[/quote]The final verse destroys the teaching that all souls in hades/sheol/purgatorium (hell or purgatory) are heaven bound. The bible opposes that, it shows that after judging them, all that are not found worthy (in the book of life) will be cast into the lake of fire [quote]

WHERE DID THAT VERSE MENTION PURGATORY? YOU DON START TO ADD TO THE BIBLE.PURGATORY IS ONLY MENTIONED AS PRISON IN 1 PET 3:19-21.IT WAS NOT THE SAME THING WITH HELL/HADES

[/quote] ... YOU BELIEVE IN HEAVEN, PURGATORY, AND HELL? WHICH ONE DO YOU AIM TOWARDS, LIKE ONE GUY SAID About NOAH PPL BEING IN PURGATORY EVEN AT THE TIME OF JESUS. WHAT IF YOU CONTINUE IN WHITE LIES AND IT LAND YOU INTO SUFFERINGS OF PURGATORY OR WORST STILL AND YOU FIND OUT THAT IT DOES NOT EXIST?[quote]

AT IF YOU DIE IN VENIAL SINS AN FIND OUT THAT PURGATORY EXISTS,WILL YOU OFFER TO GO TO PURGATORY?

italo:

Why then are you unsure of the case I asked you?

A saint who tells a white lie once, then dies immediately.

Why are you unsure of this "saint's" faith?

What happens to such a person?

I do not know the heart condition. ok lets assume he wasnt frequently practicing such act. but had no time to pray for forgiveness, he is going to heaven na. God knows that he frequently asks for forgiveness, but cant do so now cos there was no time.

Note that God declare them righteous though they are sinners. God wouldnt approve someone who takes His undeserved kindness as a certificate to go on sinning. however, it doesnt mean that we have the credential in terms of righteousness to be in heaven cos we are imperfect in body. It is just a grace from God.

chukwudi44:
WHERE DID THAT VERSE MENTION PURGATORY? YOU DON START TO ADD TO THE BIBLE.PURGATORY IS ONLY MENTIONED AS PRISON IN 1 PET 3:19-21.IT WAS NOT THE SAME THING WITH HELL/HADES

I didnt see purgatory there sir.

JMAN05:

I didnt see purgatory there sir.

chukwudi44:
WHERE DID THAT VERSE MENTION PURGATORY? YOU DON START TO ADD TO THE BIBLE.PURGATORY IS ONLY MENTIONED AS PRISON IN 1 PET 3:19-21.IT WAS NOT THE SAME THING WITH HELL/HADES

I SAID PRISON DUDE.I ALSO DID NOT SEE BIBLE IN THE BIBLE

chukwudi44:



I SAID PRISON DUDE.I ALSO DID NOT SEE BIBLE IN THE BIBLE

ok. let me get you. is it the unrighteous that are kept in purgatory?

bible is in the bible.

italo:

Which is it? The passage is about judgement only, judgement and its aftermath or you dont know?

This is the 2nd time I'm asking.

How many will I answer this?
I have answered this before. It talks about Judgment and the reward that comes with it!

The reward is not specified again, as I said!

italo:
Because I see no other reward for saints worth mentioning besides heaven.

That's why you and the catholic church say its heaven, right?

What if the reward is the reign with Christ for 1000 years?

Then you and the catholic church are utterly wrong besides, the reward of heaven does not come until after general judgment of rev 20:13.


You and the catholic church need to learn not to conclude on uncertain things or you make yourselves false teachers if you conclude wrongly.

italo:
This cannot be the reason you ascert that they hadn't been judged. I ask again: give me your reason.

Sincerely, that's the reason. Revelation 20 states clearly that those in hades will be judged in the second judgment and makes no implication that they are judged in the first.

italo:
If Jesus didn't state whether or not they were judged why are you so sure they weren't? Mr Bible alone..or are you appealing to tradition not in the Bible? [/b]

The reason above applies.
I don't imply conclusions from uncertain issues.

italo:

Can you provide evidence that all dead people go to hades/sheol/purgatory?

Including Elijah and Enoch?

How ignorant can you be!

You make a mockery of yourself with that question.
In your own bible, is stated that those men you mentioned died?

italo:
Clap! Clap!! Clap!!! Brilliant!

OLODO!

Kumuyi that showed you Rev 20:13-15 refused to show you that there was already the 1st Judgement in verses 4 & 5 of the same chapter. He didnt show you because it would corroborate Catholic teaching on purgatory after Particular Judgement and before General judgement.

To yourself and fellow catholic brothers, you av made a point right??

Hope you don't mind showing me where that passage says they will be casted to hades after the first judgment....truth twister!

Keep embarrassing yourself in a public forum.

italo:
OLODO! If only Kumuyi had shown you the 1st Judgement! Poor you.

The Catholic Church teaches that souls in purgatory are heaven bound, meaning they are in the book of life.

and thats contrary to the bible teaching that they will be judged and casted into the lake of fire if found unworthy!

By the way, is it you or the catholic church that put the names of the souls in hades in the book of life?- truth twister!

italo:
Now I hope you have been able to prove to yourself that that your hades/sheol/purgatory exists after the 1st Judgement, exactly as is taught by the Catholic Church.

That's contrary to bible teaching!!
Prove from that passage that they are sent to purgatory!

Or can't you prove it from that passage?

I know you won't like to see light....as you've been fed with all these dogmas from childhood, accepting truths Is one of the hardest things for you cos
believe in what the catholic church teach as the truth and you don't study.

italo:
Note: I will only answer any further questions if/when i like if you answer the bold and my other questions.

Hope your questions have been answered, for the evidence that dead people go to hades, it will be revealed as we unravel, truths will unfold to you.

italo:

So he should remove the 1st 6 from our common beliefs with the Orthodox when they have been our common beliefs from the days of the Apostles...millenia before you punks and fraudsters popped up?

Alright, let him leave them there.

italo:
OLODO!

They agree that Pope Francis is the direct successor of St. Peter who was bishop of Rome. And we both believe in the apostolic succession of each other.

Don't you know they have their own bishops (popes) as you may call them that they believe is equal to Francis
and is fallible.

I should not be the one to teach you this.
Educate yourself!

italo:
Stop being dubious. If he starts to list all Catholic Doctrines that they agree with, do you know how many it will be?

....So, why did he stop listing?
Is scared to expose your erroneous doctrines that were not practiced by the apostles?

Don't be scared, list them.
We already all know you practice things not practised by the apostles.

chukwudi44:

THE FACT IS THAT THE ORTHODOX CHURCH ARE EQUALLY "GUILTY" OF 99.99% OF THE "SINS" YOU PROTESTANTS ACCUSE THE CATHOLIC CHURCH OF

That's not my business.

You have not listed 99.99999% same doctrines you claim you have.

chukwudi44: By the way, is that 99.9999% of like doctrines?......I urge you to go on listing

HYPOCRITE WHY DID YOU RUN AWAY FROM LISTING THEIR "NUMEROUS" DIFFERENCES

How many doctrines are there??
The ones I listed are major ones.
They are sufficient to be tagged 'numerous' but the little you listed is not yet 99.99999% as you claim.

Besides, I referred you to Enigma if you wanted more (he has a lot more) and to be educated about these things because that's not what I'm here for.

chukwudi44:
WHERE DID THAT VERSE MENTION PURGATORY? YOU DON START TO ADD TO THE BIBLE.PURGATORY IS ONLY MENTIONED AS PRISON IN 1 PET 3:19-21.IT WAS NOT THE SAME THING WITH HELL/HADES

You see....

Italo, can you 'see' your brother saying hades/sheol is not purgatorium (purgatory).

It shows he hasn't learned and he talks before he learns.
Educate him pls.

Hades is not translated purgatory, its rather translated hell.

What's translated purgatory is the latin word 'purgatorium' which is also Hades. (I guess there's no other greek word that is closer)

adsonstone:


How many doctrines are there??
The ones I listed are major ones.
They are sufficient to be tagged 'numerous' but the little you listed is not yet 99.99999% as you claim.

Besides, I referred you to Enigma if you wanted more (he has a lot more) and to be educated about these things because that's not what I'm here for.

They are just using all of that as diversionary tactics --- and of course introducing more lies or subtly misleading statements. They are just unable to avoid being fraudulent; the thing is simply an integral part of Roman Catholicism as they need it because they cannot stand or abide the truth.

In fact, I like my main example: Jesus says, "I am the Way" and "No one comes to the Father except through me"

Roman Catholicism says, "No one can be saved except s/he submits to the Roman Catholic 'pope'"?

Do you really think that any honest Christian can defend that --- especially without resort to some fraud (and specifically to the fraud of twisting the Bible)?

Oh by the way why don't we throw in one more thing that the Eastern Orthodox do not agree with the Roman Catholic denomination people about? ------------- "Original Sin"!

Let us imagine that instead of lying once, she blew up an airplane full of passenger once.

Will she go to heaven straight still...

JMAN05:

I do not know the heart condition. ok lets assume he wasnt frequently practicing such act. but had no time to pray for forgiveness, he is going to heaven na. God knows that he frequently asks for forgiveness, but cant do so now cos there was no time.

Note that God declare them righteous though they are sinners. God wouldnt approve someone who takes His undeserved kindness as a certificate to go on sinning. however, it doesnt mean that we have the credential in terms of righteousness to be in heaven cos we are imperfect in body. It is just a grace from God.

adsonstone:

That's not my business.

You have not listed 99.99999% same doctrines you claim you have.

At least I have listed longer similarities than your own list of differences.if I even decide to list the similarities between RCC and depper life I can even get 99% let alone the orthodox church.You do not even know what you are saying.

BTW do not refer me to trolls,I do not argue with them

JMAN05:

ok. let me get you. is it the unrighteous that are kept in purgatory?

bible is in the bible.

Yes of course.Unrighteousness that does not lead to death (1 John 5:16-17)

Hope you don't mind telling me where the word bible is mentioned in the bible.

adsonstone:

How many will I answer this?
I have answered thisbefore. It talks about Judgment and the reward that comes with it!

The reward is not specified again, as I said!

Are you maintaining that the passage didnt talk about the aftermath of judgement or not?

adsonstone:

That's why you and the catholic church say its heaven, right?

What if the reward is the reign with Christ for 1000 years?

Then you and the catholic church are utterly wrong besides, the reward of heaven does not come until after general judgment of rev 20:13.

And who says the 1000 year reign after particular judgement isn't in heaven?

adsonstone:


Sincerely, that's the reason. Revelation 20 states clearly that those in hades will be judged in the second judgment and makes no implication that they are judged in the first.

The reason above applies.
I don't imply conclusions from uncertain issues.

You say the passage doesn't say those in hades were in the first judgement...and it doesn't say they weren't. Why then do you ascert that they weren't? Haven't you implied conclusion from uncertainty? Or are you appealing to tradition?

5 - The rest of the dead lived not, till the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

13 - And the sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and hell gave up their dead that were in them; and they were judged every one according to their works.

Aren't "the dead in death and hell" in v8 part of the "REST of the dead that lived not" after their particular judgement in v5?

I hope you know what "the rest" means.

adsonstone:


How ignorant can you be!

You make a mockery of yourself with that question.
In your own bible, is stated that those men you mentioned died?

There are souls that never pass hades/sheol to heaven. No?

adsonstone:


To yourself and fellow catholic brothers, you av made a point right??

Hope you don't mind showing me where that passage says they will be casted to hades after the first judgment....truth twister!

Aww...poor you. Olodo! Verses 5 & 13 tell that story.

adsonstone:


and thats contrary to the bible teaching that they will be judged and casted into the lake of fire if found unworthy!

By the way, is it you or the catholic church that put the names of the souls in hades in the book of life?- truth twister!

Its not contrary. Some will be found worthy who werent among the ones who had being reigning with Christ all along: the souls in purgatory!

adsonstone:


That's contrary to bible teaching!!
Prove from that passage that they are sent to purgatory!

Or can't you prove it from that passage?

Again: verses 5 & 13.
.

adsonstone:

Don't you know they have their own bishops (popes) as you may call them that they believe is equal to Francis
and is fallible.

You were wrong when you said they dont see Pope Francis as successor of Peter.

Even that is too much to admit?

The person wey swear for you to dey lie don die?

italo:


You were wrong when you said they dont see Pope Francis as successor of Peter.

Even that is too much to admit?

The person wey swear for you to dey lie don die?

The bold is a lie. I never said that they dont see him as peter's successor, I mentioned that they have theirs who they also believe to be Peter's direct successor.
.....and if thats true, who exactly is the true successor?
Theirs or yours?

italo:

Are you maintaining that the passage didnt talk about the aftermath of judgement or not?

I've told you my position on that.

italo:
And who says the 1000 year reign after particular judgement isn't in heaven?

....and who says it is definitely Heaven?
Hope you dont mind showing me.

italo:
You say the passage doesn't say those in hades were in the first judgement...and it doesn't say they weren't. Why then do you ascert that they weren't? Haven't you implied conclusion from uncertainty? Or are you appealing to tradition?

5 - The rest of the dead lived not, till the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

13 - And the sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and hell gave up their dead that were in them; and they were judged every one according to their works.

Aren't "the dead in death and hell" in v8 part of the "REST of the dead that lived not" after their particular judgement in v5?

I asserted that they have not been judged because I know they cant be judged twice, one that will make them suffer and another that will take them to glory.
I hope you know what "the rest" means.

Besides, read the bolded verse. It said 'they lived not'. It is a fact that they had to live(resurrect) to be judged and to live after judgement.

Hope thats been cleared.

italo:
There are souls that never pass hades/sheol to heaven. No?

I agree.
Only souls of those that did not die.

italo:
Aww...poor you. Olodo! Verses 5 & 13 tell that story.

that has been cleared in my former post.
Its a certain implication, unlike the one you implied.

italo:
Its not contrary. Some will be found worthy who werent among the ones who had being reigning with Christ all along: the souls in purgatory!

By that, do you mean these?
1. All souls in hades= certainly heaven
2. Others in death and sea= heaven or hell

if thats what you mean, give a proof.

My position is: category 1 =heaven/hell and same with category 2.

italo:
Again: verses 5 & 13.
.

again, thats been cleared.

All what you have been saying, I'll still prove it all to be false. I'm just going through this discussion with you to show you that you're still making mistakes in these false things.

I pray you see light though, I know its not easy.
You'll rather stick to a wrong teaching than be embarassed or come out to accept that you were wrong.

chukwudi44:

At least I have listed longer similarities than your own list of differences.if I even decide to list the similarities between RCC and depper life I can even get 99% let alone the orthodox church.You do not even know what you are saying.

BTW do not refer me to trolls,I do not argue with them

put them side by side and judge for yourself if it is 99.9999:0.0001.
If it is not, you have made yourself a liar.

If I have reffered you to Enigma, I don't expect you to argue with him.
Just point it out if he says something wrong.

BTW, Of all the ones he has mentioned, you have not been able to refute any.....so what are you saying?

adsonstone:

The bold is a lie. I never said that they dont see him as peter's successor, I mentioned that they have theirs who they also believe to be Peter's direct successor.
.....and if thats true, who exactly is the true successor?
Theirs or yours?

Actually, the early "church fathers" (including even the ones that can be said to be Roman Catholic) generally believed that each and every bishop and which in fact extends to each and every priest as head of a congregation is a successor of Peter!

Read these parts of a wiki entry http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primacy_of_Simon_Peter#Eastern_Orthodox_view

and also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primacy_of_Simon_Peter#Keys_and_rock_not_exclusive_to_Peter

(Hopefully the Roman Catholic propagandists will not be allowed to completely manipulate and distort those parts; they are very active at Internet/Wikipedia propaganda, I tell ye!)

"In this traditional Orthodox and Patristic view, the Church is the local Eucharistic assembly ("the diocese" in today's terminology) and the one who holds the "Chair of Peter" (St. Cyprian's expression) is the bishop. As a result, the primacy of Peter is relevant to the relationship between the bishop and the presbyters, not between the bishop of Rome and the other bishops who are all equally holding Peter's chair."


"Consequently, Eastern and Oriental Orthodox do not recognize the Bishop of Rome as the unique successor of St. Peter and consider him to be in a state of schism and heresy. However, the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople sends a delegation each year to Rome to participate in the celebration of the feast of Sts. Peter and Paul.

The Orthodox also consider that St. Linus, not Peter, was actually the first Bishop of Rome."


If necessary we can quote from the "church fathers" themselves to show that they believed that all "bishops" are direct successors of Peter.

Enigma:

They are just using all of that as diversionary tactics --- and of course introducing more lies or subtly misleading statements. They are just unable to avoid being fraudulent; the thing is simply an integral part of Roman Catholicism as they need it because they cannot stand or abide the truth.

In fact, I like my main example: Jesus says, "I am the Way" and "No one comes to the Father except through me"

Roman Catholicism says, "No one can be saved except s/he submits to the Roman Catholic 'pope'"?

Do you really think that any honest Christian can defend that --- especially without resort to some fraud (and specifically to the fraud of twisting the Bible) ?

100% correct! especially the one in the brackets.

Thats what has been happening all this while.....different forms of twists and diversions.

You must have studied these people.

adsonstone:

100% correct! especially the one in the brackets.

Thats what has been happening all this while.....different forms of twists and diversions.

You must have studied these people.

My bros, I like to defend all Christian traditions and ordinarily I like to defend even Roman Catholics!

But how can I call myself a Christian and be defending clear fraud? Unfortunately, the Roman Catholics are perpetrating fraud and spreading LIES!

What is then worse they are using these lies and fraud to claim some "authority" or "primacy" in Christianity! Well, even if we want to leave them to be deceiving themselves with their lies and fraud, we cannot allow them to be smearing the rest of us!

adsonstone:

put them side by side and judge for yourself if it is 99.9999:0.0001.
If it is not, you have made yourself a liar.

If I have reffered you to Enigma, I don't expect you to argue with him.
Just point it out if he says something wrong.

BTW, Of all the ones he has mentioned, you have not been able to refute any.....so what are you saying?

Bros I already told you I don't debate with trolls so Bleep off if you ve got nothing to contribute

chukwudi44:

Bros I already told you I don't debate with trolls so Bleep off if you ve got nothing to contribute

truth dey pain you?..... pele.

^^^ You see am? Thank you oh!

chukwudi44:

Bros I already told you I don't debate with trolls so Bleep off if you ve got nothing to contribute

you again?
You know I've advised you (not once) to learn before you start ranting.

By the way, have you put my points side by side with yours and judged if its 99.9999:0.0001 as you claim?

If its not (even in your judgment), you are a liar.

Besides, I should stop replying or quoting you as you have shown yourself to be a liar and unwilling to own up but persist in the lies you have presented, again, the truth hurts you badly as Kingk rightly said.

adsonstone:

put them side by side and judge for yourself if it is 99.9999:0.0001.
If it is not, you have made yourself a liar.

chukwudi44:

Bros I already told you I don't debate with trolls so Bleep off if you ve got nothing to contribute

truth dey pain you?.....  pele.

Excerpts from my 1999 thesis on Mary and the Queen of Heaven culled from "The Mystery Babylonian Religion"

Historical research has proved that the belief in ancient Babylonian concept of ghosts informs present Roman Catholic teachings about strange appearances, apparitions and visions of Mary. This belief in ghost-saints originated from the ancient Babylon’s religious doctrine in Semiramis, the ‘Queen of Heaven’, who was said to be appearing in different locations and shapes.
Similar to the Catholic veneration of Mary is the Babylonian belief in Semiramis, wife and mother of Nimrod, who taught that living or dead, she was in control of peoples’ lives and could petition the Sun god on their behalf. This is also the origin of goddesses like Venus, Diana, Isis, Madonna and the rest.
It started from from ancient Babylonian origins in a certain Roman Cult of Isis, which worshipped a mother goddess with her infant son, Horus. Isis, they believed, played a prominent role as protector of the sailors at sea, and her image was carried as emblem of several Roman ships. It was the importation of this belief into the Church that prompted the imaging of the Mother Mary carrying her little vulnerable son in her arms. That is why Jesus is usually pictured as a boy in the arms of Mary.
The origin is in the story of Tammuz’s death, which resulted in great grief and sorrow to his mother. Variation of the story involving Semiramis and Tammuz later resulted in a story concerning Tammuz and Ishtar (another representation of Semiramis), who were said to be mother and son. Semiramis went into the world of the dead in pursuit of her son, Tammuz, who was killed by the god of Death, in order to bear him in her arms back, while the women of Babylonia mourned. This later became a religious practice and was highlighted in a heathen practice in the Hebrew Temple recorded and condemned in Ezekiel 8: 14.
Ancient Babylonians ascribed the period of disappearance of vegetation to that which the son of Semiramis descended into the under world after death. By weeping for Tammuz, the cult of Babylon believed that vegetation would be restored, as the god would appear once again from the land of the dead.
Other doctrines around the Queen of Heaven, which later were adopted to fit into the Roman Catholic concept of the Virgin Mary include dogmas of the immaculate conception, her sinless nature, her motherhood of the Church, eucharistic devotion and her assumption into the heavens. As history has it, these became Catholic practice because several places that were used in worship of the female deities before the declaration of Constantine in Rome were just converted into Christian worship. Examples of early churches that were directly converted from worship of Roman gods include Santa Maria Antiqua church in Rome and Santa Maria church in Aracodi built on the Capitol Hill where a celestial-virgin Carthaginian goddess, Tanit used to have her Temple. The Santa Maria Maggiore Church of Esquline was also built on the same site of the Temple of Cybele, who was regarded by the Romans as the mother of all the gods.
Veneration of the mother goddess imported from the Babylonian Cult was common in Roman religious cults at the time Constantine changed the religion of Rome to Christianity. There was also Juno, the Roman goddess, who they believed played the dual role of protecting pregnant women and guardian of cities and was referred to as ‘Our Lady’. Athena Polias was another goddess usually referred to by that title. These particular conceptions of female goddesses later came to represent the Virgin Mary after all Rome compulsorily became Christian with the mandatory edict of Constantine to convert all Romans to Christianity.
Worship of Mary is a rallying point for several religions because it is in consonance, not only with the Catholic/Roman/Babylonian origins, but also with several Oriental, Asian, Middle East, African and ancient European religious practices. Traces of this religion of Semiramis exist in religions of more than five billion out of the Earth's current population of over six billion. The Hindu religion, which has almost a billion adherents, venerates the goddess called Santhana-Lakshmi. The representation of this goddess is symbolism of a mother and child, just like the Roman Catholic depictions of Mary and the Boy Jesus. There are similar stories in Yoruba tradition of Olurombi and Moremi, whose sons were taken away to the world of the dead and who followed to bring them back.
The use of the rosary in Christianity which started in the 11th Century was systematically developed by St. Dominic in devotion to Mary as a substitute for Diana, for whose worship the stringed instrument of worship was initially used. It soon become widespread and took the form in which we now know it as comprising the recitation of prayer and meditation on ‘fifteen mysteries’. But the rosary is not unique to Catholics alone. Another type is used by the Ifa religion in the Yoruba speaking areas of West Africa. In a similar way by which it was absorbed into Catholic worship, practice of praying with beaded strings was also imported into some Latin American religious worship. History reveals that migrant slaves from West Africa to Brazil, Cuba and other Latin American countries took pagan beaded strings along with them for divination when they were sold off to work on the cotton and sugarcane fields of America. The Indians of America too earlier used a type of rosary in stringed bones for divination.
Worship or veneration of a Mother goddess was prominent in Israel at stages of their backslidding from true worship of Yaweh. When the high places built right inside the Temple in Bethel was excavated, archeologists found figurines of Ashteroth described as semi or totally nude female with a dull look on her face. The same types of figures and figurines are now used to depict the ‘Virgin Mary’ in statues or statuettes in the Catholic Church, only now with flowing robes, not nude, but the facial expression remains the same. Ashteroth was to the ancient Babylonian Cult what ‘Virgin Mary’ is to the Catholics. Both are none other than different representations of Semiramis. Regarded as female gender of God, the goddess, Ashteroth, was bowed down to, worshipped and prayed through as the ‘mother of God’ as is currently practiced in Roman Catholicism and other religions. Moslems too later on adopted the use of stringed beads for praying from these same origins.
Does it come as a surprise that Franciscan University, Steubenville, Ohio Professor, Mark Miravalle, who died in 2004 before realizing his dreams, was at the core of a revolutionary demand by several Catholics to enthrone the Virgin Mary as the third or fourth person in the Godhead? (If you don't believe, you can google www.fifthmariandogma.com/co-redemptrix-fifth-marian-dogma/you-must-petition-the-holy-father-for-this-dogma-2/). The professor solicited and received signed petitions asking late Pope John Paul II to exercise his absolute power to proclaim a new and highly debated Catholic dogma declaring their Mary as co-redeemer and partner in the order of Godhead with Jesus, the Father and Holy Spirit. The move, which started about 1997, generated more than 6 million signatures from Catholics from over 148 countries all over the world, including at least 600 Bishops, 42 Cardinals (current and deceased) and also from Mother Theresa before her demise. Many cardinals in the Vatican are also ardent supporters of the move.
It is not a completely new move. As far back as the 14th century, Catholics, including popes and cardinals, have touted the belief in Mary at par or even superior to Christ. New church dogmas surfaced to the effect that Mary did not taste corruption after death, but was physically transported to heaven body, soul and spirit and that she was born in a nature of immaculate conception and never was contaminated by Original Sin.
Many popes, including late John Paul II and Pope Benedict are staunch believers in the worship of Mary. Of course, as a Fransiscan priest, Pope Benedict also believes in the Marian doctrines. Over the Catholic faithful, popes are credited with the same powers that belong to Christ with absolute authority over the Church as the Vicar of Christ on Earth. It would, therefore, not be impossible for a pope to declare Mary as part of the Godhead.
Late Pope John Paul II was a staunch believer in the Virgin Mary, because he believed she delivered him from death through the bullet of Ali Agca, and the world from the scourge of Communism. He claimed every nation he visited, kissing the soil in consecration and worship to the “Blessed Mother”. He said that he visited Fatima, Portugal on May 13, 1983 to consecrate the whole world to the 'Immaculate Heart of Mary'.
The mysterious ancient Babylonian religion involved the worship of father, mother and son gods as represented by Nimrod, Semiramis and Tammuz. Declaration of Mary as part of the Godhead would therefore be a full reincarnation of the old Babylonian religion, revealing the Mystery Babylon of Revelation chapter 17.
We would notice that most of the statues and statuettes of the ‘Virgin Mary’ used in Catholic worship have this sad look. Even the apparitions seen of Mary have always worn the sad look, while in some others the ‘Virgin’ is seen shedding tears of blood. Why would Mary be so sad? After all, her Son has been resurrected and raised into glory and she is believed to have ascended to Heaven. The answer is simple; because the Virgin Mary of Catholics is not the real Mary, the mother of Jesus. The Catholic Mary is actually Semiramis, weeping for her son Tammuz; a creation of the Cult of Babel.
Many Catholic apologists who defend the Marian doctrines are unaware that even the Vatican II document admits that the worship of Mary is not a scriptural practice, but a tradition recommended by the church authorities as developed over the centuries. But the document yet backs the practice so vehemently that it teaches that it should be generously fostered. Similar to ancient Babylonian religion, the Catholic doctrine claims that Mary, being the mother of Jesus is even as important as, if not more important than Jesus Christ, Himself. It claims also that she is in Heaven making intercessions for people of the world, so Christians should pray through her.
But, is Mary Blessed? The Bible says, “And it came to pass, as He spoke these things, a certain woman of the company lifted up her voice, and said unto Him, Blessed is the womb that bare thee, and the paps which thou hast sucked. “But he said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the Word of God, and keep it”. Luke 11: 27 – 28 The angel called Mary blessed in Luke 1: 28, referring to her being favored among women as to be chosen to bear the Lord, called the Son of the Highest. Jesus replied to indicate that Mary remains blessed, only because she believed in the spiritual work of her Son and Lord, and accepted it. Mary was one of the disciples of Jesus. As the above scripture states, Mary is blessed. But if she had not believed in Christ, she would not have remained blessed. So, the scripture also concludes, are blessed, all those who "hear the Word of God, and keep it".

HolyHolla

^^^^ Wow! This is much more than enlightening........hmmm no wonder the bible said "when the comfort er shall come he will teach us all things". So had it been I don't have or read my bible, this is how Catholics will keep many in bondage with false doctrine chai! Thank you JESUS.

I'm still patiently waiting for Italo's reply to my last response.

I've seen Him post on other threads recently so, I know its not because he's not online....of course He is.

Could it be because He hasn't found new lies or He has not completed His research or perhaps, He has found out the truth and He's trying to conceal as further words will convict Him or maybe even scared to declare the truth after all the lies.

I just wanna believe He doesnt want to attend to this now....perhaps till tomorrow after He has gotten reasons from Monks, Priests or Catechists in His church and if I dont get a reply then, I can just conclude that He's too scared of the truth as Chukwudi44 cos the truth truly hurts.

adsonstone:

you again?
You know I've advised you (not once) to learn before you start ranting.

By the way, have you put my points side by side with yours and judged if its 99.9999:0.0001 as you claim?

If its not (even in your judgment), you are a liar.

Besides, I should stop replying or quoting you as you have shown yourself to be a liar and unwilling to own up but persist in the lies you have presented, again, the truth hurts you badly as Kingk rightly said.

Bros you are the incorrigible liar and hypocrite here.You asked me to keep listing even after I had presented a longer list than you yet you do not want to name the differences or is just simply ignorant SMH for you.