Kobojunkie:

The context is different? How so? Are those whose understanding of God and the things of God become as that of Children less cunning and not harmless like doves?

Children are not known to be wise. Therefore, Jesus also said, be wise as serpents while retaining your childlike gentleness.
In understanding be men means the same thing.

shadeyinka:
Children are not known to be wise. Therefore, Jesus also said, be wise as serpents while retaining your childlike gentleness.
In understanding be men means the same thing.

The commandments given to you as part of the New Covenant are not given as independent pieces but all belong to the same unit. So when Jesus Christ states that only those who become like Children will enter into His kingdom, and then commands you be cunning as snakes but gentle as a dove, you are expected to be in full compliance at all times or choose none of Him at all.
By the way, children have wisdom, unless you indoctrinate the hell out of them filling their heads with lies instead.
It was as a child that I made the decision never to allow myself to be hoodwinked by the many doctrines and deceitful traditions of men which men seem to change whenever they feel like it. God's Truth should never change - I knew that even as a child.

Kobojunkie:
Experience? I call that circling the drain... what 10's of millions of believers do for many many years of their lives.
Really? I am preaching to you right here and now.
Remember the warnings that Jesus Christ Himself gave you.
What you continue to list are not signs that you in fact a follower of Jesus Christ.
Jesus Christ gave His apostles about 50 something or more commandments. Harping on one, while ignoring the rest will not make your situation any better.
It is not your experience that leads you to know Jesus Christ. Instead, it is your acceptance and obedience of His every commandments/teaching that bears witness on your behalf of your knowing Him. So if you spent 20 years wearing the badge, but never really got down to accepting and obeying His every teaching and commandment, you are no better than the person who has known him only a couple of months, who still refuses to accept and obey His commandments/teachings.

The Word of God is like a consuming Fire... and it is that Fire that will judge your so-called experience/works at the end. If your experience is built on the doctrines and traditions of men, instead of the very Word of God, Jesus Christ's Truth, you might as well jump ship at this point.

How do you know your parents? Is it not by your experience through your interactions with them?

Phil 3:10:
"That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable to his death;"

The above is still my quest to know Christ more than this

Kobojunkie:
The commandments given to you as part of the New Covenant are not given as independent pieces but all belong to the same unit. So when Jesus Christ states that only those who become like Children will enter into His kingdom, and then commands you be cunning as snakes but gentle as a dove, you are expected to be in full compliance at all times or choose none of Him at all.
By the way, children have wisdom, unless you indoctrinate the hell out of them filling their heads with lies instead.
It was as a child that I made the decision never to allow myself to be hoodwinked by the many doctrines and deceitful traditions of men which men seem to change whenever they feel like it. God's Truth should never change - I knew that even as a child.

Being as children is a figure of speech to indicate TRUST in God.

Kobojunkie:
There is no record of Zaccheus ever becoming one of the followers of Jesus Christ after that dinner with Jesus Christ. So, your claim that Jesus Christ only wined and dined sinners that were ready to accept the Gospel is erroneous.
Remember to read with your eyes open this time.
Please READ WHAT IS IN FACT WRITTEN FOR YOU TO LEARN FROM
That is your twist on what Jesus Christ said. Open your eyes and read what Jesus Christ in fact said.
Jesus Christ never said any of this. So you assume it should be so is akin to adding to His commandments which is against His teachings.
You obviously need to spend time learning who Jesus Christ is rather than learning from Him through verses randomly compiled. Jesus Christ attacked those in His Father's house for turning it into a den of thieves. He railed against the Religious leaders of His time who had set themselves up as authorities as far as the things of God were concerned, yet they were nothing but blind leaders who were in it for their selfish gain.
Jesus Christ did not go easy on the woman caught in adultery. He already made it clear severally in His teaching that He did not come to condemn those who are sinners but to save those who will be saved.
He even told the Jewish leaders who were trying to kill him at one point that the reason why they do not believe in Him is that God has not given them to Him.
The Gospels have been available to the world for about 2000 years at this point. Rather than trying hard to insert words in His mouth here and there, why not sit down, and let Jesus Christ Himself teach you who He is and what His teaching is about instead?

I honestly don't understand you as the Scriptures is meant to be applied in all areas of our lives.

I'm sure Jesus didn't speak about watching pornography!

shadeyinka:
I honestly don't understand you as the Scriptures is meant to be applied in all areas of our lives.
I'm sure Jesus didn't speak about watching pornography!

Just as Jesus Christ was not found preaching the Gospel to everyone He met, so also you are called to use WISDOM in applying His teachings, only WISDOM in this case is the Spirit of God.

The Gospel teachings are not meant to be thrown at all things until you find, by crook or cunning which teaching you can get to stick.

shadeyinka:
Being as children is a figure of speech to indicate TRUST in God.

It is that and more.
When you trust God, you don't trust in your own understanding and certainly not in the doctrines and commandments of men.

shadeyinka:

How do you know your parents? Is it not by your experience through your interactions with them?

Phil 3:10:
"That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable to his death;"

The above is still my quest to know Christ more than this

Experience is not even the bulk of it. Stephen, an example in the book of Acts, had less experience than most of the disciples but we read of how he was able to fully accept(trust) and obey the teaching/commandment of Jesus Christ, even where he knew his life might be at its end.

fine discussion....

But i as i go through it, the only conclusion in sight is that "religion divides".

I see persons who call themselves true christians vilifying a fine christian woman who has been a model wife in a happy marriage for 7 years. To these persons, her crime is marrying an atheist. Some of these persons quote verses in the christian holy book to justify the concealed enmity they have towards others not aligning with them in faith, especially atheists. Is this not the same as Muslims calling others not aligning with them in faith as infidels? Know that they also quote verses in their holy book for justification.

If we look at one another as individuals, and really respect one another, we really can live together irrespective of our religious differences. And for those concerned about the children of the union, know that atheist (at least my kind) don't go proselytizing. I teach our kids to have an open mind. I remember my girl once asking me whether I or mummy was right about the god subject; and my answer was why she thought either of us was right. Trust me, the little girl has been taught more christian stuff than kids in many all-christian home. But importantly, she's learned to avoid some fallacies, such as the fallacy of false dilemma.
daddy may like rice, and mummy may like beans, but she can like either or neither. That's up to her. We don't teach her what to think; we teach her how to think.

So please, stop all the enmity (whether overt or concealed). Respect one another's (especially your partners') taste/ preferences. Don't see your taste as superior. Don't force your taste on others. And you'll find that just as a rice-person and a beans-person can be successfully married, so a christain and an atheist can be successfully married.

eomajeh:

Trust me, the little girl has been taught more christian stuff than kids in many all-christian home. But importantly, she's learned to avoid some fallacies, such as the fallacy of false dilemma. daddy may like rice, and mummy may like beans, but she can like either or neither. That's up to her. We don't teach her what to think; we teach her how to think.

You empower your daughter to use her mind. And just by seeing how well you use your mind, I trust you and can't wait to read your testimony in 10 and 20 years time.

www.nairaland.com/attachments/13284837_screenshot20210319224531_jpeg0f37e22a527ea352766a86a2a8d39bef


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZp-LLfDSc4

Kobojunkie:
Experience is not even the bulk of it. Stephen, an example in the book of Acts, had less experience than most of the disciples but we read of how he was able to fully accept(trust) and obey the teaching/commandment of Jesus Christ, even where he knew his life might be at its end.

It is while trusting and obeying that one get to know Christ better.
Stephen got another revelation of Christ in the process of being stoned which he might never have as a mortal man

Kobojunkie:
It is that and more.
When you trust God, you don't trust in your own understanding and certainly not in the doctrines and commandments of men.

Doctrines and commandments of men are poisons. Doctrines and commandment of God through His Word and Spirit.

Kobojunkie:
Just as Jesus Christ was not found preaching the Gospel to everyone He met, so also you are called to use WISDOM in applying His teachings, only WISDOM in this case is the Spirit of God.

The Gospel teachings are not meant to be thrown at all things until you find, by crook or cunning which teaching you can get to stick.

I think we can converge here.

1. The gospel (good news of the mystery of salvation) should be preached to all the world.
2. The message of the gospel is not to be forced on others. Take your leave if they reject it.
3. A Christian must place his love and obedience to Christ above all things, thus he would get to know Him better

On the matter at hand
1. A Christian who has been married to an atheist should not divorce except the Atheist decided not to continue with her.
2. A Christian should not discriminate in associating with both believers and unbelievers in the spirit of love and purity.
3. A Christian must not hate Atheists but should leave them if they would not accept the gospel. Leaving them include not permanently joining themselves to Atheists in marriage.

shadeyinka:

It is while trusting and obeying that one get to know Christ better.
Stephen got another revelation of Christ in the process of being stoned which he might never have as a mortal man

Philip got a "revelation" too while he was still in his mortal body and not in danger. I think it is not necessary to maje extreme conclusions where there is no real evidence for such.

Jesus Christ reveals through His Spirit that which He chooses to and when He chooses too. We don't know that that was Steohen's first time of ever receiving such a vision from Christ. All we are told is that while he was beinf stoned, he saw one of those.

shadeyinka:

I think we can converge here.

1. The gospel (good news of the mystery of salvation) should be preached to all the world.
2. The message of the gospel is not to be forced on others. Take your leave if they reject it.
3. A Christian must place his love and obedience to Christ above all things, thus he would get to know Him better

On the matter at hand
1. A Christian who has been married to an atheist should not divorce except the Atheist decided not to continue with her.
2. A Christian should not discriminate in associating with both believers and unbelievers in the spirit of love and purity.
3. A Christian must not hate Atheists but should leave them if they would not accept the gospel. Leaving them include not permanently joining themselves to Atheists in marriage.

your number 3 still doesnt echo Jesus Christ's teaching.

shadeyinka:

Doctrines and commandments of men are poisons. Doctrines and commandment of God through His Word and Spirit.

Jesus Christ said

Kobojunkie:
your number 3 still doesnt echo Jesus Christ's teaching.

Why not?

The gospel cannot be forced on others. If an evil man insist on remaining evil, should we be friends? (I'm not saying Atheists are evil)

Does it make sense to be a friend to someone who despise my parent?
Must I bond with someone who trivialises the thing I value most in life?

Doesn't it make sense to be friend of someone who respect my parents? Doesn't it make sense to bond with someone who value what I consider important?

Only a person with an inferiority complex will want friendship/marriage with a person that doesn't value his most prized possession!

Kobojunkie:
Philip got a "revelation" too while he was still in his mortal body and not in danger. I think it is not necessary to maje extreme conclusions where there is no real evidence for such.

Jesus Christ reveals through His Spirit that which He chooses to and when He chooses too. We don't know that that was Steohen's first time of ever receiving such a vision from Christ. All we are told is that while he was beinf stoned, he saw one of those.

My point was that Stephen wasn't idle. In his course of service to God, he encountered the persecution that led to his revelation of Christ in another dimension

shadeyinka:
My point was that Stephen wasn't idle. In his course of service to God, he encountered the persecution that led to his revelation of Christ in another dimension

And I am saying, we should not jump to such conclusions. As a follower of Jesus Christ, what does it mean to be "idle"?
If God has you waiting somewhere, and you find all are required to do by God during all that time is eat, poop, and sleep, are you "idle"?
Did Jesus Christ say, anywhere in His teaching, that the Spirit of God will only teach you things when you are being active and not when you are in idle mode, waiting on God's next command?

shadeyinka:
Why not? The gospel cannot be forced on others. If an evil man insist on remaining evil, should we be friends? (I'm not saying Atheists are evil)

Jesus Christ never gave us any rules as far as who we can befriend and who we cannot. And since your friendships and your marriages are of this world, it is up to you, as a person to make these decisions based on your wisdom and situation.

shadeyinka:
Does it make sense to be a friend to someone who despise my parent?
Must I bond with someone who trivialises the thing I value most in life?

Jesus Christ did not give us any rules as far as such things and so it is no one's place to make and impose rules/commandments for others to follow as far as these such are concerned.

shadeyinka:
Doesn't it make sense to be friend of someone who respect my parents? Doesn't it make sense to bond with someone who value what I consider important?

Jesus Christ, by giving us no rules for these, left this up to individuals to decide on their own for their own selves.

shadeyinka:
Only a person with an inferiority complex will want friendship/marriage with a person that doesn't value his most prized possession!

Well, if you feel that way about you doing it, then don't. Others are free to arrive at their own conclusion of their own situation.

Kobojunkie:
Jesus Christ never gave us any rules as far as who we can befriend and who we cannot. And since your friendships and your marriages are of this world, it is up to you, as a person to make these decisions based on your wisdom and situation.
Jesus Christ did not give us any rules as far as such things and so it is no one's place to make and impose rules/commandments for others to follow as far as these such are concerned.
Jesus Christ, by giving us no rules for these, left this up to individuals to decide on their own for their own selves.
Well, if you feel that way about you doing it, then don't. Others are free to arrive at their own conclusion of their own situation.

It is morally wrong for a true Christian to marry a Moslem how much more an atheist.
Can light walk with darkness?

As a child of God, I can't have satan as my in-law! QED!

Kobojunkie:
And I am saying, we should not jump to such conclusions. As a follower of Jesus Christ, what does it mean to be "idle"?
If God has you waiting somewhere, and you find all are required to do by God during all that time is eat, poop, and sleep, are you "idle"?
Did Jesus Christ say, anywhere in His teaching, that the Spirit of God will only teach you things when you are being active and not when you are in idle mode, waiting on God's next command?

You seem to misunderstand my take on this.

How can a Christian be used to heal the sick or to deliver the satanically oppressed?

shadeyinka:
You seem to misunderstand my take on this.
How can a Christian be used to heal the sick or to deliver the satanically oppressed?

I don't understand what you mean.

shadeyinka:
It is morally wrong for a true Christian to marry a Moslem how much more an atheist.
Can light walk with darkness?
As a child of God, I can't have satan as my in-law! QED!

Those who are followers of Jesus Christ subscribe to one set of rules, and one set of rules only, and that is the teachings/commandments of Jesus Christ. Any other moral codes you have there are meaningless as far as Jesus Christ and the things of God are concerned.

As for having Satan as your in-law, Jesus Christ told you that even your "Saintly" wife/in-laws will be your enemy in this if you are His follower

Matthew 10 vs 34-39
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
34. “Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace. I came to bring trouble.[h]
35. I have come to make this happen:
‘A son will turn against his father.
A daughter will turn against her mother.
A daughter-in-law will turn against her mother-in-law.
36. Even members of your own family will be your enemies.’
37. “Those who love their father or mother more than they love me are not worthy of me. And those who love their son or daughter more than they love me are not worthy of me.
38. Those who will not accept the cross that is given to them when they follow me are not worthy of me.
39. Those who try to keep the life they have will lose it. But those who give up their life for me will find true life.

Kobojunkie:
Those who are followers of Jesus Christ subscribe to one set of rules, and one set of rules only, and that is the teachings/commandments of Jesus Christ. Any other moral codes you have there are meaningless as far as Jesus Christ and the things of God are concerned.

As for having Satan as your in-law, Jesus Christ told you that even your "Saintly" wife/in-laws will be your enemy in this if you are His follower

Atheists can be members of ones family.

If God is my Father through Christ, who is the father of the Atheist?

Should a Christian knowingly take satan as his father-in-law?

Kobojunkie:
I don't understand what you mean.

A Christian is used to heal only when he prays for the sick.
A Christian is used to cast out demons only when he confront satan in the life of a person.
A Christian can only lead a person to Christ by sharing the gospel of Christ

Things only happen in the cause of obedience to do/act in faith in that which is commanded

shadeyinka:
Atheists can be members of ones family.
If God is my Father through Christ, who is the father of the Atheist?
Should a Christian knowingly take satan as his father-in-law?

You get to decide all that for your own self there. That is the beauty of this Contract called Jesus Christ.
Where there are no "Chains/Shackles" given you by God Himself, you get to decide whether you will add Chains/Shackles of your own or live free of them completely!

Kobojunkie:
You get to decide all that for your own self there. That is the beauty of this Contract called Jesus Christ.
Where there are no "Chains/Shackles" given you by God Himself, you get to decide whether you will add Chains/Shackles of your own or live free of them completely!

You didn't answer my questions


1. If God is my Father through Christ, who is the father of the Atheist?
2. Should a Christian knowingly take satan as his father-in-law?

shadeyinka:
A Christian is used to heal only when he prays for the sick.
A Christian is used to cast out demons only when he confront satan in the life of a person.
A Christian can only lead a person to Christ by sharing the gospel of Christ

Things only happen in the cause of obedience to do/act in faith in that which is commanded

Nothing of Jesus Christ's teachings suggests that any of this is His Truth.
Also, by your submission there, are you suggesting that a sleeping Christian(in bed) is a Christian who is not in the cause of accepting and obeying the commandment of Jesus Christ?

shadeyinka:
You didn't answer my questions
1. If God is my Father through Christ, who is the father of the Atheist?
2. Should a Christian knowingly take satan as his father-in-law?

I answered your question. The same God who created you created the Atheists. So suggesting that He is yours alone is all you.
And like I already said, where Jesus Christ has given us no rules, He leaves it up to the individual to decide what he/she will do in his or her situation.

Kobojunkie:
Nothing of Jesus Christ's teachings suggests that any of this is His Truth.

Really?
I don't have the gift of healing but God has used me a lot to heal the sick.
My first experience with deliverance was a dissaster! The demonized woman grabbed me by my collars...
I am not gifted as an evangelist, by Jesus has used me to bring several people to His kingdom when I preach

I tell you the truth, if you don't step out in faith (like a child) you will be 100 years in the Lord and will see nothing.

*No one get used to it as every experience is different

Kobojunkie:

Also, by your submission there, are you suggesting that a sleeping Christian(in bed) is a Christian who is not in the cause of accepting and obeying the commandment of Jesus Christ?

I have never said that. Even Jesus as a man sleeps!

shadeyinka:

It is morally wrong for a true Christian to marry a Moslem how much more an atheist.
Can light walk with darkness?

As a child of God, I can't have satan as my in-law! QED!

Next you'd claim you did not just imply that Moslems are satan, though in fact by your own very fruits you've simply shown the satan is you walking in the darkness of your own ignorance.