greatgenius: ok now I sort of know your position on those three questions..
Now that we have established a foundation I ask that we take one topic at a time and expatiate on it before we move to the next.

Let's start with God.. what exactly do you mean by pantheist atheism ? Are saying you believe everything is a manifestation of God yet believes this God does not exist? ..

greatgenius: Before I reply your above post let me state my position simply numerically
1. God is the Source
2. There is only one God and nothing else exist but God..
3. She is the creator of all things in existence or the totality of all things in existence.
4. Thus He exist in all things in existence both "seen" and " unseen", The everything and the no-thing ..
5. We are all individuated aspect or manifestation of this BEING- God..

6. God is spirit ( what you and scientist have termed energy )..
7. Etc

As you can see I have said the same thing in different ways.. so again simply put
God is the source and we are all manifestations of this infinite being..

Mr Troll: She is the creator, He exists, is also a spirit. Lemme hazard a guess, god is a hermaphroditic spirit

plaetton:

Everything is the manifestation of one: Energy.

Like I said, god has too many problems as a conscious purposeful being.

Energy is simple. Simple to understand, simple to appreciate, simple to manipulate. In my view, if everything is just the sum of self-existent energy , then the idea of a creator, with all its problems and contradictions fly out the window.

With god thrown out the window, then we , as units of energy, then focus on creating our own reality, our own universe

To a small extent, this is what has been happening over the past 250 yrs or so with the gradual but steady emasculation of religion.

plaetton:

Yes, but with a big difference.
Once you refer energy as a being, then your are giving conscious and purposeful attributes to it.

So, you idea and mine might sound similar, but are millions of miles apart.

Like I said before, the problem with the idea of god is that it is supposed to be conscious and purposeful, and that is what contradicts everything about god and creates a lot of philosophical, religious and moral contradictions and conundrums.

Mr Troll: She is the creator, He exists, is also a spirit. Lemme hazard a guess, god is a hermaphroditic spirit

Mr Troll: She ias the creator, He exists, is also a spirit. Lemme hazard a guess, god is a hermaphroditic spirit

Uyi Iredia:

Sex as usually known is an attribute of an organism, but consciousness in humans knows not sex, ergo, you have females who act like men and men who act effiminate.

plaetton: ^^^
The problems with a conscious and purposeful god is that many questions inevitable arise as to who, when, and why regarding his mind and his purpose.
Inevitably, as human history attests, every one and every group becomes a self appointed interpreter for god's will and purpose. The rest becomes history.

So once we go on that path, it's deja vu all over again.

Now, on the other hand, when we study the workings of the universe , we see the ceaseless impersonal, purposeless pulsations of energy. Nothing else.
Everything else is the just creations of our minds.
Reality is quite different from our interpretations of it.

As an example, the universe has virtually remained more or less the same over the past 10,000yrs. Yet, see how our perceptions of the universe have undergone so many changes over that period.
So our perceptions of reality are always changing, not the realities themselves.

I mean look how many religious gods now fill the graveyards of history.
There are still few left, and presently grasping for air.
In time to come, they too will succumb to changing perceptions of reality.

plaetton: @greatgenius
Why don't you open a separate thread so we can continue with this particular line line of discussion.

On this thread, I want focus on my theme of proving that faith is actually extreme doubt.

plaetton: @greatgenius
Why don't you open a separate thread so we can continue with this particular line line of discussion.

On this thread, I want focus on my theme of proving that faith is actually extreme doubt

texanomaly: why not the bolded?

musKeeto: All the unnecessary obfuscations... Well, it was to be expected.


let's assume we have 5 points

A B C D E

God being God, knows that given an option to pick 3, a man might decide to pick any in whatever permutation. But this isn't omniscient.

Being omniscient means God knows exactly what options he will pick, and in what order. e.g B A C or D B A.

Like I said on an earlier thread, omnisicient isn't just about probabilities. God knows FOR CERTAIN WHAT will happen else, he fails to be OMNISCIENT.


The problem is this knowledge isn't limited to the now. GOD, BEING OMNISCIENT KNOWS WHAT MY UNBORN DESCENDANT 3 GENERATIONS AWAY WOULD DO.

They've not been born, yet their actions have already been known. By knowing, God has made them set. If they deviate from what God already knows, then God seizes to be omniscient. Else, their 'freewill' is just an illusion. They're only acting according to God's foreknowledge, just like the characters in a story must bend to the will of the writer.


And with this, I end my case...
May the verbal gymnastics continue...

plaetton: @greatgenius
Why don't you open a separate thread so we can continue with this particular line line of discussion.

On this thread, I want focus on my theme of proving that faith is actually extreme doubt.

aManFromMars:

Logicboy03:
God who knows everything but gives
freewill can not (exist)

truthislight: Yeah ! Talking about 'freewill'



(Jeremiah 18:7-10).

"At the instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to pluck it up, and to pull it down, and to destroy it; If that nation, against whom I have pronounced, turn from their evil, I will repent of the evil that I thought to do unto them.
And at the instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to build it and to plant it; If it do evil in my sight, that it obey not my voice, then I will repent of the good, wherewith I said I would benefit them." (Jeremiah 18:7-10).
.............

Dose not ones actions count ?

Logicboy03:


Your problem is that you are theologically/scripturally mature but not philosophically mature.


Quoting scripture does not. solve the contradiction between omniscience and freewill

truthislight:

you lost me there ^.

Is the word Omniscience in the bible ?

Mr Troll: is your god omniscient or not?

truthislight:

The bible is my guide.

If the word is not in the bible, am not interested in words humans coin and gives definition they like.

Peace

Logicboy03:



Mr. Troll......you must clap for this guy’s evasive tactics! Are you trolling or what?

Doesnt your bible say that God knows everything?

truthislight:

What has that ^ to do with "freewill" ?

aManFromMars: 1 JOhn 3:20
If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything

Logicboy03:


If your future is already known, then you have no freewill. You are just on the path that God chose