₦airaland Forum

mtisTheQubit:
An why do you think he was a christian an not a muslim or an animist ?

There were no Muslims in south Nigeria they were restricted to the northern parts he could have been an animist but if he was he wouldn’t have said ordained by god. He would have attributed it to natural occurrences or to multiple gods

mtisTheQubit:

no the dude wasn't a Christian..i know y've something against ths folks but guy wasn't one of them..actually he was talking about african oracles and priests..

Nope they didn’t use the word ordination in any African society and if they did it must have been a very minor one.

jl115:
Maybe it did maybe it didn't but I don't care about what ifs.....only facts!! and the fact is most advancements came to Africa thanks to the West

Some African societies had low crime and murder......just like there were African societies were the opposite was true! just like in Europe

Which major modern European societies had low crime and murder like at similar time periods to Benin empire not the Greeks

mtisTheQubit:
Yes there was slavery in the coastal areas of east Africa but can't compare with the scale of the trans-Atlantic one...By the way the slave traders did not venture a inland ( Kenya ) because of the fear of the Maasais...

but lets talk about the west african one which to my view was really really twisted

When the British extended their rule to south-eastern Nigeria in the late 19th Century and early 20th Century, they began to enforce abolition through military action.

But by using force rather than persuasion, many local people may not have understood that abolition was about the dignity of humankind and not a mere change in economic policy that affected demand and supply.

"We think this trade must go on," one local king in Bonny infamously said in the 19th Century.That is the verdict of our oracle and our priests. They say that your country, however great, can never stop a trade ordained by God."

We cant blame all the sh*.t which was going only to white folks

And guess what he was a fucking christian but yes some Nigerians were I support of it and were fools

jl115:
It was mentioned by Benin scripture not by the British........also there is physical evidence of human sacrifice

No such things as Benin scriptures was presented by the British no single artefact in Benin shows human sacrifice also the evidence said most were executed criminals. And 41 bodies over an over 400 year period for criminals ain’t that bad. I don’t believe in the human sacrifice stuff because most customs were represented in their artefacts. Find me the Benin scriptures you speak of first.

mtisTheQubit:
So just because a Kenyan an a Tanzanian posted something here their country becomes barbaric..but wait, not Ethiopians,Sudanese and Somalis .. They are cool guys..I feel like your arguments are driven by emotions ..
First there were no countries called Kenya or Tanzania at that time ..An talking of being barbaric, who were selling their brothers to white folks..please dont deny it..i got a map an a photo for evidence...

Okay I was just mildly annoyed I’ve had a long day and I’m genuinely just pissed off by some of the stupidity here and gallivants comment just pissed me off way too much. Nobody is denying the trans Atlantic slave trade but what I meant was most Kenyan and Tanzanian empires ( areas in those present day countries ) that had great empires and societies were ijmfkuenced by Islam those Influenced by local African traditions and cultures were a lot,less developed when compared to their west African counterparts. Ethiopia was one of the only ones in Africa that built a great society pre Christianity and Islam

SUFFERInSMILIIN:
Boko Haram captures army personnel carrier for military

We’re not even talking about please leave unless you have something productive to say your actually starting to piss me and all the other west Africans here with your incessant trolling

gallivant:
I know, dont ruin it with blanket statements like all Africans were barbaric; that's just West Africans and Zulus. Loving the debate though.

West Africans are not barbaric stop with this nonsense we had a lot greater empires the. East Africa ever did and our empires developed without Arabic or European input unlike the greatest empires in east Africa. West Africa has a greater and more developed history. East Africans if anything were a lot more barbaric except the Ethiopians, Sudanese and Somalis but Kenya, Tanzania etc. They were barbaric no question. At least some of them the buganda people of modern day Uganda were highly educated on modern anatomy and were able to carry out successful c sections before much of Europe could.

jl115:
Im talking about Ahoboy who blames the genocide rape and murder in Africa happening today on White people alone...........I never denied colonisation was an evil practise but to blame everything bad happening on our continent today on colonisation instead of our own leaders is ridicules and backwords

I don’t blame everything but look at what you guys did to Patrice lumumba, Thomas sankara, supporting civil wars in Africa including the biafra civil war, the coups you supported against good leaders like Kwame Nkrumah and shagari, your evils have been going since the slave trade and till today. The one agenda of the whitey has been to stall development in Africa.

I’m not saying all genocides etc are caused by the whites and I’m not saying it didn’t happen. But the scale it is happening at today can only be attributed to the introduction of western customs and civilization to Africa. Robbery and murder were a lot less rampant within Africa especially west Africa before they came with civilization this is very clear and evident by any mentions of scholars at the time who visited these great African empires.

jl115:
I brought actual citations from reputable news outlets......I also posted several sources on the post that got me banned.

And FYI I never denied Africa didn't have extremely advanced societies like the Benin kingdom or Zimbabwean kingdom.

What im saying is Africa had slavery, murder, genocide, rape ect ect long before the colonisers came............YOU have a victim mentality and want to blame the failings of your own people on the Whitey to make yourself feel better.

I don’t want to blame the failings of my people on the whitey but you cannot lie thst the whitey stalled our development, and used religion as a tool to keep us in mental servitude and in top of that European explorers at the time documented how much little crime, robbery, murder etc. We’re going on at the time not only in Benin kingdom but also in the Asante kingdom as well as Oyo empire.

jl115:
Your precious Benin kingdom for one practised slavery............must I name more? because I can

Also there were many barbaric African societies........the Mfecane is a great example of that!!

Many you have consistently mentioned one also you haven’t provided evidence British missionaries is not evidence because they were angry at Benin for stopping trade with them which is why they labeled them as cannibals, murderers, savages, etc shall I go on

jl115:
And? did Africans invent there own Electricity, Internet, Tarmac and Tv... ...Colonisation in Africa lasted till the 1960s

No we didn’t but the point is we were developed to a high standard before they came and things liek the slave trade, constant attack from the British and colonisation stalled our industriousness

Kazikazi:
Africans were barbaric and are still barbaric today.
All these stories of ritual killings tells you how some folks are shitholes and barbaric

Guy shut up your just a he white washed baboon

jl115:
From Benin scripture........they worshiped the God of Iron

Benin had no form of writing until the British came so stfu with your lies this is actually funny Benin scripture huh. They never had any form of writing this benin bronzes was their form of marking history so stop lying human sacrifices was British propaganda created to demonise African empires

jl115:
You said there was no slavery in Africa before Europeans came to Africa?

We’re talking about the americas not africa dumbass

jl115:
At first Abohboy denies Africans ever traded slaves......yet now he even states African had white slave(this is true btw)

In America dumbass

jl115:
I was banned that's why.........Secondly you are believing in a dude that claims the Earth is flat, Nazis were black, reptilians and believes in Unicorns.

And yes human sacrifice in Africa is very well documented as well in ancient Benin

Only became documented by the British when they wanted to take over Benin as a colony before then no Portuguese or Dutch explorer mentioned anything the British had a habit of blacklisting and demonising Africans before taking over

jl115:
LOL cool story bro next time bring facts

You haven’t brought facts either you just bring quotes I also brought quotes of Dutch and Portuguese explorers who went there but you don’t believe them. It is called selective acceptance. You accept what you want and leave the rest I can post the pictures again. The society was conducted in such a way that there was no need for doors not because they didn’t know what they were or how t9 use them but because there was so little crime and robbery in the area. They had long straight roads, tall walls and metal poles to light the streets. They had very shiny houses and all the roads were very clean these are accounts from the 1400s - 1600s

jl115:
Yes some of them were!!

Exactly some and who’s to say that these some participated in the slave trade, majority of berbers are Arabic not black so the point still stands about Africans and they are predominantly Muslims. Find me a society of Africans who practiced traditional beliefs who were as barbaric and misogynistic as the European societies

jl115:
I already did!! Electricity, piped Sewage systems, Internet, TV, Cell phones..........should I go on?

Nobody had anything of the things you listed until the 20th century. England didn’t have piped sewage systems until the 1930s. Internet 1990s and Africans helped to develop that, piped sewage systems they had pipes which would get rid of poop in each community. Tv who really had that until the 1950s. So yes do go on

jl115:
You mean you don't believe in facts?? also it wasn't the British that made those "claims" fyi!!

Then where did you get the accounts of human sacrifice, the Portuguese and Dutch never mentioned such. And Benin city had oil street lamps whether you want to accept it or not were not talking electric. We are talking about oil street KAMO and the first one was built in Benin in the 1500s

mtisTheQubit:
but someone today denied that ths stuff never happened..that it was all lies ..

Those numbers are likely highly inflated but nobody is denying the slave trade there was a slave trade but there were also Africans in The americas before there were Europeans there.

mtisTheQubit:
Please someone explain to me ths..

have read a post here suggesting that there was no trans-Atlantic slave trade..and that what happened is that white people enslaved blacks who were already in America and even transferred some of ths slaves to Africa...I know we are walking in the twilight zone but people please, don't turn into white folks an their conspiracy theories...its not good for Africans at this time..just saying

But there were Africans in the americas the point he is trying to make is that they inflated the figures of the slave trade to make it seem that there were never any Africans in the americas. We already had settlements and trade routes with them before the Europeans. We had a sizeable population of Africans within the americas, they obviously had to inflate the numbers of the slave trade to cover this up. There obviously was a slave trade but there also obviously were Africans in the americas before the Europeans.

kikuyu1:
No. While I see that figures been steadily falling from a high of 50 mn in the early 90s its still a GIVE EXAGGERATION.
Most Black Americans are either INDIGENOUS or Black European Catholics, the losers of the 100 years war who were deported as indentured servants.

Look at Anthony Johnson, one of the first Virginia dance owners. The story says he He came from Angola where he'd been purchased as a slave and 2 decades LATER he'd owning his own slaves? Really!? I smell BS. It DOESN'T make economic sense to extract such limited utility value from an enslaved human.

[[img]b]In 1621, Johnson was delivered to Virginia’s shores as an African captive, simply called “Antonio.” By the mid-17th century, he became a landowner newly named “Anthony Johnson.[/b]” His ability to gain freedom resembles the functions of indentured servitude, in which an unfree laborer is bound to work for a landowner for a specific length of time. [/img]
[url]https://www.aaihs.org/the-curious-history-of-anthony-johnson-from-captive-african-to-right-wing-talking-point//url]

Btw, THERE we're a bunker of other black slave owners who even owned white SLAVES!

Well we are already aware of the fact that Africans were already in the americas before the Europeans go and read about Ivan van sertimas books then come back and debate me. But was the number really thst large you cannot deny there was a slave trade, but it does make sense to hide the fact that Africans were already in the americas. So let’s get the facts straight

There were Africans in America before Europeans

The Africans in the americas had settlements, lands and owned farms and houses etc

There was a slave trade

The Europeans did take Africans from africa to the americas how many they took is still debatable

There were Africans who owned white slaves


There are inconsistencies in the slave labour and the number of slave owners and their ethnicities etc


Thst is my basic understanding so far

kikuyu1:
YOU'VE forgotten ALREADY!? There was no mfecane wherein Shakas' empire building supposedly killed 2 mn Africans .
Firstly that would've been 50% of the entire population at the time. Here's an academic breakdown of that myth.


[url][/https://www.jstor.org/stable/182353?seq=1]



It's complete BS! Like the empty land myth: they say when the Dutch landed in Cape Town in 1652 the whole land was empty. When you ask why then were they in conflict with the Khoi Khoi a mere DECADE after their arrival you hear crickets!

Jln115 is weirdly quiet and for once I actually believe in one of your conspiracies which is now a fact. A lot of propaganda was used by whites to label the blacks badly. We were never extremely violent, we never did human sacrifice we were highly spiritual people

Vlain:
What we need is ore than a leader winning the presidential election. We need an hardcore pan Africanist as a leader . One that is willing to put his interest behind him and stand up to the wicked force of the west that constantly trying to oppress Africa and the global black family. A die-hard leader who is ready to put the interest of his country and continent first even if it means ending up like Gaddafi.

Very true leaders like sankara and lumumba are what we need.

gallivant:
You need a leader who will fix your power issues and initiate a masterplan to save Nigerians from poverty. Let us handle the Pan Africanism at the AU headquarters and not poverty central. Thanks in advance.

If clearly very uneducated the AU is a very corrupt thing. The west knows africa will rise up with pan Africanism so they are funding the AU so they’re able to watch and see what happens next. A pan Africanist leader like lumumba or sankara would build infrastructure, create jobs and increase knowledge on Africa we don’t need your white washed brain to give us your opinions.

Vlain:
Who is it party aspiring to provide as a presidential candidate.
Pls don't tell me sowore.

It’s not Sowore or seun Kuti they are looking for Pan africanists with a socialist agenda who are spokespersons of the people and who are willing to suffer for the people. They are looking for a man of the people a true patriot, Sowore could support us but I don’t think he would be a good leader.

jln115:
- Human sacrifice in Benin is a proven historical fact..........your opinion doesn't change this. And yes Benin did trade in slaves.........Do you want a citation for this?

- "Kimberley was the first town in South Africa to have electric street lights and quite possibly the first in the southern hemisphere."

But it wasn’t the first to have street lights and I don’t believe in those British claims

jln115:
Most of the rifles imported were from Europe bru

If you say so. That ain’t the point tho

When the Europeans were still pooing in their rivers and drinking bathing etc, in them and still pumping dirty water from the same rivers they pooed in the west Africans had provided welled waters to all communities, they had great cities, there was no poverty, they had money, there was no crime there were no doors. They had long straight paved roads made with clay and stone bricks. We were way more developed then the Europeans.

jln115:
There was a Southern Nigerian slave trade..........I even gave you a reputable source that proves this.

Also you obviously haven't heard of the Berber slave traders or Barbary slave trade, trans-Saharan slave trade ect ect ect

Also: "Slavery has historically been widespread in Africa. Systems of servitude and slavery were common in parts of Africa in ancient times, as they were in much of the rest of the ancient world."

Also: "Slavery in historical Africa was practised in many different forms: Debt slavery, enslavement of war captives, military slavery, slavery for prostitution, and criminal slavery were all practised in various parts of Africa."

Also: "Plantation slavery also occurred, primarily on the eastern coast of Africa and in parts of West Africa"

Number one where’s your source and number two that still isn’t a slave trade they’re not buying the slaves like they did in America or Europe. They are being captured and you still haven’t proved that it was done in bini empire, Oyo empire, nri empire, Asante empire, Akan empire, limba empire, Wolof empire it was done in the Mali empire because those were influence by Islam. The point of this whole argument is that African belief systems and African morals never followed or allowed things like slave trades, robbery, murder etc. Which has been consistently proven because all the examples you’ve given are from arabic influenced parts of Africa. You can even go back the point was Christianity and Islam corrupted Africans and made us more criminality inclined, increased poverty, increased murder etc. East Africa was primarily muslim, so was the sahara so your simply proven my point day by day.