nopuqeater:

I asked if Eloi prayed to anyone, while jesus prayed all night to God Who he called Eloi on the cross, before it was finished. Is that a lie, or you are the cheat? I dont want to gloat. Facts are hard for you people to grasp! Shee you dey hear me, alethia? What I say about Jesus of the Bible is the truth. What you say of Muhammad (AS) is just mud slinging.

^Apparently old habits die hard. You stopped using that name for awhile after I asked you before who is this Eloi that you keep going on and on about? Is it the name of your god al-ilah? Does it appear anywhere in your qur'an? Is it among the so-called 99 names of your god? (Funny how your prophet supposedly has as many names as your god).
Even with the 99 names, Saviour does not appear among them because your god cannot save! Indeed he assures you of the Fire!

Nobody is mudslinging your prophet only reporting what is recorded in your ahadith.

nopuqeater:

When Jesus prayed the Lord's prayer, he asked for forgiveness of sins. And when Jesus was controlled by satan to jump off the cliff and his not being a bachelor, advising you about family life, none of these count, right? its it very similar to dante of aletheia advicing about spirituality.

#1. As always, (to be polite), you engage in terminological inexactitude.
#2. Doesn't your qur'an agree that Jesus is sinless? Where is it written that He was controlled by Satan (to use your words).
#3. Are you so desperate because the illogicality and inconsistencies of your Islam are coming to view that you begin to manufacture stories. Please provide evidence for your allegations above.
#4. What do you mean by "his not being a bachelor"? Who are you referring to? Rules of grammar: remember subject and predicate.
#5. I can see the reference to Dante has you all riled up. Remember it's just a work of fiction. OK.

@Aletheia: O ti sun ni daa yi? lol.
Oro mi gun e lara. O ma shee o. Inoo Olorun Oba Adeda, Oba ti ki sun ti ki nwo. Oba Aiku, Oba to daduro funra ra e, o ju oro mi lo.

You are in big cahounna problem, man. You and cgift. The c is for collapse on the cross!

Now Allah in Surah Nisaa answers your lies, making clear that father of a child is the man who sired him, or her and the boundary of blood relationship is set, so it led to abolishing adoption.

Abolition in islam is real. Unlike in Chrostianity, where it is only a word without any force behind it. Proof; check out what Jesus said about abolishing the Laws and prophets of the OT. Then the resultant force is what Paul said {cancel what jesus said and you can eat pork, and gods are now permissible). These are your faults. Aanu e nshee mi. Inoo ola e o ti ji in Fire of hell. Sorry lake of fire. I gat (got) to be consistent with Bible.

Quran; Surah Nisaa 23 to 26:
4:23 Sahih International
Prohibited to you [for marriage] are your mothers, your daughters, your sisters, your father's sisters, your mother's sisters, your brother's daughters, your sister's daughters, your [milk] mothers who nursed you, your sisters through nursing, your wives' mothers, and your step-daughters under your guardianship [born] of your wives unto whom you have gone in. But if you have not gone in unto them, there is no sin upon you. And [also prohibited are] the wives of your sons who are from your [own] loins[sons of Muhammad (as) in this case were Ibrahim, Kasim (ra), neither of whom was a husband of any wife because each died young, the reason Allah reminded men around the prophet (AS) that he was no a father to any of them, hence terminating adoption], and that you take [in marriage] two sisters simultaneously, except for what has already occurred. Indeed, Allah is ever Forgiving and Merciful.

4:24 Sahih International
And [also prohibited to you are all] married women except those your right hands possess [when your right hand possessed them, their husband may not even be around, ever. yet the functions of sensuality will still be effective. its like hunger. people have to eat. sex is very essential like that. i am sure you little boys dont know that since your minds are so juvenile, still]. [This is] the decree of Allah upon you. And lawful to you are [all others] beyond these, [provided] that you seek them [in marriage] with [gifts from] your property, desiring chastity, not unlawful sexual intercourse. So for whatever you enjoy [of marriage] from them, give them their due compensation as an obligation. And there is no blame upon you for what you mutually agree to beyond the obligation. Indeed, Allah is ever Knowing and Wise.

4:25 Sahih International
And whoever among you cannot [find] the means to marry free, believing women, then [he may marry] from those whom your right hands possess of believing slave girls. And Allah is most knowing about your faith. You [believers] are of one another. So marry them with the permission of their people and give them their due compensation according to what is acceptable. [They should be] chaste, neither [of] those who commit unlawful intercourse randomly nor those who take [secret] lovers [like you boys and your girls. the freebees, lewd in qualities. you seserve each other or one another since it is a chain reactional sex that you people engage in]. But once they are sheltered in marriage, if they should commit adultery, then for them is half the punishment for free [unmarried] women. This [allowance] is for him among you who fears sin, but to be patient is better for you. And Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.

4:26 Sahih International
Allah wants to make clear to you [the lawful from the unlawful] and guide you to the [good] practices of those before you and to accept your repentance. And Allah is Knowing and Wise.

aletheia, did you see repentance and acceptance of it between servant like me and Jesus to our Lord God Who is One? it is unlike your own that you have to invent a man between you and God, hence you say the man must die, shedding his blood for you. pitiful. this is why i think you are oloya from osun state. Eyin ara osun, e ma binu o. Aletheia lo nsee eron ibiye o, to nje amu ni buni.

@Aletheia: « #256 on: Today at 03:40:55 AM »

^Apparently old habits die hard. You stopped using that name for awhile after I asked you before who is this Eloi that you keep going on and on about?[/Quote]O ga fun e. laakaye o si fun e rara. here is your problem. Segun in yoruba is the same as triumphant in english. no? This is the same with Allah and Eloi.


[Quote]Is it the name of your god al-ilah? Does it appear anywhere in your qur'an?

Does triumphant appear anywhere in Yoruba print materials? yet Segun is well known. Oluwasegun is the same as Godtriumph. no? Allah is my Ilah.


[Quote]Is it among the so-called 99 names of your god? (Funny how your prophet supposedly has as many names as your god).
Even with the 99 names, Saviour does not appear among them because your god cannot save! Indeed he assures you of the Fire![/Quote]Read surah maryam where Allah says he has turned loose on you the evil one, because of your evil heart to stare you to pardition and land you in Hell. Continue. Soon, you will reach 100 years old. And you will be eager to die and be buried with the people of hell fire at the church burial ground. I know all about your kind. 99 Attributes of Allah includes the One Who Forgives, the One Who has Mercy. The One Who Protects. The One Who is Appreciative. The One Who is Capable. In all of these, if you do not see safety, then you are lost and you are a confirmed friend of Iblis. Your evil genius quality is apparent. I guess you are running for the presidency of Nigeria.


[Quote]Nobody is mudslinging your prophet only reporting what is recorded in your ahadith.[/Quote] Muddle on. Make firm your place in hell fire.


[Quote] from: nopuqeater on Today at 12:09:32 AM
When Jesus prayed the Lord's prayer, he asked for forgiveness of sins. And when Jesus was controlled by satan to jump off the cliff and his not being a bachelor, advising you about family life, none of these count, right? its it very similar to dante of aletheia advicing about spirituality.
#1. As always, (to be polite), you engage in terminological inexactitude.
#2. Doesn't your qur'an agree that Jesus is sinless?[/Quote]Show me a verse. Just one where it was stated. Your brother of Hell, cgift said 3/46 and I quoted it in arabic and translated it in English. where ia a verse, if you are not a liar?


[Quote]Where is it written that He was controlled by Satan (to use your words).[/Quote]You want his 3 temptations, or you want where he was driven into the wilderness to preach, or you want where he said "get away from me, Satan"? WHich one[s] so that i supply it/them to you?


[Quote]#3. Are you so desperate because the illogicality and inconsistencies of your Islam are coming to view that you begin to manufacture stories. Please provide evidence for your allegations above.[/Quote]Mark 1 verse 9-13, for starter. See how your people are playing on words, trying to make jesus look good. But of course, yahweh must really love him to have delivered him to the hands of Satan who was toying with him. You want an example, that one is for you. And i have not gone into the temptations of oh you jesus, throw yourself off the cliff, you are hungry here is bread for you to chop, you can own the whole of this world (impossible to show him the whole world that is not flat. You see your life in the Outside (shee o ri aiye e lode?). I can give you many until he said out aloud "get back from me, Satan!" sheee o fe gbo yen, ogbe ni oja? lol. I wo lo faa fun ara e o. I did not know that you know nothing of the Bible. O ma shee o.


[Quote]#4. What do you mean by "his not being a bachelor"? Who are you referring to? Rules of grammar: remember subject and predicate.[/Quote]Am toying with your mind. Who was a bachelor teaching you about marital life? Whatever you have no real knowledge of, can you teach anyone in depth? Thats what am insinuating. And heck with your grammar. I aint in classroom. This is real life, man. You want facts? I will give them to you raw!


[Quote]#5. I can see the reference to Dante has you all riled up. Remember it's just a work of fiction. OK.[/Quote]And he was not an original. Just like your claims. And your Gods. I use you to defeat you. Omode o le lakisaa to agbalagba. Gba be! Allah is on my side. Shaitan is your companion. Until you deyin leyin shaitan.

Many of the Attributes of Allah from the 99. Is there a Savior equal to any of these Attributes?


[b]1 الرحمن Ar-Rahmān The Compassionate, The Beneficent, The Gracious Beginning of every chapter except one, and in numerous other places. Name frequently used in Surah 55, Ar-Rahman.
2 الرحيم Ar-Rahim The Merciful Beginning of every chapter except one, and in numerous other places
3 الملك Al-Malik The King, The Master, The Sovereign Lord 59:23, 20:114
4 القدوس Al-Quddus The Holy, The Pure, The Perfect 59:23, 62:1
5 السلام As-Salām The Peace and Blessing, The Source of Peace and Safety, 59:23
6 المؤمن Al-Mu'min The Guarantor, The Affirming, 59:23
7 المهيمن Al-Muhaymin The Guardian, The Protector 59:23
8 العزيز Al-Aziz The Almighty, The Sufficient, The Honorable 3:6, 4:158, 9:40, 48:7, 59:23
9 الجبار Al-Jabbar The Irresistible, The Compeller, The Lofty, 59:23
10 المتكبر Al-Mutakabbir The Highest, The Greatest 59:23
11 الخالق Al-Khāliq The Creator 6:102, 13:16, 39:62, 40:62, 59:24
12 البارئ Al-Bāri' The Rightful 59:24
14 الغفار Al-Ghaffār The Forgiving 20:82, 38:66, 39:5, 40:42, 71:10
82 العفو Al-Afuww The Pardoner, The Effacer 4:99, 4:149, 22:60
83 الرؤوف Ar-Ra'ūf The Kind, The Pitying 3:30, 9:117, 57:9, 59:10[/b]


@Aletheia: See about punishments. I am warning you as one human to another. heed my warning or else,

15 القهار Al-Qahhār The Subduer 13:16, 14:48, 38:65, 39:4, 40:16
20 القابض Al-Qābid The Restrainer, The Straightener 2:245
21 الباسط Al-Bāsit The Extender / Expander [of Mercy or Punishment; the choice is yours aletheia. whatever it is Allah is capable] 2:245
22 الخافض Al-Khāfid The Abaser 95:5
25 المذل Al-Mu'dhell The Giver of Dishonour 3:26
28 الحكم Al-Hakam The Judge, The Arbitrator 22:69
40 الحسيب Al-Hasīb The Bringer of Judgment 4:6, 4:86, 33:39
43 الرقيب Ar-Raqīb The Watchful 4:1, 5:117
44 المجيب Al-Mujīb The Responsive, The Answer 11:61
45 الواسع Al-Wāsi' The Vast, The All-Embracing, The Omnipresent, The Boundless 2:268, 3:73, 5:54

48 المجيد Al-Majīd The Glorious 11:73
49 الباعث Al-Bā'ith The Resurrecter 22:7
50 الشهيد Ash-Shahīd The Witness 4:166, 22:17, 41:53, 48:28
51 الحق Al-Haqq The Truth, The Real 6:62, 22:6, 23:116, 24:25
57 المحصى Al-Muhsi The Accounter, The Numberer of All 72:28, 78:29, 82:10-12
61 المميت Al-Mumīt The Destroyer, The Bringer of Death 3:156, 7:158, 15:23, 57:2
69 القادر Al-Qādir The Omnipotent, The All Able 6:65, 36:81, 46:33, 75:40
70 المقتدر Al-Muqtadir The Determiner, The Dominant 18:45, 54:42, 54:55
71 المقدم Al-Muqaddim The Expediter, He Who Brings Forward 16:61, 17:34,
72 المؤخر Al-Mu'akhkhir The Delayer, He Who Puts Far Away 71:4
81 المنتقم Al-Muntaqim The Avenger 32:22, 43:41, 44:16
86 المقسط Al-Muqsiţ The Equitable, The Requiter 7:29, 3:18
90 المانع Al-Māni' The Withholder, The Shielder, the Defender 67:21
91 الضار Ad-Dārr The Distressor, The Harmer, The Afflictor 6:1

^^^Where is does Saviour or Salvation appear among these names. Satan also ascribed titles to himself.
KJV: Isaiah 4:13-14. For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

Your god aspires to be like the Most High: the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ but:

WEB: Jeremiah 10:10. . .Yahweh is the true God; he is the living God, and an everlasting King: at his wrath the earth trembles, and the nations are not able to abide his indignation. Thus shall you say to them, The gods that have not made the heavens and the earth, these shall perish from the earth, and from under the heavens.

Aletheia, everytime you write, you shoot yourself in the foot. Is christianity that knows and believe in salvation? No.
Even the Hindus, an eastern religion does, But i will leave you in your rage and blindness as its result of ignorance to wonder aimlessly about.

Here is Islam and what keeps people from hellfire. if this is not salvation, and Allah is not the Savior, then what is, Jesus, when the man called for Eloi to help him?

Islam
See also: Islam
[edit] Salvation

"Salvation" in Islam refers to the eventual entrance to heaven. The word does not cover the possible entry to hellfire, or the different levels of hellfire and heaven. The Quran teaches that the only thing guaranteeing no salvation is a disbelief in the “One God”; associating others with God,

Allah forgiveth not that partners should be set up with Him; but He forgiveth anything else, to whom He pleaseth; to set up partners with Allah is to devise a sin Most heinous indeed.[Qur'an 4:48]

The above verse is referring to the forgiveness in the hereafter. Those who die believing not in the “One God” do not receive salvation.

Those who die believing in the “One God”, but disbelieving in his message (Islam), are left to his will; God might forgive them, or might not.

Those who die believing in the “One God” and his message “Islam” receive salvation. Narrated Anas that Mohammad said,

Whoever said "None has the right to be worshipped but Allah" and has in his heart good (faith) equal to the weight of a barley grain will be taken out of Hell. And whoever said, "None has the right to be worshipped but Allah" and has in his heart good (faith) equal to the weight of a wheat grain will be taken out of Hell. And whoever said, "None has the right to be worshipped but Allah" and has in his heart good (faith) equal to the weight of an atom will be taken out of Hell.
—Prophet Mohammad Sahih al-Bukhari, 1:2:42

A person who becomes a Muslim must testify that "none has the right to be worshiped but Allah" indicating the belief in the One God, and "Mohammad is Allah's Apostle" indicating the belief in God's message.

Islam teaches that if one wishes to enter heaven, and avoid hellfire completely, one must believe in the "One God", and obey him following his message. There is no other way. The Quran states,

If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (submission to Allah), never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter He will be in the ranks of those who have lost (All spiritual good).[Qur'an 3:85]

[edit] Belief in the “One God”

Belief in the “One God”, also known as the Tawheed (التَوْحيدْ) in Arabic, is broken into two parts (or principals):

1. Tawheedo Al Ruboobeeya ( تَوْحيدُ الرُبوبِيَّة): Believing in the attributes of God and attributing them to no other but God. Such attributes include Creation, having no beginning, and having no end. These attributes are what make a God. Islam also teaches 99 names for God, and each of these names defines one attribute. One breaks this principle, for example, by believing in an Idol as an intercessor to God. The idol, in this case, is thought of having powers that only God should have, thereby breaking this part of Tawheed. No intercession is required to communicate with, or worship, God.
2. Tawheedo Al Ilooheeya (تَوْحيدُ الإِلوهيَّة): Directing worship, prayer, or deed to God, and God only. For example, Worshiping a planet, or God along with a creation, or multiple Gods, breaks this principle, and consequently breaks the Tawheed.

Tawheedo Al Ruboobeeya is seen to “imply” Tawheedo Al Ilooheeya, because it is seen that that who has the attributes of a God deserves to be worshiped.

Some Muslim scholars break the Tawheed into further parts by breaking Tawheedo Al Ruboobeeya into multiple parts putting emphases on some of the attributes of God that they see being vastly ignored, or forgotten, in their respective times. Many scholars, for example, state a third principle, Tawheedo Al Asma'a (تَوْحيدُ الأَسْماءْ) which explicitly states the belief in the names of God. Other scholars state another principal, Tawheedo Al Hukmee (تَوْحيدُ الحُكْم), which explicitly states the belief in the Governance Attribute of God, emphasizing this attribute which is a part of Tawheed seen to be vastly broken by modern governments of Muslim nations which do not follow the Islamic law.
[edit] The Test

To avoid hell, one must also avoid sin; belief is not enough; Islam acknowledges the inclination of man towards sin[Qur'an 3:85][Qur'an 12:51-53]. A Muslim must think of his sin, seek God's forgiveness and repent. However, this repentance must be sincere, and God's mercy must not be taken as a license to sin further. Islam teaches that God is Merciful, but it also teaches that he is wise. The Quran states:

Allah accept the repentance of those who do evil in ignorance and repent soon afterwards; to them will Allah turn in mercy: For Allah is full of knowledge and wisdom.<17> Of no effect is the repentance of those who continue to do evil, until death faces one of them, and he says, "Now have I repented indeed;" nor of those who die rejecting Faith: for them have We prepared a punishment most grievous.<18> [Qur'an 4:17]

Islam teaches that every person, including man, woman and prophet, is responsible for his/her own sins. A Muslim must be aware of his sin, and repent. The Quran states,

If ye reject (Allah), Truly Allah hath no need of you; but He liketh not ingratitude from His servants: if ye are grateful, He is pleased with you. No bearer of burdens can bear the burden of another. In the end, to your Lord is your Return, when He will tell you the truth of all that ye did (in this life). for He knoweth well all that is in (men's) hearts. [Qur'an 39:7]

Al-Agharr al-Muzani, a companion of Mohammad, reported that Ibn 'Umar stated to him that Mohammad said,

O people, seek repentance from Allah. Verily, I seek repentance from Him a hundred times a day.
—Prophet Mohammad Sahih Muslim, 35:6523

Sin in Islam is not a state, but an action (a bad deed); Islam teaches that a child who dies young, regardless of the belief of his parents, dies a Muslim; he enters heaven, and does not enter hell. Sahih al-Bukhari, 2:23:467

A Muslim must also think of heaven. The matter is not as simple as entering hellfire or entering heaven. Both hellfire and heaven have levels. A Muslim seeks to enter heaven and aims for the highest level. He does this by increasing his good deeds. In the Quran, whenever those who enter heaven are mentioned, and the virtue of belief is mentioned, it is coupled with the mention of good deeds. Some examples are,

But those who believe and work righteousness will be admitted to gardens beneath which rivers flow,- to dwell therein for aye with the leave of their Lord. Their greeting therein will be: "Peace!" [Qur'an 14:23]

But those who believe and do deeds of righteousness,- we shall soon admit them to gardens, with rivers flowing beneath,-to dwell therein for ever. Allah's promise is the truth, and whose word can be truer than Allah's? [Qur'an 4:122]

That He may reward those who believe and work deeds of righteousness: for such is Forgiveness and a Sustenance Most Generous." [Qur'an 34:4]

A Muslim does not believe that his good deeds merit him heaven, instead it is God's mercy on the people that lets them into heaven. The levels in heaven (and hell) are only a direct result of God's justice: those who do better, deserve better. Narrated Aisha, that Mohammad said,

"Do good deeds properly, sincerely and moderately, and receive good news because one's good deeds will not make him enter Paradise." They asked, "Even you, O Allah's Apostle?" He said, "Even I, unless and until Allah bestows His pardon and Mercy on me." Sahih al-Bukhari, 8:76:474

Those with belief will eventually enter heaven, but only after they are punished for their sins (those that God did not forgive). God forgives sins but it is not a guarantee. Therefore, a Muslim must keep a balance between fear of God, and hope in his mercy. One who does not have this balance is in danger of losing his belief; one who has absolute hope in God's mercy and no fear of his wrath will end up sinning, believing God will forgive him regardless, and one who has absolute fear of God's wrath and no hope in his mercy will also end up sinning, believing himself entering hellfire regardless.
[edit] Mandatory acts of worship

There are acts of worship that Islam teaches to be mandatory. According to Mohammad, Islam is built on five principles. Narrated Ibn 'Umar that Mohammad said,

Islam is based on (the following) five (principles):

1. To testify that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and Muhammad is Allah's Apostle.
2. To offer the (compulsory congregational) prayers dutifully and perfectly.
3. To pay Zakat (i.e. obligatory charity) .
4. To perform Hajj. (i.e. Pilgrimage to Mecca)
5. To observe fast during the month of Ramadan. Sahih al-Bukhari, 1:2:7

Not performing the mandatory acts of worship is a sin. See also Shirk. A person who becomes a Muslim must testify that "none has the right to be worshiped but Allah" indicating the belief in the One God, and "Mohammad is Allah's Apostle" indicating the belief in God's message and thereby obeying his commands. The Quran states.

, This day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion. , [Qur'an 5:3]

nopuqeater, my friend,

Just like the quran is so boring and uninspiring, so are your rejoinders to my posts. It is only a sense of duty such as writing an exam that can make someone read the quran due to its disjointed nature and lack of logic and sequencing. No logical and chronological order at all and mixes up times and seasons e.g. by placing Nimrod and Abraham in the same generation and so many other blunders. It is that same sense of suty that will only motivate me to respond to your lacklustre posts because they are so uninspiring and boring that I most times get lost in your trying to defend the indefensible. Let me extract some few areas in your posts and respond breifly.

nopuqeater:

@cgift: « #250 on: Today at 11:35:13 AM »Am a father of children. are you a father of any child? Yet am called by people who loved me dad. if one of them says am his father, did i sire him? Now this solve the problem that confound you about Jesus and then Allah the Almighty canceled adoption. is my step son my son? no. Is a son who is adopted my son? Can he marry his own blood sister just because they were not raised in the same household? Should he now not be able to marry my daughter, yet marry his own blood sister, because my daughter is his artificial sister, and his blood sister is raised in different household? you are a filthy person if you say he can marry his sister and my daughter he cant, for he must choose a wife from the two. You see the reality of Allah is different from your artificial god and all its impositions? And when the guy has a disease that is not from his adoptive family, who do they go to, except his real blood family? this is to let you know that lies of adoption does not wash. Allah says of Muhammad, "he is not the father of any of you men." another about adoption "call them by their father's name". And zayd (ra) was called by his blood father's name. Dont you bear your blood father's name, or are you a son of the adopted father? i hope you will not marry your own blood sister in order to proof a point.

So much irrelevance. But let me harp on the saient point of Sura 3: 46

[3:46] "He will speak to the people from the crib, as well as an adult; he will be one of the righteous."

Obviously this was referring to Christ abi ? At least Jesus was declared righteous. Now where in the Quran was Mohammad declared as such ?  

When i do pray for muhammad (AS), and request that Allah give him the honor of intercession, Maqam Mamuda, on the day of Judgement (from Surah Maryam and Surah Ahzab) it is for my own good and benefit.

Sorry, I dont need to pray for Jesus.  . You are interceding for the one who came to show the the way   , the blind leading the blind ? .A sinner praying for another sinner   A whole lot of commedy going on here  

Romans 8:34 , It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, , who also maketh intercession for us.

Christ intercedes for us. Who intercedes for you ? You are the one interceding for Mohammad and you dear say Jesus is not Superior. Well, how can someone who is dead that you are sending goodwill messages to in the grave even intercede for you anyway ?

You do not know the condition of jesus you never have seen. according to your bible, he died. that simply made him a human being,

But according to your quran, he rose again  

[Sura 19:33] And peace be upon me the day I was born, the day I die, and the day I get resurrected."

Does that still make him an ordinary human ?   Keep fooling yourself,

51    الحق    Al-Haqq    The Truth, The Real    6:62, 22:6, 23:116, 24:25

Jesus says in John 14:6

Jesus saith [/b]unto him, I am the way, [b]The truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Jesus says He is The Truth, and Allah says according to your post above that he is also called the Truth! So, Jesus is your God.  

4    القدوس    Al-Quddus    The Holy, The Pure, The Perfect    59:23, 62:1
28    الحكم    Al-Hakam    The Judge, The Arbitrator    22:69

Jesus The Judge:  John 9:39 “For judgment I have come into this world”.  

Jesus says He is your judge. Mohammad never said that

Jesus is called the Holy and Righteous One - Acts 3:14 (at least as stated above, the Suras declares Jesus as righteous)

Isaia. 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

And He said Himself in the book of John 14: 27 [b]Peace [/b]I leave with you, [b]my peace [/b]I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

My Peace he said, where is Mohammad's peace ? in the grave  

JESUS IS GOD!! HE IS YOUR GOD, EVEN YOUR QURAN DECLARES IT SO!!! You have falsely ascribed to Allah the names you should ascribe to Jesus.  

I wont waste anymore time on you. This case is settled. Jesus is your God.

In the qur'an Muhammad is by far exalted than Jesus, and recently a lot of people including Christians have rated prophet Muhammad S.A.W to be the most influential man to have walked the earth.

More importantly I worship God ---The ONE who created Jesus, why you worship his servant -- a pious man but Human, hence we can clearly see who settled for less.

The Qur'an was written by Muhammad so what do you expect
Rating Muhammad more than Jesus like you said was done by people and not GOD or Allah, so it is immaterial

I think what is paramount is the message they brought

Jesus of the Bible, according to you, must have lied or at least wrong when he said Eloi is God, and you say Yahweh is TRUE GOD!


It is you against Jesus of the Bible, aletheia.

Glory belongs to Allah Alone. I do not write for nigerian Christians, alone. No.

We are daayis, making Dawah for the pleasure of Allah to mankind carrying on the legacy of the noblest of the nobles, Muhammad{[as]the beloved of Allah} bin Abdullah bin Abi Mutalib, bin, bin, bin Hashimi, bin, bin, Kader, bin Ismail (AS), bin Ibrahim (AS), the friend of Allah.

Let me harp on the saient point of Sura 3: 46

[3:46] "He will speak to the people from the crib, as well as an adult; he will be one of the righteous."

Obviously this was referring to Christ abi ? At least Jesus was declared righteous. Now where in the Quran was Mohammad declared as such ?  

When i do pray for muhammad (AS), and request that Allah give him the honor of intercession, Maqam Mamuda, on the day of Judgement (from Surah Maryam and Surah Ahzab) it is for my own good and benefit.

Sorry, I dont need to pray for Jesus.  . You are interceding for the one who came to show the the way   , the blind leading the blind ? .A sinner praying for another sinner   A whole lot of commedy going on here  

Romans 8:34 , It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, , who also maketh intercession for us.

Christ intercedes for us. Who intercedes for you ? You are the one interceding for Mohammad and you dear say Jesus is not Superior. Well, how can someone who is dead that you are sending goodwill messages to in the grave even intercede for you anyway ?

You do not know the condition of jesus you never have seen. according to your bible, he died. that simply made him a human being,

But according to your quran, he rose again  

[Sura 19:33] And peace be upon me the day I was born, the day I die, and the day I get resurrected."

Does that still make him an ordinary human ?   Keep fooling yourself,  

51    الحق    Al-Haqq    The Truth, The Real    6:62, 22:6, 23:116, 24:25

Jesus says in John 14:6

Jesus saith [/b]unto him, I am the way, [b]The truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Jesus says He is The Truth, and Allah says according to your post above that he is also called the Truth! So, Jesus is your God.  

4    القدوس    Al-Quddus    The Holy, The Pure, The Perfect    59:23, 62:1
28    الحكم    Al-Hakam    The Judge, The Arbitrator    22:69

Jesus The Judge:  John 9:39 “For judgment I have come into this world”.  

Jesus says He is your judge. Mohammad never said that

Jesus is called the Holy and Righteous One - Acts 3:14 (at least as stated above, the Suras declares Jesus as righteous)

Isaia. 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

And He said Himself in the book of John 14: 27 Peace [/b]I leave with you, [b]my peace [/b]I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

My Peace he said, where is Mohammad's peace ? in the grave  

JESUS IS GOD!! HE IS YOUR GOD, EVEN YOUR QURAN DECLARES IT SO!!! You have falsely ascribed to Allah the names you should ascribe to Jesus.  

More importantly,

49    الباعث    Al-Bā'ith    The Resurrecter    22:7

Jesus is the Resurrecter!! He said, he will raise us up on the last day if you believe in Him. Allah claims his name is the Resurrecter!! Hmmm. Coincidence…No controversy, Jesus is your God? ( ) Don’t deny Him his Lordship.

John 6: 40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: [b]and I will raise him up at the last day  . These are Jesus's words not Paul's  

Jesus is the sweetest name i know, He is alwasy just the same oh raise hHis Holy name, that is the reason why I love Him so, JEsus is the sweetest name i know (sing sing sing , la la la)  

In The Name of Jesus ,

And Surah 3/46 says "One of the Righteous" I hope you know that One of the, implies that there are many "Righteous entities"? What a poor scholar cgift is!

John is also referred to as One of the righteous. All prophets are righteous, from Islamic point of view. I know the christians and jews say that David is a murderer, for example among many other terrible stigmas. Yet he was the man they attach his house so that Jesus the human god can be of honored bloodline.

And since cgift, doesa not have to pray for jesus, cgift conveniently forgot that the same jesus spent all night at geshamine praying, begging, crying out to Eloi/Allah the Almighty, not yahweh or Jehovah, mind you (these names have been dropped at the footsteps of the jews. Jesus didnt want to die, he cried out, asking that the cup (death) be taken off his head. That shows a real "lamb". A God begging is no God. Reality of the matter. I am sure all of these are over your understanding. (Again, am not engaging Nigerian Christians, only).

The christians amuse themselves and find solace/comfort in the statement of Paul, regardless of its going against the grain of what jesus said. Am sure Paul is your God, too, except you are too light thinking to see it. Roman 8/34, from paul. Is there a thread of truth going to jesus about it? Of course, because we cant find where jesus said he is anything that paul said he is! if any christian has it, we want it right here for all to see.

Surah 19/33; it is obvious that jesus was talking before anything happened to him, except he was born, as a baby in the crib, defending his mother. was he put on the cross at birth? cgift, i hope you read this as it actually happened;

29 But she [Mary, his mother] pointed to the babe. They said: "How can we talk to one who is a child in the cradle?"

What could Mary do? How could she explain? Would they, in their censorious mood, accept her explanation? All she could do was to point to the child, who, she knew, was no ordinary child. And the child came to her rescue. By a miracle he spoke, defended his mother, and preached-to an unbelieving audience.

30 He[Baby Jesus] said: "I am indeed a servant of Allah: He hath given me revelation and made me a prophet;

31 "And He hath made me Blessed wheresoever I be and hath enjoined on me Prayer and Charity as long as I live;

There is a parallelism throughout the accounts of Jesus and Yahya, [/b]with some variations. Both the parallelisms and the variations are interesting. For instance [b]Jesus declares at the very outset that he is a servant of Allah, thus negativing the false notion that he was Allah or the son of Allah. The greatness of Yahya is described in terms that are not applied to Jesus, but the verses xix. 14-15 as applied to Yahya are in almost identical terms with those applied to Jesus here. Devotion in Prayer and Charity is a good description of Christ at its best, and pity, purity, and devotion in Yahya are a good description of the ways leading to Prayer and Charity, just as John led to Jesus.

32 "(He) Allah hath made me kind to my mother and not overbearing or miserable;

Overbearing violence is not only unjust and harmful to those on whom it is practised; it is perhaps even more harmful to the person who practises it, for his soul becomes turbid, unsettled, and ultimately unhappy and wretched,-the state of those in Hell. Here the negative qualities are "not overbearing or miserable." As applied to John they were "not overbearing or rebellious." John bore his punishment from the State without any protest or drawing back.

33 "So Peace is on me the day I was born the day that I die and the Day that I shall be raised up to life (again)"!
and Christ was not crucified.

34 Such (was) Jesus the son of Mary: (it is) a statement of truth about which they (vainly) dispute.

The disputations about the nature of Jesus Christ were vain, but also persistent and sanguinary. The modern Christian churches have thrown them into the background, but they would do well to abandon irrational dogmas altogether.

35 It is not befitting to (the majesty of) Allah that He should beget a son. Glory be to Him! When He determines a matter He only says to it "Be" and it is. {Allah is talking about His Own Uniqueness, what is not possible that he does}

Begetting a son is a physical act depending on the needs of men's animal nature [And i have asked Christians many times, who is the wife of God that bore Him a son; no answer from anyone of them. Aletheia, cgift, take a crack at it, please]. Allah Most High is independent of all needs, and it is derogatory to Him to attribute such an act to Him. It is merely a relic of pagan and anthropomorphic materialist superstitions.

36 [b]Verily Jesus continued. This is exactly what the mark 12 verse 29 says; my Lord and your Lord is One God[/b]Allah is my Lord and your Lord: Him therefore serve ye: this is a Way that is straight.

As opposed to the crooked superstitions which take refuge in all sorts of metaphysical sophistries to prove three in one and one in three. In the Qur-an there is no crookedness (xviii. 1). Christ's teaching was simple, like his life, but the Christians have made it crooked.

[Sura 19:33] And peace be upon me the day I was born, the day I die, and the day I get resurrected."   which can also mean the day of judgment.  

futher more John was addressed in the same sura before the story of Jesus came up I quote
And piety (for all creatures) as from Us, and purity: He was devout,  (To his son came the command): "O Yahya! take hold of the Book with might": and We gave him Wisdom even as a youth, And kind to his parents, and he was not overbearing or rebellious. So Peace on him the day he was born, the day that he dies, and the day that he will be raised up to life (again)! 19:12-15.
Using your dubious standards you are supossed to worship him(JOhn)

But again since you are bent on closing your eyes to the truth I ask this when your god claimed in the NT that he does not know when the day of judgement was, was he Lying or was he telling the truth, if he was lying then one is better worshiping sticks than believing in a god that lies, but if he was telling the truth--- which he clearly was--- then you not only worship a god that is ignorant of his own plans but a god that apparent depends on the real GOD for answers.


Jjesus The Judge:  John 9:39 “For judgment I have come into this world”.  ----> your bible claimed he was judged by riff raffs--- judge indeed

Jesus says He is your judge. Mohammad never said that ------> you are confused as the thread is not about the divinity of Muhammad S.A.W ----> he never claimed to be GOD rather he submitted himself to GOD, even the Qur'an says Muhammad should jugde the affairs of his people that time  ---, BUT about the false claims that Jesus is divine.

Jesus is called the Holy and Righteous One - Acts 3:14 (at least as stated above, the Suras declares Jesus as righteous) ------>  it says one of the rightoues--meaning your god's righteousness is comparable to other men, a pity you have decided to settle for less.

Jesus is the Resurrecter!! He said, he will raise us up on the last day if you believe in Him. Allah claims his name is the Resurrecter!! Hmmm. Coincidence…No controversy, Jesus is your God? ( Shocked) Don’t deny Him his Lordship I cannot worship anybody that had to go to toilet, that will remain an imposibility, The perfect nature of GOD forbid's me to think so low about him, moreover, you god reportedly cursed a tree because it was out of season--> didn't he know that the tree was out of season before hand?  it seems your bible is spewing tales of an ignorant god. god indeed  

Jesus says in John 14:6

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, The truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Jesus says He is The Truth, and Allah says according to your post above that he is also called the Truth! So, Jesus is your God.   Grin
[quote][/Quote]While Jesus will have to yield to the "father" according to your statement, it is an indication that he is not in control. But then Truth is different from truth, the same way i say to you a real son must have a mother who is the wife of a real father.

in New York City, the old Pan Am building on park avenue is now kempers. kemper has an Umbrella, which is big enough to shelter other umbellas. The truth of jesus, and the truth of all messengers and prophets (AS) are under the TRUTH of their God Who sent them (Allah the Almighty) Creator. For Muhammad was known as Alamin (the truth, the honest, the trust holder, keeper; take your pick).

Brother Vedaxcool. Salaamualaykum wa Rahmatullah. May Allah reward with good, for all you are doing, not allwoing the liars and their lies to run unopposed.

@cgift;

Jesus The Judge: John 9:39 “For judgment I have come into this world”.

Jesus says He is your judge. Mohammad never said that

You said jesus is your Judge. Jesus cant judge me. I am from Muhammad (AS). I deal directly with God Who sent jesus. I am free of your shaitan.

Jesus is called the Holy and Righteous One - Acts 3:14 (at least as stated above, the Suras declares Jesus as righteous)[/Quote]Since there are many righteous people, are you saying that each therefore is God, the reason you are similar to a pagan?


[quote]Isaia. 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

So tell us, if you can which goverment office can we go back for his rulership: Israel or Judea? We know Pontius Pilate was ruling for and on behalf of Ceasar. When did jesu rule and did he rule? If you cant answer, that was a prophesy that was false. Now you have to eat crow [bird].

And He said Himself in the book of John 14: 27 Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

Salaama, he said. All muslims say it. Een the jews have shalom. Whats your peace? And those who say Salaam must be closer to Jesus true identity. nothing of his that you do, except that you elevated him to a god, and want him to carry your sins, for you. you must really love him, with all the evil that you commit in lagos.

My Peace he said, where is Mohammad's peace ? in the grave Grin

Surah Ahzab. Salaamualaykum wa Rahmatullah. Very rewarding. And it is on our lips to one another, and in the salah.

JESUS IS GOD!! HE IS YOUR GOD, EVEN YOUR QURAN DECLARES IT SO!!! You have falsely ascribed to Allah the names you should ascribe to Jesus. Grin

The jamaicans say mouth is made to chat, so you are free to say whatever comes ourt of it, cgift without thinking it through. And Jesus said he is a servant, sent. Now explain that.
I know that you begged every point that we made, in recent posts. Again, we will leave you to wallow in your ignorance. Alhamdulillah, our responses are for the wider people who will come across this, InshaAllah.

Brother Vedaxcool. Salaamualaykum wa Rahmatullah. May Allah reward with good, for all you are doing, not allwoing the liars and their lies to run unopposed.
---- Walayaknum salam waramatulahi Tabarikatu, Amin Wa Yaku.
 
For those that claim that Jesus said he is GOD, pls point out a single verse that Jesus said with his mouth that " i am god and worship",  you will not find anywhere he made those blasphemous statement, yet if this is suppose to be one of the most important teaching's in "his" "religion" yet he never uttered the words I am god, isn't this a pity that the most important teachings of Christianity are actually the hand work of Paul? if Jesus had ever claimed to the Jews that he is god they would have snuffed the life out of him in a matter of minutes, because then,no Jew would ever accept another Jews to be GOD, that was why they rejected the polytheism of the Romans. If you can't find any verse that Jesus claimed he is god, then it is nothing more than a heap of falsehood that some individuals  forced on him.

Jesus is the Resurrecter!!

The same way he prayed to himself in Geshamane, and it all came down, according to you, zero. the same way he cried to himself for abandoning himself, and came to "it is finish", a statement of dejection. Reality is far away fromyou cgift.

He said, he will raise us up on the last day if you believe in Him.[/Quote]And the Bible said he promised to spend 3 days and 3 nights in the belly of the earth. There was no grave dug. And friday to sunday is not exactly 3 days and 3 nights. some people are now sayng t was wednesday that he was hung. funny people.


[Quote]Allah claims his name is the Resurrecter!! Hmmm. Coincidence…No controversy, Jesus is your God? ( Shocked) Don’t deny Him his Lordship. Grin[/Quote]And when you beg enough, the rejection is still the same. i do not take jew or anything for God. My Ilah is Allah ta'ala.


[Quote]John 6: 40 And this is[b] the will of him that sent me[/b], that every one which seeth the Son,

Who is the wife? Am hoping that you see that a Sender is always Higher than the one sent. Always a servant, when sent.


[Quote]and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day  Shocked. These are Jesus's words not Paul's  Grin[/Quote]You say its Jesus words. The evidence shows the opposite since he said "Of my own power, I can do nothing". This alone is enough. Then we see that 3 days and 3 nights in the belly of the earth, did not happen.


[Quote]Jesus is the sweetest name i know,[/Quote]Your knowledge is limited.


[Quote]He is alwasy just the same oh raise hHis Holy name, that is the reason why I love Him so, JEsus is the sweetest name i know (sing sing sing , la la la)  Grin[/Quote]Same condition as that of Ogun worshipers. Again, the conversation is not to your kind, but to the world at large.

@Aletheia: You asked for salvation, and or savior, which you know are derived from "Save" Allah save believers, from not entering hellfire but herd the disbelievers into it. The believers here are muslims. And you sir, is not a muslim.

Finally, Allah made it clear that even the christians believe that jesus was a teacher, a prophet. This goes to the essence why he said the "another Comforter" shall teach, a function of a prophet. Is the ghost a prophet, or was jesus a ghost? where is the sermon preached by the ghost who taught to all things?


savior

4 definitions found

savior - Collaborative International Dictionary of English v.0.48 :

Savior \Sav"ior\ (s[=a]v"y[~e]r), n. [OE. saveour, OF. salveor,
F. sauveur, fr. L. salvator, fr. salvare to save. See Save,
v.] [Written also saviour.]
1. One who saves, preserves, or delivers from destruction or
danger.
[1913 Webster]

2. Specifically: The (or our, your, etc.) Savior, he who
brings salvation to men; Jesus Christ, the Redeemer.
[1913 Webster]

savior - WordNet (r) 2.1 (2005) :

Savior
n 1: a teacher and prophet born in Bethlehem and active in
Nazareth; his life and sermons form the basis for
Christianity (circa 4 BC - AD 29) [syn: Jesus, Jesus of Nazareth
, the Nazarene, Jesus Christ, Christ,
Savior, Saviour, Good Shepherd, Redeemer,
Deliverer]
2: [b]a person who rescues you from harm or dange[/b]r [syn: savior,
saviour, rescuer, deliverer]

nopuqeater:

And Surah 3/46 says "One of the Righteous" I hope you know that One of the, implies that there are many "Righteous entities"? What a poor scholar cgift is!

This got me seriously cracking   You know the summary :

1. Jesus was declared righteous (both the Quran and The Holy Bible confirms it right?). Mohammad  on the other hand was never declared righteous. In fact, he was asked to ask for forgiveness of his past, present and future sins  
2. Mohammad is rotten in the grave, Jesus Christ, died, and rose again
3. Muslims are supposed to be interceding for their own prophet, Jesus Christ is the One nterceding for us! Remarkable difference
4. The divine nature of Jesus was corroborated even by the quran! No man was involved in his conception, so, from birth, he did not carry the original sin. Neither did He commit any sin in all of the years he spent on earth. Mohammad had all the sins, both original and the fake   His sins are numerous that the Hadiths say he asked for forgiveness of sins 70 times a day and even went ahead to ask for forgiveness of future sins!
5. Mohammad will never aspire to the kind of honour that even the quran ascribed to Jesus!
6. Jesus ordered the death of no one but instead died in place of the guilty.   Mohammad ordered the death of many men and women
7. Jesus is mentioned in the Quran 97 times. Mohammed is mentioned in the Quran 25 times!! Even in the book he wrote himself, he was a nobody
8. Old Testament predicts His (Jesus's)  2nd coming in more Scriptures than his first. Mohammed had only self fulfilling prophecy, nothing in the Old Testament predicted his coming.
9. Miracles and healing’s were given freely, Jesus healed all kinds of diseases. Mohammad, did no miracles of healing or delivering people from demons. In fact, he himself was possed and frequently had convulsions  
10. Jesus was never married   but Mo? Lord have mercy   was married to about 22 women one of which was only 9 years old at the time.  He set the pace for paedophilia. BTW, you have not told us why he restriced you people to only 4 ? Only hypocrites and selfish people do that
11. Jesus lived a sinless life, never once prayed for forgiveness like other sinners, he forgave others but Mo? Prayed often for forgiveness of his sins.

Let me stop here.

I can go and on. Jesus remains the Way. He is alive!!! Please come show me Mohammad's tomb, let me go and visit him and pay my last respect. at least a flower would do.  

I hope you have sent your prayers to Allah on Mohammed's behalf today ?

On the main topic on whether Jesus is God or not, even if i open your cranial cavity, you will never understand it. Its not meant for you at the stage  you are in right now. You will need a mind renewal to understand. So there is no need, but meanwhile, let me enjoy the comparisons between the founder of your religion and the Founder of Life itself.  

[quote author=nopuqeater link=topic=445327.msg6592477#msg6592477 date=1282126949]
Jesus says in John 14:6

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, The truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Jesus says He is The Truth, and Allah says according to your post above that he is also called the Truth! So, Jesus is your God.   Grin

[/Quote]While Jesus will have to yield to the "father" according to your statement, it is an indication that he is not in control. But then Truth is different from truth, the same way i say to you a real son must have a mother who is the wife of a real father.

Jesus says in John 14:6

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, The truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

I really don't understand the argument in the above statement. The way to life is truth. Jesus was not referringto himself as a person but referring to the truth.

John 19: 28 - 30

28After this, Jesus knowing that all things were now accomplished, that the scripture might be fulfilled, saith, I thirst.

29Now there was set a vessel full of vinegar: and they filled a spunge with vinegar, and put it upon hyssop, and put it to his mouth.

30When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

Jesus was still alive in verse 28, but he knew he had completed his work which did not include his dying!!! contrary to what most of my christian brothers will say. His dying was actually a consequence of his work which was to bring the truth to man. He knew this and was asking for the cup to pass over him in the garden. He said he was thirsty to fulfill the scripture and said it is finished.

See passages below, Jesus knew his death was a consequence of and not the work itself
Mat 26:39  And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.
Mat 26:42  He went away again the second time, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if this cup may not pass away from me, except I drink it, thy will be done.

@Aletheia: you see that the Jews' say Adonai, while you are stuck with yahweh, and jesus said Eloi.
Matthew 4:10 New International Version About NIV
Jesus said to him, "Away from me, Satan! For it is written: 'Worship the LORD your God, and serve him only.' "
Read Entire Chapter  |  Read In Parallel  

Matthew 4:10 Complete Jewish Bible About CJB
"Away with you, Satan!" Yeshua told him, "For the Tanakh says, `Worship ADONAI your God, and serve only him.'"

Jesus even said Peter is Shaitan. Yet he was from his priced followers. Arent you a bigger shaitan? And you are comparing these below to anything from islam? When you have a leader of this caliber why would you not say God is three and one of them is a dead man!

Matthew 16:23 New International Version About NIV
Jesus turned and said to Pete[/b]r, "[b]Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me; you do not have in mind the things of God, but the things of men."
Read Entire Chapter  |  Read In Parallel  

Matthew 16:23 Complete Jewish Bible About CJB
But Yeshua turned his back on Kefa, saying, "Get behind me, Satan! You are an obstacle in my path, because your thinking is from a human perspective, not from God's perspective!"

his got me seriously cracking  Grin You know the summary :

1. Jesus was declared righteous (both the Quran and The Holy Bible confirms it right?). Mohammad  on the other hand was never declared righteous. In fact, he was asked to ask for forgiveness of his past, present and future sins-----> so did declare other prophets so go worship them too.
2. Mohammad is rotten in the grave, Jesus Christ, died, and rose again -----> Funny he had to go to toilet after eating,god indeed
3. Muslims are supposed to be interceding for their own prophet, Jesus Christ is the One nterceding for us! Remarkable difference---> this same Jesus that begged GOD to "let this cup pass over me" in other words he depended on ALLAH for HELP
4. The divine nature of Jesus was corroborated even by the quran! No man was involved in his conception, so, from birth, he did not carry the original sin. Neither did He commit any sin in all of the years he spent on earth. Mohammad had all the sins, both original and the fake  Grin His sins are numerous that the Hadiths say he asked for forgiveness of sins 70 times a day and even went ahead to ask for forgiveness of future sins-----> this same Jesus that say to called non-jews(including cgift) dogs according to the bible, that called his mum woman as if she were his mate, that called the his elders aldultrous, brood of snakes etc, sinless indeed
5. Mohammad will never aspire to the kind of honour that even the quran ascribed to Jesus!----> ALLAH calls MUHAMMAD A MERCY UPON THE WORLD THAT IN ITSELF IS ABOVE ANY COMMENDATION THAT WAS GIVEN To ANY PROPHET, Jesus said I am for the Jews and acc. to your bible called non-jews including cgift dogs.
6. Jesus ordered the death of no one but instead died in place of the guilty-----> BY CRYING MYLORD MYLORD WHY HAVE THOU FORSAKEN ME SHOWS CLEARLY HOW WILLING HE WAS TO DIE FOR YOUR SINS, FURTHERMORE HE SAID I CAN BY MYSELF DO NOTHING--THIS TRANSLATED TO THE FACT THAT HE DID NOT KNOW THE DAY OF JUDGEMENT.     Mohammad ordered the death of many men and women-----> SO DID JESUS ORDERED HIS DISCIPLES TO SELL THEIR GARMENTS AND BUY SWORDS IN TURN PETER STRUCK SOMEONE;S EAR IN ACCORDANE WITH THE PLAN TO DEFEND JESUS.
8. Old Testament predicts His (Jesus's)  2nd coming in more Scriptures than his first. Mohammed had only self fulfilling prophecy, nothing in the Old Testament predicted his coming.---> THIS OLD TESTAMENT THAT IS FILLED WITH TALES OF CRUEL VIOLENCE AND ACTION? THE OLD TESTAMENT SAYS THAT THEY SHALL CALL HIM EMMANUEL BUT THERE IS NOT A SINLE PLACE WHERE JESUS WAS REFFERED TO AS IMMANUEL, HENCE HE DID NOT FULFILL THE PROPHECY, futhermore moses made a stick into a snake, that is more than any thing Jesus did.
9. Miracles and healing’s were given freely, Jesus healed all kinds of diseases. Mohammad, did no miracles of healing or delivering people from demons(YOU ARE A REKNOWED LIAR, AS THERE ARE TALES OF prophet MUHHAMD s.a.w HEALING PEOPLE).

In the hadiths it is prophesied that Jesus will pray behind MAHDI ON HIS RETURN.

Here is a candidate that is more than Jesus in the Bible

Paul's Innovation
"For this Melchizedek, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, Without father,
without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life, "
(Hebrews 7:1,3)

Isn't Melchizedek more than Jesus since Jesus had a beginning and an end,had a mother,, etc according to your vain understanding of divinity? Misguide are those who claim that ALLAH is Equal to partners they created,
Indeed IDOL WORSHIP IS WORSE THAN CARNAGE.

« #274 on: Today at 12:40:26 PM »
Quote from: nopuqeater on Today at 11:06:53 AM
And Surah 3/46 says "One of the Righteous" I hope you know that One of the, implies that there are many "Righteous entities"? What a poor scholar cgift is!

This got me seriously cracking  Grin You know the summary :

1. Jesus was declared righteous (both the Quran and The Holy Bible confirms it right?). Mohammad  on the other hand was never declared righteous. In fact, he was asked to ask for forgiveness of his past, present and future sins  Grin

Alhamdulillah that the One Who declared jesus one of the righteous, declared John the same, too and declared Muhammad (AS) as His Messenger to all mankind and the seal of prophethood,. I am sure you do not understand it, though jesus was a prophet, too.

2. Mohammad is rotten in the grave, Jesus Christ, died, and rose again[/Quote]And the fact that Jesus of the Bible died, was an enough evidence for his not being a real God, for at death he couldnt have been able to do anything, since he said from his own account while fully alive that he had no power to do anything, too, These are the facts. While you grin senselessly, am unconcerned about you.

3. Muslims are supposed to be interceding for their own prophet, Jesus Christ is the One nterceding for us! Remarkable difference

No one intercedes for Muhammad (AS) the leader of mankind, who led jesus in Salatul Ala Ibrahima at Masjid Aqsa. You know the place in Ilya?

4. The divine nature of Jesus was corroborated even by the quran! No man was involved in his conception, so, from birth, he did not carry the original sin. Neither did He commit any sin in all of the years he spent on earth. Mohammad had all the sins, both original and the fake  Grin His sins are numerous that the Hadiths say he asked for forgiveness of sins 70 times a day and even went ahead to ask for forgiveness of future sins!

A circus comedian. I asked, who was the mother of jesus and wife of Eloi? Answer it now, or forever know that you are just talking without any substance.

5. Mohammad will never aspire to the kind of honour that even the quran ascribed to Jesus!

Muhammad (AS) is the aspiration of all Messengers and Prphets, including Jesus son of Mary (AS). The one guaranteed intercession is Muhammad, and no one else, before or at same time before him. Never!

6. Jesus ordered the death of no one but instead died in place of the guilty.     Mohammad ordered the death of many men and women

While you libe in a bubble, jesus said "bring him to me and kill him", he further said whoever didrespected his parent is worthy of death, no mercy. But then he said of his mother :Who is my mother, but you here?". If ordering of peoples death is the criteria of evil, Yahweh, Jehovah, who you say Jesus is, is the leader that controlled Moses to all those many slaughters. I wonder if you think your responses, through before writing?

7. Jesus is mentioned in the Quran 97 times. Mohammed is mentioned in the Quran 25 times!! Even in the book he wrote himself, he was a nobody

How many times is Moses mentioned? I guess he is greater than jesus? So was Ibrahim. And many other (AS) of the prophets and messengers. You are not so bright, I can see, holding on to simpletons.

8. Old Testament predicts His (Jesus's)  2nd coming in more Scriptures than his first. Mohammed had only self fulfilling prophecy, nothing in the Old Testament predicted his coming.

Give me a verse, a full name, any place they say jesus. I will be satisfied, because that was what they called him. If you say Immanuel, I will askk you to give me a berse where he was called Immanuel in all the 33 years you claimed he was alive.

9. Miracles and healing’s were given freely, Jesus healed all kinds of diseases. Mohammad, did no miracles of healing or delivering people from demons. In fact, he himself was possed and frequently had convulsions  Grin

If you are start you would checked sources about miracles of healing from Allah through the hands of Muhammad (AS), and know that jesus said he couldnt do anything from his own power.

10. Jesus was never married

And he gave you advise about marriage.

but Mo? Lord have mercy  Grin was married to about 22 women one of which was only 9 years old at the time.  He sent the pace for paedophilia.

And Solomon had 700 wives and 300 concubines, each of the two sets is 25 times 22, while the total number of wives was only 11. But then a man must be a pedophile for marrying a wife younger than him, the wife that was born before islam, considering that her father was one of the earliest muslims, in the first year, whereas she was recorded as being born before then, from a mother who rejected islam and her father divorced her for that reason right away.

11. Lived a sinless life, never once prayed for forgiveness like other sinners, he forgave others. Prayed often for forgiveness of his sins as did all the prophets in the OT and NT.

From the Bible jesus lived a sinful life, up to the moment he asked why Eloi abandoned him. That doubt or question is equal to sin. A true beliver says to God, "I hear and i obey".

Let me stop here.

You are on a roll. I am responding, until ,

I can go and on. Jesus remains the Way. He is alive!!! Please come show me Mohammad's tomb, let me go and visit him and pay my last respect. at least a flower would do.  Grin

For the misguided, he is the way, as you said. The way to jahannam. Now you wanna go to where the noblest of souls is buried? Visit Madina. rather, visit israel first, and tell the jews you wan aconvert them to christianty. Then tell them you wanna go to masjid Aqsa. The go to madina. This is the best route for you.

I hope you have sent your prayers to Allah on Mohammed's behalf today ?p/quote]I make my blessng on him, benefiting my own soul.


[quote]On the main topic on whether Jesus is God or not, even if i open your cranial cavity, you will never understand it. Its not meant for you at the stage  you are in right now. You will need a mind renewal to understand. So there is no need, but meanwhile, let me enjoy the comparisons between the founder of your religion and the Founder of Life itself.  Grin]/quote]And jesus said "am a servant of God, Who sent me". You need interpretation for this?



@Dalby (m): « #275 on: Today at 12:47:38 PM »
[quote]Quote from: nopuqeater on Today at 11:22:29 AM
Jesus says in John 14:6

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, The truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Jesus says He is The Truth, and Allah says according to your post above that he is also called the Truth! So, Jesus is your God.   Grin
Quote
While Jesus will have to yield to the "father" according to your statement, it is an indication that he is not in control. But then Truth is different from truth, the same way i say to you a real son must have a mother who is the wife of a real father.


Jesus says in John 14:6

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, The truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

I really don't understand the argument in the above statement. The way to life is truth. Jesus was not referringto himself as a person but referring to the truth.[/Quote]And when he said, "Of my own power, I can do nothing", and "I am a servant of God, Who sent me" and "your Lord is my Lord, Who is One God". are these a sign that Jesus is also telling the truth or was he not the one person who said these? Was Moses not the way, the truth of the children of israel who he led from aegypt to victory, when Yahweh made him God? You forgot about that?


[quote]John 19: 28 - 30

28After this, Jesus knowing that all things were now accomplished, that the scripture might be fulfilled, saith, I thirst.

29Now there was set a vessel full of vinegar: and they filled a spunge with vinegar, and put it upon hyssop, and put it to his mouth.

30When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

Jesus was still alive in verse 28, but he knew he had completed his work which did not include his dying!!! contrary to what most of my christian brothers will say. His dying was actually a consequence of his work which was to bring the truth to man. He knew this and was asking for the cup to pass over him in the garden. He said he was thirsty to fulfill the scripture and said it is finished.

See passages below, Jesus knew his death was a consequence of and not the work itself
Mat 26:39  And he went a little farther, and[b] fell on his face, and prayed[/b], saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.
Mat 26:42  He went away again the second time, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if this cup may not pass away from me, except I drink it, thy will be done.

We see that the above is a narration by someone, and not Jesus. Is the above figure worthy of being called God? Even the sango wordhipers never will admit to this much weakness from their god. As i pray daily, so did jesus prayed, at leat 2ice in one night; Isha and Subh. And whe a man is said to be the son of any entity, his mother must be the wife of that entity, otherwise he is a bastard, npt real son, and xant inherit from the claimed father (Jesus daid, as it is done in heaven so shall it be done on earth).

[/quote]

THE CAPTURE OF "GOD"

A Friend Betrayed the Secret Hiding Place of "God": "And Judas also, which
betrayed him, knew the place: for Jesus off-times resorted thither with his
disciples. Judas then, having received a band of man and officers from the
chief priests and Pharisees, cometh thither with lanterns and torches and
weapons." (John, 18:2-3)

"God" Was Arrested, Bound and Led Away: "Then the band and the captain and
officers of the Jews took Jesus, and bound him, and led him away." (John,
18:12-13)

"God" Was Humiliated: "And the men that held Jesus mocked him, and smote
him. And when they had blindfolded him, they struck him on the face."
(Luke, 22:63-64). "Then did they spit in his face, and buffeted him; and
others smote him with the palms of their hands." (Matthew, 26:67)

"God" Was Defenseless: "One of the officers which stood by struck Jesus with
the palm of his hand", he said: "Why smitest thou me?" (John, 18:22-23)

"God" Was Condemned to Death: "And they all condemned him to be guilty of
death." (Mark, 14:64). "They answered and said, he is guilty of death."
(Matthew, 26:66)

The Dumb and Docile "God": "He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like
a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth." (Acts, 8:32)

You guys are on serious rampage I can feel it right from my computer screen. You must be very angry Ok. take it easy nopuqeater, vedaxcool and chakula. Make una take am easy. i no want make una blood vessels go rupture o.

Let me bring you guys further home:

Mark 4:12 That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them.

Those were Jesus' words. That is why I will never waste my time in trying to prove that Jesus is God to you. I dont ever expect you to understand that because I know that it is a sheer waste of time. You cannot never comprehend spiritual things cos there is nothing spiritual in Islam. Its just a culture of 7th century Arabia that Mohammad packaged into a book and gave you as scriptures. So, its the Holy Spirit of God Himself that will take time out to speak to your hearts.

Back to our points:

You obviously dont believe in all that Jesus said according to the Bible right ? Now, when Jesus said is the Way, the Truth and the Life and that nobody comes to the Father except by Him. He states it explicitly that Salvation is found in no one else ut only through Him. Now you have a problem with that right ?

Jesus came at about 600 years ealier than Mohammed and operated His ministry for about 3 years on earth and the Bible is what captured all of His sayings while on earth. Now, if I have quoted Jesus saying for instance

John 6: 40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day and this:

John 8:12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: [/b]he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, [b]but shall have the light of life. and also this:

Matthew 14: 15

He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

And then you come back to cunter all of His sayings that they are not correct and all of that, I then will ask you this simple question:

Seeing that the Quran did not capture even 2% of Jesus' ministry on earth, on what/which authority and against what source are you raising your objections ? Do you have any reference material in your Quran or Hadiths that capture the activities and events of Jesus' ministry from the age of 30 to 33 ?

This is my submission: if you dont have any records of his ministry's events, how then can you claim that what he has said is wrong and not correct ? I would have expected that the Quran would cover all of the activities of Jesus' ministries, words, actions, and events for only then can you come and start comparing stories and records before making valuable judgements on whether Jesus' stories are mere fables or not in comparison to the same stories but ascaptured in the quran. The only thing I see here is that the words of Mohammad has made him an undisputable lunatic because they are widely at variance with all written historical records -e.g. how can he say that Noah's flood took place in Moses' days (Sura 7:136, compare 7:59ff)? Was he high on drugs or what? Furthermore, he could not even substantiate his claim on the reception of the quran which made him to give 3 different accounts:

1. We are first told that allah came to Mohammed in the form of a man and that Mohammad saw him Sura 53:2-18)
2. Then we are told that it was the Holy Spirit that came to Mohammad (Sura 16:102; 26:192-194)
3. The last and the most popular version is that it was the angel Gabriel who delivered the Quran to him (Sura 2:97). May be angel Gabriel is your own the Holy Spirit

So, how can i take that kind of man and his book seriously?

Let me summarize:

If you have the records of Jesus' sayings, actions, and events during his earthly ministry, produce them and lets start our discussions from there. If you dont, you are restricted to what the Bible has recorded that He said and did. And if that is teh case, please, I beg of you, never disclaim anything Jesus said again when it is lifted from the Bible cos you dont have any proof of what He said outside of the Bible else you will only be showing yourself as stupid, ignorant and arguing for the sake of it without facts.

John 8:12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: [/b]he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, [b]but shall have the light of life. Jesus says emphatically He is the Light of the World. . Follow Him, he will reveal his love into your heart. You have never experienced true love before, taste and see that the Lord Jesus is good. Experience Him, you will be hooked and wished you had known Him earlier.

Remember, Jesus is Alive!!! Mohammad is Dead.

nopuqeater:

@Aletheia: you see that the Jews' say Adonai, while you are stuck with yahweh, and jesus said Eloi.

Ignorance compounded by error. Cherry picking verses in a pathetic attempt at expounding the Bible. Indeed the Light shines in the darkness and the darkness comprehends it not. Some questions for you so that we will see your ignorance exposed:
#1. Why did the Jews say Adonai (Lord) instead of Yahweh?
#2. What is the meaning of Eloi? Did your prophet describe his god as Eloi?
#3. Again the question you are avoiding: Where in your qur'an is the name Eloi? Does it occur among the 99 names of your god?

On Salvation

What does the qur'an teach about Sin?
All false religions (including Islam) fail to deal with sin because they offer no final forgiveness of sin. They rely on man's good works, which are inadequate.
#1. Does Islam have a consciousness of sin and guilt?
#2. Does it have a way for the Muslim to be finally cleansed of sin?
#3. Indeed, does Islam even notice sin?

In Sura 6:120, you are told to forsake the "inwardness" of sin. How? Every person KNOWS he has sinful thoughts. Where is the power in Islam to forsake sin? Where do forsaken sins go?

This is small comfort. What about my sins against other men and God?
#1. Furthermore, you will never find in Islam how the penalty of sin is paid.
#2. In our human courts, and in the heavenly court, all unlawful acts have penalties attached. In fact, a law without a penalty attached is void from the day of inception.
#3. Where is Islam's payment of the penalty for sin, especially these small sins and the ones in which I only hurt myself?

Your prophet had no way to pay the penalty of sin and keep on living. Your prophet totally ignored the sacrifice of Jesus Christ on the cross. Why? Answer: He refused to acknowledge that he needed payment for his sin. He wanted to work up a good show for al-ilah and see if he could get into heaven on his own merits. Men who willfully stay dead in sin don't impress the God of the Bible.
The God of the Bible demands payment for acts of sin, al-ilah looks the other way and no one pays for their sins. Which of these deities is holy? Stop and think about this. Obviously the god that ignores sins isn't holy!

Muhammad was stuck[b] just like the Jewish Pharisees of Jesus' day.[/b] They refused to confront the holiness of God through "new birth," so they had to make an endless list of small sins to avoid, everyone of them becoming very important as time and tradition took over.
Islam has a similar long list of sins which must be avoided rather than cleansed and forgiven. It is found in the hadiths. Here is a few examples, though there are perhaps 4000, of the small sins that the Muslim cannot commit:
Al Hadis, Book 1, Chap. 7, No. 54- Ibn Mas'ud reported that the Messenger of Allah said: 'Don't cleanse yourselves (wipe your backside) with impure things, nor with bones, because these are the provision (food) of your brethren from the Jinn (demons)'. Attested by Tirmizi, Nisai
^This shows you the mind of "The Prophet" of al-ilah. When sin cannot be paid, it is necessary to make silly little laws about the most mundane thing, like wiping your bottom after relieving oneself.

Al Hadis, Book 1, Chap 8, No. 58- Abdullah-b-Sarjas reported that the Messenger of Allah said: 'None of you must pass urine in a snake's hole'. Attested by Nisai, Abu Daud
^Why? There is no reason given. What is al-ilah telling us about urine and snakes? The serpent is the image of evil in the Word of God. Why is al-lah showing this consideration for snakes?

Al Hadis, Book 2, Chap. 11, No. 109- Abu Sayeed-al-Khodri reported that the Messenger of Allah said: 'When a fly falls into your food, drown it (in the food), because there is poison in one of its wings and a cure in the other, and it gives off the poison first and the cure last.' Attested by Sharhi Sunnat.
^I wonder how many Muslims are faithfully doing this today? Also, it would be of great use to follow up on this bit of medical information and identify the cure in a fly's wing. Perhaps the cure could be isolated and made into a life saving drug.

The Bible's answer to al-ilah's notions on sin
Ezekiel 18:20, The soul that sinneth, it shall die, the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

There is no distinction with God as to small and great sins. The penalty in the earth, in human courts, may vary, as with adultery and touching a dead body, but the final verdict for anyone who sins before the God of the Bible is guilt. The penalty must be paid.

Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Sin came by Adam, and death came with sin. Everyone is a sinner in some way, so everyone faces the same final penalty-- death.

God gives the verdict in the Bible, Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
Romans 6:23, For the wages of sin is DEATH; but the gift of God is eternal LIFE through Jesus Christ our Lord.

It is clear from the Bible that one sin of any kind will send you to Hell. al-ilah might tolerate little sins, but the God of the Bible will not. He is so holy that He cannot look at one sin in a man. This is not a matter of preference, it is a LIFE AND DEATH matter. Al-ilah is a pagan deity, for only pagan gods allow sin. The Greek gods even sinned like men. The God of the Bible is the only God who will not tolerate one small sin in man. The God of the Bible demands payment for all sins, and death is the penalty.

God has provided forgiveness for our sins, all of which would damn us. The God of the Bible does not just want to remove "great" sins, as al-ilah does. Yahweh God is in the business of removing ALL of our sin, but only if we come to Him by His way. Only the believer in Jesus Christ has a convincing hope.

II Corinthians 5:17, Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, ALL THINGS are become new.

@Aletheia: #283 on: Yesterday at 07:59:11 PM »
[Quote] from: nopuqeater on Yesterday at 01:48:35 PM
@Aletheia: you see that the Jews' say Adonai, while you are stuck with yahweh, and jesus said Eloi.
Ignorance compounded by error. Cherry picking verses in a pathetic attempt at expounding the Bible. Indeed the Light shines in the darkness and the darkness comprehends it not. Some questions for you so that we will see your ignorance exposed:
#1. Why did the Jews say Adonai (Lord) instead of Yahweh?
#2. What is the meaning of Eloi? Did your prophet describe his god as Eloi?
#3. Again the question you are avoiding: Where in your qur'an is the name Eloi? Does it occur among the 99 names of your god?[/Quote]Am neither a jew now a follower of Jesus who died on the cross. I am a hanifan, muslima and not a mushrikin. And to sum up your ignorance, your quizzing me here is similar, exactly like a fanti from Ghana saying to an Igbo man that where is oluwa the God, in a book written in Igbo language with so many Chukwu and Chineke in it. The igbo man will know that he is being challenged by ignorance.



[Quote]On Salvation

What does the qur'an teach about Sin?[/Quote]I hope everyone is reading this guy? he said salvation and jumped to sin, reminding of Lord's prayer (title}, the first line started with father, from a man who said he was a servant sent, at some point in his earthly life.



[Quote]All false religions (including Islam) fail to deal with sin because they offer no final forgiveness of sin. They rely on man's good works, which are inadequate.
#1. Does Islam have a consciousness of sin and guilt?
#2. Does it have a way for the Muslim to be finally cleansed of sin?
#3. Indeed, does Islam even notice sin?

In Sura 6:120, you are told to forsake the "inwardness" of sin. How? Every person KNOWS he has sinful thoughts. Where is the power in Islam to forsake sin? Where do forsaken sins go?

This is small comfort. What about my sins against other men and God?
#1. Furthermore, you will never find in Islam how the penalty of sin is paid.
#2. In our human courts, and in the heavenly court, all unlawful acts have penalties attached. In fact, a law without a penalty attached is void from the day of inception.
#3. Where is Islam's payment of the penalty for sin, especially these small sins and the ones in which I only hurt myself?

Your prophet had no way to pay the penalty of sin and keep on living. Your prophet totally ignored the sacrifice of Jesus Christ on the cross. Why? Answer: He refused to acknowledge that he needed payment for his sin. He wanted to work up a good show for al-ilah and see if he could get into heaven on his own merits. Men who willfully stay dead in sin don't impress the God of the Bible.
The God of the Bible demands payment for acts of sin, al-ilah looks the other way and no one pays for their sins. Which of these deities is holy? Stop and think about this. Obviously the god that ignores sins isn't holy!

Muhammad was stuck just like the Jewish Pharisees of Jesus' day. They refused to confront the holiness of God through "new birth," so they had to make an endless list of small sins to avoid, everyone of them becoming very important as time and tradition took over.
Islam has a similar long list of sins which must be avoided rather than cleansed and forgiven. It is found in the hadiths. Here is a few examples, though there are perhaps 4000, of the small sins that the Muslim cannot commit:
Al Hadis, Book 1, Chap. 7, No. 54- Ibn Mas'ud reported that the Messenger of Allah said: 'Don't cleanse yourselves (wipe your backside) with impure things, nor with bones, because these are the provision (food) of your brethren from the Jinn (demons)'. Attested by Tirmizi, Nisai
^This shows you the mind of "The Prophet" of al-ilah. When sin cannot be paid, it is necessary to make silly little laws about the most mundane thing, like wiping your bottom after relieving oneself.[/Quote]And muslims will end up in Paradise (jannah) after all of the above, while christians shall end up only in heaven. Allah is indeed Most Merciful. i need not even tell you anything else.



[Quote]Al Hadis, Book 1, Chap 8, No. 58- Abdullah-b-Sarjas reported that the Messenger of Allah said: 'None of you must pass urine in a snake's hole'. Attested by Nisai, Abu Daud
^Why? There is no reason given. What is al-ilah telling us about urine and snakes? The serpent is the image of evil in the Word of God. Why is al-lah showing this consideration for snakes?[/Quote]Today, snakes are pets. and humans dont crush their heads, at least not all of them. Some snakes are imported to fight the rodent epidemic, or problems that farmers have. Are snakes all bad? Are snakes devils? Of course, those who own them as pets will say no. And by the way, when you intentionally inconvenient a creation that does not bother you, thats a sin. Can a snake in the whole that you pee in not jut strike out at you, and hurt you? Dont pee in a snake hole is a sound advise.



[Quote]Al Hadis, Book 2, Chap. 11, No. 109- Abu Sayeed-al-Khodri reported that the Messenger of Allah said: 'When a fly falls into your food, drown it (in the food), because there is poison in one of its wings and a cure in the other, and it gives off the poison first and the cure last.' Attested by Sharhi Sunnat.
^I wonder how many Muslims are faithfully doing this today? Also, it would be of great use to follow up on this bit of medical information and identify the cure in a fly's wing. Perhaps the cure could be isolated and made into a life saving drug. Grin[/Quote]if you know what disease one wing carries, you will find the antidote, on the other. that reality. And many muslims, and am one of those who practice it.



[Quote]The Bible's answer to al-ilah's notions on sin
Ezekiel 18:20, The soul that sinneth, it shall die, the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.[/Quote]the first bold tells us that Jesus of the Bible was a sinner, as we are told by those who said he died on the cross. Otherwise, ezekiel verse is a lie. the bold tells us that contrary to what the christians say about carrying their sins, the wickedness of the weaked shall be upon him, the wicked.



[Quote]There is no distinction with God as to small and great sins. The penalty in the earth, in human courts, may vary, as with adultery and touicing a dead body, but the final verdict for anyone who sins before the God of the Bible is guilt. The penalty must be paid.[/Quote]i did not know that touching a dead body is sin. then no christian who prepares the dead for burial will not be punished for the good deeds of not allowing the dead to rot right in the community. strange religion. And the penalty must be paid by the gulty, as you said above sows, again that Jesus in truth is not responsible for your sins.



[Quote]Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Sin came by Adam, and death came with sin. Everyone is a sinner in some way, so everyone faces the same final penalty-- death.

God gives the verdict in the Bible, Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
Romans 6:23, For the wages of sin is DEATH; but the gift of God is eternal LIFE through Jesus Christ our Lord.[/Quote]One sees that everyone including jesus was covered above, until Paul in Roman becomes the mouth piece of God, whereas jesus his servant sent failed, and suddenly from Paul, Jesus became the "GIFT"!




[Quote]It is clear from the Bible that one sin of any kind will send you to Hell. al-ilah might tolerate little sins, but the God of the Bible will not. He is so holy that He cannot look at one sin in a man. This is not a matter of preference, it is a LIFE AND DEATH matter. Al-ilah is a pagan deity, for only pagan gods allow sin. The Greek gods even sinned like men. The God of the Bible is the only God who will not tolerate one small sin in man. The God of the Bible demands payment for all sins, and death is the penalty.[/Quote]Hey human, unless you are demented, which of the Two would you love as your Lord, since you will never be perfect, according to the Bible? I prefer a Merciful God, rather than the One Who will never forgive me for the smallest of mistakes, yet He knew that I will never be perfect. The Biblical God went to far, according to the christians from Animal blood, to Human blood just to satisfy Himself. Yet Allah Will forgive you all your sins without any killing.



[Quote]God has provided forgiveness for our sins, all of which would damn us. The God of the Bible does not just want to remove "great" sins, as al-ilah does. Yahweh God is in the business of removing ALL of our sin, but only if we come to Him by His way. Only the believer in Jesus Christ has a convincing hope.
II Corinthians 5:17, Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, ALL THINGS are become new.[/Quote]Corinthians, the formula from Paul. Where is the formula from Jesus? Yet, above the Biblical God that will punish you, and you alone for your sins, now turns to be God that has a son that He will sacrifice for your sin. Where is the wife of Biblical God, who is the mother of the son, otherwise, the child is a bastard. And the parents are entities of adultery.

nopuqeater:

I hope everyone is reading this guy? he said salvation and jumped to sin,

Why wont you be confused ? Its not your fault. Thats why aletheia said that quran's concept of sin, love, righteousness lacks clarity and genuiness and hope is grossly flawed. You nopuqeater really have no hope of the future cos there is nothing that cleanses you of your sins (both original and your own, nothing gives you the ability to stay righteous, nothing gives you the assurance of salvation. If Mohammad did not know what allah was going to do with him, I then wonder what hope you have.

Let me remind you, this cyber-war is not Jihad or fatwa o  So, dont think you have the same rewards as getting on a commercial plane with some bombs strapped to your loins and blowing it up.  This cyber-war cannot assure you of your lewd and endless sex with how many virgins and endless drinking of wine in your "dream jannah".  Ashawo paradise So, my advice, get on the next plane and cut some jews down  (kidding)

Today, snakes are pets. and humans dont crush their heads, at least not all of them. Some snakes are imported to fight the rodent epidemic, or problems that farmers have. Are snakes all bad? Are snakes devils? Of course, those who own them as pets will say no. And by the way, when you intentionally inconvenient a creation that does not bother you, thats a sin. Can a snake in the whole that you pee in not jut strike out at you, and hurt you? Dont pee in a snake hole is a sound advise.

Even my 4 year old daughter will  cringe at this hogwash of a response.  I could pee in a hole of rats abi ?

if you know what disease one wing carries, you will find the antidote, on the other. that reality. And many muslims, and am one of those who practice it.

al-ilah a-koro-ba !!!

the first bold tells us that Jesus of the Bible was a sinner,

Where in the bible did you read that ? Or you want to quote the Lords prayer again ?

In case you might have missed it: i will still bring my last post to the fore:

You obviously dont believe in all that Jesus said according to the Bible right ? Now, when Jesus said is the Way, the Truth and the Life and that nobody comes to the Father except by Him. He states it explicitly that Salvation is found in no one else ut only through Him. Now you have a problem with that right ?

Jesus came at about 600 years ealier than Mohammed and operated His ministry for about 3 years on earth and the Bible is what captured all of His sayings while on earth. Now, if I have quoted Jesus saying for instance

John 6: 40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day and this:

John 8:12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life. and also this:

Matthew 14: 15

He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

And then you come back to cunter all of His sayings that they are not correct and all of that, I then will ask you this simple question:

Seeing that the Quran did not capture even 2% of Jesus' ministry on earth, on what/which authority and against what source are you raising your objections ? Do you have any reference material in your Quran or Hadiths that capture the activities and events of Jesus' ministry from the age of 30 to 33 ?

This is my submission: if you dont have any records of his ministry's events, how then can you claim that what he has said is wrong and not correct ?  Undecided I would have expected that the Quran would cover all of the activities of Jesus' ministries, words, actions, and events for only then can you come and start comparing stories and records before making valuable judgements on whether  Jesus' stories are mere fables or not in comparison to the same stories but ascaptured in the quran. The only thing I see here is that the words of Mohammad has made him an undisputable lunatic because they are widely at variance with all written historical records -e.g. how can he say that Noah's flood took place in Moses' days (Sura 7:136, compare 7:59ff)? Was he high on drugs or what?  Furthermore, he could not even substantiate his claim on the reception of the quran which made him to give 3 different accounts:

1. We are first told that allah came to Mohammed in the form of a man and that Mohammad saw him Sura 53:2-18)
2. Then we are told that it was the Holy Spirit that came to Mohammad (Sura 16:102; 26:192-194)
3. The last and the most popular version is that it was the angel Gabriel who delivered the Quran to him (Sura 2:97). May be angel Gabriel is your own the Holy Spirit  Undecided

So, how can i take that kind of man and his book seriously?

Let me summarize:

If you have the records of Jesus' sayings, actions, and events during his earthly ministry, produce them and lets start our discussions from there. If you dont, you are restricted to what the Bible has recorded that He said and did. And if that is the case, please, I beg of you, never disclaim anything Jesus said again when it is lifted from the Bible cos you dont have any proof of what He said outside of the Bible else you will only be showing yourself as silly, ignorant and arguing for the sake of it without facts.

John 8:12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life. Jesus says emphatically He is the Light of the World. . Follow Him, he will reveal his love into your heart. You have never experienced true love before, taste and see that the Lord Jesus is good. Experience Him, you will be hooked and wished you had known Him earlier.

Remember, Jesus is Alive!!! Mohammad is Dead!!!!!

[b]His First Miracle(s)
Thus Jesus, peace and blessings be upon him, defended his mother from the grave
calumny and innuendoes of her enemies. This is the very first miracle attributed to
Jesus in the Holy Qur’ân that, he spoke as an infant from his mother's arms. Contrast
this with his first miracle in the Christian Bible, which occurred when he was over thirty
years of age:
"And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus
was there: And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage. And when
they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, they have no wine. Jesus saith
unto her, 'Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.' His mother
saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it. And there were set there
six water pots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or
three firkins apiece. Jesus saith unto them, Fill the water pots with water. And they filled
them up to the brim. And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor
of the feast. And they bare it. When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was
made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew
the governor of the feast called the bridegroom, And saith unto him, Every man at the
beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is
worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now." (John 2:110)[/b]

Look at what their bible brought upon them.

Since this miracle, wine has flowed like water in Christendom. Many reason that what
was good for the Master is good enough for them. Jesus was no "kill-joy" they say.
Didn't he make good potent wine, that even those "well drunk", those whose senses had
been dulled could make out the difference? "That the best was kept for the last.". This
was no pure grape juice. It was the same wine that, according to the Christian Bible,
enabled the daughters of Lot to seduce their father (Genesis 19:32-33). It was the same
wine which the Christian is advised to eschew in Ephesians 5:18 - "And be not drunk
with wine, "