JMAN05:

Alpha and Omega in Rev. 22: 13 doesnt apply to Jesus but God. At Rev. 21: 6, 7 where the word occur again, the reference is to God. because it is God whose relationship of Him and the saints are son while Jesus view the saints as brothers. heb. 2:1.

JMAN05: The fact that Jesus answers the first and the last doesnt change anything. in the bible two people can share one title. Jesus and his apostles are both called "apostles". heb 3:1

The title for both (Jah and Jesus) mean different things. in the original of Isaiah 44:6 the first and the last doesnt possess any definite article while definite article is found at Rev. 1:17. grammatically, the latter describes a title while the former is about Jah's Godship.

JMAN05:

He is.

http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2010250?q=michael+the+archangel&p=par

ayoku777: I'm always confusing JW with the 7th day adventist (7DA)

I have a few JW friends who believe Jesus is God and that confuses me.

hisblud: How can God a Spirit have a Spirit? https://www.nairaland.com/1422575/frosbel-how-god-god/1#18644407

ayoku777: I'm always confusing JW with the 7th day adventist (7DA). But are they the ones that believe that Jesus is an angel? Or that he is not God?

I have a few JW friends who believe Jesus is God and that confuses me. Guess there are breakout factions like in every other denomination in christianity.

One thing i believe is that in every denomination, there are weird doctrines. From catholics, to methodists, to pentecostals, to JW and adventist. But that hasn't stopped God from having a remnant among them, even in the midst of all the heresis.

So lately i no longer judge individuals by the doctrine of the whole. I prefer to ask 'what do YOU believe?'

I know Christ will build his church, and he will do so through remnants from all this denominations. I know catholics who don't believe all the doctrines of catholics, same with protestants, pentecostals etc.

And i don't believe JW are not christians. If you believe that Jesus Christ is the messiah, the Son of the Living God; and that He died for your sins and rose from the dead for your justification, you are a christian, even if you have some other weird doctrines like purgatory, or there's no hell or Jesus is coming on 15th Dec. This is what the bible calls the COMMON FAITH

true2god: U r right to an extent. But u need to understand that doctrines go a long way in shaping an individual or family. Some doctrines can as well destroy individual or family.

Lets take this instance, I am from a family where we r all JW and my sister fell in love with a guy from the redeemed christian church of God. By JW doctrine, my sister has no right getting married to the guy cos he is from another 'religion' or the christendom. So if she goes ahead to marry the guy, against JW teachings, she will be disfellowshipped cos she married someone from a 'satanic' organization.

The consequent of dis singular action will make her family, and her JW friends, shun her because she has commited a 'great crime'. The psychological impact is better imagined than felt. This singular doctrine, i tell u, is capable of tearing a family apart (and has torn some family apart).

The problem is not doctrinal variation, but wen an organization structure their belief such that it alienate individual frm the larger society, thats wat makes the organization dangerous and cult-like. This is because a JW sees the world as 'this system of things' that will soon be 'destroyed by the impending armagedon' hence you must not have anything to do with the larger society (except the watchtower society). This teaching is both wrong and dangeruos.

ayoku777: And by the way, Jesus is SO NOT MICHEAL. Infact not only is Jesus God, according to Isaiah 9v6 and John 1v1; He is also infact JEHOVAH.

Jeremiah 23v5-6 ...behold, the days come saith the Lord, that i will raise up unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.

In his days Judah shall be saved, and THIS IS HIS NAME whereby he shall be called, the Lord our righteousness (JEHOVAH TSIDKENU). Jesus is Jehovah Tsidkenu, not the Father. It was Jesus who took our sins and gave us his righteousness. So Christ is not just God, he is YHWH like the Father.

hisblud: jman ok granted you acknowledged your fallibility, pls could you itemise YOUR mistakes and where YOU admitted such as a mistake. This will help your readers know. Thanks

hisblud: How can God a Spirit have a Spirit? https://www.nairaland.com/1422575/frosbel-how-god-god/1#18644407

woky: and when did JW started believing that God is omniscience and omnipresent??

woky: and when did JW started believing that God is omniscience and omnipresent??

JMAN05:

The bible shows He is omniscience but not omnipresent. pls answer the question. is Jesus omniscience?

italo:

@ JMAN05, Please answer his question.

We ask you about your previous lies, you dodge, saying it is not current teaching. Meanwhile, you dont provide any evidence that it is not current teaching.

He's asking you current teaching now, you're still being evasive.

italo:

@ JMAN05, Please answer his question.

We ask you about your previous lies, you dodge, saying it is not current teaching. Meanwhile, you dont provide any evidence that it is not current teaching.

He's asking you current teaching now, you're still being evasive.

italo:

Please give us the link to read that or post the text here. Let us see if they actually admitted making mistakes or they just tried to lie their way around it as usual.

We cant trust you. Perhaps you're lying again.

italo:

Waiting for the official position of the Heaven filled up in 1935" lie.

The Spirit bears us witness that the Catholic faith is truth and scriptural. Why do you condemn us while you claim you can't argue with people who claim the Spirit bears them witness that heaven isnt filled up...as againt your lies that it is filled up.

Then explain what you meant be the crap you wrote earlier and tell us if it is your private opinion.

So what actually happened? Did they change God's mind and make him offer more vacancies in heaven or did God change their minds and make them know that heaven is filled up?

But the reason I need you to tell me the official teachings is that if I bring evidence of your teaching that is contrary to this, you will start to lie that it is not current teaching.

Waiting for proof that your statement below is your official teaching.

"The fact is that you can never say with certainty the number that has been anointed to be in heaven. You can do that to some, but not all. that is our position. that is why i ignored that one. it is still among the past i ve been talking about."

JMAN05:

His spirit is His active force. the holy spirit.

italo:
What do you mean by "future life prospect?" Provide proof that this is your current official teaching.

Do you teach that the soul is the body...yes or no?

If I provide evidence that your teaching is different from this now, you'll say it's past teaching.


I haven't said anything about soul. This thread is for you to defend your false doctrines. It isn't for me to defend Catholic doctrine.

italo:

That he is called mighty God by Isaiah in Isaiah 9:6 means he is the almighty God that was called mighty God in by the same Isaiah in Isaiah 10:20, 21 who Isaiah says is only one God in Isaiah 43:10, 44:6.

true2god: He is a typical JW who has mastered the act of 'evasion'. I know he dare not ask the same question at their kingdom hall, he will be rebuked or disfellowshipped.

true2god: @ JMAN05 does this response represent your thought or position?

JMAN05:

Thanks. but we preach christ's presence. though i ve stated that it wont be good to keep repeating what we have jettisoned, some still bring it up.

I do ignore some reponses that dont sound serious. It is true that many are not sincere, but some of the things they are saying are true, not just allegations. it is only sad how they dont apply that method in what their pastors teach them. If you paste their own errors now, they will deny it. well it is to their detriment. If you see a gutter and tell urself that it is not gutter, who will eventially fall into it? that becomes one deceiving himself.

It is true we never say the day and the hour, but the issue is, Did you foretell what later failed? Yes. the truth is there, even if you pretend it didnt happen, you ve not changed anything.

The gov body too admits it, so should we. the only sad thing is that the people we are talking with cant be this sincere in their own teachings.

JMAN05:

If you dont respond to that question, I wont answer you. the goal of JWs is to tell you that what they believe is what the scriptures says. So if you ask what we believe, we will let you know how we arrive at that believe. so that you can see that it is the truth from the bible. If not after saying it, u will say "oh that is your doctrine". You now neglect its authenticity.

Also compare Rom. 10:2. I ve been answering ur questions. you keep rejecting without any prove.

reapond to 1cor. 7:39

hisblud: This thread is so hilarious on what jw is and what they stand for. Jman tried to defend their failed prophecy, then loveroftruth came wit his confidence of been taken up on their teaching and he was no where to defend it. Hmm. Jman of all your post, you only have your organization official link on Jesus as angel, yet for Jesus as not God, no link! Why? Should we wait or take your opinion, becos your opinion cant be taken except it has an official basis.

italo: This is another shameful lie.

Rev 22:12 “And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work. 13[b] I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.[/b]”

14 Blessed are those who do His (Jesus is clearly referring to the father here, meaning he is the one speaking) commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

16 “I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star.”

17 And the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.

18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God(clearly referring to the father again) will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; 19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away[k] his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

20 He who testifies to these things says, “Surely I am coming quickly.” (this is a repeat of Jesus words in verse 22).

Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus!

Clearly Jesus addresses himself as "the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last"

Why are you Jehovah's Witnesses so full of falsehood?

Abi can other people help us judge the passage above?


Jesus Christ: “Do not be afraid; I am the First and the Last. 18 I am He who lives, and was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore."

You lie that "the first and last" Jesus said is a title that means something different from that of God.

What does it mean and where does the Bible tell you its meaning?

JMAN05:

the link cant be provided oga cos our library online starts from 2000 and above. You can ask loveoftruth to confirm it.

or better still this is a recent statement on that.

.
14 In a similar way, at the beginning of
the 20th century, there were a number of
wrong expectations among true Christians
regarding “the last days.” (2 Tim. 3:1 ) For
instance, in the year 1914, some thought
that their being taken to heaven was
imminent.

http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2013684

JMAN05:

So if Jesus is called a servant in Isaiah and Isaiah the prophet is also called servant, so that makes Isaiah Jesus? wrong answer. answer the question bro.