Kobojunkie:
Why should an atheist be restricted when it comes to whom he/she can marry? Did God somehow make a rule against atheists marrying whomever they please?

Kobojunkie:

I am a follower of Jesus Christ - I stick to the Truth as taught by Jesus Christ Himself - and I am not a "brainwashed gullible" Christian. None of my old friends, many of whom remain atheists to this day, think of me as a "brainwashed gullible" Christian. So?

Kobojunkie:

As part of the Old Covenant, God Himself commanded His people to teach His laws, which He gave through to Moses, to their children.

He instructed them to talk about the commandments wherever they gather, write it on their hands, doorposts, everywhere.
And as is customary with men, you tell him to do A, man will do Z. The people of course added their own "spin" to the laws of God and even threw in the kitchen table, pots and cups into their telling of the laws to their children, instead of indoctrinating generations, leading to their abandonment of the way of God, in some cases, entirely( Jesus Christ railed against the so-called teachers of the law on this in His teachings).

God then announced through His prophets that He was going to bring a new deal to His people, and in the new deal, He alone would teach His people of Himself.

No longer would a man have to teach his neighbor or brothers about God - God Himself will do the teaching Himself and Himself alone.

When Jesus Christ, the New Covenant promised us, arrived He Himself declared again, that He and He alone is Teacher to all of His - none of His followers is to set themselves as teachers over those who belong to Him.

This He made clear in His final instructions to His followers when He sent them out to go teach the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven, that which He taught them(no modifications of any kind), to the world.

So, if you think that you can "train" your children into becoming followers of Jesus Christ, I am afraid you are thoroughly deceived. It is that or God is a LIAR and Jesus Christ His grand deception!.

Kobojunkie:

So, if you want your children to have real peace, as God Himself said, and not that imaginary peace many of the religious folks out there walk around with, I suggest you get to accepting(trusting) and obeying the teachings/commandments of Jesus Christ so that the Light of Jesus Christ can shine through you and be seen by your loved ones and those around you, as Jesus Christ commanded.

shadeyinka:
[s]You have said nothing of value here Buda. My lack of knowledge is outstanding but you forget that fool is always wise in his own eyes.

You quote the Scriptures like only satan can. Didn't he assure Jesus of his protection by angels if he jumped down from the top of the temple?

Love your neighbor doesn't mean partaking or promoting the lawlessness of sons of Belial![/s]

shadeyinka:

[s]You may ascribe whatever you want to what I have said...does it matter?
It is worthless statements, empty and without content. You do not even seem to know the meaning of false witness with all your readings. I suspect you are prone to Taqqiya and I am not surprised!

I know that as usual, you wouldn't answer these questions because it betrays your shallowness
1. Is morality objective or subjective?
2. What is the standard of morality for Atheists?
3. Is sex before marriage between consenting adults moral or immoral?

If you cannot justly and truthfully answer these questions, your comments are at best ramblings of empty barrels![/s]

Kobojunkie:
I am a follower of Jesus Christ - I stick to the Truth as taught by Jesus Christ Himself - and I am not a "brainwashed gullible" Christian.

shadeyinka:
Ps 14:1: [/b]The [b]fool has said in his heart, There is no God.
Isn't an atheist godless?
Combine these two, you arrive at "godless fools"!

shadeyinka:
Are Atheists sons of God? Do they have the spiritual DNA of God?
John 1:12:
"But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:"

shadeyinka:
Have Atheists received the Power to be sons of God (spiritual DNA)?
I do not need to respond to "senselessness"!

shadeyinka:
I didn't ask why an atheist cannot marry whoever they want. I asked why an atheist would be interested in marrying a true Christian. Is it because of satanic evangelism? What is so special with true Christians that an atheist would ignore true Atheists and be pursuing true Christians?

shadeyinka:
Just check a few NL post and tell me the impression the average Atheist have about Christians!

shadeyinka:
As a Christian, your knowledge seem highly skewed.

shadeyinka:
Mat 28:20:
"Teaching them to observe all things whatever I have commanded you: and, see, I am with you always, even to the end of the world. Amen."

Mat 28:19:
"Go you therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:"

This He made clear in His final instructions to His followers when He sent them out to go teach the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven, that which He taught them(no modifications of any kind), to the world.

shadeyinka:

A Christian's child is his first student and disciple.

shadeyinka:
If you cannot teach your children to do all Christ has taught, my brother, you have failed. For your home is your primary CHURCH!

shadeyinka:
The wheat and tares are true children of God AND pseudo children of God. They look alike but they do not have the same DNA!
The parable isn't about children of God versus anti-Christs.

shadeyinka:
Do true children of God and Atheists look-alike with respect to God?
I don't know where you learned your bible!

Kobojunkie:
David may have taught to call those he referred to in his writing there as fools, but God did not think me a fool when He dogged me and pulled me to Himself even while I was still an atheist.
Note, God does not necessarily share David's opinion there that you should take your training from David there.

Kobojunkie:

The atheist is condemned to die (cease to exist in his grave) but anyone who believes in Jesus Christ has eternal life. However, the same Jesus Christ who told you that also told you that those who do not become Sons of God, though they have received Him will spend eternity in Hell. So, are you, as a person, better than those you suggest do not have the spiritual DNA of God?
Again, are you better than the atheist?

Kobojunkie:
Only God is able to see into the heart of another to know their "Spiritual" state. You cannot see a person's "spiritual state".

Go ask the 10's of millions of so-called Christians who taught they married a fellow Christian only to realize that they married someone no different from their own selves in cunning and deceit.
God Himself told you through His very prophets that you should not concern yourself with such things. He, God, is Spirit, and He has told you that He will teach His children of the things of the Spirit in this New Covenant.
Do you not trust your own God?
I never said Christians should take any hard drugs. Teaching your children to stay away from hard drugs is common sense and has nothing to do with their being "Christians".
My response there was instead to get you thinking about the question you had asked me of whose decision it was or something like .
You are flesh and blood... you cannot impart anything that belongs to the Spirit of God to anyone. You are not built for such. However, the teachings of Jesus Christ are all you can teach others for His teachings are Spirit, just as He taught them, mind you(any modification results in a lie).
All this boils down to one thing... Do you trust the word of the one you call God or do you instead trust in your own gut feelings and not in God?

Kobojunkie:
Remember that you brought the Parable of wheat and tares into this. I simply followed your analogy by pointing out that even then, Jesus Christ told you that the tares will not be separated from the wheat until the end.

Wheat refers to those who accept and obey the commandments of Jesus Christ whereas Tares refers to those who refuse to obey Jesus Christ(i.e. they are anti-Christs).
Considering God made us all - atheists and non-atheists - it makes sense that we all look alike.
You keep using the term "True Children" of God, yet forgetting that Jesus Christ, God's very own avatar came down to earth, wined and dined with these same sinners, and never once condemning them or their choices. Are you truer than God Himself in this?

Kobojunkie:
Your question still makes no sense. You assume that atheists discriminate as far as who they would marry in the same way that you have chosen for yourself.
I am a Christian and I don't even get those who claim to believe in Jesus Christ and think as you do that Christians should only marry Christians or that nonsense.
You seem to care a lot about what the average Athiest on Nairaland thinks, don't you?
I am not skewed... instead I have been set free from all that bullsheet religion that many of you like to cling to -- those moral codes that at the end of the day have absolutely nothing to do with Jesus Christ or the Kingdom of God to begin with.
Exactly what I said to you before.
You are to teach the Gospel exactly as Jesus Christ gave them to you. That is all He commanded you to do. Jesus Christ commanded you to teach ONLY THAT WHICH HE TAUGHT... He did not send you to teach your own doctrines and traditions which is what you have been spewing all this time, pretending you do so in the name of Jesus Christ.
Your child is your first student? Really? Says who?
The Spirit of God, the one who is supposed to direct you to each of those He commands that you teach the Gospel to or You since you probably believe it is your decision to teach the Gospel to whomever you want and whenever?

Even Jesus Christ did not teach His Gospel to everyone since He was well aware that He was only to teach them to those God had sent Him to, and not to those He had not sent Him(Jesus Christ) to.
God has yet to send me to teach members of my own family(I live with them too), and I understand why.
Again, this is, at the end of the day, a question of whether you trust the one you claim as your God, or you instead trust yourself to do handle it all by your own power and might.

Even Jesus Christ, the Lord Himself, who spent over 30 years on this earth with His family, was not able to convince until much much later in His time on earth, and after He had left this world. If you think the measure of you is in whether you are able to convince your family or not, then you are truly running your own show there.

shadeyinka:
A fool can be saved isn't it?An atheist can be saved isn't it?A sinner is one who need salvation and not the sinless!
Atheists are fools because despite all the evidences, they think something can come out of nothing!They think a book can write itself.
Anyone who thinks a library of books can make itself is a compound fool
But yet, a fool can be transformed at salvation.

shadeyinka:
I wish what you wrote is true but it goes against the nature of God.
If God is the Source of all morality (rules for interpersonal relationships) then He must set up a system of justice (morality is meaningless without justice). It will be stupidity to know that God is the source of morality and not expect Justice.

Rev 20:15:
"And whoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."

shadeyinka:
1. Why do you think there would first be resurrection of both the good and the evil before judgement?
2. Why wouldn't God just resurrect the good and leave the evil in an unconscious state?

shadeyinka:
3. It the worst punishment God can give death?
I wish you can truthfully answer these three questions!

shadeyinka:
A Tare is a kind of weed that looks very much like wheat only that they are barren. Many times they are indistinguishable from wheat hence the Master said, "wait till the harvest"..."so that you wouldn't accidentally pull out a single wheat"!

It's amazing that Jesus didn't mix with Herod!

shadeyinka:
My question still is, why is it diserable for an atheist to seek marriage with a true Christian.
Is it not diserable for Atheists to marry fellow Atheists? Are Atheists afraid of corruption expected from fellow Atheists?

shadeyinka:
Are you refuting these statements or concuring?

Kobojunkie:
Again, God does not necessarily share the opinions of David. since He, God, decided to pick up a fool like me and make me one of His very own - one who accepts(trusts) and obeys the commandments of Jesus Christ Himself.
I am afraid you are mistaken. God is not the source of all morality. Man's ideas of morality are not of God - they are mans. And Jesus Christ warned you severally against adopting the commandments of men as they are lies that nullify the power of God in your lives, rendering your worship of God meaningless.

God condemned unbelievers to death (condemnation of sin) since the garden of Eden(Genesis 2). Adam and Eve(they both perished in their graves - where turned to dust/ceased to exist as a result) were first to be condemned by this judgement that God instituted since the very beginning. God repeated the validity of this judgement in Ezekiel 18.

In John 3 vs 16-21, it is made clear to you that what Jesus Christ offers you is salvation from the condemnation of Sin(Death), and not sin itself. It goes on to state that Jesus Christ's offer only applies to those who believe in Him - meaning unbelievers remain condemned to die as God stipulated from the beginning. So those who are in their graves, aren't unbelievers but the righteous(from Old) and believers(who have been gifted eternal life by Jesus Christ), all of whom exist, and sleep in their graves.

Know the truth of your God from the many doctrines and traditions of men which many of you cling to.
The second resurrection is of those who are of the Kingdom of God, you forget there are two parts to this kingdom promised... Heaven and Hell. The good(sheep) are for Heaven and the bad(goats) of Jesus Christ's flock are bound for Hell.

By "the unconscious" state, I suppose you mean God should leave them sleeping in their graves instead. Remember that the Covenant came with a promise of eternity to be spent either in Heaven or in Hell. And God is True, and His Word is Truth. Read Matthew 25 vs 31 - 46.
You assume that God would think as humans do where punishment is concerned. Here are two things I learnt very early on when I started investigating the character of the Bible God while still an atheist.
1) God does not judge the same people twice.
2) And God punishment for His own turns out worse than the punishment He gives to those who not belong to Him.

This pattern is seen over and over in the Old Testament.

* Death(return to dust, cease to exist, become nothing, mind, body and soul) was declared as punishment by God from right in the same garden where He made man. He sentenced the very first man to this fate even there. And this is the condemnation He has placed on those who do know Him.
However, on those who know Him, through Jesus Christ, He condemned instead to eternity in Hell.

Kobojunkie:
I responded as clearly to each one of them as I could.

Kobojunkie:
My answer is an atheist is free to marry whomever he/she chooses to, regardless of religious background. So long as the couple if happy, it is their right and freedom by God to do as they please.

While you sit here lampooning this one for marrying a Christian, your God continues, daily, by the way, to pour on them(the wicked and ungrateful alike) His mercy and compassion. Don't you find that ironic?

Kobojunkie:
The point of the parable of tares is the landowner said Not to separate the tares from the wheat until the very end. so suggesting that Jesus Christ called for "Christians" to separate themselves in any way from those around them is not according to the teachings or Acts of Jesus Christ.

shadeyinka:
We say the same thing and it's in agreement with the Scriptures. An atheist is a godless fool until his eyes be opened to God.

shadeyinka:
If death is the worst punishment man can give, what's the worst punishment God can give?
Luk 12:4: "And I say to you my friends, Be not afraid of them that kill the body, and after that have no more that they can do."

shadeyinka:
Only a stupid, gullible or selfish Christian will choose to marry an atheist except if she never knew Christ

And this same God will select out for his judgement the children of Belial!?

shadeyinka:

The parable is saying in summary that God cares even about the "baby Christians" and would rather allow pretenders around them until the day of harvest.
Correlate with these Scriptures below:

Mat 7:22-23:
"Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name? and in your name have cast out devils? and in your name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess to them, I never knew you: depart from me, you that work iniquity."

Luk 6:46:
"And why call you me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?"

Mat 7:21-23:
"Not every one that said to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name? and in your name have cast out devils? and in your name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess to them, I never knew you: depart from me, you that work iniquity."

Kobojunkie:
I know what the parable says. You however picked to bring it into this discussion to support your idea of separation of peoples and I merely threw it back at you, pointing out that even in the parable, Jesus Christ made it quite clear that no separation will take place until when the "harvest" is due, and that does not happen until after He returns.

Kobojunkie:
Jesus Christ has nothing to do with what any of what are saying here at all. This is all that is stored up inside of you and not God or Christ.

Kobojunkie:
I don't say what David says because it is not from David I learned of God but from God Himself that I learnt of what God says of me.
The kind of Death(Condemnation of sin) that God inflicts is the kind that destroys both the body and the soul. That is the Death that He imposed, from the beginning, on those who do not believe in Him.

Kobojunkie:

As for the worst punishment God can give? I am not sure which of Hell or Death God considers worst, but from where I sit, I would choose God's Death over eternity in Hell any day, and God knows this of me.

Sheunma:
Interesting conversation going on here. From all that's been said, something jumps at me:

Former atheists, like Buda and Kobo, who are now "christians" seem to have a different, somewhat philosophical interpretation of the scriptures from "mainstream" christians, like Shade.

The majority of christians, including members of JW like Max, would find the position of Shade and Max agreeable- No "true christian"( whatever that means) would marry an atheist. I might be wrong but it takes a christian who has passed through the eye of athiesm or at least agnosicm to even entertain the thought.

So my quandary remains why is former athiests idea of christianity different from other christians?

Anyone?

shadeyinka:
Continuation:
My journey to atheism was slow and steady.

Sheunma:
Interesting conversation going on here. From all that's been said, something jumps at me:

Former atheists, like Buda and Kobo, who are now "christians" seem to have a different, somewhat philosophical interpretation of the scriptures from "mainstream" christians, like Shade.

The majority of christians, including members of JW like Max, would find the position of Shade and Max agreeable- No "true christian"( whatever that means) would marry an atheist. I might be wrong but it takes a christian who has passed through the eye of athiesm or at least agnosicm to even entertain the thought.

So my quandary remains why is former athiests idea of christianity different from other christians?

Anyone?

lilvicky68:

Those former atheists now christians are true believers because they've taken time to study the word of God and also been touched by the Holy Spirit they dropped their atheism and believes unlike we normal christians who just go to church and agree with anything the pastor says..

budaatum:


I will say "understanders" instead of "true believers". As in, we seek an understanding and find one.

I, for instance, believe nothing when it comes to Gods, but if you slap my right cheek and I turn my left cheek and you slap, you'd likely not go past 7 times before you find you can't lift your hand to slap again, and I sure will be occupying space in your head for days, if not months and years and for the rest of your life, because you will find it hard to stop thinking of the me you slapped 7 times.

And yes, I know this because I have always lived by this mantra though the slappers never go past 3.

lilvicky68:

Me i won't turn the other cheek oh..I no want my face to swell abeg I will just walk away..