ghettogospel:

i thought your kinsmen say y'all lot live only in lagos. What are you doing ibadan why not go back to your erosion ridden hellhole. Thanks i don't eat that fermented civil war induce rubbish y'all mistake for food.

I came to do charity work, too many poor people in IB.

gurnam:

Guy ...stop exposing profound ignorance here...you've done enough of that here all day!

Waiver to pay duty given by the Fed Ministry of Finance exempts coy from paying duties on imported goods that already have a tariff bar.

It's been bastardized in Nigeria because of its indiscriminate use for political patronage...


If you don't know something ...ask questions or keep quiet.

Look to import and get a waiver for a particular purpose and then use it for another is criminal.

For example, if I import a cloth as a gift for my mother and then go ahead to sell same cloth, that is criminal on its own.

ballabriggs:

I'm based in England.

lol nothing person no see for the NL

dontjealousme: See wat traders are suffering at the hands of Fashola in Ladipo Market Lagos. Just so he can go and buy 9 Armoured Vehicles.

Fashola, Tinubu and his Iyaloja and Babaloja armed robbers children have blood on their hands.

Stick to topic and stop trolling...you are clearly breaching NL rule #1.... That can easily earn you a week ban.

ballabriggs:

Look to import and get a waiver for a particular purpose and then use it for another is criminal.

For example, if I import a cloth as a gift for my mother and then go ahead to sell same cloth, that is criminal on its own.

Absolutely....that is criminal intent...

gurnam:

Stick to topic and stop trolling...you are clearly breaching NL rule #1.... That can easily earn you a week ban.

Wat is dat? My friend shut up the cat is out. Nothing is hidden under the sun or are u a learner?

We now know who the armed robbers are? Theif.

KenGali:

At the beginning of this controversy, people like you took a lot of pain to explain and prove that NCAA was an Agency independent of the Minister, and as such the minister must not dictate to them. Especially since the DG is appointed by the President.

Your Question 1, 2 and 3 are premised on your forgetting this fact. The Minister of Aviation has administrative authority over the NCAA, but she is not responsible for managing nor keeping the budget of NCAA. I believe the Aviation Ministry has its own Budget and keeps it, why is it not the subject of this controversy?

The minister has the duty of approving the purchase of cars as a necessity to the unit, whether it is within or outside the budget of NCAA. What she approved is the administrative decision to buy the cars. The procedure for their procurement is the responsibility of the DG of NCAA. Means the DG of NCAA has the responsibility of complying with his own budget or the requirements of his tenders board, or any other procedure for extra budgetary appropriation.

Last we checked, the cars are not registered under Oduah or the Ministry of Aviation. Their is absolutely no case against the Aviation Minister.

As for your grouse with Mr Maduka. He is a business man. He will not throw away post supplied waivers for cars he has already delivered. He will recover the tax he paid by using the waivers for other vehicle imports.
Their is no law that says you cannot sell a car you imported to another person because you paid the import duty in your name.
Rather the question is that NCAA needed to apply to NSA for approval for the armoured vehicle.

1. There's no point discussing Maduka, available evidence is good enough to call him a shady business man and even a thief. He needs to be sanctioned and his business fined heavily as a deterrent to others. You can only advise him to get a good lawyer.

2.What I argued for or not is not the issue. The type of authority-moral, administrative, whatever- Stella exercises over NCAA does not change the facts of this case. Ask yourself these questions:
(a) Why did NCAA seek approval of Stella Oduah to execute the deal? Can Stella give what she doesn't have?
(b) Would NCAA have executed the deal without Stella approval?
(c) What's the point of questioning Stella if she does not have authority over NCAA?

gurnam:

Guy ...stop exposing profound ignorance here...you've done enough of that here all day!

Waiver to pay duty given by the Fed Ministry of Finance exempts coy from paying duties on imported goods that already have a tariff bar.

It's been bastardized in Nigeria because of its indiscriminate use for political patronage...


If you don't know something ...ask questions or keep quiet.

Why are you obfuscating the discussion.
The simple thing is that waivers were granted for products to be supplied to government by government.
The supplier supplied products already in his stock, on which he must have paid tax to clear
Subsequently he used the waivers in the process of replenishing his stock
Then sold the newly stocked product to a new client.

End of story, your political talk does not come into the room.

Prof Corruption:

1. There's no point discussing Maduka, available evidence is good enough to call him a shady business man and even a thief. He needs to be sanctioned and his business fined heavily as a deterrent to others. You can only advise him to get a good lawyer.

2.What I argued for or not is not the issue. The type of authority-moral, administrative, whatever- Stella exercises over NCAA does not change the facts of this case. Ask yourself these questions:
(a) Why did NCAA seek approval of Stella Oduah to execute the deal? Can Stella give what she doesn't have?
(b) Would NCAA have executed the deal without Stella approval?
(c) What's the point of questioning Stella if she does not have authority over NCAA?

#GBAM

1. what type of operational car is armoured vehicle to NCAA.

2. Are they min of foreign affairs that they are receivimg foreign dignitaries. If they are fron ICAO, IATA etc, must we convey them in the most expensive (apart from the fact that the price is dubious and fraudulent) car possible.

3. Why cant the Min of Aviation ask this fundamental questions when the approval was being sought.

if to her 255mm is not too much for 2 cars that will majorly be parked idle, if it was not intended for stella as the e-suppoerters are claiming, is that a sound judgement from a public officer holder of her status?

gurnam:

Absolutely....that is criminal intent...

I honestly think Nigeria must amend its tax laws to stop such abuses.

If you get a waiver to import for a specific purpose, then that asset must be used for a certain number of years or scrapped by you for the waiver to apply. Where you go ahead to sell same asset within a short period of time and make a gain on it, then the appropriate import duty as well as the capital gains tax must be paid on that asset.

What we see in this whole import regime is a sham. People cheating the system.

KenGali:
Why are you obfuscating the discussion.
The simple thing is that waivers were granted for products to be supplied to government by government.
The supplier supplied products already in his stock, on which he must have paid tax to clear
Subsequently he used the waivers in the process of replenishing his stock
Then sold the newly stocked product to a new client.

End of story, your political talk does not come into the room.

That's a Lie Sir,Coscharis was give the Waiver to import a number of Vehicles for a specific Purpose,those two armored Vehicles were not included under the Waiver,he Fraudulently included those two Vehicles among the ones that had legitimate Tax Cover.

Food for thought;if it was all as easy and straightforward as you explained above;why didnt he just tell the Reps that?

Prof Corruption:

1. There's no point discussing Maduka, available evidence is good enough to call him a shady business man and even a thief. He needs to be sanctioned and his business fined heavily as a deterrent to others. You can only advise him to get a good lawyer.

2.What I argued for or not is not the issue. The type of authority-moral, administrative, whatever- Stella exercises over NCAA does not change the facts of this case. Ask yourself these questions:
(a) Why did NCAA seek approval of Stella Oduah to execute the deal? Can Stella give what she doesn't have?
(b) Would NCAA have executed the deal without Stella approval?
(c) What's the point of questioning Stella if she does not have authority over NCAA?

Lets play with your logic?
a. Can NCAA ask her for something she does not have?

b. NCAA cannot execute the administrative decision without Stella's Approval, however the procedure of transaction has nothing to do with Stella. Stell does not sit on NCAA tenders board, nor does she recieve their report. The Director of NCAA does.

c.That is like going contrary to the facts your people established at the onset, that NCAA is an Agency, not a department of Ministry of Aviation. The DG is whole responsible for his procedures, Administrative decisions need be passed through the Ministry of Aviation, Hence the Minister.
If these where not so, the house committee will not accept that NCAA rather than Oduah should make statements about the Budget.

You can also note that in all this media Hype the Minister has been careful not to make any statements about the Busdget, since it is not her keep. It is only the DG of NCAA that implements his own budget.

ballabriggs:

Look to import and get a waiver for a particular purpose and then use it for another is criminal.

For example, if I import a cloth as a gift for my mother and then go ahead to sell same cloth, that is criminal on its own.

How is that a criminal act pls? I wonder how you NIGERIANS reason.

koonbey:

That's a Lie Sir,Coscharis was give the Waiver to import a number of Vehicles for a specific Purpose,those two armored Vehicles were not included under the Waiver,he Fraudulently included those two Vehicles among the ones that had legitimate Tax Cover.

Food for thought;if it was all as easy and straightforward as you explained above;why didnt he just tell the Reps that?

Maybe you should go read his statements to the committee yesterday, then comeback and make your argument about lies or truth

KenGali:

Maybe you should go read his statements to the committee yesterday, then comeback and make your argument about lies or truth

I read it,and what I have posted above is what any rational,objective and honest Person will make of it. Thank you.

koonbey: I read it,and what I have posted above is what any rational,objective and honest Person will make of it. Thank you.

15:45
"The cars inspected by the House committee yesterday, Tuesday, are different from the ones stated in the documents between NCAA and Coscharis, the reps said. Lawmakers say they saw cars with different chassis number from those on the communication between NCAA and Coscharis." But Coscharis said since it did not inspect the cars with the House members, it cannot say whether that was the car delivered to NCAA. The firm insists it has done no wrong.

15:31

"Coscharis admits telling Ministry of Finance/NSA the cars were meant for Lagos state government, but said the arrangement was a usual "sponsor practice" for an event like the sports festival, and there was nothing wrong with that. The company insists it did not lie. It said during the events the company gives cars for use by government, in exchange for waivers that would be used for importing new ones as replacement.

With a lot of gusto, Coscharis said it price was right. But lawmakers have busted that claim by revealing that the firm sent different prices to NCAA and NSA. Coscharis also claims the car in question goes for N87.7million(factory price) without tax, shipping etc. But a lawmaker has confirmed that he received a quotation from an American firm for the same car for about N42million. Jerry Manwe(a member): "Your own bullet proof is not manufactured in the moon"
, Coscharis says a seven series in America is different with what they got from Europe."
https://www.nairaland.com/1498215/stella-oduah-armoured-car-scandal#19188976

Well Sir, I do not think you fall into the category of Rational, Objective and Honest. So I give you the bolded in the reported proceedings to help you.

KenGali:
Lets play with your logic?
a. Can NCAA ask her for something she does not have?

They asked because her approval was needed to execute the deal. That's straight forward, isn't it?

KenGali:
b. NCAA cannot execute the administrative decision without Stella's Approval, however the procedure of transaction has nothing to do with Stella. Stell does not sit on NCAA tenders board, nor does she recieve their report. The Director of NCAA does.

[img]https://www.nairaland.com/avatars/248947[/img]

Do you know the meaning of approval? How can you approve what you can't control? If a decision can be taken without your approval, you have no business approving such a decision.

KenGali:
c.That is like going contrary to the facts your people established at the onset, that NCAA is an Agency, not a department of Ministry of Aviation. The DG is whole responsible for his procedures, Administrative decisions need be passed through the Ministry of Aviation, Hence the Minister.
If these where not so, the house committee will not accept that NCAA rather than Oduah should make statements about the Budget.
You can also note that in all this media Hype the Minister has been careful not to make any statements about the Busdget, since it is not her keep. It is only the DG of NCAA that implements his own budget.

This is a pure joke.

lacidi:
Are you actuallying following this whole saga? Did you take time to read what the NCAA boss said about the dignitaries? Did you see where he mentioned the agencies that the dignitares represent? Did you not see that the list was all Airpace/airport inspection and accreditiation agencies. How does that then concern foreign afffairs ministry?

Na wa. The urge to find Oduah guilty has really made people to lose the ability for objective arguement.

^^^

Gbam


She's innocent, until proven guilty.




.

One of such probes to decieve poor masses.

dontjealousme: See wat traders are suffering at the hands of Fashola in Ladipo Market Lagos. Just so he can go and buy 9 Armoured Vehicles.

Fashola, Tinubu and his Iyaloja and Babaloja armed robbers children have blood on their hands.

www.vanguardngr.com/2013/09/my-ordeal-in-prison-says-okoli-ladipo-market-leader/

dis one funny o . see as you are disgracing your people all in the name of winning a silly e-war.

5:45
"The cars inspected by the House committee yesterday, Tuesday, are different from the ones stated in the documents between NCAA and Coscharis, the reps said. Lawmakers say they saw cars with different chassis number from those on the communication between NCAA and Coscharis." But Coscharis said since it did not inspect the cars with the House members, it cannot say whether that was the car delivered to NCAA. The firm insists it has done no wrong.

15:31

"Coscharis admits telling Ministry of Finance/NSA the cars were meant for Lagos state government, but said the arrangement was a usual "sponsor practice" for an event like the sports festival, and there was nothing wrong with that. The company insists it did not lie. It said during the events the company gives cars for use by government, in exchange for waivers that would be used for importing new ones as replacement.

He declared that the Cars were meant for the LASG,and then went ahead to deliver them to NCAA,is it he NCAA that organised the Event?is the NCAA in need of Sponsors? and in any case,in Situations like that,the Cars the Waivers are used to import are Cars of Similar Value,you cannot get a Waiver for Goods worth 3Million Naira,and use it to import Goods valued at 125Million Naira.

The Customs representatives at the hearing said Coscharis lied to the Ministry of Finance and NSA, making them to believe that the cars were for Lagos state government, for the National Sports festival.

The NSA office issued End User certificate without knowing that it was doing so for cars to be delivered to Stella Oduah or the NCAA.

Coscharis imported the cars without paying import duties since there was a waiver from the ministry of finance.
Coscharis obtained the waiver claiming the armoured cars were part of 300 vehicles imported for the Sports festival in Lagos last year, and therefore the beneficiary was Lagos state government.

The due import duty should have been N10.1 million.

The cars had an End User Certificate from the NSA office in the name of Coscharis.

The waiver obtained by Coscharis was for one year; as such the time of importation this year was covered.

Customs admit its laws requires that it enforces duty on any item for which waiver was obtained, which was not used for the purpose stated-in this case, for Sports festival.

Car dealers as well as end users of armoured cars are mandated to seek authorization from the office of the National Security Adviser, NSA, before ordering or importing such vehicles into Nigeria.

Last week, reliable sources at the office of the NSA told PREMIUM TIMES no authorization certificate was ever issued to either Minister Oduah or the Nigerian Civil Aviation Authority, NCAA, to procure the controversial vehicles.

Ve ben speachless ova dis issue but 1 tin is sure... D minister(as wel as evry oda person) is remains innocent until proven guilty by law... God bless 9ja

Oduah stays,


Punch, Sahara Reporters, etc, and all those sponsoring the propaganda to rubbish Nigerian best performing aviation minister, should start mourning.








.

koonbey:

He declared that the Cars were meant for the LASG,and then went ahead to deliver them to NCAA,is it he NCAA that organised the Event?is the NCAA in need of Sponsors? and in any case,in Situations like that,the Cars the Waivers are used to import are Cars of Similar Value,you cannot get a Waiver for Goods worth 3Million Naira,and use it to import Goods valued at 125Million Naira.

I am sure your are aware that waivers have values and are not just blank cheques, so cannot be used beyond their value.
You are quoting and reading the statements of one party without referencing what Coscharis himself provided. Obviously your are not being Objective as you initially insinuated. Again, that I imported a car and paid duties in my name does not in anyway stop me from selling it to someone else. That is what most people do when they sell their cars for second hand use. Stop trying to be floating of the reality.

The lawmakers insisted that the cars was not brand new.Though, Maduka tried to explain that the high mileage recorded in the vehicle could have been the result of usage by NCAA, the agency denied ever using the car since it was delivered.

5:45
"The cars inspected by the House committee yesterday, Tuesday, are different from the ones stated in the documents between NCAA and Coscharis, the reps said. Lawmakers say they saw cars with different chassis number from those on the communication between NCAA and Coscharis." But Coscharis said since it did not inspect the cars with the House members, it cannot say whether that was the car delivered to NCAA. The firm insists it has done no wrong.

Please give me a reasonable Explanation for this;why the Discrepancy between he declared Chassis Number and the one found on the Cars inspected by the Reps,and why the High Mileage? since Coscharis's Price Claims are grounded on the Assumption that said Cars are brand New??

This a few Days after a Spokesman for the Minister declared that the Story about the Cars was all "Hogwash"??and after Newspaper Reports that the Cars were nowhere to be found?

It all makes me think that the Plan in fact;was to (mis)Appropriate the Money without delivering any Cars(There was no Registration,End User Certificate or similar Documents,in fact;the only Documents available are Financial related),and that the Vehicles inspected by the Reps was just a hurried Plant by Coscharis(How does a brand new,never driven Car have a high Mileage??) to deceive the Reps.

This is me being Rational,objective and Honest...if you lack any of these;please don't quote me.

koonbey:



Please give me a reasonable Explanation for this;why the Discrepancy between he declared Chassis Number and the one found on the Cars inspected by the Reps,and why the High Mileage? since Coscharis's Price Claims are grounded on the Assumption that said Cars are brand New??

This a few Days after a Spokesman for the Minister declared that the Story about the Cars was all "Hogwash"??and after Newspaper Reports that the Cars were nowhere to be found?

It all makes me think that the Plan in fact;was to (mis)Appropriate the Money without delivering any Cars(There was no Registration,End User Certificate or similar Documents,in fact;the only Documents available are Financial related),and that the Vehicles inspected by the Reps was just a hurried Plant by Coscharis(How does a brand new,never driven Car have a high Mileage??) to deceive the Reps.

This is me being Rational,objective and Honest...if you lack any of these;please don't quote me.

When you are done with the issue of tax waiver, we can advance to Chasis number, for now let us finish the discussion you started by calling me a liar.
If you are now satisfied that you poorly understood the transcripts, let me know clearly and we can proceed. But not before establishing that you clearing do not have the capacity to understand some discussions.

amarilo: Why is this thread moving slowly? Correct answer will get a 1000 naira recharge card.

^^^


All the propagandists asking for the woman's head, are fully disappointed.


Please use the card for me, I don't need it.





.

Follow Kengali's logic and you can easily decipher a mental block.

Kengali need to answer the question posed about approval. If not needed why was it sought and why was it given?

KenGali:
I am sure your are aware that waivers have values and are not just blank cheques, so cannot be used beyond their value.
You are quoting and reading the statements of one party without referencing what Coscharis himself provided. Obviously your are not being Objective as you initially insinuated. Again, that I imported a car and paid duties in my name does not in anyway stop me from selling it to someone else. That is what most people do when they sell their cars for second hand use. Stop trying to be floating of the reality.

Stop being diversionary,Is this all you got from my Post above,I deliberately included other Actions Coscharis took which are Criminal,but you chose to ignore them...no problem.

@the Bolded;if you knew a little more about the National Finance,you'd know that;

1.you cannot apply for and get a Waiver to import a Car,and then use said Waiver to import a Tank;which is about the Difference between a "Car" as you put it and the level B7 Cars Coscharis Imported. If you go through the Customs Official's Testimony,you'd see that he as much as called Maduka a Liar;he mis-declared what he intended to Import,if he had,the Payable Customs Duties would have been 10 Million Naira.

2.Waivers,like Tax Umbrellas,are given to very Specific People,for very specific Purposes;You cannot acquire a Tax Umbrella for a Factory Producing Computers,and suddenly sell to someone who plans to produce TVs,and expect the Tax Umbrella to still be respected(correct me if I'm wrong)... Coscharis got that Waiver on the Guise of they being Part of a Lagos State Government Event,then received them and sold them to another Entity entirely,or are you telling me he didn't know whom exactly he planned to deliver them to,even before Payment,that he Imported them on the Off chance of finding a ready Buyer...maybe he even planned to advertise them in Nairaland's Auto Section (Just Landed!!Lot of Two BMW B7 level Armored Vehicles available in Lagos at Giveaway Price...asking 255Million...call 080419419419 ..eh?..

KenGali:
When you are done with the issue of tax waiver, we can advance to Chasis number, for now let us finish the discussion you started by calling me a liar.
If you are now satisfied that you poorly understood the transcripts, let me know clearly and we can proceed. But not before establishing that you clearing do not have the capacity to understand some discussions.

I'll ignore this.

koonbey:

Stop being diversionary,Is this all you got from my Post above,I deliberately included other Actions Coscharis took which are Criminal,but you chose to ignore them...no problem.

@the Bolded;if you knew a little more about the National Finance,you'd know that;

1.you cannot apply for and get a Waiver to import a Car,and then use said Waiver to import a Tank;which is about the Difference between a "Car" as you put it and the level B7 Cars Coscharis Imported. If you go through the Customs Official's Testimony,you'd see that he as much as called Maduka a Liar;he mis-declared what he intended to Import,if he had,the Payable Customs Duties would have been 10 Million Naira.

2.Waivers,like Tax Umbrellas,are given to very Specific People,for very specific Purposes;You cannot acquire a Tax Umbrella for a Factory Producing Computers,and suddenly sell to someone who plans to produce TVs,and expect the Tax Umbrella to still be respected(correct me if I'm wrong)... Coscharis got that Waiver on the Guise of they being Part of a Lagos State Government Event,then received them and sold them to another Entity entirely,or are you telling me he didn't know whom exactly he planned to deliver them to,even before Payment,that he Imported them on the Off chance of finding a ready Buyer...maybe he even planned to advertise them in Nairaland's Auto Section (Just Landed!!Lot of Two BMW B7 level Armored Vehicles available in Lagos at Giveaway Price...asking 255Million...call 080419419419 ..eh?..

you even have their time. they know the truth, but they have to work for the money they were paid for. simple. spare yourself the explanation.