@joshthefirst

"How shalt not kill" is an absolute rule which bars even self defence ( a legitimate self preservation), the draftsman lacked the foresight to exempt the necessary/lawful killings.

I can tell you for sure, no such commandment is written in my heart.

@oladegbu

So you agree sperm cells and eggs carry half of this vital crucial indispensable life, isn't it logically to campaign for the preservation of sperms and eggs?!

Besides your picture just explained the process of fertilization, it didn't justify that life (that special breath) starts from conception.

Kay 17: @joshthefirst

"How shalt not kill" is an absolute rule which bars even self defence ( a legitimate self preservation), the draftsman lacked the foresight to exempt the necessary/lawful killings.

I can tell you for sure, no such commandment is written in my heart.

it is actually. Its written in everyone's heart.

You made a wrong assumption it seems, and an ignorant one at that, in an effort to disqualify the lawmaker.

The ten commandments is not written in mine!!

The draftsman obviously lacks legal experience while writing thou shalt not kill, without any regard for exemptions.

Kay 17:

@oladegbu

So you agree sperm cells and eggs carry half of this vital crucial indispensable life, isn't it logically to campaign for the preservation of sperms and eggs?!

Besides your picture just explained the process of fertilization, it didn't justify that life (that special breath) starts from conception.

When does the first day of the nine months of pregnancy begin?

Joshthefirst: does the infant/ pre-birth stage make anyone less human?

It is not the childs fault that he came into being. Yet he will pay the price of things that happened without his hand with his willing death? Because he cannot yet cry out in pain?

What circumstance justifies the unlawful killing of a baby in the womb?

Yes it does. The child is not yet fully developed into a "human".

The child has no sense of fault, or no properly developed emotions or attachment yet.

Whereas the mother is fully developed in all these aspects.

It is not the mothers fault to bear the child of one who has r.aped and dishonored her!

It is not the mothers fault to spend time and effort on a child she never wanted and asked for in the first place!

It is not the mothers fault to look after a persons child who attacked her!

Who are you to decide what is lawful or unlawful?

The killing of such a child is justifiable in every sense.

and a child should pay for the sins of its father because of the simple inconvenience of its mother? It is truly a selfish world. Where we take a childs life for happenings it knows nothing about. Where it is the decision of a selfish mother to take the life of the unborn.

The child is not really a child but a half formed human being. The child is not really paying for anything. The child has no sense of "paying" yet.

You are selfish. so that gives you the right to r.ape people and plant your seed everywhere in the secure knowledge that it will survive You are the selfish one!

Why should someone else bear YOUR child for YOUR crime?!


HOW DARE YOU CALL THE MOTHER SELFISH?

SHE NEVER ASKED FOR THE CHILD?


TUFIAKWA!

CAVEMAN!"

I AM DISGUSTED!

OLAADEGBU:

Human life starts at conception, if you know what that means.

L@@K at this brainwasher! Typical xtian!

you think your cartoon of that cute baby in the womb will melt our hearts into accepting your evil views


See how sly you are.

Babies dont even have proper hair in the womb. Their eyes are not even open. They are a blood-streaked ugly mess inside there.


See how you paint the baby like a cute , beautiful being in order to gain sympathy.

This is not the way to get a point across!

stop playing with peoples emotions!

POPE II: JEEZ, you are disgusting

your father is disgusting!

PAGAN 9JA:



L@@K at this brainwasher! Typical xtian!

you think your cartoon of that cute baby in the womb will melt our hearts into accepting your evil views


See how sly you are.

Babies dont even have proper hair in the womb. Their eyes are not even open. They are a blood-streaked ugly mess inside there.


See how you paint the baby like a cute , beautiful being in order to gain sympathy.

This is not the way to get a point across!

stop playing with peoples emotions!

OLAADEGBU:

BUllshyt! That doesnt even make sense.


Babies look something like this during birth:

OLAADEGBU:

Educate yourself with this videoclip and stop basking in ignorance.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7y2KsU_dhwI

It is amazing how people change their minds when faced with facts and the truth as you will see in this videoclip.

OLAADEGBU:

It is amazing how people change their minds when faced with facts and the truth as you will see in this videoclip.

videoclips made by brainwashers like you.

Because the bull**** you throw at us does not seem to be changing any of our minds.

PAGAN 9JA:


Yes it does. The child is not yet fully developed into a "human".

when is a human a human? When it is fully developed? Or when it is concieved? Even todlers are not yet fully developed yet.

PAGAN 9JA:
The child has no sense of fault, or no properly developed emotions or attachment yet.

people suffering from down's syndrome are not human then. Mad people are not human then.

PAGAN 9JA:
Whereas the mother is fully developed in all these aspects.

the child is a developing human being. We do not kill a child if it not yet fullly developed. That is cold-blooded murder.

PAGAN 9JA:
It is not the mothers fault to bear the child of one who has r.aped and dishonored her!

it is not the childs fault to die because of the one who raped its mother.

PAGAN 9JA:
It is not the mothers fault to spend time and effort on a child she never wanted and asked for in the first place!

yes it is not, but the child is a human being. She can give him to a orphanage, we value human life. Soldiers in combat move to carry their wounded men. Even those who have lost all limbs in an explosion. They even move to carry the corpse of their comrades. [b]they value human life

PAGAN 9JA:
It is not the mothers fault to look after a persons child who attacked her![/b]

she musn't. She can easily give the child to foster parents or an orphanage. No need to kill the child because of the incoveniences of carrying it. Do you realize what the ending of life is? Do you value human life?

PAGAN 9JA:
Who are you to decide what is lawful or unlawful?

THou shalt not murder. If there is no standard for what is lawful in society, we'd have chaos. I rely on the 10 commandments.

PAGAN 9JA:
The killing of such a child is justifiable in every sense.

the killing of anyone taken to be underdeveloped or indisposed, especially an innocent child, is unjustified and should not be cordoned by anyone.

PAGAN 9JA:
The child is not really a child but a half formed human being. The child is not really paying for anything. The child has no sense of "paying" yet.

so because he is half-formed he is not a human being? How do you prove this? This is a [b]blatant lie from you. Just because the child has no sense of paying, we should kill it?

PAGAN 9JA:
You are selfish. so that gives you the right to r.ape people and plant your seed everywhere in the secure knowledge that it will survive You are the selfish one!

what are you saying? Stop lashing out in butthurt and ad hominems and red herrings and tackle the issue at hand. The man has done wrong. The child must not be killed for the mans wrong-doing. There is a child here. It is no longer what the woman wants or does, she is not the only one. The child is alive. A human being developing within her. We cannot easily dismiss his life and murder it.

PAGAN 9JA:
Why should someone else bear YOUR child for YOUR crime?!

why should the child die for its fathers crimes?

PAGAN 9JA:
HOW DARE YOU CALL THE MOTHER SELFISH?

she acts for her interests alone, forgetting there is a child, a human being growing within her. I know its a burden, but she should be ready to bear it, she should value human life.

PAGAN 9JA:
SHE NEVER ASKED FOR THE CHILD?

the child is there all the same. Things happen, doesn't mean we should kill an innocent baby just because something goes wrong

PAGAN 9JA:
TUFIAKWA!

CAVEMAN!"

I AM DISGUSTED!

butthurt and ad hominem. What should disgust you is the taking of the life of an innocent baby for circumstances that it has no play in. Go to an abortion clinic and you'll be truly disgusted.

This is what happens when faith takes the place of reason,beautiful people die & lives are lost unnecessarily...

Dentist's death sparks outrage, parents demand international probe

The death of an Indian dentist in Ireland, whose life could have been saved through an abortion, on Thursday sparked outrage in India with political parties terming it as a violation of human rights while her parents demanded an international probe.

The Delhi Catholic Archdiocese said the mother's life should not have been risked though abortion was a complete no for them
31-year-old Savita Halappanavar died in Ireland last month from blood poisoning after doctors allegedly refused to terminate her 17 week long pregnancy, telling her that "this is a Catholic country".

"In a case when a mother's life is in danger, save her life and while saving the mother if something happens to the baby in the womb then no doctor or mother should be held responsible as their intention was to save a life and not to end a life.

"It is important that the intention should be to save the life," Rev Fr Dominique Imanuel, Spokesperson of Delhi Catholic Archdiocese, said.

Halappanavar's parents demanded an "international probe" and said Irish law on abortion should be changed.

"Only following rules, what about humanity? They killed my daughter to save a foetus. Only a mother knows the pain," said Halappanavar's mother, while her father urged the government to act accordingly.

Political parties termed it a violation of human rights and demanded the government to direct External Affairs Ministry to ask Irish government to act on the issue and ensure justice to the family.

Senior CPI(M) leader Brinda Karat described the incident as a "crime" and sought government's intervention.

"We should lodge a very strong protest with the Irish authorities as they are responsible for committing a crime which resulted in loss of a human life," Karat said.

"It was a medical emergency and they preferred to sacrifice the young woman's life rather than to do something which have gone against their religious belief," she said.

Senior BJP leader Mukthar Abbas Naqvi said BJP Mahila Morcha chief Smriti Irani has written a letter to External Affair Minister Salman Khurshid on this issue.

The death of Halappanavar has reopened the long and continuing public debate on the issue of abortion and the views of Catholic church, said John Dayal, Member of National Integration Council of India and former president of All India Catholic Union.

He said the Catholic teachings on abortion and for that matter other pro-life issues were clear.

"The church opposes abortions as the foetus is a human life. Abortions have been often used as a lazy solution to population control, teenage pregnancies and such like," he said.

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/outrage-over-death-of-indian-dentist-in-ireland/1/229330.html

This is what happens when reason & commonsense triumphs over faith & dogmatism.Lives are saved...

Ireland Has Performed Its First-Ever Legal Abortion, And It Saved A Dying Woman’s Life

"Ireland Has Performed Its First-Ever Legal Abortion, And It Saved A Dying Woman’s Life"
The first legal abortion in an Irish hospital has been carried out in Dublin, the Irish Times confirmed on Friday. It represents the first pregnancy termination under Ireland’s historic new abortion law, which slightly relaxed the country’s total ban to allow for legal abortions in cases when it’s necessary to preserve a woman’s life.
Before Ireland’s prime minister approved the new law in July, the country’s abortion laws had not been updated since 1867. Now, there are 25 Irish hospitals that are authorized to perform legal abortions in life-threatening cases without worrying about legal repercussions.
The National Maternity Hospital in Dublin carried out the pregnancy termination for a dying woman whose membrane had ruptured for more than 24 hours. She ran a high risk of sepsis, and her 18-week twin fetuses had no chance of survival outside of the womb. Doctors said her case bore many similarities to that of Savita Halappanavar, a 31-year-old woman who died after being denied an emergency abortion in an Irish Catholic hospital last year. Halappanavar developed sepsis after she began to miscarry, but doctors wouldn’t terminate her doomed pregnancy until the fetal heartbeat had officially stopped three days later — and by that time, it was too late.
The Irish Times reports that in contrast to Halappanavar, the woman who received a legal abortion this month “has made a good recovery after receiving antibiotic treatment and undergoing the termination a number of weeks ago.”
Ireland’s new abortion law was spurred by Halappanavar’s tragic death, which sparked a global controversy. Reproductive rights activists vowed that an individual would “never again” be denied the life-saving medical care that could avert this type of tragedy. But even though Ireland has slightly relaxed its stringent abortion law to successfully avert another Savita, a handful of other conservative Catholic countries still impose total bans on the procedure. Following Halpannavar’s death, similar controversies have unfolded in El Salvador and Chile.
The Guttmacher Institute’s research has found that harsh bans on abortion don’t actually lower abortion rates. Instead, they simply encourage women to risk their lives to end a pregnancy illegally. An estimated 47,000 women around the world die each year from unsafe abortions — and that figure doesn’t include women like Halpannavar who die from pregnancy-related complications that an abortion could have averted.

http://thinkprogress.org/health/2013/08/23/2516291/ireland-legal-abortion/#

Moral of the story-Reason will always triumph over faith.You pro-lifers are simply wasting your time since you all fail to see the folly in your arguments

Abortion is the unlawful killing of a child. The case above is extreme and should not be among the considerations of this discourse.

Do you know the probability of this cases happening? They are very rare.


Check that with the amo of legal abortions in the States alone.

Over 53 million babies have been killed.

We should be ashamed of ourselves.
It is when foolishness takes preeminence over morality that we have thinkers who would deliberately reach forth into the safes place on earth and terminate innocent life therein.

Do you mind him? Evidently, he has forgotten that people also die in abortions and even normal and legal surgeries too. Outrage ko, outage ni.

cold: This is what happens when faith takes the place of reason,beautiful people die & lives are lost unnecessarily...

Dentist's death sparks outrage, parents demand international probe

The death of an Indian dentist in Ireland, whose life could have been saved through an abortion, on Thursday sparked outrage in India with political parties terming it as a violation of human rights while her parents demanded an international probe.

The Delhi Catholic Archdiocese said the mother's life should not have been risked though abortion was a complete no for them
31-year-old Savita Halappanavar died in Ireland last month from blood poisoning after doctors allegedly refused to terminate her 17 week long pregnancy, telling her that "this is a Catholic country".

"In a case when a mother's life is in danger, save her life and while saving the mother if something happens to the baby in the womb then no doctor or mother should be held responsible as their intention was to save a life and not to end a life.

"It is important that the intention should be to save the life," Rev Fr Dominique Imanuel, Spokesperson of Delhi Catholic Archdiocese, said.

Halappanavar's parents demanded an "international probe" and said Irish law on abortion should be changed.

"Only following rules, what about humanity? They killed my daughter to save a foetus. Only a mother knows the pain," said Halappanavar's mother, while her father urged the government to act accordingly.

Political parties termed it a violation of human rights and demanded the government to direct External Affairs Ministry to ask Irish government to act on the issue and ensure justice to the family.

Senior CPI(M) leader Brinda Karat described the incident as a "crime" and sought government's intervention.

"We should lodge a very strong protest with the Irish authorities as they are responsible for committing a crime which resulted in loss of a human life," Karat said.

"It was a medical emergency and they preferred to sacrifice the young woman's life rather than to do something which have gone against their religious belief," she said.

Senior BJP leader Mukthar Abbas Naqvi said BJP Mahila Morcha chief Smriti Irani has written a letter to External Affair Minister Salman Khurshid on this issue.

The death of Halappanavar has reopened the long and continuing public debate on the issue of abortion and the views of Catholic church, said John Dayal, Member of National Integration Council of India and former president of All India Catholic Union.

He said the Catholic teachings on abortion and for that matter other pro-life issues were clear.

"The church opposes abortions as the foetus is a human life. Abortions have been often used as a lazy solution to population control, teenage pregnancies and such like," he said.

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/outrage-over-death-of-indian-dentist-in-ireland/1/229330.html

This is what happens when reason & commonsense triumphs over faith & dogmatism.Lives are saved...

Ireland Has Performed Its First-Ever Legal Abortion, And It Saved A Dying Woman’s Life

"Ireland Has Performed Its First-Ever Legal Abortion, And It Saved A Dying Woman’s Life"
The first legal abortion in an Irish hospital has been carried out in Dublin, the Irish Times confirmed on Friday. It represents the first pregnancy termination under Ireland’s historic new abortion law, which slightly relaxed the country’s total ban to allow for legal abortions in cases when it’s necessary to preserve a woman’s life.
Before Ireland’s prime minister approved the new law in July, the country’s abortion laws had not been updated since 1867. Now, there are 25 Irish hospitals that are authorized to perform legal abortions in life-threatening cases without worrying about legal repercussions.
The National Maternity Hospital in Dublin carried out the pregnancy termination for a dying woman whose membrane had ruptured for more than 24 hours. She ran a high risk of sepsis, and her 18-week twin fetuses had no chance of survival outside of the womb. Doctors said her case bore many similarities to that of Savita Halappanavar, a 31-year-old woman who died after being denied an emergency abortion in an Irish Catholic hospital last year. Halappanavar developed sepsis after she began to miscarry, but doctors wouldn’t terminate her doomed pregnancy until the fetal heartbeat had officially stopped three days later — and by that time, it was too late.
The Irish Times reports that in contrast to Halappanavar, the woman who received a legal abortion this month “has made a good recovery after receiving antibiotic treatment and undergoing the termination a number of weeks ago.”
Ireland’s new abortion law was spurred by Halappanavar’s tragic death, which sparked a global controversy. Reproductive rights activists vowed that an individual would “never again” be denied the life-saving medical care that could avert this type of tragedy. But even though Ireland has slightly relaxed its stringent abortion law to successfully avert another Savita, a handful of other conservative Catholic countries still impose total bans on the procedure. Following Halpannavar’s death, similar controversies have unfolded in El Salvador and Chile.
The Guttmacher Institute’s research has found that harsh bans on abortion don’t actually lower abortion rates. Instead, they simply encourage women to risk their lives to end a pregnancy illegally. An estimated 47,000 women around the world die each year from unsafe abortions — and that figure doesn’t include women like Halpannavar who die from pregnancy-related complications that an abortion could have averted.

http://thinkprogress.org/health/2013/08/23/2516291/ireland-legal-abortion/#

Moral of the story-Reason will always triumph over faith.You pro-lifers are simply wasting your time since you all fail to see the folly in your arguments

Sad story

Image123: Do you mind him? Evidently, he has forgotten that people also die in abortions and even normal and legal surgeries too. Outrage ko, outage ni.

Spoken like a true Christian. Very Christlike

PAGAN 9JA:



your father is disgusting!

leave my dad out of your comments and i don't want to repeat myself

Image123:

Do you mind him? Evidently, he has forgotten that people also die in abortions and even normal and legal surgeries too. Outrage ko, outage ni.

Happy New Year my broda. Don't mind them they are only seeking for loopholes that will justify their blood thirstiness.

OLAADEGBU:

Typical "atheist" questions.

Bob Cole said: "You shouldn't kill the baby for the crime of the father." God disagrees with you: "So Moses chiselled out two stone tablets like the first ones and went up Mount Sinai early in the morning, as the Lord had commanded him; and he carried the two stone tablets in his hands. Then the Lord came down in the cloud and stood there with him and proclaimed his name, the Lord. And he passed in front of Moses, proclaiming, 'The Lord, the Lord, the compassionate and gracious God, slow to anger, abounding in love and faithfulness, maintaining love to thousands, and forgiving wickedness, rebellion and sin. Yet he does not leave the guilty unpunished; he punishes the children and their children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation'." (Exodus 34:4-7 NIV)

Responses:

Where does it say to kill the child for the crime of the father? It says he doesn't leave the guilty unpunished. Only those who are guilty get punished by God. Read it again: "Yet he does not leave the guilty unpunished; he punishes the children and their children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation." The use of "children" is speaking of the offspring (adults) who also have children (the nation of Israel is often called "The children of Israel". Also "the children and their children" is obviously referring to those who bear children. Little children don't have children.

This is a skeptic mouth stopper.

I am applaud at how selfish males can be. They only consider that their way is best without considering how women feel. Selfish, selfish, selfish.

You think our women will say the contrary?

Fulaman198: I am applaud at how selfish males can be. They only consider that their way is best without considering how women feel. Selfish, selfish, selfish.

we consider the unborn innocent child.

OLAADEGBU:

Whatever term it is given it is still cold blood murder. Can you give one instance of pregnancy where the mother's life is threatened, and how often this takes place?

"In my 36 years in pediatric surgery, I've never known of one instance where the child had to be aborted to save the mother's life"

-- C. Everett Koop U.S. Surgeon General, 1982-89

Do ectopic pregnancies count?

Fulaman198: I am applaud at how selfish males can be. They only consider that their way is best without considering how women feel. Selfish, selfish, selfish.

I am doubly applaud at how very selfish some adults can be. They only consider that their way is best without considering the right to life of children. Selfish! Selfish!! Selfish!!!

PS: I won't be surprised if folks like YOU Fulaman believes firmly that the place of d woman is in d kitchen but when it comes to the ish of abortion, you guys come out screaming "WOMEN'S RIGHT"...What about the rights of the Children?? Selfish I tell you!

striktlymi:

I am doubly applaud at how very selfish some adults can be. They only consider that their way is best without considering the right to life of children. Selfish! Selfish!! Selfish!!!

PS: I won't be surprised if folks like YOU Fulaman believes firmly that the place of d woman is in d kitchen but when it comes to the ish of abortion, you guys come out screaming "WOMEN'S RIGHT"...What about the rights of the Children?? Selfish I tell you!

I don't generalise nor am I an ethnic bigot like you. So you think it's fine for a man to forcefully de-virginize a woman though rape?

A woman's place is not in the kitchen. It is where she wants it to be. You are selfish because you think only one way is the right way. The Bible was written by men, not one woman. So naturally, it is a very sexist book towards women.

Fulaman198:

I don't generalise nor am I an ethnic bigot like you. So you think it's fine for a man to forcefully de-virginize a woman though rape?

A woman's place is not in the kitchen. It is where she wants it to be. You are selfish because you think only one way is the right way. The Bible was written by men, not one woman. So naturally, it is a very sexist book towards women.

when and where has anyone supported molest here? What we say is that there are many other options, and we should not use r.ape as an excuse for murder.


And we argue from a moral standpoint. Do you know how immoral you sound then? Arguing that we should use the r.ape of a woman to cordone the killing of an innocent child?

POPE II: You think our women will say the contrary?

They will be too afraid to say so, except for the brave Olaochi

Joshthefirst: when and where has anyone supported molest here? What we say is that there are many other options, and we should not use r.ape as an excuse for murder.


And we argue from a moral standpoint. Do you know how immoral you sound then? Arguing that we should use the r.ape of a woman to cordone the killing of an innocent child?

The filter blocked out rap.e in favour of molest.

You are not a woman, you don't have to experience what they have to for 9 months. It's backwards thinking to say/dictate how a woman should behave and act. God gave us all individual thought processes. A woman should not have to carry the baby of a woman she never wanted with a man who forced himself upon her.

If you can find a passage in your holy book that specifically states that a woman who is rap.ed should carry his child and give birth then I'll probably keep quiet and peacefully go away. We live in a world full of evil, and it seems certain groups of people receive the short end of the stick.

Fulaman198:

I don't generalise nor am I an ethnic bigot like you. So you think it's fine for a man to forcefully de-virginize a woman though rape?

A woman's place is not in the kitchen. It is where she wants it to be. You are selfish because you think only one way is the right way. The Bible was written by men, not one woman. So naturally, it is a very sexist book towards women.

You dey mind dem? Very selfish & inconsiderate set of people. See how they craftily evaded the story of the woman that died because some hospital chose to enforce some archaic belief over saving a life. Instead,they insist on their grasping at straws even when it's obvious they've been floored..sigh

Fulaman198:

The filter blocked out rap.e in favour of molest.

You are not a woman, you don't have to experience what they have to for 9 months. It's backwards thinking to say/dictate how a woman should behave and act. God gave us all individual thought processes. A woman should not have to carry the baby of a woman she never wanted with a man who forced himself upon her.

If you can find a passage in your holy book that specifically states that a woman who is rap.ed should carry his child and give birth then I'll probably keep quiet and peacefully go away. We live in a world full of evil, and it seems certain groups of people receive the short end of the stick.

I understand your position, but I also do not believe we should extend that stick to the unborn children.
But it is always the womans choice. And a law discouraging her might not stop her.

cold:
You dey mind dem? Very selfish & inconsiderate set of people. See how they craftily evaded the story of the woman that died because some hospital chose to enforce some archaic belief over saving a life. Instead,they insist on their grasping at straws even when it's obvious they've been floored..sigh

If they were honest with themselves, they would read your article.