@Joagbaje

Alright let us start with the second i.e. John 8:59. First let me point out your duplicity with this: the first time you referred to that passage you quoted the following version

Joagbaje:

John 8:59
59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

It was after we pointed out to you that the passage says he went through the midst of them, and thus "hid" did not mean he went into hiding, that you started looking for various Bible versions. (I can tell you now that there is plenty of manuscript evidence for "he went through the midst of them"

In any event, even if we go with your latest Bible version does it say "he ran"? Previously you said "he hid" whether under the table or under the pulpit or under the bed; now you switch to "he ran"!


Now to your second passage (and chosen Bible version) i.e. John 10:39: what it says is that "he escaped out of their hands." Where does it say "he ran."? Earlier we showed you in graphic form how Jesus "escaped" in similar circumstances --- from Luke 4

All the people in the synagogue were furious when they heard this. 29They got up, drove him out of the town, and took him to the brow of the hill on which the town was built, in order to throw him down the cliff. 30 But he walked right through the crowd and went on his way.

Now if you were honestly and truly trying to "rightly divide the word of truth" you would use the maxim "scripture interpretes scripture"; you would look at the person and nature of Jesus and the mighty works He did and use your sense rightly to conclude on how He would escape.

Instead, you would rather drag Jesus to a level lower than yourself and to accomplish this you would rather twist the scriptures. As I always say, that is the way with Chris Embassy and WoF doctrine.

@nuclearboy

I've just seen your post. Enigmalet is doing fine  thanks ---fast asleep now. I will check enigmatrax (it is always working only I go weeks before remembering to check it unless I get a prompt like this); I will check it and I'm sure I will like what I see. 

If you would NOW use the Hebrew and Greek bibles which you normally massacre to get money out of innocent people on the same verse, you would find a total different meaning.

The word used is translated to mean "concealment", to make secret (disappear), not to hide like a common criminal.

κρύπτω
kruptō
kroop'-to
A primary verb; to conceal (properly by covering): - keep secret, secret [-ly].

Jesus "concealed" Himself. Hiding is what oyaks does when he refuses to face anybody that can ask questions that will embarrass him and show hjim for the fraudster he is. Jesus did not behave like that

Jesus didnt come as God . Even though he is God. He came as a man. Don't forget that. He was hungry ,he was angry, he trembled , he feared . He wept.  He was 100% man. He was tempted . He would not be qualified to be our example if he cheated. But he didn't cheat . He emptied himself (kenosis) to be a man.  That's what made him a bonafide representative of man. If he had come as a supernatural spirit , then that would be cheating.

Hebrews 4:15
15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

So, you guys should not create an idea of Jesus that he was not. He walked by faith and by the holyghost. Stop helping Jesus . That's what led many into error.

2 John 1:7
7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.


Anyone who is scripturally sound will know I'm saying the truth here.

John 10:39. (kjv)
39 Therefore they sought again to take him: but he escaped out of their hand,  

Does it sound here as though he took a walk? Take the bible for what says .

Let me take a leaf from nuclearboy's last post. According to Strong the relevant Greek word for "he escaped" in John 10:39 is "exerchomai".

And below is Strong's explanation of the word. So please tell us how you arrive at your own interpretation "he ran"

1) to go or come forth of

a) with mention of the place out of which one goes, or the point from which he departs

1) of those who leave a place of their own accord

2) of those who are expelled or cast out

2) metaph.

a) to go out of an assembly, i.e. forsake it

b) to come forth from physically, arise from, to be born of

c) to go forth from one's power, escape from it in safety

d) to come forth (from privacy) into the world, before the public, (of those who by novelty of opinion attract attention)

e) of things

1) of reports, rumours, messages, precepts

2) to be made known, declared

3) to be spread, to be proclaimed

4) to come forth

a) emitted as from the heart or the mouth

b) to flow forth from the body

c) to emanate, issue

1) used of a sudden flash of lightning

2) used of a thing vanishing

3) used of a hope which has disappeared

nuclearboy:

If you would NOW use the Hebrew and Greek bibles which you normally massacre to get money out of innocent people on the same verse, you would find a total different meaning.

The word used is translated to mean "concealment", to make secret (disappear), not to hide like a common criminal.

κρύπτω
kruptō
kroop'-to
A primary verb; to conceal (properly by covering): - keep secret, secret [-ly].

Jesus "concealed" Himself. Hiding is what oyaks does when he refuses to face anybody that can ask questions that will
embarrass him and show hjim for the fraudster he is. Jesus did not behave like that

What you talking? Why would he conceal himself? What was he afraid of? And that doesn't suggest disappearance. Don't try to manipulate it. Read other scriptures . Jesus will rather be laughing at you.

Enigma:

Let me take a leaf from nuclearboy's last post. According to Strong the relevant Greek word for "he escaped" in John 10:39 is "exerchomai".

And below is Strong's explanation of the word. So please tell us how you arrive at your own interpretation "he ran"

What is an escape? A stroll?

What kind of escape?

What kind of escape is walked right through the crowd and went on his way?

Is that running or hiding?

BTW if the disciples were His "security" what were His "security" doing when all these happened?

And I see you have not addressed Strong's explanation of "he escaped" instead you want to insist on conjuring "he ran" --- something that it would seem you are conjuring from your backside!

No, he's conjuring it live from his mind. Which only shows how much semblance there is between that mind and a backside.

And yes, we have got to "exerchomai" and would like to see how the original language when put in context as Enigma has done can become Jesus running like a thief as pastor Jo, the Jesus follower insists Jesus did to prop up chairman Mao yaks

So what's your point . Now we are dwelling on petty an minor issue. A word could mean several things in English. But based on the context you get the mind of the writer.  The truth is communicated clearly . He slipped away, hid himself he escaped. What is your point really. And mind you this thing didn't occur only once  in Jesus life. The bible recorded such incidence in about 3 occasions

Now you are asking the point when you started it? Do you notice that I was not even part of the discussion until you started dragging Jesus' name in the mud as is customary with you? OK here are some points for you:

1. STOP dragging Jesus' name in the mud and worse with lies and Bible twisting and manipulation.
2. STOP comparing Jesus with MOGs --- the way you do it in particular is disgraceful and lacking integrity
3 Re 2 above, it is lacking integrity because you are trying to justify your empty and shameful boast that Oyaks and co are doing greater things than Jesus by lying against Jesus saying things like "he hid" or "he ran".
4 STOP treating and presenting Jesus, even in His time and ministry on earth, as just a man; if you don't understand the passage "he came in the flesh" ask for someone to explain it to you.
5 STOP belittling Jesus and placing Him at a level even lower than yourself and opaks Oyaks
6 In relation to the thread topic, no one is saying you and your MOGs should not have reaasonable security: the two major problems are (a) the hypocrisy of saying you have all these powers of miracles yet you need security (then lying about Jesus) to defend the insanity; (b) the cause and effect of the necessity for the security --- the MOG has become so exalted and full of himself or has been over exalted that his name and persona is more important than the message or even Christ.

Finally, did i say STOP telling lies against Jesus and STOP dragging His name in the mud? Maybe I didn't --- so STOP telling lies against Jesus and DTOP dragging His name in the mud!!!

Enigma:


BTW if the disciples were His "security" what were His "security" doing when all these happened?

They must have escaped too obviously. Peters denial was proof

And I see you have not addressed Strong's explanation of "he escaped" instead you want to insist on conjuring "he ran" --- something that it would seem you are conjuring from your backside!

I don't want to waste my time on that. The bible was clear. A Greek work could have multiple meaning but when you study in context it will be clear. Why will you leave the clear english to complicate Greek . The experts have done a good job ,let's not try complicate it. You just looking for where to bury this thing.

Let me take your (c) definition in the Greek. Which says "to go forth from one's power, escape from it in safety"  it's still the same thing.  It suggests even as though they had laid hold on him and he broke off from them and escaped .

Enigma:

Now you are asking the point when you started it? Do you notice that I was not even part of the discussion until you started dragging Jesus' name in the mud as is customary with you? OK here are some points for you:

1. STOP dragging Jesus' name in the mud and worse with lies and Bible twisting and manipulation.
2. STOP comparing Jesus with MOGs --- the way you do it in particular is disgraceful and lacking integrity
3 Re 2 above, it is lacking integrity because you are trying to justify your empty and shameful boast that Oyaks and co are doing greater things than Jesus by lying against Jesus saying things like "he hid" or "he ran".
4 STOP treating and presenting Jesus, even in His time and ministry on earth, as just a man; if you don't understand the passage "he came in the flesh" ask for someone to explain it to you.
5 STOP belittling Jesus and placing Him at a level even lower than yourself and opaks Oyaks
6 In relation to the thread topic, no one is saying you and your MOGs should not have reaasonable security: the two major problems are (a) the hypocrisy of saying you have all these powers of miracles yet you need security (then lying about Jesus) to defend the insanity; (b) the cause and effect of the necessity for the security --- the MOG has become so exalted and full of himself or has been over exalted that his name and persona is more important than the message or even Christ.

Finally, did i say STOP telling lies against Jesus and STOP dragging His name in the mud? Maybe I didn't --- so STOP telling lies against Jesus and DTOP dragging His name in the mud!!!

Im sorry if such impression is suggested. But it's not true. I take the word for what he says. I honestly don't enjoy a thread like this. So don't think I'm having fun. Its those who mske a sport of attacking preachers and churches . Men who dont know the worth of a soul to God that are dragging the name of christ in mud. We ought to make post that will save sinners or posts that will build the body of christ and not all these evil speakings about churches and ministers who are labouring day and night interceding for people to get saved.

^^^ Ha ha ha now you are tired of Greek - what with all your "nepios" "ginosko" "katallage" etc that you quote here?

OK let's stick to English: find one translation that says or suggests "he ran".

What are you saying? He broke off from them and escaped. What can be more clearer than that? You keep pushing this matter and you don't want me to talk .

In summary and according to Joagbaje (I composed the below from what I glean from his posts)

Jesus usually hid (in fear) before He ran away (terrified). Because it had happened like 3 times, He then decided to get bodyguards. but He didn't have enough money (even though He used to collect Tithes, first fruits and offerings [Jesus had used all the money to jericurl His hair and buy designer clothes]) so He told the disciples to go get money and buy swords.

But when the Romans came, His guards took off when they saw He was afraid (which led to Him telling them to surrender) and He Himself surrendered.

Which is why His servant Oyaks now likes Jericurls, boasts but fakes miracles (like Jesus boasted about security before losing His nerve) and collects offers 7, 24  and doesn't pay his staff salary in the first month of the year

Read through the above, dude and remove whichever does not suit your sermons on NL  

Pastor JoAgbaje, there can't be any "minor issue" when you claim too many things that are BASELESS or unable to withstand any scrutiny. I believe it is time you folks reorganize your "NL ministry" and bring in some fresh blood the same way you replaced "tonyet(tonye-tithe)" who might still be digging for some more scrolls to support your kind of ministry.

Any "ministry" not based on Christ shall fall like babylon and won't rise anymore!

My people make I go sleep. At nuke. that last was quite funny despite the'frownies'.

ogajim:

Any "ministry" not based on Christ shall fall like babylon and won't rise anymore!

Amen Oo . And everyone who allow themselves to be used as instrument of attacks against the body of christ and his ministers will fall likewise.

nuclearboy:

In summary and according to Joagbaje (I composed the below from what I glean from his posts)

Read through the above, dude and remove whichever does not suit your sermons on NL  

Go through the scripture below and remove the one that didn't fit into the idea you are promoting.

Hebrews 5:7-8
7 Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; 8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;

Can't resist this one for the road before I go to bed!

Joagbaje why do you do this? Why? OK see that passage in better light by doing a comparison

NKJV

who, in the days of His flesh, when He had offered up prayers and supplications, with vehement cries and tears to Him who was able to save Him from death, and was heard because of His godly fear,

NIV

During the days of Jesus' life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission.

NLT

While Jesus was here on earth, he offered prayers and pleadings, with a loud cry and tears, to the one who could rescue him from death. And God heard his prayers because of his deep reverence for God.

Look you should stick to fooling your flock and stop making a fool of yourself in public like this. Yee ma d'oju ti ra rẹ!


You think the Jesus who said the below will truly and really be afraid of men?

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

I didnt say he was afaraid of a man. My point was to express the humanity of Jesus . Against the idea you are creating for him. He want us to see how he conquered In  Human flesh. But you are trying to paint him as a spirit. He defeated the devil as a man.

I don't understand the continuous contention on this thread, you know what jo l think you are giving a little too much of your attention to this people whom l think have been staved of the opportunity to engage in a war of words in recent times and that frustration is driving then notoriously on speed in their determination to always see a need to attack persons rather than objectively contributing even at the detriment of deviating the core focus of a potencially interesting thread

I feel for Joagbaje,

I know its because of the possibility of threads like these to mislead and destroy the faith of some that he is responding to these people.
He is obviously not on their level: judging from knowledge of scriptures or the spiritual understanding he exhibits.

I personally haven't  brought anyone to this religion section since 2005. It hardly is edifying to me.
Some on this forum think it is a contest of opinions or an opinion poll. I laugh.

We can overrun this religion section if we choose to. Only one PCF in church can do the job. But we are led of the Spirit and the love of Christ constrains us.

@donnie
I challenge you to invite your goons to come and over run it and see if we won't take them to the cleaners. You would also definitely loose a good number of members cause their eyes would be open to the fraud going on in cec. The multiple I.D pranks your members are doing on this forum is making very little impact. So go and bring more of your deluded goons and let's open their eyes.

How friend, l wonder these people can't seem to get it that it is not somuch about body guards as it is to the issue of simply security because not everybody is friend with th e gospel and the preacher imagine the situation in the north today. Look at this scripture about Paul and Barnabas at Iconnium
Acts 14:2-5 TCNT
"Therefore Paul and Barnabas spent a long time, and spoke out fearlessly, relying upon the Lord, who comfirmed the Message of his Love by permitting signs and wonders to take place at their hands. BUT THE TOWNSPEOPLE WERE DIVIDED, SOME SIDING WITH THE JEWS, SOME WITH TH E APOSTLES; AND, WHEN THERE WAS AN ATTEMPT ON THE PART OF BOTH GENTILES AND JEWS, WITH TH EIR LEADING MEN, TO RESORT TO VIOLENCE AND TO STONE THEM"

Verse 6(NKV)
"They were ware of it, and fled unto Lystra and Derbe, cities of Lycaonia. . ."
You see they knew when to flee, why didn't they day stay and prove God that you be selfishness. The message was more important coz more people needed to hear it so they were wise enough to leave it is that same wisdom that is applicable in the meal presently being cooked

Thats my point. SECURITY IS COMMON SENSE.

Joagbaje:

Thats my point. SECURITY IS COMMON SENSE.

My own point! -- JERI 'CURLS too is common sense and so is a FAKE ACCENT to impress dull people. And so is GREED in a poverty stricken society.

In fact, everything is common sense as long as it is Joagbaje interpreting it to be so

Come one nuclear boy .
What is your palaver with another person hairstyle and accent. Don't you have your own

donnie:

I feel for Joagbaje,

I know its because of the possibility of threads like these to mislead and destroy the faith of some that he is responding to these people.
He is obviously not on their level: judging from knowledge of scriptures or the spiritual understanding he exhibits.

I personally haven't  brought anyone to this religion section since 2005. It hardly is edifying to me.
Some on this forum think it is a contest of opinions or an opinion poll. I laugh.

We can overrun this religion section if we choose to. Only one PCF in church can do the job. But we are led of the Spirit and the love of Christ constrains us.

Obviously one of those multiple IDs but I couldn't help but catch the highlighted part, Nigerians and "levels" and claim to be Christians, omase!

Jesus Christ called himself OUR BROTHER and now these fakes and their followers have "levels"(which I thought existed only in the occult world but i digress), truth coming out perhaps?

@Mr Jo

you said

Come one nuclear boy .
What is your palaver with another person hairstyle  and accent. Don't you have your own

Only a vain fraud will go around in jerry curls and a fake accent.

@ Mr Jo

Thanks for your reply, though i dont agree with it 100%.

I dont feel you should equate Elijah/Elisha with some of these Present day Men. however there is no yardstick to measure faith.

One more thing, Does Oyakilome have security?.

Another, do you aknowlegde that some Mog's are fraudulent? or do you just accept anybody with that label?

Thanks.