Then I implore you to indulge yourself in reading the bibliographies of these text to find the references you are looking for.
You are the person to provide these bibliographies, after all you have access to these modern books by Alagoa and the rest.
We also look forward to any pre-colonial documents from the Portuguese, Spanish or any neutral European operators in Ubani, that you may be basing your assertions on.
In this forum, I was able to show translated snippets from Portuguese explorers, written about 550 years ago, to prove that the NRI kingdom was the cultural and religious overlord of Benin empire.
All you need to do, is to provide a few pre colonial documents to back your assertions
Yes, me personally do not even add them at all.. Sometimes, some just flex these muscles to show that we actually know or could dig up the history when these people who make it a sports to look for our territories and plant Igbophobic propaganda all around. Go to Facebook groups and see the kind of hate the Ijaws plant within the minorities and the onslaught of landgrabbing.
Okay, I understand. But we Igbos need to know we were born with respect, and pride and we do not come to their level of hate. For me, even if my mom is Igbo, I'm proud to be called an Igbo woman. And I will do anything to foster the unity.
We should simply focus on bringing the Igbo kin together and showing them the love that we were all born through our chi is still present. The chi, which connects us and stop wallowing in the filth of the opposing tribes which try to differentiate, for the reason I can't fathom till today.
I like threads like this, which brings facts and justifies it. No exchanging words, and calling aboriginals of the land slaves, like some people do here. How would an Igbo majority which have overturned the language to strictly Igbo's be slaves in the same land as you.
Here how I feel it went during the civil war:
The Igbos were found majorly around the coastal waters with their neighbours such as Ijaws and the Ibibios. But when the civil war broke out, the naval forces lined the coast and prevented anything Igbo from coming near the coast, becuase if they believed you were iGbo you were good as dead.
This gave the added advantage of the Izon people to come into such lands, changing what they wanted and making it their own. I'll like to call it a subtle way to conquer and acculturalize. The Igbos had no choice than to quickly accept the tribe which they felt safe, but still kept who they are secretly.
This reminds me of the Aztecs (or one red Indian tribe) of México. When the Spaniards came into the land, they wanted them to be Christians by force and do away with their traditional worship. But the Aztecs found a subtle way to satisfy their colonialist, they simply took the Catholic worship but imbibed most of the ritual there with their traditional rituals. So, unknowingly for the Spanish conquerors they were still worshiping their goddess, although it seemed they were worshiping or holding reverence to Mary.
From the works of Charles Ogan (1980s), Finapiri (2001), Alagoa & Fombo (1960s) and Nzewuwa (1980s), among others, it is well-established that the Amanyanabo system is a modern monarchy system that first came about in the 17th century among most Eastern Ijaw communities.
Nzewuwa (1983) showed that the House System and a feudal/factional kingship system already existed in the Elem Kalabari area. Kalabari oral traditions and documentary evidence from European traders suggests that these institutions came to be in active practice by the 17th century. Additionaly, Amakiri I (the first of the modern Kalabari monarchs), is recollected as becoming the first "overall Amanyanabo", creating the modern Kalabari dynasty and galvanizing the Kalabari kingdom. This tradition of Amakiri I becoming the first "overall Amanyanabo" suggests the presence of other feudal kings (at least some, not all) going by "Amanyanabo" (Alagoa, 1970s, 2005).
Unlike the series of events/oral traditions of Kalabari, the picture was rather different for Okrika. Charles Ogan (1980s) did a decent job in marking down a chronology for the adoption of both the House System and the Amanyanabo System within Okrika (which Charles Ogan refers to as Amanyanaboship). Charles shows that the Amanyanabo institution did not exist in Okrika prior to its adopted in the seventeeth century. The first Amanyanabo of Okrika (Ado I) was installed as part of the ongoing effort to free Okrika from Bonny's political and economic authority.
Finapiri (2001) researched and collected Bonny oral traditions which credit Perekule as having brought drastic changes to the kingship system in Bonny in the 18th century, in which Perekule was officially proclaimed as the "Amanyanabo", starting the new Amanyanabo dynasty in Bonny. For Bonny, both the House System and the Amanyanabo system were imported between the late 17th to early 18th centuries (Alagoa 1971, Oriji 2011).
Only Ijaw people quite Alagoa and with all due respect madam/sir you have proven beyond both reasonable and unreasonable doubt that you are Ijaw.
Quit the games and come clean as an Ijaw.
BTW, Alagoa and Fombo's work was in 1972 not 1960's like you claimed. Look at your references, none was before the war. Before the war, nobody from Bonny and Opobo identified as anything other than Igbo. After the war identity crises caused by revision from Minorities is what I call "scramble for Igboland by Minorities"
You are the person to provide these bibliographies, after all you have access to these modern books by Alagoa and the rest.
We also look forward to any pre-colonial documents from the Portuguese, Spanish or any neutral European operators in Ubani, that you may be basing your assertions on.
In this forum, I was able to show translated snippets from Portuguese explorers, written about 550 years ago, to prove that the NRI kingdom was the cultural and religious overlord of Benin empire.
All you need to do, is to provide a few pre colonial documents to back your assertions
She is going to disappoint you. Ijaw people like her only reference Alagoa's lies of 1970 and 1972, nothing more.
Ijoh are more relevant as they are the owners of Bonny. Ijohs are not slaves, rather, they are slaves merchants who served as middle men to European agents. The Aros are not exclusively ibos but a mix of both ibo and ibibio origin. The Aros are well known for slave raiding who raided and sold ibos to the ijohs who in turn delivered them in exchange to the Europeans agents. The Aros established a Confederacy over the interior ibo dwellers. They also sold a large number of ibos who were regarded as sacrifices or dedicated to the gods as punishment for their transgressions, markets and settlements were raided to keep a consistent supply of slaves. The Aros had treaties/slave trading agreements with the ijoh coastal dwellers as well as the calabar merchants who operated at Calabar port, which served as another port for ibo slaves. Bonny & Elem Kalabari are both ijaw towns that served as slave ports through which the Aros supplied a large number of ibo slaves.
And, tell us the name of one recorded Ijaw sláve merchant?
And you know what? I understand Ngwa 100%, in fact no Igbo man from any corner of Igbo land that will not understand Ngwa, but he willfully write unnecessary twists and self-generated spellings and alphabets to trick you into thinking otherwise.
She is fond of doing that. Ngwa is one dialect that is too clear to any part of Igboland but to make her balkanization mission take root, she combine unintelligible consonants to trick naive people to think that Ngwá is that distinct.
There is a theory I have, but just from historical observation, how their name changed over time. I mean the Wakirike people.
Barbot recorded the name as Creke or something like that. (I will check the right spelling later) but it started with C, and one could pronunce it as "Creeke" or "Creek". I feel Kirike is a corruption of the word "Creek" or a Portuguese or Latin base meaning of the word "Creek".
The dialectical word for "Nwa" in that area is "Wa". I think that's why they are called, "Wakirike". "Child of the Creeks".
I just hazard that guess, but a logical one from the records of how the names were recorded. Just like how parts of New Calabar became "Kalabari"
N.B. This is my personal observation.
How about Waikirike i.e Nwa Ikirike ( There is a highland clan known as Ikirike in Enugwu)
Anybody can belong to ijaw national council as long as 100 hungry people from the place come together, that is according to your ijaw constitution, infact we will soon register nairaland as part of ijaw we are 80 people now just waiting for more 20 people to sign up
So why are they not part of Ohaneze Ndigbo or Aka Ikenga? Why are they not using Eze of Bonny or Eze of Opobo?
Okay, I understand. But we Igbos need to know we were born with respect, and pride and we do not come to their level of hate. For me, even if my mom is Igbo, I'm proud to be called an Igbo woman. And I will do anything to foster the unity.
We should simply focus on bringing the Igbo kin together and showing them the love that we were all born through our chi is still present. The chi, which connects us and stop wallowing in the filth of the opposing tribes which try to differentiate, for the reason I can't fathom till today.
I like threads like this, which brings facts and justifies it. No exchanging words, and calling aboriginals of the land slaves, like some people do here. How would an Igbo majority which have overturned the language to strictly Igbo's be slaves in the same land as you.
Here how I feel it went during the civil war:
The Igbos were found majorly around the coastal waters with their neighbours such as Ijaws and the Ibibios. But when the civil war broke out, the naval forces lined the coast and prevented anything Igbo from coming near the coast, becuase if they believed you were iGbo you were good as dead.
This gave the added advantage of the Izon people to come into such lands, changing what they wanted and making it their own. I'll like to call it a subtle way to conquer and acculturalize. The Igbos had no choice than to quickly accept the tribe which they felt safe, but still kept who they are secretly.
This reminds me of the Aztecs (or one red Indian tribe) of México. When the Spaniards came into the land, they wanted them to be Christians by force and do away with their traditional worship. But the Aztecs found a subtle way to satisfy their colonialist, they simply took the Catholic worship but imbibed most of the ritual there with their traditional rituals. So, unknowingly for the Spanish conquerors they were still worshiping their goddess, although it seemed they were worshiping or holding reverence to Mary.
Yes, I agree. You see, sometimes due to the nature of places like this, you cannot bring some facts in isolation. Like you cannot establish some facts about Opobo, without talking about Bonny and the history of Okrika and New Calabar. As you can see, we have all played fair by digging up painstakingly digging up history all these while and basing our arguments on truth rather out of desperation by lying.
...but you see these other guys, they don't even play fair. You know that they tried with resources and everything to curse identity crisis at Ndoki because they see that the history of Ndoki and Bonny can be linked also, especially regarding the first settlers. They even paid one or two hungry people in Ndoki in Abia state to join their meetings and went as far as going to their king's palace.
Mind you, Ndoki in Abia state is as Igbo as anything.
Bonny is a mix tribe. The culture and titles are ijohs. Slave trade brought ibos from the interior to Bonny. Mbanaso was installed as a king by his ijoh master. Olukumi have been igbonized even though they aren't ibos. The large concentration of ibos in a given area gives them undue advantage over the less peopled minorities. The fact remains that the abolishment of slave trade in 1801 gave ibos the leeway as freed slaves in Bonny, prior to 1801, ibos were the largest supplier of slaves. It was for purpose of slavery that brought ibos to Bonny.
More than others, this post summarize the most neutral picture of Bonny.
Kirike or krike (how wakirike/okirika people, call their language or themselves) is the same as in the older English word for Creek or the French word.
You know what, Exactly how it is called in Dutch. The Dutch call Creeks, Kreke but sounds like "Kirike".
I have uploaded the names. So, Wa "kirike", means "Child of the creeks" Note, most of these coastal places had European names from Lagos to Warri to Calabar.
wa-krike nwa-okoike nwa-ike nwa-kike all these sounds almost alike and thesame meaning tho
@zooposki, this finally confirms your answer. @slayerforever, just to reiterate that your assertions about the Kwas are correct. All the mmoghu people were also called "Mokos" or "Moscoes". In later books, Quaws were recorded as "Kwas". Proof below
Second proof. This is another account about Bonny.
I will not upload the third proof, it explained how Ijo later influenced the language of Okrika and New Calabar.
Please I'd like you to send me the books you posted your excerpts from so that i can use them for a research... Here's my mail: cheruvskiy@gmail.com
Yes, I agree. You see, sometimes due to the nature of places like this, you can bring some facts in isolation. Like you cannot establish some facts about Opobo, without talking about Bonny and the history of Okrika and New Calabar. As you can see, we have all played fair by digging up painstakingly digging up history all these while and basing our arguments on truth rather out of desperation by lying.
...but you see these other guys, they don't even play fair. You know that they tried with resources and everything to curse identity crisis at Ndoki because they see that the history of Ndoki and Bonny can be linked also, especially regarding the first settlers. They even paid one or two hungry people in Ndoki in Abia state to join their meetings and went as far as going to their king's palace.
Mind you, Ndoki in Abia state is as Igbo as anything.
EmmaJnr1: na small boy you be. U don't know anything. I see my response to you as a waste of time but I just have to do it. Igbos own rivers state most especially porthacourt. After the war, some minority tribes started taking over igbos lands and property in rivers state which made many igbos to claim they were not igbos just to still live in their ancestral land and have access to their properties. It was within this time that Ikwere was created by Obi nwanali just so they can get job and retain their properties as ikwerre people instead of being seen as igbos. Read about this from this link https://www.nairaland.com/6695300/meet-man-established-ikwerre-rivers
I know u are a fulani sponsored miscreant that moves around to post nonsense just to spit on the Igbos. Una plan na moi moi. Igbos knows where their land starts and end and no one will be left behind when we enter biafra. Even minority ijaw can join through a referendum. Urobo have more population than Ijaw but they are not making noise like this. 90% of Rivers state is Igbo land and are igbos
Referendum will decide. No one would be forced to join biafra. Ijaw, Itshekiri, Urobo can join Biafra which is opened to all. Take note that Biafra is not an Igbo thing. Cross river and akwaibom are biafrans too. You this fulani government paid detractors will soon get tired and run
Just say there are no Ijaw in Nigeria. It will cool your frusrated soul better. Ijaws are larger than Ibo in population. Why didn't Ibo use their false population figure and swallow Nigeria up already?
Kwem: Jesus!! You see I didn't see your comment before I made my comment and they're almost the same...
These are known and established facts.
Igbos are indigenous to these lands stretching into and over the Atlantic ocean all the way to the islands including Equatorial Guinea where they are the third largest tribe.
It's like we're saying the same thing here. You're simply rehashing my statement.
It seems you misunderstand the point of my statement. The point is simply this: Europeans, due to their extensive slave trading contact with Kalabari and then Bonny, were not ignorant of which groups from the interior. In fact, the Europeans did not need to venture into the interior to get information about these communities, because they could record all they needed from their dealings at Kalabari and Bonny slave markets. Between the 16th - 18th centuries, virtually every group within the Lower Niger passed through Kalabari and Bonny slave markets. Europeans purchased them, catalogued and documented them. These documents include reports and memoirs.
I've dived into this subject multiple times here on NL and also provided recommendations for people to use in researching these points. I won't debate this with you. Rather, I'll simply make the following recommendations.
Afigbo's writings within the Ropes of Sand serialization. Talbot and Mulhall's works on Physical Anthropology in the Lower Niger region. Akwaranwa's publication on the politico-cultural history of the Ngwa and Ukwa regions.
Can you send me the links to these works so that I can download them? I seem to have issues locating them online
Please I'd like you to send me the books you posted your excerpts from so that i can use them for a research... Here's my mail: cheruvskiy@gmail.com
Hi bro, because some of these are old scanned books, it may exceed the limits of data an email can carry. I will find a way to write down the reference list. Luckily, many of them are on worldcat, archive.com and even some on Google books. Some are scanned photocopies, especially on Google books.
Some are on Jstor but I think you will need subscribed login or institutional login.
Okay, thank you. Then let's stop adding them to the Igbo nation. I believe we have to focus on our brothers and sisters in Bonny/Opobo and the likes. Okrirka is out of it for me.
We are just telling them the Ijaws that we have the details of all those tribes in our hands.
The obsession, the greed in their heart to Kay claim to a placebin which the people want nothing to do with them. You claim you own Bonny n Opobo, yet they don't sell lands to you people.
After going thro all the trash you forked out, you people fail to know that there wasn't anytown like Opobo until after the bonny war where Jaja has to leave with 14houses from bonny to form what is today Opobo town.
The simple question binhave asked you miscreants foaming in the mouth is this, how come, Jaja never named his children Ibo names. Do your research.
Only Ijaw people quite Alagoa and with all due respect madam/sir you have proven beyond both reasonable and unreasonable doubt that you are Ijaw.
Quit the games and come clean as an Ijaw.
BTW, Alagoa and Fombo's work was in 1972 not 1960's like you claimed. Look at your references, none was before the war. Before the war, nobody from Bonny and Opobo identified as anything other than Igbo. After the war identity crises caused by revision from Minorities is what I call "scramble for Igboland by Minorities"
This is why I hated talks of BIAFRA with minorities as proposed by IPOB. I was totally against it, which pitched me against my IPOB brothers here.
These minorities aided by Hausa-Fulani and Yoruba, scrambled for and grabbed our coastal lands, in places they couldn't grab, they introduced and continue to introduce strong Igbophobia among the populace to atleast make sure the Indigenous become anti Igbo, they started late in Ndoki, at a time Igbo nationalism had awakened and we fought them to a standstill. And going by their lack of remorse up till today, you can see that they hope to keep these lands forever and have no plans of returning them back without violence or use of force on our own part.
It's only common sense that we have a score to settle with these lots once we manage to keep Hausa-Fulani and Yorubas who backed and Continue to back them away, and they know it too, which is why despite the rape they suffer under Hausa-Fulani and Yoruba ruled NIGERIA, they will never lash out to them or even attempt secession.
Our work is cut out. Anyone or group talking about a country between us and Ijaws, only exposes their lack of understanding of issues at play here, and cannot get my support.
This is why I hated talks of BIAFRA with minorities as proposed by IPOB. I was totally against it, which pitched me against my IPOB brothers here.
These minorities aided by Hausa-Fulani and Yoruba, scrambled for and grabbed our coastal lands. And going by their lack of remorse up till today, you can see that they hope to keep these lands forever and have no plans of returning them back without violence or use of force on our own part.
It's only common sense that we have a score to settle with these lots once we manage to keep Hausa-Fulani and Yorubas who backed and Continue to back them away, and they know it too, which is why despite the rape they suffer under Hausa-Fulani and Yoruba ruled NIGERIA, they will never lash out to them or even attempt secession.
Our work is cut out. Anyone or group talking about a country between us and Ijaws, only exposes their lack of understanding of issues at play here, and cannot get my support.
9Pluto: A lot of debates or arguments have been going on mainly between(igbos and ijaws) about the identity of Bonny and Opobo people. So much that lots of indigenes are confused about their own identity. The reason for this is not far fetched. The igbo language is an indigenous language in both places and while most inhabitants bear English names, some bear ijaw names and few still retain their igbo names. However, I will try to be as neutral as possible while I implore you to be a little objective as we embark on this historical fact check. Most of the arguments in my opinion have been nothing more than mere conjectures. For instance, ijaw people claim the igbo language spoken in both places is foreign or creolized version while trying to force inhabitants to start learning an entirely new language different from what they learnt at home. We have seen both igbos and ijaws trying to make their own interpretations of what they think must have happened and as such both of them twist words to have meanings in their their own language. For example: Ndoki-ndoki/aminadokiari Ibani-ubani/ibani/igbani Amanyanabo-Ama onye nabo/ It might interest you to know that the title Amanyanabo use by ijaws originated from Bonny. The igbo interpretation means, “The town/community of 2 kings/persons”. Bonny traditionally had 2 kings as documented by Captain Hugh and he was friends with both men who held him in high esteem. King Pepple and King Holiday were both kings that reigned in Bonny at the same time.
To understand the reality of who Bonny and Opobo people are I would be rellying on the Memoirs of Captain Hugh Crow of Liverpool(1765-1829) and I implore any true son of Bonny or Opobo to consult this book or any other one written before it to really find out their identity. If you do not have much time, you can read from chapter 10, however reading the whole book gives a huge insight into slavery. It is important to note that while the author confirmed Eboes/igbos as natives of Bonny, there was no mention or acknowledgement of ijaws. But I am using my discretion to assume that the ijaws were the Brass people as the author asserts that they came from the Brass country which is located North West of Bonny.
Impotant dates: Captain Hugh Crow of Liverpool(1765-1829) King Jaja of Opobo 1821-1891 Technically King Jaja was born 12 years after slave trade was abolished. Slave trade was abolished in 1809 by Sir Wilberforce. Apart from being a popular slave merchant, Captain Crow(a.k.a Play man) was very popular with Kings and Natives of Bonny. He was so popular that he was invited to crown one of the Kings of Bonny at a time and he was regularly invited to help resolve palaver in the kingdom. He was captain of the last ship that left Bonny with slaves after slavery was abolished.
The authors memoir is insightful for many reasons: It rendered a vivid account of what trans Atlantic slave trade looks like. In his assertions, slaves taken off the West African coast to America were better off than their countrymen left behind in Africa. During the period in review, whites were also slaves and most Britons including the author became prisoners of the French.
The author asserts that: Bonny people are chiefly a mix of Eboe/Igbo and Brass/ijaw people. He described/mentioned the igbo country in the hinterland and the brass country lying north-west of Bonny. However, most of the details of daily living amongst the natives was more in tune with igbo lifestyle. He talked about igbo native doctors he referred to as dibia and the enormous influence they wield in justice and health administration, even the kings respect them. He also described details of igbo marriage customs and funneral as observed in Bonny. He talked about the use of elephant during the commemoration of King Pepple's father 10 years after the father's death. He mention the value of elephant tusk. Contrary to conjectures that the name Pepple was European's attempt at pronouncing Perekule, the author asserts that Bonny people derived joy in bearing english names as he himself was responsible for crowning a King who he named after an English prince. An incident that excited the populace. He confirms that both King Pepple and King Holiday were igbos. He described in detail the physique, including complexion and character of different tribes eboes, brass, appas, quaws, ottams etc
The author described one Chief Fubara who was an acquaintance of King Pepple. He asserts that Chief Fubara was not an indigene of Bonny but a stranger who migrated from his country during a crisis with a false claim that he was a warrior in his native country.
The author proved that ijaws were not selling igbo slaves as claimed in some quarters. According to him, everyone/every tribe was sold as slave. He described instances where some igbo chiefs set people up with their beautiful young wives and victims eventually pay a fine or become slaves. He explained the reason why more igbo slaves were sold. They were more relatable to Europeans than most other tribes.
Captain Hugh is credited with one of the earliest attempt to create an Eboe/igbo dictionary. The author asserts that Opobo is an Igbo name for male children. He also said that natives are often marked according to their origin and that Bonny natives often have short cupped perpendicular markings on both sides of their temple(this is consistent with the igbo tribal mark).
He confirmed the existence of Cannibalism, that Andoni was considered a dangerous place to venture, the fact that Calabar people eat dog meat, the influence of Benin empire, that some Brass people were usually employed to make salt during dry season under the Benin empire amongst other things.
I was planning to post pages from his write up to buttress some points, unfortunately i cannot do so on this forum as it seems to permit posting only few images at a time. But i will post some.
CONCLUSION
Bonny and Opobo people are a mix of Eboe/Igbo and Brass/Ijaw people in origin. This document however asserts a more igbo origin or dorminance as most of his history of the ancient kingdom was about igbos. This perhaps explains the existence of the igbo language spoken there and the presence of igbo masqurades like nwaotam. Shalom
P.S: I am being challenged to prove that Brass people are Ijaw people, so I must state once more that this was an assumption on my part and it remains to be proven or disputed.
Please where can I get this book. I want to read on know. Thanks
Please where can I get this book. I want to read on know. Thanks
Just Google,'Memoirs of Captain Hugh Crow of Liverpool'.
Aside proving the identity of Bonny natives, the book renders a fantastic account of the slave trade era. It contains details of what life was like for most European(mainly British) Sailors. There are a lot more in the book we could talk about, so I encourage guys to read up and come share your findings.
The intent is for this thread to elicit an intellectual discourse and not some rabid noise typical of educated illiterates.
So far, I have seen some interesting additions to the conversation especially from @Ekealterego for which I am grateful.
So why are they not part of Ohaneze Ndigbo or Aka Ikenga? Why are they not using Eze of Bonny or Eze of Opobo?
That's a fallacy, the Ohanaeze Ndigbo has no charter on the tribal composition of the Igbo race -unlike the ijaw organization that without consultations ,subscribed tribal groups into there charter.
The people of Asaba called there king the Asagba of Asaba. They don't use Eze. You see, Eze is a generic term and some other Igbo communities use other terms to denote there kings.
Just Google,'Memoirs of Captain Hugh Crow of Liverpool'.
Aside proving the identity of Bonny natives, the book renders a fantastic account of the slave trade era. It contains details of what life was like for most European(mainly) British Sailors. They're a lot more in the book we could talk about, so I encourage guys to read up and come share your findings.
I intent is for this thread to elicit an intellectual discourse and not some rabid noise typical of educated illiterates.
So far, I have seen some interesting additions to the conversation especially from @Ekealterego for which I am grateful.
