Italo and aletheia,

I greet you in the name of the Lord. . What can we do but pray for our lost brothers, There is no comparing His love and saving grace. God bless you all for your "missionary" work.

The argument that Jesus is not God is an illusion.

Jesus is God because God can decide to manifest Himself through ANY MEANS He deems fit and no one can and should question that!

Yes, He (God) does not have the qualities the poster highlighted but we should not rule out the fact that when He came down to earth, He did not come as God but as man. That was why He could "SLEEP", "EAT", "WALK" etc and this should not be misconstrued.

He is God and the Alpha And the Omega! If He could create the whole world by a spoken word, what would/could be difficult for Him to do?

Dude which Lord did you mean the Eloi, Yehweh, Jehovah or Jesus?all what i can learn or understand by Christians they are Worshipping three different Entity as a one thing, what a pitiful.

cgift:

I greet you in the name of the Lord.

chakula:

Dude which Lord do mean the Eloi, Yehweh, Jehovah or Jesus?all what i can learn or understand by Christians they are Worshipping three different Entities as a one thing, what a pitiful.

Your comm. skills beat me. One could have migraine trying to understand your point. I have a solution for you anyway, get the Bible, if not for anything, for the mastery of words and explicit construction of sentences and logical sequencing. It will surely improve your vocabs. I am sure your Qoran wont give you that. You have been reading the Bible for all the wrong reasons. The right reasons stare you in the face but you ignore them.

Takia.

Interesting thread ain't it ? Pimpu et al, the more you look the less you see. That is the nature of the divinity of the GodHead. You can't analyse and constrict Jesus Christ, the Mighty God into your cranium. Don't even attempt it cos you might explode  Cheesy. But I wonder why it does bite you that Christains are contented with the mystery of Godliness. We ain't forcing anything down your throat are we ? Just let us be since from all ramifications, the One we serve is in way in the class of your Prophet and Allah. Jesus Christ is by all means superior to any deity you are fronting for and that is incontestible. We dont have issues at all cos our God is bigger than your mind can conceive. We dont struggle to defend him. Call Jesus whatever you like, call him weary, call him anything, it does not diminish him. it does not get us angry, it does not turn us into belligerent people, cos, like Paul, when He knows its time to arrest you, nothing can stop Him, but then, i only hope, you will come back here anr share with us, the powerful testimony of your conversion. i have seen that happen countless times. You can't beat the power of Jesus to save.

I wish you all the best.

Peace.

 good thing you cannot refute the basis of all the argument presented, rather you will depend on faith? to continue to believe in this fantasy that claims JESUS IS(not) God, reminds one of the Jehovah witness who also reject such beliefs as not being consistent with what is in the bible, hence to them(the Jehovah witness) the diety of Jesus has Pagan origins.


He is God and the Alpha And the Omega! If He could create the whole world by a spoken word, what would be difficult for Him to do?

, Lord let this cup pass away, , Jesus prayed to God to save him from the impeding danger, if he was God he would have saved himself and wouldn't need to pray, Even his disciples did not believe he was God because they forsook him and Fled when Yaawa gas, this only indicates that they didn't believe he could save them from problem.

 Didn't Jesus say that : I can by myself do nothing, if he was God He won't make such claims, He said only God knows the when the day of Judgment is, meaning that as god he is Ignorant of things that suppose to be easy for him to recall.
My lord(self)  My lord(self) why have you forsaken?

And where did Jesus claim he is Lord?.


Your comm. skills beat me. One could have migraine trying to understand your point. I have a solution for you anyway, get the Bible, if not for anything, for the mastery of words and explicit construction of sentences and logical sequencing. It will surely improve your vocabs. I am sure your Qoran wont give you that. You have been reading the Bible for all the wrong reasons. The right reasons stare you in the face but you ignore them.

Sorry oh, but please instead fighting over english mistake, answer the questions thrown?? this is diversion tactics only goes to show how you lack answers to give.

You know what, there is no point trying to prove anything to you. Like I said in my earlier posts, Jesus Christ remains supreme to Mohummad. I will rather go with the greater and better one than stay with mediocrity. We dont belong in the same class or genre anyway you want to look at it. Mohammed is dead but Jesus is alive - you can't dispute it. Hence, the Quaran's assertion that He is coming back. So, why settle for less ?

Don't attempt to denigrate Jesus cos you will running foul of Mohammad's injunctions not to denigrate the "Prophet of God".

I repeat, i wont settle for less when I can see there is the better.

Please let us be.

You all claim that God can do all thing but doubt the fact that he can appear in the nature of Man to redeem man from the doom of death.
i beleive your premise is such an irony

vedaxcool:

In the qur'an Muhammad is by far exalted than Jesus,

I challenge [/b]you to give me the reference in the Quran that substantiates the claim you have given above and i will tear you into pieces. Let me give you a tip right from your Quran: when the Quran mentions that Allah has preferred some apostles above certain others it specifically mentions Jesus and David:

[b]    Those apostles We endowed with gifts, some above others: To one of them God spoke; others He raised to degrees (of honour); to Jesus the son of Mary We gave clear (Signs), and strengthened him with the holy spirit. If God had so willed, succeeding generations would not have fought among each other, after clear (Signs) had come to them, but they (chose) to wrangle, some believing and others rejecting. If God had so willed, they would not have fought each other; but God Fulfilleth His plan. S. 2:253 Y. Ali

And it is your Lord that knoweth best all beings that are in the heavens and on earth: We did bestow on some prophets more (and other) gifts than on others: and We gave to David (the gift of) the Psalms. S. 17:55 Y. Ali . Now if Allah, preferred David more than other servants, and It is established that Jesus Christ is from the lineage of David, so how on your imaginary earth is Mohammed more noble than Jesus?

From the above you see clearly that David had more honour than any other and more importantly, NO WHERE is it mentioned that Mohammed had more honour than those he himself is said to have mentioned

vedaxcool:

and recently a lot of people including Christians have rated prophet Muhammad S.A.W to be the most influential man to have walked the earth.

This is laughable - the testimony of mere mortals is what you are using to substantiate the claim to Mohammed's legitimacy! Talking about a hanging on to a weak straw. This is just too feeble and alarming to say the least!

Remember JESUS IS STILL ALIVE -Mohammed is DEAD!!! What about that ?

challenge you to give me the reference in the Quran that substantiates the claim you have given above and i will tear you into pieces[b](which is consistent with the behaviour of the crusaders[/b]). Let me give you a tip right from your Quran: when the Quran mentions that Allah has preferred some apostles above certain others it specifically mentions Jesus and David:


And some part of the night offer Tahajjud (Salah), an additional Prayer for you. Soon, your Lord will raise you to a Station of Praise (the highest position in Paradise). (17:79)

O people of the Scripture! (Jews and Christians) Indeed Our (Prophetic) Messenger has come to you, expounding to you much of that which you used to hide from the Scripture, and forgiving much. Undoubtedly, there has come to you a Light from Allah and a clear Book (the Qur’an). (5:15)

And We have sent you(Muhammad) not except as a mercy for all the worlds. (21:107) God didn't give neither David(A.s) nor Jesus (A.s) this kind of exultation or mission.



Those apostles We endowed with gifts, some above others: To one (THE VERSE SAYS "SOME" MEANING MORE THAN ONE--MANY,THIS IS JUST ONE AMONGST MANY)of them God spoke; others He raised to degrees (of honour); to Jesus the son of Mary We gave clear (Signs), and strengthened him with the holy spirit. If God had so willed, succeeding generations would not have fought among each other, after clear (Signs) had come to them, but they (chose) to wrangle, some believing and others rejecting. If God had so willed, they would not have fought each other; but God Fulfilleth His plan. S. 2:253

And it is your Lord that knoweth best all beings that are in the heavens and on earth: We did bestow on some prophets more (and other) gifts than on others: and We gave to David (the gift of) the Psalms. S. 17:55 Y.
Now can you point were it says David is most exalted and funny enough it says " to some Prophets(Meaning more than one)" and goes on to site the example of David.

This is laughable - the testimony of mere mortals is what you are using to substantiate the claim to Mohammed's legitimacy! Talking about a hanging on to a weak straw. This is just too feeble and alarming to say the least!
Just as you mere Mortals have made Jesus your god, a god that was did not know when of the day of judgmental is, god indeed, and like I sited in my response earlier I worship God, the ONE, The master of Jesus whom Jesus said sent him to carry My GOD's will, You have decided to worship his Messenger and called him Your LORD--Pity---- Haven't you settled for less

vedaxcool:

And some part of the night offer Tahajjud (Salah), an additional Prayer for you. Soon, your Lord will raise you to a Station of Praise (the highest position in Paradise). (17:79)

I am almost purging from the casuistry and illogical reasoning you are putting up here. I can now see the low levels of the person i am dealing with. You are extremely mischievous and intentionally bent on misrepresenting the truth. Why are you like this ?

Sura [17:78] You shall observe the Contact Prayer (Salat) when the sun declines from its highest point at noon, as it moves towards sunset. You shall also observe (the recitation of) the Quran at dawn. (Reciting) the Quran at dawn is witnessed. [17:79] During the night, you shall meditate for extra credit, that your Lord may raise you to an honorable rank.

The above is the full text of the verse you were trying to twist which is well in line with the morbid nature of your Prophet anyway. It is explicitly talking about prayers you offer at Noon and at Night. That portion of verse 79 relates directly to Tahajjud prayers and from a close scrutiny does not even suggest anything near what you have read into it. Are you re-writing the Quran? Where did the Quran mention the paradise not to talk of the highest point ? OMG!!!

And We have sent you(Muhammad) not except as a mercy for all the worlds. (21:107) God didn't give neither David(A.s) nor Jesus (A.s) this kind of exultation or mission.

Again, was the portion in blue written in the Quran ? Why are you giving your own notes and interpretation to the Quran ? Is that not an offence in itself ?

Now can you point were it says David is most exalted and funny enough it says " to some Prophets(Meaning more than one)" and goes on to site the example of David.

And where did it mention Mohammed please ? Why are you using mathematical induction  to explain the Quran ? From all certainty, Mohammed was never sure of his lot and place and could not have summoned the courage to ever say he was more superior. He dared not.

Just as you mere Mortals have made Jesus your god, a god that was did not know when of the day of judgmental is, god indeed, and like I sited in my response earlier I worship God, the ONE, The master of Jesus whom Jesus said sent him to carry My GOD's will, You have decided to worship his Messenger and called him Your LORD--Pity---- Haven't you settled for less

This is not inspiring. Let me confine it to the dustbin where it belongs.

JESUS IS ALIVE !!! MOHAMMED IS DEAD!!!! Prove me wrong!!! I go with the one who is living rather than have my place with the dead.[quote][/quote]

funny thing You spoke of Jesus genealogy, last time I checked it was one of the big headaches of christianity where one man has Two fathers at the same time,


Genealogy of Jesus according to Matthew:  13.
 14. David & Wife of Uriah



 15. Solomon
 16. Rehoboam
 17. Abijam
 18. Asa
 19. Jehoshaphat
 20. Jehoram
 21. Uzziah
 22. Jotham
 23. Ahaz
 24. Hezekiah
 25. Manasseh
 26. Amon
 27. Josiah
 28. Jeconiah



 29. Shealtiel
 30. Zerubbabel
 31. Abiud
 32. Eliakim
 33. Azor
 34. Zadok
 35. Achim
 36. Eliud
 37. Eleazar
 38. Matthan
 39. Jacob
 40. Joseph
 41. Jesus


Comparing it to the one in Luke you will come to a conclusion that a man can have two fathers at the same time

35. David



 36. Nathan
 37. Mattatha
 38. Menna
 39. Melea
 40. Eliakim
 41. Jonam
 42. Joseph
 43. Judah
 44. Simeon
 45. Levi
 46. Matthat
 47. Jorim
 48. Eliezer
 49. Joshua



 50. Er
 51. Elmadam
 52. Cosam
 53. Addi
 54. Melchi
 55. Neri
 56. Shealtiel
 57. Zerubbabel
 58. Rhesa
 59. Joanan
 60. Joda
 61. Josech
 62. Semein
 63. Mattathias



 64. Mahath
 65. Naggai
 66. Hesli
 67. Nahum
 68. Amos
 69. Mattathias
 70. Joseph
 71. Jannai
 72. Melchi
 73. Levi
 74. Matthat
 75. Eli
 76. Joseph
 77. Jesus

Again goes to show how getting relaible information from the bible is hard.

funny thing You spoke of Jesus genealogy, last time I checked it was one of the big headaches of christianity where one man has Two fathers at the same time,

Runawy soldier. That is another area where i will expose your intentional ignorance.

Back to the issue of Superiority; from the Quran we gather the following:

   * Allah has preferred some messengers above others.
   * David and Solomon are some of those messengers that Allah has chosen above the rest.
   * David is Jesus’ ancestor.
   * Allah has chosen Imran’s family above all creatures.
   * Imran is said to be Mary’s father, Jesus’ grandfather.
   * Allah has chosen Jesus’ mother Mary above all women.
   * Jesus is the only person explicitly said to be honored in the next world.
   * Jesus is given specific attributes and titles that are not given to any other messenger.

What this all means is that it is NOT[/b]Muhammad that is the most exalted creature of all according to the Quran. Rather, Jesus is the one messenger, the one person, whom Allah has preferred and exalted above all the others. Allah has conferred upon Christ and his family an honor that has not been given to anyone else.

Do you dispute the above or you want me to bring verses form your Quran to support them ? Now, you show me one very [b]explicit [/b]verse where it ever mentioned that Mohammed (recall he was pronounced a sinner by Allah and he himself agreed) enjoys the same honour that Jesus enjoys.

[b]JESUS IS ALIVE!! Mohammed is DEAD!!!!

May be we should go back to the main topic under discourse: Re: Top 10 Reasons Why Jesus Christ Is Not God . i seem to be derailing this thread

017.078
YUSUFALI: Establish regular prayers - at the sun's decline till the darkness of the night, and the morning prayer and reading: for the prayer and reading in the morning carry their testimony.

017.079
YUSUFALI: And pray in the small watches of the morning: (it would be) an additional prayer (or spiritual profit) for thee: soon will thy Lord raise thee to a Station of Praise and Glory!

[17:79] During the night, you shall meditate for extra credit, that your Lord may raise you to an honorable rank.


I wonder when does raise you to an honorable rank become the same as salat, Ina Azumi, you understanding of the verse appears faulty, as you can see above I have quoted the verse from Yusuf Ali translation, which also give the same interpretation as Taking him to the highest rank.

The above is the full text of the verse you were trying to twist which is well in line with the morbid nature of your Prophet anyway. It is explicitly talking about prayers you offer at Noon and at Night. That portion of verse 79 relates directly to Tahajjud prayers and from a close scrutiny does not even suggest anything near what you have read into it. Are you re-writing the Quran? Where did the Quran mention the paradise not to talk of the highest point ? OMG!!!

That is the interpretation(are additions from the translator, even bible tranlsator do the same thing) of the verse from hadiths and Islamic scholars, Man-god worshiper. Desist from worshiping GOD's Messenger as Jesus said I by myself can do nothing, hence he depended on my God blessing's to perform all the works he did, ask ALLAH all that you need he will give you instead of behaving like Ifa and shango worshipers who have to go through a second route to get what they want from Olodumare.



And where did it mention Mohammed please ? Why are you using mathematical induction  to explain the Quran ? From all certainty, Mohammed was never sure of his lot and place and could not have summoned the courage to ever say he was more superior. He dared not.

Prophet MUHAMMAD S.A.W, was very humble and did not engage in fruitless boastings' as you expect from him rather, He behaved very down to earth and respectful to others, He even extended his forgiveness to the pagans of Mecca after overcoming them, in fact the Meccans expected him to forgive them with out asking, so he is not like you who assumes Prophet came to the world to boast about their status, in fact he did all he could to help the needy, once it was reported that a woman(with mental issues) drew the Prophet to come and clean her house, and the prophet followed her without any hesitation, YA ALLAH HE IS INDEED A MERCY UNTO THIS WORLD, ALLAHU AKBAR, this is what people like you who are too pompous can never do, The prophet was satisfied living with the knowledge that his close door neighborhours think good about him, the extent of his Humility will surprise the pompous and arrogance. He was indeed a MERCY TO ALL THE WORLD.


I go with the one who is living rather than have my place with the dead

GOD IS REINGING, WE MUSLIMS DO NOT WORSHIP THE PROPHET MUHAMMAD WE WORSHIP ALLAH THE ONE WHO SENT HIM, IN OUR THEOLOGY JESUS WILL EVENTUALLY DIE WHEN THE WORLD COMES TO IT'S CLOSE, SO JESUS ACKNOWLEDGES THE SUPERIORITY OF ALLAH TO HIM AND HE HUMBLES HIMSELF IN THE PRESENCE OF GOD AS HE SAID THE SERVANT CANNOT BE MORE THAN THE MASTER, HIS FALSE DISCIPLES SHOULD FOLLOW HIM IN WORSHIPING THE ONE TRUE GOD, WHO HAS NO DEFECTS, WHO DOES NOT EATS, NOR SLEEPS,NOR CRY, NOR GO TO TOILET,NOR ACCUSE HIMSELF OF FORSAKING HIMself( my lord, my lord, why have you forsaken me),, ETC


You all claim that God can do all thing but doubt the fact that he can appear in the  nature of Man to redeem man from the doom of death.
i believe your premise is such an irony

YES how ironical, if satan were to ask GOD make me more powerful than you are will GOD do that?, I guess NO, yet he can do anything, but would not stoop down to the level of Human beings to engage in actions that are not worthy of his LORDSHIP, According to your reasoning when your god claimed he did not know when the day of Judgment is, was he lying or genuinely telling the truth, if he was telling the truth in will only mean he is not GOD because GOD knows all things and GOD bestows Knowledge on mankind.

vedaxcool:


017.079
YUSUFALI: And pray in the small watches of the morning: (it would be) an additional prayer (or spiritual profit) for thee: soon will thy Lord raise thee to a Station of Praise and Glory!

[17:79] During the night, you shall meditate for extra credit, that your Lord may raise you to an honorable rank.


I wonder when does raise you to an honorable rank become the same as salat, Ina Azumi, you understanding of the verse appears faulty, as you can see above I have quoted the verse from Yusuf Ali translation, which also give the same interpretation as Taking him to the highest rank.

My good Lord Jesus!!! You wont cease to maze me will you ? Ok, you have resorted to giving your own meaning to the Quran. Even at that, it says " soon will thy Lord raise thee to a Station of Praise and Glory!" - lifting directly from your own quotes. This explicitly (not implicit) means that Mohammed is still in the grave!! He is yet to be lifted to that so called station. Please face facts and state them as they are, Mohammed is still in the grave still waiting when Allah will raise him to the so-called station of Praise and Glory (whatever that means anyway)! Lucidly, Mohammed was just very ignorant of where he was going - he was either just clueless of what it means or the writers and translators of the Quran did a shoddy job.Let me recap - Mohammed is still in the grave - he is waiting for when Allah will raise him up to that dream station!! OMG!! Some guys wont stop deluding themselves.

Sequel to the above therefore, how does that translate to his being higher or better or more superior to Jesus ? Jesus is alive and not waiting for anyone to wake Him up! How does that sound ? Cool and more assured right ? Compare that to the uncertainty surrounding Mohammed's rising from the grave (I hope he does) :

color=#000099]The above is the full text of the verse you were trying to twist which is well in line with the morbid nature of your Prophet anyway. It is explicitly talking about prayers you offer at Noon and at Night. That portion of verse 79 relates directly to Tahajjud prayers and from a close scrutiny does not even suggest anything near what you have read into it. Are you re-writing the Quran? Where did the Quran mention the paradise not to talk of the highest point ? OMG!!![/color]

That is the interpretation(are additions from the translator, even bible tranlsator do the same thing) of the verse from hadiths and Islamic scholars, Man-god worshiper. Desist from worshiping GOD's Messenger as Jesus said I by myself can do nothing, hence he depended on my God blessing's to perform all the works he did, ask ALLAH all that you need he will give you instead of behaving like Ifa and shango worshipers who have to go through a second route to get what they want from Olodumare.

Your statement (in bold) exposes abysmal weakness and jaded reasoning - stop whining please.

Prophet MUHAMMAD S.A.W, was very humble and did not engage in fruitless boastings' as you expect from him rather, He behaved very down to earth and respectful to others, He even extended his forgiveness to the pagans of Mecca after overcoming them, in fact the Meccans expected him to forgive them with out asking, so he is not like you who assumes Prophet came to the world to boast about their status, in fact he did all he could to help the needy, once it was reported that a woman(with mental issues) drew the Prophet to come and clean her house, and the prophet followed her without any hesitation, YA ALLAH HE IS INDEED A MERCY UNTO THIS WORLD, ALLAHU AKBAR, this is what people like you who are too pompous can never do, The prophet was satisfied living with the knowledge that his close door neighborhours think good about him, the extent of his Humility will surprise the pompous and arrogance. He was indeed a MERCY TO ALL THE WORLD.

Please dont choke me. That "humble" path got me cracking. Ok, let me help you, (I'm being sacarstic now) I guess it was his "humble " that made him to leave such a yawning gap as to who he was, what his fate was in the afterlife ; his "humble" made him call humans pigs right, his "humble" got him to snatch the wife of another man; his "humble" directed him to nearly commit suicide when he was no sure of the kind of spirit in him; his "humble" made him allow some satanic verses into the quran only for him to later abrogate them even after initially allowing people to worship the three daughters of Allah ? I seem to be going too far. Pardon me.

Mohammed was not humble, he was just being duplicitous. There is no mark of humility in any one who could not keep to his words by breaking the rules of a treaty that was supposed to last for 10 years. Please in the name of your Al-Ilah, Al-Uzah, or Al-whatever, dont ever ascribe that word to Mohammed again. You defile that word and make it loose its sanctity by associating that virtue that Jesus had to the fulelst to Mohammed.

You all claim that God can do all thing but doubt the fact that he can appear in the  nature of Man to redeem man from the doom of death.
i believe your premise is such an irony[/color]

YES how ironical, if satan were to ask GOD make me more powerful than you are will GOD do that?, I guess NO, yet he can do anything, but would not stoop down to the level of Human beings to engage in actions that are not worthy of his LORDSHIP, According to your reasoning when your god claimed he did not know when the day of Judgment is, was he lying or genuinely telling the truth, if he was telling the truth in will only mean he is not GOD because GOD knows all things and GOD bestows Knowledge on mankind.

Permit me to allow this pass. there is no stuff there.

My advice: Dont bite more than you can chew but who knows, you might want to regurgitate.

Bringing this back to the fore.

Back to the issue of Superiority; from the Quran we gather the following:

   * Allah has preferred some messengers above others.
   * David and Solomon are some of those messengers that Allah has chosen above the rest.
   * David is Jesus’ ancestor.
   * Allah has chosen Imran’s family above all creatures.
   * Imran is said to be Mary’s father, Jesus’ grandfather.
   * Allah has chosen Jesus’ mother Mary above all women.
   * Jesus is the only person explicitly said to be honored in the next world.
   * Jesus is given specific attributes and titles that are not given to any other messenger.

What this all means is that it is NOT[/b]Muhammad that is the most exalted creature of all according to the Quran. Rather, Jesus is the one messenger, the one person, whom Allah has preferred and exalted above all the others. Allah has conferred upon Christ and his family an honor that has not been given to anyone else.

Do you dispute the above or you want me to bring verses form your Quran to support them ? Now, you show me one very [b]explicit [/b]verse where it ever mentioned that Mohammed (recall he was pronounced a sinner by Allah and he himself agreed) enjoys the same honour that Jesus enjoys.

[b]JESUS IS ALIVE!! Mohammed is DEAD!!!!

dnt argue with the devil for he will definitely win.
my dear poster I read what you wrote, you thought well, infact the devil inspired you well.
can I put these questions to you?
1. is there anything like Good and evil?
2. Does God really exist?
3. how do you read the bible?
just answer these, am still coming

dnt argue with the devil for he will definitely win.
my dear poster I read what you wrote, you thought well, infact the devil inspired you well.
can I put these questions to you?
1. is there anything like Good and evil?
2. Does God really exist?
3. how do you read the bible?
just answer these, am still coming

@Cgift: Muhammad, Noah, Ibrahim, Musa,(AS to all), just to name a few are all dead.

Jesus son of Mary, Elijah or was it Elisha (AS to all of them) are not dead.

Is death the yardstick of not good?

You ask for Quranic Verses. You got them;

[b]"Say (O Muhammad to mankind): “If you (really) love Allâh then follow me (i.e. accept Islâmic Monotheism, follow the Qur’ªn and the Sunnah), Allâh will love you and forgive you your sins. And Allâh is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.” Say (O Muhammad): “Obey Allâh and the Messenger (Muhammad).” But if they turn away, then Allâh does not like the disbelievers." (Qur’an 3: 31)

"O mankind! Verily, there has come to you the Messenger (Muhammad) with the truth from your Rabb (Sustainer). So believe in him, it is better for you. But if you disbelieve, then certainly to Allâh belongs all that is in the heavens and the earth. And Allâh is Ever All-Knowing, All-Wise." (Qurân 4: 170)

"O you who believe! Obey Allâh, and obey the Messenger (Muhammad) and render not vain your deeds." (Qurân 47: 33)

Allah (S.W.T.) tells us that he who obeys His Messenger (s.a.w.s.) obeys Him: (Qurân 4: 80)

Allah (S.W.T.) sent His Messenger with Guidance and the Religion of Truth to make it prevail over all religions. He (I) says:

"It is He (Allah) Who has sent His Messenger with Guidance and the Religion of Truth that he may proclaim it over all religion even though the Pagans may detest (it)." (Qurân 61: 9)[/b]

Many more to list, but a few will help your heart: Allah says we should follow Muhammad without following another: (Qur’an 3: 31)

Allah says that all mankind should follow Muhammad: (Qurân 4: 170)

"O you who believe! Obey Allâh, and obey the Messenger (Muhammad) and render not vain your deeds." (Qurân 47: 33)

It is a must that we obey Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w.s.); (8:24)

Given the knowledge of the unseen as much as Allah Wills: (3:179)

5. Nabi Ibrahim 'Alayhissalam prayed for his coming: (2:129)

6. Foretold by Nabi 'Isa (Jesus) 'Alayhissalam. (61:6)

7. Allah asks all Prophets to believe in him: (3:81)

8. Confirms the previous Prophetic Messengers of Allah: (37:37)

The Final Prophet, Sallallahu 'alayhi wa Sallam: (33:40)

2. Mentioned first among the greatest Prophets, 'Alayhimussalam: (33:7)

Surely, We have revealed (the revelation) to you (O beloved Prophet) as We revealed to Nuh, and the Prophets after him, and We revealed to Ibrahim and Ismail and Is'haq and Ya'qub and the tribes, and 'Isa and Ayyub and Yunus and Harun and Sulayman, and We gave Dawud the Psalms. (4:163)

3. A Prophet with proven prophecies; (30:1-6)

Undoubtedly, We have given you (O beloved Prophet) a clear victory. (48:1)

Certainly, Allah has proved true the true vision of His (Prophetic) Messenger; (48:27)

And (He will give you) another (blessing) which you love: help from Allah and a victory near at hand, so (O beloved Prophet) give glad tidings to the believers. (61:13) 5.

Allah Himself praises him; (33: 45-47)

Possessor of Allah's Grace; (4:113)

His Station of Praise (Al-Maqam al-Mahmud); (17:79)

If you want to gain the love of Allah, follow him; (3:31)

Allah addresses him with love and affection; Ta Ha. (20:1), Ya Seen. (36:1), O you wrapped up in your raiment. (73:1), O you enveloped in your cloak. (74:1)

Allah's (Prophetic) Messenger; (49:7)

Allah describes him with His Own Attributes of Rauf (Most Kind) and Rahim (Merciful); (9:128)


www.muhammad.net/, /59-the-holy-quran-on-muhammad-saaw.html - Cached

[color=Black]1. is there anything like Good and evil? senseless question isn't it.
2. Does God really exist? ?? another sensless question to ask me
3. how do you read the bible ------> with eyes open and brain working
[/color]
just answer these, am still coming
Yet to arrive??


Sequel to the above therefore, how does that translate to his being higher or better or more superior to Jesus ? Jesus is alive and not waiting for anyone to wake Him up! Smiley How does that sound ? Cool and more assured right ? Compare that to the uncertainty surrounding Mohammed's rising from the grave (I hope he does) :

Maybe we should compare it to the uncertainty surrounding the genealogy of Jesus --now that is a puzzle--- and his allged crucifixion where he prayed to GOD to save ---let this cup pass over me--- and the bible claims GOD heard(acepted) his prayer, yet goes o to say He suffered during this alleged crucifixion, in which he shouted to my lord my lord why have thou forsaken( meaning since his prayers where heeard he did not expect to have been crucified).

(recall he was pronounced a sinner by Allah and he himself agreed) where pls instead of this ranting.



And He was saying to her, “Let the children be satisfied first, for it is not good to take the children's bread and throw it to the dogs(He refers to all non Jewish chistians).” (Mark 7:27).

allah is great

Allahu Akbar.

vedaxcool:

Jesus is alive and not waiting for anyone to wake Him up! Smiley How does that sound ? Cool and more assured right ? Compare that to the uncertainty surrounding Mohammed's rising from the grave (I hope he does) :

Hello dear. I missed you over the weekend. You know the son of God must also work with his hands and not lay in wait for innocent people or plunder their goods in order to make a living - you know what i mean

For all I care, Mohammad is yet to wake up. I am sure he is still receiving punishment from the grave. You know he prayed to allah to deliver him from the punishment of the grave - dnt ask me the verse in teh Quran else, i will know i am dealing with an Olodo

[Sura 4:171] O people of the scripture, do not transgress the limits of your religion, and do not say about GOD except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was a messenger of GOD, and His word [/b]that He had sent to Mary, and a revelation from Him.

You see Mohammad even called Jesus the Messiah in his inordinate desire to discredit the mystery of the relationship of God the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Again, [b]Mohammad, said Jesus is the [size=13pt]MESSIAH[/size] He even called Jesus the Word of God sent to Mary.

What more can you guys take ? A word is enough for the wise.

(recall he was pronounced a sinner by Allah and he himself agreed) where pls instead of this ranting.

Tell me you are joking in asking for this verse. I thought you have the quran to youself ? Ok, see it:


The Hadith makes clear that Muhammad was a sinner--NOT sinless as some Muslims now claim:

"Muhammad replied, "O Allah, set me apart from my sins, "

While the Bible says Jesus was sinless, here is what the Qur’an and Bukhari Hadith say about Mohammed. In 48:1-2 Allah tells Mohammed to ask forgiveness for his sins. Sahih Muslim vol.1 book 4 ch.268 no.1695 p.373 says Mohammed prayed, "I wronged myself and make a confession of my sin. Forgive all my sins,…" Bukhari vol.1 book 2 ch.13 no.19 p.23, vol.1.12.57 no.781 p.434; vol.6 .60.3 no.3 p.4; vol.8.75.3 no.319 p.213, and vol.8.75.62 prior to no.407 p.271 prior also mention Mohammed’s sins. [/b]Specific things mentioned in the Bukhari vol.1.4.70 no.234 p.147-148; Bukhari vol.8.82.1 no.794,795 p.520 [b]are amputating people’s arms and legs, burning out their eyes, and making them thirst as they died after their limbs were cut off. See Bukhari vol.8.82.3 no.796, ch.4 p.797; Bukhari vol.6 ch.150 prior to no.198 p.158-159, as well as Fiqh us-Sunnah vol.1 p.133.

You would probably agree these are serious sins. Since Mohammed did this, he needed forgiveness very badly.

Do you want me to reel this for you in Arabic

One more:

Verily, Jesus is as Adam in the sight of God. He created him of dust: He then said to him, "Be" - and he was. Quran 3:59. A further confirmation right from your qu'ran that Jesus is the word of God . Your book invalidates you and exposes you as being mischievous and canny and unwise. These words are strong but they describe the hogwash you have been peddling here all the while.

Pimpu:

allah is great

Dont fool yourself. There is nothing great about allah. Do you know allah exsited before the birth of Mohammed ? Dont tell me you want facts. . I will spoil you with more than enough. But for you, just relish, and revel your deliberate ignorance okay.

In all of this, i am delighted to remind you that your prophet called my Lord, The Messiah right there in the qu'ran and your qu'ran confirms that my Lord lives while your own servant master or master servant is dead unassured of where he was going after suffering from the punishment of the grave.

To my silent brethren, those who have been reading from the sidelines. The truth is clear. it speaks for itself, it does not contradict. Even enemies, when trying to kill the truth, unknowingly, aid it. And this is what the Quran has done to the Bible. I cannot exhaust the genuiness and the reliability that the qu'ran confers on the bible. It is not vice-versa. The Bible remains independent of any other source. If the qu'ran came to complete the scriptures as it claims and Mohammed severally, in the qu'ran confirms that his listeners should consult the Christians and Jews (the people of the book) to confirm what he was saying, what other evidence do you need to know that Mohammed was just a fraud and always behind himself ?

They tell you that the Bible is corrupt, you ask them why did Allah allow the Bible to be corrput, they have no answer, you ask them ok, since you say the bible is corrupt, have you kept an original manuscript that we can use to compare present Bibles to "this original", they cannot oblige you. On what basis then do they claim the Bible is corrupt ? Or does it mean, "Allah" could not safeguard the bible, his book that the qu'ran was supposed to come and complement ? If allah could not do that, then allah is either a fraud or grossly incompetent to be called the Almighty God.

Or what do you say of a man who could not substantiate his call and gave us four different versions of his call ? Lunatic or what ? if you say you were called by some god, and you give us for very contradicting narrations of your call in one Quran! The writers of the quran did a shoddy job or at best, Mohammed was just perpetually under a spell that prevented him from thinking straight and maintaining an acceptable degree of sanity -little wonder he tried to kill himself at some point when he was not sure of the spirit controlling him.

Once again, let Christians be, there is nothing intellectual in the quran hence i wqould have asked for an intellectual discourse. There si absolutely nothing to cheer about because the qu'ran stands logic on its head. I have never seen a so-called "Holy or Sacred Book" always at loggerheads with itself.

JESUS IS ALLIVE!!! Mohammed is Dead.

I commit you to the loving hands of Jesus.

@cgift: « #247 on: Today at 07:34:16 PM »
[Quote] from: vedaxcool on August 14, 2010, 12:36 PM
Jesus is alive and not waiting for anyone to wake Him up! Smiley How does that sound ? Cool and more assured right ? Compare that to the uncertainty surrounding Mohammed's rising from the grave (I hope he does) :

Hello dear. I missed you over the weekend. Wink You know the son of God must also work with his hands and not lay in wait for innocent people or plunder their goods in order to make a living - you know what i mean Wink

For all I care, Mohammad is yet to wake up. I am sure he is still receiving punishment from the grave. Grin You know he prayed to allah to deliver him from the punishment of the grave - dnt ask me the verse in teh Quran else, i will know i am dealing with an Olodo Grin[/quote]Am not Vedaxcool. So I ask you to give me the verse in the Quran. If you said its there.



[Quote]
[Sura 4:171] O people of the scripture, do not transgress the limits of your religion, and do not say about GOD except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was a messenger of GOD, and His word that He had sent to Mary, and a revelation from Him.

You see Mohammad even called Jesus the Messiah in his inordinate desire to discredit the mystery of the relationship of God the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Again, Mohammad, said Jesus is the MESSIAH He even called Jesus the Word of God sent to Mary.
What more can you guys take ? A word is enough for the wise.[/quote]If Muhammad [as] discredited Jesus of the bible by praising Isa bin Maryam [as] in the Quran, how do you calibrate what Jesus of the Bible said of himself, thus; "Your Lord is my Lord and He is One God". "Jesus Your servant who You send/sent". "My Eloi [God], my Eloi [God], why have you forsaken me". Tell us if Jesus had not behaved on himself as Muhammad said or behaved about Jesus, above? Your call, cgift.



[Quote]Quote
(recall he was pronounced a sinner by Allah and he himself agreed) where pls instead of this ranting.[/quote]He was not pronounced a sinner. When Allah says pray for your sins, even of the future I wil forgive them, it does not mean you have sinned and already in the future, but being guaranteed that if when future arrives and if you commit any sin[s], your condition will be as if you never have committed any. this is the meaning and Muhammad in Surah Ta Ha was thankful that he was forgiven already the sins he had not committed. Jesus also said forgive us our sins, inclusive of himself in the Bible's Lord's prayer. Will a true Lord be Praying to any Lord, the reason we never heard Yahweh or Jehovah or Eloi making prayers.

Tell me you are joking in asking for this verse. I thought you have the quran to youself ? Ok, see it:
The Hadith makes clear that Muhammad was a sinner--NOT sinless as some Muslims now claim:

"Muhammad replied, "O Allah, set me apart from my sins, "

Hey, Islamic scholar, Mr. Cgift, Quran is differen from hadith! And when Jesus said "forgive us our sins, then that makes him a sinner, too. I guess it does not look for the Biblical image that you are projecting. Jesus said whosover called anyone a fool, will go to hell fire for it. Then he called people fools, after it. So did Paul call people fools, too. If neither will go to hell fire, then both must be Gods.

While the Bible says Jesus was sinless, here is what the Qur’an and Bukhari Hadith say about Mohammed. In 48:1-2 Allah tells Mohammed to ask forgiveness for his sins. Sahih Muslim vol.1 book 4 ch.268 no.1695 p.373 says Mohammed prayed, "I wronged myself and make a confession of my sin. Forgive all my sins,…" Bukhari vol.1 book 2 ch.13 no.19 p.23, vol.1.12.57 no.781 p.434; vol.6 .60.3 no.3 p.4; vol.8.75.3 no.319 p.213, and vol.8.75.62 prior to no.407 p.271 prior also mention Mohammed’s sins. Specific things mentioned in the Bukhari vol.1.4.70 no.234 p.147-148; Bukhari vol.8.82.1 no.794,795 p.520 are amputating people’s arms and legs, burning out their eyes, and making them thirst as they died after their limbs were cut off. See Bukhari vol.8.82.3 no.796, ch.4 p.797; Bukhari vol.6 ch.150 prior to no.198 p.158-159, as well as Fiqh us-Sunnah vol.1 p.133.

I went to research all your allegations in Bukhari hadith collections. I did not see anything in it tat suggested all that you wrote, except that i read from where you lifted them, the christian websites. You should have researched a little better.

You would probably agree these are serious sins. Since Mohammed did this, he needed forgiveness very badly.

Do you want me to reel this for you in Arabic Grin

Even though I couldnt find it, I think Moses will have a serious explanation to make, like Muhammad. Interestingly, while Yahweh wanted to terminate His Messenger Moses for his disobedience [sin], nothing like that was found in Quran or hadith on Muhammad (AS).

One more:

Verily, Jesus is as Adam in the sight of God. He created him of dust: He then said to him, "Be" - and he was. Quran 3:59. A further confirmation right from your qu'ran that Jesus is the word of God Grin. Your book invalidates you and exposes you as being mischievous and canny and unwise. These words are strong but they describe the hogwash you have been peddling here all the while.

The whole arguments of the muslims is that Jesus of the Bible, regardless of your beautification of him, was a creation, a messenger, a human being.

Quote from: Pimpu on August 14, 2010, 03:30 PM
allah is great

Dont fool yourself. There is nothing great about allah. Do you know allah exsited before the birth of Mohammed ?

And before the birth of jesus, Yahweh did not exist? Jehovah did not exist? Eloi did not exist?



[Quote]Dont tell me you want facts. Cheesy. I will spoil you with more than enough. But for you, just relish, and revel your deliberate ignorance okay.

In all of this, i am delighted to remind you that your prophet called my Lord, The Messiah right there in the qu'ran and your qu'ran confirms that my Lord lives while[b] your own servant master or master servant is dead unassured of where he was going after suffering from the punishment of the grave.[/b][/quote]While Muhammad is our human master and servant of our God, just like every messenger and prophet sent were, Jesus being one of them, Moses died, too. While on earth Yahweh was after his life. But then, Muhammad is well assure of his place in Paradise, and never suffering in the grave. Allah Himself and His Angels praised Muhammad in Surah Ahzab. Am sure you missed that. Also you missed the many verses about Muslims going to Paradise, and the rest going to hell.



[Quote]To my silent brethren, those who have been reading from the sidelines. The truth is clear. it speaks for itself, it does not contradict. Even enemies, when trying to kill the truth, unknowingly, aid it. And this is what the Quran has done to the Bible. I cannot exhaust the genuiness and the reliability that the qu'ran confers on the bible. It is not vice-versa. The Bible remains independent of any other source. If the qu'ran came to complete the scriptures as it claims and Mohammed severally, in the qu'ran confirms that his listeners should consult the Christians and Jews (the people of the book) to confirm what he was saying, what other evidence do you need to know that Mohammed was just a fraud and always behind himself ?[/Quote]while you make your claims, here are the realities; Muhammad confronted the Jews, about the stoning of adultery people. They wanted to hide it in there book, after over 600 years that you said Jesus did away with it, though he said not the least of the jots should be disregarded. Muhammad caught them in a lie. Muhamad caught you in a lie too, mr. christian by telling you that Jesus and his mother were mere mortals, needy, eating drinking, for example and God Who is Perfect cant produce imperfection. Afterall Jesus had no full knowledge, and you were asked what purpose shall God need a son for. We are stil waiting for answer, since God can forgive at will, and you said He did away acceptance of anmal blood, why would God gravitate fot human blood, instead?



[Quote]They tell you that the Bible is corrupt, you ask them why did Allah allow the Bible to be corrput, they have no answer,[/quote]Te answer is complete with Allah. Hence as human, I see that Torah came before Gospel. Why was Gospel later after the many miracles from Moses, alone? So that Jesus who completed the chain of prophethood on the children of Israel may come. Why Bible as a whole before Quran? So that the earlier texts may have remnant of truth even after all the addition, subtraction, changing words from their places, may be supported by Quran. Why do we still have "Jesus, Your servant, who You sent", in the Bible if jesus was God, except that such truths will agree with Quran, and can clearly be sieved away from the lies that permiates it.

you ask them ok, since you say the bible is corrupt, have you kept an original manuscript that we can use to compare present Bibles to "this original", they cannot oblige you. On what basis then do they claim the Bible is corrupt ?

On one hand the Quran is the essence of the Original of Torah, Sabur, Injil. Secondly, the Bible itself confirms that it is correupted; The Catholic Bible, is exactly like the Protestant bible, except one has many books subtracted from it. And in many generations, the Bible went and still going through revision, reedition, and all the new things. There is no single Bible for al the people of Christianity. Just the other day an old Bible was found in Palestine confirming the story of the Quran about Jesus is true. Do a video Youtube search. its in there.



[Quote]Or does it mean, "Allah" could not safeguard the bible, his book that the qu'ran was supposed to come and complement ? If allah could not do that, then allah is either a fraud or grossly incompetent to be called the Almighty God.[/Quote]I have given you explanaton from Islamic perspective. Now lets look at the christian argument which yo present; Cant Yahweh, or Jehovah or Eloi Who sent jesus his servant safeguard the Bible, the document He wished to be the only word from Him? Why all the many versions, without 2 versions being exactly the same? Why cant He make up His mind about Jesus who says he is His servant sent by Him, while you say Jesus is that Eloi, or Jehova or Yahweh? These are your problems, since Alah has confirmed that He will only safeguard the Quran and no other book, allowing them to be corrupted is not surprising to me.



[Quote]Or what do you say of a man who could not substantiate his call and[b] gave us four different versions of his call[/b] ? Lunatic or what ? if you say you were called by some god, and you give us for very contradicting narrations of your call in one Quran! The writers of the quran did a shoddy job or at best, Mohammed was just perpetually under a spell that prevented him from thinking straight and maintaining an acceptable degree of sanity -little wonder he tried to kill himself at some point when he was not sure of the spirit controlling him.[/quote]What do you mean by different versions of his call? Are you reading well or just throwing darts in the dark? Lets assume that Muhammad was intending to kill himself because he didnt know what spirit was driving him at the beginning of his mission, this is your view. But did he not get grounded pretty firmly by hs Creator? Of course you can see that he did not waiver in his duties and commitment to that duty. Now lets talk about Biblical Jesus who you ssay is God; The evil spirit drove him to the wilderness to preach, instead of habitation of people. The devil was seducing him with a loaf of bread of al food stuff. The sevil asked him to worship him. The devil took drove him to stand on a cliff and challenged him to jump off. Listen, none of these is less in gravity of satanic influence on so called God, than what you are unable to substantiate clearly about a human prophet known as Muhammad (AS). If your God is this weak that satan he creted is toyng with him, why blame a human prophet who was desperate to hear from his Lord that he contemplated suicide [though it is hardly true]?

Once again, let Christians be, there is nothing intellectual in the quran hence i wqould have asked for an intellectual discourse. There si absolutely nothing to cheer about because the qu'ran stands logic on its head. I have never seen a so-called "Holy or Sacred Book" always at loggerheads with itself.

so i ask you tell me how trinity (3 gods; Jesus is one, ghost is another and father is yet another] becomes One single God, indivisible, yet from Jesus lips, we hear him say "my Lord, is your Lord, and He is One God", and "Your servant jesu, who You sent" can possibly make Jesus the servant GOD?

JESUS IS ALLIVE!!! Mohammed is Dead.

Noah, Enoch, Abraham, the Friend of Eloi, Moses to name a few are are dead. ELijah is not dead, according to the bible. Now what are you so over joyed for?

I commit you to the loving hands of Jesus

comitting a slave to the hand of a servant is pure idolatry,

@Cgift and others like him: I greet you in your lies. I do not respect you. But I greet you that the mouth of liars do not bleed, it would have been a sign that they are liars.

Your listed Bukhari hadith, i couldnt find them. i went to answering-christianity, and i suggest you do before you lie against on the blessed Messenger [as]. was Muhammad (AS) unfair and unjust to anyone? Never. So, go back and research your sources. then get Bukhari book, and there is no real hadith except that it agrees with the verse of Quran which it explains.

nopuqeater:

He was not pronounced a sinner. [/b]When Allah says pray for your sins, even of the future I wil forgive them, [b]it does not mean you have sinned and already in the future, but being guaranteed that if when future arrives and if you commit any sin[s], your condition will be as if you never have committed any.

What a duo of imperfection! Both Allah and Mohammad! If Allah could tell Mohammad to pray for his future sins little wonder why there is no righteousness of the heart for you muslims. You concept of righteouness is flawed. If i can pray for my future sins that i have not committed and expect that when i commit them, it will be as if the sin never took place! Little wonder he went ahead to snatch his adopted son's wife !! Broke peace treaties, removed people's eyes, cut off limbs, plundered goods, despoiled women!! Sinful Mohammad! Or how much more filthy can a man be ? No wonder also he had to ask for forgiveness for sin more than seventy times a day. (Bukhari vol. I, nos. 711; 78; vol. V, no. 724.

JESUS WAS SINLESS (Sura 3:46)!!!!! Don’t ever compare my Saviour to your directionless Mohammad. The latter never had hope.

This is the meaning and Muhammad in Surah Ta Ha was thankful that he was forgiven already the sins he had not committed. [b]Jesus also said forgive us our sins, [/b]inclusive of himself in the Bible's Lord's prayer. Will a true Lord be Praying to any Lord, the reason we never heard Yahweh or Jehovah or Eloi making prayers.

You cheat. 

The whole world can clearly see your duplicity.  The disciples asked to be taught how to pray and he gave them a format. Now you are reading that he was referring to himself. I shake my head in pity for your deranged logic. The qu’ran is obviously not helping your intelligence – it obviously makes you grow duller.

nopuqeater:


Even though I couldnt find it, I think Moses will have a serious explanation to make, like Muhammad. Interestingly, while Yahweh wanted to terminate His Messenger Moses for his disobedience [sin], nothing like that was found in Quran or hadith on Muhammad (AS).

I wont waste my time discussing Moses with you. Thats some diversionary tactics. It wont work with me. The topic remains Jesus. Jesus never felt any guilt of sin. Mohammad had all. Your leader had too much sins and confusion within himself to contend with. He almost committed suicide but no thanks to his wife (was it the fifth one ?) He had 22 wives and turns back to restrict you people to only four (4). Only a hypocrite does that. 

The whole arguments of the muslims is that Jesus of the Bible, regardless of your beautification of him, was a creation, a messenger, a human being.

I repeat, Mohammad called [b]Jesus the Messiah [/b]right there in your Quran. Want me to quote the verse again ?

And before the birth of jesus, Yahweh did not exist? Jehovah did not exist? Eloi did not exist?

oh yeah! Allah existed with his three daughters that Mohammad asked you to worship and later changed his mind ! Allah was consfused  at that point right ? What you call Satanic verses - Mohammed got inspired by Satan!!
Allah had three daughters named Lat, ‘Uzza, and Manat. At one time the "prophet of Allah" compromised and said in the Qur’an (Sura 53:19) that "their intercession was to be hoped for." In other words, he said we should hope for the help of these three idols.
Mohammed’s followers must have been amazed that he said this. Later, Mohammed changed his mind and said Satan deceived him. Since a mistake was made, these verses were "abrogated" or taken out. These are often called "the Satanic verses." It is interesting to read how Allah could have what are called "abrogated verses" in Suras 13:39; 16:101; vol.2:106. Sura 41:37 mentions with disapproval sun and moon worshippers.
JESUS WAS AND IS PERFECT!!

while you make your claims, here are the realities; Muhammad confronted the Jews, about the stoning of adultery people. They wanted to hide it in there book, after over 600 years that you said Jesus did away with it, though he said not the least of the jots should be disregarded. Muhammad caught them in a lie. Muhamad caught you in a lie too, mr. christian by telling you that Jesus and his mother were mere mortals, needy, eating drinking, for example and God Who is Perfect cant produce imperfection. Afterall Jesus had no full knowledge, and you were asked what purpose shall God need a son for. We are stil waiting for answer, since God can forgive at will, and you said He did away acceptance of anmal blood, why would God gravitate fot human blood, instead?

Te answer is complete with Allah. Hence as human, I see that Torah came before Gospel. Why was Gospel later after the many miracles from Moses, alone? So that Jesus who completed the chain of prophethood on the children of Israel may come. Why Bible as a whole before Quran? So that the earlier texts may have remnant of truth even after all the addition, subtraction, changing words from their places, may be supported by Quran. Why do we still have "Jesus, Your servant,  who You sent", in the Bible if jesus was God, except that such truths will agree with Quran, and can clearly be sieved away from the lies that permiates it.

So much rubbish that you just make me yawn 

I have given you explanaton from Islamic perspective. Now lets look at the christian argument which yo present; Cant Yahweh, or Jehovah or Eloi Who sent jesus his servant safeguard the Bible, the document He wished to be the only word from Him? Why all the many versions, without 2 versions being exactly the same? Why cant He make up His mind about Jesus who says he is His servant sent by Him, while you say Jesus is that Eloi, or Jehova or Yahweh? These are your problems, since Alah has confirmed that He will only safeguard the Quran and no other book, allowing them to be corrupted is not surprising to me.

Good. Allah allowed the bible to be corrupted abi ? And yet Mohammad referred you to the same bible to validate what he was saying!  See your tail in between your legs as you run 

Lets assume [/b]that Muhammad was intending to kill himself because he didnt know what spirit was driving him at the beginning of his mission, [b]this is your view.

You are a fraud! And its good you are plaing to the gallery. My view ? This is simply what the qu'ran says sir. Not my view sir. Did he contemplate suicide or not ? Can’t you just say things as they are ?

comitting a slave to the hand of a servant is pure idolatry,

You have no hope. Come to One Who was, Who is and Who is to come. Mohammad will be judged like you will be judged.

Jesus remains alive but your Mohammad is dead and rotten in the grave. That is so much joy to me in addition to the accolades the qu'ran gives to him (Jesus). Mohammad can only wish he had those accolades even in his next life  .
Jesus is Lord!! (Note- i did not need to say "May Peace Be Unto Him" as you would to Mohammad because Jesus is the Prince of Peace). Keep praying for Mohammad okay.)

JESUS IS ALIVE!!! This makes my heart rejoice.

nopuqeater:

I do not respect you.

You need not respect me.Just give due respect to your Quran that says you should validate it with the Bible.

[/quote][quote]

@cgift:
May Jesus Christ greatly strengthen you as you continue in this work. God bless you my brother.

@cgift: « #250 on: Today at 11:35:13 AM »
[Quote]What a duo of imperfection! Both Allah and Mohammad! If Allah could tell Mohammad to pray for his future sins little wonder why there is no righteousness of the heart for you muslims. You concept of righteouness is flawed. If i can pray for my future sins that i have not committed and expect that when i commit them, it will be as if the sin never took place! Little wonder he went ahead to snatch his adopted son's wife !! Broke peace treaties, removed people's eyes, cut off limbs, plundered goods, despoiled women!! Sinful Mohammad! Or how much more filthy can a man be ? No wonder also he had to ask for forgiveness for sin more than seventy times a day. (Bukhari vol. I, nos. 711; 78; vol. V, no. 724.[/quote]Am a father of children. are you a father of any child? Yet am called by people who loved me dad. if one of them says am his father, did i sire him? Now this solve the problem that confound you about Jesus and then Allah the Almighty canceled adoption. is my step son my son? no. Is a son who is adopted my son? Can he marry his own blood sister just because they were not raised in the same household? Should he now not be able to marry my daughter, yet marry his own blood sister, because my daughter is his artificial sister, and his blood sister is raised in different household? you are a filthy person if you say he can marry his sister and my daughter he cant, for he must choose a wife from the two. You see the reality of Allah is different from your artificial god and all its impositions? And when the guy has a disease that is not from his adoptive family, who do they go to, except his real blood family? this is to let you know that lies of adoption does not wash. Allah says of Muhammad, "he is not the father of any of you men." another about adoption "call them by their father's name". And zayd (ra) was called by his blood father's name. Dont you bear your blood father's name, or are you a son of the adopted father? i hope you will not marry your own blood sister in order to proof a point.




[Quote]JESUS WAS SINLESS (Sura 3:46)!!!!! Don’t ever compare my Saviour to your directionless Mohammad. The latter never had hope.[/Quote]3/46 is wa yukallimunnasa filmahdi wa kahlan wa minal sahlihin. {english "and He will speak to the people in the cradle and in maturity and will be of the righteous."}. Now tell me where this verse says he is sinless, big time magician you. And the life of magician is in peril with God. You think you are talking to a novice? Allah has put knowledge in the mist of Muslims, but you are ignorant of it.



[Quote]You cheat. Grin[/Quote]I asked if Eloi prayed to anyone, while jesus prayed all night to God Who he called Eloi on the cross, before it was finished. Is that a lie, or you are the cheat? I dont want to gloat. Facts are hard for you people to grasp! Shee you dey hear me, alethia? What I say about Jesus of the Bible is the truth. What you say of Muhammad (AS) is just mud slinging.



[Quote]The whole world can clearly see your duplicity. Grin The disciples asked to be taught how to pray and he gave them a format. Now you are reading that he was referring to himself. I shake my head in pity for your deranged logic. The qu’ran is obviously not helping your intelligence – it obviously makes you grow duller.[/Quote]The prayer of jesus in the garden of Geshamine shows that thebolded is a lie. Jesus also said many atime that God is his Lord God! Why would a God be praying to another God, except the one praying is no God, but god in the mind of those who take him as God. I am wondering if you can think below the surface? Did Yahweh pray to anyone, including Jesus, while you praye to jesus, and jesus prayed to Eloi? Now, thats the truth of your emptiness. I bet Eloi is Jesus' Lord God Creator.



[Quote]Even though I couldnt find it, I think Moses will have a serious explanation to make, like Muhammad. Interestingly, while Yahweh wanted to terminate His Messenger Moses for his disobedience [sin], nothing like that was found in Quran or hadith on Muhammad (AS).[/Quote]i emphatically said you are a liar, you as per the above. am sure you missed by your below response, which went to something different. of course, Moses, you said Yahweh wanted to kill him, though he sent him on an errant and yet to complete his mission on it. The God missed killing him by his wife exposing her hair. such a tactics, such a god.



[Quote]I wont waste my time discussing Moses with you. Thats some diversionary tactics. It wont work with me. The topic remains Jesus. Jesus never felt any guilt of sin. Mohammad had all. Your leader had too much sins and confusion within himself to contend with. He almost committed suicide but no thanks to his wife (was it the fifth one ?) Grin He had 22 wives and turns back to restrict you people to only four (4). Only a hypocrite does that. Wink[/Quote]When Jesus prayed the Lord's prayer, he asked for forgiveness of sins. And when Jesus was controlled by satan to jump off the cliff and his not being a bachelor, advising you about family life, none of these count, right? its it very similar to dante of aletheia advicing about spirituality.


[Quote]I repeat, Mohammad called Jesus the Messiah right there in your Quran. Want me to quote the verse again ?[/Quote]massiah for bani israil. end of prophethood ever coming to the children of israel. is that too hard for you to grasp? maybe i am wrong about you. really. and how is massiah translating to God Almighty?



[Quote]oh yeah! Allah existed with his three daughters that Mohammad asked you to worship and later changed his mind ! Allah was consfused at that point right ? What you call Satanic verses - Mohammed got inspired by Satan!![/Quote]You call satanic verses. but alas, nothing like that in the Quran. yet, below, i see you saying that what is abrogated is still in the Quran, yet this your satanic verses, if they ever existed, why are they not in the Quran as abrogated? it shows that you are throwing mud, whereever you can, thats all. Allah already answered you with Surah 112, and many others including verses from Maryam. Afterall, Jesus as a human wil be better than mere idols, carved. Yet Allah refutted your claims hat jesus was His son!

Allah had three daughters named Lat, ‘Uzza, and Manat. At one time the "prophet of Allah" compromised and said in the Qur’an (Sura 53:19) that "their intercession was to be hoped for." In other words, he said we should hope for the help of these three idols.
Mohammed’s followers must have been amazed that he said this. Later, Mohammed changed his mind and said Satan deceived him. Since a mistake was made, these verses were "abrogated" or taken out. These are often called "the Satanic verses." It is interesting to read how Allah could have what are called "abrogated verses" in Suras 13:39; 16:101; vol.2:106. Sura 41:37 mentions with disapproval sun and moon worshippers.
JESUS WAS AND IS PERFECT!![/Quote]the first thing Muhammad (AS) did that made him became enemy number one to even his uncle abilahab (Lanatullah), is the fact that he tod everyone of his people that Allah does not have any partnership, no son or daughter. that meant that Muhammad destroyed trinity from the first day. So when did this event of yours happened, after or before little hijas to Ethiopia or Isra wa Miraj, after the incidence at Taif? when, mr. know it all? You have no answer, and you are just making things up like shaitan that is playing with your heart, that you cant know that man is not God. You might as well be worshipping ogun the god of iron, like alagbede. lol. aletheia, this yoruba is for you, aborisha, man. you will fit well in south carolina oyo tunji people. Shee eyin boys yi kola soju? Allahu Akbar.



[Quote]So much rubbish that you just make me yawn Cheesy[/Quote]My refusal to take a man for God, while I stand firm on truth must have to be rubbish. well i will die on that rubbish, inshaAllah. not accepting a man who bled, as i would have bled, for God. Never.



[Quote]Good. Allah allowed the bible to be corrupted abi ? And yet Mohammad referred you to the same bible to validate what he was saying! Shocked See your tail in between your legs as you run Grin

You are like dick cheney trying to sell a lie. I aint buying. Allah says to the Muslims, ask the people of the book, as if to confront them about the truth that you have and they will not deny it. this is similar to when Allah told Musa (AS0 in Surah baqarah that he should tell the children of Israel to go back to Egypt or any place they want, if what they have from Him of food (manna and salwa) are not good enough. Allah says it to mock them, just like he mocks you as we are to ask you about the truth that you know and yet hiding it. he is my asking you: When jesus said he is a servant of God Who sent him, why do you insist that he is that God? Can you explain how, and if not, then have fear of that God and stop lying.



[Quote]You are a fraud! And its good you are plaing to the gallery. My view ? This is simply what the qu'ran says sir. Not my view sir. Did he contemplate suicide or not ? Can’t you just say things as they are ?[/quote]Now, I wanna know who the fraudster is. Show me a verse in the Quran, your claim; that says Muhammad wants to kill himself. I have many verses about the satan taking Jesus about the places, until he yelled "get back from me, satan". Remember? everything i say is from your Bible. And if you doubt me, i will pull them out for you to see. Now pull out the verse from the Quran that says Muhammad (AS) wants to kill himself. A verse. And for me, i will show you at least 4 places that jesus was under the control of Satan. Three temptations, driving him to the wilderness, and was tormented enough that he had to yell. now thats 5.



[Quote]You have no hope. Come to One Who was, Who is and Who is to come. Mohammad will be judged like you will be judged.[/quote]Jesus cant Judge the jews who killed him, according to your Bible. You remember Pilate? That was the judge over Biblical Jesus. read it again.

Jesus remains alive but your Mohammad is dead and rotten in the grave. That is so much joy to me in addition to the accolades the qu'ran gives to him (Jesus). Mohammad can only wish he had those accolades even in his next life Grin.
Jesus is Lord!! (Note- i did not need to say "May Peace Be Unto Him" as you would to Mohammad because Jesus is the Prince of Peace). Keep praying for Mohammad okay.)

When i do pray for muhammad (AS), and request that Allah give him the honor of intercession, Maqam Mamuda, on the day of Judgement (from Surah Maryam and Surah Ahzab) it is for my own good and benefit. If death is the issue here, Ibrahim (AS), Musa (AS) Nuh (AS), and the rest of them, including DAud (AS), whose Psalm you use to protect yourself, leaving out everything from Gospel, though you speak ill of David, are all in the same condition like Muhammad (AS), while jesus and melchezdeke, and elijah are all in the same condition. By the way[b] Satan has not died. he is alive, too[/b]. i thought you may like that, seeing how weak your blind arguments are. And when a person dies, he rots, right away? the ice man discovered in the depth of the ice defies your statement.

JESUS IS ALIVE!!! This makes my heart rejoice.[/Quote]You do not know the condition of jesus you never have seen. according to your bible, he died. that simply made him a human being, if anyone had doubted it before. if i go along with your theory of his waking up from death, many a "zombie" they say wake up and walk about in Haiti for many years. Jesus didnt walk on this earth for more than few days after the so called resurrection. are the xombie Gods, too? ridiculous thoughts. now he was lifted by God to heaven. He was not the first to be lifted. according to the Bible, even elijah did not die and was lifted up, to heavens, too. he is God too, by your account? what about melchezdeke, who the bIble said did not have a beginning, an end, family father or mother, nor children. was he not a God, a bigger one than jesus, if i follow your logic? where will your theory not lead you? no wonder you have many gods!



[Quote]You need not respect me.Just give due respect to your Quran that says you should validate it with the Bible. Grin[/Quote]Amsd what the Wuran says is that Jesus was son of Mary, a servant of God, a prophet to the Children of israel and "one" of those who are close to Allah.when i said i do not respect you, it differntiated the greetings away from respect. it is without any respect. its like a man called "Evil: genius. his wisdom bellongs to what the devil incites him to do. it has nothing to do with God. this is your case, for jesus is a servant and you called him God.



@dskj56:« #251 on: Today at 05:10:14 PM »
[quote]There is no controversy about this issue, read your bible, it is clearly stated in Isaiah 9:6
JESUS CHRIST IS GOD ALMIGHTY. NO ARGUMENT.

And when Jesus said in your Bible that he is a servant of God, there is controversy, in that verse? Do you know jesus than Jesus son of Mary? How you guys are making aservant become God, beats even your own imagination, except that it fits into the dilution that plagues the heart of disbelief.
I could ask a trillion times, no christian is able to discard the verse that says Jesus son of Mary is a servant of God. A trillion times I say and i need just a good answer, just one time. Rejoice because your time is already a for gone conclusion.

Aletheia, shee you dey enjoy how i group you with sango worshippers? afterall you have more than one Gos. they the same. you have a physical rep. they too. lol.

yours died and you say he is alive, by your own theory. the onisango say obakoso, meaning the same thing. weak gods both of you have.

^^^
You can group me with anyone you want. It makes no difference to me.
Such distinctions are of no import to one who has died! What matters is that Jesus be glorified!
Gal 2:20.
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
John 11:25.
Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: