EfemenaXY:

No one's saying they should be stopped.

But as they take up their "posts", we pull out our kids. So who would they be left to "look after"?

No kids = No money for the business = No jobs for them. So yeah, in a round about way, they've been indirectly stopped.

*** Smirks!***

I don't think alternatives are that vast.

Also, the switch cost might be too high to the point you will just complain and give up.

It is like me saying I don't like the integration of homosexuality as a funky and progressive way of life in my residential environment. I can only complain as the alternative environments without such philosophy are few and the switch cost is too high.

Not all patrons would object. And not all that object would be so bothered to switch.

Sagamite:

I don't think alternatives are that vast.

Also, the switch cost might be too high to the point you will just complain and give up.

It is like me saying I don't like the integration of homosexuality as a funky and progressive way of life in my residential environment. I can only complain as the alternative environments without such philosophy are few and the switch cost is too high.

Not all patrons would object. And not all that object would be so bothered to switch.

I get what you're driving at: similar principle in theory, but it's practical application is different.

Moving house in itself is a big do, compared to switching Nursery. In just one borough, you can get over fifty nurseries, with similar price ranges, and staff with different orientations / ethnic backgrounds / (and genders?) so my choice of options is wider. Supply exceeding demand, especially if I live in a large inner city.

But it's completely different with regards to moving homes. A lot of factors need to be taken into consideration such as proximity to work and schools for other family members, and so on. A more difficult move I'd say.

EfemenaXY:

I get what you're driving at: similar principle in theory, but it's practical application is different.

Moving house in itself is a big do, compared to switching Nursery. In just one borough, you can get over fifty nurseries, with similar price ranges, and staff with different orientations / ethnic backgrounds / (and genders?) so my choice of options is wider. Supply exceeding demand, especially if I live in a large inner city.

But it's completely different with regards to moving homes. A lot of factors need to be taken into consideration such as proximity to work and schools for other family members, and so on. A more difficult move I'd say.

Lol.

I don't have any pikinis to know if there are multiples in a borough.

That said, there is the physical and the human capital constraints.

I am sure as the UK is a sane country, the council will rigorously cap and regulate the maximum amount of kids that each establishment can take considering the size of the physical location and the ratio of carers to child.

That said, not all of them would be convenient for your needs, be it due to their location (distance and on your way to work), staff quality, class background of attending kids etc. So that limits your pool.

Secondly,

- not all would object.
- not all of the few that objects will want to take action.
- not all that want to take action would be able to take action.
- not all that are able to take action would do so with the same inertia and momentum.

That is the curse of mass action. That is why moronic, corrupt, dynastical or cliquey politicians flourish. Some of that mass action challenges applies here.

You will need a coordinated mass action OR some serious scandal to be able to exclude nurseries with male staff.

Sexual deviation is not an exclusive male preserve.

oyb: Sexual deviation is not an exclusive male preserve.

huh?

Sagamite:

Lol.

I don't have any pikinis to know if there are multiples in a borough.

Trust me, there are.

There are four or five nurseries that I know off, all walking distance from my home and are all OFSTED certified. You get even more as you move further away from residential areas and towards busy city centers and high streets. There are three nurseries literally back-to-back with each other where my daughter schools, all vying for kids to fill up their places. So as you can imagine, competition amongst them is fierce as they try to out do each other, and this was what I meant about supply exceeding demand. All well and good for us the consumers (parents and kids) as we're spoilt for choice and the quality of service offered by them is invariably high - as it should be anyway, else we take our business (i.e: kids) else where if we aren't satisfied with the quality of service on offer...

Sagamite: That said, there is the physical and the human capital constraints.

Not really.

If these outstandingly rated nurseries are all within walking distance from my home (ease of dropping my kid there, as I leave for work in the mornings) or close to my place of work (remember, some employers offer staff nursery places) - which would make it just as easy for me to drop my little one off before going to my office, that won't pose much of a physical constraint to me, will it? And if I do take up a nursery place offered by my employer, I would get a discounted price or vouchers to discount the price for me...all part of the flexible benefits package offered by my employer / salary sacrifice scheme. So here again, there won't be that much of a capital constraint to me - not when I'm getting a very good offer.

Sagamite: I am sure as the UK is a sane country, the council will rigorously cap and regulate the maximum amount of kids that each establishment can take considering the size of the physical location and the ratio of carers to child.

True that. The younger the child, the more staff allocated to them. You could get 1 person looking after two under six month olds. The older the kids, the bigger the ratio but not to the point where the staff are overwhelmed and frazzled out.

Sagamite: That said, not all of them would be convenient for your needs, be it due to their location (distance and on your way to work), staff quality, class background of attending kids etc. So that limits your pool.

I've already addressed this point - especially with my SWOT analysis being on point baby.

The Threat of new entrants establishing within close vicinity of each other is a Weakness for the nurseries and presents fabulous Opportunities for me the paying customer and I daresay, may translate into a Strength for me with my buying power.

Sagamite: Secondly,

- not all would object. Not outwardly, no. We're all politically correct in this country aren't we? We're too polite to tell it like it is, but the objection will still be there, nevertheless.

- not all of the few that objects will want to take action. I think you'll find that when it comes to matters concerning your kids, even the laziest parents will sit up and do the necessary. Sure there is always an exception to every rule, but generally speaking, if a parent with a very young child isn't satisfied with the quality of care / environment in which their child is being looked after, they have that option to pull out. Freedom of choice.

- not all that want to take action would be able to take action. Why ever not?

- not all that are able to take action would do so with the same inertia and momentum. Ah! But that's were you're wrong. Just because you don't see them doing it, or talking about it in the open, doesn't mean they aren't working silently in the background. If I'm going to pull my child out of such a nursery, I'd be crazy to tell them that it's because they've got men working with the under 1's. No... I'd rather make up some excuse about proximity / affordability / etc. Of course it won't be done in one day, but it will most certainly be done asap!

That is the curse of mass action. That is why moronic, corrupt, dynastical or cliquey politicians flourish. Some of that mass action challenges applies here.

You will need a coordinated mass action OR some serious scandal to be able to exclude nurseries with male staff.

This is why I love the English. Cunning people.

You don't have to physically demonstrate with placards to show your disapproval with nurseries employing male staff. You do it indirectly. When you go for the open day visit, you the parent are expected to ask them deep questions. This is your opportunity to find out who works there and to meet the key workers that'll have contact with your child. If you don't like what you've seen, you simply play along, and at the end of the visit, shake hands cordially with the manager / whoever showed you around, thank them for their time, and give them the typical vague response of: "I'll be in touch", knowing fully well you won't.

Afterall, it's exactly what I did.

***Smirks!***

vikel2104: huh?

Yes o! oyb is right. Apparently, you haven't heard of stories such like this:

The first time I noticed my son’s odd habit was when I carried him on my legs in church, I realized he would become quite uncomfortable when my hand was not resting on his crotch, not his thigh, but his crotch, at first I thought maybe he was in pain, and I initially got worried, bit I later noticed his hands where going between my legs, this was not an unconscious action, he knew exactly what he was doing, because I brushed his hand away and gave him a stern look, but moments later I noticed he was doing it again, so I had to drop him off my legs and made him sit on a chair by himself, and did I mention my son was just 4 years old?

When we got home, I brought it to the attention of my husband, and in his usual manner he tried to make light of it, and even chastised me for even thinking our own son would be trying to get fresh with me, maybe he just misses you, he obviously doesn’t know what he is doing or where his hands where, my husband said, and after-all you are gone before he wakes up, and in bed before you return, so don’t blame the boy for trying to get as much attention from you as he possibly can, he added, but I was not convinced, what if my son had been exposed to pornography or had started hanging out with bad kids, I mean it’s never too early to start, especially in this day and age, it made me worry.
The next day I called his teacher on the phone and asked her to keep an eye on him, I told her I had noticed some changes in him and I didn’t want the damage to be irreversible, my son’s teacher assured me she would do her best to make sure he wasn’t exposed to the wrong set of people, satisfied with her response I laid all my worries to rest.

A few weeks later I noticed some strange with my son, I had taken my annual vacation and decided to spend it with my husband and son, on this day I was giving him a bath, and he kept on saying it’s mummy’s turn to suck on the straw, at first I thought it was a nursery rhyme not until I saw him grab hold of his penis, and repeated the words he said earlier “it’s mummy’s turn to suck the straw”, and while he held his penis, I noticed it was getting erect, now don’t get me wrong, I have noticed his erection before, in these cases it usually meant he needed to wee-wee, or he was just waking up from a nap or something, in other words very involuntary actions, but this time I felt he was getting aroused, I was so embarrassed I stood up, brought him out of the bath and quickly wrapped him up in a towel, I did all this without looking at him

I immediately told my husband, and this time I didn’t take it lightly, he saw the seriousness in me and together we grilled our little boy, until he opened up and told us where he learnt the song.

Sometimes you see a lot of things reported on TV and in the papers, and you say to yourself, do these things really happen, or are they stories fabricated by the media to get the attention of the masses, or for print media and soft sell magazines to make a quick buck, and if at all they happen, who would be so blind as to allow it escalate to such an alarming point. Well I was about to understand that these things actually happened, and it was happening to my little boy, the words I would never forget, after long minutes of question and some threats from my husband, he finally opened up, “aunty Tola said she likes to suck my straw and I should not let anyone suck it, and that I should always put my hands inside her pants because it makes her happy”.

I collapsed on the floor, when I heard my son say those words, at first I didn’t believe him, but I realized how on earth a four year old child, would come up with such a story, I stared at my husband, he stared back at me, we were both speechless, and our son stood between us, weeping, I instinctively pulled him close and hugged him tight, and silently blamed myself for not noticing earlier.

We stormed his school, and went straight to the principal’s office, where we explained everything to him and even got our son to tell him exactly what he had told us, the principal was quite upset and summoned aunty Tola to his office immediately, she denied everything, blaming everything my son had said on him having a very active imagination, at this point my husband was hot with rage, and he began threatening to involve the police, and not until my husband actually brought out his phone and began dialing a number, aunty tola fell on her knees begging and crying, and proceeded to blame the devil, we all stared at her in bewilderment, what on earth would possess a full grown woman to sexually abuse a four year old boy, a child put in your care, to protect and nurture, you turn around and hurt, we called the police and she was arrested, I quit my job, and became a full time mum, what would be my gain, if I had all the wealth and ended up with a disturbed and abused child….

This is a great lesson for parents, pls watch your children and make immediate moves as soon as you get to see any changes or funny acts in them. Above all,teach them in the way of the Lord so as to guide them in everything they do as they grow..

Source- Praise Fowowe

damiso:
Can I ask you also what of male neo-natal nurses? I know parents are often around a lot with preterm babies but the parents do go home sometimes and some pre-term babies can be in hospital for up to a year. Would you take the child out if as you were leaving your 6 month old baby one night a male neo-natal nurse signed in for a night shift?

Excellent question Damiso!

Was there an answer to this by any chance? I couldn’t find it…


TV

mojeer678:
Yes o! oyb is right. Apparently, you haven't heard of stories such like this:

Nasty. Parents must be vigilent.

Funny how anyone could think that women don't have an at least equal capacity for abuse and violence. Not only do they have a greater capacity, they are more readily able to rationalise and justify it.

Afterall, isn't it women arguing for the unilateral right to terminate the lives of their unborn children at any point time and for any reason? "Ethicists" have even gone one further and advanced the argument to include "legal infanticide" - termination of a newborn/infant that is solely dependant on them.


Abeg, all this talk of women being more sensitive, faithful, gentle spiritual etc. etc. is tosh. They are just as given to the baser aspects of the human nature as men.


TV

so aunty tola was sucking a 4-year old boy?

may God deliver our innocent sons from the aunty tolas of this world. if only little boys had hymëns, it would have been clearer to the gullible ones on this thread that women are the chief abusers of children.

Feminist biting their own tail since 1892.

coogar: so aunty tola was sucking a 4-year old boy?

may God deliver our innocent sons from the aunty tolas of this world. if only little boys had hymëns, it would have been clearer to the gullible ones on this thread that women are the chief abusers of children.

aunty tola is sucking little willy.

tintingz: aunty tola is sucking little willy.

and the same aunty tola would be on NL after work to preach about feminism.

TV01:

Excellent question Damiso!

Was there an answer to this by any chance? I couldn’t find it…


TV

Had a busy weekend so just logged in today

Efemenaxy would you also be averse to male neo-natal nurses taking care of vulnerable preterm babies in Neo natal ICU units? I know it's an hypothetical question but the ALL MALE nursery question was hypothetical as well.

damiso:

Had a busy weekend so just logged in today

Efemenaxy would you also be averse to male neo-natal nurses taking care of vulnerable preterm babies in Neo natal ICU units? I know it's an hypothetical question but the ALL MALE nursery question was hypothetical as well.

Sorry Damiso, only just seeing this in my mentions as I'd already unfollowed this topic. In response to "your" question, what do you think?

EfemenaXY:

Sorry Damiso, only just seeing this in my mentions as I'd already unfollowed this topic. In response to "your" question, what do you think?

Haa Efe so you would take out a child from an intensive care unit because of a male nurse?haan haan now that's harsh. I don't want to second guess you though so want your thoughts would you take a child out of intensive care because a male nurse who may or may not be a child abuser signed in for a night shift?

damiso:

Haa Efe so you would take out a child from an intensive care unit because of a male nurse?haan haan now that's harsh. I don't want to second guess you though so want your thoughts would you take a child out of intensive care because a male nurse who may or may not be a child abuser signed in for a night shift?

Read between the lines Damiso. No offence babes, but I don't do second-hand questions.

Anyone willing to take me on in an argument should be bold enough to put their hands down their pants, find their balls and quote me.

I hope you get my drift?

EfemenaXY:
Read between the lines Damiso. No offence babes, but I don't do second-hand questions.
I hope you get my drift.

Ok. Like I said earlier we are all entitled to our opinions.

damiso:

Haa Efe so you would take out a child from an intensive care unit because of a male nurse?haan haan now that's harsh. I don't want to second guess you though so want your thoughts would you take a child out of intensive care because a male nurse who may or may not be a child abuser signed in for a night shift?

I'm sorry o, but how exactly does a neonatal nurse, male or female, achieve the feat of molesting a sick preterm infant? He just disconnects the child from the breathing machine/oxygen, turns off all the monitors (heart and oxygen monitors), disconnects the IV lines and feeding tubes and then carries this sick infant to the full glare of all the other nurses, techs and receptionists in the ICU and just waltzes into the bathroom to go molest them? Does this sick child also survive this whole ordeal in this hypothetical scenario?

ileobatojo:

I'm sorry o, but how exactly does a neonatal nurse, male or female, achieve the feat of molesting a sick preterm infant? He just disconnects the child from the breathing machine/oxygen, turns off all the monitors (heart and oxygen monitors), disconnects the IV lines and feeding tubes and then carries this sick infant to the full glare of all the other nurses, techs and receptionists in the ICU and just waltzes into the bathroom to go molest them? Does this sick child also survive this whole ordeal in this hypothetical scenario?

Help me ask them o. Anyway, it's nothing new, skittish suburban housewives always see male caregivers( of any age) as rapi,sts and Slender men.
http://www.abcnews.go.com/US/slender-man-stabbing-survivors-parents-describe-horrific-ordeal/story?id=25787516

...when actually, females are more often the abusers.

ileobatojo:

I'm sorry o, but how exactly does a neonatal nurse, male or female, achieve the feat of molesting a sick preterm infant? He just disconnects the child from the breathing machine/oxygen, turns off all the monitors (heart and oxygen monitors), disconnects the IV lines and feeding tubes and then carries this sick infant to the full glare of all the other nurses, techs and receptionists in the ICU and just waltzes into the bathroom to go molest them? Does this sick child also survive this whole ordeal in this hypothetical scenario?

Perfect response, Ile.

ileobatojo:

I'm sorry o, but how exactly does a neonatal nurse, male or female, achieve the feat of molesting a sick preterm infant? He just disconnects the child from the breathing machine/oxygen, turns off all the monitors (heart and oxygen monitors), disconnects the IV lines and feeding tubes and then carries this sick infant to the full glare of all the other nurses, techs and receptionists in the ICU and just waltzes into the bathroom to go molest them? Does this sick child also survive this whole ordeal in this hypothetical scenario?

A sicko is a sicko and sick deranged individuals get off on the weirdest and oddest things and sometimes get off on abusing the most vulnerable people not just in s.exual ways.There have been cases of health workers molesting people in coma..As I said abuse is in various forms and an abuser could just be a sadist who takes delight in playing or toying with people's lives.There was a case of a nurse who was found fiddling with patients breathing machines just for kicks.Another was found to increase the amount of insulin given to some old geriatric clients also just for kicks.A Neo natal nurse might not waltz the child into the bathroom to molest the child but might engage in other sick activities and need just the few moments they are alone with the child to carry out their sick activities.

I never set out to argue on this thread. I just stated my opinions that I felt it was unfair for someone who might not be a child abuser be denied a job they might actually be good at based on their gender. I try to maintain a 'my opinion is not necessarily law or better than yours' stance on NL but I was actually beginning to feel that Efe was implying that I did not have 'motherly instincts' because of that opinion.

damiso:


A sicko is a sicko and sick deranged individuals get off on the weirdest and oddest things and sometimes get off on abusing the most vulnerable people not just in s.exual ways. A Neo natal nurse might not waltz the child into the bathroom to molest the child but might engage in other sick activities and need just the few moments they are alone with the child to carry out their sick activities.

Yes, but as far as I could tell, the debate you were having was specifically relating to sex.ual abuse. Hence my confusion at the analogy.

ileobatojo:

Yes, but as far as I could tell, the debate you were having was specifically relating to sex.ual abuse. Hence my confusion at the analogy.

If you read my stance on my other posts my arguments on why I think not only males could be predatory was that abuse on children especially those who could not speak was not only of the s.exual kind.

damiso: I try to maintain a 'my opinion is not necessarily law or better than yours' stance on NL but I was actually beginning to feel that Efe was implying that I did not have 'motherly instincts' because of that opinion.

Okay, I've just gone through all my posts on this thread and I fail to see where I implied directly or indirectly that Damiso "does not have motherly instincts".

Would you mind terribly pointing that out to me? Because come to think of it, that specific post was me responding to carefreewannabe and cococandy's posts.

EfemenaXY:

Okay, I've just gone through all my posts on this thread and I fail to see where I implied directly or indirectly that Damiso "does not have motherly instincts".

Would you mind terribly pointing that out to me? Because come to think of it, that specific post was me responding to carefreewannabe and cococandy's posts.

It was not a post per se but the insistence and amplification of ALL male nursery 8am to 6pm for my 6 month old daughter.

damiso:


It was not a post per se but the insistence and amplification of ALL male nursery 8am to 6pm for my 6 month old daughter.

And that implied you lacked motherly instincts?

EfemenaXY:

And that implied you lacked motherly instincts?

It felt that way especially when you kept on emphasising on political correctness not standing in lieu of a child's safety.

damiso:

It felt that way especially when you kept on emphasising on political correctness not standing in lieu of a child's safety.

That was on the very first page - long before you joined the conversation.

EfemenaXY: Sorry Damiso, only just seeing this in my mentions as I'd already unfollowed this topic. In response to "your" question, what do you think?

Yeah right

Which is why you made a number of responses to Saga afterwards? And then tried to craftily deflect the question back to Damiso when expressly called out?

I didn't butt in as I wanted the conversation to progress and reach it's natural conclusion. When you thought you were making a point, you continued with your usual low-brow smirking and high fiving with the rent-a-like crowd, your posturing was palpable. And Damiso wasn't the only one who sensed your "na me first born pikin" attitude.

Then bereft of answers - not easily cribbable this one hey? On the spot, no long neck possible! - you tried to make it about me with that sly remark. No problemo, we are all here together.

And then you breathed an audible sigh of relief when Ileobatojo posted what was at best a distractionary rejoinder. Had to be rescued again huh?

Pray tell, what's the difference between a liar and a plagiariast?

Damiso I doff my hat, well articulated, not intimidated and presented with a style EfemenaXY couldn't display if we sprinkled it on her grits. Please show some more of your class and ignore her.


TV

TV01:

And then you breathed an audible sigh of relief when Ileobatojo posted what was at best a distractionary rejoinder. Had to be rescued again huh?

Pray tell, what's the difference between a liar and a plagiariast?

I'm going to assume neither of these refer to me.

TV01:
Yeah right
Which is why you made a number of responses to Saga afterwards? And then tried to craftily deflect the question back to Damiso when expressly called out?
I didn't butt in as I wanted the conversation to progress and reach it's natural conclusion. When you thought you were making a point, you continued with your usual low-brow smirking and high fiving with the rent-a-like crowd, your posturing was palpable. And Damiso wasn't the only one who sensed your "na me first born pikin" attitude.
Then bereft of answers - not easily cribbable this one hey? On the spot, no long neck possible! - you tried to make it about me with that sly remark. No problemo, we are all here together.
And then you breathed an audible sigh of relief when Ileobatojo posted what was at best a distractionary rejoinder. Had to be rescued again huh?
Pray tell, what's the difference between a liar and a plagiariast?
Damiso I doff my hat, well articulated, not intimidated and presented with a style EfemenaXY couldn't display if we sprinkled it on her grits. Please show some more of your class and ignore her.
TV

Aww...he finally found his balls to confront me!

You know, I started typing out a long epistle for you but decided you aren't worth it. You never are, and you never will be, as far as I'm concerned.

A liar and a plagiarist you say? Over what? A debate supposedly dead and buried months ago? A debate where every single reference I used was documented in my write up?
A debate where the judges voted my argument superior to yours? It still hurts you, doesn't it? Why don't you request the judges andmoderators to remark the whole argument on your favour? Or better still, come take my 2nd place position, if that will help you sleep better at night, you despicable man?

Listen, I don't go back to vomit, but you obviously do. Now with all due respect, my fanatical Christian brother, be my guest and go fück yourself slowly.

I'm so done with your bile, but hey, feel free and have the last word(s). The dance floor is all yours. Mtcheew!!

*** Thread Unfollowed!***