ChrisOD:

Permit me to digress, but in Nigeria, IGR and GDP don't mean much because half of the money is stolen by politicians. It's just on paper.

It does. It shows the buffer zone and shock ability of each state. If FGN removes allocations today, due to the oil wells drying up, your IGR will show whether you will thrive, survive, barely make ends meet or out rightly turn to detroit --- bankruptcy.

Allocation makes stealing easier for politicians. With IGR, the citizens are more concerned about how government/politicians are spending the money, because it is the sweat of the people. With asking of questions by the electorate, the system will induce better think tanks as politicians, sustainable accountability and progressive development.

ChrisOD:

Permit me to digress, but in Nigeria, IGR and GDP don't mean much because half of the money is stolen by politicians. It's just on paper.

But IGR and GDP are now becoming political weapons to determine, the free loaders in the system. So, states need to take them serious.

ketoprofen:

Webometrics univ ranking? Guy, must u import every single thing to argue this?
What abt CBN stats, Common entrance stats., poverty rates that favours SE more?
The GDP and igr have been trashed severally, osun was placed ahead of anambra n abia and we have seen how osun, as economically sleeping as it is became more productive than ekwulobia or neni.
Biko, argue in line.

Yes I said University ranking was arguable

But those other stats you mentioned are still individual indices. And I have said that individually we are the best.

Can you readily mention one great government hospital in Igboland where someone from Lagos or Kano can come for treatment? Those are public things we are lacking.

EasternLeopard:

I beg to disagree

Rather than Igbos return back home, I will advice we spread our businesses/investments throughout the world why leaving their head offices and main industries back home

My reasons

In the event of another war, foreign currencies will flow in and help us to acquire needed war materials

If we secretly finance ruling party and opposition parties of our host foreign nations, we could use influence the political decision of our host nations to favour Biafra


In business, it is wise you go to potential customers if you want to control the market and make more money. So if we go to potential global customers we would control global market and make huge profits.
This wealth when sent back will boast our economy and wipe out poverty

Don't be perturb about the federal allocations received by other regions but be concern about

1) How many Igbos have escaped poverty

2) How connected are Igbos to global benefits

3) How immune are we to disasters affecting Nigeria

The 2006 census often bandied about was not comprehensively counted in the SE because of the MASSOB apprehension. The SE is the most congested zone in the country. Growing at about 3 per cent per annum, the Igbo should number between 30 to 40 million peoples in Nigeria alone. The 2016 census will shock many people in this fake country.
Be that as it may, it is good to spread investment as the Igbos are doing as it always come in handy. A tribe that loves itself like the Igbo-as witnessed during the civil war-where people shared salts, medicine, (supplies) and cloths with neighbours in the heat of famine, would always leverage on them at the right time. Ndewo!

atlwireles:

But IGR and GDP are now becoming political weapons to determine, the free loaders in the system. So, states need to take them serious.

Yes, I am arguing along these lines too. Read my posts. I just wanted to tamper down Superstar1 a little bit

superstar1:

See this mengistu.

What is the debt profile of US and Europe?

This is the logic behind.public sector indebtedness. Pick up the indebtedness now to build infrastructure that will lead to more socio-economic activities and it will translate into higher IGR for govt and more amenities will be provided.

The infrastructure built by indebtedness will still be built by the ones that did not borrow in the nearest future, but at an higher cost. The cost would have increased because of inflation.

I repeat, penny wise pound foolish.

And u think what happens in USA occurs in Oyo state? hahahahahahaha
loots loots loots.
They loot allocations n borrow much for a cheap project.
Imagine osun with GDP got 8.4b naira and spent it on substandard tablets that have been withdrawn from schools, is that what u r talking abt? Mtchew.
U invest borrowed funds on revenue generating projects not for looting.

superstar1:

Bros it can never grow. Individuals will not provide the enabling environment and infrastructure only govt can provide. No investor will ever think of investing without any noticeable infrastructure in.place. That will translate to lesser IGR for the govt and the wave of emigration of your able bodied men to other regions that have such infrastructure, will continue and they will keep developing the economy of those regions for them by the recipient economic ventures and the accrued taxes they will pay.

Pls read my post before this post

You will see an example of how community development groups and individual re- investment supported by govt can help in infrastructural development

ChrisOD:

Yes I said University ranking was arguable

But those other stats you mentioned are still individual indices. And I have said that individually we are the best.

Can you readily mention one great government hospital in Igboland where someone from Lagos or Kano can come for treatment? Those are public things we are lacking.

For what diseases?
And mention the diseases that can be treated in kano which can't be treated in Enugu for eg.
What do u mean by one govt Hosp one can come for treatment?

Even, the current state of Ariaria Market in Aba https://www.nairaland.com/1874739/current-state-ariaria-international-market is a classic example of how private wealth cannot do much for the collective good. Okay, why is every trader not tarring the front of their shop in that market?

superstar1:

It does. It shows the buffer zone and shock ability of each state. If FGN removes allocations today, due to the oil wells drying up, your IGR will show whether you will thrive, survive, barely make ends meet or out rightly turn to detroit --- bankruptcy.

Allocation makes stealing easier for politicians. With IGR, the citizens are more concerned about how government/politicians are spending the money, because it is the sweat of the people. With asking of questions by the electorate, the system will induce better think tanks as politicians, sustainable accountability and progressive development.

Let's be frank

When govt waste money and we complain, what happens next.?

EasternLeopard:

Pls read my post before this post

You will see an example of how community development groups and individual re- investment supported by govt can help in infrastructural development

leave that dude, let him keep talking.
he is from osun and I have not seen any remarkable thing in that state both private n public , yet, its GDP is bigger than anambra.
With enough debt profile that will wake up a dead man.
I told u that those figures have lapses.

ketoprofen:

And u think what happens in USA occurs in Oyo state? hahahahahahaha
loots loots loots.
They loot allocations n borrow much for a cheap project.
Imagine osun with GDP got 8.4b naira and spent it on substandard tablets that have been withdrawn from schools, is that what u r talking abt? Mtchew.
U invest borrowed funds on revenue generating projects not for looting.

We are talking reality here and not the usual tribalistic partisan talk.

If you want to travel that lane, I will gladly oblige you. Trust me.

However, Osun borrowing has greatly improved the state and even mover their IGR from a paltry 300mm to over a billion monthly.

I introduced the debt profile of US and Europe, for you to see the synergy between indebtedness and development.

ChrisOD: Even, the current state of Ariaria Market in Aba https://www.nairaland.com/1874739/current-state-ariaria-international-market is a classic example of how private wealth cannot do much for the collective good. Okay, why is every trader not tarring the front of their shop in that market?

I Neva said state govts shouldn't do their work.
Remember how this arguments started, private wealth shd not prevent state govt from working or the FG from investing.
Go through that thread, abagorro produced pix of other regions with the same problems.
Lagos is the most classic eg of Nigeria n flooding, y haven't the GDP conscious state plus its private investors take care of its flooding?

ketoprofen:

leave that dude, let him keep talking.
he is from osun and I have not seen any remarkable thing in that state both private n public , yet, its GDP is bigger than anambra.
With enough debt profile that will wake up a dead man.
I told u that those figures have lapses.

When the stats favours you, it is the correct stat, and when it favours others, it must be incorrect.

The usual myopic view of the people from the East of the Niger.

I am from Osun and the stat currently says their GDP is better than.the whole of SE. Deal.with it.

ChrisOD: Even, the current state of Ariaria Market in Aba https://www.nairaland.com/1874739/current-state-ariaria-international-market is a classic example of how private wealth cannot do much for the collective good. Okay, why is every trader not tarring the front of their shop in that market?

Having lived in a community, where the village built its own secondary school, town hall and village clinic. Including a small village market. The traders of Ariara failed themselves, all the billions or tens of millions, they earn daily in the market, yet they lack the common humanity to improve the surroundings. This is not a failure of government, but a failure of the traders.

ChrisOD: Even, the current state of Ariaria Market in Aba https://www.nairaland.com/1874739/current-state-ariaria-international-market is a classic example of how private wealth cannot do much for the collective good. Okay, why is every trader not tarring the front of their shop in that market?

That is why I talked about community development groups

Take Aba for example

Government might do a feasibility study of how much it will cost to solve the flooding issue. Govt then tells the people the cost and encourage them to do their feasibility study.

Once the people agree to help govt solve the problem, they will jointly solve that problem.

superstar1:

We are talking reality here and not the usual tribalistic partisan talk.

If you want to travel that lane, I will gladly oblige you. Trust me.

However, Osun borrowing has greatly improved the state and even mover their IGR from a paltry 300mm to over a billion monthly.

I introduced the debt profile of US and Europe, for you to see the synergy between indebtedness and development.

and the governor used 8.4 b naira to import cheap notebooks with poor curriculum that reached UNESCO, before it was withdrawn and packaged the change .
U see y we shd be more concerned with what they do with the funds, not just figures.
Osun indigenes didn't get richer either, multiple taxation was introduced.
Abeg .....

EasternLeopard:

Let's be frank

When govt waste money and we complain, what happens next.?

You vote them out by next election. That is the civil way to deal with politicians and by the time the judiciary is stronger and immunity clause is removed, the citizens will start taking them to court.

atlwireles:

Having lived in a community, where the village built its own secondary school, town hall and village clinic. Including a small village market. The traders of Ariara failed themselves, all the billions or tens of millions, they earn daily in the market, yet they lack the common humanity to improve the surroundings. This is not a failure of government, but a failure of the traders.

its primarily a failure of the govt.
Then, the traders

superstar1:

It does. It shows the buffer zone and shock ability of each state. If FGN removes allocations today, due to the oil wells drying up, your IGR will show whether you will thrive, survive, barely make ends meet or out rightly turn to detroit --- bankruptcy.

Allocation makes stealing easier for politicians. With IGR, the citizens are more concerned about how government/politicians are spending the money, because it is the sweat of the people. With asking of questions by the electorate, the system will induce better think tanks as politicians, sustainable accountability and progressive development.

Are you suggesting that politicians don't steal IGRs?

ChrisOD:

There are functional ports in Onne ( I worked in Onne for 5 years) and Port Harcourt. And even if they are non functional now, why is that so? GEJ has been president for how many years now and he cannot make the ports in his zone functional?

A River Port will do only as much as the feeding sea port allows. Onitsha River port will be fed by either Warri or other ports in ND. If those are not doing well, then Onitsha River Port would not do well too. I do not want to blame God for not giving core Igboland a seaport, but if we had ours thing would be way different.

Am not Here to talk abt gej and what he has done or not .
Am telling u the issue at stake, all fxnal ports are in Lagos, thanks to obj.
So, where are the ports in Warri to service Onitsha river port? where is onitsha port?
none.
Back to how we started.
It gotta be private driven devt n cash for now

ketoprofen:

its primarily a failure of the govt.
Then, the traders

I have to disagree with you. The traders make enough money there, to either have enough political influence to make things happen via the state or self fund the improvement themselves. Nobody, should run any business in such an environment

ChrisOD:

Are you suggesting that politicians don't steal IGRs?

help me out

superstar1:

When the stats favours you, it is the correct stat, and when it favours others, it must be incorrect.

The usual myopic view of the people from the East of the Niger.

I am from Osun and the stat currently says their GDP is better than.the whole of SE. Deal.with it.

Osun GDP greater than that of the whole of SE? Could you share that data here? Thanks.

That is why when people talk of true federalism i don't have any fear, because the north will be able to sustain them self than some southern who run from their state to north for survival, especially the ibos and they like to call northern parasite. Mainwhile they are the real parasite

superstar1:

We are talking reality here and not the usual tribalistic partisan talk.

If you want to travel that lane, I will gladly oblige you. Trust me.

However, Osun borrowing has greatly improved the state and even mover their IGR from a paltry 300mm to over a billion monthly.

I introduced the debt profile of US and Europe, for you to see the synergy between indebtedness and development.

What is development.?

How many osun people have escaped poverty and can access basic things of life.?

My friend

Development is all about people's wellbeing and not beautification of city landscape


The fastest development is achieved through people aided by their government

Pls watch this documentary

THE MEN WHO BUILT AMERICA

Also find out the asia men who built the first car ship train etc industries in asia and find out the impact they make

If I am to advise we Igbos, I will tell the govt to find means to encourage the creation, development and contributions of SE Rockefellars JP Morgan Dangotes Ibetos etc

atlwireles:

I have to disagree with you. The traders make enough money there, to either have enough political influence to make things happen via the state or self fund the improvement themselves. Nobody, should run any business in such an environment

I said primarily.
Don't worry, I have even said it on fb that the biz men shd build those roads and then increase the price of Aba made products.

ketoprofen:

For what diseases?
And mention the diseases that can be treated in kano which can't be treated in Enugu for eg.
What do u mean by one govt Hosp one can come for treatment?

Any major disease at all. And please leave kano out of it. Let's discuss our own problem. Much is expected of Igbos.

atlwireles:

Having lived in a community, where the village built its own secondary school, town hall and village clinic. Including a small village market. The traders of Ariara failed themselves, all the billions or tens of millions, they earn daily in the market, yet they lack the common humanity to improve the surroundings. This is not a failure of government, but a failure of the traders.

Gbam

Perfect


That is why government backed community development groups must be developed

ketoprofen:

and the governor used 8.4 b naira to import cheap notebooks with poor curriculum that reached UNESCO, before it was withdrawn and packaged the change .
U see y we shd be more concerned with what they do with the funds, not just figures.
Osun indigenes didn't get richer either, multiple taxation was introduced.
Abeg .....

See you, they did not get richer but they have better roads, schools, health services and infrastructure -- that translates to better quality of life and life expectancy.

Riches is not in Naira and Kobo alone. Get that straight.

EasternLeopard:

What is development.?

How many osun people have escaped poverty and can access basic things of life.?

My friend

Development is all about people's wellbeing and not beautification of city landscape


The fastest development is achieved through people aided by their government

Pls watch this documentary

THE MEN WHO BUILT AMERICA

Also find out the asia men who built the first car ship train etc industries in asia and find out the impact they make

If I am to advise we Igbos, I will tell the govt to find means to encourage the creation, development and contributions of SE Rockefellars JP Morgan Dangotes Ibetos etc

The kyn beautiful landscape is not in osun.
From osogbo to Iwo.
The clean parts of Aba are like London to osogbo, let him keep linking indebtedness to devt, that's y I said we shdnt give in to the ideology of the swners here in this issue.

EasternLeopard:

What is development.?

How many osun people have escaped poverty and can access basic things of life.?

My friend

Development is all about people's wellbeing and not beautification of city landscape


The fastest development is achieved through people aided by their government

Pls watch this documentary

THE MEN WHO BUILT AMERICA

Also find out the asia men who built the first car ship train etc industries in asia and find out the impact they make

If I am to advise we Igbos, I will tell the govt to find means to encourage the creation, development and contributions of SE Rockefellars JP Morgan Dangotes Ibetos etc

How can you differentiate people's well being from infrastructure eg landscaping, city beautification road, electricity, water etc

Will you rather have a state with infrastructure and middle class, than have one without infrastructure and supposedly rich people?