislative arm of Govt for a proper debate..... i will sponsor your draft if you so wish.....we have been at this for too long.

johnydon22:
It is seriously amazing..

Let me make my own prophecies.
Boko haram will pull another attack..
A politician will die if they don't pray.
A nollywood actor will die.
Nigeria will see further economic break down.
President buhari should watch his health.
ISIL will intensify attack leading to major coalition of world powers.
somebody here will have twins
Nairaland will push more useless topics to front page and keep marginalizing science topics.

---

And imbecil_es will take these con men serious after they yap things that are very likely to be the case and call them prophecies buttered in trials and errors.... Its incredible..

johnydon22....

i hail O......this matter never tire u

otemanuduno:
Oh, I just read your thread of how you converted to Christianity in Dunamis and I almost laughed myself to stupor. They played the brain game on you and you think that it was a god who struck you down. Lol.

Lemme explain what happened to you in that church. Simply put, it's called HYPNOTISM. I hypnotise myself to sleep using such method everyday because it puts my brain to a state of dreaming, which I always enjoy.

Here's it, pick any language you like, which you don't know the meaning(because that makes it work better). Even the magicians use that to play illusions. As for me, I recite the SERIOT LANGUAGE, but it isn't necessary. Just keep muttering anything you don't know its meaning. Your brain will come to a level whereby it wouldn't be able to comprehend anything and then it hibernates. Just so simple!

Have you ever wondered why the Muslims want people to be speaking Arabic, even though they don't know its meaning? This is to aid the believer's falling into trance. Just as simple as that. No Supernatural thing involved except the BRAIN!

SO, THAT'S EXACTLY THE PSYCHOLOGY THE PASTORS ARE PLAYING ON THE GULLIBLE PEOPLE. THEY HAVE YOUR TRUST, SO IT MAKES YOU GO INTO TRANCE EASILY.

Other methods of doing this is by focussing your attention on nothing while counting 'tesibil' or rosary or stones, or anything at all. You will feel sleepy. And because in church, you are standing, you'll just fall when you have absorbed so much dosage of the pastor's 'Kabash'.

8 months ago, you may make sense.... but not anymore

What a write up.... i could not just stop reading.

struggle no more my brother....i hated religion before... i de taste custom and tradition....in fact

God will locate you soon.....you will find fulfillment.

plaetton:
Another illusion , a most false and logical fallacy.

How Deepsight salutes you on this logical fallacy is perhaps the biggest mystery of 2016.

That conclusion was a good argument for your post....death is not an illusion but a reality for your post.....and it still is a reality....we donn't have to experience it to know.

hopefulLandlord:
from my deep observation, what they call "Holy Spirit" is simply their instincts making the right choice and that's made with power of hindsight

let's say they're at a point where they must make a decision and they have 4 options

normally human would have about the same voice in his/her head debating the possible outcomes of all four, then narrow it down to 3, 2, then 1 which would be the final decision

if I narrow mine and my final decision is right I simply praise my instincts, if it's wrong I simply beat myself over it (depending on the consequences of the failure)

for a Christian however, same thing also happens, they may "pray about it" "fast about it", even claim to "talk to god about it" but at the end of it all they have their decision to make based on the same voice in their head debating all four possible choices and here's the kicker- they have tricked their subconscious to create a new voice for each option of the debate

Voice 1: Chose option 3, can't you see its right?

Voice 2 (more coarse): chose option 4, it makes the most sense

Voice 3 (female voice): chose option 2, because xxxxxxxxxxxxx

voice 4 (David Beckham voice): option 1 makes sense, don't listen to the other voices

question now is "Which of these four voices age from the holy spirit?"

that voice is determined by hindsight!

whichever option ends up being the right one is the holy spirit voice

if they fail it means they didn't "hearken to the voice of the holy spirit" and if they do succeed it means they were able to recognise the voice of the spirit

that's why the "discerning spirit" of the average Christian isn't better than the average atheist or Muslim or Hindu or.............

The Holy Spirit is accurate in revealing things ....If it gives you a message for me, it will give you my full name... tell you my problem... and give you the solution... it will also give you my picture so you will recognize me and single me out of a crowed........brother...that is how it works.

plaetton:
Experience is the key thing, the key barometer.

Everything is an illusion, until it is consciously experienced.

There are experiences that i have had that you will write off as illusions...

everything cannot be an illusion...you are like.."death is an illusion until it is experienced" .

what you call illusion are my realities.

try again

DeepSight:
Whilst this is very interesting, it still has little to do with the core existential sort of illusion which I am discussing. I would say that what you have referred to is better described as living in a definite reality with false notions about its system and economy which then cause one to invent an imaginary future reality to assuage same.

This is quite different from the existential question of y[b]our entire life as it is already being an illusion: a dream of a sort - a simulation that is in fact not real at all[/b] but only appears so when viewed through the biochemical visor and transmitter that is the human body.

not our entire life but yours alone......you only know that you are not real... i wouldn't know.

i marvel at this statement though.

texanomaly:
Interesting discussion.

longest time Ma.

good to have you here.

DeepSight:
I have been discussing the idea that we live in a simulated reality for some time: an illusion of sorts.

But, even if true, just how could we ever know such a thing?
There are a number of interesting takes I would like to discuss regarding this.

Let me however open with a quote I picked from another Forum:

"Koukl points out that in order to recognize something as an illusion, two things are required: (1) the presence of a conscious observer who is capable of perception, and (2) the ability to distinguish between what is real and what is illusion.

If there were no conscious observers who can perceive, then it is impossible to know there is an illusion because the non-conscious do not perceive or know anything. So if consciousness was not real there would be no way to perceive that consciousness was just an illusion. If consciousness is required to perceive an illusion, then consciousness cannot itself be an illusion. Similarly, one would have to be able to perceive both the real world and the illusory world in order to know there is a distinction between the two, and to subsequently identify the illusory world as illusory. If all one perceived was the illusion, they would not be able to recognize it as such."

Takers?

If i tell you this is my reality... it will make no sense to you...because you will say is an illusion......that madman reality is just an illusion...ok..

ok who will be the independent conscious observer who is capable of perception that will be the umpire between me and you... when i said a pastor prayed for me and i saw a large crocodile walking out of me...or i find my self in my village family house roasting cobwebs....

this is my reality


so i ask you a question in the absence of a conscious observer....what is the illusion

plaetton:
What is the difference between existential illusion and an economic or systemic one ?

If, from infancy , we are sold the first illusion that resources are scare and must be competed for, then that forms the foundations of our perceptions or worldview, and upon which other existential illusions are constructed.

From this illusion of scarcity, we compel our selves to spend almost 100℅ of our lives struggling to accumulate as much of the so-called scarce resources as possible.
Therefore, our consciousness, our conscious perceptions become limited, unable to expand beyond primitive accumulation.

Now , here is the funny part.
Because we spend so much our lives trying to accumulate, we develop a natural fear of death. We complain that life is too short.
We then create an after-life , eternal life illusion to assuage our fears.
In other words, we create an illusion of time, more time to do something other than primitive accumulation.

This is why heaven is sold as a paradise, with no work, no strife, no economic structure, no usury.

not everyone is afraid of death.....to me death is a transformation....is an important part of life....the issue of heaven or paradise does not entice every believer.....to think i will not die is an illusion that must fail......christian or not...we must all transform


"Death is the only reality"